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View Full Version : Jay Cutler: Taking the forum's temperature...


Popps
03-11-2009, 12:28 AM
It's the elephant in the room, and no one is ignoring it. So, we may as well see where people are with regards to the situation. No other issue seems to be able to trump this one right now, and probably for good reason.

So, given the new information that Cutler/Staff have spoken and the end result is that Jay has stated that he is unsure about attending camp, and I would assume unsure about wanting to play for the Broncos... where do you stand on the issue?

Only two options, so round up or round down...

JCMElway
03-11-2009, 12:30 AM
Trade him if he doesn't get in line with the new regime. Right or wrong, that's the way it is.

BroncoDoug
03-11-2009, 12:32 AM
He needs to realize he isn't bigger then the organization...

Popps
03-11-2009, 12:35 AM
Trade him if he doesn't get in line with the new regime. Right or wrong, that's the way it is.

He's hurting his trade-value, though.

One would think that if he didn't want to play in Denver, he'd try to work with the staff to get out. But, he's just sort of folding his arms and pouting.

So, how do we trade that? Certainly, someone will snap him up. No question. But, if Jay wants out of town... wouldn't he help his own cause by appearing NOT to be a problem-case?

BroncoBuff
03-11-2009, 12:36 AM
After Sandy Clough reported the #1 and #20 offer ... a deal that Shannon Sharpe kinda reiterated ... I'm thinking maybe we should have taken it. And the reason I'm changing around on this is that Jay is really acting like a baby. Being torqued off at first is okay - they should've called him and kept him in the loop. But now, feeding a reporter the story "I might not show up Monday" ... that's just not cool. Time is up on the pouting, Jay.

Before I can answer, though ... I need to know what the offer is.
.

Popps
03-11-2009, 12:39 AM
After Sandy Clough reported the #1 and #20 offer ... a deal that Shannon Sharpe kinda reiterated ... I'm thinking maybe we should have taken it. And the reason I'm changing around on this is that Jay is really acting like a baby. Being torqued off at first is okay - they should've called him and kept him in the loop. But now, feeding a reporter the story "I might not show up Monday" ... that's just not cool. Time is up on the pouting, Jay.

Before I can answer, though ... I need to know what the offer is.
.

Well, no matter what the offer is... it's just a temperature poll. At THIS stage, with all of the info in, and considering where we are... do you think the staff is holding up the team's best interests, or do you think Cutler is?

DBroncos4life
03-11-2009, 12:44 AM
I dont repost stuff often but its vaild here too...


There are far worse first round QBs that got more time to prove themselves then what most here are giving Jay. The sad thing is he is way better then guys like Vick, Heath Shuler, Akili Smith, David Carr, Ryan Leaf, Tim Couch, David Klingler, Dan McGwire, and Rick Mirer. Most of them got multiple years to prove their worth in the NFL with little to no reason to believe that they would ever amount to anything other then a bust.

Here we have Jay who doesn't always handle things well but on the field he gives us lots of reasons to believe that he can take us to the next level but instead we get a rookie HC that wants to ship him out before we even know if we have a Manning or a David Carr.

Blueflame
03-11-2009, 12:45 AM
If McD had come into Dove Valley with the full intention of decimating this team, he couldn't have succeeded more completely than he has in just a few short weeks.

OBF1
03-11-2009, 12:46 AM
Make Jay join the military and ship his ass off to Iraq, He will find out how damn good he has it after Ackmed fires a gun at his crying ass.

OBF1
03-11-2009, 12:48 AM
If McD had come into Dove Valley with the full intention of decimating this team, he couldn't have succeeded more completely than he has in just a few short weeks.

Sure he could of, He could of offered our 1st and Jay to the Patriots for Cassell

Blueflame
03-11-2009, 12:48 AM
Make Jay join the military and ship his ass off to Iraq, He will find out how damn good he has it after Ackmed fires a gun at his crying ass.

Better yet, send McD there.

Popps
03-11-2009, 01:02 AM
Make Jay join the military and ship his ass off to Iraq, He will find out how damn good he has it after Ackmed fires a gun at his crying ass.

What, you mean his Sergeant wouldn't apologize to him for potentially sending him on a different mission than he had in mind that day?

Bob's your Information Minister
03-11-2009, 01:08 AM
Cutler's being ****ed raw with a sandpaper condom.

Popps
03-11-2009, 01:11 AM
Taco's telling me that no one else on the planet thinks Jay has potential personality issues. Yep, it's all just lies I'm making up....


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"Is it his sub-.500 winning percentage that gives him his sense of entitlement?"

LOL

Just two more in a long string of professionals who have come out and said that the kid needs to grow the **** up.

But, what would all of these former Superbowl winners know.

Popps
03-11-2009, 01:13 AM
Hey Taco,

What an odd coincidence... these two pros are saying the EXACT same thing I've been saying on this forum since this started.

Jay is hurting HIS OWN cause with his actions. Even if you believe he isn't at fault, he's still hurting HIS OWN cause with his crybaby bull****.

Weird that all of these pros are so off-base, huh?

Wow, these former champions are also saying that Josh is asserting himself as the leader and that Jay needs to respect that.

Who'da thunk it!?

SlipperyPete
03-11-2009, 01:15 AM
He's hurting his trade-value, though.

If you'd have said when the season ended that Jay would be traded, the sky would have been the limit for the kind of compensation we'd get.

Today, I'd say we're probably only looking at getting around 75% of what his actual trade value should be. It's a combo of the team not having a strong position in the negotiations and more of the bloom coming off Jay's rose.

If he doesn't report on Monday, it freefalls from there. Any trade discussions would basically be saying "We've got a problem, do us a favor and take this guy off our hands".

Which isn't to say we won't get anything good. We'd have to at least get someone's first round pick, but any dreams of multiple first-rounders or firsts and seconds and all that is out the window. Honestly, as it stands now I'd be surprised if we managed to get more than Jared Allen went for last year, and a young QB should be worth far more than a DE with a checkered off-field history.

It's mind-boggling how badly this has been handled from both ends.

Popps
03-11-2009, 01:17 AM
If you'd have said when the season ended that Jay would be traded, the sky would have been the limit for the kind of compensation we'd get.

Today, I'd say we're probably only looking at getting around 75% of what his actual trade value should be. It's a combo of the team not having a strong position in the negotiations and more of the bloom coming off Jay's rose.

If he doesn't report on Monday, it freefalls from there. Any trade discussions would basically be saying "We've got a problem, do us a favor and take this guy off our hands".

Which isn't to say we won't get anything good. We'd have to at least get someone's first round pick, but any dreams of multiple first-rounders or firsts and seconds and all that is out the window. Honestly, as it stands now I'd be surprised if we managed to get more than Jared Allen went for last year, and a young QB should be worth far more than a DE with a checkered off-field history.

It's mind-boggling how badly this has been handled from both ends.

Agree, there's probably blame on both sides... but at this point, I think Cutler holds the key to this working out for HIMSELF, as much as anyone, and oddly... he just seems perfectly happy poisoning his own waters.

Blueflame
03-11-2009, 01:20 AM
If you'd have said when the season ended that Jay would be traded, the sky would have been the limit for the kind of compensation we'd get.

Today, I'd say we're probably only looking at getting around 75% of what his actual trade value should be. It's a combo of the team not having a strong position in the negotiations and more of the bloom coming off Jay's rose.

