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TheDave
01-31-2009, 01:16 PM
Jakes red ass syndrom continues...


Plummer: Shanny firing "was past due"

TAMPA, Fla. — Not all of Mike Shanahan's former quarterbacks were disappointed to see him get fired as the Broncos' coach.

"I thought it was past due," Jake Plummer said in a telephone interview Thursday. "I think he had done what he could do and was just tapped out as far as his coaching style wasn't motivating guys anymore."

One of Plummer's former teams is here preparing for Super Bowl XLIII. Who would have guessed two years ago, when Plummer retired at the relatively young age of 32, that it would be the Arizona Cardinals and not the Broncos?

"You think the Cardinals have been perfect to get there?" Plummer said. "They've scrapped and clawed and they're standing now on the verge of a very historic moment."

The Broncos finished this past season 8-8 and missed the playoffs. The Cardinals finished their regular season 9-7 and are 60 minutes away from a world championship.
It can be razor-thin, the difference between success and failure. It's a line Plummer believes Shanahan found difficult to straddle.

Plummer was the Broncos' quarterback from 2003 until he was replaced 12 games into the 2006 season by a rookie named Jay Cutler. Speaking not out of bitterness but in his relaxed, if straightforward, manner in a telephone interview from his home in Sandpoint, Idaho, Plummer indicated Shanahan seemed to become increasingly obsessed with the Broncos' NFL rank in offense or defense instead of the win-loss record.

"It's hard on a team. We were 7-2 at one point my last year and we came out of a meeting with our heads bowed and we were all just sulking around like we had just been berated for not putting up 40 points, for not leading the league in offense, for not creating enough turnovers," Plummer said.

"It was a weird style to be coached that way. It really took it out of you as a player. I've been on 2-7 teams that had better attitudes coming out of team meetings than oftentimes when we came out of team meetings after Shanahan felt a need to motivate us even more."

To be fair to Shanahan, others of his former players did not feel that way. Cutler was upset when Broncos owner Pat Bowlen fired Shana-han two days after the 2008 season, and he said so publicly. And Plummer admits his personal relationship with Shanahan began to deteriorate after the Broncos' home loss in the 2005 AFC championship game and was compounded by a miscommunication regarding an offseason workout. Plummer thought he had cleared missing a week of offseason conditioning with an assistant coach only to learn later Shanahan was not informed.

Soon after, the Broncos traded up in the first round to select Cutler with the No. 11 pick in the 2006 draft. From then on, Shanahan seemed to be looking for reasons to replace Plummer with the rocket-armed Cutler.

The Broncos were 40-18 with Plummer as their starting quarterback. While everyone acknowledges Cutler is a far more talented passer, he is only 17-20 as a starter.

"He's a great quarterback, don't get me wrong," Plummer said. "I'm not saying anything to disrespect him. I think he's a helluva player. But Jeff George was a helluva player. There's a lot of guys who have been great players."

George had a long NFL career but was criticized for not winning more games.

Plummer said Cutler has a chance to become a star now that former New England offensive coordinator Josh McDaniels has replaced Shana-han as head coach.

"I think it's a real smart move," Plummer said. "There's a lot of young coaches that are coming out of situations where they're coordinators for great coaches and going out on their own and really establishing themselves. He is young, but he's got to bring a lot of life and energy to coaching, which I'm sure will be good for that organization."

Let others question Bowlen's wisdom for hiring a 32-year-old as head coach. Plummer's not among them.

"At that level, there's mutual respect," Plummer said. "There should be mutual respect between coach and player and player and coach. Some coaches can accomplish that while staying in charge, but others, if they can't do it naturally, they do it with an iron fist or engulfing you in a way that didn't feel right. I think that's what happened to Shanahan. He just tried so hard and pushed so hard that nothing was good enough. Nothing."


http://www.denverpost.com/sports/ci_11586720

SouthStndJunkie
01-31-2009, 01:18 PM
This has already been covered for a few days in the other Jake/Shanny thread.

http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showthread.php?t=76330

TheDave
01-31-2009, 01:19 PM
This has already been covered for a few days in the other Jake/Shanny thread.

http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showthread.php?t=76330

my bad...

gunns
01-31-2009, 01:19 PM
Sorry, I totally agree with Plummer in what he said about Shanahan. But also, where's the thank you to Shanahn for rescuing him from Arizona and making him the best QB he could be?

