lets get dirty ........

[Spider]

Obama with a smackdown on repubs ........... basically saying .....look you silly bastards , you ****ed up the last 8 years , what in the hell makes you think you have any answers ..........
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/29050187
excerpt ........ "We are not going to get relief by turning back to the very same policies that for the last eight years doubled the national debt and threw our economy into a tailspin," Obama said — an implicit criticism of the GOP that was in power during that period.

"We can't embrace the losing formula that says only tax cuts will work for every problem we face," he said.

[Garcia Bronco]

Obama with a smackdown on repubs ........... basically saying .....look you silly bastards , you ****ed up the last 8 years , what in the hell makes you think you have any answers ..........
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/29050187
excerpt ........

LOL. So the last 8 years...and you really mean the 6 before the last 2, Congress spent like drunken sailors. That was a failed policy. So what is Congress trying to do now and what is the President advocating? The exact same crap to the tune of the largest spending bill ever in our history. All Obama and Congress are doing is heaping more debt on us all, making his statement completely dumb.

Least we forget Obama promised to lower taxes on 95 percent of Americans. How is that going to happen with a 900 billion stimulus bill? It isn't. Not anytime soon.

[Miss I.]

I feel cheated...I thought this was about something else, like mud wrestling...dang...though mud slinging works too I suppose.

[Spider]

LOL. So the last 8 years...and you really mean the 6 before the last 2, Congress spent like drunken sailors. That was a failed policy. So what is Congress trying to do now and what is the President advocating? The exact same crap to the tune of the largest spending bill ever in our history. All Obama and Congress are doing is heaping more debt on us all, making his statement completely dumb.

Least we forget Obama promised to lower taxes on 95 percent of Americans. How is that going to happen with a 900 billion stimulus bill? It isn't. Not anytime soon.

you go to the link and read , I have on several occasions tried to explain to you how spending money can get you out of debt , but you can not grasp it , it is beyond your level of understanding .........

[TailgateNut]

Why beat around the "Bush". Reality needs to be what we deal with, not addressing the make belief BS the republican administration has wasted our tax dollars on for 8 frigging years. If they can't take the heat for their mistakes, maybe they shouldn't make mistakes, or they should just get the **** out of the way.

[Spider]

See here is the difference in me and you Garcia , I supported the Bail out under Bush , I didnt like the no strings attached ,or the way the stimulus bill was put in motion , but the stimulus bill had to be passed ......... It was good for America ,not just the party .........
the idea behind the first Stimulus bill was dead on , the way it was enforced wasnt .........

[Garcia Bronco]

you go to the link and read , I have on several occasions tried to explain to you how spending money can get you out of debt , but you can not grasp it , it is beyond your level of understanding .........

Spending money will not get you out of debt. Saving money will and making wise investments. But let's look at Obama's statement you've highlight. Tax cuts alone aren't going to help. I agree. Over the past 8 years we've had true tax cuts and increased spending. So the President implies he likes tax cuts and is in favor of them. Remember his campaign promise to lower taxes on 95 percent of Americans? Of course you do. But he's also advocating an 900 billion spending bill.

Sounds like the exact same policy he denouces.

[Miss I.]

you go to the link and read , I have on several occasions tried to explain to you how spending money can get you out of debt , but you can not grasp it , it is beyond your level of understanding .........

Okay Spider, you explain it to me, seriously. Because even though I support Obama, I am not certain the idea behind the stimulous package is any sounder then when Bush did it. I do see spending money as stimulating the economy to a degree, but it won't fix the fundamental problems with the housing market and the overburden of debt held by most Americans.

I am not arguing with you I just want to understand more clearly how this would work.

Thanks. :-*

[Garcia Bronco]

See here is the difference in me and you Garcia , I supported the Bail out under Bush , I didnt like the no strings attached ,or the way the stimulus bill was put in motion , but the stimulus bill had to be passed ......... It was good for America ,not just the party .........
the idea behind the first Stimulus bill was dead on , the way it was enforced wasnt .........

I don't support Government bailouts of any kind. Printing money doesn't do anyone any good and notice all the TARP money that isn't going to where it's supposed to go and notice the banks still aren't lending money. It was bad then. It's bad now.

