someone defend slowik now

[tsiguy96]

tell me why he ever deserves to work in the NFL again?

[Popps]

Again, I'm not defending him... but when you have no D-line and a makeshift secondary, I'm just not sure what else we should expect.

He probably does need to go, but his D has played O.K. recently despite injuries. We just came out looking like crap from top to bottom today. Cutler looks disinterested and we're back to running the ball sideways again.

[lex]

duuuuuuuhhhhh...no talent......duuuuuuhhhhh. nur, nur.

[footstepsfrom#27]

tell me why he ever deserves to work in the NFL again?
Because he's Shanny's pal.

[ludo21]

DJ overpursued and Barret fell, not exactly all on Slowick there.

But he isnt doing anything scheme wise to wow me either.

[Popps]

DJ looks pretty bad today.

Again, probably just a coincidence... but our "starting" LBs return... and the defense goes to hell.

[Garcia Bronco]

I just wish we'd put the LB's back the way they were.

[baja]

A good QB would be shredding our D today

[tsiguy96]

this is sad sad sad for sure. someone tell them the chargers won today please...

[TheChamp24]

DJ looks pretty bad today.

Again, probably just a coincidence... but our "starting" LBs return... and the defense goes to hell.

It's the LB's fault for the defense getting torched through the air?

[TheChamp24]

I will say, Slowik's scheme has always sucked. It generates ZERO pressure, and often leaves WR's WIDE OPEN, as evidenced again in today's game.

[Bronx33]

Ummmmmm ummmmmmm the suN was in his eyes ummmmm hes doesn't have the personel ummmmmmm he ran out of construction paper to build schemes the D could understand ummmmmmm bly is simply misunderstood ummmmmmm my blitz free D ( will work i TELL YA!)

[Popps]

Hey... Tyler Brayton was a free agent, right?

Good thing we didn't sign him.

[Taco John]

I've seen nothing from Slowik that made it worth losing Coyer over.

[broncolife]

Never cared for Slowiks no hands D. I never seen a team rely so much on dropped passes like we do.

[Bronx33]

Deep thoughts by Mr slowik: Well he to good to cover ( so why bother)

[Popps]

I've seen nothing from Slowik that made it worth losing Coyer over.

Agree, but let's be honest... Coyer had much better weapons to work with... as scary as that is to think. Who would have known how talented that 05 defense looked compared to the junk we throw out there these days.

Coyer's squads broke down in big games... in embarrassing fashion. That wasn't all his fault, clearly. But, we've not got about 60% as much talent as we did then, so I'm not sure how we can really evaluate anyone.

[TheReverend]

DJ looks pretty bad today.

Again, probably just a coincidence... but our "starting" LBs return... and the defense goes to hell.

Our "starting" RB's return has gone just as well...

[Popps]

Our "starting" RB's return has gone just as well...

No, see.... we won't miss a beat without Hillis. Selvin averages almost as much as him so he MUST be just as useful to the offense!!


::)

[eddie mac]

I hear everyone saying no talent.

If that's the case then which **** should be canned for wasting mutliple draft picks on these no talented defenders???

[lex]

Agree, but let's be honest... Coyer had much better weapons to work with... as scary as that is to think. Who would have known how talented that 05 defense looked compared to the junk we throw out there these days.

Coyer's squads broke down in big games... in embarrassing fashion. That wasn't all his fault, clearly. But, we've not got about 60% as much talent as we did then, so I'm not sure how we can really evaluate anyone.


Wow, I knew it was only a matter of time before a Slowik apologist would step forward.

[Taco John]

Agree, but let's be honest... Coyer had much better weapons to work with... as scary as that is to think. Who would have known how talented that 05 defense looked compared to the junk we throw out there these days.


I have a hard time buying that. Slowik would have gotten nothing out of that 05 defense. Coyer was able to get them to play at a consistent level. They got shown up in big games, just like we're seeing now. I think that's a product of the talent problem as much as anything.

[Florida_Bronco]

As much as I'd like to see Slowik go, the front 7 was playing the run pretty well today.

