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View Full Version : It's Gotta Be Peppers...


cmhargrove
02-05-2009, 06:38 AM
After all the back and forth about free agency, I can't help coming back to the fact that Julius Peppers would have to be our #1 free agent target.

We might be running a hybrid defense, but will probably be leaning to 3-4.

He is a freakish athlete and can play DE / OLB at a pro bowl level. I say he can play 3-4 OLB because he does get used "standing up" at the end of the line, or can rush from inside or outside. He's 6'7" and already plays over 280.

We know we need to pay at least one difference maker on the line to come help this team. Make it Peppers. Can Robertson, cut Boss, get rid of Niko. Get us someone who will really make a difference.

Make it Peppers.

bap454
02-05-2009, 06:51 AM
Peppers would make an immediate impact and improve our line from day one. Then we could FINALLY cut Engleberger. At all cost we have to improve that spot.

socalorado
02-05-2009, 07:00 AM
IF CAR does indeed franchise him, then forget it. HE will cost too much, and DEN needs those draft picks. Think what MIN had to give KC last year for Allen.

But if they just let him hit the FA market, well then DEN should be the 1st place he comes to. And he shouldnt leave until hes signed.

gyldenlove
02-05-2009, 07:16 AM
I think our priority should be safety. Very few rookie safeties play well and we need a lot of help.

I would like Jermaine Philips, Sean Jones, Atogwe or Leonhard. I think if we get a veteran back there with starting quality we can pair him up with a rookie or Josh Barrett depending on how TC goes.

I would like Haynesworth or Canty as a second priority. I think either will fit well as a DE and I think it would help a lot.

I am not big on giving Peppers a contract like a 4-3 DE and then playing him in a 3-4 OLB spot.

Paladin
02-05-2009, 07:23 AM
Isn't Peppers getting a bit.......(o-god) oldl? (Sigh) Some of you young pups should be quesitoning geriatric picks.

cutthemdown
02-05-2009, 07:25 AM
Peppers also young enough to be worth an investment.

socalorado
02-05-2009, 07:28 AM
I think our priority should be safety. Very few rookie safeties play well and we need a lot of help.

I would like Jermaine Philips, Sean Jones, Atogwe or Leonhard. I think if we get a veteran back there with starting quality we can pair him up with a rookie or Josh Barrett depending on how TC goes.

I would like Haynesworth or Canty as a second priority. I think either will fit well as a DE and I think it would help a lot.

I am not big on giving Peppers a contract like a 4-3 DE and then playing him in a 3-4 OLB spot.
DEN needs a FS.
Jermaine Phillips cant play FS.
Sean Jones can and has played FS very well. He is very versatile.
OJ would just be incredible. Atogwe would completely solve the safety issue in DEN. Pairing him with Barrett allows barrett to just be a In-the-box/TE coverage, @$$ kicking SS. OJ can play centerfield. Sean Jones can do this as well, just not as well as OJ. Leonhard and Dawan Landry to a lesser degree are perfect examples of having a really good FS. They are really just average SS's, but becaue their assignments and responsibilites are lessened, due to having such a force in centerfield, they look like pro bowlers.
basically DEN needs OJ Atogwe.

Haynesworth or Canty. Sure. I like that plan too!
$h!t i like all the plans considering just about every one of em makes DEN much better! Which really isnt saying much for the current cr@p DEN has been running out there on defense.

cmhargrove
02-05-2009, 08:24 AM
I think our priority should be safety. Very few rookie safeties play well and we need a lot of help.

I would like Jermaine Philips, Sean Jones, Atogwe or Leonhard. I think if we get a veteran back there with starting quality we can pair him up with a rookie or Josh Barrett depending on how TC goes.

I would like Haynesworth or Canty as a second priority. I think either will fit well as a DE and I think it would help a lot.

I am not big on giving Peppers a contract like a 4-3 DE and then playing him in a 3-4 OLB spot.

I agree in principle, but I think the popularity of the 3-4, supply and demand, and the sack numbers coming from 3-4 OLB's essentially makes them one of the "priority players" on any 3-4 roster. If a 3-4 OLB can generate 14-18 sacks, they should get paid like any other D-end.

JCMElway
02-05-2009, 09:30 AM
Peppers would make an immediate impact and improve our line from day one. Then we could FINALLY cut Engleberger. At all cost we have to improve that spot.

I think we would still keep Engelberger as a rotational guy.

