PDA

View Full Version : Conner Barwin ,Ziggy Hood and Jarron Gilbert having great combines


Elway777
02-23-2009, 10:13 AM
Conner Barwin with a 4.56 plus 41 inch verticle. Ziggy Hood with a 4.89 plus bench o 30. Gilbert with a 4.78 with a 36 inch verticle. What if the Broncos trade down with Philly and draft 1 . Conner Barwin 2a Ziggy Hood 2b Jarron Gilbert. In The 3 round the go after Donald Brown or Peerman. The Broncos then could offer Watson from the cardinals about 5 year 20 million with 10 million signing bonus to play nose tackle. Watson would cost us a 4 round pick. The Broncos would have a defensive line of Thomas ,Watson ,and Hood with Peterson and Gilbert and Powell off the bench. Barwin and Moss at outside linebacker with Williams and larsen in the middle.

Northman
02-23-2009, 10:15 AM
I see my boy Sidbury did very well. Sweeeet.

gyldenlove
02-23-2009, 10:16 AM
Hood is not a great fit for 3-4.

Barwin is an interesting pick, he has done very well.

rugbythug
02-23-2009, 10:19 AM
Conner Barwin with a 4.56 plus 41 inch verticle. Ziggy Hood with a 4.89 plus bench o 30. Gilbert with a 4.78 with a 36 inch verticle. What if the Broncos trade down with Philly and draft 1 . Conner Barwin 2a Ziggy Hood 2b Jarron Gilbert. In The 3 round the go after Donald Brown or Peerman. The Broncos then could offer Watson from the cardinals about 5 year 20 million with 10 million signing bonus to play nose tackle. Watson would cost us a 4 round pick. The Broncos would have a defensive line of Thomas ,Watson ,and Hood with Peterson and Gilbert and Powell off the bench. Barwin and Moss at outside linebacker with Williams and larsen in the middle.

Can't they still tender him at a higher level?

Kaylore
02-23-2009, 11:21 AM
Connor Barwin: Mike Vrabel II?

Evander Hood: A decent 4-3 prospect.

Jarron Gilbert: Could he play DE in a 3-4? Does anyone know?

cmhargrove
02-23-2009, 11:27 AM
Hood is not a great fit for 3-4.

Barwin is an interesting pick, he has done very well.

I think Ziggy Hood might be a very good 3-4 DE. I mean he might even be better than Tyson Jackson at that spot. He is a high motor player, and his team mates and coaches think he's the hardest working guy on the team.

Doesn't 6'4" 295 fit the 3-4 De mold perfectly? High motor, can beat double teams? I like him, because he's a great football player. Watching Big 12 games - you hear his name a lot. He's a disruptor.

I'd love to see him at 3-4 DE.

UberBroncoMan
02-23-2009, 11:44 AM
I think Ziggy Hood might be a very good 3-4 DE. I mean he might even be better than Tyson Jackson at that spot. He is a high motor player, and his team mates and coaches think he's the hardest working guy on the team.

Doesn't 6'4" 295 fit the 3-4 De mold perfectly? High motor, can beat double teams? I like him, because he's a great football player. Watching Big 12 games - you hear his name a lot. He's a disruptor.

I'd love to see him at 3-4 DE.

The ideal size is 6'6 - 6'7 and 300-310 lb.

cmhargrove
02-23-2009, 11:52 AM
The ideal size is 6'6 - 6'7 and 300-310 lb.

No one on the Steelers is that big.
No one on the Ravens is that big.
There is one Charger (Olshansky) that meets your criteria.

Most of the guys on these successful 3-4 teams are around 6'3" - 6'4" and average about 290.

Kaylore
02-23-2009, 12:00 PM
No one on the Steelers is that big.
No one on the Ravens is that big.
There is one Charger (Olshansky) that meets your criteria.

Most of the guys on these successful 3-4 teams are around 6'3" - 6'4" and average about 290.

Beat me to it.

rugbythug
02-23-2009, 12:00 PM
No one on the Steelers is that big.
No one on the Ravens is that big.
There is one Charger (Olshansky) that meets your criteria.

Most of the guys on these successful 3-4 teams are around 6'3" - 6'4" and average about 290.

Brett Kiesel is that big.

Kaylore
02-23-2009, 12:07 PM
Brett Kiesel is that big.

6'7" and 310? Then his bio is false. He doesn't have the frame to go over 295 and he's closer to 6'5" than 6'6".