[tsiguy96]

they are running every single play. 3rd and 9, here comes the first down.

[Popps]

Wow, I knew it was only a matter of time before a Slowik apologist would step forward.

:spit:

I hope that's a joke, because it's pretty funny.

[gyldenlove]

Holy crap our game planning has been BAD this game.

We are not pressuring Delhomme at all, we are back to that gimmick zone defense we got analy abused with, we are playing 1 deep and we all remember what happened when we stopped doing that, we started winning.

Our players are not performing and our game plan looks like it was made up by a chimp.

If it wasn't because I so desperately want some defensive stability, I would want Slowick fired right now, out of a cannon and into the sun.

[lex]

:spit:

I hope that's a joke, because it's pretty funny.

No. Its not a joke. The first thing a Slowik apologist does is start bitching about the talent. Thats what you did.

[NASurfer]

What really kind of sucks is that we had a shot to establish ourselves as division favorites when San Diego hired Norv Turner and we had to go out and hire our own version.

I understand Shanahan wants that pressure defense but man, a whole lot of people saw this coming.

[Bronx33]

Ya know a DC that could put together an average slightly consistant D this year would have been a plus slowiks schemes offer nothing positive and can be planned around with great ease. ( not a good quality for a DC imo)

[lex]

Holy crap our game planning has been BAD this game.

We are not pressuring Delhomme at all, we are back to that gimmick zone defense we got analy abused with, we are playing 1 deep and we all remember what happened when we stopped doing that, we started winning.

Our players are not performing and our game plan looks like it was made up by a chimp.

If it wasn't because I so desperately want some defensive stability, I would want Slowick fired right now, out of a cannon and into the sun.

Why would you want a car with a broken engine just so you can have a car with an engine?

[Popps]

I have a hard time buying that. Slowik would have gotten nothing out of that 05 defense. .

Look, you're just playing fantasy-football, now. Maybe Slowik would have screwed that defense up. You could be right. But, we know Coyer's squads broke down horribly in big games. He needed more play-makers up front and never got them.

Flash forward a few years and our defense somehow managed to take major steps BACKWARD from a talent-perspective.

Is Slowik to blame for a lot of our failure? Sure, like I've already said. Probably so. I have no idea why he got the job. (See my thread I posted before he was even hired.)

That said, it'll be difficult to evaluate anyone with the horrific D-line we throw out there... and now add in a make-shift secondary.

People need to be smart enough to understand that we may have problems in BOTH areas.

[Popps]

No. Its not a joke. The first thing a Slowik apologist does is start b****ing about the talent. Thats what you did.

Wow, man... honestly, you need some real help reading there at home.
Do a little homework before you make yourself look silly next time.

[lex]

Wow, man... honestly, you need some real help reading there at home.
Do a little homework before you make yourself look silly next time.

You did what apologists do. Thats all I needed to see. No looking silly. Im not the one with the double talk.

[Bronx33]

Why would you want a car with a broken engine just so you can have a car with an engine?


He likes working on cars? :clown:

[Popps]

You did what apologists do. Thats all I needed to see. No looking silly. Im not the one with the double talk.

Seriously, dude. You generally post smarter than this.

I led the charge on this board against even hiring this guy. I've stated TODAY, ALONE multiple times that I don't think the guy is helping our cause.

But, you also have to be intelligent enough to look at the trash we have out there on the field to understand that even if we had a top-notch DC right now, we'd have problems.

This team has COACHING issues AND TALENT issues.

Now, that wasn't so hard... was it.

[extralife]

The scheme today made some sense given Carolina's strength and our desire to keep Woodyard on the field. But without Champ the secondary had no business being asked to do what it was asked to do today. We were not going to match up well with this team today. I'm glad we tried something, I guess.

[lex]

Seriously, dude. You generally post smarter than this.

I led the charge on this board against even hiring this guy. I've stated TODAY, ALONE multiple times that I don't think the guy is helping our cause.

But, you also have to be intelligent enough to look at the trash we have out there on the field to understand that even if we had a top-notch DC right now, we'd have problems.

