PDA

View Full Version : Rogers still miffed at Mangini


Popcorn Sutton
03-19-2009, 01:29 PM
Thursday, March 19, 2009
Rogers-Mangini rift still unresolved
By James Walker
ESPN.com

Apparently, the internal rift between Pro Bowl defensive tackle Shaun Rogers and new Cleveland Browns coach Eric Mangini remains unresolved.

According to a source, Rogers has been a no-show this week for the team's offseason workout program, which began Monday.

While the workouts are considered voluntary, Mangini has made it clear that he wants his players in attendance because it was his first chance to address the team in a group setting.

Mangini and Rogers have clashed for nearly two months when the coach initially refused to communicate with his star player, despite being in the same place on two separate occasions. Rogers didn't take the snubs lightly, as things escalated to the point where he asked to be released from his six-year, $42 million contract.

Rogers is guaranteed a $5 million bonus this month, making the player's release unlikely, and should earn an additional $950,000 in likely-to-be-reached incentives when he's on the field. Mangini has since attempted to reach out to Rogers, but his absence this week makes it clear that there is still much work to be done to patch up the relationship.

The eight-year veteran had one of his best seasons in 2008, registering 76 tackles and 4.5 sacks. The Browns finished 4-12 last season.

James Walker is the AFC North blogger for ESPN.com.

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/print?id=3997500&type=story

I hate to do this. I know we've all had enough of this but doesn't this just make sense? Browns just shipped Winslow to Tampa. Well hey, rumor has it a very good tight end may be available in Denver. Rogers is miffed and a no-show and Cutler is miffed and a no-show. The Browns have 2 QB's and one that has ties to the New England coaching tree. If Rogers continues to press this could be very interesting. I hate to speculate but this story just won't die.

BroncoBuff
03-19-2009, 01:31 PM
I've been posting and posting about this ... those two are like a couple of high school girls.

We should definitely try to nab this guy ... he is a Pro Bowl 3-4 nose tackle, we could most definitely use that.

I've been suggesting Brady Quinn, Shaun Rogers and the #5 pick.

Thoughts?

Gcver2ver3
03-19-2009, 01:32 PM
i just saw the article on ESPN and you beat me to it...

i find it fascinated the similarities between Roger's and Cutler's rift with their coaches...

basically they're both claiming their feelings are hurt...

anyway...we need to get this guy...i see no other viable options at a starting calibur NT right away...

UberBroncoMan
03-19-2009, 01:35 PM
My question is that if Rogers can't handle Mangini's personality, what makes us think he'd get along with McDaniels. They are very similar coaches in terms of attitude, though McDaniels is probably a little more energetic.

BroncoBuff
03-19-2009, 01:35 PM
we need to get this guy...i see no other viable options at a starting calibur NT right away...
I think Fields is pretty good, but he's no Rogers.

Plus Quinn knows the offense ....

We get an impact defensive player at #5.

Broncojef
03-19-2009, 01:35 PM
I've been posting and posting about this ... those two are like a couple of high school girls.

We should definitely try to nab this guy ... he is a Pro Bowl 3-4 nose tackle, we could most definitely use that.

I've been suggesting Brady Quinn, Shaun Rogers and the #5 pick.

Thoughts?

Quinn, Rogers and the #5 for Scheffler/Cutler seems like a good fit at this point. I just hope we don't reach/overpay to get Cassel through the other threeway Deadskin/Chef trade rumor cause our upside return in that scenario just wouldn't be that good.

lex
03-19-2009, 01:37 PM
I've been posting and posting about this ... those two are like a couple of high school girls.

We should definitely try to nab this guy ... he is a Pro Bowl 3-4 nose tackle, we could most definitely use that.

I've been suggesting Brady Quinn, Shaun Rogers and the #5 pick.

Thoughts?

Well, Ive been an advocate of this as well. Rogers' value isnt equal to a 1st and Jays trade value is 2 firsts (incl the #5) and a player (such as Quinn). Pat Kirwan says the value of draft picks for Cutler should be around 3,600. So, maybe we could look for Quinn, Rogers, the #5, and a 2nd or 3rd, instead. It takes time for DTs to get on board with the pro game, so it might make sense to put a premium in getting someone without a learning curve.

