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View Full Version : Armstrong: Forget peace. Give Jay Cutler a chance


Taco John
03-16-2009, 05:48 PM
Forget peace. Give Jay Cutler a chance

A lot of numbers have been flying around in the midst of the Jay Cutler-Josh McDaniels spat. Some of the most interesting involve Cutler's record in games in which the Broncos have allowed 30-plus points.

For the record, it's 3-12. To put those numbers in perspective, Cutler has played two full seasons and five games of a third. Donovan McNabb has played 10 NFL seasons and is 3-16 when the Eagles allow 30-plus.

Eli Manning? He's 1-16 in such games. Jake Plummer during his days in Our Town was 0-10. Matt Cassel, if that name rings a bell, was 0-4 last season when the Pats allowed 30-plus.

Oh, and did I mention that defense isn't the only problem? The Broncos have some of the worst special teams in the league, too, forcing Cutler into lousy field position.

Just a thought, but if and when Coach J-Mac mends fences with his quarterback, maybe he can get to work on fixing the real problems.


http://www.denverpost.com/broncos/ci_11909880?source=rss

Popps
03-16-2009, 05:50 PM
I agree.

The entire organization says they want you back, Jay.

C'mon back, buddy. All is forgiven.

I'm sure Jay will show up, since everyone wants him back.

Mogulseeker
03-16-2009, 05:52 PM
Maybe poor special teams is why we gained so much yardage without scoring.

SJ Bronco
03-16-2009, 05:53 PM
the most sober thing I've heard so far.....

Rulon Velvet Jones
03-16-2009, 05:54 PM
Put the "the whole organization wants you back" line through the Bus Cook filter, though, and it turns into "they all want you back, unless something better comes along".

BMarsh615
03-16-2009, 05:55 PM
Cutler is crybaby facts don't matter/McDaniels fanboys

USMCBladerunner
03-16-2009, 05:55 PM
None of that is in dispute...by anyone...the Broncos just need to put sugar on top and all will be well I guess.

Popps
03-16-2009, 05:56 PM
The Broncos have already clearly stated that the doors are open and they want him to come in and do his job.

Where's the confusion, here?

No one needs "give Cutler a chance."

He needs to show up and do his job. He's not, so direct your ire at him, not the franchise.

TheReverend
03-16-2009, 05:57 PM
Was that on the "Jimmy Page"?

I like the message, but he's really one corny mother ****er.

BroncoFiend
03-16-2009, 06:01 PM
Well...if you take what everyone is saying at face value, then McD won't trade Cutler, Cutler will show up for all mandatory events, and the Broncos will have Cutler as their QB next year.

And since Jay always looks grumpy, no one will really be able to tell the difference once the season starts. :thumbs:

Rohirrim
03-16-2009, 06:02 PM
Jay has left town and demanded a trade. Maybe Armstrong, with his superior journalism skills, didn't hear about it?

Shoemaker
03-16-2009, 06:03 PM
Right, Jimbo. Its up to "Coach J-mac" to mend fences with Jay.

How should he go about that? Probably by saying stuff like "We're not going to trade Jay Cutler," treating Cutler like an adult and explaining that he DID listen to offers but then shut them down, and proposing one-on-one, Bus Cook-less meetings where he and the offended QB can sit down and hash things out without outside interference.

That would be the best way for the coach to go about things.

Luckily, this shouldn't be too hard to do, since Jay was in town this very day working out with those teammates that he loves and plays for.

Come on, McFailidiotnumbnuts. Hurry up and mend fences already. Jay's waiting.

SportinOne
03-16-2009, 06:07 PM
Maybe poor special teams is why we gained so much yardage without scoring.

Or it COULD be because of a lack of healthy running backs. Did you forget that we lost about 5 of them to the IR this year? You see, when you get to the goal line it's all about running the ball and if there is no one to run the ball it makes it awful tough to score a touchdown. A well known fact around these parts is that this has been a problem since the Plummer days.

Popps
03-16-2009, 06:17 PM
Right, Jimbo. Its up to "Coach J-mac" to mend fences with Jay.

How should he go about that? Probably by saying stuff like "We're not going to trade Jay Cutler," treating Cutler like an adult and explaining that he DID listen to offers but then shut them down, and proposing one-on-one, Bus Cook-less meetings where he and the offended QB can sit down and hash things out without outside interference.