NFLBRONCO
02-05-2009, 09:50 AM
Peppers would make an immediate impact and improve our line from day one. Then we could FINALLY cut Engleberger. At all cost we have to improve that spot.


I heard the same thing when Champ arrived. Yes we got impact but, it also proved ONE great player won't fix this mess. Peppers looks good on a better D but, will he look good on a D that is not nearly as good. We would be giving a boatload to one player. I'd rather wait a year or two and make such move for that final piece when our D is alot better.

Doggcow
02-05-2009, 09:52 AM
Why dont we just ask Larsen to play DE? We ask him to do everything else.

Beantown Bronco
02-05-2009, 09:55 AM
Isn't Peppers getting a bit.......(o-god) oldl? (Sigh) Some of you young pups should be quesitoning geriatric picks.

He'll only be 29 for the entire 2009 season.....

NFLBRONCO
02-05-2009, 11:26 AM
He'll only be 29 for the entire 2009 season.....

He'll be 32 by the time our D is really solid. Basically we had a 3 yrs of a huge contract and nothing to show for it (see Champ).

ohiobronco2
02-05-2009, 12:23 PM
He'll be 32 by the time our D is really solid. Basically we had a 3 yrs of a huge contract and nothing to show for it (see Champ).

Strahan looked pretty good at 36. Just sayin.

NFLBRONCO
02-05-2009, 01:19 PM
Strahan looked pretty good at 36. Just sayin.

Good point :)

BroncoMan4ever
02-05-2009, 01:21 PM
Strahan looked pretty good at 36. Just sayin.

and for every Strahan, there are 10 washed up former talented DE's who are worth nothing.

cmhargrove
02-05-2009, 01:33 PM
He'll be 32 by the time our D is really solid. Basically we had a 3 yrs of a huge contract and nothing to show for it (see Champ).

We might flip a good part of our offense in 3-4 years.

Try to win now.

Get a difference maker, then draft his replacement.

Peppers is 'da man...

cmhargrove
02-05-2009, 01:35 PM
and for every Strahan, there are 10 washed up former talented DE's who are worth nothing.

Great point, but do you feel Peppers was washed up this year with his 14.5 sacks?

NFLBRONCO
02-05-2009, 02:01 PM
Great point, but do you feel Peppers was washed up this year with his 14.5 sacks?

Question is would he have 14.5 sacks on a bad D?

NFLBRONCO
02-05-2009, 02:02 PM
We might flip a good part of our offense in 3-4 years.

Try to win now.

Get a difference maker, then draft his replacement.

Peppers is 'da man...

True you never know what we will actually do.

yerner
02-05-2009, 02:51 PM
i think peppers wouold almost immiediately change the defense. just having someone that needs to be doubled would free up doom and the others.

BroncoMan4ever
02-05-2009, 03:02 PM
Great point, but do you feel Peppers was washed up this year with his 14.5 sacks?

not yet, but i do feel that he has already hit his peak, and is about to be on the decline. his 2.5 sack season 2 seasons ago is worrisome, and the fact that about half of his sacks this season came against the Raiders and Chiefs, teams that are basically garbage right now, makes me a little cold on him. plus i tend to think if you put him on a line with less talent than the Panthers he will be just an average DE, and that isn't worth the richest DE contract in NFL history. Plus with our switch to a 3-4 defense, i don't want to pay him that much to play a position he never has before.

Paladin
02-05-2009, 03:05 PM
Simeon Rice is looking for work.

Just saying....

Dedhed
02-05-2009, 03:28 PM
I'm not on board with Peppers. Why hasn't he put up those numbers for the last 3 years? Contract players annoy me, and I just don't see him bringing the attitude shift that this defense desperately needs.

ohiobronco2
02-05-2009, 06:57 PM
Simeon Rice is looking for work.

Just saying....

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOo:rofl:

DBroncos4life
02-05-2009, 07:01 PM
I still think Panthers need to tag Gross if they don't get a deal done soon. I would be shocked if they tagged Peppers over Gross.

