Why not Billick or Mariucci?

[Taco John]

I don't understand why we're not interviewing either of these guys. Both are supremely qualified for the job. Why are we interviewing these en vogue, flavor of the month, 32 year old coaches, and not bringing in guys who have actual NFL head coaching experience?

[jmz313]

I could handle mariucci but Billick would drive me nuts. Billick, IMHO, was a huge failure in Baltimore as he was sopposed to bring O to the table and Never did in 8 years. His successor has done more in 1 year.

[Grumps]

Has beens. Keep the retreads away please.

[theAPAOps5]

Because they don't offer a fresh look. Thats what Bowlen wants. Seriously to fire Shanny for those guys would be dumb. I think you have to go with a young new mind. Thats why I think they along with Fassel are being ignored.

[TonyR]

You can't recycle the same guys forever. This is a young man's league. Young and/or inexperienced guys worked out in Baltimore, Atlanta, and Miami this year. And it worked out okay for Denver back in 1995, too, when a young guy named Mike Shanahan was hired. Remember him? He had, what, a half a season of experience under Al Davis? Every great coach was once young and inexperienced as a head coach. Sometimes you have to be progressive.

[BigPlayShay]

Billick got ousted for running a Club Med operation, I am sure Mooch would do the same.

[Meck77]

I'm telling you guys. Wait Bill Cowher still may surface. I think there may have been a deal going on before he pulled the plug on shanny. All this interviewing stuff is part of the NFL process that owners are FORCED to go thru.

[MileHighMagic]

I really dislike the Ravens and always thought Billick was an a$$hole but he seemed to be a helluva good coach and motivator. He always found a way to beat us.

[TonyR]

A better question is why Rex Ryan isn't getting more love.

[Smiling Assassin27]

I don't understand why we're not interviewing either of these guys. Both are supremely qualified for the job. Why are we interviewing these en vogue, flavor of the month, 32 year old coaches, and not bringing in guys who have actual NFL head coaching experience?

You know, I tossed Mooch's name out there on Day 1 of this thing and I haven't completely let go of that. Billick's kind of a douchebag but really is a quality coach. Mooch has less qualifications but has worked with two of the greatest qb's of all time in Favre and Young. Of the retread class, these two have some juice, IMO.

I still prefer a fresh face, though. I mean, Shanny had only coached the Raiders and no one could know he was a stud purely from that track record. Bowlen gave him a shot, though. A guy like Spags or Rivera have developed a track record and so they should get a shot. Morris and McDaniel are too green. I'd be OK with a Billick or Mooch, though I think that'd be the safe move, not the bold move.

[baja]

I don't understand why we're not interviewing either of these guys. Both are supremely qualified for the job. Why are we interviewing these en vogue, flavor of the month, 32 year old coaches, and not bringing in guys who have actual NFL head coaching experience?

If they hire Billick I would honestly stop being a Broncos fan.

[theAPAOps5]

I'm telling you guys. Wait Bill Cowher still may surface. I think there may have been a deal going on before he pulled the plug on shanny. All this interviewing stuff is part of the NFL process that owners are FORCED to go thru.

No way that hack coaches for Bowlen, thank God. I can almost guaruntee he isn't coaching. He wants another year off with his daughter.

[DBBBSBS]

Keep them both far away from denver ... No from colorado.

[TheReverend]

I could handle mariucci but Billick would drive me nuts. Billick, IMHO, was a huge failure in Baltimore as he was sopposed to bring O to the table and Never did in 8 years. His successor has done more in 1 year.

So you consider Billick a failure but not Mariucci...........?

[theAPAOps5]

A better question is why Rex Ryan isn't getting more love.

Because of who his father is. Not saying its fair but I think his image taints his kids.

[no-pseudo-fan]

I don't understand why we're not interviewing either of these guys. Both are supremely qualified for the job. Why are we interviewing these en vogue, flavor of the month, 32 year old coaches, and not bringing in guys who have actual NFL head coaching experience?

I actually think that teams have more success with these unknown young guys over the long haul. Guys like Billick and Mariucci have found a comfortable existance without the 20 hr days of being a NFL HC.

[montrose]

A better question is why Rex Ryan isn't getting more love.

We can't talk to him until the Ravens are out anyway.

[Taco John]

I actually think that teams have more success with these unknown young guys over the long haul.


I don't know how anyone could figure that. All of the recent Superbowl winning coaches disprove that:

2008 - Coughlin
2007 - Dungy
2006 - Cowher
2005 - Belichick
2004 - Belichick
2003 - Gruden
2002 - Belichick
2001 - Billick
2000 - Vermiel
1999 - Shanahan
1998 - Shanahan


That's almost a dozen years of coaches who were veterans of the position. Hiring a 32 year old coach doesn't seem to be the recipe for Superbowl success.