If George Bush is ****ing moron and Obama does the same economic ****, what does that make Obama?

[Spider]

Spending money will not get you out of debt. Saving money will and making wise investments. But let's look at Obama's statement you've highlight. Tax cuts alone aren't going to help. I agree. Over the past 8 years we've had true tax cuts and increased spending. So the President implies he likes tax cuts and is in favor of them. Remember his campaign promise to lower taxes on 95 percent of Americans? Of course you do. But he's also advocating an 900 billion spending bill.

Sounds like the exact same policy he denouces. tunnel vision , remember the story about buying a 110K rig ? see Taxes is like a paycheck for the government , it is income coming in , and investing aka creating Jobs will cost money , but you put more people to work , increasing the Amount of people paying taxes . follow so far ?
more people paying = you can cut the % of tax rate a person pays .....
come on Garcia , I am a High school drop out and I can follow the formula .

[Spider]

I don't support Government bailouts of any kind. Printing money doesn't do anyone any good and notice all the TARP money that isn't going to where it's supposed to go and notice the banks still aren't lending money. It was bad then. It's bad now.

If George Bush is ****ing moron and Obama does the same economic ****, what does that make Obama?

No what you cant do is separate a good Idea from a failed execution ....
because the bill didnt have any teeth , no penalty for not complying with the terms of tarp money , you in your limited range of thinking , says hey bailouts dont work ...... The Bailout was a good idea , what happened after wasnt .........But it just goes to show , you can not trust Wal Street or Corporate America , they have to be regulated .......So some good did come out of the first bailout

[TailgateNut]

I don't really care how it's done (pumping money into public projects, funding new energy projects, closing the borders, tariffs on overseas products, penalties for companies which outsource their work, mass "round-ups" of illegal workers, ....etc.....), but we need to "create" jobs for American workers. Workers which will pump money back into OUR economy. Current unemployment rates will gnaw at every State and Federal asset due to entitlements (unemployment pay, health care costs, food stamps) and due to the reduced tax revenues. Not only income tax but also declined sales tax revenue.

[Spider]

Okay Spider, you explain it to me, seriously. Because even though I support Obama, I am not certain the idea behind the stimulous package is any sounder then when Bush did it. I do see spending money as stimulating the economy to a degree, but it won't fix the fundamental problems with the housing market and the overburden of debt held by most Americans.

I am not arguing with you I just want to understand more clearly how this would work.

Thanks. :-*

;D you enforce the conditions of the loan , they do it on us , we the people , Wal Street and Corporate America is no better .......
As for the stimulus working , right now banks are not loaning money , so Joe blow the widget maker cant afford to buy a new warehouse or new people and machinery to meet demands, to store more product , also fuel went up in price ( it is down now , but no were near the pre 2000 prices ) so Joe really cant afford to ship his product as much anymore , so Joe has to cut back on shipping , this effects Spider the trucker ,so Spider doesnt spend money like he did before , so stores are effected , they have to cut back on overhead cause they dont have the money coming in like before ....... this is a really simple break down , alot more to it then this , but this gives you the idea

[TailgateNut]

;D you enforce the conditions of the loan , they do it on us , we the people , Wal Street and Corporate America is no better .......
As for the stimulus working , right now banks are not loaning money , so Joe blow the widget maker cant afford to buy a new warehouse or new people and machinery to meet demands, to store more product , also fuel went up in price ( it is down now , but no were near the pre 2000 prices ) so Joe really cant afford to ship his product as much anymore , so Joe has to cut back on shipping , this effects Spider the trucker ,so Spider doesnt spend money like he did before , so stores are effected , they have to cut back on overhead cause they dont have the money coming in like before ....... this is a really simple break down , alot more to it then this , but this gives you the idea


I notice the negative effects of the economy "across the board".

1. Bidding in new projects is a losing battle. If you are successful, most likely the profit margins are dangerously low or non-existant (buying projects to keep our workforce employed).
2. No new residential developments are negating planned public works projects due to reduced new customer fees.
3. Equipment rental fees are at an all-time low (good for us, but an indication of a surplus of available equipment). These companies are cutiing back their long time employees do to reduce business.
4. Material costs (lumber, concrete, etc) decreasing to an abundance of supply (good for us........but they are also cutting employees and some are closing shop).
5. Bonding moneys are "tight". What happened with the STIMULUS??? Being spend on junkets for the bankers?