BroncoMan4ever
02-05-2009, 07:14 PM
I still think Panthers need to tag Gross if they don't get a deal done soon. I would be shocked if they tagged Peppers over Gross.

i think they are dependent on each other. Peppers needs Gross to be seen as one of the best DE in football, and Gross needs Peppers to get good matchups.

cmhargrove
02-05-2009, 07:21 PM
not yet, but i do feel that he has already hit his peak, and is about to be on the decline. his 2.5 sack season 2 seasons ago is worrisome, and the fact that about half of his sacks this season came against the Raiders and Chiefs, teams that are basically garbage right now, makes me a little cold on him. plus i tend to think if you put him on a line with less talent than the Panthers he will be just an average DE, and that isn't worth the richest DE contract in NFL history. Plus with our switch to a 3-4 defense, i don't want to pay him that much to play a position he never has before.

Aren't the Broncos kings of the "incentive laden" contract.

Offer him a good base salary - give him the big bucks if he plays like a bad ass the next three years.

DBroncos4life
02-05-2009, 07:31 PM
i think they are dependent on each other. Peppers needs Gross to be seen as one of the best DE in football, and Gross needs Peppers to get good matchups.

The Panthers have a chance to have a very very young and talented OLine with an amazing set of RBs at their command. Everyone saw how good that OLine got when they started to gel and play together. To lose Gross would be a bigger blow then Peppers. Thats just my opinion though.

Ziggy
02-05-2009, 07:40 PM
Aren't the Broncos kings of the "incentive laden" contract.

Offer him a good base salary - give him the big bucks if he plays like a bad ass the next three years.

Hargrove, we are one of the best teams in the NFL at incentive laden contracts, but why would Peppers do that? He's going to get a huge contract with a good portion of it guarunteed from someone. If we are going to sign him, it's going to have to be on a big-time contract. It's a high risk move. I don't know if Bowlen is willing to do that again or not right now.

BroncoMan4ever
02-05-2009, 08:11 PM
Aren't the Broncos kings of the "incentive laden" contract.

Offer him a good base salary - give him the big bucks if he plays like a bad ass the next three years.

yeah, when it comes to guys who aren't going to get any contracts with big guaranteed money.

Peppers won't even wipe his ass with a contract with less than 20million guaranteed let alone an incentive laden one.

rugbythug
02-06-2009, 07:01 AM
i think they are dependent on each other. Peppers needs Gross to be seen as one of the best DE in football, and Gross needs Peppers to get good matchups.

Gross plays offense.

Bob
02-06-2009, 11:45 AM
and for every Strahan, there are 10 washed up former talented DE's who are worth nothing.

Neil Smith wasnt that bad for two years, at the end of his career....

Dedhed
02-06-2009, 02:30 PM
i think peppers wouold almost immiediately change the defense. just having someone that needs to be doubled would free up doom and the others.

Unfortunately the direction the defense is heading doesn't suit Peppers at all.

cmhargrove
02-06-2009, 03:18 PM
Unfortunately the direction the defense is heading doesn't suit Peppers at all.

He has openly stated he wants to play in the 3-4 defense.

cmhargrove
02-06-2009, 03:47 PM
Opinions on Peppers' best fit split, 3-4 or 4-3?

NFL personnel who would talk can envision defensive end having success in right formula.

By Charles Chandler
cchandler@charlotteobserver.com
Posted: Sunday, Jan. 25, 2009


MOBILE, Ala. NFL coaches, scouts and front-office personnel attending Senior Bowl practices last week disagreed about how Julius Peppers would fare in a 3-4 defense.

Some, such as Jacksonville coach Jack Del Rio, think Peppers could be marvelous if used primarily as a pass-rushing outside linebacker without much pass coverage responsibility in a 3-4.

Others think Peppers is ideally suited to play right defensive end in a 4-3 scheme like the Panthers use. Peppers' agent, Carl Carey, said last week that Peppers is interested in, but not fixed on, playing in a 3-4 scheme and wants to continue his career with a new team after his contract expires Feb.26.

The Panthers haven't said what they'll do about Peppers, but they likely will put their franchise tag on him to either try to keep him for another season or trade him.

Most of the coaches, scouts and team officials approached by the Observer preferred not to discuss Peppers publicly.

Some shared their thoughts but didn't want to be quoted.

Chicago Bears coach Lovie Smith so wanted to avoid the topic that he ended a conversation as soon as Peppers' name was mentioned.

Media in the Chicago area have reported the Bears could have an interest in Peppers, or at least that he'd be a big help to the team.

Those who believe Peppers fits best where he is described him as a prototypical 4-3 defensive end with extraordinary athletic ability and pass-rushing skills who might struggle to convert to a 3-4 scheme.