This team has COACHING issues AND TALENT issues.

Now, that wasn't so hard... was it.
It doesnt have to be smarter than that. Just calling it what it was. I was responding to something you said. How is that my fault? Slowiks so bad, its hard to know who is really THAT bad. He has always gotten less out of his talent than what was there. The guy is inverse synergy so to start apologizing for him is a little ridiculous. And pointing posts from two years ago doesnt give you enough cache to disavow double talk.

[Bronx33]

If it were a flow chart i would say caoching was at the top because with that you can ( not all the time) but you can overcome talent issues. slowik has shown zero ability to do anything above mediocore. You just can't depend on the talent level being high all the freaking time you have to adapt and deal with what your handed. Slowiks needs to be gone and coach where you handed perfect players every year in the bazarro league which some folks seem to beleive exists.

[TonyR]

I'm no Slowik fan but just wanted to point out that our offense scored 10 points today. We would've lost even with a decent defense.

[lex]

I'm no Slowik fan but just wanted to point out that our offense scored 10 points today. We would've lost even with a decent defense.

If today was the only game where our defense struggled, its doubtful this thread would exist, dont you think?

[Bronx33]

I'm no Slowik fan but just wanted to point out that our offense scored 10 points today. We would've lost even with a decent defense.


So we can agree we don't have a decent defense.

[snowspot66]

I'm no Slowik fan but just wanted to point out that our offense scored 10 points today. We would've lost even with a decent defense.

Our defense isn't trying to operate with it's 7th string anything. In fact some of the starters were back today.

[The MVPlaya]

I'm no Slowik fan but just wanted to point out that our offense scored 10 points today. We would've lost even with a decent defense.

Our offense and defense blew it today...

Playing a 4-4 with a safety 20 yards back isn't even pro football anymore.

As for our offense, we had no running game which killed us. They had no fear in dropping back into coverage.

[TonyR]

If today was the only game where our defense struggled, its doubtful this thread would exist, dont you think?

The point is why is the defense getting all the blame? Did the offense do its job today? 10 points? 279 total yards?

[Popps]

It doesnt have to be smarter than that. Just calling it what it was. I was responding to something you said. How is that my fault? Slowiks so bad, its hard to know who is really THAT bad. He has always gotten less out of his talent than what was there. The guy is inverse synergy so to start apologizing for him is a little ridiculous. And pointing posts from two years ago doesnt give you enough cache to disavow double talk.

O.K. boss. You go have yourself a good cry over that whole fantasy if it makes your world feel better.

Meanwhile, I'll reside here in reality... where we have a coaching (as I pointed out long before you) AND a talent problem.

[lex]

The point is why is the defense getting all the blame? Did the offense do its job today? 10 points? 279 total yards?

No, the point that youre missing is that its Slowiks ineptness extends beyond one game. Go ahead and look at where our offense is ranked and then check out where our defense is ranked,...in spite of having a good offense.

[Spider]

Our offense and defense blew it today...

Playing a 4-4 with a safety 20 yards back isn't even pro football anymore.

As for our offense, we had no running game which killed us. They had no fear in dropping back into coverage.

on the bright side , our Kick off and punt return coverage played well

[baja]

O.K. boss. You go have yourself a good cry over that whole fantasy if it makes your world feel better.

Meanwhile, I'll reside here in reality... where we have a coaching (as I pointed out long before you) AND a talent problem.

But Popps it takes a little while to build a winner after you win the Super Bowl.....

Didn't you get the memo???

[snowspot66]

The only good stint Slowik had was in the 80's with the Bears wasn't it? The only thing the Bears have ever been known for is a decent defense and the 80's gave them a great one. So unless we can field the 1980's Bears defense we should tell Slowick to go **** himself.

[bpc]

This team lacks any sort of playmaker. DJ is a good player but will never be great. Champ or CB's in general you can scheme out of the equation. We need an front 7/Safety type playmaker who can create some momentum.

We're just stopping offenses out there waiting for the next big play WHICH always happens.