Kaylore
02-23-2009, 12:09 PM
his bio lists him at 6'5" and 285. (http://www.nfl.com/players/brettkeisel/profile?id=KEI384586)

rugbythug
02-23-2009, 12:37 PM
his bio lists him at 6'5" and 285. (http://www.nfl.com/players/brettkeisel/profile?id=KEI384586)

oops

gyldenlove
02-23-2009, 12:40 PM
Connor Barwin: Mike Vrabel II?

Evander Hood: A decent 4-3 prospect.

Jarron Gilbert: Could he play DE in a 3-4? Does anyone know?

The book on Gilbert is that he is the 2nd best 4/5 technique DE after Tyson Jackson in the draft.

ludo21
02-23-2009, 12:40 PM
I like all three of those guys. I hope we can land one or 2 of them somehow.

rugbythug
02-23-2009, 12:42 PM
I could be wrong though

MagicHef
02-23-2009, 12:50 PM
Barwin is doing so well, it's starting to scare me. Like Mike Mamula.

HGT-6040
WGT-256
40-4.66
225-21
VERT-40.5
JUMP-10'8"
20S-4.18
60S-
3C-6.87

ludo21
02-23-2009, 12:56 PM
Are they all 2nd - 3rd rounders or will one get into the first somehow??

MVP-06
02-23-2009, 01:13 PM
Connor Barwin: Mike Vrabel II?

Evander Hood: A decent 4-3 prospect.

Jarron Gilbert: Could he play DE in a 3-4? Does anyone know?

6'5" and 290 lbs so should be able to hold it down on the edge. Was reading a little about him the other day and he had like 22 tfl last year so and was the defensive co-mvp in the WAC so his combine stats seem to be lining up with his on the field contributions. Problem is he is probably at worst a high 2nd rounder now

elsid13
02-23-2009, 01:30 PM
Barwin is doing so well, it's starting to scare me. Like Mike Mamula.

HGT-6040
WGT-256
40-4.66
225-21
VERT-40.5
JUMP-10'8"
20S-4.18
60S-
3C-6.87

Unlike Mamula Barwin actually perform in college. Everyone knew that he was very good athlete the question is how easily can he move into OLB in the pros

Kaylore
02-23-2009, 01:31 PM
6'5" and 290 lbs so should be able to hold it down on the edge. Was reading a little about him the other day and he had like 22 tfl last year so and was the defensive co-mvp in the WAC so his combine stats seem to be lining up with his on the field contributions. Problem is he is probably at worst a high 2nd rounder now

Well maybe we can still trade down.

cmhargrove
02-23-2009, 01:38 PM
Back to Connor Barwin - what do you do with this kid?

He is beating the crap out of all the D-linemen. Lots of his combine times and jumps are better than Aaron Curry's. I know, I know - beware of the Combine star. But the fact is, he is beating the most talented LB prospect on the board - so where does this kid get drafted?

e-mac
02-23-2009, 02:09 PM
Conner Barwin goes in the 2nd to one of the 3-4 teams to us who knows but the first day is in his future IMO one of the 3-4 teams miss out on the big name DE conversion guys and he is the consolation pick in the 2nd.

rugbythug
02-23-2009, 02:17 PM
Unlike Mamula Barwin actually perform in college. Everyone knew that he was very good athlete the question is how easily can he move into OLB in the pros

The Myth of Mike Mamula
By Michael David Smith

Mike Mamulaís name is thrown around every year at draft time as the simple shorthand for a player whom N.F.L. general managers fall in love with based solely on the athleticism he displays at the scouting combine, and who then goes on to have a terrible N.F.L. career.

There are just two problems with that perception of Mamula:
1. The Eagles didnít make him the seventh pick in the 1995 draft based solely on his combine performance.
2. His N.F.L. career wasnít terrible.

As to that first part, yes, itís true that Mamula helped himself by showing strength, speed and quickness at the combine. But he also helped himself by showing great production on the field during his career at Boston College. N.F.L. personnel evaluators liked Mamula long before they knew how fast he could run or how high he could jump. As just one example, take this Times story by William N. Wallace on November 13, 1994, after Boston College beat Syracuse, 31-0. Wallace wrote:

There were several National Football League scouts watching the game, and they could not help but give good grades to Mike Mamula, the Boston College defensive end who spent most of the day in the Syracuse backfield.