That would be the best way for the coach to go about things.

Luckily, this shouldn't be too hard to do, since Jay was in town this very day working out with those teammates that he loves and plays for.

Come on, McFailidiotnumbnuts. Hurry up and mend fences already. Jay's waiting.

:rofl:

fdf
03-16-2009, 06:52 PM
The entire organization says they want you back, Jay.


But they didn't say it nicely enough. And, they should have said "please" at least one more time.

Popps
03-16-2009, 06:54 PM
But they didn't say it nicely enough. And, they should have said "please" at least one more time.

Probably.

I think most of us would do that if we were mad at our bosses, right? Just not show up?

Seems normal.

Our bosses would probably call and apologize, too.

SJ Bronco
03-16-2009, 06:56 PM
Probably.

I think most of us would do that if we were mad at our bosses, right? Just not show up?

Seems normal.

Our bosses would probably call and apologize, too.

Not that I'm disagreeing with you, but If my boss told me the meeting was optional and i was getting paid anyway and i was pissed off, I may not go....

theAPAOps5
03-16-2009, 06:58 PM
Meeting wasn't optional the workout after was. At least thats what was said in the papers this weekend.

Popps
03-16-2009, 07:00 PM
Not that I'm disagreeing with you, but If my boss told me the meeting was optional and i was getting paid anyway and i was pissed off, I may not go....

Maybe, but you probably wouldn't tell him to find you another job after he said he wanted you to come back to work.

Or, if you did... at that point, you're to blame, not him.

TonyR
03-16-2009, 07:01 PM
...If my boss told me the meeting was optional and i was getting paid anyway and i was pissed off, I may not go....

Some free career advice for you: if you ever get a new boss I suggest you show up for the first meeting he/she calls.

Taco John
03-16-2009, 07:10 PM
I think people are taking the headline to personal. I think by "give Cutler a chance" Armstrong is actually saying "give Cutler a better defense."

NFLBRONCO
03-16-2009, 07:11 PM
I think this would be all over IF

Someone would point out to Jay Cassel was traded to kc he acts like he is still available. Cassel does not have a twin brother either.

SportinOne
03-16-2009, 07:13 PM
But they didn't say it nicely enough. And, they should have said "please" at least one more time.

Or they didn't really mean it at all. About 85% of what any front office says is PR.

SportinOne
03-16-2009, 07:17 PM
Some free career advice for you: if you ever get a new boss I suggest you show up for the first meeting he/she calls.

I'm pretty sure everyone gets it. You all work very hard and athletes shouldn't complain because they make sooo much money... he shouldn't ever get mad, he makes too much money, right?

Man-Goblin
03-16-2009, 07:26 PM
Jim Armstrong is the biggest hack of a writer I personally have ever read. He's horrible. HORRIBLE. He gets paid to spew out 3 worthless paragraphs two times a week. If someone is going to push his Cutler agenda he shouldn't use Jim Armstrong as a source.

And oh, by the way, Armstrong stole this entire piece from a poster on this very same board.

Be back in a sec if I can find it.

GreatBronco16
03-16-2009, 07:28 PM
I'm pretty sure everyone gets it. You all work very hard and athletes shouldn't complain because they make sooo much money... he shouldn't ever get mad, he makes too much money, right?

I know if I was playing a game for a living making millions, well there isn't too much that would make me upset if that was the case. Not saying it is an excuse or anything, but that would just be me.

SportinOne
03-16-2009, 07:31 PM
Jim Armstrong is the biggest hack of a writer I personally have ever read. He's horrible. HORRIBLE. He gets paid to spew out 3 worthless paragraphs two times a week. If someone is going to push his Cutler agenda he shouldn't use Jim Armstrong as a source.

And oh, by the way, Armstrong stole this entire piece from a poster on this very same board.

Be back in a sec if I can find it.

Whether he stole this article or not, I'm glad he wrote it because this is something that I did not know. I'm guessing that the majority of Bronco fans do not visit the Mane, so it served to educate them as well. Hack? Yes. Informative hack? uh huh.