[TheReverend]

I don't know how anyone could figure that. All of the recent Superbowl winning coaches disprove that:

2008 - Coughlin
2007 - Dungy
2006 - Cowher
2005 - Belichick
2004 - Belichick
2003 - Gruden
2002 - Belichick
2001 - Billick
2000 - Vermiel
1999 - Shanahan
1998 - Shanahan


That's almost a dozen years of coaches who were veterans of the position. Hiring a 32 year old coach doesn't seem to be the recipe for Superbowl success.

..........BUT MIIIIIIIIIIIIIKE SMIIIIIIIIIIIIIIITHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!

[tsiguy96]

I don't know how anyone could figure that. All of the recent Superbowl winning coaches disprove that:

2008 - Coughlin
2007 - Dungy
2006 - Cowher
2005 - Belichick
2004 - Belichick
2003 - Gruden
2002 - Belichick
2001 - Billick
2000 - Vermiel
1999 - Shanahan
1998 - Shanahan


That's almost a dozen years of coaches who were veterans of the position. Hiring a 32 year old coach doesn't seem to be the recipe for Superbowl success.

because you dont fire shanahan to hire a coach who is half as good as he is. you take a risk, we know waht those coaches bring to the table, and its not enough for this team. we want a great coach, a 10 as pat put it, and if being risky about hiring a young guy is what it takes, like what happened with shanahan (who was essentially new himself, 4 games with the raiders isnt like being a HC) then thats what pat is going to do.

[TheReverend]

because you dont fire shanahan

good post bro, you just went on a little extra than was necessary. i trimmed the fat for you and fixed it up.

[no-pseudo-fan]

I don't know how anyone could figure that. All of the recent Superbowl winning coaches disprove that:

2008 - Coughlin
2007 - Dungy
2006 - Cowher
2005 - Belichick
2004 - Belichick
2003 - Gruden
2002 - Belichick
2001 - Billick
2000 - Vermiel
1999 - Shanahan
1998 - Shanahan


That's almost a dozen years of coaches who were veterans of the position. Hiring a 32 year old coach doesn't seem to be the recipe for Superbowl success.

I stated "more success with these unknown young guys over the long haul."

How old was Shanahan when he was hired in Denver? Gruden in TB? Belichick in NE? Cowher in Pittsburg?

I am talking long haul.

[Taco John]

I stated "more success with these unknown young guys over the long haul."

How old was Shanahan when he was hired in Denver? Gruden in TB? Belichick in NE? Cowher in Pittsburg?

I am talking long haul.



Their age doesn't matter as much as their experience. Just about every one of those coaches had experience as a head coach before taking their current team to the Superbowl.

And what do you mean by "taking the long haul?" The only long haul worth mentioning is the one that lasts from December through February and ends with a Superbowl Trophy.

[DenverBrit]

Billick is the Rumsfeld of the NFL. No thanks.

[tsiguy96]

good post bro, you just went on a little extra than was necessary. i trimmed the fat for you and fixed it up.

yes, he should have been fired, though i would have liked to see him get one more year. good try though.

are you still on total melt down, or have you accepted that there will be someone else coaching the denver broncos next year? are you going to support that coach or be ready to kill them after one loss?

[Taco John]

because you dont fire shanahan to hire a coach who is half as good as he is. you take a risk, we know waht those coaches bring to the table, and its not enough for this team. we want a great coach, a 10 as pat put it, and if being risky about hiring a young guy is what it takes, like what happened with shanahan (who was essentially new himself, 4 games with the raiders isnt like being a HC) then thats what pat is going to do.



This post is incoherent. Shanahan was already a HC once before - he wasn't essentially new. He had coached the Raiders, and after that won a Superbowl with the 49ers.

And the point "you don't fire Shanahan to hire a coach half as good as he is - you fire him to hire one nowhere even close to that" isn't much of a point.

[Broncomutt]

LMAO

I hear Don Shula and Mike Ditka are still alive also.

[tsiguy96]

This post is incoherent. Shanahan was already a HC once before - he wasn't essentially new. He had coached the Raiders, and after that won a Superbowl with the 49ers.

And the point "you don't fire Shanahan to hire a coach half as good as he is - you fire him to hire one nowhere even close to that" isn't much of a point.

yes it makes sense. we know how billick is, and how much like shanahan he went downhill after his SB win. we are trying to find someone better, you take a gamble that one of the young guys who is great at what they do can be a great HC as well. they are not great, only good. shanahan was only GOOD in the past 5-6 years. average over the last 3. he never fielded a competent defense, and you need one to win, he only cared about offense. if he cared about defense slowik would have been gone mid season.

shanahan coached 4 games for the raiders, explain to me how coaching 1/4 of a season for that organization is anything like being a HC for any other team? he was a coordinator for the 9ers when they won, much like spags is for the giants when they won.

i dont understand why people are constantly crying about this, shanahan is GONE. get over it, he will never coach for this team again. move on and respect the new coach, not criticize his every move. shanahan got 1,000 free passes before getting fired, give the new coach some as well.