If he doesn't report on Monday, it freefalls from there. Any trade discussions would basically be saying "We've got a problem, do us a favor and take this guy off our hands".

Which isn't to say we won't get anything good. We'd have to at least get someone's first round pick, but any dreams of multiple first-rounders or firsts and seconds and all that is out the window. Honestly, as it stands now I'd be surprised if we managed to get more than Jared Allen went for last year, and a young QB should be worth far more than a DE with a checkered off-field history.

It's mind-boggling how badly this has been handled from both ends.

It's also because McD is widely viewed as a dumbass who would consider trading a franchise QB for a day-old ham sammich.

Bob's your Information Minister
03-11-2009, 01:34 AM
Ripping Cutler for his winning percentage is absolutely idiotic.

You might as well rip Marino for not winning a Super Bowl.

Popps
03-11-2009, 01:39 AM
Ripping Cutler for his winning percentage is absolutely idiotic.

You might as well rip Marino for not winning a Super Bowl.


So, when you give input... knowing people would rather step in dog poop than read your posts, what's your motivation?

BroncoBuff
03-11-2009, 01:42 AM
If McD had come into Dove Valley with the full intention of decimating this team, he couldn't have succeeded more completely than he has in just a few short weeks.

And he has way too much power ... Xanders is obviosuly a figurehead, so that means Josh has Sanahan power already, and he's too young and inexperienced for that. He's in over his head here.

Bob's your Information Minister
03-11-2009, 01:44 AM
So, when you give input... knowing people would rather step in dog poop than read your posts, what's your motivation?

I know you read them, so that's good enough.

BroncoBuff
03-11-2009, 01:48 AM
So, when you give input... knowing people would rather step in dog poop than read your posts, what's your motivation?

Actually I agree with Bob here ... you can't hang a W-L percentage on a rookie/young quarterback for a team with the worst defense in the league, you just can't do it.

And even though Jay might have personality issues - and I think he prolly does - Josh did lie to him. And that breaks the trust between two guys that have to be very close.

I can see both sides - Jay is pouting, and Josh is in over his head.

Natedog24
03-11-2009, 03:21 AM
Sadly I agree with him too, its absolutely idiotic to use W/L record against Cutler given the overall talent level on the team, especially on the D. Its sad when a notorious chief troll is a voice of reason. That said I don't think Cutler deserves any kind of free pass on this, he has acted just as stupid as the front office in this whole thing. So both the face of the franchise player and the head coach/front office have both come across looking like idiots, great...

I REALLY look forward to this offseason ending ASAP, but I fear what kind of team we will when it is over...

These are dark times indeed...

The Joker
03-11-2009, 04:08 AM
There needs to be a 3rd option on the poll.

'Cutler needs to grow the **** up' would suffice.

Broncoman13
03-11-2009, 04:47 AM
It's the elephant in the room, and no one is ignoring it. So, we may as well see where people are with regards to the situation. No other issue seems to be able to trump this one right now, and probably for good reason.

So, given the new information that Cutler/Staff have spoken and the end result is that Jay has stated that he is unsure about attending camp, and I would assume unsure about wanting to play for the Broncos... where do you stand on the issue?

Only two options, so round up or round down...

Sorry Popps, you don't have a answer that fits how I feel. At this point I think McD is doing the right thing. However, he is the one that made it this way. He's made his bed and now he IS sleeping in it.

Cutler will grow up eventually and I'm betting he will be a pro-bowl caliber QB for many years to come. I just don't think it will be with the Denver Broncos at this point. This snafu is going to cost Bowlen millions, but that is just my opinion. Seriously, think of it in these terms. Who in their right mind is going to buy a Broncos jersey right now? I've bought at least 15 jerseys in the last seven or eight years. Griese, Eddie Mac, Cutler x5, Rod Smith x2, John Elway x2, Champ Bailey... all of which are either gone or will soon be gone with this new regime willing to trade them on a moments notice. On the team currently, I'd go buy a Eddie Royal jersey in a heart beat. Problem is, the team has already (reportedly) discussed him in a trade. And, even if that rumor is total BS, the fact of the matter is he could be traded at any time b/c the new FO said as much... for every player! Brandon Marshall, Tony Scheffler, Champ Bailey, DJ Williams... you going to pony up $200+ for a jersey for one of those guys right now? The old timers will continue to sell their jerseys. Elway, Atwater, Smith, Eddie Mac, Meck, TD, etc. But I don't think you'll see a lot of fans spending the money to buy jerseys for any of our current players.

TheReverend
03-11-2009, 04:54 AM
Make Jay join the military and ship his ass off to Iraq, He will find out how damn good he has it after Ackmed fires a gun at his crying ass.

Well, I've been in that situation, and I still have no idea how that could possibly be revelant to the discussion/situation at hand...

Broncoman13
03-11-2009, 05:00 AM
I just don't see it. I see Jay's health being an issue and him being out of the league in just a few years. I certainly sympathize with Jay's beetus but come on Oskie. He's basically getting hit with moving refrigerators 16 times per year. It's a crap shoot if any player can have a long career like a John Elway but even more difficult when you have to be hooked up to tubes just to survive.

I don't think he has the physical toughness and he's showing us that he certainly doesn't have the mental toughness for a long pro bowl career in the NFL.

That's a great point. Honestly I hadn't give the "beetus" much thought in all of this. I guess they could have that concern though it seems that he was able to keep that under control pretty well last year. I don't know enough about the disease to say whether "hits" would have a different effect on Cutler vs someone without diabetes. None the less, good point that has to be taken into consideration.

Meck77
03-11-2009, 05:06 AM
Well there certainly is a decent list of athletes who've done well in sports but I'd imagine it takes a certain mental toughness to pull that off. Does Jay have it? I don't know but he's not committed enough to this game if he's running around Denver getting **** faced on Saturdays before the games I can tell you that much. Heck he may not be committed enough to himself to even be drinking under his circumstances.

Yeah I'm down on Jay Cutler right now. He's just not giving us too much to be excited about. He doesn't strike me as the "I'm going to go out and prove you guys wrong" type guy.

My only hope is that this situation does light a fire under his ass and he stops talking and proving what he thinks he is.

HEAV
03-11-2009, 05:22 AM
Jay Cutler is the "poison pill" left behind by Mike Shanahan. This young man was drafted only to save Shanny's face from the flop of the of AFC Championship game.

Shanny used the kid as the reason to replace Jake Plummer. It was never about making the team better or the future of the Denver Broncos. It was about the future of Mike Shanahan.

The result was splitting the 06 locker room and giving Jay a free rein. Which now has come back and bite this franchise in the ass. Cutler, for all his talent, is a spoiled child that seems to think (like a few shmucks on here) that a rocket arm and a pro bowl invitation means you are on Elway,Marino,Brady,Manning's level.

Now the kid is being told the truth, the truth that you are an employee and part of a team and not the entire team. Yet sadly Jay can't handle this type treatment after having been given the world by daddy Shanahan.

Daddy's gone son. It's time to be a man.

It's time to cut ties with Cutler and get the best value for him.

Broncoman13
03-11-2009, 05:28 AM
I agree with a lot of that Heav. Problem is the Broncos are doing their very best to smear Cutler right now. Tell me again how that improves his value?