What the HELL was up with that long DWIlliams run? Who was the safety that royally effed that thing up. He had 20 yards on the guy and leverage and he blew contain right up the middle.

Dre Bly f***in sucks. I knew that Steve Smith was going to eat our lunch today but that guy flat out has no heart. None.

[Popps]

But Popps it takes a little while to build a winner after you win the Super Bowl.....

Didn't you get the memo???

:rofl:

Yea, I got that memo back in 2001.

[Bronx33]

We simply need a coach that can coach and deal with what he has, i can tell when a defense is coached well and lacks in talent vs a defense that is coached poorly weather it has talent on it or not. I have seen zero progression or consistancy other that giving up huge chunks of realestate and 10 yard cushions hoping to not give up the big play. I have seen a coach refuse to blitz game after game after game even in key situations when it warrants it i have witnessed a defense that seems to be out of position game after game after game ( that's not the sign of a good coach) or a coach that addresses little/huge problems i havent seen slowik tell that idiot bly to quit tackling up high, iam done with slowik hes not a good DC (end of story)

[elsid13]

Slowik calls plays like he scared. You can not play or call scared or you will lose. Barrett 20 yards from the line of scrimage is joke. If going to lose, go down swinging.

[Bronx33]

So where does slowik live ( i will get the torches and pitch forks) and yes iam serious.

[TonyR]

No, the point that youre missing is that its Slowiks ineptness extends beyond one game. Go ahead and look at where our offense is ranked and then check out where our defense is ranked,...in spite of having a good offense.

This still doesn't change the fact that our offense deserves much of the blame for today's loss. Again, 10 points and 279 yards isn't going to get it done.

[Bronx33]

This still doesn't change the fact that our offense deserves much of the blame for today's loss. Again, 10 points and 279 yards isn't going to get it done.


This thread is about slowik....... not the offense.

[TonyR]

This thread is about slowik....... not the offense.

Try to keep up. My point is that Slowik is a convenient excuse for this loss and most of our losses. Again, I'm not a Slowik fan but let me again present you two facts: 1) we lack talent on defense, and 2) the offense didn't get it done today, either.

[Bronx33]

convenient excuse? is an excuse ( try to keep up)

[orinjkrush]

we just ran into a much better team today.
the offense gave up, what 10 points?
if our O doesn't score about 30, we're just not competitive.
their D made our O look silly at times.
Our D, well, it is what it is.
Am glad they experimented with WWIII

[skpac1001]

Seems to me like the whole "fire the DC, anyone is better then him" yearly movement is how we got stuck with Slowik in the first place.

[Bronx33]

Seems to me like the whole "fire the DC, anyone is better then him" yearly movement is how we got stuck with Slowik in the first place.


So the next monkey has to be the good one. ;D

[TonyR]

So the next monkey has to be the good one. ;D

Apparently Gregg Williams will be available. Is that a monkey you'd be interested in?

[Ironlung]

If Denver fielded a defense made up of members of this website, it wouldn't be much worse.

Pathetic but true.

[BroncoMan4ever]

tell me why he ever deserves to work in the NFL again?

Defend Slowik? Why don't you ask one of us to cure Cancer while we're doing the impossible?

[BroncoMan4ever]

Seems to me like the whole "fire the DC, anyone is better then him" yearly movement is how we got stuck with Slowik in the first place.

a dog with no head, could come up with a better defensive scheme than Slowik

[Bronx33]

Apparently Gregg Williams will be available. Is that a monkey you'd be interested in?


I don't know you tell me.

[broncolife]

We simply need a coach that can coach and deal with what he has, i can tell when a defense is coached well and lacks in talent vs a defense that is coached poorly weather it has talent on it or not. I have seen zero progression or consistancy other that giving up huge chunks of realestate and 10 yard cushions hoping to not give up the big play. I have seen a coach refuse to blitz game after game after game even in key situations when it warrants it i have witnessed a defense that seems to be out of position game after game after game ( that's not the sign of a good coach) or a coach that addresses little/huge problems i havent seen slowik tell that idiot bly to quit tackling up high, iam done with slowik hes not a good DC (end of story)

I hated it when we made him our DC. Forgot what game it was but we blitzed like 2 times during it and they were both on screens. To me thats poor coaching.