Others considered Peppers flexible enough to play in either defense as long as his 3-4 role would be as a hybrid end/linebacker, much like Dallas' DeMarcus Ware, who led the NFL this season with 20 sacks, 51/2 more than Peppers.

Cincinnati Bengals coach Marvin Lewis noted Calvin Pace started as a defensive end and now is a 3-4 outside linebacker with the New York Jets.

However, at 6-foot-4, 270 pounds, Pace is about as big as any 3-4 outside linebacker in the NFL.

Peppers is listed at 6-7, 283, but he is believed to weigh closer to 290. If he played in a 3-4, he'd be a new breed.

Lewis said he didn't think size would deter Peppers.

There's “always a first for everything,” said Lewis. “Nobody was as fast and big and strong as him when he came out (in the 2002 draft from North Carolina), so he's got special ability.”

In a 4-3 scheme, there are four defensive linemen backed up by three linebackers, with most of the non-blitzing pass pressure coming from the end positions.

In a 3-4, there are three defensive linemen who generally try to tie up blockers so the four linebackers can make plays. The outside linebackers usually are the primary pass rushers.

There are different types of 3-4 defenses. The Pittsburgh Steelers, under coordinator Dick LeBeau, make liberal use of zone blitzes and have their linebackers drop into pass coverage with some regularity.

Other teams, like Dallas, use players like Ware more sparingly in pass coverage and try to take advantage of their pass rusher's size, speed and power.

In any scheme, Peppers will spend time in a three-point stance as he does at end with the Panthers. However, in 3-4 schemes he would spend more time upright as a linebacker.

Del Rio said Peppers could star in a 3-4 if used properly.

“I don't think there's any question he could stand up and do those types of things,” said Del Rio, who was Carolina's defensive coordinator in 2002 when Peppers was a rookie. “He's a freakish athlete. He's got rare ability.

“I think you'd want to bring him (as a pass rusher) predominantly, but there are a lot of 3-4 teams (who) do bring those guys outside.”

Del Rio said that approach could lead to running backs and tight ends blocking Peppers some, creating mismatches.

“He could be a weapon doing that,” said Del Rio.

But Del Rio stopped short of saying Peppers needs to change schemes.

“To say he'd be better (in a 3-4), I don't know. I think he's been really good in Carolina.”

Asked if he was surprised Peppers indicated through his agent he wants to change teams to reach his full potential, Del Rio said:

“I don't know if he really feels that way or not. I haven't spoken to him. I think he's a terrific player and, from everything I've seen about him, he's been a good person.

“It sounds like maybe he was frustrated.”

BroncoMan4ever
02-06-2009, 04:08 PM
Gross plays offense.

i am mixing up players. the DE that plays opposite of Peppers, i can't think of his name. i think they are co-dependent on each other. remove one from the equation and the other is nothing special

BroncoMan4ever
02-06-2009, 04:16 PM
Neil Smith wasnt that bad for two years, at the end of his career....

yes and for every Neil Smith, Strahan, Bruce Smith, Reggie White guys who played well into their 30's there are 10-20 Trevor Pryce's. He was among the elite when he was in his 20's, got a little older and now is at best a rotational guy. the point i am making is, there are a lot of guys who were awesome then hit the age of 30 and vanished. Personally i feel that Peppers is going to be that type of guy, because even now he is streaky. 2 years ago 2.5 sacks this year 14.5 and about half came against KC and Oakland. i just think some team is going to be strapped to him for 30 million guaranteed and i pray it isn't Denver.

i feel the same way with Hayneworth, that guy is going to get paid and then hit the buffet table and get fat and lazy, and some team is going to wish they never signed him.

BroncoMan4ever
02-06-2009, 04:20 PM
He has openly stated he wants to play in the 3-4 defense.

that doesn't mean he would be any good at it.

we have the same questions with both Doom and Moss. both are DE who are going to have to try and learn the OLB position in a 3-4 to see if they can stick in Denver. Why would we want to bring in another guy who is a DE, move him to OLB and then pay him upwards of 30 million guaranteed to attempt to play a position he never has before?

Elway777
02-06-2009, 04:24 PM
Too expensive to waste that kind of money on a 3-4 defensive end. Unless the Broncos plan on staying in a 4-3 then I would pass on Peppers. If the Broncos are really switching to a 3-4 then I rather go after Suggs.