HEAV
03-11-2009, 05:52 AM
I agree with a lot of that Heav. Problem is the Broncos are doing their very best to smear Cutler right now. Tell me again how that improves his value?

Sadly both Jay and the FO are lowering his value with this episode.

But a team out there will still trade a #1 for his talent. If Buffalo will sign T.O. then Cutler should and can recieve a #1 draft selection.

Just need more than one team to get into the bidding. Jet's,Lions,Bucs,Rams,Browns,Bears. Just take's two of these teams to create a value for Jay.

NOLA Bronco
03-11-2009, 05:54 AM
[QUOTE=Popps;2325083]
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QUOTE]


I love Rock Hoover.

lex
03-11-2009, 05:55 AM
It's the elephant in the room, and no one is ignoring it. So, we may as well see where people are with regards to the situation. No other issue seems to be able to trump this one right now, and probably for good reason.

So, given the new information that Cutler/Staff have spoken and the end result is that Jay has stated that he is unsure about attending camp, and I would assume unsure about wanting to play for the Broncos... where do you stand on the issue?

Only two options, so round up or round down...

You were doing ok until the "unsure about wanting to play for the Broncos" part. Prior to that, you did a relatively good job of hiding your bias. His problem is with McDaniels and less the Broncos. I know you want to fuse the two together but not everyone thinks of it in those terms. Presenting the question this way is a subtle attempt to sway people into thinking in those terms.

BTW, this is no longer on Jay Cutler. Its more on McDaniels. He went into a meeting with what is probably the teams most important player and where he could of used a velvet glove, he used a hammer. Not smart. The guy is not trustworthy.

Rohirrim
03-11-2009, 06:00 AM
We've got an emo QB. Will that be trouble down the road, or will he grow up? McD and X need to do what's best for the Broncos. If Jay refuses to come in on Monday and continues his tantrum, then I'd be all sweetness and light with him until draft day and then let it be known that Cutler is on the market, because that's the day teams start to panic and deal. Trade him to the Lions for their two firsts and walk away with Curry, Sanchez and Matthews. That would be a good first day.

scttgrd
03-11-2009, 06:08 AM
We've got an emo QB. Will that be trouble down the road, or will he grow up? McD and X need to do what's best for the Broncos. If Jay refuses to come in on Monday and continues his tantrum, then I'd be all sweetness and light with him until draft day and then let it be known that Cutler is on the market, because that's the day teams start to panic and deal. Trade him to the Lions for their two firsts and walk away with Curry, Sanchez and Matthews. That would be a good first day.

Yes let's go get Leinart part 2, and Moss redux. We have a good QB and some people can't seem to crap on him and get rid of him fast enough.

HEAV
03-11-2009, 06:12 AM
We've got an emo QB. Will that be trouble down the road, or will he grow up? McD and X need to do what's best for the Broncos. If Jay refuses to come in on Monday and continues his tantrum, then I'd be all sweetness and light with him until draft day and then let it be known that Cutler is on the market, because that's the day teams start to panic and deal. Trade him to the Lions for their two firsts and walk away with Curry, Sanchez and Matthews. That would be a good first day.


Too much to pay for three first rounders.

Getting the 1st overall would be fine enough, not to mention costly enough that trading out of 12 would be best.

Teams can build through the 2nd round.

alkemical
03-11-2009, 06:14 AM
We've got an emo QB. Will that be trouble down the road, or will he grow up? McD and X need to do what's best for the Broncos. If Jay refuses to come in on Monday and continues his tantrum, then I'd be all sweetness and light with him until draft day and then let it be known that Cutler is on the market, because that's the day teams start to panic and deal. Trade him to the Lions for their two firsts and walk away with Curry, Sanchez and Matthews. That would be a good first day.

<a href="http://s86.photobucket.com/albums/k82/amesj523/?action=view&current=emojaycutler.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i86.photobucket.com/albums/k82/amesj523/emojaycutler.jpg" border="0" alt="Emo Cutler"></a>

alkemical
03-11-2009, 06:15 AM
<a href="http://s86.photobucket.com/albums/k82/amesj523/?action=view&current=griesehitstheroadyr1.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i86.photobucket.com/albums/k82/amesj523/griesehitstheroadyr1.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>

The Joker
03-11-2009, 06:20 AM
BTW, this is no longer on Jay Cutler. Its more on McDaniels. He went into a meeting with what is probably the teams most important player and where he could of used a velvet glove, he used a hammer. Not smart. The guy is not trustworthy.

It's on both of them. McDaniels didn't deal with the situation well in the first place, not at all in my opinion.

But as this goes on, more and more it's becoming apparent that there's something a bit wrong with Jay Cutler. Something that needs to change.

I think the issue is that McDaniels doesn't want to have to treat Cutler with kiddie gloves, Jay is just another member of the team, albeit an important one.

To be an elite QB you need to be made of some real stern stuff, you shouldn't have to be pleaded with and have the coach tell you how much he needs and loves you.

Dealing with adversity is a massive part of being a QB, and Jay is dealing with this particular adversity in a very poor fashion.

Drek
03-11-2009, 06:58 AM
You were doing ok until the "unsure about wanting to play for the Broncos" part. Prior to that, you did a relatively good job of hiding your bias. His problem is with McDaniels and less the Broncos. I know you want to fuse the two together but not everyone thinks of it in those terms. Presenting the question this way is a subtle attempt to sway people into thinking in those terms.

BTW, this is no longer on Jay Cutler. Its more on McDaniels. He went into a meeting with what is probably the teams most important player and where he could of used a velvet glove, he used a hammer. Not smart. The guy is not trustworthy.

Oh REALLY?

CBS4 Sports has also learned that Bowlen attempted to contact Cutler last week, but he was unsuccessful.

Not returning Bowlen's phone calls, yet its all just Cutler v. McDaniels?

Cutler has aligned himself against the entire Broncos organization, apparently because they had the temerity to consider a trade offer for him. Its not just McDaniels, or Xanders, its the entire team short of his friends on the offense. He's made that quite clear when he's said in interviews that he plays "for his teammates on the offense".

Drek
03-11-2009, 07:03 AM
Yes let's go get Leinart part 2, and Moss redux. We have a good QB and some people can't seem to crap on him and get rid of him fast enough.

I'm not a fan of Sanchez, but who are you referring to as Moss redux?

Little Clay? Aaron Curry? They're probably the two most hard nosed, warrior mentality players in this entire draft, as well as both being freakishly durable.

DrFate
03-11-2009, 07:06 AM
I feel like I'm in the twilight zone.

I'll preface - I have no idea what Cutler is like in the locker room. If the players thinks he's a punk, then maybe this is all justified. I don't know. I don't SEE that.

I see a first time head coach (has he ever coached as much as Pop Warner team?) strut into Dove Valley and try to move Cutler (who, at worst, is in the top third of QBs in the league NOW) for a career backup. Matt @#$%@ Cassel couldn't even start in college. If he was Jonny Unitas incarnate, he would have transferred somewhere. But instead he MOVED TO TE.

Sparky has done nothing. Period. Cutler is a pro bowl QB. Systems don't win in this league, players do. Sure some franchises are consistently solid (good front office, good scouting, whatever). The Pats do a good job (cheating doesn't hurt). The Steelers do a good job. But it isn't 'a system'.