I would definitely through Scheffler into that deal but thats going to escalate the draft pick.

Gcver2ver3
03-19-2009, 01:37 PM
I hate to do this. I know we've all had enough of this but doesn't this just make sense? Browns just shipped Winslow to Tampa. Well hey, rumor has it a very good tight end may be available in Denver. Rogers is miffed and a no-show and Cutler is miffed and a no-show. The Browns have 2 QB's and one that has ties to the New England coaching tree. If Rogers continues to press this could be very interesting. I hate to speculate but this story just won't die.

no you're absolutely right...

it's crazy how much us and Cleveland fit like a glove right now...

these two teams should do business...

we have a malcontent at QB and need a replacement and the Browns are looking to rebuild and move in another direction and aren't enamoured with either of their QBs...they need a receiving TE and we have one we're trying to trade...we need a NT and they have one that doesn't want to be there...

even if we have to add a third team, i just don't see how Cleveland and Denver don't do business before the draft...

SoDak Bronco
03-19-2009, 01:37 PM
I've been posting and posting about this ... those two are like a couple of high school girls.

We should definitely try to nab this guy ... he is a Pro Bowl 3-4 nose tackle, we could most definitely use that.

I've been suggesting Brady Quinn, Shaun Rogers and the #5 pick.

Thoughts?

I think Rogers is another IHOP waiting to happen, but would def. contribute, for how many seasons(maybe 2-3) and then you have #5 Pick and Brady Quinn. I thought Quinn looked good against us, but then again so did Jamarcus Russell and every other QB. I don't mind it, just not sure how good Quinn will be, he has his limitations with his arm-strength and mobility(not terrible).

BABronco
03-19-2009, 01:37 PM
I've been posting and posting about this ... those two are like a couple of high school girls.

We should definitely try to nab this guy ... he is a Pro Bowl 3-4 nose tackle, we could most definitely use that.

I've been suggesting Brady Quinn, Shaun Rogers and the #5 pick.

Thoughts?

That would be a wet dream if they would add a 6th or 7th. And I love Cutler.

Popcorn Sutton
03-19-2009, 01:43 PM
I've been posting and posting about this ... those two are like a couple of high school girls.

We should definitely try to nab this guy ... he is a Pro Bowl 3-4 nose tackle, we could most definitely use that.

I've been suggesting Brady Quinn, Shaun Rogers and the #5 pick.

Thoughts?

If Cutler is unwilling to tuck his ***** between his legs and come back and play for the Broncos I would be on-board with this scenario. I still stand by the best option is Cutler and McDaniels to iron it out and move forward.

Crushisback
03-19-2009, 01:44 PM
How about this:

Broncos Get: #5 and #36 Shaun Rodgers from CLE, and #33 from DET
Browns Get: Jay Cutler and #75(3rd #15) from Den
Lions Get: Brady Quinn

Deal!!

SureShot
03-19-2009, 01:47 PM
I've been posting and posting about this ... those two are like a couple of high school girls.

We should definitely try to nab this guy ... he is a Pro Bowl 3-4 nose tackle, we could most definitely use that.

I've been suggesting Brady Quinn, Shaun Rogers and the #5 pick.

Thoughts?

Sorry that is not enough. Hershel Walker-Ricky Williams type trade or no deal. He has three years on his contract so what is the hurry? If they want to trade him they should wait until next year when there will be some talent at QB i n the draft.

BroncoBuff
03-19-2009, 01:48 PM
If Cutler is unwilling to tuck his ***** between his legs and come back and play for the Broncos I would be on-board with this scenario. I still stand by the best option is Cutler and McDaniels to iron it out and move forward.

Of course, that is the 100% best result here.



How about this:

Broncos Get: #5 and #36 Shaun Rodgers from CLE, and #33 from DET
Browns Get: Jay Cutler and #75(3rd #15) from Den
Lions Get: Brady Quinn

Deal!!

That's interesting, I can hardly imagine having 5 picks in the first 45 ...

But it's also a heckuva lotta money on this year's draft class ... and no quarterback ???
.

supermanhr9
03-19-2009, 01:48 PM
I really really really want this to happen

Crushisback
03-19-2009, 01:52 PM
Of course, that is the 100% best result here.





That's interesting, I can hardly imagine having 5 picks in the first 45 :Zowie:

But a heckuva lotta money on this year's draft class ... and no quarterback ???
.

