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watermock
02-04-2009, 06:09 PM
We are going to have Clinton style inflation soon.

Not because the economy is so strong, Vohlker destroyed the post vietnam economy and made the prime rate 22% eliminating usury laws 100 years old. Max % in default was 21%.
We have a nagetive -5% rate now considering inflation. ZIRP monetary policy.

I expect hat soon, we will remenise about the Carter years, because we HAD a strong economy.Vohlker just killed it. Then cc's could chrage whaterve he consuner would accept..21%. 27.99% 34.99%. untill they went under.

Once this trillion dollar stimulus package along with Bush's rebatess, and the comming 1T 2010 stimulus plan, adding to the fed borrowing 54 TRILLION in toxixc assets...


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Broncojef
02-04-2009, 06:37 PM
The government has propped up this econiomy for too long. Instead of looking the American people in the eye and telling the truth for a full recovery in a few years every one wants a quick fix. Print more money, prop up companies that should go bankrupt, make loans to people with no jobs because we don't want to discriminate, put fixes and money into the hands of the people that screwed us in the first place, stimulation packages with outrageous pork, hand tax rebate checks to people who don't pay taxes, overtax the industries hiring people and whine when they start laying people off, elect a far left lunatic fringe that think they can spend their way out of the situation just because their different than a clueless Bush administration, put people in charge of our country that couldn't understand tax code so they didn't pay their own taxes despite the fact they wrote the code, create a fairness doctrine because we don't want people expressing disharmony with things that are obviously wrong, continue to let Mexicans cross the boarder and give them health care and more protection than real Americans, create huge new socialistic programs dispite being in a recession, buy up all the debt being created because other countries just won't invest in our mess anymore...yep I'd say inflation is the next shoe to drop and it may be the least of our worries. Tip of the berg.

Spider
02-04-2009, 06:47 PM
LOL was that Glen Beck ? errr wait this is a serious message .... лллллллллллIs paying attention

Broncojef
02-04-2009, 07:24 PM
GB rocks, nice to see him on FOX.

Spider
02-04-2009, 07:31 PM
GB rocks, nice to see him on FOX.
;D we will agree to disagree

Hallside
02-04-2009, 07:38 PM
Printed currency is a poor proxy for the money supply.

I haven't researched this, but tightening credit conditions (reduced borrowing and lending) could actually result in a net money supply decrease in spite of torrential currency printing. In any event, there would, I imagine, be a substantial offset.

The following chart [wikipedia] clearly demonstrates that the banking system has much more control over the money supply than the US Mint. Compare "currency" (M0) and M1 with the overall money supply:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/9/95/Components_of_the_United_States_money_supply2.svg/570px-Components_of_the_United_States_money_supply2.svg. png

Spider
02-04-2009, 07:40 PM
Printed currency is a poor proxy for the money supply.

I haven't researched this, but tightening credit conditions (reduced borrowing and lending) could actually result in a net money supply decrease in spite of torrential currency printing. In any event, there would, I imagine, be a substantial offset.

The following chart [wikipedia] clearly demonstrates that the banking system has much more control over the money supply than the US Mint. Compare "currency" (M0) and M1 with the overall money supply:


Ok lets pretend i dont know what you are talking about here .. could you put it in laymans terms , so some of the other people ( not me ;D ) can understand ?

Hallside
02-04-2009, 07:54 PM
Ok lets pretend i dont know what you are talking about here .. could you put it in laymans terms , so some of the other people ( not me ;D ) can understand ?

The force at work is fractional reserve banking. Let's say you deposit $100 cash in your bank. With a 5:1 reserve requirement, for example, the bank is allowed to give out $500 dollars worth of claims on your money: the bank has $100, you have a claim to $100, and the bank can create $400 more out of thin air by lending money to other people.

This is a simplification, but you see. So, with fractional reserves, less lending=less money.

Spider
02-04-2009, 07:55 PM
The force at work is fractional reserve banking. Let's say you deposit $100 cash in your bank. With a 5:1 reserve requirement, for example, the bank is allowed to give out $500 dollars worth of claims on your money: the bank has $100, you have a claim to $100, and the bank can create $400 more out of thin air by lending money to other people.

This is a simplification, but you see. So, with fractional reserves, less lending=less money.

Kinda what I thought

TonyR
02-04-2009, 08:27 PM
...overtax the industries hiring people and whine when they start laying people off...

So let me get this straight. You really think the current layoffs are somehow related to corporations being "overtaxed"? I mean, seriously?

~Crash~
02-04-2009, 09:36 PM
So let me get this straight. You really think the current layoffs are somehow related to corporations being "overtaxed"? I mean, seriously?

no they are adjusting Like told you guys when obama was voted in . I told you guys next year I would not hire a person like I normally do . and people said your crazy.... well I still have not planted tomatoes I should have 3 days ago ... I am thinking of skipping next season because I see no change in the Ideas that got me were I am . fuel prices are still to high and fertilizer is crazy and the sprays are going to kill me so I guess I may be looking for a job ...:sunshine:

if I were to grow I would have to ask a price I cannot get people will do with out. or grow there own.

Spider
02-04-2009, 09:41 PM
no they are adjusting Like told you guys when obama was voted in . I told you guys next year I would not hire a person like I normally do . and people said your crazy.... well I still have not planted tomatoes I should have 3 days ago ... I am thinking of skipping next season because I see no change in the Ideas that got me were I am . fuel prices are still to high and fertilizer is crazy and the sprays are going to kill me so I guess I may be looking for a job ...:sunshine:

if I were to grow I would have to ask a price I cannot get people will do with out. or grow there own.

really we just bought another truck and hired 2 more labors .......

