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AtlantaBronco
03-16-2009, 06:42 PM
that none of this is good for the organization and doesn't give positive momentum heading into the new season.

I think all of us can agree that the reason last season went so bad WASN'T because of the offense. If you look at the moves this offseason most of them have been directed at the offense. Look at the players McDaniels has brought it. Buckhalter? Lamont Jordan? Are these guys an improvement over Torain and Hillis? Why not spend the money on the defensive side of the ball?!

Cutler issue aside, I seriously question what management skills McDaniels has. I also question what Bowlen was seeing when he hired this guy. I have to agree with Reggie Rivers that McDaniels wants his guys playing for the Broncos (see Leach). In any business the last thing you do as a leader is make a bunch of changes especially the things that are working. When you don't give existing guys a chance and you dump or try to trade them for guys you are comfortable with, you aren't ready for a leadership position in any organization. Men that are leaders don't have to show who is the boss. McDaniels is no leader.

Living in Atlanta, I can remember when the Falcons hired Dan Henning. The first thing Henning did was go after the starting QB, Steve Bartkowski. Henning started a lost decade.

I'll say this about Cutler. He is the right guy for Denver. Denver is a tough place to play. Denver needs a QB that doesn't care what the fans think. Cutler is a guy that will say what's on his mind and he doesn't care. Maybe this comes across as childish but I like it.

Popps
03-16-2009, 06:48 PM
Shanahan came into Denver and turned over the team. He kept Elway, obviously. (Please no one go there... stop the stupidity.)

It started a Sueprbowl run.

Sometimes you have to ruffle a few feathers to get things done.

As for Cutler, he's making the choice to leave. No one has asked him to.

lex
03-16-2009, 06:48 PM
I think what matters as much as anything is what Nolan does with the defense. I realize the offense has been getting a lot of attention and Im assuming that Cutler will be in the fold. If Cutler is still with the team and the offense is good, it will be because they already had good players on offense. What is the Schwerpunkt is the defense, even in spite of all this drama that Josh has mismanaged.

scttgrd
03-16-2009, 06:49 PM
Oh boy, your going to get it now. McDaniels is the greatest leader in history, he is gathering his people to lead this team into the promised land.

LOL

DrFate
03-16-2009, 06:54 PM
Great post Atlanta.

UberBroncoMan
03-16-2009, 06:55 PM
No question McDaniels needed to make some radical changes to the D... but the O was just fine.

With a healthy running game and his offense scheme we would be a top 2 SCORING and yardage team next year.

Now... I don't know.

Without Jay I foresee a Chad Pennington/Matt Cassel type of QB with a lot of dinks and dunks and the occasional (rare) long pass with a heavy running game. No one really that athletic or anything... (Cassel was pathetic in the pocket when pressured and got sacked like a freaking mad man)

We simply aren't going to be that exciting to watch on O.

Besides with our 31+ year old patchwork defense I expect without Jay it will be 3-4 years before we're where we want to be anyway. It will take that long to fix our D and hopefully find a quality QB.

However if we keep Jay and all this **** is mended I foresee us in the playoffs and a BIG contender in 2010.

maher_tyler
03-16-2009, 07:02 PM
that none of this is good for the organization and doesn't give positive momentum heading into the new season.

I think all of us can agree that the reason last season went so bad WASN'T because of the offense. If you look at the moves this offseason most of them have been directed at the offense. Look at the players McDaniels has brought it. Buckhalter? Lamont Jordan? Are these guys an improvement over Torain and Hillis? Why not spend the money on the defensive side of the ball?!

Cutler issue aside, I seriously question what management skills McDaniels has. I also question what Bowlen was seeing when he hired this guy. I have to agree with Reggie Rivers that McDaniels wants his guys playing for the Broncos (see Leach). In any business the last thing you do as a leader is make a bunch of changes especially the things that are working. When you don't give existing guys a chance and you dump or try to trade them for guys you are comfortable with, you aren't ready for a leadership position in any organization. Men that are leaders don't have to show who is the boss. McDaniels is no leader.