I have NO confidence in this new front office. None. They have picked up a ton of retreads free agents and alienated the teams best player.

NFLBRONCO
03-11-2009, 07:09 AM
Sadly both Jay and the FO are lowering his value with this episode.

But a team out there will still trade a #1 for his talent. If Buffalo will sign T.O. then Cutler should and can recieve a #1 draft selection.

Just need more than one team to get into the bidding. Jet's,Lions,Bucs,Rams,Browns,Bears. Just take's two of these teams to create a value for Jay.

With this weak QB class I would think Denver could get solid value. I honestly don't want #1 overall unless we can trade out of it. I bet Philly would offer up 21 and 28 in a heartbeat for Jay.

outdoor_miner
03-11-2009, 07:44 AM
It's too early to answer this question without knowing what is really going on in each camp (as I've said before - we really no almost nothing on the true story of what happened)... I still believe that McDaniels is using Cutler to send a message to the team. I'm not going to go so far as to say that the whole thing was orchestrated, but I believe that McDaniels did not like the attitude he was seeing from Jay (and perhaps other members of the offense), and that he is using this opportunity to take Jay and some other guys down a peg. I think the calling out of teammates (defense), the pouting during games, the Phillip Rivers verbal jabs, the Shanahan/Bates transition, the supposed trade demand... I think this all has left McDaniels (and perhaps others in the organization like Bowlen) thinking that Jay needs a wake-up-call to ever reach his potential. This probably also led them to at least consider the Cassel trade, where McDaniels knew he would have a team-first player and someone that could run his offense. And if reports on the trade value are true; they had to consider it. So, I think Jay is lashing out because the Broncos are goading him (or at least refusing to coddle him), and I can understand his being upset.

However, now that Cassel is no longer available, if the Broncos DO in fact end up trading Cutler, it will be a total, unmitigated disaster for McDaniels and Bowlen. I mean - you do not ever trade a franchise quarterback without winning the deal. You don't do it ever. There was only one single player in the NFL that a deal made some sense for (Cassel), and he is no longer available. If the Broncos trade Cutler for "Plan B", this whole friggin city will be caught up in Cutler drama for years and years. And if Jay goes on to success wherever he lands, it would go down as one of the worst blunders in sports history while the Broncos attempt to "rebuild" (something that the fans were not sold on when McDaniels came on board).

However, until the Broncos do trade Jay, I have to believe that this is part of a plan. Hearing how the Broncos acted in the conference call solidifies my belief in this. They did not sound like they were panicked, trying to kiss Jay's ass to make things better. They told him how things were, that no player is untouchable, and that he is expected to report on Monday. I think this shows they have a plan, and I REALLY doubt that plan involves dealing Jay for a 3-years-til-he-might-be-good QB (Stafford or Sanchez), some over-the-hill bandaid like McNabb, or garbage like Brady Quinn. Obviously, they would get other compensation, but nothing matches a franchise qb except another franchise qb. Nothing. Plus, Jay really doesn't have much power, despite what anyone says. He can't actually force a trade, and the coaches and FO have a LONG time to get him onboard into the new "program". Jay doesn't have to be happy. He just has to make plays on the field. I think the divided locker-room only happens if the offense goes out and sucks, which will almost certainly not happen this year. The defense could be crap once again, but then the focus would be on the D, not on Cutler.

Northman
03-11-2009, 07:45 AM
I still think the staff was wrong initially but at this point its up to Jay to suck it up and move on. But considering he hasnt moved on from the Rivers fiasco im not sure he ever will. I have a feeling trading him might be the only here now. We will see.

theAPAOps5
03-11-2009, 07:49 AM
I am surprised by the poll results. It sure doesn't match my REP! But then again I was being a huge ass so that skews my rep!

2KBack
03-11-2009, 07:49 AM
I feel like I'm in the twilight zone.

I'll preface - I have no idea what Cutler is like in the locker room. If the players thinks he's a punk, then maybe this is all justified. I don't know. I don't SEE that.

I see a first time head coach (has he ever coached as much as Pop Warner team?) strut into Dove Valley and try to move Cutler (who, at worst, is in the top third of QBs in the league NOW) for a career backup. Matt @#$%@ Cassel couldn't even start in college. If he was Jonny Unitas incarnate, he would have transferred somewhere. But instead he MOVED TO TE.

Sparky has done nothing. Period. Cutler is a pro bowl QB. Systems don't win in this league, players do. Sure some franchises are consistently solid (good front office, good scouting, whatever). The Pats do a good job (cheating doesn't hurt). The Steelers do a good job. But it isn't 'a system'.

I have NO confidence in this new front office. None. They have picked up a ton of retreads free agents and alienated the teams best player.

Vince Young is a Pro-bowl QB too.
Sparky has 3 superbowl rings and 4 AFC championship rings.
Cassell likely could have started for Vanderbilt

SoDak Bronco
03-11-2009, 07:55 AM
great hire bowlen

Northman
03-11-2009, 07:55 AM
I am surprised by the poll results. It sure doesn't match my REP! But then again I was being a huge ass so that skews my rep!


Yea, you are a huge ass so i can understand the rep your getting. :thumbs:

theAPAOps5
03-11-2009, 07:56 AM
Yea, you are a huge ass so i can understand the rep your getting. :thumbs:

LOL but I think people are forgetting to change the button from I approve to I disapprove! :spit:

Northman
03-11-2009, 07:57 AM
LOL but I think people are forgetting to change the button from I approve to I disapprove! :spit:

I can fix that. Ha!

Dagmar
03-11-2009, 08:04 AM
2 thirds say man up Cutler, it seems. (67 - 30)

PRBronco
03-11-2009, 08:12 AM
Jay is not my favourite person right now. And to think I drove all over this stupid city just a few weeks ago to find his terrible Donovan McNabb mcfarlane. Glad I didn't find it.

scttgrd
03-11-2009, 08:12 AM
And two thirds will cry the blues when there is another Griese behind center. It's going to be a rough couple of years watching this train wreck. I really hope im wrong, but I can't see how.

Kaylore
03-11-2009, 08:18 AM
I feel much better seeing that an overwhelming majority of people are seeing this clearly.

Here in Denver it's a house divided, but once you get outside of Colorado when you take the homer glasses off it becomes crystal clear what punk he's being.

Taco John
03-11-2009, 08:19 AM
Taco's telling me that no one else on the planet thinks Jay has potential personality issues.



You continue to lie. Where did I ever say that?

Mountain Bronco
03-11-2009, 08:26 AM
This kid hasn't won since high school. Not even a winning record one year. He is bitching like a angry wife PMSing. Yes Jay, if Indy offered Manning and their #1 (ie the right package) for you before draft day the Broncos would pull the trigger (relax OMane it is hypothetical). So would every team except maybe NE.

Send his ass to Detroit and see how he likes them apples. See how big his next contract is when he has two more losing seasons.

TheReverend
03-11-2009, 08:31 AM
I feel much better seeing that an overwhelming majority of people are seeing this clearly.

Here in Denver it's a house divided, but once you get outside of Colorado when you take the homer glasses off it becomes crystal clear what punk he's being.

Here's my bone of contention with that statement.

"Here in Denver it's a house unnecessarily divided" imo

jonny1
03-11-2009, 08:37 AM
I say again, can we possibly wait and see if Cutler shows up Monday before throwing him under the bus?

