Dempsey Dog
12-16-2008, 11:30 AM
I thought this was interesting. I generally agree with the top 6 and cannot really argue too much with them. I am just not sure about the order of guys between 2-6.
Brees is a good choice for 1, at this point. He is just a good pure QB. Ben is good at doing what is asked and is the perfect QB for the type of team the Steelers are. Manning, if he does not get good protection, struggles and will not be able to carry a team on his back alone. Like Ben, he did win an SB and that is what it is all about. Rivers with his play this year has demonstrated that he is a very good QB (that was really hard to say), but Jay has a much greater ceiling. Jay will get much better, while I suspect Rivers has has shown the highest he will go already. Last, I think the below assessment on Romo is accurate, but I would have put him 6th.
Now, Dec 2009, the ranking will be Cutler, Ryan, Manning, Rothy, and Flacco / Rivers tied. Brees will be 30 next year so he is out.
Young Guns: A Look at the Under 30 QB Crowd
Monday, December 15, 2008
Posted By Ken Ilchuk 2:23 PM
The Elite
Among the youngsters there is a group that clearly stands head and shoulders above the rest.
1. Drew Brees, Saints: It's hard for anyone to argue with the potentially record setting numbers Brees has put up this season despite the loss of several of his top weapons over the course of the year. Most people don't realize that he is just 29 years old and has already led two teams to the playoffs. If the Saints had a defense, he'd be there again this year.
2. Philip Rivers, Chargers: Rivers leads the NFL in passer rating and has really come into his own, at times carrying this team without a healthy LT in the backfield and a banged up Antonio Gates struggling for much of the year. He was strong in the '07 postseason, leading the Bolts to the AFC Championship Game and showing great toughness in playing through injury. This year, his ability to deliver the ball accurately to the perimeter and involve the receivers in the offense has made him one of the top passers in the NFL.
3. Eli Manning, Giants: We here at Real Scouts knew that the light was coming on for Manning when he started finding Amani Toomer on a regular basis. During the playoffs last year, he placed an emphasis on playing mistake-free football, and now he is one of the better passers in the league at working through his progressions and finding the open man. Critics will point to his recent struggles, but no QB does it alone. The loss of Plaxico Burress has completely changed the coverages he is seeing, and as a result, has opened up more blitz opportunities for defenses to disguise blitz schemes, making the reads much tougher. Take away the power running game (no, it doesn't matter that they have Bradshaw and Ward, they are different kinds of runners) and things get tough against good defenses like Philly and Dallas.
4. Tony Romo, Cowboys: Romo is obviously talented, does a very good job of spreading the ball around in the passing game (despite TO's objections), and is very impressive using his legs and mobility to extend the play. Again, critics will ask how someone with so many weapons could fail, but anyone who has been in at least a semi-conscious state this week must now realize that sometimes it's harder to manage all those weapons than play without them. Still, Romo makes too many mistakes for my tastes, and I've been saying it since Week One, when Cowboys fans lambasted me for knocking their team. It's only hurt him in the playoffs against better competition, but the mistakes are there far too often.
5. Ben Roethlisberger, Steelers: I'll give you this; that was an impressive drive to win that game Sunday. Roethlisberger has great size, a strong arm, and good mobility for a bigger QB. But he holds the ball too long, doesn't have real good poise under pressure, takes too many sacks, and makes far too many mistakes with the ball. Some will point to his Super Bowl win as a sophomore and the Steelers postseason record and I say, "so what". Big Ben does his part on a team blessed with a devastating defense and a run game that can carry the load if given the chance, but he has not been a consistent standout player on that team. He's good, very good, but I can't put him higher than this at this point.
6. Jay Cutler, Broncos: Another strong armed guy who has excellent field vision and the mobility to make plays on the run. Unlike some of the players in front of him, Cutler carries the load for his team, and his innate playmaking ability makes him very tough to defend. Unfortunately, with that load comes the responsibility of doing it week in and week out, and he hasn't shown the ability to perform at a high level consistently. Of this whole group, he may be the next truly great QB in the NFL.