Drek
03-16-2009, 07:35 PM
I'm pretty sure everyone gets it. You all work very hard and athletes shouldn't complain because they make sooo much money... he shouldn't ever get mad, he makes too much money, right?

In any owner versus player dispute about money I'm 100% pro-union. I don't see why, given that they'll never charge us fans less, the billionaires should get a larger cut than the millionaires.

But it isn't about how much money you make. Its about being a damn professional. He works in a highly competitive salaried field, there is a lot more expected than all the fry pushers around here apparently thinks goes into a job.

I'm only slightly older than Jay myself, I work in a highly competitive salaried field. I'm also only going to be living in the city I'm currently in for a few more years, and my employers know that, so I don't even have a long term vested interest in the company.

I still kick ass every single day and if the VP of my division calls up with some questions after hours, you know I'm answering it. If the owner ever feels inclined to send me a personal phone call or ask me to show up at a meeting after hours you can be damn sure I'll show.

A lot more goes into being a highly skilled salaried professional in this crazy thing we call the real world than punching your 9-5 and meeting the bare minimum of what's required of you. And that is EXACTLY what is lacking from Jay's game right now.

I know, someone will regale me with tails of his marvelous work ethic, about how he was showing up the past few weeks to get up to speed on the new offense. Great, he did a little overtime. Thats nice. Why not man up and talk to your supervisor about your gripes, or at the very least your damn boss.

He's acting like some hourly union worker who the second he's a little butt hurt about how things are going he calls his BA (Bus Cook) to whine about how unfair the job is being. Not like a high level salaried employee who puts the company high up his list of priorities.

Man-Goblin
03-16-2009, 07:35 PM
http://neighbors.denverpost.com/viewtopic.php?p=695238

Okay, here it is. The poster on this board was quoting someone with the stats on the Denver Post forum. So actually Armstrong stole it from the forum on the site of his very own newspaper. Pretty awesome reporting.

I guess you have to fill 3 paragraphs somehow, Jim. Good job. Meanwhile, there are very good columnists and reporters out of work from the Rocky Mountain news. Anyways, carry on.

BroncoMan4ever
03-16-2009, 07:35 PM
Maybe poor special teams is why we gained so much yardage without scoring.

that and inside the red zone we lack the RB to still get yards, and the play calling gets really conservative and we stop playing aggressive

Circle Orange
03-16-2009, 07:37 PM
Forget peace. Give Jay Cutler a chance

A lot of numbers have been flying around in the midst of the Jay Cutler-Josh McDaniels spat. Some of the most interesting involve Cutler's record in games in which the Broncos have allowed 30-plus points.

For the record, it's 3-12. To put those numbers in perspective, Cutler has played two full seasons and five games of a third. Donovan McNabb has played 10 NFL seasons and is 3-16 when the Eagles allow 30-plus.

Eli Manning? He's 1-16 in such games. Jake Plummer during his days in Our Town was 0-10. Matt Cassel, if that name rings a bell, was 0-4 last season when the Pats allowed 30-plus.

Oh, and did I mention that defense isn't the only problem? The Broncos have some of the worst special teams in the league, too, forcing Cutler into lousy field position.

Just a thought, but if and when Coach J-Mac mends fences with his quarterback, maybe he can get to work on fixing the real problems.


http://www.denverpost.com/broncos/ci_11909880?source=rss


That 30 plus points thing is a peculiar statistical category to bring up. Okay, no qb thrives with a bad defense. We get it. How about a stat category for qbs who don't understand competition is brought in all the time, like it or not? Or the four game crumble the team put on late? Fourth quarter stayaways? Plus the fact that CASSELL IS IN KANSAS CITY.

Much ado about nothing, still.

SportinOne
03-16-2009, 07:40 PM
I know if I was playing a game for a living making millions, well there isn't too much that would make me upset if that was the case. Not saying it is an excuse or anything, but that would just be me.

I find that hard to believe. I know what you mean, though. I sometimes try to imagine what I would be like if I were in their shoes. But I always just come back to the fact that, at the end of the day, money or not, we are all humans. We get angry, and when we do we say things we shouldn't, do things we shouldn't, and no ammount of any currency is going to calm your nerves, especially if that initial "big payday" was 3 years ago and you are used to being wealthy.