I'd rather have the #33 from Det than Brady Quinn. This gets the lions off of the Stafford Sanchez hook and allows us to pick our QB in the top of the 2nd.

TheElusiveKyleOrton
03-19-2009, 01:53 PM
Rogers won't be coming. It's a huge cap hit for Cleveland if they move him at all. I wish that wasn't the case, I just... don't see it.

Also, the browns traded winslow because they don't really use a TE in their offense. So, Scheff has virtually no value to them.

BABronco
03-19-2009, 01:54 PM
That's interesting, I can hardly imagine having 5 picks in the first 45 ...

But it's also a heckuva lotta money on this year's draft class ... and no quarterback ???
.

That would be pretty sick. I think we would go back to being one of the youngest teams. Imagine the defensive talent we could get with that many picks. We could easily convert to our 3-4 in a year.

Crushisback
03-19-2009, 01:54 PM
Remember Det has a Defensive first year head coach. A ball control HC's worst nightmare is a rookie QB.

Popcorn Sutton
03-19-2009, 01:56 PM
I'd rather have the #33 from Det than Brady Quinn. This gets the lions off of the Stafford Sanchez hook and allows us to pick our QB in the top of the 2nd.

Why are so many people so down on Quinn? Sure he only played in a couple games last year but every time he has been given the chance he has played very well. I'm talking pre-season, relief work etc. He's already had 2 years to learn an NFL type system and he is "familiar" with the offensive system run by Weis/Patriots.

Crushisback
03-19-2009, 01:57 PM
Besides, Rodgers is a Browns D lineman. This deal is a lock!

Inkana7
03-19-2009, 01:58 PM
I was open to this deal before I learned how much of a Douche Cutler was. So I'm even more open to it now.

Crushisback
03-19-2009, 01:59 PM
Not really down on Quinn. If McD likes him I'm fine with it. Otherwise if we trade JC, I'd like McD to bring in his kinda guy. If I recall he comes from an organization pretty good at spotting late-round QB talent.

meangene
03-19-2009, 02:02 PM
I've been posting and posting about this ... those two are like a couple of high school girls.

We should definitely try to nab this guy ... he is a Pro Bowl 3-4 nose tackle, we could most definitely use that.

I've been suggesting Brady Quinn, Shaun Rogers and the #5 pick.

Thoughts?

I would be thrilled with this, but, I might prefer a #2 pick from Cleveland over Rogers. He is another bad attitude player. Great when motivated but too often fat and lazy. I think Cleveland is getting an extra second in the Winslow deal. Salary cap-wise, early second round picks are great value. Quinn, an early first and an early second for Cutler and Scheffler.

BroncoBuff
03-19-2009, 02:03 PM
I think Quinn has kinda failed to impress....

http://img9.imageshack.us/img9/6565/98865011.jpg



On the bright side, he knows the system, and has always avoided interceptions. He had sick numbers at Notre Dame, klike 35/7 TDs to Ints in both his junior and senior years.

And the cap hit on Rogers? Isn't Jay's cap hit little or nothing this year? He's making oinly $150 anyway ... maybe they could backload a new deal and thusswallow Rogers' cap-hit as a trade-off ???

cutthemdown
03-19-2009, 02:04 PM
I've been posting and posting about this ... those two are like a couple of high school girls.

We should definitely try to nab this guy ... he is a Pro Bowl 3-4 nose tackle, we could most definitely use that.

I've been suggesting Brady Quinn, Shaun Rogers and the #5 pick.

Thoughts?

If we have to trade him a deal like that would at least be palatable. Especially if you could get Curry at number 5.

BroncoBuff
03-19-2009, 02:06 PM
I think Quinn has kinda failed to impress....
http://img9.imageshack.us/img9/6565/98865011.jpg


On the bright side, Quinn knows Josh's system, and has always avoided interceptions. In fact he had sick numbers at Notre Dame, like 35-7 TDs to Ints in both his junior and senior years.

And the cap hit on Rogers? Isn't Jay's cap hit little or nothing this year? He's making oinly $150 anyway ... maybe they could backload a new deal and thus swallow Rogers' cap-hit as a trade-off ???
.