As far as Cutler goes, he has no right to say anything as Cutler is already a better QB than him. BUT Cutler has a little attitude problem that if he doesn't check it will result in him becoming a neanderthal like George, not a QB like George.

gunns
01-31-2009, 01:20 PM
This has already been covered for a few days in the other Jake/Shanny thread.

http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showthread.php?t=76330

Yeah but that one has gotten so long it got lost.

ludo21
01-31-2009, 01:33 PM
interesting. I love Plummer but he needs to eventually just not answer these questions asked about Denver. Get over it.

"Getting reamed for not putting up 40".....

Good, Shanny and Denver fans want Wins and more wins. Slapping backs and enjoying a win is great, but moving onto the next week is even more important.

BroncoBuff
01-31-2009, 01:36 PM
To be fair to Shanahan, others of his former players did not feel that way.
Most important line in the story.

Sad to see front-runner Jake embarrass himself like this.

lex
01-31-2009, 01:48 PM
Most important line in the story.

Sad to see front-runner Jake embarrass himself like this.

Yeah, he further stigmatizes his time in Denver. Im getting to the point that I regret this guy was ever a Bronco. In fact, Im already there.

BroncoInferno
01-31-2009, 02:19 PM
Most important line in the story.

Sad to see front-runner Jake embarrass himself like this.

He didn't embarrass himself. Nothing he said isn't true.

lex
01-31-2009, 02:26 PM
He didn't embarrass himself. Nothing he said isn't true.

Well, considering Plummers best years were clearly when he was with Denver, its apparent that Shanahans message was clearly reaching Plummer. So its a little dishonest for him to suggest Shanahan was no longer having an effect on the team, when he was clearly having an effect on Jakes career. Jakes talking out of both sides of his mouth.

BroncoInferno
01-31-2009, 02:28 PM
Well, considering Plummers best years were clearly when he was with Denver, its apparent that Shanahans message was clearly reaching Plummer. So its a little dishonest for him to suggest Shanahan was no longer having an effect on the team, when he was clearly having an effect on Jakes career. Jakes talking out of both sides of his mouth.

I will say he should give Shanny more credit for the best years of his career. That said, it is hard to argue that the team never seemed very motivated the last few seasons.

Taco John
01-31-2009, 02:31 PM
Most important line in the story.

Sad to see front-runner Jake embarrass himself like this.


I thought he embarssed himself too. Like I said in the other thread:

Jake can flap his gums all he wants about not getting his hand held by Shanahan. But at the end of the day, all it does is open an old wound and shows us why this guy couldn't hack it in the NFL: poor judgement.

His best years were under Shanahan. His absolute best play was when Shanahan had him by the scruff of his neck, and kept the leash short. Jake played his way out of a job, and then quit. Every thing he says comes off as some kind of half-assed rationalization for why he couldn't hack it.

Taco John
01-31-2009, 02:35 PM
That said, it is hard to argue that the team never seemed very motivated the last few seasons.


No it's not. The Broncos never gave up in any game this last season. That was one of the comments that consistenly came up - no matter what the score was, especially on offense, our guys went out with a purpose.

You can't argue the results - we had an 8-8 season and folded down the stretch. But to say that they weren't very motivated - that's nonsense. The only time we've ever seen a Broncos team not motivated was during the "We're finished" Superbowl hangover era.

yavoon
01-31-2009, 02:35 PM
interesting. I love Plummer but he needs to eventually just not answer these questions asked about Denver. Get over it.

"Getting reamed for not putting up 40".....

Good, Shanny and Denver fans want Wins and more wins. Slapping backs and enjoying a win is great, but moving onto the next week is even more important.

you can only breathe flame indiscriminately for so long before the ppl u do it to develop defense mechanisms. Start tuning you out, or start sniping behind your back.

lex
01-31-2009, 02:36 PM
I will say he should give Shanny more credit for the best years of his career. That said, it is hard to argue that the team never seemed very motivated the last few seasons.


