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titan
03-16-2009, 03:35 PM
Listening to Dave Logan on KOA. In the first hour he gave some comments and then had Adam Schefter on in the 2nd hour.

First Logan's comments:

Logan did say he talked to McDaniels 1/2 hour before the show. Logan said it is his opinion that it is "85/15" that Cutler does not play with the Broncos this year. He said this isn't what McDaniels told him - just Logan's opinion of the situation.

This is different than what was being reported on KOA this morning, where it was reported that Logan thought Cutler would be with the broncos qb this year.

Logan said that Cutler spent 10 days with the Broncos learning the new system last month. Two Fridays ago Cutler came to the Broncos office to talk to McDaniels, and McDaniels was on the phone. Cutler waited 30 to 40 minutes to talk to Josh and finally gave up and left, saying he'd catch up with Josh on Monday. That weekend the whole Cassell mess happened.

Logan also said "in all the years i have dealt with the nfl, both as a player and a broadcaster, Jay is the most head strong, stubborn guy I have ever been around." Logan said in his pregame show before the 1st san diego game he asked cutler about his feud with philip rivers the year before. Logan said he gave cutler an out, saying "you probably don't want to talk about this but I have to ask, any ill feelings between you and Rivers?" Cutler said "no no no it's ok to ask - it's not over and it'll never be over between me and Rivers!". This was told as an example of how Cutler holds a grudges. Logan thinks that Cutler feels McDaniels just doesn't want Jay as the qb.

Logan said current staff looks at jay cutler and sees a good qb, not necessarily a franchise qb. "I don't think the current staff is certain that Cutler is the guy to lead the broncos in the future."

Logan said the team needs to find a resolution in the next week or so or the broncos will try to move Cutler.

Now some of you may say Logan is just a broadcaster so his opinion doesn't matter much. But he does have good contacts into the organization, he gave these opinions right after talking to Josh McDaniels, so I put alot of stock in what he says. Logan was careful not to share what he and McDaniels talked about, but still after that call it was Logan's opinion "85/15 chance Cutler is gone"

====

Then Logan had Adam Schefter on. Schefter didn't say anything too revealing except this:

"The shelf life of this story runs through the nfl draft. Lets say the broncos don't deal him by the nfl draft, then he's not getting traded. The focus will then shift to the relationship between these two men. Whether they can get to that point is a different issue.

You are going to hear from now to the nfl draft what the broncos options are, what they can get for Cutler, etc.

Teams are out there sniffing and putting together packages - I know that, this is not even a guess. Is there a team out there that can put together an attractive enough package to make denver bite? - that's the question.

The problem is that the teams that need qb's don't have qb's - Denver will not be getting a qb in return. Who are the broncos taking into the season as starting qb?"

Schefter concluded by saying "all (trade) options are now in play. I
wouldn't have said that a week ago."

OrangeRising
03-16-2009, 03:43 PM
I miss hearing Dave Logan. The man does have tremendous insight into the inner workings of the team, and my guess is that he has already built a good relationship with this new coaching staff. Schefters' credibility almost goes without saying.

When these two start talking in the negative about this McDaniels-Cutler feud, you know it's bad.

And when Logan says 85/15 against Cutler playing QB for the Broncos in '09, you can probably bank it.

What damn shame. Horrible.

Popps
03-16-2009, 03:43 PM
Jay is the most head strong, stubborn guy I have ever been around

Shocking.

HEAV
03-16-2009, 03:45 PM
Logan also said "in all the years i have dealt with the nfl, both as a player and a broadcaster, Jay is the most head strong, stubborn guy I have ever been around."

This is the second time we have heard/read this from a broadcaster.

jutang
03-16-2009, 03:46 PM
McD just hasn't mastered the art of managing strong personalities. Cutler's knack for holding grudges like Rivers is a good case that he just doesn't have the temperament for a franchise NFL QB. Somehow Shanahan and Bates didn't have any problems coaching him up so IMHO the onus is still on McDaniels to mend fences.

broncos-rock
03-16-2009, 03:50 PM
McD just hasn't mastered the art of managing strong personalities. Cutler's knack for holding grudges like Rivers is a good case that he just doesn't have the temperament for a franchise NFL QB. Somehow Shanahan and Bates didn't have any problems coaching him up so IMHO the onus is still on McDaniels to mend fences.

Do you not think Randy Moss is a strong personality?

BroncoInferno
03-16-2009, 03:51 PM
The problem is that the teams that need qb's don't have qb's - Denver will not be getting a qb in return. Who are the broncos taking into the season as starting qb?"