SonOfLe-loLang
03-19-2009, 02:11 PM
I still like my idea if we really are gonna trade him...id still rather keep him:

Redskins: Cutler
Browns: Scheffler, our 3rd
Broncos: Rogers, Landry, #13, redskins 4th

Popcorn Sutton
03-19-2009, 02:20 PM
I still like my idea if we really are gonna trade him...id still rather keep him:

Redskins: Cutler
Browns: Scheffler, our 3rd
Broncos: Rogers, Landry, #13, redskins 4th

Browns get rid of Rogers for a 3rd and Scheffler...? :puff:

socalorado
03-19-2009, 02:24 PM
I've been posting and posting about this ... those two are like a couple of high school girls.

We should definitely try to nab this guy ... he is a Pro Bowl 3-4 nose tackle, we could most definitely use that.

I've been suggesting Brady Quinn, Shaun Rogers and the #5 pick.

Thoughts?

And.....?

SonOfLe-loLang
03-19-2009, 02:25 PM
Browns get rid of Rogers for a 3rd and Scheffler...? :puff:

They are down a TE, Rogers has proven he tanks when he doesnt want to play, he's gonna be 30...and didnt they give up a third to get him? Sounds like an OK deal to me

Broncos_OTM
03-19-2009, 02:27 PM
Remember Det has a Defensive first year head coach. A ball control HC's worst nightmare is a rookie QB.

I'm sorry. But that jsut doesnt make sense. look at Baltimore. Atlanta. Good Defense and a running game in a ball controlled offensee is ideal. Trying to put him in the situation in indy is not

Broncos_OTM
03-19-2009, 02:28 PM
Browns get rid of Rogers for a 3rd and Scheffler...? :puff:

Scheffler whose value i think is around a 3rd. two thirds for shaun is over payment. maybe a fifth or sixth

socalorado
03-19-2009, 02:33 PM
I still like my idea if we really are gonna trade him...id still rather keep him:

Redskins: Cutler
Browns: Scheffler, our 3rd
Broncos: Rogers, Landry, #13, redskins 4th


I think this is more along the lines of what each team is looking at. Fair value.
Redskins: Cutler, Sheffler
Browns: Campbell, Cooley
Broncos: Quinn, Rogers, Landry, #13, redskins 3rd

Broncojef
03-19-2009, 02:39 PM
I think this is more along the lines of what each team is looking at. Fair value.
Redskins: Cutler, Sheffler
Browns: Campbell, Cooley
Broncos: Quinn, Rogers, Landry, #13, redskins 3rd

Anyway we could convince you to broker a deal for us? :wiggle:

socalorado
03-19-2009, 02:49 PM
Anyway we could convince you to broker a deal for us? :wiggle:

I woulda smacked Cutler, MCD and Bowlen all upside the head and said
"whats a matter with you idiots!!!" "Now can we all just take off the dresses, pull out the tampons, and get to F'N work!?!?!?"

But if these guys are dead set on not making this work, then i could have that deal done by 5PM!!

Pfft....amatuers

cabronco
03-19-2009, 02:50 PM
I've been posting and posting about this ... those two are like a couple of high school girls.

We should definitely try to nab this guy ... he is a Pro Bowl 3-4 nose tackle, we could most definitely use that.

I've been suggesting Brady Quinn, Shaun Rogers and the #5 pick.

Thoughts?

If the McD & JC cant come to terms than Im all for this for sure. :thumbs:

Drek
03-19-2009, 02:50 PM
I still like my idea if we really are gonna trade him...id still rather keep him:

Redskins: Cutler
Browns: Scheffler, our 3rd
Broncos: Rogers, Landry, #13, redskins 4th

Thats giving Scheffler and a 3rd for Rogers (I'd call that an overpay, since Rogers is a two or three year rental at best) and Cutler for Landry, #13, and a 4th.

So we get ****ed on both ends?

A 3rd alone is the most I'd give for Rogers. Cutler should be worth Landry, #13, and another first day pick, if not this year then next.

GoBroncos84
03-19-2009, 03:00 PM
Quinn was overrated in college, and I don't think he will ever be more than an average starter, and has a higher chance of being an average backup for his career.