An unnamed source says that Jay "might not show up for camp" and everyone goes into another tizzy, while the organization itself says that the call went well, and that they are working things out.

scttgrd
03-11-2009, 08:38 AM
This kid hasn't won since high school. Not even a winning record one year. He is b****ing like a angry wife PMSing. Yes Jay, if Indy offered Manning and their #1 (ie the right package) for you before draft day the Broncos would pull the trigger (relax OMane it is hypothetical). So would every team except maybe NE.

Send his ass to Detroit and see how he likes them apples. See how big his next contract is when he has two more losing seasons.

And our brilliant coach wanted to replace him with a QB that couldn't even start anywhere till someone got hurt. How nice is that

ak1971
03-11-2009, 08:39 AM
Cutler should stfu and play. Wah Wah Wah.. I'm paying your salary so shut up and get back to work.

RaiderH8r
03-11-2009, 08:44 AM
Our management team and new HC have failed gloriously, taken a heaping dump right in their pants and pissed down their legs. They've taken stop gaps on D and they're working to dismantle the best thing the team had going for it, the offense. An offense that was ranked 2 in the league, an offense that still went through 7 different RBs. An offense against whom the only game plan for success was to go after Jay and Jay handled it pretty god damned well. So McD wanted his security binky, Matt Cassell. Piss of McD, Jay Cutler's done as much as a head coach as he has, hell, I've done as much as a head coach as McD. In fact, I'm already a better head coach because I didn't crap the bed with my franchise QB when the only other option that could be had was Chris Sims and his missing spleen.

I give you the Broncos Mangement Team:

http://blogs.tampabay.com/photos/uncategorized/spaceballs_1.jpg

Left to Right: Col. Xanders, Dark McHelmet, Pat Bowlen (you gutless drunk).

So far they've only demonstrated they're a couple of rank amateurs who aren't capable of putting together any sort of plan but instead just flit about in a breeze dictated by whatever passing fancy may strike without any consideration of how to manage their club, their roster, or their players. They stumble about in their PR dealings, they're shady in their personal dealings, and their three stooges act of bumbling stupidity is wearing thin. If Shanny was dispensed of for the good of the team then McHelmet and Col. Xanders should not be buying any green bananas. I fear Bowlen may have his head too deep in the bourbon bottle to recognize the obvious problems.

Kaylore
03-11-2009, 08:45 AM
Here's my bone of contention with that statement.

"Here in Denver it's a house unnecessarily divided" imo

I don't disagree with that. There's no question that the FO fumbled the trade talks. But since then I agree with everything the FO has done with the situation.

Cutler's been a b**** since then. I mean not returning calls from the owner? What a child. At least have the decency to answer the phone and say "Hey Pat, I'm going to sit on things down here for a few days. I'll talk to you guys when I get back in town." Now he's debating not coming into camp.

For what? For the team entertaining trade talks and then deciding not to? For "lying to him" because they were shopping him and then decided not to? Nothing is any different. He's still on the team, they came forward and said they aren't trading him, yet Cutler continues to pout.

baja
03-11-2009, 08:54 AM
What you are seeing here is a classic power struggle between a new young head coach and a young egotistical "star" quarterback. The chances of this happening given the youth involved was high and I am not surprised about the situation. My take is Jay will eventually report and he and McD will work thinks out. They will become very tight over a long winning career

TheReverend
03-11-2009, 08:56 AM
I don't disagree with that. There's no question that the FO fumbled the trade talks. But since then I agree with everything the FO has done with the situation.

Cutler's been a b**** since then. I mean not returning calls from the owner? What a child. At least have the decency to answer the phone and say "Hey Pat, I'm going to sit on things down here for a few days. I'll talk to you guys when I get back in town." Now he's debating not coming into camp.

For what? For the team entertaining trade talks and then deciding not to? For "lying to him" because they were shopping him and then decided not to? Nothing is any different. He's still on the team, they came forward and said they aren't trading him, yet Cutler continues to pout.

I think to have that opinion, you have to be buying into rumors, and I think if one is to buy into rumors as true, you have to believe that either McD, Xanders, Ellis or Bowlen IS leaking reports about this situation.

Here's what I know:
They did pursue trading him.
They did not admit to it.
Cutler gave an honest interview with a local douche.

Rumored info:
Still on trade block
Pat called twice did not return call
Asked for trade after Bates was let go
Was not happy with conversation
Might not show up Monday

Personally, I don't even care if he shows up Monday. As long as he's in town for mini-camps and especially TC, then it's all good and repairable. There's a lot of **** getting flung around on both sides of this and that, like the entire situation, has been completely unnecessary.

Sometimes "strong arm" isn't the most successful personnel management tool, whether you're instituting "your way" or not.

theAPAOps5
03-11-2009, 08:56 AM
What you are seeing here is a classic power struggle between a new young head coach and a young egotistical "star" quarterback. The chances of this happening given the youth involved was high and I am not surprised about the situation. My take is Jay will eventually report and he and McD will work thinks out. They will become very tight over a long winning career

Normally I would agree but the way Jay holds onto grudges I don't think the likelihood of him swallowing his pride are very high.

Drek
03-11-2009, 08:57 AM
Here's my bone of contention with that statement.

"Here in Denver it's a house unnecessarily divided" imo

How is it unnecessary?

Cutler thinks he's earned a lot more cache than he really has. He clearly expects to be treated differently from his teammates. The division entirely stems from that. I'd say its pretty damn necessary if this team is every going to win anything, because a mentally weak Cutler isn't going to deliver anything of worth for the Denver Broncos, ever.

TheReverend
03-11-2009, 09:05 AM
How is it unnecessary?

Cutler thinks he's earned a lot more cache than he really has. He clearly expects to be treated differently from his teammates. The division entirely stems from that. I'd say its pretty damn necessary if this team is every going to win anything, because a mentally weak Cutler isn't going to deliver anything of worth for the Denver Broncos, ever.

Is that a serious question?

Archer81
03-11-2009, 09:10 AM
Line of thought 1: OMG, THE WORLD IS ENDING, FIRE EVERYONE, FIRE JESUS, IN FACT FOR ALLOWING THIS TRAVESTY

Line of thought 2: Chill out, let it sort itself out. Time heals all wounds.

Line of thought 3: McDaniels is the HC, period. Cutler is just a bitch who needs to do what his pimp tells him.

At least how I see it around here lately...

:Broncos:

Kaylore
03-11-2009, 09:17 AM
They did pursue trading him.
They did not admit to it.

I don't think this is true. I don't believe they initiated the trade talks, but I do think they considered them. Does that = "tried to trade him?" I don't believe it does. I think it means they listened and it didn't happen. It should be much ado about nothing.

baja
03-11-2009, 09:20 AM
Normally I would agree but the way Jay holds onto grudges I don't think the likelihood of him swallowing his pride are very high.

It will not be like that he will come in and get caught up in learning the new O and playing football soon all this crap will be forgotten.

TheReverend
03-11-2009, 09:22 AM
I don't think this is true. I don't believe they initiated the trade talks, but I do think they considered them. Does that = "tried to trade him?" I don't believe it does. I think it means they listened and it didn't happen. It should be much ado about nothing.

