PDA

View Full Version : Who's going to be on the trading block?


peacepipe
01-19-2009, 04:52 PM
If McDaniels goes about his bussiness like billichek, you can probably expect him to make some trades for draft picks/FAs, more likely for picks. Whom do any of you see getting traded. I'm thinking dre bly.

tsiguy96
01-19-2009, 04:52 PM
everyone on defense.

Ninjatime
01-19-2009, 04:54 PM
Definately need to look at trading Cutler cuz he sucks, just ask anyone with a sofacoaching degree

peacepipe
01-19-2009, 04:55 PM
Trust me, someone is hitting the tradeing block.

telluride
01-19-2009, 04:57 PM
Champ
Boss
Either Doom or Moss, whichever doesn't project to a good LB.

I'd list "anyone possible on defense" but I don't think any of them have trade value.

Killericon
01-19-2009, 05:09 PM
Dumervil, Moss, Crowder, Robertson, Boss, Bly...Everyone.

goldengopher1976
01-19-2009, 05:19 PM
There is a sense in which a new coach can make the kinds of difficult decisions that might be necessary (trading Champ, for instance) for long-term sustained success in today's NFL. Of course, if any coach ever perfected the art of buy-low/sell-high, they would probably make a better living in Vegas with a lot less stress. Whatever else will be the case, McD will see our players with a different (and perhaps fresh) perspective.

I, for one, am willing to live with almost any decision he makes in the short run, because our franchise is clearly in need of change. It's hard as a Bronco fan to remember that we are privileged, and that consistently being competitive is a luxury many fans know nothing about, but I yearn for another championship, and so I'm willing to see some shake-up for that elusive mountain-top experience. After all...rise or fall, win or lose, my life goes on...

SoCalBronco
01-19-2009, 05:24 PM
I highly doubt its Doom. He seems to be the only player from the current front 7 that would actually benefit from a move to the 3-4.

Killericon
01-19-2009, 05:37 PM
I highly doubt its Doom. He seems to be the only player from the current front 7 that would actually benefit from a move to the 3-4.

You think he will be able to make the transition to stand up and cover?

jutang
01-19-2009, 05:37 PM
I don't feel that the hiring of McDaniels will lead to any similarities of NE trading players for picks. Bowlen has said that after Shanahan there would be a separation of GM and coach duties. Goodman may trade players to transition to a 3-4, but his style in terms of FA/Trades has yet to be seen (unless he had input on Niko, Boss... which would suck).

broncofan7
01-19-2009, 05:38 PM
I highly doubt its Doom. He seems to be the only player from the current front 7 that would actually benefit from a move to the 3-4.

Really? that surprises me. I realize his unique ability to rush the passer, but somehow I think that his lack of height and agility/speed make him even more a liability in pass coverage than someone like Greg Ellis who made the transition in Dallas from 4-3 End to 3-4 OLB. I would thik that a team like Tampa or Washington (yes please-we'd like another) would love to trade for a guy like doom.

Popps
01-19-2009, 05:39 PM
I highly doubt its Doom. He seems to be the only player from the current front 7 that would actually benefit from a move to the 3-4.

I agree. He's a little small, but it's intriguing to think what he might be able to do in the 3-4. He's a solid tackler, has nice run-down speed. I'm not sure how agile he is side-to-side, and I do worry about him getting engulfed, at times.

Where do you see him playing, SoCal?

Killericon
01-19-2009, 05:45 PM
I agree. He's a little small, but it's intriguing to think what he might be able to do in the 3-4. He's a solid tackler, has nice run-down speed. I'm not sure how agile he is side-to-side, and I do worry about him getting engulfed, at times.

Where do you see him playing, SoCal?

I wasn't asked, but I can ONLY see him as a weak side OLB.

Sodak
01-19-2009, 05:47 PM
Why are you guys stuck on this 3-4 idea. No one with the Broncos has said anything about the 3-4.

rugbythug
01-19-2009, 05:52 PM
Why are you guys stuck on this 3-4 idea. No one with the Broncos has said anything about the 3-4.

If it walks like a duck...

ayjackson
01-19-2009, 05:54 PM
Why are you guys stuck on this 3-4 idea. No one with the Broncos has said anything about the 3-4.