[Hotrod]

I blame pop tarts

[TailgateNut]

I blame pop tarts

..another insightful comment...

[Hotrod]

..another insightful comment...

I do what I can :)

[Miss I.]

I blame pop tarts

Leave Britney Alone!!!

;)

[Spider]

I notice the negative effects of the economy "across the board".

1. Bidding in new projects is a losing battle. If you are successful, most likely the profit margins are dangerously low or non-existant (buying projects to keep our workforce employed).
2. No new residential developments are negating planned public works projects due to reduced new customer fees.
3. Equipment rental fees are at an all-time low (good for us, but an indication of a surplus of available equipment). These companies are cutiing back their long time employees do to reduce business.
4. Material costs (lumber, concrete, etc) decreasing to an abundance of supply (good for us........but they are also cutting employees and some are closing shop).
5. Bonding moneys are "tight". What happened with the STIMULUS??? Being spend on junkets for the bankers?

I agree 100% , I still say now that the Banks and Wal Street drop the ball on the bail out part one , for part 2 , we impose strict , tough laws on part 2 , and distribute the relief monies through state government ........

[Garcia Bronco]

tunnel vision , remember the story about buying a 110K rig ? see Taxes is like a paycheck for the government , it is income coming in , and investing aka creating Jobs will cost money , but you put more people to work , increasing the Amount of people paying taxes . follow so far ?
more people paying = you can cut the % of tax rate a person pays .....
come on Garcia , I am a High school drop out and I can follow the formula .

You assume the though that's it a one-to-one equation. X lost his job over here and now he can get this job over here through a Governemnt stimulus. Well what if he was a machine operator, but the job opened by the stimulus package is climatology. While this stimlus package will create jobs, it's not going to get people that lost jobs new jobs without re-education.

[Spider]

You assume the though that's it a one-to-one equation. X lost his job over here and now he can get this job over here through a Governemnt stimulus. Well what if he was a machine operator, but the job opened by the stimulus package is climatology. While this stimlus package will create jobs, it's not going to get people that lost jobs new jobs without re-education.

No i dont , what I assume is this is a credit driven economy , and given that if 1 part falters , then you just dont go anywhere and get a job ........Just sit back garcia and be thankful people are looking out for you .......

[Spider]

But lets just say you are correct for a minute here ( I know the shock is alot to handle ;D ) but lets say the Machinist goes off gets reeducated and becomes a climatologist . what does that do ? it puts another person back to work , he is spending money again , so people are buying product , what happens to his old job ? thats right it is there again , so now he can go back to his old job , creating an opening as a climatologist , or stay where he is and there is a new position open for a machinist ..... So I dont get your downside of this argument

[Spider]

I notice the negative effects of the economy "across the board".

1. Bidding in new projects is a losing battle. If you are successful, most likely the profit margins are dangerously low or non-existant (buying projects to keep our workforce employed).
2. No new residential developments are negating planned public works projects due to reduced new customer fees.
3. Equipment rental fees are at an all-time low (good for us, but an indication of a surplus of available equipment). These companies are cutiing back their long time employees do to reduce business.
4. Material costs (lumber, concrete, etc) decreasing to an abundance of supply (good for us........but they are also cutting employees and some are closing shop).
5. Bonding moneys are "tight". What happened with the STIMULUS??? Being spend on junkets for the bankers?

yeah bush didnt work the plan well at all , but you have to be Blue Collar real worker to see whats going on here ....... you see the short comings , cause you deal with them , Garcia and others cant see this aspect , they dont want to see the big picture , in a consumer /Credit driven economy , you have to tinker with it , it is a strong economy , but when 1 part fails , look out , you are on a down hill slide ....... No doubt the repubs ****ed up the first stimulus , I hope Obama kicks ass on the 2 nd one .........0 tolerance for junkets

[barryr]

Geez, spending out the ass has never, ever helped improve any economy. Yet there are those that refuse to see and understand that and insist it has to work sometime, so let's keep doing it. Again, throw money around and hope that works. Yeah, that's always been so successful.