GreatBronco16
03-16-2009, 07:43 PM
I find that hard to believe. I know what you mean, though. I sometimes try to imagine what I would be like if I were in their shoes. But I always just come back to the fact that, at the end of the day, money or not, we are all humans. We get angry, and when we do we say things we shouldn't, do things we shouldn't, and no ammount of any currency is going to calm your nerves, especially if that initial "big payday" was 3 years ago and you are used to being wealthy.

Yeah I know, I'd probably turn out to be an even bigger ass, as my wife calls me. :~ohyah!:

SportinOne
03-16-2009, 07:43 PM
That 30 plus points thing is a peculiar statistical category to bring up. Okay, no qb thrives with a bad defense. We get it. How about a stat category for qbs who don't understand competition is brought in all the time, like it or not? Or the four game crumble the team put on late? Fourth quarter stayaways? Plus the fact that CASSELL IS IN KANSAS CITY.

Much ado about nothing, still.


And... when did Cutler complain about Simms being brought in? Last time i checked, he wasn't complaining about competition as much as he was complaining about the possibility of his coach not wanting him on his team.

SportinOne
03-16-2009, 07:46 PM
Yeah I know, I'd probably turn out to be an even bigger ass, as my wife calls me. :~ohyah!:

For what it's worth, I think I would too.

rastaman
03-16-2009, 08:06 PM
That 30 plus points thing is a peculiar statistical category to bring up. Okay, no qb thrives with a bad defense. We get it. How about a stat category for qbs who don't understand competition is brought in all the time, like it or not? Or the four game crumble the team put on late? Fourth quarter stayaways? Plus the fact that CASSELL IS IN KANSAS CITY.

Much ado about nothing, still.

Are you talking about the last four games w/o a running attack to speak of???? And the same old porous Defense?

oubronco
03-16-2009, 08:13 PM
I think it would be a monumental mistake to trade Jay, what if Mcd isn't coach in 2-3 yrs and Jay's playing and going to probowls with another team
How will everyone feel about that?

garandman
03-16-2009, 08:16 PM
In any owner versus player dispute about money I'm 100% pro-union. I don't see why, given that they'll never charge us fans less, the billionaires should get a larger cut than the millionaires.

But it isn't about how much money you make. Its about being a damn professional. He works in a highly competitive salaried field, there is a lot more expected than all the fry pushers around here apparently thinks goes into a job.

I'm only slightly older than Jay myself, I work in a highly competitive salaried field. I'm also only going to be living in the city I'm currently in for a few more years, and my employers know that, so I don't even have a long term vested interest in the company.

I still kick ass every single day and if the VP of my division calls up with some questions after hours, you know I'm answering it. If the owner ever feels inclined to send me a personal phone call or ask me to show up at a meeting after hours you can be damn sure I'll show.

A lot more goes into being a highly skilled salaried professional in this crazy thing we call the real world than punching your 9-5 and meeting the bare minimum of what's required of you. And that is EXACTLY what is lacking from Jay's game right now.

I know, someone will regale me with tails of his marvelous work ethic, about how he was showing up the past few weeks to get up to speed on the new offense. Great, he did a little overtime. Thats nice. Why not man up and talk to your supervisor about your gripes, or at the very least your damn boss.

He's acting like some hourly union worker who the second he's a little butt hurt about how things are going he calls his BA (Bus Cook) to whine about how unfair the job is being. Not like a high level salaried employee who puts the company high up his list of priorities.

Again, here we go comparing our jobs with that of a pro-athlete. Even though we would like to think the fundamentals of how we approach work should be the same as this situation, it's a different planet in pro-sports. Like it or not, Jay Cutler puts butts in the seats, sells merchandise etc.. in other words he is putting a lot of money in Bowlen's pockets. Going 4-12 next year isn't going to help the Broncos bottom line. It is a business, no doubt, but if you really make a business decision, is it smart letting this escalate the way it has?

IMO, Bowlen should have worked a lot harder to avoid this issue all together.

GreatBronco16
03-16-2009, 08:46 PM
Like it or not, Jay Cutler puts butts in the seats,

The same fans have been selling out the home games in Denver well before Jay Cutler existed. That staduim doesn't sell out because of one player. The is the Denver Broncos, not the Atlanta Vicks.

theAPAOps5
03-16-2009, 08:56 PM
http://neighbors.denverpost.com/viewtopic.php?p=695238

Okay, here it is. The poster on this board was quoting someone with the stats on the Denver Post forum. So actually Armstrong stole it from the forum on the site of his very own newspaper. Pretty awesome reporting.