So what if they've said anything. I think most believe its better than a 50/50 proposition that they'll switch, thus the speculation. Besides, haven't there been revealing quotes from the FO about switching?

Atlas
01-19-2009, 06:01 PM
Why are you guys stuck on this 3-4 idea. No one with the Broncos has said anything about the 3-4.

Nolan coaches the 3-4, McDaniels coaches the 3-4. Denver experimented with the 3-4 last year so the players that don't get cut will be familar with it.

tsiguy96
01-19-2009, 06:05 PM
Nolan coaches the 3-4, McDaniels coaches the 3-4. Denver experimented with the 3-4 last year so the players that don't get cut will be familar with it.

nolan also admitted we dont have teh players for a 3-4, and he will evaluate the personnel and devise a scheme thats best suited to it.

Sodak
01-19-2009, 06:06 PM
I just don't see it. Where are we going to get a 3-4 NT? and a 3-4 NT backup? Even if we draft one, we won't have a NT to fill in if the starter (rookie?) goes down?

Maybe if we had a couple big DT's who could move to NT, but we don't even have that.

I'm just not convinced. The personnel aren't there, and there aren't that many FA's moving from their 3-4 teams who are worth a ****.

SoCalBronco
01-19-2009, 06:09 PM
I agree. He's a little small, but it's intriguing to think what he might be able to do in the 3-4. He's a solid tackler, has nice run-down speed. I'm not sure how agile he is side-to-side, and I do worry about him getting engulfed, at times.

Where do you see him playing, SoCal?

I would think it would have to be WOLB. That way he needs only to shed the block of the back to get to the QB as a pass rusher. And, as you noted, this would make him a more effective run defender, especially in pursuit.

The only area that concerns me is pass coverage. I would suspect that we would play more zones, though. I'd rather not see Doom in M-M on the HB. They might be able to mask his deficiencies by limiting him to playing flat coverage. It is something to be worried about (pass coverage), but overall, I think it benefits him.

broncos-rock
01-19-2009, 06:10 PM
I think it maybe champ because new England never seemed to pay top dollar for corners. Hate to say it but I think it very well may happen!

peacepipe
01-19-2009, 06:11 PM
I just don't see it. Where are we going to get a 3-4 NT? and a 3-4 NT backup? Even if we draft one, we won't have a NT to fill in if the starter (rookie?) goes down?

I don't see it. Maybe if we had a couple big DT's who could move to NT, but we don't even have that.

I'm just not convinced. The personell aren't there, and there aren't that many FA's moving from their 3-4 teams who are worth a ****.We're alot closer to a 3-4 than you think, Doom & Moss are both cause of their size tweaners,who get moved to LB in 3-4 defenses. Robertson played NT in a 3-4 prior to comming to us.

Br0nc0Buster
01-19-2009, 06:14 PM
nolan also admitted we dont have teh players for a 3-4, and he will evaluate the personnel and devise a scheme thats best suited to it.

well its not like we have the talent to run a good 4-3 defense.
We are going to a 3-4, but it may be something we transition into.

telluride
01-19-2009, 06:24 PM
nolan also admitted we dont have teh players for a 3-4, and he will evaluate the personnel and devise a scheme thats best suited to it.

Well, since we don't have any real defensive personnel to speak of, now would be an ideal time to make the switch.

telluride
01-19-2009, 06:24 PM
Damn you, BroncoBuster!

Dedhed
01-19-2009, 06:38 PM
I agree. He's a little small, but it's intriguing to think what he might be able to do in the 3-4. He's a solid tackler, has nice run-down speed. I'm not sure how agile he is side-to-side, and I do worry about him getting engulfed, at times.

Where do you see him playing, SoCal?
If he hits the treadmill with authority in the spring and drops 10-15 pounds I think he can play standing up. I think he's got a similar build to Harrison, and he's done pretty well for himself. Imagine situations where we can get Doom matched up on a TE or RB in blitz packages. End Game for the QB.

Hercules Rockefeller
01-19-2009, 06:40 PM
If McDaniels goes about his bussiness like billichek, you can probably expect him to make some trades for draft picks/FAs, more likely for picks. Whom do any of you see getting traded. I'm thinking dre bly.