[Spider]

Geez, spending out the ass has never, ever helped improve any economy. Yet there are those that refuse to see and understand that and insist it has to work sometime, so let's keep doing it. Again, throw money around and hope that works. Yeah, that's always been so successful.

and tax cuts have done what ? ....... or did you spring a leak there little buddy ?

[defenseman]

Spending money will not get you out of debt. Saving money will and making wise investments. But let's look at Obama's statement you've highlight. Tax cuts alone aren't going to help. I agree. Over the past 8 years we've had true tax cuts and increased spending. So the President implies he likes tax cuts and is in favor of them. Remember his campaign promise to lower taxes on 95 percent of Americans? Of course you do. But he's also advocating an 900 billion spending bill.

Sounds like the exact same policy he denouces.

Basic rule of economics. It has gone unheeded for the second time in 6 months....not good for the hometeam folks....save your dimes..dman

[Spider]

Basic rule of economics. It has gone unheeded for the second time in 6 months....not good for the hometeam folks....save your dimes..dman

LOL ...... this is absurd ......... the hard core republicans bring this country down ... maybe it isnt your fault , maybe when things get to complex you run to religion and morals .........

[baja]

Why beat around the "Bush". Reality needs to be what we deal with, not addressing the make belief BS the republican administration has wasted our tax dollars on for 8 frigging years. If they can't take the heat for their mistakes, maybe they shouldn't make mistakes, or they should just get the **** out of the way.

Probe: Govt. Bailout Exceeded Market Value of Firms’ Stocks, Assets

A congressional investigation has found the Bush administration overpaid tens of billions of dollars in its purchase of bank stocks and assets under the Wall Street bailout. The Congressional Oversight Panel says the government received assets with a market value worth at least $78 billion less than what it invested. That translates to a roughly thirty-cent loss for every dollar the government spent.

[TailgateNut]

Probe: Govt. Bailout Exceeded Market Value of Firms’ Stocks, Assets

A congressional investigation has found the Bush administration overpaid tens of billions of dollars in its purchase of bank stocks and assets under the Wall Street bailout. The Congressional Oversight Panel says the government received assets with a market value worth at least $78 billion less than what it invested. That translates to a roughly thirty-cent loss for every dollar the government spent.

Don't even get me started on the Bush debacle. Those brainfarts wasted so much money with their whack a mole war. The cost of the war, Halliburton contracts, Civilian quasi military contractors, paying off Iraquis to be friendly, losing millions upon millions (or was it just misplaced), the costs to care for the tens of thousands of injured will haunt budgets for decades to come. Rebuilding costs for work in a nation we attacked and destroyed (A nation which BTW had nothing to do with 9-11) will be paid for by our children and grandchildren. Each and everyone of them should be allowed to kick a Bush supporter in the nuts each day of their lives.

**** these whiney ass bastards (D-man, Barryr, Ass-clown, Td, spdirty and GB to an extent). They had their blinders on while BushCo took us down the drain. In the name of Terror, no expense was to great. Allowing the Oil companies to rape us with $4 a gallon gas was OK. Bailing out banks without any rules attached to the Billion dollar checks was ok. Allowing Halliburton to fleece the taxpayers was OK. Disregarding the Constitution was OK. Torture was OK. Allowing Americans to suffer after national disasters was ok. Evoking executive privilidges to hide their criminal activities was OK.
Ignoring the economic Tsunami was ok. Ignoring the effects of Illegal immigration was ok. Being the greatest failures to ever occupy the WH was ok.

Now they want to whine and blame the person charged with cleaning up a mess created over an 8 year period.

It's hilarious to watch them cry like the little pussies they really are. Pussies, because they didn't do a damn thing while Bush and Cheney were butt****ing our nation with their BS Terror cries.

They didn't listen to the warnings and ignored what was clear to many of us, and now they whine because of the extraordinary measures required to get us the **** out of this mess we're in.

[ghwk]

I do what I can :)

Reach high Dortoh, reach high....