PDA

View Full Version : scheffler, kuper and marshall all UFAs next year?


tsiguy96
01-16-2009, 09:41 AM
we need to get these guys extended asap if im correct. if they all go UFA we wont be able to sign them all, most importantly marshall.

Man-Goblin
01-16-2009, 09:48 AM
I read somewhere that Marshall's contract is jumping from 456k to over $2 million this year because of incentives. Good for him.

Also, when teams have 3 marquee free agents (there might be more?), you generally see one taken care of before the season, one during the season, and one after the season. Teams usually save the most difficult to get done (or easiest to franchise) for last. So, Brandon, you may have to wait.

crowebomber
01-16-2009, 09:50 AM
Who gets franchised?

Kaylore
01-16-2009, 09:51 AM
I read somewhere that Marshall's contract is jumping from 456k to over $2 million this year because of incentives. Good for him.

Also, when teams have 3 marquee free agents (there might be more?), you generally see one taken care of before the season, one during the season, and one after the season. Teams usually save the most difficult to get done (or easiest to franchise) for last. So, Brandon, you may have to wait.

That might be good anyway. I want to see his arm come back and I'd like to see if McDaniels can make him take his game to the next level. He could be Randy Moss good, but if he doesn't apply himself he'll be a "pretty good" starter in the mold of Yancey Thigpen.

no-pseudo-fan
01-16-2009, 10:04 AM
I want to see more creative route combos. Having Marshall running across the formations, put in motion, and other ways to get him the ball.

Beantown Bronco
01-16-2009, 10:06 AM
Even if they don't address their contracts, it's my understanding that none of these guys will be UFAs next year because they don't have enough years in the league. The 2010 "uncapped" year means they're essentially stuck with us due to a technicality if I'm not mistaken.

rugbythug
01-16-2009, 10:06 AM
They will only be UFA if a new CBA is finished. Otherwise they are RFA.

Beantown Bronco
01-16-2009, 10:08 AM
Even if they don't address their contracts, it's my understanding that none of these guys will be UFAs next year because they don't have enough years in the league. The 2010 "uncapped" year means they're essentially stuck with us due to a technicality if I'm not mistaken.

Here it is:

http://www.nfl.com/news/story?id=09000d5d808736ba&template=with-video&confirm=true

Here's some early indications of what's ahead.
A general manager told me that the projections for players scheduled to be free agents -- if it were a capped year -- could be upwards of 170 fewer players if it is uncapped. Every player from the 2005 draft who signed a five-year contract and every player who signed a four-year deal in 2006 would miss out on eligibility for free agency and revert back to their club as a restricted free agent. Keep in mind, teams target this group over all others when it comes to spending the big money in free agency.

gyldenlove
01-16-2009, 10:08 AM
They will all be RFAs. Since 2010 will be uncapped you need 6 years to become UFA, they will all only have 4 so we can tender them.

All that aside, I do think we extend an offer to Marshall when the regular season roles around, I think they want him to get through the offseason without incidents.

Kuper will probably start negotiations during the offseason. Scheffler I am not so sure about, it depends on what his market is going to be, right now he is an oft-injured pass catching TE, if he will settle for a deal in the area of the deal Clady has now (with less guaranteed) I think he will stay.

telluride
01-16-2009, 10:12 AM
Until Scheffler can prove that he can stay healthy, we shouldn't spend serious money on him. Right now he's all potential, little production.

Rock Chalk
01-16-2009, 11:16 AM
Scheffler needs to stay healthy otherwise I could care less. He's great and all but oft injured.

Marshall and Kuper are must signs though.

montrose
01-16-2009, 11:21 AM
Tight Ends are usually pretty cheap by NFL standards. Considering Tony's injury history, lack of blocking ability and relationship with Cutler - I'd hope he wouldn't be too hard to resign. I'm assuming at some point Graham's contract will be reworked (if not released depending on his role in McDaniels' offense) and that money could be allotted to Scheffler.

Kuper shouldn't be terribly difficult either. The Broncos have always taken care of their OL. Nalen, Lepsis, Hamilton and Neil are all examples of guys who never hit the open market.

Marshall's a big one. As long as he's not planning on holding out, there's no reason to give him big money now until we know his arm is all the way back.