Belichek does not make trades simply for the point of making trades. He makes trades from areas of strength on his team, or when he thinks he's trading down for picks today and picks next year.

Please tell me what area Denver is actually strong enough in where they can trade someone away and the depth won't suffer?

Bly? Please, corner's about the last area they need to be trading anyone away. Maybe, if they do go 3-4, they move someone who doesn't fit the new scheme. That's about it, this team isn't good enough to go trading away players so they can have 32 draft picks in April.

Popps
01-19-2009, 06:42 PM
Dumervil, Moss, Crowder, Robertson, Boss, Bly...Everyone.

Crowder.

Hilarious!

Can you imagine the laughter on the other end of the line when we call up and offer Crowder to someone?

Hope you're right about Boss, though.

I think Bly stays. With a real front seven, he's at least an average CB, which may be better than we can find in FA without spending a ton.

Hercules Rockefeller
01-19-2009, 06:43 PM
I think it maybe champ because new England never seemed to pay top dollar for corners. Hate to say it but I think it very well may happen!

So they've never paid top dollar for corners, and they're going to turn around and trade for a guy who is going to want a new deal?

Champ is not going to get traded, the guy was specatular even on this defense before he got hurt last year. He's still playing at an incredibly high level. I just do not understand the desire from some on this board to trade away an elite player like Champ so the Broncos can have more draft picks.

Dedhed
01-19-2009, 06:49 PM
Why are you guys stuck on this 3-4 idea. No one with the Broncos has said anything about the 3-4.

Why would they tell everyone that they'll be looking for 3-4 players in the draft?

BroncoBuff
01-19-2009, 07:03 PM
There's two problems trading guys for draft picks, 1) As Herc mentioned, we have zero depth on defense so we can't trade from strength, and 2) We already have 10 picks in the next draft - despite the fact we are a very, very young team. We don't need more picks this year ... if anything, we'll trade some picks for established or emerging veterans (sorry, SoCal).


FYI everyone, Draft Dogs' mock draft the other day has us taking B.J. Raji (http://www.nfldraftdog.com/Mock_Drafts/2009_nfl_mock_draft.htm) with the 12th pick.

This despite the fact Rotoworld reported today that Raji is "having his way" with all the O-linemen at the first Senior Bowl practices today. (http://www.rotoworld.com/content/playerpages/player_main.aspx?sport=NFL&id=5210) They say he's moving up, maybe into Top 10 pick range.

broncos-rock
01-19-2009, 07:06 PM
So they've never paid top dollar for corners, and they're going to turn around and trade for a guy who is going to want a new deal?

Champ is not going to get traded, the guy was specatular even on this defense before he got hurt last year. He's still playing at an incredibly high level. I just do not understand the desire from some on this board to trade away an elite player like Champ so the Broncos can have more draft picks.

I think you missed the point.....Josh mcd having come from New England where Bellichek coaches never has paid top dollar for corners. I believe if Josh gets the right deal will trade Champ. I believe that if you get good pressure from the front 7 an elite corner like champ is not needed. Seriously what have we won with champ......nada nothing zlich. I think some people on this board are going to be pissed when Champ is dealt on draft day.

SoCalBronco
01-19-2009, 07:07 PM
There's two problems trading guys for draft picks, 1) As Herc mentioned, we have zero depth on defense so we can't trade from strength, and 2) We already have 10 picks in the next draft - despite the fact we are a very, very young team. We don't need more picks this year ... if anything, we'll trade some picks for established or emerging veterans (sorry, SoCal).


.

Well, I agree that we don't have the depth to trade away any of the decent guys that we have. I don't agree that we have more than enough picks though. We have 9 picks, not 10. It was reported in error, earlier that we got an extra day 2 pick in 2009 for Holland, which is not true. Basically, all we have is a regular draft plus a couple late rounders. It's not appreciably more than anyone else.

There's other ways to get those picks, though. We can offer to forego the premium or in fact give up some chart value overall in order to get a move down accomplished. That would not be bad.

kappys
01-19-2009, 07:08 PM
Crowder.

Hilarious!

Can you imagine the laughter on the other end of the line when we call up and offer Crowder to someone?