[atomicbloke]

I don't know how anyone could figure that. All of the recent Superbowl winning coaches disprove that:

2008 - Coughlin
2007 - Dungy
2006 - Cowher
2005 - Belichick
2004 - Belichick
2003 - Gruden
2002 - Belichick
2001 - Billick
2000 - Vermiel
1999 - Shanahan
1998 - Shanahan



Actually that guy was not a veteran then. He became HC of the team after just a season's worth of HC experience with the Raiders and several years of OC experience.

[CBF1]

If they hire Billick I would honestly stop being a Broncos fan.

Said the life long, Cut me I bleed Orange Bronco fan :thumbs:

[TonyR]

I2008 - Coughlin
2007 - Dungy
2006 - Cowher
2005 - Belichick
2004 - Belichick
2003 - Gruden
2002 - Belichick
2001 - Billick
2000 - Vermiel
1999 - Shanahan
1998 - Shanahan


Billick, Cowher and Dungy were never HC's before being hired by the teams they won Super Bowls with. And Shanny was a HC for half a season.

[baja]

Said the life long, Cut me I bleed Orange Bronco fan :thumbs:

I could not stand watching Billick on the sidelines of the Broncos.

You might as well hire George Bush to coach the broncos IMO.

[WolfpackGuy]

I hate Brian Billick. His smugness makes Bill Belichick look like Richard Simmons.
He wasn't even that much of a mastermind in MIN.
Jump balls from Randall Cunningham to Randy Moss.

Playbook in Baltimore:
Jamal Lewis Left
Jamal Lewis Right
Jamal Lewis Middle
Jump ball to Heap

Brilliant!

[HEAV]

I like Billick...in the Coors Light ad's...

[BMF Bronco]

I hate Brian Billick. His smugness makes Bill Belichick look like Richard Simmons.
He wasn't even that much of a mastermind in MIN.
Jump balls from Randall Cunningham to Randy Moss.

Playbook in Baltimore:
Jamal Lewis Left
Jamal Lewis Right
Jamal Lewis Middle
Jump ball to Heap

Brilliant!

Because that's all they had, there was never a QB in Baltimore who could be considered top 10 in any particular year. We have the offensive weapons now that would allow him to turn his focus on the Defensive side of the ball and let the O cooridnator handle the O.

[no-pseudo-fan]

Their age doesn't matter as much as their experience. Just about every one of those coaches had experience as a head coach before taking their current team to the Superbowl.

And what do you mean by "taking the long haul?" The only long haul worth mentioning is the one that lasts from December through February and ends with a Superbowl Trophy.

Cowher was hired as a young coach with little experience, and it took him over a decade to win the Super Bowl.

How much experience did Gruden have before being the youngest coach in NFL history?

When I say "The Long Haul" I mean we find a young coach and stick with him. I do not want to change coaches every 3 or 4 years. Who says the next coach doesn't bring the spark that we need to get us to the next level?

Head Coaching experience means very little. You will never get that experience until someone gives you that chance. You also have these guys that have been DC's or OC's forever, but does that make Norv a great coach, or Wade Phillips a great coach, or Buddy Ryan a great coach. HC is more about drive, work ethic and leadership than anything.

[Traveler]

BMF,

Replace a few of those names and you have the Dan Reeves offense.ROFL!

[theAPAOps5]

I like Billick...in the Coors Light ad's...

MIKE, MIKE, MIKE

I always crack up on that one!

[HEAV]

MIKE, MIKE, MIKE

I always crack up on that one!

<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/Wvl31pIsonI&hl=en&fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/Wvl31pIsonI&hl=en&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>

It's a boot!

[theAPAOps5]

<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/Wvl31pIsonI&hl=en&fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/Wvl31pIsonI&hl=en&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>

It's a boot!

If they don't use that one on those commercials I will be extrememly dissappointed.

[SureShot]

I think being in one of those Coors Light commercials should preclude them from consideration.

[theAPAOps5]

I think being in one of those Coors Light commercials should preclude them from consideration.

Seconded. Motion to vote

[Orange_Beard]

Michael Vick - Player/Coach

[Taco John]

Billick, Cowher and Dungy were never HC's before being hired by the teams they won Super Bowls with. And Shanny was a HC for half a season.

Cowher had coached for 14 years before getting a Superbowl win. He qualifies as a veteran coach. Dungy coached the Tampa Bay Bucs before going to the Colts.

Billick is the only coach on that list who didn't have prior head coaching experience. My point is pretty sound.

[TheReverend]

yes, he should have been fired, though i would have liked to see him get one more year. good try though.

are you still on total melt down, or have you accepted that there will be someone else coaching the denver broncos next year? are you going to support that coach or be ready to kill them after one loss?

What meltdown?

I think Pat Bowlen is a dip**** that made a horrid decision. That's hardly about to change, but anyone and their cousin certainly has the right to disagree with me.

You'll be hard pressed to find me say a bad thing about the next regime aside from them inheriting a built offense and the best FA and draft for defense in as long as I can remember.