On the Come
These guys are relatively new starters and appear to have the tools to succeed with more time to grow into the role.
1. Matt Schaub, Texans: Schaub was brought to Texas last year to be the savior. It didn't quite work out that way initially, but now that Alex Gibbs has fixed the O-line, and there is a strong running game in place, Schaub has had the time and patience to establish new targets in the passing game, like Kevin Walter and Owen Daniels.
2. Aaron Rodgers, Packers: Considering all he's had to endure over the past eight months, Rodgers has performed reasonably well. He possesses a lot of the tools necessary to become the next legend in Green Bay; he's accurate, has a capable arm, is more mobile than his predecessor, and has a better command of the West Coast offense than initially given credit for. All he needs is time.
3. Matt Ryan, Falcons: Ryan has established a very good rapport with Roddy White and has the arm to stretch the field, which is dangerous with the way the Falcons can run the ball. He is gaining more knowledge and experience with each passing game, and though he will have tough ones like Sunday (2 INT), he has the physical tools and intangibles to lead this team in the future.
4. Joe Flacco, Ravens: Ditto for Flacco. Though he is still more game manager than full-fledged signal caller, he has shown some big play ability and is learning how to work the passing game off play action and a strong run game. What he has proven more than anything is that the level of competition is not going to be an issue for him. Once over that, he has all the physical tools to excel.
With a Little Help From Their Friends
These are guys who have excelled (in my eyes) because of coaching, playing in a particular system, or because of support they get from other segments of the team (run game, defense, etc).
1. Matt Cassel, Patriots: He has two 400-yard games to his credit and four games with at least 3 TD passes. He has improved tenfold over the course of the season, and his 7.0 yards per attempt is strong. He is also a threat as a runner, which works to his advantage in the New England spread. He's proven to be a quick study and a solid leader. Is he a product of coaching and the system? Maybe. But his performance this year has earned him some money on the free agent market.
2. Jason Campbell, Redskins: Campbell has had success in Jim Zorn's west coast offense, but as the O-line and the running back have faltered due to injury, his weaknesses have been exposed. He lacks ideal accuracy on the long ball, especially for a team that features WR Santana Moss, and he is going to have to improve his pre-snap reads and learn how to counter pressure.
3. Kyle Orton, Bears: Where would Orton be without the running, and catching, and playmaking of Matt Forte? We don't know. That's why he's in this group. He's fine, as long as he doesn't have to carry the load. With that being said, he has had five games where his yards per attempt is over 7.0. He's cooled off in recent weeks, but still has shown enough playmaking ability in the passing game to show that he is a capable leader.
4. Trent Edwards, Bills: Edwards is another player who has struggled after a fast start. He's smart and accurate, and as long as he has a full complement of weapons at his disposal, he can win games.
Questions Abound
This group would have to be considered the "incompletes". Each has flashed some skill or ability, but none have shown they are ready to be a bona fide NFL starter.
1. Ryan Fitzpatrick, Bengals: His running ability helped him behind that porous O-line, and he has an accurate enough arm to make it work as a spot starter. Anyone who can lead a bad team like the Bengals to a few wins is okay in my book.
2. Tarvaris Jackson, Vikings: Jackson sure looked good on Sunday, didn't he? Now let's see if he can do it again. Jackson has a strong arm, which can really open up the Vikes playbook. But he has to get his head around the mental part of the game and be consistently accurate, stand in the pocket and deliver the ball on the longer routes
3. Tyler Thigpen, Chiefs: Thigpen has shown me enough flashes against some good defenses to make me believe that Herm Edwards was right. They may have found their guy of the future here. Now he needs some help and some time.
4. Shaun Hill, 49ers: He's big, strong, and athletic, and he has a decent arm. However, he's not a good fit in this system.