If youre Jake Plummer and the guy you are criticizing is significantly responsible for the best years of your career, then youre not the one that should be saying anything about his ability to motivate. Again, its double talk and because he's talking out of both sides of his mouth, he's not making sense.

yavoon
01-31-2009, 02:37 PM
I thought he embarssed himself too. Like I said in the other thread:

Jake can flap his gums all he wants about not getting his hand held by Shanahan. But at the end of the day, all it does is open an old wound and shows us why this guy couldn't hack it in the NFL: poor judgement.

His best years were under Shanahan. His absolute best play was when Shanahan had him by the scruff of his neck, and kept the leash short. Jake played his way out of a job, and then quit. Every thing he says comes off as some kind of half-assed rationalization for why he couldn't hack it.

what absurdist standard of "hacking it" in the nfl are u using. not that I liked jake and his low pocket passing %, but he was a qb for like what? a decade? then when he retired he still had teams chasing him down to be their qb.

BroncoInferno
01-31-2009, 02:38 PM
No it's not. The Broncos never gave up in any game this last season. That was one of the comments that consistenly came up - no matter what the score was, especially on offense, our guys went out with a purpose.

You can't argue the results - we had an 8-8 season and folded down the stretch. But to say that they weren't very motivated - that's nonsense. The only time we've ever seen a Broncos team not motivated was during the "We're finished" Superbowl hangover era.

It's not nonsense when you go out one week and beat playoff caliber teams and then the next get embarrassed by teams like Oakland, KC, and Detroit. That is an unmotivated team, sorry.

Taco John
01-31-2009, 02:52 PM
interesting. I love Plummer but he needs to eventually just not answer these questions asked about Denver. Get over it.

"Getting reamed for not putting up 40".....

Good, Shanny and Denver fans want Wins and more wins. Slapping backs and enjoying a win is great, but moving onto the next week is even more important.


The interesting thing about that quote is that it happened after we beat the Raiders 17-13. We were lsoing 7-13 going into the fourth quarter, and jake had thrown two interceptions in the first half, and another interception in the third quarter. Our first ten drives we had 1 touchdown, 3 interceptions, and 6 punts.

The drive that we ended up with the go ahead winning score, Plummer fumbled the ball on the Oakland 4 yard line, but Nash recovered it. On 4th an 1, Plummer managed to find Kyle Johnson in the endzone.

It was a very ugly game. Apparently Jake wanted more pats on the back after his performance there.

Blart
01-31-2009, 02:54 PM
Shanahan just didn't like Plummer. Simple as that. I like both of them but they just weren't meant to be.

Spider
01-31-2009, 02:56 PM
my bad...

Damn you .. post only in existing thread , as a self appointed mod , it is my duty to ban for 7 weeks starting in 2012 ......... dont let it happen again ;D

colonelbeef
01-31-2009, 03:02 PM
Most important line in the story.

Sad to see front-runner Jake embarrass himself like this.

Yep, this really is embarrassing. Guy owes most of his success to Shanahan, had his best years with the Broncos after the league had pretty much given up on him. He has turned out to be an absolutely whiny child

SureShot
01-31-2009, 03:31 PM
Anyone else think Jake is missing the game and regrets that he quit?

broncogary
01-31-2009, 05:23 PM
Anyone else think Jake is missing the game and regrets that he quit?

Anyone else think the Cards wouldn't be in the SB if Jake was their QB? Hilarious!

Blueflame
01-31-2009, 05:26 PM
Anyone else think Jake is missing the game and regrets that he quit?

It looks more likely to me that his ego is still bruised over Shanahan's drafting of Jay. The opportunity to take a retaliatory shot presented itself and he took it. IMO, he would have been better served to remain silent if he couldn't say something nice... it would have shown more maturity and class. But whatever... he's no longer relevant to the Broncos and therefore, neither is his opinion.

Willynowei
01-31-2009, 05:59 PM
how can anyone side with Plummer on this.

Listen to his words, "nothing is ever good enough", what is this the 3rd grade? Pop Warner football? No I'd be disrespecting those kids with such a comparison. What type of a loser wonders aloud "nothing is good enough?" a sore one, thats who.

Really, "football wasn't fun anymore"??? Jesus if a teamate told me that the coach is yelling at him too much or that football's not fun anymore, I think the entire team would get on him for that type of bull****, Its actually appauling to me that a NFL football player can say something as retarded as that.

Winners win and shut the **** up, losers are the only ones that make excuses like these. I was unaware that Jake was so lazy and afraid of a challenge.