Cleveland is the only team with a guy who might be attractive to McD in Quinn. Byt, you know, I really doubt if McD is the kind of guy who will be scared to death going with an unknown commodity at QB, whether it's Simms or whomever. I think whoever he settles on will be productive, if unspectacular.

telluride
03-16-2009, 03:52 PM
Well, Jay certainly hasn't done anything in the past several weeks to prove that he's a franchise QB, so I don't blame the new regime for questioning that label. Stubborn, whiny, and drunk is no way to go through life, son.

bronco_diesel
03-16-2009, 03:53 PM
Logan also said "in all the years i have dealt with the nfl, both as a player and a broadcaster, Jay is the most head strong, stubborn guy I have ever been around."

This is the second time we have heard/read this from a broadcaster.

who was the other?

TonyR
03-16-2009, 03:53 PM
Somehow Shanahan and Bates didn't have any problems coaching him up...

I'm not so sure about that. Do you think Jay progressed as a football player throughout this last season? I certainly don't think he did.

summerdenver
03-16-2009, 03:54 PM
Logan also said "in all the years i have dealt with the nfl, both as a player and a broadcaster, Jay is the most head strong, stubborn guy I have ever been around."

This is the second time we have heard/read this from a broadcaster.

Jay is the most head strong, stubborn guy I have ever been around

Shocking.

May be. It is safe to say however, that Jay and Bus cook did not plan an exit the moment Bates left.

We can't balme the guy for both being childish and for scheming an exit from Denver.

lex
03-16-2009, 03:55 PM
Logan also said "in all the years i have dealt with the nfl, both as a player and a broadcaster, Jay is the most head strong, stubborn guy I have ever been around."

This is the second time we have heard/read this from a broadcaster.

Ive been hearing "proud and fiercely loyal" as adjectives describing Cutler by those who know him.

jutang
03-16-2009, 03:56 PM
Do you not think Randy Moss is a strong personality?

Looks a lot more that Belichick runs the show in New England, not the assistants.

rovolution
03-16-2009, 03:57 PM
I'm not so sure about that. Do you think Jay progressed as a football player throughout this last season? I certainly don't think he did.

i think after the Hillis injury in the KC game, the whole offense just went downhill, not just Jay.

I cant blame Jay not with the piece of s*** defense we fielded last season. Im sure Shanny just told him to wing it whenever after Hillis went down. Everyone seems to minimize the impact of the Hillis injury last season. It was huge IMO. If peyton stays healthy, we wouldnt be in this fiasco (and i place blame on both sides of the arguement BTW).

hambone13
03-16-2009, 03:58 PM
Do you not think Randy Moss is a strong personality?

Randy Moss has a much more experienced, mature perspective now that he's been around a bit. He'll more than likely be a HOF'er and he was a big a egomaniac as any player other than perhaps TO in history. He also has a reputation of being very reclusive. I'd say you make a strong point that patience could be a virtue in letting Jay grow up a bit. Everyone pretty much agrees he has some growing up to do, he just needs to be managed properly.

Rohirrim
03-16-2009, 04:11 PM
Hopefully, Jay keeps his mouth shut for a while so the Broncos can get the most possible out of a trade.

broncocalijohn
03-16-2009, 04:15 PM
The main juice I got out of that is that teams that need a QB are not going to be able to give one back in return. Unless McDaniels can make Simms in the QB that Cassel was last season, we are screwed!

HEAV
03-16-2009, 04:18 PM
Which player would you think had the bigger ego? 3.5 year,1 year pro-bowl, losing record quarterback or the 9 year,4 pro-bowl, 3 Super Bowl winner,2 Super Bowl MVP, 1 NFL MVP...

HEAV
03-16-2009, 04:19 PM
who was the other?

Randy Cross on Sirius NFL Radio.

titan
03-16-2009, 04:24 PM
Logan also said just now that Cutler and his agent were very disappointed that Pat Bowlen wasn't there at the meeting Saturday with McDaniels. They took that to mean Bowlen was siding with McDaniels.

Logan said McDaniels told him at the end of the Saturday meeting Cutler said he wanted to think about what was discussed. McDaniels told Jay "you have my cell phone # when you are ready to talk." Next thing the broncos hear is bus cook calling xanders with cutler's demand to be traded.

Rohirrim
03-16-2009, 04:25 PM
The main juice I got out of that is that teams that need a QB are not going to be able to give one back in return. Unless McDaniels can make Simms in the QB that Cassel was last season, we are screwed!