GoBroncos84
02-06-2009, 05:21 PM
I am hoping we snag one "elite" free agent on defense: Suggs, Haynesworth, Peppers, Ray Lewis, Asomugha. I don't want to trade for anyone that gets franchised, too much to give up. And then I would like to see us get Sean Jones in addition. I think OJ is the most overrated safety in the league. He will take risks and get a pick, but then give up huge plays and do more damage than good. No thanks, not worth the money. Even though we have McDaniels, Nolan, and our d-line coach all coming from 3-4 systems, they will not determine what they will run until after they see what they can get in free agency or the draft. If we signed Haynesworth I bet we stick to the 4-3. I think that is the best case scenario because it would involve the least amount of turnaround on the roster and with him drawing double teams it would really free up Thomas and Dumvervil. Then we would just have to keep him motivated

Traveler
02-07-2009, 03:53 AM
I am hoping we snag one "elite" free agent on defense: Suggs, Haynesworth, Peppers, Ray Lewis, Asomugha. I don't want to trade for anyone that gets franchised, too much to give up. And then I would like to see us get Sean Jones in addition. I think OJ is the most overrated safety in the league. He will take risks and get a pick, but then give up huge plays and do more damage than good. No thanks, not worth the money. Even though we have McDaniels, Nolan, and our d-line coach all coming from 3-4 systems, they will not determine what they will run until after they see what they can get in free agency or the draft. If we signed Haynesworth I bet we stick to the 4-3. I think that is the best case scenario because it would involve the least amount of turnaround on the roster and with him drawing double teams it would really free up Thomas and Dumvervil. Then we would just have to keep him motivated

Say for instance Peppers is franchised and that no team is willing to part with 2009 draft choices. Would you still feel that way if we could land Peppers using picks from 2010 & 2011?

elsid13
02-07-2009, 06:22 AM
Say for instance Peppers is franchised and that no team is willing to part with 2009 draft choices. Would you still feel that way if we could land Peppers using picks from 2010 & 2011?

Carolina won't accept that deal, it hurts them big time. They lose Peppers and get nothing for next two years.

cmhargrove
02-07-2009, 07:03 AM
Say for instance Peppers is franchised and that no team is willing to part with 2009 draft choices. Would you still feel that way if we could land Peppers using picks from 2010 & 2011?

I posted the thread, and I wouldn't even go for Peppers if he were franchised. Two first round picks is just too much.

Only sign him if we can get him in FA. Otherwise, I would rather trade 1 first round pick for another player already under contract - someone who isn't even a free agent.

Spend what we have available under the cap, but giving up too many draft picks right now is suicide.

cmhargrove
02-07-2009, 07:08 AM
yes and for every Neil Smith, Strahan, Bruce Smith, Reggie White guys who played well into their 30's there are 10-20 Trevor Pryce's. He was among the elite when he was in his 20's, got a little older and now is at best a rotational guy. the point i am making is, there are a lot of guys who were awesome then hit the age of 30 and vanished. Personally i feel that Peppers is going to be that type of guy, because even now he is streaky. 2 years ago 2.5 sacks this year 14.5 and about half came against KC and Oakland. i just think some team is going to be strapped to him for 30 million guaranteed and i pray it isn't Denver.

i feel the same way with Hayneworth, that guy is going to get paid and then hit the buffet table and get fat and lazy, and some team is going to wish they never signed him.

You say half the sacks came against our division teams that each blew us out once last year? Do you mean that winning those two games last season would have guaranteed us a spot in the playoffs?

So 10-6 and the playoffs last season? What would that have been worth to the organization?

Broncos_OTM
02-07-2009, 07:28 AM
Too expensive to waste that kind of money on a 3-4 defensive end. Unless the Broncos plan on staying in a 4-3 then I would pass on Peppers. If the Broncos are really switching to a 3-4 then I rather go after Suggs.

I highly doubt Suggs leaves Baltimore. Peppers does not want to play 3-4 end he wants to try 3-4 linebacker.

MechanicalBull
02-07-2009, 11:40 AM
I'm thinking Peppers gets tagged and they sign Gross to a long term deal worry about Peppers next year.

Snarfalicious
02-07-2009, 11:52 AM
Personally, I would much rather see us add guys like Bart Scott, OJ Atogwe, Mike Wright, and possibly trade for Gabe Watson then pidgeonholing ourselves by adding that big-name guy. Would I be angry with an acquisition of Peppers, hell no, but I don't think it would be the smart choice with a bunch of potential starters in FA and the amount of gaping holes in our D. All four of those guys would instantly help our D and could very easily be acquire without breaking the bank. I love Peppers as much as the next guy, I understand his freakish athletic ability, but I see a lot of Peppers in a guy like Everette Brown, who very well might be there at #12, and is about 8 years younger.