How about this trade:

Cle: Tony Scheffler and a 5th round pick

Den: Shaun Rogers


The going rate for DT in trade last year was 3rd and 5th round picks. If you grade Scheffler as a 3rd round value this trade would make sense. I would even go Scheff and a 4th round pick to get Rogers. We keep Jay, which is the only sane and logical thing in my opinion, and upgrade our D without leveraging our franchise by dealing its best player. This is assuming that we can work things out with our miffed star, and Cleveland cannot do the same with theirs. Does anyone else think its not a coincidence that the teams having these issues are both from the Patriot coaching tree? Perhaps they should win something before trying to be Bill Belichick. Not trying to make this a bash thread, there are enough of those. I just don't want to get rid of Cutler, and I do want Rogers. So if possible, I'd like to get my cake and eat it too, have them both.

Broncojef
03-19-2009, 03:03 PM
Thats giving Scheffler and a 3rd for Rogers (I'd call that an overpay, since Rogers is a two or three year rental at best) and Cutler for Landry, #13, and a 4th.

So we get ****ed on both ends?

A 3rd alone is the most I'd give for Rogers. Cutler should be worth Landry, #13, and another first day pick, if not this year then next.

I'm with Socalorado add Quinn into that deal and we're done.

UberBroncoMan
03-19-2009, 03:04 PM
People forge that Quinn was as much a product of the system and the talent around him at Notre Dame as Leinhart was at USC and Young was at Texas.

They're all overrated and appear to be solid career NFL backups. I wouldn't mind either of them (except Young eww) as a backup at all... but as a starter... no thanks.

Anyone noticing how the smaller school players are doing better? Flacco - Delaware, Ryan - Boston College, Cutler - Vanderbilt.

There's a reason for that. They performed exceptionally well without the tons of stud talent around them, which means in the NFL if they are without stud talent they will perform well... and with it they will do amazing.

Hercules Rockefeller
03-19-2009, 03:05 PM
Skins can't trade Cooley, which is why that rumor was bunk right off the bat. They can't take the accelerate cap hit from his signing bonus.

BroncoBuff
03-19-2009, 03:16 PM
Quinn was overrated in college, and I don't think he will ever be more than an average starter, and has a higher chance of being an average backup for his career.
He had a terrible O-Line at Notre Dame, I know that ... but he still managed sick 35-7 TD/Int numbers (appx) in both his junior and senior years.

I don't care for Quinn as a person much, but he does knows this offense, and kinda reminds me of Cassel ... (although I'm probably projecting there). He and Simms would be a good battle for starting spot, they'd probably make each other better. And Quinn is pretty accurate/mistake avoidant, and he actually DOES have a pretty strong arm, throws an excellent deep ball. I dunno where the idea he's weak-armed came from ???

meangene
03-19-2009, 03:17 PM
People forge that Quinn was as much a product of the system and the talent around him at Notre Dame as Leinhart was at USC and Young was at Texas.

They're all overrated and appear to be solid career NFL backups. I wouldn't mind either of them (except Young eww) as a backup at all... but as a starter... no thanks.

Anyone noticing how the smaller school players are doing better? Flacco - Delaware, Ryan - Boston College, Cutler - Vanderbilt.

There's a reason for that. They performed exceptionally well without the tons of stud talent around them, which means in the NFL if they are without stud talent they will perform well... and with it they will do amazing.

I'm with you on Leinhart and Young but the talent level at Notre Dame was way down when Quinn was there.

BroncoBuff
03-19-2009, 03:28 PM
I'm with you on Leinhart and Young but the talent level at Notre Dame was way down when Quinn was there.

Exactly ... the O-Line was really a sieve, he took a real pounding some weeks. And re: other talent there, has Jeff Smardzja landed on an NFL roster? He was the #1 target ....

Still, he managed that sick 35-7 (appx) TD-Int ratio in both his years starting.

As a "game manager" in this offense of Josh's, he might be okay. He did look pretty damned poised in his first-ever start against us (and our crappy defense ::))

Drek
03-19-2009, 03:41 PM
Exactly ... the O-Line was really a sieve, he took a real pounding some weeks. And re: other talent there, has Jeff Smardzja landed on an NFL roster? He was the #1 target ....

Still, he managed that sick 35-7 (appx) TD-Int ratio in both his years starting.