Hope you're right about Boss, though.

I think Bly stays. With a real front seven, he's at least an average CB, which may be better than we can find in FA without spending a ton.

Might be able to nab a conditional 7th for him. Worth a shot IMO.

Inkana7
01-19-2009, 07:14 PM
Might be able to nab a conditional 7th for him. Worth a shot IMO.

You only get conditional picks for players who leave via Free agency. You can't get them from trades or cuts.

BroncoBuff
01-19-2009, 07:15 PM
Well, I agree that we don't have the depth to trade away any of the decent guys that we have. I don't agree that we have more than enough picks though. We have 9 picks, not 10. It was reported in error, earlier that we got an extra day 2 pick in 2009 for Holland, which is not true. Basically, all we have is a regular draft plus a couple late rounders. It's not appreciably more than anyone else.

I'm usually on board (albeit reluctantly) with your "more picks the better" strategy, SoCal, but this roster is so freaking young ... I have never seen such a young group of Broncos. We have a core group of 9 players under 25 years old on offense - none of whom are under any threat of losing their jobs, and unless Weigmann retires, our starting lineup is already set. On defense of course we're a disaster area, but again, there's only so many spots available. Honestly, I can't see using more than 2 of the 9 picks on offense. If that. Our defense is just too awful.

SoCalBronco
01-19-2009, 07:21 PM
I'm usually on board (albeit reluctantly) with your "more picks the better" strategy, SoCal, but this roster is so freaking young ... I have never seen such a young group of Broncos. We have a core group of 9 players under 25 years old on offense - none of whom are under any threat of losing their jobs, and unless Weigmann retires, our starting lineup is already set. On defense of course we're a disaster area, but again, there's only so many spots available. Honestly, I can't see using more than 2 of the 9 picks on offense. If that. Our defense is just too awful.

Ahh...but don't mistake young for good, BB. I agree with you that very little is further required on offense in terms of the draft. There are a few things that should be addressed there, specifically RB, 3rd WR (for the future) and another interior lineman to groom, but that's about it.

But what about the other side of the ball? S needs to be addressed big time. I'm not willing to just assume that Barrett and/or WW will just fit in fine there. WW is ****ed up the most by the move to the 3-4. Even more than DJ. While Barrett showed some things, its not enough to justify us not making a substantial investment there. Adding another young corner is needed, also. Maybe even more than 1, considering the age of our starters. Same at LB is probably true, esp. since we are now in the 3-4. The entire DL needs to be reshaped with the exception of Thomas. That Moss and Crowder are young doesnt mean they don't suck. It doesn't mean that they have high ceilings. Radical surgery is still requried on that side of the ball.

I don't think we should be focusing on youth in the analysis of whether we need more picks. The analysis should be talent. We havent made the postseason for three years. We are an average team. I always smile when I see this "well there' s no room for all your picks, SoCal" line of thought presented. I wasn't aware that there were 53 studs on this team. This is a weak....very weak team in many respects. There is more than enough room for fresh new talent.

Popps
01-19-2009, 07:34 PM
If he hits the treadmill with authority in the spring and drops 10-15 pounds I think he can play standing up. I think he's got a similar build to Harrison, and he's done pretty well for himself. Imagine situations where we can get Doom matched up on a TE or RB in blitz packages. End Game for the QB.

I like it. He's just a little heavier than your average linebacker. Wouldn't surprise me at all to see this happen... again, IF we're moving to a 3-4, which seems like a real question mark, still.

Arkansas Bronco
01-19-2009, 07:38 PM
Other then our young stars I think anyone is up after this major FO restaffing.

driver
01-19-2009, 07:55 PM
Why would they tell everyone that they'll be looking for 3-4 players in the draft?

The only people I've seen saying anything like that are posters on this board!;D

Tombstone RJ
01-19-2009, 08:17 PM
I don't feel that the hiring of McDaniels will lead to any similarities of NE trading players for picks. Bowlen has said that after Shanahan there would be a separation of GM and coach duties. Goodman may trade players to transition to a 3-4, but his style in terms of FA/Trades has yet to be seen (unless he had input on Niko, Boss... which would suck).

good point.