I never said they initiated anything. Negotiations went far enough to have multiple clear offers on the table. That's known and that means the issue was pursued and considered.

It's over, and frankly at this point, I don't care. But it WOULD serve McDaniels well to realize that transparency with your players (PLAYERS not media) on situations that involve them, is a good thing and fosters a mutually respectful environment. That's not kow-tow'ing, that's honesty while still not showing the world your hand.

theAPAOps5
03-11-2009, 09:23 AM
It will not be like that he will come in and get caught up in learning the new O and playing football soon all this crap will be forgotten.

Hmmm maybe but I don't think so. His ego and his grudges are something he holds onto.

DrFate
03-11-2009, 09:27 AM
I don't disagree with that. There's no question that the FO fumbled the trade talks. But since then I agree with everything the FO has done with the situation.

Cutler's been a b**** since then. I mean not returning calls from the owner? What a child. At least have the decency to answer the phone and say "Hey Pat, I'm going to sit on things down here for a few days. I'll talk to you guys when I get back in town." Now he's debating not coming into camp.

For what? For the team entertaining trade talks and then deciding not to? For "lying to him" because they were shopping him and then decided not to? Nothing is any different. He's still on the team, they came forward and said they aren't trading him, yet Cutler continues to pout.

Not truly knowing what was said...

The FO could have, during the call on Monday, played nice with Jay. You are our guy, we were just listening, we know we can win the Super Bowl with you at QB, etc.

Nobody here knows what they said. But I think it was probably more along the lines of 'nobody is untradeable', which isn't the best thing to say, even if it is true.

I go back to one thing, and one thing only. Sparky wanted to replace Cutler with lifetime backup Cassel. That makes me seriously doubt his judgement. The trade that was rumored (we get Cassel and a #1, and give up our #1) was nuts. You don't trade a young QB who is in the top third in the NFL (at worst) for a lifetime backup and a move up in the first round.

Now if the other rumor was true, where the Broncos get multiple first round picks is true, you have more to work with. I still don't understand the motivation. Are you improving THE TEAM by ditching Cutler for draft picks?

Unless Cutler is slashing tires at Dove Valley (who really knows) I don't understand why Sparky didn't come in and worry about the lousy defense. Instead of cutting a quality snapper and pisses off the young hotshot QB.

Drek
03-11-2009, 09:31 AM
Is that a serious question?

Yep.

If your dog keeps ****ting on your carpet do you discipline him or do you say "well, I love him and he plays a mean game of fetch, so thats ok"?

Cutler's personality left no room in this situation. Either he gets treated like the star QB who is above the tradeable peasantry that compose the rest of his roster, or he's unhappy.

There is no rational reason the organization should have kept coddling him, so the division was unavoidable.

We would've had the same problem if Spagnuolo was the HC, because Spags isn't a pussy and he knows how you instill some toughness and accountability in a franchise. Thats all this is. McDaniels is installing a culture of accountability and no one player being above the team here and Jay doesn't like the fact that he's included in those statements.

Dagmar
03-11-2009, 09:32 AM
<a href="http://s86.photobucket.com/albums/k82/amesj523/?action=view&current=emojaycutler.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i86.photobucket.com/albums/k82/amesj523/emojaycutler.jpg" border="0" alt="Emo Cutler"></a>

http://n1.cdn.spikedhumor.com/1/683000/173100_pleaseemos_1.jpg

TheReverend
03-11-2009, 09:35 AM
Yep.

If your dog keeps ****ting on your carpet do you discipline him or do you say "well, I love him and he plays a mean game of fetch, so thats ok"?

Cutler's personality left no room in this situation. Either he gets treated like the star QB who is above the tradeable peasantry that compose the rest of his roster, or he's unhappy.

There is no rational reason the organization should have kept coddling him, so the division was unavoidable.

We would've had the same problem if Spagnuolo was the HC, because Spags isn't a p***Y and he knows how you instill some toughness and accountability in a franchise. Thats all this is. McDaniels is installing a culture of accountability and no one player being above the team here and Jay doesn't like the fact that he's included in those statements.

That has nothing to do with the situation being unneccessary to begin with.

Popps
03-11-2009, 09:38 AM
You continue to lie. Where did I ever say that?

Here's the transaction, Taco...

I told you (the truth) in that Jay doesn't have this reputation for no reason...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Popps

Chris, this guy doesn't have a rep around the league as a crybaby for no reason.

You replied...

Huh?

You always just lie and make stuff up. How can anybody believe a word you ever say?




So, once again... your tactic of just calling people liars or claiming you didnt' say things falls flat. Looks like your very own forum has a ratio of about 3:1 who thinks Cutler is potentially in the wrong here, and I just posted YET ANOTHER couple of pros comments that Cutler is "aloof" and has an overinflated sense of "entitlement."

So, drop the playground tactics. If you disagree, disagree. Own your opinions. Don't just call people liars because you don't want to believe the truth.

Cutler is well-known as a guy who has personality issues. I'm not "lying" about that. Just look around, Taco.

worm
03-11-2009, 09:40 AM
I don't think this is true. I don't believe they initiated the trade talks, but I do think they considered them. Does that = "tried to trade him?" I don't believe it does. I think it means they listened and it didn't happen. It should be much ado about nothing.

The important thing is that Jay believes they initiated talks. Whether that comes from people close to him like his agent....or from when he was in the room next door working on the playbook when he knew big things were happening next door. Who knows?

It would serve McD well to take less of a hard line and at least listen to Jay's perspective. Is this really the issue you want to draw a line in the sand over if you are Josh?

Meck77
03-11-2009, 09:43 AM
<a href="http://s86.photobucket.com/albums/k82/amesj523/?action=view&current=griesehitstheroadyr1.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i86.photobucket.com/albums/k82/amesj523/griesehitstheroadyr1.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>

That's classic. Anyone that defended that fool had their credibility taken with the rest of his trash!

Hulamau
03-11-2009, 10:00 AM
It's also because McD is widely viewed as a dumbass who would consider trading a franchise QB for a day-old ham sammich.

A Dumbass??? I don't hear anyone calling him a dumb-ass except a few people holding Cutler's jock about now? Yes, he could have handled this better and wil no doubt make other mistakes along the curve, but we have no idea as yet what all led up to even considering a trade!

An d McD was NEVER going to settle for a 'day old ham sammich' in any event. He's had a chance to work with Cutler for a couple weeks now on the new system and take his measure of how he is responding, his level of enthusiasm, how he is picking things up and what his demeanor is like etc, and no doubt has gotten a full picture of just how the FO thinks of Cutler both on and off the field as well.

This WAS NOT JUST McD deciding one morning to send Cutler packing I can promise you that!

Plus the more Cutler acts out and exposes his 'self-absorbed sense of entitlement' (look up Cluster B personality disorders for a group of behavior characteristics that feature those two traits prominently), the more I'm thinking McD may well have been both brave and ahead of the curve on this and may well have had good reason to look at Cassel more favorably when it came up than he may have otherwise? We just don't know!

But to call him a dumbass over considering all options at least is not very bright it self in my book.

I'm NOT suggesting nor diagnosing Cutler with any of those four Cluster B personality problems in any formal sense at this point at all. But he is displaying some immature, childish traits that suggest a real hint of some 'possible' issues here. Prove us all wrong Jay and make the right choice this is a fork in the road for you man and you can make the right choice now for yourself and the team or make the wrong one. Its up to you!