As a "game manager" in this offense of Josh's, he might be okay. He did look pretty damned poised in his first-ever start against us (and our crappy defense ::))

Shark is a prospect in the Cubs' farm system, doing pretty well but probably converting to reliever, still living off his solid fastball too.

But Maurice Stovall hasn't done much in his time in the NFL, and he was the clear #2 there.

Ryan Harris is the only member of his OL to have any NFL success, and Quinn's last year there Harris had a very down year, hence him sliding to us in the 3rd when he entered the season as a 1st round lock.

Anthony Fasano was a very good TE that Quinn had at his disposal his junior year, but they started a true freshman at TE his senior year if I recall.

The best RB he ever had was Darius Walker, who didn't catch much more than a cup of coffee on a few NFL practice squads.

People forge that Quinn was as much a product of the system and the talent around him at Notre Dame as Leinhart was at USC and Young was at Texas.

They're all overrated and appear to be solid career NFL backups. I wouldn't mind either of them (except Young eww) as a backup at all... but as a starter... no thanks.

Anyone noticing how the smaller school players are doing better? Flacco - Delaware, Ryan - Boston College, Cutler - Vanderbilt.

There's a reason for that. They performed exceptionally well without the tons of stud talent around them, which means in the NFL if they are without stud talent they will perform well... and with it they will do amazing.

Funny, the big knock on ND during Quinn's time there was that the overall team talent level was woefully behind USC, OSU, etc. at the time. They were constantly playing up to teams that from a talent standpoint they really didn't belong on the same field with, and Quinn more often than not actually lead them to victory.

Its also a big reason they got stomped in Bowl games. You could literally see the speed difference between their secondary and the likes of OSU or LSU's recievers, their RBs and opposing linebackers, etc..

Crushisback
03-19-2009, 03:46 PM
I'm sorry. But that jsut doesnt make sense. look at Baltimore. Atlanta. Good Defense and a running game in a ball controlled offensee is ideal. Trying to put him in the situation in indy is not

Understood. However, Detroit is emplementing that philosophy while it already existed in Baltimore and was alot closer in Atlanta than in 0-16 Dfrikintroit. So no need for the apology. It makes lots of sense.

Gcver2ver3
03-19-2009, 03:49 PM
People forget that Quinn was as much a product of the system and the talent around him at Notre Dame as Leinhart

not true...ND had good but not great WRs, an ok RB and bad O-line...

here's the trade i want to see...

Cleveland gives: Quinn, Rogers, #5 overall
Detroit gives: #1 overall, #20 overall
Denver give: Cutler, 2nd round pick

Cleveland receives: #1 overall, Scheffler, #20 overall
Detroit receives: Cutler, 2nd round pick
Denver receives: Quinn, Rogers, #5 overall

quite the blockbuster...

run it!...

eddie mac
03-19-2009, 03:49 PM
Forget about trades involving more than 2 players. How often has that ever happened in the league in 1 deal???

This is not the NBA. Every single player involved would more than likely be looking a pay day as part of the trade plus the accelerated cap hits unless players are involved in rookie deals could be astronomical plus the fact with no CBA in place for 2010 all accelerated money hits this year.

The Browns also dont have a lot of cap room so even trading Rogers may well be a major issue given the fact their previous dumbass administration gave out near $30m in guaranteed roster bonuses to players all hitting this year.

Plus all LTBE's hit this year as well regardless of whether they're met or not.

Rohirrim
03-19-2009, 03:51 PM
I think Quinn has kinda failed to impress....

http://img9.imageshack.us/img9/6565/98865011.jpg



On the bright side, he knows the system, and has always avoided interceptions. He had sick numbers at Notre Dame, klike 35/7 TDs to Ints in both his junior and senior years.

And the cap hit on Rogers? Isn't Jay's cap hit little or nothing this year? He's making oinly $150 anyway ... maybe they could backload a new deal and thusswallow Rogers' cap-hit as a trade-off ???

The key to the McD offense is an "accurate" QB. I doubt he's interested in anybody who doesn't fit that fundamental requirement. Thankfully.

barryr
03-19-2009, 03:53 PM
3 team trades are very rare in the NFL.

Popcorn Sutton
03-19-2009, 03:57 PM
3 team trades are very rare in the NFL.

Being able to trade for QB's with Jay Cutler's combination of talent and age is also very rare...