~Crash~
02-04-2009, 09:43 PM
TonyR soaking the rich only sounds good but will end up in a hell of a mess .

~Crash~
02-04-2009, 09:45 PM
really we just bought another truck and hired 2 more labors .......

well I am a small farmer . I have no pull I am done .

Paladin
02-04-2009, 09:46 PM
GB rocks, nice to see him on FOX.

What? Glad he's not on legitimate news channels. Faux News is the best gig he can get......

Spider
02-04-2009, 09:48 PM
well I am a small farmer . I have no pull I am done .

we are a Construction /Trucking out fit in Wyoming .....very seasonal on one end , boss got tired of that, invested and made a trucking Division ....... Construction up north here is a biatch in winter time

~Crash~
02-04-2009, 10:00 PM
I am thinking with all these people losing there houses they are going to need a place to rent .... I been looking into rentals ...I am in no hurry we are making the bills ...I really am not sure were I want to go in my life I am 43 there is a part of me thinking of going to college....who knows I moved here 10 years ago with big dreams(From up north of you lol Idaho) lol I got to say I was doing OK but some were in there I started spinning wheels . I probably should of bought a couple of green houses and started raising in the winter I would of been rich but I am tired of using my back at this point . I don't want to start over and that would be what I would be doing if I plat this spring starting over......

TheDave
02-04-2009, 10:06 PM
Printed currency is a poor proxy for the money supply.

I haven't researched this, but tightening credit conditions (reduced borrowing and lending) could actually result in a net money supply decrease in spite of torrential currency printing. In any event, there would, I imagine, be a substantial offset.

The following chart [wikipedia] clearly demonstrates that the banking system has much more control over the money supply than the US Mint. Compare "currency" (M0) and M1 with the overall money supply:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/9/95/Components_of_the_United_States_money_supply2.svg/570px-Components_of_the_United_States_money_supply2.svg. png

People here aren't real big on facts... Any chance you could just yell and scream about Armageddon, conspiracies, and then recommend a move to the gold standard?

Spider
02-04-2009, 10:22 PM
I am thinking with all these people losing there houses they are going to need a place to rent .... I been looking into rentals ...I am in no hurry we are making the bills ...I really am not sure were I want to go in my life I am 43 there is a part of me thinking of going to college....who knows I moved here 10 years ago with big dreams(From up north of you lol Idaho) lol I got to say I was doing OK but some were in there I started spinning wheels . I probably should of bought a couple of green houses and started raising in the winter I would of been rich but I am tired of using my back at this point . I don't want to start over and that would be what I would be doing if I plat this spring starting over......

nothing wrong with getting an education ...... I wish i could , but I made my bed , pretty happy with the choices I ahve made so far ....... well except for the time in Juarez , but we dont need to go there ;D

Hallside
02-05-2009, 11:40 AM
People here aren't real big on facts... Any chance you could just yell and scream about Armageddon, conspiracies, and then recommend a move to the gold standard?

"The End" may be nigh at hand, and the inflation may be on the horizon, but Beck's way off here. Even if he's making a good point (and I don't know if he is), he's making it poorly and simplistically. In other words, if he's proven right, it will be for the wrong reasons.

TonyR
02-05-2009, 11:49 AM
TonyR soaking the rich only sounds good but will end up in a hell of a mess .

I don't advocate "soaking the rich" but I also scoff at those still clinging to trickle down economics at a time when the wealthiest have never owned such a high percentage of capital. Oh the poor, put upon rich!

TonyR
02-05-2009, 11:51 AM
...fuel prices are still to high...

How so? I think the current prices are very moderate.

rugbythug
02-05-2009, 12:54 PM
Printed currency is a poor proxy for the money supply.

I haven't researched this, but tightening credit conditions (reduced borrowing and lending) could actually result in a net money supply decrease in spite of torrential currency printing. In any event, there would, I imagine, be a substantial offset.

The following chart [wikipedia] clearly demonstrates that the banking system has much more control over the money supply than the US Mint. Compare "currency" (M0) and M1 with the overall money supply:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/9/95/Components_of_the_United_States_money_supply2.svg/570px-Components_of_the_United_States_money_supply2.svg. png

So what happens now that you have drastacly increased the currency in the bank, and they begin to lend again?

rugbythug
02-05-2009, 12:56 PM
I don't advocate "soaking the rich" but I also scoff at those still clinging to trickle down economics at a time when the wealthiest have never owned such a high percentage of capital. Oh the poor, put upon rich!

The problem is that you can't soak the already rich. The people you seem to have a problem with already have money and thus can't be taxed. You are soaking the "Trying to Get Rich". These are the people you actually need to incentivize, they are the ones who get things done.

Hallside
02-05-2009, 01:39 PM
So what happens now that you have drastacly increased the currency in the bank, and they begin to lend again?

All the tools of monetary policy are available in that case. The most basic is simply increasing the reserve requirement, which can be done by fiat. The fed can also engage in what are called open market operations wherein they buy and sell government securities to regulate the money supply.

There are lots of other options too.

Killericon
02-05-2009, 02:01 PM
I think that pretty much anyone who thinks they can figure out what's going to happen to this economy is kidding themselves.