So what I have I said? That Spagnuolo's resume doesn't inspire confidence from me outside of 2 seasons out of 30? That we should trust the FO decision because they're the ones PARTAKING in the interview process and the candidates' PLANS for the team? That's nothing we're privy to on the internet. Was that the meltdown?

As for "killing them after a loss" the closest I've said is that the local media will be harder on the new coach than they have been on QBs since John Elway left town.

Anything else you'd like to fabricate?

[Rock Chalk]

I don't understand why we're not interviewing either of these guys. Both are supremely qualified for the job. Why are we interviewing these en vogue, flavor of the month, 32 year old coaches, and not bringing in guys who have actual NFL head coaching experience?

You want to interview Mooch and Billick but were deadset adamant against Cowher?

Dude seriously, your credibility in matters concerning football is gone.

[no-pseudo-fan]

At least our coach will not have to deal with the "Can't win one without Elway" tag.

[Taco John]

You want to interview Mooch and Billick but were deadset adamant against Cowher?

Dude seriously, your credibility in matters concerning football is gone.


Cowher says he's not coaching this year. But I'd rather have him than some 32 year old kid.

[Rock Chalk]

What meltdown?

I think Pat Bowlen is a dip**** that made a horrid decision. That's hardly about to change, but anyone and their cousin certainly has the right to disagree with me.

Why do you think he made a horrid decision?

Honestly, what had Shanahan done in the last 10 years that makes you think Pat's decision was so bad?

He has failed to groom Cutler well. The offense is weak and Cutler doesnt keep his cool.

His defense has been on a rapid decline.

His special teams have never been good.

So why? What was so special about Shanahan since we won our Superbowls that makes you think Pat's decision was "horrid"?

[Rock Chalk]

Cowher says he's not coaching this year. But I'd rather have him than some 32 year old kid.

Hey im not on board with Morris as HC (DC would be ok though).

But you were dead set against Cowher BEFORE he decided not to coach this year, but you would like Mooch or Billick? WTF.

[Taco John]

Hey im not on board with Morris as HC (DC would be ok though).

But you were dead set against Cowher BEFORE he decided not to coach this year, but you would like Mooch or Billick? WTF.


I'm not a Cowher fan. He's a Marty Schottenheimer clone.

[Rock Chalk]

I'm not a Cowher fan. He's a Marty Schottenheimer clone.

Except that pesky ability to WIN IN THE PLAYOFFS.

[TonyR]

Dungy coached the Tampa Bay Bucs before going to the Colts.


Yep, I had a brain fart on Dungy. I was thinking he was the DC in Tampa.

[TheReverend]

Why do you think he made a horrid decision?

See further comments

Honestly, what had Shanahan done in the last 10 years that makes you think Pat's decision was so bad?

Competed annually in the dominant conference. Set records in yards, points, and any offensive category you can think of. Managed all that with Brian Griese and Jake Plummer thanks to poor draft status making no franchise quarterback available without a crystal ball (Tom Brady, Drew Brees)

He has failed to groom Cutler well. The offense is weak and Cutler doesnt keep his cool.

Pass that ****! The pro bowl says hi. So does the #2 offense in the NFL along with a whopping 6.2 yards per play!

His defense has been on a rapid decline.

True

His special teams have never been good.

Prater started the season strong, but finished rough. Inconsistency comes with young players. Royal was brilliant along with Kern. The coverage units were also greatly improved thanks to guys like Larsen and Woodyard

So why? What was so special about Shanahan since we won our Superbowls that makes you think Pat's decision was "horrid"?

Maybe that's not enough for you, but combining the complete overhaul of the offensive side of the ball in 3 years to a top unit, along with the progression of younger players AND the deepest defensive FA and draft I can remember... the future looked insanely bright


That's all. Feel free to disagree. I've justified my opinion.

[Rohirrim]

Frankly, I don't think Mike Shanahan the head coach got fired. I think Mike Shanahan the GM got fired.

[Rock Chalk]

6.2 yards per play and good fo 16th in POINTS SCORED and last I checked points won football games, not yards.

Pro-Bowl? Yeah, Cutler deserved 3rd string or alternate on the pro-bowl. Good Bronco fans got him in, but he certainly didnt deserve to go over Rivers who had the best passer rating in the AFC and the most TOUCHDOWNS, you know, those things that win football games?

Prater is one part of special teams. Kern and Royal were improvements but neither was a gamebreaker at the position and the coverage units were ****ing horrible.

The offense is not special, not last year. Chalk it up to RB depth but get over the myth that our offense was good. It wasnt. It turned the ball over too much and failed to put it in the end zone AND failed to retain control of the ball to keep the worst Bronco defense I have ever seen off the field.

And as for your first comment Rev, the AFC has been a dominant conference but Shanahan hardly competed in it in the last 10 years. Winning one playoff game against a team we nearly always beat and getting SPANKED in every other playoff game and not even making it for 5 of the last 10 years is not competing annually.