My opinion of next season before Shanahan left was that the Broncos could go 4 and 12 with the patchwork defense they had facing the schedule they've got. Even if Jay came in tomorrow with a big grin on his face and ready to play, this team wasn't going to the playoffs barring a total AFCW collapse. I now also believe that Jay would have been a problem sooner or later anyway. Better to cut the losses now and get serious about a rebuild. In other words, Shanahan already left us screwed, blued and tattooed. Now we need to clear the decks and create a new team.

Rohirrim
03-16-2009, 04:26 PM
Logan also said just now that Cutler and his agent were very disappointed that Pat Bowlen wasn't there at the meeting Saturday with McDaniels. They took that to mean Bowlen was siding with McDaniels.

Logan said McDaniels told him at the end of the Saturday meeting Cutler said he wanted to think about what was discussed. McDaniels told Jay "you have my cell phone # when you are ready to talk." Next thing the broncos hear is bus cook calling xanders with cutler's demand to be traded.

Didn't Bowlen pretty much publicly state that he was with McDaniels on this?

DenverBrit
03-16-2009, 04:28 PM
The main juice I got out of that is that teams that need a QB are not going to be able to give one back in return. Unless McDaniels can make Simms in the QB that Cassel was last season, we are screwed!

Next year's draft will have both McCoy and Sam Bradford.
Two winning QBs who are accurate and have leadership personality and ability.
This season is one of transition at best.....the D is going to be fixed through the draft.
We'll be fine no matter how this drama plays out.

lex
03-16-2009, 05:04 PM
Next year's draft will have both McCoy and Sam Bradford.
Two winning QBs who are accurate and have leadership personality and ability.
This season is one of transition at best.....the D is going to be fixed through the draft.
We'll be fine no matter how this drama plays out.

No way.

wandlc
03-16-2009, 05:13 PM
Logan also said just now that Cutler and his agent were very disappointed that Pat Bowlen wasn't there at the meeting Saturday with McDaniels. They took that to mean Bowlen was siding with McDaniels.

Logan said McDaniels told him at the end of the Saturday meeting Cutler said he wanted to think about what was discussed. McDaniels told Jay "you have my cell phone # when you are ready to talk." Next thing the broncos hear is bus cook calling xanders with cutler's demand to be traded.

This is different than Jay saying he would call in a couple of hours. Looks like McD assumed he would call back.

jutang
03-16-2009, 05:13 PM
Next year's draft will have both McCoy and Sam Bradford.
Two winning QBs who are accurate and have leadership personality and ability.
This season is one of transition at best.....the D is going to be fixed through the draft.
We'll be fine no matter how this drama plays out.

It took 10 years to find a QB that could be a legit franchise QB. Cutler isn't there yet, but he's the closest thing since Manning or Brady. Drafting a QB who will be a star is a crap shoot. The Broncos draft a QB it'll be another 3 yrs before you know if it'll pan out.

McD seems to think he can coach someone into a franchise QB... dumbest most overconfident strategy. Picking up Simms... wtf?? Shanahan made Griese and Plummer into serviceable QBs, but he knew he wasn't getting anywhere with them. McD got Cassell to guide them to 11-5, but the Patriots would never win the SB with him.

McD is an offensive minded coach which means the Broncos best chance is winning through it's offense ala Shanahan II. Yet McD is screwing up the offense and hoping Nolan can patchwork a mediocre D while they build through the draft. I don't see the Broncos becoming the Ravens if they lose Cutler... I see them becoming (gulp) the Chiefs.

maher_tyler
03-16-2009, 06:31 PM
The main juice I got out of that is that teams that need a QB are not going to be able to give one back in return. Unless McDaniels can make Simms in the QB that Cassel was last season, we are screwed!

Only this time he'll have an entire off season to coach Simms or who ever up and get him ready...

DenverBrit
03-16-2009, 06:50 PM
It took 10 years to find a QB that could be a legit franchise QB. Cutler isn't there yet, but he's the closest thing since Manning or Brady. Drafting a QB who will be a star is a crap shoot. The Broncos draft a QB it'll be another 3 yrs before you know if it'll pan out.

McD seems to think he can coach someone into a franchise QB... dumbest most overconfident strategy. Picking up Simms... wtf?? Shanahan made Griese and Plummer into serviceable QBs, but he knew he wasn't getting anywhere with them. McD got Cassell to guide them to 11-5, but the Patriots would never win the SB with him.

McD is an offensive minded coach which means the Broncos best chance is winning through it's offense ala Shanahan II. Yet McD is screwing up the offense and hoping Nolan can patchwork a mediocre D while they build through the draft. I don't see the Broncos becoming the Ravens if they lose Cutler... I see them becoming (gulp) the Chiefs.