TheReverend
01-16-2009, 11:47 AM
Tight Ends are usually pretty cheap by NFL standards. Considering Tony's injury history, lack of blocking ability and relationship with Cutler - I'd hope he wouldn't be too hard to resign. I'm assuming at some point Graham's contract will be reworked (if not released depending on his role in McDaniels' offense) and that money could be allotted to Scheffler.

Kuper shouldn't be terribly difficult either. The Broncos have always taken care of their OL. Nalen, Lepsis, Hamilton and Neil are all examples of guys who never hit the open market.

Marshall's a big one. As long as he's not planning on holding out, there's no reason to give him big money now until we know his arm is all the way back.

Good post, but Marshall I certainly disagree with. We should pay him sooner than later. He's already got a pair of seasons average at 1300 yards... do we wait until he posts an Andre Johnson season and then have to make him the highest paid receiver in the NFL? Or we could hit it now and pay him a pro bowl rate.

tsiguy96
01-16-2009, 11:50 AM
Good post, but Marshall I certainly disagree with. We should pay him sooner than later. He's already got a pair of seasons average at 1300 yards... do we wait until he posts an Andre Johnson season and then have to make him the highest paid receiver in the NFL? Or we could hit it now and pay him a pro bowl rate.

for sure, we need to avoid any issues with him now and get him signed to 5-6 years.

Ray Finkle
01-16-2009, 11:53 AM
Good post, but Marshall I certainly disagree with. We should pay him sooner than later. He's already got a pair of seasons average at 1300 yards... do we wait until he posts an Andre Johnson season and then have to make him the highest paid receiver in the NFL? Or we could hit it now and pay him a pro bowl rate.

I expect the Broncos to take the Pats model of player management. You will get paid well to stay or come here but if you are looking for a payday, don't let the door hit you on the rear. Marshall is a good WR but there are many holes in his game.

Kuper will be the key signing. He is a big, quick interior lineman that plays well with the line they have. Sign him long term should be the top priority. Shef should take less money to stay here. If all else fails, try to sign Marshall to a team friendly deal, if not, franchise and trade his ass.

SonOfLe-loLang
01-16-2009, 11:55 AM
That might be good anyway. I want to see his arm come back and I'd like to see if McDaniels can make him take his game to the next level. He could be Randy Moss good, but if he doesn't apply himself he'll be a "pretty good" starter in the mold of Yancey Thigpen.

He's 25 and already had 2 seasons of 100+ recepts and 1300 yards. Yancey Thigpen Wishes. We are harsh on our own players here

tsiguy96
01-16-2009, 12:03 PM
I expect the Broncos to take the Pats model of player management. You will get paid well to stay or come here but if you are looking for a payday, don't let the door hit you on the rear. Marshall is a good WR but there are many holes in his game.

Kuper will be the key signing. He is a big, quick interior lineman that plays well with the line they have. Sign him long term should be the top priority. Shef should take less money to stay here. If all else fails, try to sign Marshall to a team friendly deal, if not, franchise and trade his ass.

look at what happened to the giants without burress. thats what would happen to us permanently without marshall, it would close down the passing lanes for the other receivers. he needs to be a bronco for life :pimp:

TheReverend
01-16-2009, 12:05 PM
I expect the Broncos to take the Pats model of player management. You will get paid well to stay or come here but if you are looking for a payday, don't let the door hit you on the rear. Marshall is a good WR but there are many holes in his game.

Kuper will be the key signing. He is a big, quick interior lineman that plays well with the line they have. Sign him long term should be the top priority. Shef should take less money to stay here. If all else fails, try to sign Marshall to a team friendly deal, if not, franchise and trade his ass.

There are many holes in every third year player, dude. Coaches help clean that up.

You can't retain a player like him without coughing up a payday, but losing a player like that is disastrous.

Kaylore
01-16-2009, 12:14 PM
He's 25 and already had 2 seasons of 100+ recepts and 1300 yards. Yancey Thigpen Wishes. We are harsh on our own players here

That's true. I undersold Marshall but I just know what he can do and want to see him get there.

bowtown
01-16-2009, 12:15 PM
I expect the Broncos to take the Pats model of player management. You will get paid well to stay or come here but if you are looking for a payday, don't let the door hit you on the rear. Marshall is a good WR but there are many holes in his game.