GoBroncos84
02-07-2009, 12:10 PM
Say for instance Peppers is franchised and that no team is willing to part with 2009 draft choices. Would you still feel that way if we could land Peppers using picks from 2010 & 2011?

I don't want to give up any 1st round picks. If we could work out a trade with Carolina, not just sign Peppers and be forced to give up 2 1sts, then it would be an option. But I'd rather focus on free agents that require no draft pick compensation. If Gross gets franchised and Peppers walks, then I am all for going after him. Though I have Haynesworth and Suggs above him on my wish list, he would be my number 3.

Cito Pelon
02-07-2009, 01:35 PM
IDK if it's better to try and sign Peppers who will command a huge chunk of cap, or spread the money around on lesser names but we can get three of them.

Sure, Peppers is dynamite and he'll be a nice acquisition regardless of 4-3 or 3-4, but with all the holes to fill on the interior DL, S, LB, CB it might be smarter to go for 3 or 4 FA's out of this group - Rocky Bernard, Dansby, Yeremiah Bell, Shaun Cody, Kelvin hayden, Keiwan Ratliff, Atari Bigby.

Maybe Denver can amount to a better team with 3 or 4 FA's for a little bit more than the price Peppers will command. Supplemented with some of the young studs on D like Larsen, Barrett, the tweener Woodyard and lots of draft picks, maybe it's better to go for more FA's rather than the big splash guy.

BroncoMan4ever
02-07-2009, 03:35 PM
Say for instance Peppers is franchised and that no team is willing to part with 2009 draft choices. Would you still feel that way if we could land Peppers using picks from 2010 & 2011?

YES! even if they were 2010 and 2011 picks i still wouldn 't pull the trigger. 2-1st round picks regardless of being future picks is still too much to give up for any player.
we have been drafting really well and we could snag 2 impact players with both of those picks, or we could trade them off for 1 guy who is probably going to get paid and then become just an average player and have 30million guaranteed.

BroncoMan4ever
02-07-2009, 03:39 PM
You say half the sacks came against our division teams that each blew us out once last year? Do you mean that winning those two games last season would have guaranteed us a spot in the playoffs?

So 10-6 and the playoffs last season? What would that have been worth to the organization?

i am saying half his sacks came against garbage teams, which mean his numbers were inflated.
also, take him off an already strong defense and his numbers will be cut by more than half

HE ISN'T WORTH IT!!!

Paladin
02-07-2009, 04:00 PM
I agree.

I'd rather the Broncos "grow their own" with the new staff with the top picks. I'm uip for Rey and Brace, but I can be bought.

Anybody?

Anybody?.....

cmhargrove
02-07-2009, 05:08 PM
i am saying half his sacks came against garbage teams, which mean his numbers were inflated.
also, take him off an already strong defense and his numbers will be cut by more than half

HE ISN'T WORTH IT!!!

Ok, devil's advocate.

Would you pay out the nose for Peppers if you knew he could get us 16 sacks and 100 tackles next year and play OLB in our new 3-4? Just asking what value you put on a player like that.

BroncoMan4ever
02-07-2009, 05:26 PM
Ok, devil's advocate.

Would you pay out the nose for Peppers if you knew he could get us 16 sacks and 100 tackles next year and play OLB in our new 3-4? Just asking what value you put on a player like that.

NO! because realistically statistical seasons like that never happen.

i would love to have a guy who could put up numbers like that, but realistically, Peppers will be 30 next season, he played well in a contract year after having a 2.5 sack season the year before, about half of his sacks this season came against garbage teams in 2 games, and in about 8 games last season he had no sacks. he is streaky. i want consistency for a guy who will make that kind of money. i want him capable of notching sacks against talented teams, not just crap teams.

also, for an OLB the amount of money he will want is way too much. if we are going to pay an OLB, pay a guy who has played the damn position before, Suggs.

if we are going to bring in a guy to play OLB in a 3-4, i want a guy who has played the position in that system as opposed to a guy who may or may not be any good at it.

plus we can get 2 impact players with the 1st round picks we would need to give up to get him, when most likely as history has shown, guys who play lights out in contract years, get paid and come back down to earth and turn out to be not worth the money

Dedhed
02-08-2009, 06:05 AM
He has openly stated he wants to play in the 3-4 defense.
I don't care what he says he "wants". Paying HUGE money to find out if he can do it would be insane to me.