Steve Prefontaine
01-19-2009, 08:30 PM
I think you missed the point.....Josh mcd having come from New England where Bellichek coaches never has paid top dollar for corners. I believe if Josh gets the right deal will trade Champ. I believe that if you get good pressure from the front 7 an elite corner like champ is not needed. Seriously what have we won with champ......nada nothing zlich. I think some people on this board are going to be pissed when Champ is dealt on draft day.

Do you realize how silly that is? You could apply that logic to so many players on so many teams.

Brandon Marshall has never "won" anything. Trade him?
Andres Johnson has never "won" anything. Trade him?
Jay Cutler has never "won" anything. Trade him?
Antonio Gates has never "won" anything. Trade him?
Michael Turner has never "won" anything. Trade him?
Devon Hester has never "won" anything. Trade him?

Jesterhole
01-19-2009, 08:33 PM
Maybe we can trade for the entire Brown's defensive line?

Malcontent
01-19-2009, 08:36 PM
ohhhhh the offseason...the bestest time on the mane...

Dedhed
01-19-2009, 08:40 PM
[/B]

The only people I've seen saying anything like that are posters on this board!;D

For those who thought Shanny was secretive, they're going to learn a new definition if Coach Mac is anything like Belichik.

Dedhed
01-19-2009, 08:43 PM
Do you realize how silly that is? You could apply that logic to so many players on so many teams.

Brandon Marshall has never "won" anything. Trade him?
Andres Johnson has never "won" anything. Trade him?
Jay Cutler has never "won" anything. Trade him?
Antonio Gates has never "won" anything. Trade him?
Michael Turner has never "won" anything. Trade him?
Devon Hester has never "won" anything. Trade him?

What isn't a silly stat is the number of games Champ has missed the last two years.

Steve Prefontaine
01-19-2009, 08:47 PM
What isn't a silly stat is the number of games Champ has missed the last two years.

Champ missed 1 game in 2007. So, yeah. That is a silly stat.

Arkansas Bronco
01-19-2009, 08:49 PM
Maybe we can trade for the entire Brown's defensive line?

A few years late on that one huh

broncos-rock
01-19-2009, 09:12 PM
Do you realize how silly that is? You could apply that logic to so many players on so many teams.

Brandon Marshall has never "won" anything. Trade him?
Andres Johnson has never "won" anything. Trade him?
Jay Cutler has never "won" anything. Trade him?
Antonio Gates has never "won" anything. Trade him?
Michael Turner has never "won" anything. Trade him?
Devon Hester has never "won" anything. Trade him?

The offense has not been the problem and Champ is supposed to be the difference maker on defense. How many picks did he have this year again? what like 3...and how many games did he miss....face it he let the team down along with the rest of the d. Don't get me wrong it has to be a sweet deal not a conditional pick or whatever something that you can't pass up. I like Champ but I'm up for change and champ being traded is part of that change.

mr007
01-19-2009, 09:35 PM
You only get conditional picks for players who leave via Free agency. You can't get them from trades or cuts.

You can't? Pretty sure you can get conditional picks based on a players performance, playing time, etc after a trade (which would be from a trade).

SonOfLe-loLang
01-19-2009, 09:55 PM
You can't? Pretty sure you can get conditional picks based on a players performance, playing time, etc after a trade (which would be from a trade).

No...its only from free agents. not trades or people you cut. Its designed to give you some compensation...with trades you obviously already receive comp.

Taco John
01-19-2009, 10:07 PM
Trading Champ Bailey would be pretty stupid if our goal is to improve the defense.

cutthemdown
01-19-2009, 10:10 PM
Considering high picks like Chad Jackson who were busts were cut I don't think players like Crowder or Moss would get you any picks. More then likely you could trade them for another teams bust IE Middlebrooks for Engleberger.

Doom IMO would maybe get you a 5th more likely a 6th round pick from a team like colts maybe?

Bly with his contract I doubt you find any takers. If I'm wrong and he has an attractive contract for a trade then maybe a 4th-5th round pick at most.

Champ Bailey IMO would still get some attention for a 1st round pick, but more likely onl a 2nd

broncos-rock
01-19-2009, 10:10 PM
Trading Champ Bailey would be pretty stupid if our goal is to improve the defense.