Kuper will be the key signing. He is a big, quick interior lineman that plays well with the line they have. Sign him long term should be the top priority. Shef should take less money to stay here. If all else fails, try to sign Marshall to a team friendly deal, if not, franchise and trade his ass.

Why does everyone assume that just because we have a coach from the Patriots coming over, that we will suddenly also adopt their FO way of doing things? We got McDaniels, not Pioli. The Goodman's have their own system, and it's one that Bowlen likes or he wouldn't have kept them on. I don't expect you to see a huge diference in how contracts are handled this year vs the last few.

Ray Finkle
01-16-2009, 12:18 PM
There are many holes in every third year player, dude. Coaches help clean that up.

You can't retain a player like him without coughing up a payday, but losing a player like that is disastrous.

did not say they shouldn't pay him. Pats players all took a home discount to stay or come to the Pats. I believe you will see that culture here.

TSI-don't compare Burress to Marshall. 2 total different offenses and QB's. What did the Broncos do to the Raiders without Marshall? The Giants have a good o-line, good rb's and a bunch of #2 and #3 wideouts....

BabyTO
01-16-2009, 12:19 PM
marshall is still under contract next season

Ray Finkle
01-16-2009, 12:19 PM
Why does everyone assume that just because we have a coach from the Patriots coming over, that we will suddenly also adopt their FO way of doing things? We got McDaniels, not Pioli. The Goodman's have their own system, and it's one that Bowlen likes or he wouldn't have kept them on. I don't expect you to see a huge diference in how contracts are handled this year vs the last few.

If the front office runs the same way, the McDaniels will fail. They need to work in tandem and the Goodman's need to understand and find the players that fit the current system, not how it was done in the past.

You create a winning culture and environment, players are going to come.

bowtown
01-16-2009, 12:27 PM
If the front office runs the same way, the McDaniels will fail. They need to work in tandem and the Goodman's need to understand and find the players that fit the current system, not how it was done in the past.

You create a winning culture and environment, players are going to come.

I guess I should have said that it will be run similar to last year, when the Goodman's actually had power. Which I wouldn't consider a failure. We brought in a few free agents, nothing spectacular... most of them were misses but maybe you can balme that on Shanahan, maybe you can't. However, it was a relatively quiet free agency with a strong focus on keeping our own and building through the draft. I don't see that philosophy changing this year. We might go after one big name in FA but I think people are going to be disappointed if they expect much more than that.

And to your last point, this town already has a winning culture, and players already do want to come. That hasn't been a problem in Denver for at least 10 years.

TheReverend
01-16-2009, 12:28 PM
did not say they shouldn't pay him. Pats players all took a home discount to stay or come to the Pats. I believe you will see that culture here.

TSI-don't compare Burress to Marshall. 2 total different offenses and QB's. What did the Broncos do to the Raiders without Marshall? The Giants have a good o-line, good rb's and a bunch of #2 and #3 wideouts....

Well, I think we HAVE seen that culture here. Every great player that's resigned with the club has done so for less than they could've had in FA (the sole exception MAY be Trevor Pryce's second contract). Even with a discount, a young, premier player like Marshall is going to be expensive, and every season that price is headed in one direction.

Kaylore
01-16-2009, 12:28 PM
Scheffler isn't injured that often, it's just that he's had two that had him out for extended periods of time. He's not someone who's always gimpy. He had the broken foot because he put on thirty pounds in three months and then tried to go run and his body couldn't handle it. With the surgery he had a plate put in that always nagged him. Then this last year he pulled a groin, but so did half the team. I think it could be bad luck. Maybe not. We'll see.

BroncoMan4ever
01-16-2009, 12:37 PM
That might be good anyway. I want to see his arm come back and I'd like to see if McDaniels can make him take his game to the next level. He could be Randy Moss good, but if he doesn't apply himself he'll be a "pretty good" starter in the mold of Yancey Thigpen.

He's more in the TO mold minus the team destruction. He lacks the straight ahead track speed of Moss.

BroncoMan4ever
01-16-2009, 12:38 PM
Scheffler isn't injured that often, it's just that he's had two that had him out for extended periods of time. He's not someone who's always gimpy. He had the broken foot because he put on thirty pounds in three months and then tried to go run and his body couldn't handle it. With the surgery he had a plate put in that always nagged him. Then this last year he pulled a groin, but so did half the team. I think it could be bad luck. Maybe not. We'll see.

that is why i am in favor of getting rid of all of our trainers and s&c coaches.

tsiguy96
01-16-2009, 01:00 PM
did not say they shouldn't pay him. Pats players all took a home discount to stay or come to the Pats. I believe you will see that culture here.