[Bronx33]

And iam not looking for perfection but just basic rudimentary defensive coordination with a touch of dealing with injuries/player placement ( anything could help) moving ww2 to SS basically opened up the middle of the field today. Yes DJ was back but why in the hell would you insert a cold player vs a very good team?

[Spider]

i think Slownik is being judge to harshly here .........Slownik deserves at least 3 more years to prove himself

[mhgaffney]

What I don't understand is the zone pass defense. We needed to stop one man -- S Smith-- and we couldn't get it done.

Why not man to man on Smith?

[Bronx33]

What I don't understand is the zone pass defense. We needed to stop one man -- S Smith-- and we couldn't get it done.

Why not man to man on Smith?


Now your talking wayyyyy above slowik mental defensive capacity hes still try to figure out how to transfer files from one ps3 to another ps3.

[~Crash~]

I've seen nothing from Slowik that made it worth losing Coyer over.


Well Kiffen told Sapp he is out of TB next year he seems to be a better option ...

[TonyR]

Well Kiffen told Sapp he is out of TB next year he seems to be a better option ...

No, he's going to Tennessee to work for his son who will be the Vols head coach.

[tsiguy96]

i wonder if shanahan is somehow putting his hand on the defense every year. every year they suck, every year we have a new coordinator, and every year they continually suck. we never ever blitz or attempt to bring pressure, but we dont have good enough safeties or LBs in coverage to NOT bring pressure, it just doesnt make sense?

[baja]

i think Slownik is being judge to harshly here .........Slownik deserves at least 3 more years to prove himself

Ya and he needs to be given the first three picks for the next two years before the verdict is in on him.

[baja]

Actually I think we should be quick to sign Wade Phillips for DC when Dallas shiit cans him.

[Spider]

Ya and he needs to be given the first three picks for the next two years before the verdict is in on him.

thats the spirit

[Steve Prefontaine]

Slowik calls plays like he scared. You can not play or call scared or you will lose. Barrett 20 yards from the line of scrimage is joke. If going to lose, go down swinging.

Exactly. That's what is so frustrating. Against Atlanta and the Jets, the defensive game plan seemed to be more aggressive with a some bump and run and even a blitz or 2 thrown in for ****s and giggles.

Today...watching Barrett sit around whacking it 30 yards off the LOS...was just a embarrassing. He was basically useless. If you going to waste a player like that there is no way you are going to win the game. ****. I would have preferred that they sent Barrett blitzing up the middle every down over that bs today. I guarantee there would have been better results.

[fontaine]

Ya and he needs to be given the first three picks for the next two years before the verdict is in on him.

I hope you're joking about this. I get that we're missing a lot of starters on the defense with no decent pass rushers but even at the start of the season with a healthy squad they were near last against the pass and were getting gashed across the board against the run.

The biggest problem isn't with talent. It's that Slowik DOESN'T KNOW what to do with that talent. In other words he can't bring the best out of that talent.

A coach that's been in the team for 5 years should know his players inside out and where they best fit and execute. Instead we have Slowik playing a 3-4, 4-3 fronts in the beginning of the year with our best and most experienced LB saying that the D doesn't know what it's doing out there.

SD have the same damn problem. A head coach who simply doesnt' know how to get the best out of a talent laden team.

The only improvement we've seen is that Slowik has setup his front 7 to stop the run sacrificing the pass rush. It doesn't take a genius coach to do that.

[Bronx33]

Exactly. That's what is so frustrating. Against Atlanta and the Jets, the defensive game plan seemed to be more aggressive with a some bump and run and even a blitz or 2 thrown in for ****s and giggles.

Today...watching Barrett sit around whacking it 30 yards off the LOS...was just a embarrassing. He was basically useless. If you going to waste a player like that there is no way you are going to win the game. ****. I would have preferred that they sent Barrett blitzing up the middle every down that that bs today. I guarantee there would have been better results.