Drek
03-11-2009, 10:05 AM
That has nothing to do with the situation being unneccessary to begin with.

You're right, if Jay Cutler had a pair of balls even 1/10th as big as his head is this would be all unnecessary.

Old No. 7
03-11-2009, 10:05 AM
I want that douchebag on your team for the next 15 years.

"May his reign be a long and miserable one".

Old No. 7
03-11-2009, 10:06 AM
They went to take Cutler's temperature and said "open your mouth".


So he bent over and spread his cheeks.

HEAV
03-11-2009, 10:31 AM
That's classic. Anyone that defended that fool had their credibility taken with the rest of his trash!

TJ,Isaac,and Taco John:~ohyah!:

I really miss Jake weak arm and all he was fun to watch and understood the NFL politics....ya he flipped off a fan given him crap, but he wasn't the first and won't be the last.

Everything Jay has done on the field to win me over is now a wash with his attitude off.

Move him and get the value, sign another vet draft a rookie and let move on with 09 season.

TheReverend
03-11-2009, 10:43 AM
You're right, if Jay Cutler had a pair of balls even 1/10th as big as his head is this would be all unnecessary.

That might be the case, and it might not be. A lot of this is media born and sheer rumor. Who knows?

I do know, all of this could've been avoided and was unneccessary. As for the rest, time will tell.

USMCBladerunner
03-11-2009, 11:59 AM
Not truly knowing what was said...

The FO could have, during the call on Monday, played nice with Jay. You are our guy, we were just listening, we know we can win the Super Bowl with you at QB, etc.

Nobody here knows what they said. But I think it was probably more along the lines of 'nobody is untradeable', which isn't the best thing to say, even if it is true.

I go back to one thing, and one thing only. Sparky wanted to replace Cutler with lifetime backup Cassel. That makes me seriously doubt his judgement. The trade that was rumored (we get Cassel and a #1, and give up our #1) was nuts. You don't trade a young QB who is in the top third in the NFL (at worst) for a lifetime backup and a move up in the first round.

Now if the other rumor was true, where the Broncos get multiple first round picks is true, you have more to work with. I still don't understand the motivation. Are you improving THE TEAM by ditching Cutler for draft picks?

Unless Cutler is slashing tires at Dove Valley (who really knows) I don't understand why Sparky didn't come in and worry about the lousy defense. Instead of cutting a quality snapper and pisses off the young hotshot QB.

That is not the draft rumor I heard. Not even close. Even if it was, it didn't happen, so what blame is there to put on McDaniels? The only remaining issue is how to deal with a QB who can't handle the idea that he could possibly be traded and wants the Broncos to taste his ass in order to feel better.

Oh, and all your arguments about Cassel are turned directly on their head by Tom Brady. I'm not saying Cassel will be the man, but all of your points apply equally well to Brady.

Old Dude
03-11-2009, 12:13 PM
I say again, can we possibly wait and see if Cutler shows up Monday before throwing him under the bus?

An unnamed source says that Jay "might not show up for camp" and everyone goes into another tizzy, while the organization itself says that the call went well, and that they are working things out.

That's kinda where I'm at. When this first came out, I thought it was a mountain being made out of a molehill. McD considered trading Jay. Jay's feelings were hurt. Then we found out that the compensation under discussion was pretty substantial and that, if anything, Jay should have been flattered that anyone was even thinking about giving up that much.

This should have all been put to bed a week ago. Instead, here we are with one side saying one thing while undisclosed sources are saying something else. Like Baja, I think they'll set it aside and get on to serious business. At least I hope that happens.

If not, then it really will be a mess, and there will be plenty of blame to spread around, in terms of both McDs management skills and Jay's ego. Neither one would come out of it looking very good.

TheReverend
03-11-2009, 12:21 PM
That's kinda where I'm at. When this first came out, I thought it was a mountain being made out of a molehill. McD considered trading Jay. Jay's feelings were hurt. Then we found out that the compensation under discussion was pretty substantial and that, if anything, Jay should have been flattered that anyone was even thinking about giving up that much.

This should have all been put to bed a week ago. Instead, here we are with one side saying one thing while undisclosed sources are saying something else. Like Baja, I think they'll set it aside and get on to serious business. At least I hope that happens.

If not, then it really will be a mess, and there will be plenty of blame to spread around, in terms of both McDs management skills and Jay's ego. Neither one would come out of it looking very good.

Absolutely. The sticky part is a coach is only as good as his players.

Jay can throw a hissy fit, force his way out of town, and every team in the NFL without a franchise QB will still be waiting in line backing up a truckload of money to him.

Then if he has success at the next stop, the media will turn every touchdown into a notch in McDaniels' noose, and he'll hang quickly if he can't find a monster replacement for him.

Popps
03-11-2009, 12:22 PM
A Dumbass??? I don't hear anyone calling him a dumb-ass except a few people holding Cutler's jock about now?

Her takes are straight off of the playground. Pure slander, no basis in reality.

She thinks it's a major controversy that we signed Lamont Jordan to play a back-up role.

That, and the fact that we listened to an offer to make the team better has led her to her conclusion that she hates the entire staff, now.

Very insightful stuff, huh?

lex
03-11-2009, 12:38 PM
Yep.

If your dog keeps ****ting on your carpet do you discipline him or do you say "well, I love him and he plays a mean game of fetch, so thats ok"?

Cutler's personality left no room in this situation. Either he gets treated like the star QB who is above the tradeable peasantry that compose the rest of his roster, or he's unhappy.

There is no rational reason the organization should have kept coddling him, so the division was unavoidable.

We would've had the same problem if Spagnuolo was the HC, because Spags isn't a p***Y and he knows how you instill some toughness and accountability in a franchise. Thats all this is. McDaniels is installing a culture of accountability and no one player being above the team here and Jay doesn't like the fact that he's included in those statements.

With lies and inconsistencies? How can you hold others accountable when you yourself talk out of both sides of your mouth?

Kaylore
03-11-2009, 12:40 PM
Not truly knowing what was said...

The FO could have, during the call on Monday, played nice with Jay. You are our guy, we were just listening, we know we can win the Super Bowl with you at QB, etc.

Nobody here knows what they said. But I think it was probably more along the lines of 'nobody is untradeable', which isn't the best thing to say, even if it is true.
Why can't they expect their QB to not act like a child and require coddling of this nature? Why can't they just say "here are the rules, play along, you're (presumably) a big boy?"
I go back to one thing, and one thing only. Sparky wanted to replace Cutler with lifetime backup Cassel. That makes me seriously doubt his judgement.
Says who? Cutler? He wasn't even in Colorado! All we know is what the FO is saying and that the trade didn't happen.


Now if the other rumor was true, where the Broncos get multiple first round picks is true, you have more to work with. I still don't understand the motivation. Are you improving THE TEAM by ditching Cutler for draft picks?
Do you trust your team to someone with this kind of maturity to deliver in the clutch?

Unless Cutler is slashing tires at Dove Valley (who really knows) I don't understand why Sparky didn't come in and worry about the lousy defense. Instead of cutting a quality snapper and pisses off the young hotshot QB.
Hyperbole much? Basically every signing has been on defense but let's misrepresent reality to fix our position.