Mamula was an excellent college player who was attracting N.F.L. attention for his play on the field before the scouting combine.

And what about the second part, that Mamulaís N.F.L. career was terrible? Well, it wasnít. A year ago at this time, Reuben Frank did something extraordinary: He wrote an N.F.L. draft story that actually analyzed Mamulaís career objectively. And an objective analysis of Mamulaís career shows that he was a fine player who had some bad luck with injuries. For his first three seasons in Philadelphia, Mamula was a starter on one of the best defenses in the N.F.L. He missed all of 1998 after suffering a preseason injury, returned in 1999 to record 8.5 sacks, and then suffered more injuries in 2000 before finally calling it a career.

Yes, Eagles fans who say the team would have been better off drafting Warren Sapp are correct. But the Eagles were looking for an edge pass rusher that year, and if they hadnít drafted Mamula, they likely would have passed on Sapp and chosen Derrick Alexander, the defensive end out of Florida State. Alexander finished his career with 20 sacks, 11.5 fewer than Mamula.

Mamula will never be remembered as a great N.F.L. player. But neither should his name be synonymous with failure in the N.F.L. draft.

Michael David Smith also writes for FanHouse, Pro Football Talk, College Football Talk,Football Outsiders and The New York Sun.

chaz
02-23-2009, 02:40 PM
Barwin is doing so well, it's starting to scare me. Like Mike Mamula.

HGT-6040
WGT-256
40-4.66
225-21
VERT-40.5
JUMP-10'8"
20S-4.18
60S-
3C-6.87

His shuttle and 3-cone numbers are unreal! Those are WR/RB/CB quick...pretty impressive but I would rather not draft anyone based on combine numbers. I like picking guys who show up on game day regardless of their 40 times. I don't know anything about him or his production so I can't say.

chaz
02-23-2009, 02:43 PM
Back to Connor Barwin - what do you do with this kid?

He is beating the crap out of all the D-linemen. Lots of his combine times and jumps are better than Aaron Curry's. I know, I know - beware of the Combine star. But the fact is, he is beating the most talented LB prospect on the board - so where does this kid get drafted?

Like I said, I don't know anything about his production. However, for workout warriors in general: I hope they get drafted ahead of us pushing someone back a few spots. I really hope we build our front seven especially with gamers who may not put up great numbers but play hard and make things happen.

elsid13
02-23-2009, 02:57 PM
Like I said, I don't know anything about his production. However, for workout warriors in general: I hope they get drafted ahead of us pushing someone back a few spots. I really hope we build our front seven especially with gamers who may not put up great numbers but play hard and make things happen.

The guy had 12 sack from his first year playing DE after being moved over from TE. I think he was productive enough to play the game.

Dedhed
02-23-2009, 07:50 PM
I like what I've seen from Barwin, but he doesn't belong in the 1st round. Classic combine fallacy putting Barwin in the 1st.

bpc
02-23-2009, 08:29 PM
He looked great at the combine. Pretty crazy in his first year at DE, he had so much production. It's hard to say whether that bodes well for his future. I wasn't blown away by him at the senior bowl at either TE or DE. I think he's a 2nd round (now) or 3rd round guy who is a great prospect to bring along, plug into a system and let him grow.

400HZ
02-23-2009, 08:53 PM
Hood is not a great fit for 3-4.

Barwin is an interesting pick, he has done very well.

You are high. Hood would be the top 3-4 end prospect in the draft if Mizzou didn't surround him with such crap and play against insane offenses every week. He's neck and neck with Tyson Jackson at worst.

bpc
02-23-2009, 09:47 PM
I think Hood is a good prospect, definitely more so for the 4-3, not he 3-4 though. Ziggy isn't a stack and shed player. He's a quick DT, who can penetrate and has a formidable spin move (IMO, the worst pass rush move a DT can have) that keeps linemen off balance.

Jackson is a perfect fit for a 3-4 DE but is a tweener in the 4-3. Probably not fast enough to be an active pass rusher in that set at DE. Most teams would look at moving him to DT.

400HZ
02-23-2009, 09:57 PM
I think Hood is a good prospect, definitely more so for the 4-3, not he 3-4 though. Ziggy isn't a stack and shed player. He's a quick DT, who can penetrate and has a formidable spin move (IMO, the worst pass rush move a DT can have) that keeps linemen off balance.