[TheReverend]

Frankly, I don't think Mike Shanahan the head coach got fired. I think Mike Shanahan the GM got fired.

That might be the case, though the recent successes make that pretty dumb, in my opinion, as well.

The recent drafts have been amazing.

This season we had glaring holes at MLB, and both S spots. Gibril Wilson was the only "marquee FA" available in either spot and it was more important to protect Jay Cutler via the draft (not that I necessarily agree with that). The FO used a value approach and didn't break the bank for any of the players that were brought in an attempt to minimize the pain at the spots.

We can make fun of how worthless McCree, Niko and Manuel were, but there really weren't any better options...

[Rohirrim]

That might be the case, though the recent successes make that pretty dumb, in my opinion, as well.

The recent drafts have been amazing.

This season we had glaring holes at MLB, and both S spots. Gibril Wilson was the only "marquee FA" available in either spot and it was more important to protect Jay Cutler via the draft (not that I necessarily agree with that). The FO used a value approach and didn't break the bank for any of the players that were brought in an attempt to minimize the pain at the spots.

We can make fun of how worthless McCree, Niko and Manuel were, but there really weren't any better options...

I don't believe anybody in any position of responsibility in the NFL would expect to keep their jobs after posting the kind of season the Broncos had. Obviously, judging by Mike's statements, he didn't either.

[Mountain Bronco]

Why trade one old coach for another?

[TheReverend]

6.2 yards per play and good fo 16th in POINTS SCORED and last I checked points won football games, not yards.

Pro-Bowl? Yeah, Cutler deserved 3rd string or alternate on the pro-bowl. Good Bronco fans got him in, but he certainly didnt deserve to go over Rivers who had the best passer rating in the AFC and the most TOUCHDOWNS, you know, those things that win football games?

Why not look up the top scoring offenses then, and THEN reference that with how many turnovers their defenses got them? You see, Denver had a pretty damn good possession-scoring percentage. When a defense gets you the ball, you can score. When the defense gets pushed around for 8 minute drives culminating in a certain TD, kinda hard to do... you also tend to force more throws trying to make the possessions you DO have count.

RE: the Pro Bowl. I can understand a position where Rivers should be ahead of Cutler at the Pro Bowl. I CAN'T understand a claim where Cutler's out. If anything, Favre would be out. Period. Cutler's a legitimate Pro Bowl quarterback.

Prater is one part of special teams. Kern and Royal were improvements but neither was a gamebreaker at the position and the coverage units were ****ing horrible.

Royal wasn't a gamebreaker at the position in your eyes? Kern was one of the top punters in the NFL! And the coverage units were MUCH improved

The offense is not special, not last year. Chalk it up to RB depth but get over the myth that our offense was good. It wasnt. It turned the ball over too much and failed to put it in the end zone AND failed to retain control of the ball to keep the worst Bronco defense I have ever seen off the field.

See above

And as for your first comment Rev, the AFC has been a dominant conference but Shanahan hardly competed in it in the last 10 years. Winning one playoff game against a team we nearly always beat and getting SPANKED in every other playoff game and not even making it for 5 of the last 10 years is not competing annually.

The "one" playoff game is skewed. It's true, but I don't think you should penalize a man for having a great reg season and securing a first round bye. Also, not sure if you've noticed buy playoff wins have been extremely hard to come by for teams without guys named "Brady" or "Manning" in the AFC the past 10 years. Mike did it with a dude with a porno stache.



Like I said, you're welcome to disagree, but I'll certainly continue to refute a rant like that containing very little actual substance.

[HooptyHoops]

Frankly, I don't think Mike Shanahan the head coach got fired. I think Mike Shanahan the GM got fired.

I absolutely agree!

[TheReverend]

I don't believe anybody in any position of responsibility in the NFL would expect to keep their jobs after posting the kind of season the Broncos had. Obviously, judging by Mike's statements, he didn't either.

I'm not so sure. He had some clever little hints at things, like the one where he said "I didn't say I agree with it," and almost a couple winks, even. I think he just appreciates the opportunity Pat gave him and continued to be all class.

[broncosteven]

Except that pesky ability to WIN IN THE PLAYOFFS.

Cower has more wins than Marty in the playoffs but how many SB's?

I would take Marriuci over Cowlover but I prefer a young guy this go around.

If the young guy hoses up and sets the franchise back 5 years then we get a true rebuilding, everyone here will know what is like to root for a team that does not have a shot at the playoffs year in/out, and I move up fast for Season tix as people bail on the franchise.

[Meck77]

I'm not a Cowher fan. He's a Marty Schottenheimer clone.

Whoops!

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/pit/#playoffs

Take a look at how many average QBs they consistently made the playoffs with. Being able to put together a defense will do that for a team.

Weren't you saying you wanted a coach with experience?

[tsiguy96]

Frankly, I don't think Mike Shanahan the head coach got fired. I think Mike Shanahan the GM got fired.

thats exactly what happened, its pretty obvious. if we keep shanny the coach, we keep shanny the GM as well. he wouldnt do that however, so we had to get rid of both.