We could spend millions less to Terrell Suggs, and know that he's a beast in a 3-4.

cmhargrove
02-08-2009, 06:06 PM
Ask Cutler what he thinks of Peppers after that batted ball and pick...

DBroncos4life
02-08-2009, 06:35 PM
NO! because realistically statistical seasons like that never happen.

i would love to have a guy who could put up numbers like that, but realistically, Peppers will be 30 next season, he played well in a contract year after having a 2.5 sack season the year before, about half of his sacks this season came against garbage teams in 2 games, and in about 8 games last season he had no sacks. he is streaky. i want consistency for a guy who will make that kind of money. i want him capable of notching sacks against talented teams, not just crap teams.

also, for an OLB the amount of money he will want is way too much. if we are going to pay an OLB, pay a guy who has played the damn position before, Suggs.

if we are going to bring in a guy to play OLB in a 3-4, i want a guy who has played the position in that system as opposed to a guy who may or may not be any good at it.

plus we can get 2 impact players with the 1st round picks we would need to give up to get him, when most likely as history has shown, guys who play lights out in contract years, get paid and come back down to earth and turn out to be not worth the money

12
7
11
10.5
13
2.5
14

You keep talking about the 2.5 sacks he had the year before and talking about him preforming in a contract year. I think other then the ONE bad year he had he would be atleast worth trying to sign. Freeney had back to back poor sack totals and still no one thinks he isn't a good pass rusher.

ludo21
02-08-2009, 06:41 PM
Id love Peppers, but how will he respond to a position change in Denver?

Br0nc0Buster
02-08-2009, 07:10 PM
Id love Peppers, but how will he respond to a position change in Denver?

apparently he would welcome

He is implying his skills would suite him well for the 3-4

ludo21
02-08-2009, 07:49 PM
Of course he says he would, but any people on here actually think he could transition to it well?

Im no expert on making that switch.. Id imagine a freak like Peppers would be good. But why spend money on a "maybe" when we can get the "sure thing" in Suggs?

chaz
02-08-2009, 09:15 PM
YES! even if they were 2010 and 2011 picks i still wouldn 't pull the trigger. 2-1st round picks regardless of being future picks is still too much to give up for any player.
we have been drafting really well and we could snag 2 impact players with both of those picks, or we could trade them off for 1 guy who is probably going to get paid and then become just an average player and have 30million guaranteed.

Not arguing with our drafting success (although DL is the exception), but tell the Vikings 2 first rounders isn't worth a difference making DE. I know they didn't do much in the playoffs, but Jared was more than worth it. If we could keep our 09 picks (give '10 and '11 first rounders) I would be more than for it. Peppers is a talent unlike many other in any sport, and would really help our defense reformation. Champ, Peppers, DJ, Spencer, Woodyard, Bly, Marcus, some more DL and we have a real defense

BroncoMan4ever
02-08-2009, 10:10 PM
Not arguing with our drafting success (although DL is the exception), but tell the Vikings 2 first rounders isn't worth a difference making DE. I know they didn't do much in the playoffs, but Jared was more than worth it. If we could keep our 09 picks (give '10 and '11 first rounders) I would be more than for it. Peppers is a talent unlike many other in any sport, and would really help our defense reformation. Champ, Peppers, DJ, Spencer, Woodyard, Bly, Marcus, some more DL and we have a real defense

true, but i think if you remove Peppers from a good defense and make him the focal point of a weak defense, he will not have anywhere near the impact he does in a good defense.

plus i don't count the 2007 draft as a Goodmans draft. that was a Bates draft that Shanahan allowed and had final say on

i think if the Goodmans have say in who we pick and with input from good defensive coaches(or at least better than we have had in recent years) that we will get over the hump and begin being able to draft DL well.

Traveler
02-09-2009, 08:22 AM
YES! even if they were 2010 and 2011 picks i still wouldn 't pull the trigger. 2-1st round picks regardless of being future picks is still too much to give up for any player.
we have been drafting really well and we could snag 2 impact players with both of those picks, or we could trade them off for 1 guy who is probably going to get paid and then become just an average player and have 30million guaranteed.

Nowhere did I mention giving away 1st round picks. If memory serves me correctly, I don't recently recall a team giving up the 2 first rounders while trying to acquire a player that has been franchised . It's been mainly second rounders and less.