Merlin
01-31-2009, 06:07 PM
you can only breathe flame indiscriminately for so long before the ppl u do it to develop defense mechanisms. Start tuning you out, or start sniping behind your back.
True, when you are a team full of vets. Apparently you have not seen the current roster, especially on offence. Interesting that the player that feels the most pressure under Shanny, the QB, showed public disdain for the owner's actions, which speaks volumes of his opinion of Shanny. Plummer's comments are idiotic considering his record in Denver at every facet of the game, and his record before. Moreover, the yr he complains about, Denver's offence was atrocious.

PS I'm not a Plummer hater, I frequently defend him from knee jerk criticism labeled against him in this forum, but his actions this time are so transparent they are not defensible...as is your conclusion considering the team's youth, their respect for Shanny and the need for direction. In fact my criticism of Shanny this yr was that it seemed his team was too lax when they played inferior teams (too much hubris with that talent).

Jason in LA
01-31-2009, 06:15 PM
Seeing that Plummer likes to talk about Shanny not getting the job done, when is somebody going to ask him why he totally sucked ass during his final year? When is somebody going to ask how he figured that they could continue to win with him playing horrible and the D falling apart due to injuries? I'd love to hear what Plummer has to say. He's pretty much acting like nothing was ever his fault, and like he was the reason why the team was good during his tenure. He needs to STFU!!!

cutthemdown
01-31-2009, 06:51 PM
**** Plummer. His career was a joke, he's a joke, he's not respected by football fans for being a good player and now the one cool thing he had, walking away without saying much, he has ruined.

Talk about a qb who would make the worst mistake at the worst time. That was Jake the mistake Plummer.

OBF1
01-31-2009, 11:18 PM
my bad...

Damn idiot ROFL!

Dukes
01-31-2009, 11:23 PM
Who gives a flying **** what Plummer thinks? For someone who left the game to pursue other interests and wanted to get away from the game, he sure has a lot to say about it. Just shut your mouth and enjoy your privileged life.

Pontius Pirate
01-31-2009, 11:42 PM
Haha - this board is hilarious. Talk about being bitter. In terms of bitterness:

This board > Plummer

Dukes
01-31-2009, 11:43 PM
Haha - this board is hilarious. Talk about being bitter. In terms of bitterness:

This board > Plummer

What is there to be bitter about? Did he play for an AFCW rival and beat us in the playoffs or something? Nobody is bitter.

Pontius Pirate
02-01-2009, 12:03 AM
What is there to be bitter about? Did he play for an AFCW rival and beat us in the playoffs or something? Nobody is bitter.

Quite simply, it's bitterness that Jake is right: Shanahan lost the team and Jake called it. The crowd here on the board doesn't want to believe that their precious Shanahan could've ****ed up. How else can you explain a team that went 40-18 under one QB to switching to another QB whose gone 17-20, capped off with the coach getting canned (and the new QB ultimately agreeing that Shanny leaving is a good thing).

Sure, all sorts of things fell apart after Jay got the nod (including Kubiak leaving, the defense overhauling, etc.). But ultimately, you have to concede that something else could've been at the root of Jake and the team's demise - because what came after Jake was a complete falling apart of the team. And Shanny was at the center of all of it.

Popps
02-01-2009, 01:46 AM
The funny thing is... examine Cutler's recent quotes about Shanahan and you start to hear a little more insight as to how things may have been going. Cutler wasn't shy about hinting that it was time for a change. His language sure sounded a little bit like Jake's.... certainly not as strong, but the underlying message there was that Shanahan may have lost the team.

But, losing the team was the least of his problems. He couldn't field an NFL defense, and even when he got close... he just bailed out on the idea in favor of offensive toys, and... here we are.

As I've said before, the Shanahan/Plummer story will never truly be known, but likely has fault on both sides and ultimately, it doesn't matter. One is happily retired and one is going to be working again soon.

Again, I just hope Jay can start winning games at a .750 clip like Plummer did, whether it's him... his supporting cast... or both. I'm bloody tired of this team being a laughing stock.