TSI-don't compare Burress to Marshall. 2 total different offenses and QB's. What did the Broncos do to the Raiders without Marshall? The Giants have a good o-line, good rb's and a bunch of #2 and #3 wideouts....

i knew someone was gonna say that. it was the damn raiders. look how many teams marshall BEAT. we shoulda had miami too but teh refs took that away. different offenses, same basic principle. if you have a WR that requires double coverage, that means teams will have to man up on some of your other receivers. royal, stokely and scheffler match up favorably in those situations

montrose
01-16-2009, 01:02 PM
Good post, but Marshall I certainly disagree with. We should pay him sooner than later. He's already got a pair of seasons average at 1300 yards... do we wait until he posts an Andre Johnson season and then have to make him the highest paid receiver in the NFL? Or we could hit it now and pay him a pro bowl rate.

Before this season I was all for resigning Marshall now. He's one of my favorites and I hope he's wrapped up long term, but I'm just a bit weary with his admission that his arm was still numb. I'm no doctor so I have no idea if that feeling will ever come back - but I'd just like to be certain before committing a lot of money long term. The key to me is how much money would we really be saving by signing Brandon now versus one year from now. If its a manageable amount, I'd prefer to wait and take the risk of paying more money. Now if the difference is extremely significant - just do it now. I'm not as well-versed in the salary cap as I'd like to be, I'm just gun shy on giving guys big money until we have to. I wouldn't be too mad one way or the other. Now if Brandon decides to holdout this summer, that certainly changes things.

Why does everyone assume that just because we have a coach from the Patriots coming over, that we will suddenly also adopt their FO way of doing things? We got McDaniels, not Pioli. The Goodman's have their own system, and it's one that Bowlen likes or he wouldn't have kept them on. I don't expect you to see a huge diference in how contracts are handled this year vs the last few.

Very good post.

that is why i am in favor of getting rid of all of our trainers and s&c coaches.

Word, bring in Romo!

Kaylore
01-16-2009, 01:07 PM
that is why i am in favor of getting rid of all of our trainers and s&c coaches.

I wouldn't mind that either. They at least need to look at it and review why we have so many soft tissue injuries every year.

Dos Rios
01-16-2009, 01:23 PM
Tight Ends are usually pretty cheap by NFL standards. Considering Tony's injury history, lack of blocking ability and relationship with Cutler - I'd hope he wouldn't be too hard to resign. I'm assuming at some point Graham's contract will be reworked (if not released depending on his role in McDaniels' offense) and that money could be allotted to Scheffler.


A little off-topic, but why no love for Graham, Montrose? I know there's a theory out there that Graham didn't fit in NE and so McDaniel's arrival means trouble for Graham, but I'm skeptical. To my mind, Graham has been a blocking beast since arriving, helped protect the franchise qb, tutored/trained young tackles, and was a big part of keeping the Denver running tradition alive during lean times. And he found time to catch a couple passes. But his biggest contribution has been as an apparent team leader, during a post-Al Wilson, post-Rod Smith, post-Keith Burns, post-Jason Elam, post-Tom Nalen, era in which player leadership has been a more glaring hole than any other problem on the roster.

Dude's earned every penny in my book. I hope Scheffler sticks around too, but I think Graham's 30 catches a year is worth a lot more than Scheffler's potential 60-70. Put it this way, I think the dropoff from Scheffler to Jackson (or Putzier) is a less than the dropoff from Graham to Mustard.

Beantown Bronco
01-16-2009, 01:26 PM
A little off-topic, but why no love for Graham, Montrose? I know there's a theory out there that Graham didn't fit in NE and so McDaniel's arrival means trouble for Graham, but I'm skeptical.

We don't have to worry about this. He was viewed as expendable at the time because Watson and D. Thomas showed promise. Since he left, though, the running game has suffered and most everyone around here blames his loss as the primary reason. Folks here miss him a lot.

I think McDaniels knows this better than most and will certainly keep him around.