Cutler has talent, there's no doubt about that. If this episode were the first in which Jay showed a lack of maturity, he would be getting a lot more support.
But it isn't. I still cringe when I think of the press conference (I forget which) where he pouted, stared at his feet, rolled his eyes, fidgeted like a schoolboy and generally acted like an immature 'man child.'
I love his play....most of the time, but I think there has always been doubt about his attitude and maturity. This is a classic example.
Instead of letting it go.....or sitting down one on one with McDaniels, he's turned it into a soap, wanting to be traded.
This scenario felt wrong from the opening bell. Cutler overreacted to the point of WTF?
A team player and leader doesn't react in this manner. It's all about Jay from here on in....new contract, new team.....his way or he hits the highway.
He needs to man up and be the leader he is expected to be. Like you say, he has the potential, but he's not there yet.
If Bowlen wasn't drunk before....this should do it. ;D

DenverBrit
03-16-2009, 06:52 PM
No way.

Ok, I'm probably going to regret this......but why not? ;D

TotallyScrewed
03-16-2009, 06:52 PM
Randy Cross on Sirius NFL Radio.

The mute button can't be pressed fast enough if Randy Cross is about to speak.

TotallyScrewed
03-16-2009, 07:06 PM
Well, Jay certainly hasn't done anything in the past several weeks to prove that he's a franchise QB, so I don't blame the new regime for questioning that label. Stubborn, whiny, and drunk is no way to go through life, son.

Not any worse a reaction than those of the people I know (including myself) who were let go.

Take a bit of that sour apple before you label someone's reaction.

BroncoMan4ever
03-16-2009, 07:10 PM
Die Mcdaniels You Dumb ****ing Retard!!!

wandlc
03-16-2009, 07:25 PM
Logan also said just now that Cutler and his agent were very disappointed that Pat Bowlen wasn't there at the meeting Saturday with McDaniels. They took that to mean Bowlen was siding with McDaniels.

Logan said McDaniels told him at the end of the Saturday meeting Cutler said he wanted to think about what was discussed. McDaniels told Jay "you have my cell phone # when you are ready to talk." Next thing the broncos hear is bus cook calling xanders with cutler's demand to be traded.

This is different than Jay saying he would call in a couple of hours. Looks like McD assumed he would call back.

telluride
03-16-2009, 07:28 PM
Not any worse a reaction than those of the people I know (including myself) who were let go.

Take a bit of that sour apple before you label someone's reaction.

Actually, you could apply that to any of Jay's last three seasons. I've liked the guy, but I cringe when he does his pouty, blame-everyone-but-me act on the sidelines, and after games. Add in the "rookie" mistakes he keeps making, the lack of commitment he shows by continuing to party despite his diabetes, and his outsized sense of entitlement, and you've got a big problem. Would I be happy if Jay stays as QB? Yes. Do I think this team will be crippled if he leaves? No. I honestly think that his will not be a long career, mostly for health reasons.

orinjkrush
03-16-2009, 07:34 PM
my guess is that they are mirror images of each other:
McD with his "entitled" coaching
and JayC with his "entitled" QBing.

they evoke each other.

~Crash~
03-16-2009, 08:10 PM
Do you not think Randy Moss is a strong personality?

yep you are so right lol them QB coaches are all over them there WR's:cowgirl:

halfcreek
03-16-2009, 08:26 PM
Ive been hearing "proud and fiercely loyal" as adjectives describing Cutler by those who know him.

Pray tell from whose lips to your ears?

theAPAOps5
03-16-2009, 08:28 PM
Pray tell from whose lips to your ears?

He doesn't know anyone. The OLine, Scheffler, and his college buddies are about it. The rest of the team either could care less or can't stand him.

UboBronco
03-16-2009, 08:37 PM
Next year's draft will have both McCoy and Sam Bradford.
Two winning QBs who are accurate and have leadership personality and ability.
This season is one of transition at best.....the D is going to be fixed through the draft.
We'll be fine no matter how this drama plays out.

If somehow we got Bradford, I would be estactic. He is the most accurate passer since Montana, I think Brady is just behind Joe, and Bradford would take McDaniels system and excel. The best part about a QB that understands the philosophy of the play, is you control time of possession, which Shannny had his teams do during our super bowl years, I really feel that would return.

If we on could get McCoy, I could handle that, just would prefer Bradford.

ayjackson
03-16-2009, 08:49 PM
Ive been hearing "proud and fiercely loyal" as adjectives describing Cutler by those who know him.

sure you have.