Living in Atlanta, I can remember when the Falcons hired Dan Henning. The first thing Henning did was go after the starting QB, Steve Bartkowski. Henning started a lost decade.

I'll say this about Cutler. He is the right guy for Denver. Denver is a tough place to play. Denver needs a QB that doesn't care what the fans think. Cutler is a guy that will say what's on his mind and he doesn't care. Maybe this comes across as childish but I like it.

Torrain has accomplished basically ZERO in the NFL and Hillis is a FB..the only reason he was ever even the RB is cause he was our only other option. You really think he's expecting these guys to run for 1500 yards?? And as far as Cutler goes...wow..that guy really needs to grow a ****in pair...crying like a 5 year old girl cause his name was brought up in a trade..boo ****ing hoo..there are a lot worse things going on in the world right now..grow the **** up!!!

Jay6Cutler
03-16-2009, 07:06 PM
that none of this is good for the organization and doesn't give positive momentum heading into the new season.

I think all of us can agree that the reason last season went so bad WASN'T because of the offense. If you look at the moves this offseason most of them have been directed at the offense. Look at the players McDaniels has brought it. Buckhalter? Lamont Jordan? Are these guys an improvement over Torain and Hillis? Why not spend the money on the defensive side of the ball?!

Cutler issue aside, I seriously question what management skills McDaniels has. I also question what Bowlen was seeing when he hired this guy. I have to agree with Reggie Rivers that McDaniels wants his guys playing for the Broncos (see Leach). In any business the last thing you do as a leader is make a bunch of changes especially the things that are working. When you don't give existing guys a chance and you dump or try to trade them for guys you are comfortable with, you aren't ready for a leadership position in any organization. Men that are leaders don't have to show who is the boss. McDaniels is no leader.

Living in Atlanta, I can remember when the Falcons hired Dan Henning. The first thing Henning did was go after the starting QB, Steve Bartkowski. Henning started a lost decade.

I'll say this about Cutler. He is the right guy for Denver. Denver is a tough place to play. Denver needs a QB that doesn't care what the fans think. Cutler is a guy that will say what's on his mind and he doesn't care. Maybe this comes across as childish but I like it.





I disagree I think a new coach tries to get the players HE thinks he can win with plain and simple. Apparently he thought castle was a better fit. What good does it do too be able to throw a 15 yard if you are a mental midget which at this point jay is. Athletic ability alone won’t win championships in this league give me a smart QB anyday.

scttgrd
03-16-2009, 07:07 PM
I can see a certain amount of gamesmanship that goes on with every NFL team. But at some point you stop playing games and show you are a leader and get things worked out. That is, if that was what you ever had in mind.

maher_tyler
03-16-2009, 07:15 PM
No question McDaniels needed to make some radical changes to the D... but the O was just fine.


Actually the "O" wasn't just fine...in gaining yardage yes, but thats it. If you check the stats they were a -17 in TO differential and only scored 23.1 pts/game, thats 16th in the league. The O is far from just fine!!

http://www.nfl.com/stats/categorystats?tabSeq=2&offensiveStatisticCategory=GAME_STATS&conference=ALL&role=TM&season=2008&seasonType=REG&d-447263-s=TOTAL_YARDS_GAME_AVG&d-447263-o=2&d-447263-n=1

broncosteven
03-16-2009, 07:36 PM
Oh boy, your going to get it now. McDaniels is the greatest leader in history, he is gathering his people to lead this team into the promised land.

LOL

Actually some dudes in brown shirts just busted up my house, painted "Ich Leibest Cutler" on my door and told me I could only pack one suitcase and report to the train station.

Something about not being pure enough for MickyD.

Drek
03-16-2009, 08:00 PM
that none of this is good for the organization and doesn't give positive momentum heading into the new season.

I think all of us can agree that the reason last season went so bad WASN'T because of the offense. If you look at the moves this offseason most of them have been directed at the offense. Look at the players McDaniels has brought it. Buckhalter? Lamont Jordan? Are these guys an improvement over Torain and Hillis? Why not spend the money on the defensive side of the ball?!