Bronco Bob
02-01-2009, 03:13 AM
Yep, this really is embarrassing. Guy owes most of his success to Shanahan, had his best years with the Broncos after the league had pretty much given up on him. He has turned out to be an absolutely whiny child

Not sure where you got the idea the league had given up on Plummer
before he came over to the Broncos. It's not like he was sacking
groceries somewhere waiting for a call. He was the QB of the Cardinals
at the time, and was the only QB to lead the Cardinals to a playoff
win, prior to this year, for several decades. The only reason he left
the Cardinals was the Broncos made a better offer.

cutthemdown
02-01-2009, 04:04 AM
Not sure where you got the idea the league had given up on Plummer
before he came over to the Broncos. It's not like he was sacking
groceries somewhere waiting for a call. He was the QB of the Cardinals
at the time, and was the only QB to lead the Cardinals to a playoff
win, prior to this year, for several decades. The only reason he left
the Cardinals was the Broncos made a better offer.

Arizona didn't want him back and not many other teams were interested in him as a starter. Shanny took a huge risk on him and it didn't pay off.

LonghornBronco
02-01-2009, 08:20 AM
Jake is a good guy, but I don't think he wanted it enough.

Archer81
02-01-2009, 08:22 AM
Arizona didn't want him back and not many other teams were interested in him as a starter. Shanny took a huge risk on him and it didn't pay off.


Yeah it did. We made an AFC Championship game and made the playoffs every year he was a starter the entire season. He just could not get it done, and he had limits, which limited our offense and made us easier to stop.


:Broncos:

BroncoInferno
02-01-2009, 08:27 AM
Shanny took a huge risk on him and it didn't pay off.

Based on what crazy standard did the move not pay off? We went 40-18 and played for the AFC championship with him starting for us, and he had a solid 71-47 TD-INT ratio in those 58 starts (in other words, he was not the turnover machine you revisionists like to pretend he was--at least not while he played for Denver). Picking up Plummer was one the better FA acquisitions of the Shanny era. To say it "didn't pay off" is ludicrous.

Jason in LA
02-01-2009, 08:34 AM
Quite simply, it's bitterness that Jake is right: Shanahan lost the team and Jake called it. The crowd here on the board doesn't want to believe that their precious Shanahan could've ****ed up. How else can you explain a team that went 40-18 under one QB to switching to another QB whose gone 17-20, capped off with the coach getting canned (and the new QB ultimately agreeing that Shanny leaving is a good thing).

Sure, all sorts of things fell apart after Jay got the nod (including Kubiak leaving, the defense overhauling, etc.). But ultimately, you have to concede that something else could've been at the root of Jake and the team's demise - because what came after Jake was a complete falling apart of the team. And Shanny was at the center of all of it.


It's not that people don't believe it, a lot of us don't agree with it. There is a difference.

You think that switching QBs caused the callapse? So you think that if they stuck with Plummer, and he was the starter the last two years, things would have been different? If you believe that they you are just dreaming.

Even you mention that the defense totally fell apart, so it's funny that you then point the finger right back at Cutler. Like benching Plummer caused the defense to go from being really good to really bad. That's just silly. The defense would have fallen apart even if they stuck with Plummer. Can you imagine what the team would have looked like with a horrible defense and Plummer at QB? Yeah, 10 loss seasons. Can you imagine what the Broncos would have looked like with Cutler and really good defenses, like Plummer had? I'd say Super Bowl.

Jason in LA
02-01-2009, 08:36 AM
Haha - this board is hilarious. Talk about being bitter. In terms of bitterness:

This board > Plummer

This bitterness didn't come up until Plummer started running his mouth a few weeks back. Seemed like everybody was happy that he found happiness. Now he's trying to stick it to Shanahan. So people on this board would like him to STFU.

BroncoInferno
02-01-2009, 08:38 AM
This bitterness didn't come up until Plummer started running his mouth a few weeks back. Seemed like everybody was happy that he found happiness. Now he's trying to stick it to Shanahan. So people on this board would like him to STFU.

He's not trying to "stick it to Shanahan." He was asked his opinion, and he gave it. And, that opinion was pretty accurate.

Jason in LA
02-01-2009, 08:44 AM
He's not trying to "stick it to Shanahan." He was asked his opinion, and he gave it. And, that opinion was pretty accurate.

An accurate opinion? So anybody that's opinion is opposed to his, is inaccurate?

Now that somebody actually cares to ask him a question, his bitterness is showing. He should just let it go, like he has been doing.