[TheReverend]

Just to clarify Alec, the top scoring teams in the NFL were:

NO, SD, AZ, NYG, GB who had 22, 24, 30, 22, 28 takeaways respectively. Denver managed a whopping 13.

[DHallblows]

Michael Vick - Player/Coach

END THREAD ROFL!

[baja]

You want to interview Mooch and Billick but were deadset adamant against Cowher?

Dude seriously, your credibility in matters concerning football is gone.

I think TJ just likes to stir the pot once and awhile how else can you explain some of his threads/takes???

[baja]

BTW the only reason Cowher won a SP is because Mike Shanahan handed it to him.

[baja]

Cowher says he's not coaching this year. But I'd rather have him than some 32 year old kid.

How old was Shanahan when Bowlen first tried to hire him as HC?

[DontBeMessin]

Wow - I thought the Raiders were pulling coaches out of their arses...

[baja]

I'm not a Cowher fan. He's a Marty Schottenheimer clone.

Either one of those two would be a 1000 times better than Bile a chuck and I hate both of um.

[broncocalijohn]

yes, he should have been fired, though i would have liked to see him get one more year. good try though.

are you still on total melt down, or have you accepted that there will be someone else coaching the denver broncos next year? are you going to support that coach or be ready to kill them after one loss?

what we have here is the new Wolf to badger us to ignore status. Of course some will state that Rev is already at that point with them.

[Rock Chalk]

Like I said, you're welcome to disagree, but I'll certainly continue to refute a rant like that containing very little actual substance.

I will continue to disagree.

Cutler adn teh offense produced more 3 and outs than they did under Plummer in Plummer's last year.

The failures in the red zone are a direct result of horrendous play calling and allowing a young QB who is too cocky and arrogant to take what is given to him to throw the ball in the red zone.

Kern and Royal were improvements, but at what point in the season were they gamebreakers on Special Teams?

Play calling is stale and predictable so much so that even my wife who has no knowledge of the intricacies of football questioned why we did a lot of the things we did on offense this year.

I dont disagree that the offense in 2005 was a remarkable coaching job but one years remarkable job doesnt make up for 9 years of complete and utter failure.

As for that stupid comment you about about not penalizing a coach for a great regular season record but a bad post season record, its just that, stupid. Pat Bowlen has ALWAYS been about winning teh SB and SHANAHAN himself said that if you dont win it all, you have failed. The season is a failure.

He failed, in every aspect of coaching the last ten years by his OWN standards, and yet you and Taco are still upset that the owner held the coach to his own standards and fired him.

[Tombstone RJ]

I don't understand why we're not interviewing either of these guys. Both are supremely qualified for the job. Why are we interviewing these en vogue, flavor of the month, 32 year old coaches, and not bringing in guys who have actual NFL head coaching experience?

eh, no thanks. Mooch is a girlie man moron who should have never been a hc to begin with in the NFL and Billick never could get the Ravens offense going, even though he's supposedly an offensive genius...

[SureShot]

How old was Shanahan when Bowlen first tried to hire him as HC?

Comparing Shanahan at the time of his hiring to the current young prospects is silly. Shanny had head coaching experience and a SB ring after heading one of the best offenses in recent history. Not mention he was a known commodity within the organization and had a great relationship with Elway.

[TonyR]

Comparing Shanahan at the time of his hiring to the current young prospects is silly. Shanny had head coaching experience and a SB ring after heading one of the best offenses in recent history. Not mention he was a known commodity within the organization and had a great relationship with Elway.

FYI, McDaniels helmed one of the best offenses EVER last season in NE, went to a Super Bowl, and coached an unknown QB to an 11-5 record this season. So I don't think the comparision is that outlandish. Sure he's a bit younger and less experienced but not by all that much.

[DHallblows]

I can in no way accept any statement saying Royal was a game breaker in special teams this year...

[Inkana7]

I don't understand why we're not interviewing either of these guys. Both are supremely qualified for the job. Why are we interviewing these en vogue, flavor of the month, 32 year old coaches, and not bringing in guys who have actual NFL head coaching experience?

Their NFL head coaching experience involved epic failure.

[SureShot]

FYI, McDaniels helmed one of the best offenses EVER last season in NE, went to a Super Bowl, and coached an unknown QB to an 11-5 record this season. So I don't think the comparision is that outlandish. Sure he's a bit younger and less experienced but not by all that much.

No one can deny NE's success on offense but do you believe Pat would have hired Shanny if he only had been an OC at SF and not had any HC experience and never worked for the Broncos?

I don't think so.

[TonyR]

Their NFL head coaching experience involved epic failure.

Fyi, Billick did win a Super Bowl.

[Inkana7]

Fyi, Billick did win a Super Bowl.

Billick is a supposed "offensive genius" who's team went what, 4, 5 games without scoring an offensive TD during that 2000 season.

[Tombstone RJ]

Billick is a supposed "offensive genius" who's team went what, 4, 5 games without scoring an offensive TD during that 2000 season.