5. JaMarcus Russell, Raiders: Russell has regressed. He doesn't have many weapons at his disposal, but it wouldn't matter if he did. The Raiders need to find him a coach and stick with him in order for the kid to learn, because right now he doesn't seem to have any idea of how to drop back from center and run a pro style offense.
http://www.sportingnews.com/blog/real_scouts/entry/view/15694/young_guns_a_look_at_the_under_30_qb_crowd
Brees is a good choice for 1, at this point. He is just a good pure QB. Ben is good at doing what is asked and is the perfect QB for the type of team the Steelers are. Manning, if he does not get good protection, struggles and will not be able to carry a team on his back alone. Like Ben, he did win an SB and that is what it is all about. Rivers with his play this year has demonstrated that he is a very good QB (that was really hard to say), but Jay has a much greater ceiling. Jay will get much better, while I suspect Rivers has has shown the highest he will go already. Last, I think the below assessment on Romo is accurate, but I would have put him 6th.
Now, Dec 2009, the ranking will be Cutler, Ryan, Manning, Rothy, and Flacco / Rivers tied. Brees will be 30 next year so he is out.
Young Guns: A Look at the Under 30 QB Crowd
Monday, December 15, 2008
Posted By Ken Ilchuk 2:23 PM
The Elite
Among the youngsters there is a group that clearly stands head and shoulders above the rest.
1. Drew Brees, Saints: It's hard for anyone to argue with the potentially record setting numbers Brees has put up this season despite the loss of several of his top weapons over the course of the year. Most people don't realize that he is just 29 years old and has already led two teams to the playoffs. If the Saints had a defense, he'd be there again this year.
2. Philip Rivers, Chargers: Rivers leads the NFL in passer rating and has really come into his own, at times carrying this team without a healthy LT in the backfield and a banged up Antonio Gates struggling for much of the year. He was strong in the '07 postseason, leading the Bolts to the AFC Championship Game and showing great toughness in playing through injury. This year, his ability to deliver the ball accurately to the perimeter and involve the receivers in the offense has made him one of the top passers in the NFL.
3. Eli Manning, Giants: We here at Real Scouts knew that the light was coming on for Manning when he started finding Amani Toomer on a regular basis. During the playoffs last year, he placed an emphasis on playing mistake-free football, and now he is one of the better passers in the league at working through his progressions and finding the open man. Critics will point to his recent struggles, but no QB does it alone. The loss of Plaxico Burress has completely changed the coverages he is seeing, and as a result, has opened up more blitz opportunities for defenses to disguise blitz schemes, making the reads much tougher. Take away the power running game (no, it doesn't matter that they have Bradshaw and Ward, they are different kinds of runners) and things get tough against good defenses like Philly and Dallas.
4. Tony Romo, Cowboys: Romo is obviously talented, does a very good job of spreading the ball around in the passing game (despite TO's objections), and is very impressive using his legs and mobility to extend the play. Again, critics will ask how someone with so many weapons could fail, but anyone who has been in at least a semi-conscious state this week must now realize that sometimes it's harder to manage all those weapons than play without them. Still, Romo makes too many mistakes for my tastes, and I've been saying it since Week One, when Cowboys fans lambasted me for knocking their team. It's only hurt him in the playoffs against better competition, but the mistakes are there far too often.
5. Ben Roethlisberger, Steelers: I'll give you this; that was an impressive drive to win that game Sunday. Roethlisberger has great size, a strong arm, and good mobility for a bigger QB. But he holds the ball too long, doesn't have real good poise under pressure, takes too many sacks, and makes far too many mistakes with the ball. Some will point to his Super Bowl win as a sophomore and the Steelers postseason record and I say, "so what". Big Ben does his part on a team blessed with a devastating defense and a run game that can carry the load if given the chance, but he has not been a consistent standout player on that team. He's good, very good, but I can't put him higher than this at this point.
6. Jay Cutler, Broncos: Another strong armed guy who has excellent field vision and the mobility to make plays on the run. Unlike some of the players in front of him, Cutler carries the load for his team, and his innate playmaking ability makes him very tough to defend. Unfortunately, with that load comes the responsibility of doing it week in and week out, and he hasn't shown the ability to perform at a high level consistently. Of this whole group, he may be the next truly great QB in the NFL.
On the Come
These guys are relatively new starters and appear to have the tools to succeed with more time to grow into the role.