Like getting rid of Shannahan to improve the offense!!

Paladin
01-19-2009, 10:36 PM
No...its only from free agents. not trades or people you cut. Its designed to give you some compensation...with trades you obviously already receive comp.

That is total BS. What did the Robinson trade have? Yes. A "Conditional" pick based on the percentage of D plays. Plummer to Tampa was to be a higher pick if he signed. That was conditional. We have had players traded to other teams for a conditional pick, based on whether they make that team or not.

Paladin
01-19-2009, 10:37 PM
Bly is money .......lost......

Taco John
01-19-2009, 10:40 PM
I think Bly is better than he gets credit for. Nobody is going to look consistently great out there when the quarterback isn't getting pressured.

Broncos_OTM
01-19-2009, 11:04 PM
nolan also admitted we dont have teh players for a 3-4, and he will evaluate the personnel and devise a scheme thats best suited to it.

Wait a minute he said we dont have personel for either the 4-3 or the 3-4 that are worth a damn

Broncos_OTM
01-19-2009, 11:07 PM
We're alot closer to a 3-4 than you think, Doom & Moss are both cause of their size tweaners,who get moved to LB in 3-4 defenses. Robertson played NT in a 3-4 prior to comming to us.

Robertson got traded becuae he couldnt handle the 3-4 dude... man some of you people kill me

Broncos_OTM
01-19-2009, 11:15 PM
Considering high picks like Chad Jackson who were busts were cut I don't think players like Crowder or Moss would get you any picks. More then likely you could trade them for another teams bust IE Middlebrooks for Engleberger.

Doom IMO would maybe get you a 5th more likely a 6th round pick from a team like colts maybe?

Bly with his contract I doubt you find any takers. If I'm wrong and he has an attractive contract for a trade then maybe a 4th-5th round pick at most.

Champ Bailey IMO would still get some attention for a 1st round pick, but more likely onl a 2nd

Chad Jackson hasnt done jack at the pro leval. Doom has as a situational pass rusher is awesome. People looking to up there pass rush woould be very wise to offer a pick... man come on poor arguement

BroncoMan4ever
01-20-2009, 12:23 AM
You think he will be able to make the transition to stand up and cover?

i honestly think he would be a 12 sacks a year producer in a 3-4.

cutthemdown
01-20-2009, 12:24 AM
Chad Jackson hasnt done jack at the pro leval. Doom has as a situational pass rusher is awesome. People looking to up there pass rush woould be very wise to offer a pick... man come on poor arguement

you need to read better. I compared Chad Jackson to Crowder and Moss not Doom. I made a new paragraph, hence new thought, then said what I think about Doom. I feel he is only worth about a 5th round pick. That is what I believe.

Understand the argument before you decide to say it's a bad one.

Crowder, Moss = haven't done crap, are worth nothing in trade value. Chad Jackson was a high pick who did nothing, it's a good comparison IMO.

BroncoMan4ever
01-20-2009, 12:25 AM
Really? that surprises me. I realize his unique ability to rush the passer, but somehow I think that his lack of height and agility/speed make him even more a liability in pass coverage than someone like Greg Ellis who made the transition in Dallas from 4-3 End to 3-4 OLB. I would thik that a team like Tampa or Washington (yes please-we'd like another) would love to trade for a guy like doom.

the current defensive player of the year is 6ft and 240lbs. Doom is 5'11" 260lbs and has arms like a dude who is 6'6"

BroncoMan4ever
01-20-2009, 12:29 AM
I just don't see it. Where are we going to get a 3-4 NT? and a 3-4 NT backup? Even if we draft one, we won't have a NT to fill in if the starter (rookie?) goes down?

Maybe if we had a couple big DT's who could move to NT, but we don't even have that.

I'm just not convinced. The personnel aren't there, and there aren't that many FA's moving from their 3-4 teams who are worth a ****.

i think we are going to be transitioning into a 3-4 defense while also continuing with the 4-3 since we don't have the players to make a complete transition to the 3-4. We will run the 4-3 probably as our base defense, but as the season goes on, it would not surprise me to see us use less and less of the 4-3, and by McDaniels 2nd year we will more than likely be a 3-4 defense.

cutthemdown
01-20-2009, 12:30 AM
Robertson got traded becuae he couldnt handle the 3-4 dude... man some of you people kill me

Some of the fixes fans are throwing around tell me they still haven't learned a thing about football. It kills me as well because you would think after awhile they would start to wise up.