Kaylore
03-11-2009, 12:42 PM
The important thing is that Jay believes they initiated talks. Whether that comes from people close to him like his agent....or from when he was in the room next door working on the playbook when he knew big things were happening next door. Who knows?

It would serve McD well to take less of a hard line and at least listen to Jay's perspective. Is this really the issue you want to draw a line in the sand over if you are Josh?

Absolutely. The team needs to fall in line and work like every other job in America.

lex
03-11-2009, 12:48 PM
Why can't they expect their QB to not act like a child and require coddling of this nature? Why can't they just say "here are the rules, play along, you're (presumably) a big boy?"

Its amazing. When McDaniels acts similarly, people spin it as demanding respect. When Cutler does it, its petulance. When you really think about it, McDaniels demanding respect by playing games is the folly of someone who is too insecure...not a lot different from a thin skinned QB.

Says who? Cutler? He wasn't even in Colorado! All we know is what the FO is saying and that the trade didn't happen.



Do you trust your team to someone with this kind of maturity to deliver in the clutch?
Cutler already has delivered in the clutch a number of times.


Hyperbole much? Basically every signing has been on defense but let's misrepresent reality to fix our position.

Oh the irony.

1. JJ Arrington
2. Corell Buchhalter
3. Lamont Jordan
4. Jabar Gaffney
5. Chris Simms


How many signings have we made? I thought it was something like 12. A little less than half is "basically every"? A fourth of our signings have been RBs. LOL

epicSocialism4tw
03-11-2009, 12:54 PM
He needs to realize he isn't bigger then the organization...

Ten years from now when Cutler is one of the top players in the league and people are saying that we let the big one get away, you wont have this opinion.

Was it better to have Elway or Reeves around?

Do I even need to ask that question?

Kaylore
03-11-2009, 12:56 PM
Oh the irony.

1. JJ Arrington
2. Corell Buchhalter
3. Lamont Jordan
4. Jabar Gaffney
5. Chris Simms


How many signings have we made? I thought it was something like 12. A little less than half is "basically every"? A fourth of our signings have been RBs. LOL

Oh yay. A running back and some backups! Yup clearly McDaniels is going to destroy the offense with all these signings! Moron.

Now list all the guys who are projected starters we signed on defense.

lex
03-11-2009, 01:02 PM
Oh yay. A running back and some backups! Yup clearly McDaniels is going to destroy the offense with all these signings! Moron.

Now list all the guys who are projected starters we signed on defense.

Brian Dawkins? Goodman?

BroncoInferno
03-11-2009, 01:10 PM
With lies and inconsistencies? How can you hold others accountable when you yourself talk out of both sides of your mouth?

I await with baited breath your proof that McDaniels lied about anything.

alkemical
03-11-2009, 01:13 PM
I await with baited breath your proof that McDaniels lied about anything.

http://tbn3.google.com/images?q=tbn:mWU7yPBvRCAX4M:http://www.imperialdobrazil.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/07/tic_tac_meus.jpg

montrose
03-11-2009, 02:53 PM
Brian Dawkins? Goodman?

Dawkins - SS
Hill - FS
Goodman - CB
Davis - ILB
Fields - NT

UberBroncoMan
03-11-2009, 03:00 PM
I think Cutler needs to just suck it up at this point and deal with Mc****Tard. If he has an amazing season, it will be McDaniels not Cutler who will be the replaceable commodity in Bowlens eyes. I mean we got rid of Reeves for Elway, we can do it again with McDaniels for Cutler... oh and Reeves actually coached us to Super Bowls and wasn't half bad.

If Cutler truly wants to be the franchise QB of the Broncos he needs to realize now that the FO is too stubborn to admit their wrong in anything, and he needs to just stick it to them with his play. At this point if he keeps pouting about the stupidity and hotheadedness of the FO he's just going to get himself traded and f over all the team mates he loves and "plays the game for" on offense.

NYBronco
03-11-2009, 03:01 PM
Cutler needs to get his business suit on and show up for work.

MplsBronco
03-11-2009, 03:15 PM
VaJayJay clearly wants out and is trying to spin it as if the Broncos are forcing his hand. I have really enjoyed watching Cutler play but if he leaves I hope he goes to the Lions and wallows in mediocrity.

crowebomber
03-11-2009, 03:16 PM
I guarantee that if Cutler is traded it won't take long before all the fans and this entire board loathes him. Because you know he is going to take his parting shots once he is out the door - that's the kind of guy he is. And he'll have no problems saying things that will tick off the whole organization and fanbase to the point where he is hated on an Eddie Kennison level. Maybe not on an Al Davis level, but in the ballpark.

Tell me that all you Cutler apologists will slowly turn and learn to hate the guy if he leaves the Broncos.

colonelbeef
03-11-2009, 03:34 PM
with a Caveat. Cutler needs to mature a bit here too, but he is only 25 with an ego to match his talent.

It is up to McDaniels to take the first major step in making this right, and so far he has been unable to do so.

DrFate
03-11-2009, 03:39 PM
That is not the draft rumor I heard. Not even close. Even if it was, it didn't happen, so what blame is there to put on McDaniels? The only remaining issue is how to deal with a QB who can't handle the idea that he could possibly be traded and wants the Broncos to taste his ass in order to feel better.

Oh, and all your arguments about Cassel are turned directly on their head by Tom Brady. I'm not saying Cassel will be the man, but all of your points apply equally well to Brady.

Which draft rumor did you hear? I heard the three way trade with Tampa and the Pats - we get Cassel and Tampa's pick, the Pats get our pick, Tampa gets Cutler. ESPN reported thusly:

http://myespn.go.com/blogs/afceast/0-6-0/Why-would-Pats-turn-down-12th-pick-for-Cassel-.html

The Broncos were willing to offer their own first-round pick (12th overall) to the Patriots for Cassel. Obviously, it was conditional upon Cutler being traded and Tampa Bay was the most likely destination, the Bucs willing to part with their first- and third-round picks.


Brady was a starter in college. Cassel can't even say that. I'm not saying that Brady didn't have a quiet start, but he had more pedigree than Cassel ever had.

DrFate
03-11-2009, 03:40 PM
Hyperbole much? Basically every signing has been on defense but let's misrepresent reality to fix our position.

'Basically every signing'? We've signed THREE different RBs, gotten a new long snapper, and signed Gaffney, to say nothing of Simms. Please evaluate how that translates to 'basically every signing'...

(or else you are unsure of the definition of hyperbole...)

Popps
03-11-2009, 03:44 PM
What a difference a week makes.

Well over 2:1 now believe that Cutler may be the source of the issues, or at least holding up progress to better the team.

No surprise as far as I'm concerned. Jay has handled this horribly from the get-go.

2KBack
03-11-2009, 03:46 PM
I think Cutler needs to just suck it up at this point and deal with Mc****Tard. If he has an amazing season, it will be McDaniels not Cutler who will be the replaceable commodity in Bowlens eyes. I mean we got rid of Reeves for Elway, we can do it again with McDaniels for Cutler... oh and Reeves actually coached us to Super Bowls and wasn't half bad.

dude, you talk like McDaniels has coached 3 straight losing or mediocre seasons. A guys has to actually coach a game or two before he can be compared to other coaches.

You do realize that if cutler goes out and tears it up and Denver wins, McD will get just as much, if not more, credit than Cutler right?