Plus Billick never could develop a QB. Billick is just not a good fit IMHO. Mooch sucks even worse...

[TonyR]

Billick is a supposed "offensive genius" who's team went what, 4, 5 games without scoring an offensive TD during that 2000 season.

I'm not a Billick fan so I hate to appear to be defending him but consider the QB's he had: Tony Banks, Elvis Grbac, Kyle Boller, and a washed up Steve McNair. That right there is a hot mess.

[WolfpackGuy]

Awww, come on. Boller can throw it 70 yards from his knees.

[Inkana7]

I'm not a Billick fan so I hate to appear to be defending him but consider the QB's he had: Tony Banks, Elvis Grbac, Kyle Boller, and a washed up Steve McNair. That right there is a hot mess.

He had a stellar defense every year he was coaching there. You'd think at one point he could focus and build a half decent offense.

And McNair had a good year in 06.

[oubronco]

going from Shanny to Maracoochie is like going from pros to Div.3 college

[elsid13]

You can't recycle the same guys forever. This is a young man's league. Young and/or inexperienced guys worked out in Baltimore, Atlanta, and Miami this year. And it worked out okay for Denver back in 1995, too, when a young guy named Mike Shanahan was hired. Remember him? He had, what, a half a season of experience under Al Davis? Every great coach was once young and inexperienced as a head coach. Sometimes you have to be progressive.

I wouldn't call Mike Smith (49) or Tony Sparano (48) really young.

[TheReverend]

I will continue to disagree.

Cutler adn teh offense produced more 3 and outs than they did under Plummer in Plummer's last year.

I have absolutely ZERO clue where you got this stat. The only way to make that true is to take it literally and naturally that would be the case considering Cutler played a full season here where Jake played little over a half in his last year... if you meant something else, you're flat out lying:

2008's Broncos offense had a #2 in the NFL outstanding 3rd down conversion rate of 48%. That's DYNAMIC. Plummer's last year saw a 37% conversion, and that includes Cutler's game where he RAISED that percentage.

Maybe you're referring to 2005? The AFCCG run? Well, no, because that's a 36% rate.

The failures in the red zone are a direct result of horrendous play calling and allowing a young QB who is too cocky and arrogant to take what is given to him to throw the ball in the red zone.

And nothing to do with the situation in the backfield? Notice how redzone efficient the team was to start the season before injuries mounted? And then how efficient they were again with Hillis in the backfield? Or is it just more convenient for you to flat out blame Cutler?

Kern and Royal were improvements, but at what point in the season were they gamebreakers on Special Teams?

Royal was top 5 in ave return yardage, and Kern was in the top 5 on yards per punt...

Play calling is stale and predictable so much so that even my wife who has no knowledge of the intricacies of football questioned why we did a lot of the things we did on offense this year.

I dont disagree that the offense in 2005 was a remarkable coaching job but one years remarkable job doesnt make up for 9 years of complete and utter failure.

You mean the season where both RBs stayed healthy all season and we rushed for over 2000 yards? Btw, that season was only 6% higher in scoring, despite the gaudy turnovers the defensive provided that season because Jake can't throw on 3rd down.

As for that stupid comment you about about not penalizing a coach for a great regular season record but a bad post season record, its just that, stupid. Pat Bowlen has ALWAYS been about winning teh SB and SHANAHAN himself said that if you dont win it all, you have failed. The season is a failure.

You misunderstood my comment. Penalize him for playoff failures but credit playoff successes appropriately. Saying "1 playoff win in 10 years" IS accurate, but it skews the first round bye and makes it seem like the height of achievement was the divisional round and not handing Tom Brady his first ever playoff loss, stopping the Pats from getting 3 in a row and playing in the AFCCG. That's all

He failed, in every aspect of coaching the last ten years by his OWN standards, and yet you and Taco are still upset that the owner held the coach to his own standards and fired him.

Yes, I am. SB's don't come easy, and he'd proven capable of getting it done.



Other than my comments in red, on the whole that was a good post, Alec.

[baja]

Comparing Shanahan at the time of his hiring to the current young prospects is silly. Shanny had head coaching experience and a SB ring after heading one of the best offenses in recent history. Not mention he was a known commodity within the organization and had a great relationship with Elway.

All I asked is how old was he.

[baja]

No one can deny NE's success on offense but do you believe Pat would have hired Shanny if he only had been an OC at SF and not had any HC experience and never worked for the Broncos?

I don't think so.

He wanted Shanny before the SB at SF

[TheReverend]

He wanted Shanny before the SB at SF

That's when he got Shanny. He snuck through SF security at the hotel wearing a fake mustache and disguise to get to Mike. Tampering at it's finest :thumbs:

[elsid13]

All I asked is how old was he.

He's 56 now and spent 14 years with the team. So he was around 42 named coach of the Denver Broncos.

[TheReverend]

He's 56 now and spent 14 years with the team. So he was around 42 named coach of the Denver Broncos.