Broncos have very little that fits a 3-4 defense. IMO you need big run stuffer middle linebackers. We have no big inside defenders. If you have a 240 pound guy like DJ you will put inside you better have a Ray Lewis next to him at 250.

We don't have any outside linebackers that look good for a 3-4. Winborn, Bailey, Woodyard, Webster(inside) all have to go.

Marcus Thomas may be able to move to end in a 3-4 but I don't really know. Robertson IMO doesn't fit a 3-4 anywhere on the line.

The dends would all have to go except maybe Moss/Doom but that would be a huge reach to expect them to make that transition.

Seems like a reach to switch to 3-4 but since all the players pretty much stink maybe they will cut like 6-7 players and bring in a ton of fresh faces.

To even suggest though Broncos have talent on defense the new coach will make good on is a reach. The Broncos just don't have the horses on defense.

BroncoMan4ever
01-20-2009, 12:32 AM
you need to read better. I compared Chad Jackson to Crowder and Moss not Doom. I made a new paragraph, hence new thought, then said what I think about Doom. I feel he is only worth about a 5th round pick. That is what I believe.

Understand the argument before you decide to say it's a bad one.

Crowder, Moss = haven't done crap, are worth nothing in trade value. Chad Jackson was a high pick who did nothing, it's a good comparison IMO.

i could honestly see us getting as much as a 2nd round pick, but more than likely a 3rd for Doom. for a team that is set with at the DT and can use Doom as a pass rush specialist and not a starter he would be a good investment and would draw good compensation for us, were we to let him go.

lex
01-20-2009, 12:35 AM
i could honestly see us getting as much as a 2nd round pick, but more than likely a 3rd for Doom. for a team that is set with at the DT and can use Doom as a pass rush specialist and not a starter he would be a good investment and would draw good compensation for us, were we to let him go.

Yeah. If youre a team that wants someone who can generate a pass rush, would you rather spend a 3rd round pick on an unknown or trade for Doom, who still has a year on his rookie contract?

BroncoMan4ever
01-20-2009, 12:39 AM
Like getting rid of Shannahan to improve the offense!!

we didn't get rid of Shanahan to improve the offense. we got rid of shanahan because Bowlen decided to take back control of his team because it wasn't worth Mike having all that power for a 3 year stretch where the defense got worse every year and we couldn't get back to the playoffs.

also, people saying our offense was great, technically that isn't true. we generate a lot of yards which is what makes us the 2nd ranked offense in the league, but as anyone can tell and should know by looking at our running game since Portis was traded, yards don't mean a damn thing, points are what matters, and we were only capable of averaging about 23 points a game. We still couldn't run the ball, and still coudn't do anything once we were in the red zone.

our offense has the potential to be really good if we could get a good consistant RB, and we could generate TD's instead of Field Goals or nothing in the red zone.

Popps
01-20-2009, 01:13 AM
I think Bly is better than he gets credit for. Nobody is going to look consistently great out there when the quarterback isn't getting pressured.

He actually played O.K. in the second half of the season when not many others did. He's just simply not an elite corner. Probably never was. He's never been top-notch in coverage and with no pass-rush, he can't jump routes the way he used to.

But, the thing with him is... he took a pay-cut (I believe) and I just don't think you're going to go out and make a big improvement there in free agency, and certainly not the draft.

Good lord, horrible thought... if we draft a CB 1st... I honestly have fears for my own safety.

cutthemdown
01-20-2009, 03:11 AM
i could honestly see us getting as much as a 2nd round pick, but more than likely a 3rd for Doom. for a team that is set with at the DT and can use Doom as a pass rush specialist and not a starter he would be a good investment and would draw good compensation for us, were we to let him go.

LOL a 2nd round pick. No team in the NFL is going to give a 2nd round pick for Doom. Maybe a super low 3rd to a really crappy GM. More then likely if you want to move Doom you move him for a late late pick.