I guess you have to fill 3 paragraphs somehow, Jim. Good job. Meanwhile, there are very good columnists and reporters out of work from the Rocky Mountain news. Anyways, carry on.

He was supposed to write a blog about Training Camp last year. he would walk around asking anyone who would make eye contact to give him a topic as he had no clue what to write about.

If you listen to the guy on the radio you don't read his crap. I text his radio show on a daily basis saying, "I can't wait for the day that we hear HE GONE, and it means you."

The guy is a hack writer and its sad people from the RMN are out of work while he still collects a pay check.

HEAV
03-16-2009, 09:46 PM
So it's proven (again) that a defense was what really needed improved and not a QB...

fdf
03-16-2009, 10:44 PM
Or they didn't really mean it at all. About 85% of what any front office says is PR.

I used to be a commercial litigator. My bosses were frequently a$$holes. Things did things without consulting ME ME ME that affected ME ME ME. They said things they didn't really mean. I didn't get all bent over every time one of them was rude or dissed me and threaten to go to another firm. And I wasn't even under contract. But go to another firm and some of the folks you work for are going to act like jerks sometimes. It's part of that business.

And working with jerks is part of any tough business. I cannot imagine that pro football is any gentler than working in a law firm. Suppose McDaniels was a jerk--and I'm not at all convinced that was the case. All the drama over it is stupid. Jay needs to grow up. (Or, imho, the more likely scenario is that he knows exactly what he is doing and that what really set him off was the firing of Shanahan and Bates. Since then, he's been looking for a reason to leave and blame someone else.)

It's a bloody Oprah episode when everyone sits around talking about how the organization should have "reached out." What a stupid narrative. He's got a contract, he's been paid millions of dollars. There's nothing in the contract that says the team not only has to pay him millions, but they also promise never to hurt his feelings. Feelings get hurt. Adults get over it. In any event, he's going to bank tens of millions of dollars from some organization over the next five years regardless of his hurt feelings--so my sympathy glands are a bit on low here.

I'm going to miss his razor sharp passes and pocket presence. I'm not going to miss all the stupid drama or the stupid interceptions.

hambone13
03-17-2009, 03:48 AM
I used to be a commercial litigator. My bosses were frequently a$$holes. Things did things without consulting ME ME ME that affected ME ME ME. They said things they didn't really mean. I didn't get all bent over every time one of them was rude or dissed me and threaten to go to another firm. And I wasn't even under contract. But go to another firm and some of the folks you work for are going to act like jerks sometimes. It's part of that business.

And working with jerks is part of any tough business. I cannot imagine that pro football is any gentler than working in a law firm. Suppose McDaniels was a jerk--and I'm not at all convinced that was the case. All the drama over it is stupid. Jay needs to grow up. (Or, imho, the more likely scenario is that he knows exactly what he is doing and that what really set him off was the firing of Shanahan and Bates. Since then, he's been looking for a reason to leave and blame someone else.)

It's a bloody Oprah episode when everyone sits around talking about how the organization should have "reached out." What a stupid narrative. He's got a contract, he's been paid millions of dollars. There's nothing in the contract that says the team not only has to pay him millions, but they also promise never to hurt his feelings. Feelings get hurt. Adults get over it. In any event, he's going to bank tens of millions of dollars from some organization over the next five years regardless of his hurt feelings--so my sympathy glands are a bit on low here.

I'm going to miss his razor sharp passes and pocket presence. I'm not going to miss all the stupid drama or the stupid interceptions.

For someone who should have been trained in law school to be objective, this post implys you missed that. The purpose of "law and litigation" is the opportunity for equal argument in the interest of, "the betterment of any situation."

Being that you've experienced so much 'litigation" I'd think, ethically, you'd have to be a bit more middle of the road unless you were always funded by the "big money" side of the equation.

Q: What's the difference between an pile of **** in the road and a lawyer lying in the road?

A: The pile of **** showed definitive evidence that the driver tried to miss it......