1. Matt Schaub, Texans: Schaub was brought to Texas last year to be the savior. It didn't quite work out that way initially, but now that Alex Gibbs has fixed the O-line, and there is a strong running game in place, Schaub has had the time and patience to establish new targets in the passing game, like Kevin Walter and Owen Daniels.
2. Aaron Rodgers, Packers: Considering all he's had to endure over the past eight months, Rodgers has performed reasonably well. He possesses a lot of the tools necessary to become the next legend in Green Bay; he's accurate, has a capable arm, is more mobile than his predecessor, and has a better command of the West Coast offense than initially given credit for. All he needs is time.
3. Matt Ryan, Falcons: Ryan has established a very good rapport with Roddy White and has the arm to stretch the field, which is dangerous with the way the Falcons can run the ball. He is gaining more knowledge and experience with each passing game, and though he will have tough ones like Sunday (2 INT), he has the physical tools and intangibles to lead this team in the future.
4. Joe Flacco, Ravens: Ditto for Flacco. Though he is still more game manager than full-fledged signal caller, he has shown some big play ability and is learning how to work the passing game off play action and a strong run game. What he has proven more than anything is that the level of competition is not going to be an issue for him. Once over that, he has all the physical tools to excel.
With a Little Help From Their Friends
These are guys who have excelled (in my eyes) because of coaching, playing in a particular system, or because of support they get from other segments of the team (run game, defense, etc).
1. Matt Cassel, Patriots: He has two 400-yard games to his credit and four games with at least 3 TD passes. He has improved tenfold over the course of the season, and his 7.0 yards per attempt is strong. He is also a threat as a runner, which works to his advantage in the New England spread. He's proven to be a quick study and a solid leader. Is he a product of coaching and the system? Maybe. But his performance this year has earned him some money on the free agent market.
2. Jason Campbell, Redskins: Campbell has had success in Jim Zorn's west coast offense, but as the O-line and the running back have faltered due to injury, his weaknesses have been exposed. He lacks ideal accuracy on the long ball, especially for a team that features WR Santana Moss, and he is going to have to improve his pre-snap reads and learn how to counter pressure.
3. Kyle Orton, Bears: Where would Orton be without the running, and catching, and playmaking of Matt Forte? We don't know. That's why he's in this group. He's fine, as long as he doesn't have to carry the load. With that being said, he has had five games where his yards per attempt is over 7.0. He's cooled off in recent weeks, but still has shown enough playmaking ability in the passing game to show that he is a capable leader.
4. Trent Edwards, Bills: Edwards is another player who has struggled after a fast start. He's smart and accurate, and as long as he has a full complement of weapons at his disposal, he can win games.
Questions Abound
This group would have to be considered the "incompletes". Each has flashed some skill or ability, but none have shown they are ready to be a bona fide NFL starter.
1. Ryan Fitzpatrick, Bengals: His running ability helped him behind that porous O-line, and he has an accurate enough arm to make it work as a spot starter. Anyone who can lead a bad team like the Bengals to a few wins is okay in my book.
2. Tarvaris Jackson, Vikings: Jackson sure looked good on Sunday, didn't he? Now let's see if he can do it again. Jackson has a strong arm, which can really open up the Vikes playbook. But he has to get his head around the mental part of the game and be consistently accurate, stand in the pocket and deliver the ball on the longer routes
3. Tyler Thigpen, Chiefs: Thigpen has shown me enough flashes against some good defenses to make me believe that Herm Edwards was right. They may have found their guy of the future here. Now he needs some help and some time.
4. Shaun Hill, 49ers: He's big, strong, and athletic, and he has a decent arm. However, he's not a good fit in this system.
5. JaMarcus Russell, Raiders: Russell has regressed. He doesn't have many weapons at his disposal, but it wouldn't matter if he did. The Raiders need to find him a coach and stick with him in order for the kid to learn, because right now he doesn't seem to have any idea of how to drop back from center and run a pro style offense.
http://www.sportingnews.com/blog/real_scouts/entry/view/15694/young_guns_a_look_at_the_under_30_qb_crowd