HooptyHoops
01-16-2009, 01:39 PM
that is why i am in favor of getting rid of all of our trainers and s&c coaches.

Amen!!

yavoon
01-16-2009, 01:55 PM
did not say they shouldn't pay him. Pats players all took a home discount to stay or come to the Pats. I believe you will see that culture here.

TSI-don't compare Burress to Marshall. 2 total different offenses and QB's. What did the Broncos do to the Raiders without Marshall? The Giants have a good o-line, good rb's and a bunch of #2 and #3 wideouts....

ppl take discounts if they think they will win superbowls. ring up 3 in 4 years and there will be a broncos discount.

SonOfLe-loLang
01-16-2009, 02:14 PM
Before this season I was all for resigning Marshall now. He's one of my favorites and I hope he's wrapped up long term, but I'm just a bit weary with his admission that his arm was still numb. I'm no doctor so I have no idea if that feeling will ever come back - but I'd just like to be certain before committing a lot of money long term. The key to me is how much money would we really be saving by signing Brandon now versus one year from now. If its a manageable amount, I'd prefer to wait and take the risk of paying more money. Now if the difference is extremely significant - just do it now. I'm not as well-versed in the salary cap as I'd like to be, I'm just gun shy on giving guys big money until we have to. I wouldn't be too mad one way or the other. Now if Brandon decides to holdout this summer, that certainly changes things.


!

Dude, he caught a hundred balls this year with a "numb hand"

yavoon
01-16-2009, 02:16 PM
Dude, he caught a hundred balls this year with a "numb hand"

is that more difficult than with a claw?

montrose
01-19-2009, 10:37 AM
A little off-topic, but why no love for Graham, Montrose?

I love Graham and hope McDaniels recognizes his value to the team. I do think that at some point he'll be asked to restructure though.

Dude, he caught a hundred balls this year with a "numb hand"

I know, I'd just want to be as careful as I can. Until he's demanding a new deal, I'm willing to way on the side of caution with resigning him. This of course taking into account the price differential in signing him now versus a year from now.

TheReverend
01-19-2009, 10:41 AM
I know, I'd just want to be as careful as I can. Until he's demanding a new deal, I'm willing to way on the side of caution with resigning him. This of course taking into account the price differential in signing him now versus a year from now.

You need to reward performance and leadership before players turn unappreciated and bitter and you end up losing both.

montrose
01-19-2009, 11:28 AM
You need to reward performance and leadership before players turn unappreciated and bitter and you end up losing both.

I agree, and if I get a text message from the Broncos today that BMarsh has signed an extension I'll be very happy. I'm simply saying that if I were Jim Goodman, unless Brandon's agent was beating down my door for a new deal - I'd wait until at least camp gets started. I'm thinking around the time DJ got his new deal last year. Lets see Brandon come into camp in shape and focused after an entire year of OTA's, assuming he does all that lets get the deal done before the season ever starts.

gyldenlove
01-19-2009, 11:47 AM
is that more difficult than with a claw?

No, it is slightly harder, now if he had a tentacle with suction cups we would be in business....

TheReverend
01-19-2009, 11:59 AM
I agree, and if I get a text message from the Broncos today that BMarsh has signed an extension I'll be very happy. I'm simply saying that if I were Jim Goodman, unless Brandon's agent was beating down my door for a new deal - I'd wait until at least camp gets started. I'm thinking around the time DJ got his new deal last year. Lets see Brandon come into camp in shape and focused after an entire year of OTA's, assuming he does all that lets get the deal done before the season ever starts.

I'd wait a few months to make sure he can stay clean this off-season, and if so, make him a top 5 $ receiver before waiting another season and potentially being forced to make him the highest paid receiver.

montrose
01-19-2009, 12:12 PM
I'd wait a few months to make sure he can stay clean this off-season, and if so, make him a top 5 $ receiver before waiting another season and potentially being forced to make him the highest paid receiver.

That sounds like a good plan to me.

tsiguy96
01-19-2009, 12:58 PM
I'd wait a few months to make sure he can stay clean this off-season, and if so, make him a top 5 $ receiver before waiting another season and potentially being forced to make him the highest paid receiver.

because hes been so bad in the last year ;)

what kind of idiot problematic receivers wishes he was double covered all day so his teammates would be open to get the ball. i say cut him.