I'd gladly give up 2nd rounders this year and next for Peppers. No?

edit: I believe Jared Allen fetched quite a bit from the Vikes.

chaz
02-09-2009, 03:35 PM
Nowhere did I mention giving away 1st round picks. If memory serves me correctly, I don't recently recall a team giving up the 2 first rounders while trying to acquire a player that has been franchised . It's been mainly second rounders and less.

I'd gladly give up 2nd rounders this year and next for Peppers. No?

edit: I believe Jared Allen fetched quite a bit from the Vikes.

Ya, peppers will get a nice load of picks for the panthers much like allen

chaz
02-09-2009, 03:38 PM
true, but i think if you remove Peppers from a good defense and make him the focal point of a weak defense, he will not have anywhere near the impact he does in a good defense.


You could make that argument about any superstar...obviously surrounding talent will help, but there is no denying the elite talent. Getting Julius wouldn't end the defensive project, we still need to put solid guys around him but he is a difference maker with very unique skills.

BroncoMan4ever
02-09-2009, 06:14 PM
Nowhere did I mention giving away 1st round picks. If memory serves me correctly, I don't recently recall a team giving up the 2 first rounders while trying to acquire a player that has been franchised . It's been mainly second rounders and less.

I'd gladly give up 2nd rounders this year and next for Peppers. No?

edit: I believe Jared Allen fetched quite a bit from the Vikes.

to get him, the Panthers will be looking at what the Vikes gave up for Allen. which is why i am saying 2-1st round picks would be the price for him.

bap454
02-09-2009, 10:22 PM
to get him, the Panthers will be looking at what the Vikes gave up for Allen. which is why i am saying 2-1st round picks would be the price for him.

Or.....Maybe......one...umm....champ bailey. Wow Im going to get rolled for this one but it has to be asked again. Any takers? The more and more I think of trading our only legit all pro, the more im in favor.?

BroncoBuff
02-09-2009, 10:49 PM
OJ would just be incredible. Atogwe would completely solve the safety issue in DEN. Pairing him with Barrett allows barrett to just be a In-the-box/TE coverage, @$$ kicking SS. OJ can play centerfield.
Let's hope. And like I keep saying, S is better for free agency acquisition than the draft because even the top safeties are not big budget-busters in free agency like LBs or DEs.

cmhargrove
02-10-2009, 06:44 AM
Or.....Maybe......one...umm....champ bailey. Wow Im going to get rolled for this one but it has to be asked again. Any takers? The more and more I think of trading our only legit all pro, the more im in favor.?

I'm not willing to throw away Bailey if we are really trying to build a championship team.

However, it's almost impossible to be a "shutdown corner" with a poor front seven.

Forget about safeties and corners if we don't fix the line, it will be the same old thing in a different package...

BroncoMan4ever
02-10-2009, 11:29 AM
Or.....Maybe......one...umm....champ bailey. Wow Im going to get rolled for this one but it has to be asked again. Any takers? The more and more I think of trading our only legit all pro, the more im in favor.?

it would take more than just Champ for Peppers.

i don't know if i would be ok with unloading Champ. i feel he is too important. not just as one of the elite Corners in the NFL, but he is probably the best run defender on the team. i also believe that his groin injury is healed and with an improvement in the front 7 he will return to the form he was at a couple seasons ago.

elsid13
02-10-2009, 03:21 PM
Or.....Maybe......one...umm....champ bailey. Wow Im going to get rolled for this one but it has to be asked again. Any takers? The more and more I think of trading our only legit all pro, the more im in favor.?

Trading Champ would eat up over 14M of 28M cap space. Still think it a good idea?

bap454
02-10-2009, 06:26 PM
Trading Champ would eat up over 14M of 28M cap space. Still think it a good idea?

Then you also throw in the notion that you can cut Boss Bailey with no retrobute from the departed brother.... whats not to like. Win-Win.

bap454
02-10-2009, 06:29 PM
Trading Champ would eat up over 14M of 28M cap space. Still think it a good idea?

In reality .. No..if thats the case. I must be way off here, but I thought that the contract fully transfers as well with no negative hit on the cap??

Inkana7
02-10-2009, 07:38 PM
In reality .. No..if thats the case. I must be way off here, but I thought that the contract fully transfers as well with no negative hit on the cap??

I thought this as well until I looked it up. That's not true in the NFL.