34 for his first HC gig, I believe.

[TheReverend]

Come on, Alec. You could at least pop in and apologize for the parts you were wrong about.

[SureShot]

All I asked is how old was he.

I don't know why I quoted you I guess I need to quit drinking on the job. :)

[JCMElway]

Ugh. No thanks to those two.

There are a lot of candidates out there that I am stoked about! I could find a lot of positives about hiring Spags, Ryan, Morris, or McDaniels. I think it's a slam dunk that we get one of these four guys.

[SureShot]

He wanted Shanny before the SB at SF

Because he had a great relationship with the face of the franchise and worked for the Broncos for 7 seven years prior. Not one candidate can come close to familiarity that Pat had for Shanny.

Thats why the drunk canuck is sitting back and letting "smarter people" clean up his mess.

[TheReverend]

Because he had a great relationship with the face of the franchise and worked for the Broncos for 7 seven years prior. Not one candidate can come close to familiarity that Pat had for Shanny.

Thats why the drunk canuck is sitting back and letting "smarter people" clean up his mess.

Understatement. :thumbs:

[Hogan11]

I never thought Mariucci was worth a **** and I still don't.

[ScottXray]

I can in no way accept any statement saying Royal was a game breaker in special teams this year...
I disagree. He returned several punts to inside the opponents 20. Not his fault they ended up getting nothing out of those plays because of horrid plaay calling afterward, then Prater midding the FG too.

[DHallblows]

I disagree. He returned several punts to inside the opponents 20. Not his fault they ended up getting nothing out of those plays because of horrid plaay calling afterward, then Prater midding the FG too.

As the season progressed, he became more and more afraid of returning ANYTHING. He'd fair catch or just let it drop behind him even when he was standing on like the 30. It was ridiculous for the last 8 or so games, he was terrified of doing anything productive...

[Taco John]

Their NFL head coaching experience involved epic failure.

So did Belichick before the Pats brought him in. He was the laughing stock of the league.

[stugotsII]

I don't understand why we're not interviewing either of these guys. Both are supremely qualified for the job. Why are we interviewing these en vogue, flavor of the month, 32 year old coaches, and not bringing in guys who have actual NFL head coaching experience?

Simple:


Because Bellick and Mariucci suck.

[stugotsII]

So did Belichick before the Pats brought him in. He was the laughing stock of the league.

Dear Hairy Taco,

Belichick had success because of their GM.

[Taco John]

How old was Shanahan when Bowlen first tried to hire him as HC?

42 if I recall correctly.

[Taco John]

I never thought Mariucci was worth a **** and I still don't.

I thought Mariucci did very well with the 49ers, and should have kept his job there except that Terrell Owens was a cancer in that locker room and hurt that team. His team was 10-6 when he lost his job after losing to the eventual Superbowl winning Bucs. He was a playoff contender in 4 of his 6 years with the 49ers.

Whether he's the long term solution or not, at the very least, I know that Mariucci knows how to run a football club and isn't going to be swallowed whole by the hot media spotlight, and the shadow of Shanahan.


....oh, I should mention that I don't count anything that happened with the Matt Millen Detroit Lions against him.

[Taco John]

Also, for what it's worth, I don't like Billick, but I know more about him than the flavor of the month candidates that everybody is so gaga about. I'd rather not have Billick or Cowher, but I'd feel better about either of them than some of the 32 year old prospects that are being thrown out. At the very least, I know that they'll be able to hold their own with the Denver media and know how to keep a team focused through adversity.

[Ray Finkle]

Also, for what it's worth, I don't like Billick, but I know more about him than the flavor of the month candidates that everybody is so gaga about. I'd rather not have Billick or Cowher, but I'd feel better about either of them than some of the 32 year old prospects that are being thrown out. At the very least, I know that they'll be able to hold their own with the Denver media and know how to keep a team focused through adversity.

Billick is overrated. He had success in Minnesota due to Moss, Smith, and Carter and everyone labeled him a genius. He won in Baltimore because of Lewis. I see nothing that he can bring to the table except smugness.


Mooch is the same way....was good with a skilled team and could not coach up an average team....

[TheReverend]

Billick is overrated. He had success in Minnesota due to Moss, Smith, and Carter and everyone labeled him a genius. He won in Baltimore because of Lewis. I see nothing that he can bring to the table except smugness.

That's usually how it works, though. This is exactly why Mike scrapped the Championship Game team to get HIS shiny toys.

Think Dungy sniffs the hall without Peyton Manning scoring gaudy points every game?

Where is Belicek without a coin toss from his QBs coach that got Tom Brady over Tim Rattay?

...and it goes on and on! Rarely does anyone win the superbowl when it's not on the back of a Hall of Fame great. Coaching can help position you for the playoffs... but by that time, it's the player's execution that's going to take over. ****ty clock management teams don't make it that far. Teams that don't know their assignments don't make it that far.

(Disclaimer: Not an endorsement for Billick)