Rock Chalk
02-01-2009, 08:50 AM
Well, considering Plummers best years were clearly when he was with Denver, its apparent that Shanahans message was clearly reaching Plummer. So its a little dishonest for him to suggest Shanahan was no longer having an effect on the team, when he was clearly having an effect on Jakes career. Jakes talking out of both sides of his mouth.

I dont think its dishonest at all. Plummer's best years were under Kubiak. He had a great deal of respect for Kubiak and truth be told I dont think he ever liked Shanahan. So I dont think he is being dishonest at all. I dont think Shanahan helped Jake be the best he can be. I think Kubiak did that. Because when Kubiak left, Jake sucked again.

And if all that anyone cares about is wins, the they should have loved having Jake even if the wins weren't all his doing.

Rock Chalk
02-01-2009, 08:50 AM
An accurate opinion? So anybody that's opinion is opposed to his, is inaccurate?

Now that somebody actually cares to ask him a question, his bitterness is showing. He should just let it go, like he has been doing.

So Jake's opinin that is opposed to yours is bitter?

That **** works both ways Jason.

Jason in LA
02-01-2009, 08:55 AM
So Jake's opinin that is opposed to yours is bitter?

That **** works both ways Jason.

I'm not bitter towards Jake's play while with the Broncos. I didn't show any bitterness to him over the past couple years. I have defended the argument that it was right to bench him, but that doesn't mean that I was bitter towards the guy. I was happy for the guy to ride off into the sunset, and felt that the Bucs were screwing him.

I will say that I have formed a bitterness towards the guy over the past few weeks, because he keeps running his mouth. It has nothing to do with his play on the field.

Jason in LA
02-01-2009, 08:57 AM
One more point, without Shanahan, Plummer's career would have been a totally failure. He would have went down as one of the worst QBs ever. But Shanahan shined him up and pretty much saved the guy. So he should really STFU.

Rock Chalk
02-01-2009, 08:58 AM
One more point, without Kubiak, Plummer's career would have been a totally failure. He would have went down as one of the worst QBs ever. But Kubiak shined him up and pretty much saved the guy. So he should really STFU.

Fixed it for you.

Rock Chalk
02-01-2009, 08:59 AM
I'm not bitter towards Jake's play while with the Broncos. I didn't show any bitterness to him over the past couple years. I have defended the argument that it was right to bench him, but that doesn't mean that I was bitter towards the guy. I was happy for the guy to ride off into the sunset, and felt that the Bucs were screwing him.

I will say that I have formed a bitterness towards the guy over the past few weeks, because he keeps running his mouth. It has nothing to do with his play on the field.

I meant you think he is bitter.

I dont.

You people think Shanahan did wonders with him but the reality is Kubiak is the one that worked with Plummer. Not Shanahan. I dont think Plummer ever liked Shanahan and it became increasingly apparent after Kubiak left.

gunns
02-01-2009, 09:02 AM
Arizona didn't want him back and not many other teams were interested in him as a starter. Shanny took a huge risk on him and it didn't pay off.

There were other teams interested in him, primarily Chicago. There were no alternatives that year, except maybe Kordell Stewart and that would have been even worse.

Jason in LA
02-01-2009, 09:26 AM
Fixed it for you.

Dude, I'm going to go ahead and call it, you're a moron.

Jason in LA
02-01-2009, 09:29 AM
I meant you think he is bitter.

I dont.

You people think Shanahan did wonders with him but the reality is Kubiak is the one that worked with Plummer. Not Shanahan. I dont think Plummer ever liked Shanahan and it became increasingly apparent after Kubiak left.


I guess we should credit Kubiak for the Super Bowls too. There wasn't much of a fall off in offensive production, if any, when he left. The defense went to ****. That has nothing to do with Kubiak leaving.

rastaman
02-01-2009, 09:40 AM
Jake is a good guy, but I don't think he wanted it enough.

I agree Jake is a good guy. Where he and Shanny really differed in my opinion was based solely on generation attitudes and beliefs btwn coach and player.

For those of us old enough to remember, Elway and Reeves never saw eye-to-eye, yet they went to 3 SB's together. Now b/c Shanahan and Elway were closer in age by 8 years, they seemed to click right away.