Cutler issue aside, I seriously question what management skills McDaniels has. I also question what Bowlen was seeing when he hired this guy. I have to agree with Reggie Rivers that McDaniels wants his guys playing for the Broncos (see Leach). In any business the last thing you do as a leader is make a bunch of changes especially the things that are working. When you don't give existing guys a chance and you dump or try to trade them for guys you are comfortable with, you aren't ready for a leadership position in any organization. Men that are leaders don't have to show who is the boss. McDaniels is no leader.

Living in Atlanta, I can remember when the Falcons hired Dan Henning. The first thing Henning did was go after the starting QB, Steve Bartkowski. Henning started a lost decade.

I'll say this about Cutler. He is the right guy for Denver. Denver is a tough place to play. Denver needs a QB that doesn't care what the fans think. Cutler is a guy that will say what's on his mind and he doesn't care. Maybe this comes across as childish but I like it.

Bill Parcells, two rings, 3 SB appearances, took the Dolphins from 1st in the draft to a playoff birth in a season last year, disagrees with your bolded statement.

Bill Belichick, three rings, four SB appearances, disagrees with your bolded statement.

Mike Shanahan, two rings in two SB appearances, disagrees with your bolded statement.

What your statement basically suggests is that McDaniels was obligated to give every old Bronco a chance to keep their jobs. So I take it you were quite happy with how Marquand Manual, Marlon McCree, Nate Webster, etc. all played last year?

I sure wasn't. I don't see why they deserved a chance to keep their jobs.

Living in Atlanta I'd hope you'd also remember a guy named Thomas Dimitroff, he came into Atlanta after a 5-11 season, effected some significant roster turnover himself, and took them to the playoffs. This year he's already shown the longest tenured Falcon in Keith Brooking the door. But he won, fast.

This mindset that an HC should pick up 95% of the pieces that got the previous guy fired is about as rational as asking someone to turn water into wine or lead into gold. You're asking for alchemy, not molecular alchemy but psychological and physical alchemy performed on a bunch of players either not gifted enough or mentally capable enough to get it done.

In the real world bad infections occasionally need to be just chopped clean out, and sometimes some healthy skin goes with it.

AtlantaBronco
03-17-2009, 07:02 AM
Parcells, Belicheat, and Shanahan all have Super Bowl rings as HC's. McDaniels doesn't. Ask Belicheat what happened to him when he ran Kosar out of Cleveland. It wasn't long before he was let go too. In a couple of years or less we will be on this board talking about how the next Bronco's coach will be. In 10 years we will be talking about when the next Elway will get drafted.

McDaniels can do as he wishes. It is his neck. However, the smart thing to do is to evaluate what you have on the team you are running. The problem is McDaniels is inexperienced and it shows because he would rather have "his guys" no matter if the talent level is equal or greater to what is currently on the team. Do you really think Cassel is a better QB than Cutler?

The biggest problem with the Falcons was the coaching staff. Unlike in Denver, the Falcons had a quitter for a coach (Petrino) and before him a carpet salesman (Mora). As for Dimitroff, the jury is still out. The Falcons had a good year but they have never had back to back winning seasons. Brooking should have been gone years ago based on his performance. That was an easy decision. Would Dimitroff trade Matt Ryan for Cassel?

AtlantaBronco
03-17-2009, 07:05 AM
Actually the "O" wasn't just fine...in gaining yardage yes, but thats it. If you check the stats they were a -17 in TO differential and only scored 23.1 pts/game, thats 16th in the league. The O is far from just fine!!

http://www.nfl.com/stats/categorystats?tabSeq=2&offensiveStatisticCategory=GAME_STATS&conference=ALL&role=TM&season=2008&seasonType=REG&d-447263-s=TOTAL_YARDS_GAME_AVG&d-447263-o=2&d-447263-n=1


23.1 points per game would beat 21 of the 32 teams. That's pretty good odds in my book.

WolfpackGuy
03-17-2009, 07:33 AM
I don't care what system you're running.
Matt Cassel for Jay Cutler would've been a major downgrade.
Yeah, Cassel went 11-5, but he was a game MANAGER, not a game BREAKER.
If McDaniels can't see what he has in Jay, then WTF is he doing in the NFL?