Teams just don't give picks for bit players. Doom is perhaps the worst run defending Dlineman I have ever seen by the way. He can rush passer a bit but I seriously doubt any team gives a 3rd round, 2nd round etc pick for him.

Traveler
01-20-2009, 05:10 AM
I highly doubt its Doom. He seems to be the only player from the current front 7 that would actually benefit from a move to the 3-4.

I tend to agree. Look no further than the Steelers James Harrison. He's an inch taller than Elvis, but Dumervil outweighs him by almost 15-20 pounds. Similar pass rushing skills.

If we are switching to a 3-4 defense, it may benefit Elvis more than Jarvis Moss.

As for Moss, he won't get traded because of cap ramifications IMO.

Boss Bailey, Bly, Engleberger, Crowder, and Robertson might have some trade value.

On offense, I wouldn't be surprised if Hamilton and or Kuper were dealt.

cutthemdown
01-20-2009, 05:26 AM
I tend to agree. Look no further than the Steelers James Harrison. He's an inch taller than Elvis, but Dumervil outweighs him by almost 15-20 pounds. Similar pass rushing skills.

If we are switching to a 3-4 defense, it may benefit Elvis more than Jarvis Moss.

As for Moss, he won't get traded because of cap ramifications IMO.

Boss Bailey, Bly, Engleberger, Crowder, and Robertson might have some trade value.

On offense, I wouldn't be surprised if Hamilton and or Kuper were dealt.

Bailey was just a FA and is coming off a bad injury, no team will give a thing for him.

Bly would get some interest if his contract wasn't too bad. Maybe a 3rd round pick.

Engleberger-Cmon are you serious? Nothing for Engleberger

Crowder- Probably hasn't done enough to warrant a team trading for him. Instead probably only trade you a similar type player who hasn't done anything yet but is young enough to maybe have hope.

Robertson would probably be worth a 3rd or 4th round pick.

cutthemdown
01-20-2009, 05:33 AM
There is of course an outside chance Doom could play the jack backer position in a 3-4 but I don't think we should count on it. If we switch to a 3-4 you bring in or draft some good 3-4 backers and then give Doom and Moss a chance to make the switch. To count on them to make that switch could end in complete chaos.

broncos-rock
01-20-2009, 11:52 AM
I agree with the majority of what you said I was trying to make a point that the highest payed player on the team has not earned his money this last year and while he may redo his deal for less there is also a possibility for trade. I just have a gut feeling that he's going be dealt. I also said before the season that Shannahan would be gone if the team didn't make the playoffs.





we didn't get rid of Shanahan to improve the offense. we got rid of shanahan because Bowlen decided to take back control of his team because it wasn't worth Mike having all that power for a 3 year stretch where the defense got worse every year and we couldn't get back to the playoffs.

also, people saying our offense was great, technically that isn't true. we generate a lot of yards which is what makes us the 2nd ranked offense in the league, but as anyone can tell and should know by looking at our running game since Portis was traded, yards don't mean a damn thing, points are what matters, and we were only capable of averaging about 23 points a game. We still couldn't run the ball, and still coudn't do anything once we were in the red zone.

our offense has the potential to be really good if we could get a good consistant RB, and we could generate TD's instead of Field Goals or nothing in the red zone.

no-pseudo-fan
01-20-2009, 12:03 PM
Champ could be traded. You have to trade him when and if you can get value for him. I love Champ, but if someone gave us a high 2nd and a 4th for him, I would take it. We could use that 2nd on another DT or LB or something. We have to look towards the future, and I believe that Champ thinks he has one more big contract coming to him.

eddie mac
01-20-2009, 12:24 PM
I'd rather Champ signed with Denver for life.

cutthemdown
01-20-2009, 02:22 PM
Champ could be traded. You have to trade him when and if you can get value for him. I love Champ, but if someone gave us a high 2nd and a 4th for him, I would take it. We could use that 2nd on another DT or LB or something. We have to look towards the future, and I believe that Champ thinks he has one more big contract coming to him.

At least you are realistic in the value a 2nd round pick has. Some fans on the board expect to get a 2nd round pick for doom? LOL gimme a break. For Champ yes we could get a 2nd and another pick, or maybe even a first round pick to the right team.