But one must consider Reeves was born in the 40's and Elway in the 60's. Like it or not, if you have that wide of gap in the ages, generation gap/flare ups will occur. Fast forward to Jake and Shanahan, Jake was born in the 70's and Shanny was born in 50's, hence, you had the generation gap of ideals flare up.

Also, the players Shanahan coached in the 80's and those veteran players in the 90's nearing the end of their careers, responded much better to corrective criticism than the players who came into the league after....lets say 1996.

Jake didn't like corrective criticism (he took it personally), he wasn't a student of the game (film rat), and he went to beat of his own drum. This was the polar opposite of how Shanahan ran his team.

Does anyone remember back in 2003 the stunt Jake pulled when he tried to throw a pass with his left hand (he's right handed) on the 3 or 5 yard line and it was intercepted!!! Well Shanny blew a gasket at that moment. I remember that incident quite vividly.

Jake came back to the sideline trying to pretend to be mildly embrassed, but he didn't pull it off! It was Jake just being Jake...but I think Shanny saw something in Jakes attitude about the game, to where Shanny couldn't really trust Jake anymore---The Honey Moon was over.

You must remember neither Elway nor Steve Young ever pulled a school yard stunt like that. In the 2005 when Jake laid an egg and made bone headed turn overs in the AFC Title game with the Steelers, that was the straw that broke the camels back.

Jake made the correct throws and made the right reads at practice and gave Shanny confidence...but for some reason Jake could not make the correct throws and make the correct reads during the games. Sure Jake had a 750 winning percentage.....but Jakes inability to execute the offense when it really counted is what got Jake fired.

Inkana7
02-01-2009, 10:08 AM
There were other teams interested in him, primarily Chicago. There were no alternatives that year, except maybe Kordell Stewart and that would have been even worse.

I saw in another thread that Jake Delhomme and Kurt Warner were both on the market that year.

cutthemdown
02-01-2009, 10:12 AM
There were other teams interested in him, primarily Chicago. There were no alternatives that year, except maybe Kordell Stewart and that would have been even worse.

I don't ever count the Bears when it comes to qbs. They even tried to sign me one time.

Taco John
02-01-2009, 11:20 AM
I saw in another thread that Jake Delhomme and Kurt Warner were both on the market that year.

Yes. Kurt Warner, Kordella, Jake Plummer, and Jake Delhomme.

TheReverend
02-01-2009, 11:24 AM
Yes. Kurt Warner, Kordella, Jake Plummer, and Jake Delhomme.

And Delhomme is the only other one that could've fit the system.

Taco John
02-01-2009, 11:32 AM
I dont think its dishonest at all. Plummer's best years were under Kubiak. He had a great deal of respect for Kubiak and truth be told I dont think he ever liked Shanahan. So I dont think he is being dishonest at all. I dont think Shanahan helped Jake be the best he can be. I think Kubiak did that. Because when Kubiak left, Jake sucked again.

And if all that anyone cares about is wins, the they should have loved having Jake even if the wins weren't all his doing.

It's curious that Kubiak seemingly didn't lift a finger to try and get Jake when it was clear that he wasn't going to be with the Broncos. All it cost Tampa Bay was a 7th rounder.

TheDave
02-01-2009, 11:37 AM
In all seriousness, the reason I posted this was my surprise that his red ass syndrome extends to Cutler... I was pretty surprised that ripping on Shanahan wasn't enough. He felt the need to get in a Cutler = Jeff George blast.

Bronx33
02-01-2009, 11:41 AM
So was plumber better than jeff george?

Spider
02-01-2009, 11:44 AM
the Jeff George shot .......totally off base ..... Jeff george had the strongest arm I have ever seen in the NFl , havent seen any other QB come close , but George was a freaking basket case and it took him a week to run the 40 .....George was no athlete , he was a statue of a QB with a howitzer for an arm, and a completely bat shiit

Taco John
02-01-2009, 11:55 AM
So was plumber better than jeff george?



That's an interesting question. I wonder how Jeff George would have done in a Shanahan system.

Spider
02-01-2009, 11:57 AM
That's an interesting question. I wonder how Jeff George would have done in a Shanahan system.

not worth a **** .... Jeff operates in his own world ........suggestions and coaching is by invitation only ........Maybe george couldnt read a defense .. but his melt downs are legendary