Jackson is a perfect fit for a 3-4 DE but is a tweener in the 4-3. Probably not fast enough to be an active pass rusher in that set at DE. Most teams would look at moving him to DT.

His spin isn't that good. He has the speed and strength to get off blocks and make plays. He's the type of player who is always around the ball, and he'd be a huge asset rushing from the inside on pass downs. Maybe not elite against the run, but good enough and can get a lot better with improved technique. He gets too high, but that's to be expected in an undisciplined defense like Missouri.

Tyson has the speed and strength but doesn't make it happen often enough.

SouthStndJunkie
02-23-2009, 10:04 PM
Connor Barwin, TE/DE/OLB, Cincinnati is a very intriguing prospect.

Started out at Cincinnati as a basketball player.

Played tight end his first 3 years and had 53 catches for 692 yards and 6 TDs.

Moved to defensive end his senior year and earned 1st Team All-Big East honors and led the conference with 11 sacks.

May project to OLB in a 3-4 defense.

6'4 256 pounds and he ran a 4.66 40 yard dash.

40.5 inch vertical and a 10'8 broad jump....both tops among defensive ends.

6.87 in the 3 cone drill....tops among defensive lineman....as was his 4.18 20 yard shuttle.

Those measurables indicate that he should be able to transition to OLB in the 3-4.

I have seen comparisons of him to Mike Vrabel of New England in terms of potential versatility.

I could definitely see Bill Belichick drafting this guy.

What round will he go in?

Tough to say....probably the 2nd round....but a team at the end of the 1st could get a hard on for him and take him earlier.

Broncos_OTM
02-24-2009, 05:55 AM
Connor Barwin: Mike Vrabel II?

Evander Hood: A decent 4-3 prospect.

Jarron Gilbert: Could he play DE in a 3-4? Does anyone know?he did it his junior year before they went to a 4-3

cmhargrove
02-24-2009, 06:58 AM
Connor Barwin, TE/DE/OLB, Cincinnati is a very intriguing prospect.

Started out at Cincinnati as a basketball player.

Played tight end his first 3 years and had 53 catches for 692 yards and 6 TDs.

Moved to defensive end his senior year and earned 1st Team All-Big East honors and led the conference with 11 sacks.

May project to OLB in a 3-4 defense.

6'4 256 pounds and he ran a 4.66 40 yard dash.

40.5 inch vertical and a 10'8 broad jump....both tops among defensive ends.

6.87 in the 3 cone drill....tops among defensive lineman....as was his 4.18 20 yard shuttle.

Those measurables indicate that he should be able to transition to OLB in the 3-4.

I have seen comparisons of him to Mike Vrabel of New England in terms of potential versatility.

I could definitely see Bill Belichick drafting this guy.

What round will he go in?

Tough to say....probably the 2nd round....but a team at the end of the 1st could get a hard on for him and take him earlier.

Barwin will be this years Eric Weddle. Everyone knows he has loads of talent and can be a jack of all trades, but where does he go in the draft, and what does he play in the NFL?

Regardless, someone will probably really reap some rewards with this kid. He is a truly gifted athlete, seems very intelligent, and just knows how to play football - offense and defense.

Vrabel is a great comparison, and a guy like that would be a very solid second round pick for the right coach.

Mediator12
02-24-2009, 07:07 AM
The thing to like about Connor Barwin is he has proven he has a very quick learning curve mentally, to go along with his outstanding physical skills. This is the kind of player every team wants as a rookie. He will play whatever position he needs to play for a team and learn it, then actually execute it when it counts.

Remember, the whole reason top talented players "bust" is they can never make the mental transition to the NFL level, let alone the Starter/Elite level. Personally, I would be surprised if he made it to the third round after his workouts. He is one of the few players teams can be relatively certain can transition quickly to the next level and he is going to play a value position of OLB/DE for a team who needs a pass rusher. His value has a very high Floor/ and his skills look to have a high ceiling after the combine. He looked very smooth in drills too.

HILife
02-24-2009, 08:00 AM
His shuttle and 3-cone numbers are unreal! Those are WR/RB/CB quick...pretty impressive but I would rather not draft anyone based on combine numbers. I like picking guys who show up on game day regardless of their 40 times. I don't know anything about him or his production so I can't say.

He was a TE that switch to DE his senior year and lead the Big East in sacks. That was his first and only year to play DE in college and did really well.