Slowik is wondering what this word means..

[BroncoMan4ever]

Slowik is wondering what this word means..

Shanahan thought of telling him to google it, but he is too stupid to use the internet, so he wouldn't be able to use google anyway

[baja]

Of course i am joking read the very next post (#76)

[fontaine]

But absolutely worst of all, we've made almost every single QB we've faced this season put up flawless games. From J Russell, to Thigpen, rookies, backups, you name it. All of them have near perfect QB ratings when playing against Denver and that was with Champ healthy and a full squad of safeties.

Slowik was DB coach for how long? This guy hasn't just sucked as a Defensive Coordinator, he's sucked at the very basic position coaching job he was brought in for years ago.

[Popps]

Of course i am joking read the very next post (#76)

Be careful with the sarcasm around here tonight, bro. It's a little slow this evening, if you know what I mean.

[baja]

Ask the Green Bay fans what they think of him.

[broncolife]

But absolutely worst of all, we've made almost every single QB we've faced this season put up flawless games. From J Russell, to Thigpen, rookies, backups, you name it. All of them have near perfect QB ratings when playing against Denver and that was with Champ healthy and a full squad of safeties.

Slowik was DB coach for how long? This guy hasn't just sucked as a Defensive Coordinator, he's sucked at the very basic position coaching job he was brought in for years ago.

Except the Greaseball:) He almost cost us the game when he left

[Br0nc0Buster]

But absolutely worst of all, we've made almost every single QB we've faced this season put up flawless games. From J Russell, to Thigpen, rookies, backups, you name it. All of them have near perfect QB ratings when playing against Denver and that was with Champ healthy and a full squad of safeties.

Slowik was DB coach for how long? This guy hasn't just sucked as a Defensive Coordinator, he's sucked at the very basic position coaching job he was brought in for years ago.

Hey man, Jemarcus was the 1st pick in the draft, and according to Al Davis, he is a "great player".......

[fontaine]

I know I'm going on about this, but it bears repeating. Slowik has been with this team for what 5 years now?

If you're with a team for that long and you've seen what's been going wrong with a defense and what other coaches like Coyer/Bates etc have tried, and knowing all the key players for that long then is this the best you can do?

And again, I get that our defense is full of injuries but I'm talking about when they were healthy for the first half of the season.

Sh*t, I'm not pissed off about the loss. Carolina was unbeaten at home with a solid rushing game so getting a win there was always going to be tough.

But I'll tell you I AM PISSED OFF ABOUT. Wasting any more years with a D Coach that can't get it done when you consider our offense is playoff ready RIGHT NOW.

[baja]

Be careful with the sarcasm around here tonight, bro. It's a little slow this evening, if you know what I mean.

Fontaine is cool but some of these new kids are a pain.

[fontaine]

Fontaine is cool but some of these new kids are a pain.

What? You didn't like all the "Trade DJ", "Cutler is a bust", "Fire Shanahan" threads??

:rofl:

Pure comedic gold!!

[BroncoMan4ever]

I know I'm going on about this, but it bears repeating. Slowik has been with this team for what 5 years now?

If you're with a team for that long and you've seen what's been going wrong with a defense and what other coaches like Coyer/Bates etc have tried, and knowing all the key players for that long then is this the best you can do?

And again, I get that our defense is full of injuries but I'm talking about when they were healthy for the first half of the season.

Sh*t, I'm not pissed off about the loss. Carolina was unbeaten at home with a solid rushing game so getting a win there was always going to be tough.

But I'll tell you I AM PISSED OFF ABOUT. Wasting any more years with a D Coach that can't get it done when you consider our offense is playoff ready RIGHT NOW.

another thing that is really annoying is that he was a DB's coach for those years, yet he has our Corners 10 yards off the receiver, and he had Barrett lined up in the stands 10 rows up.

i could understand him not being able to be great with the front 7 as the new DC, but the secondary should look better considering he coached that unit exclusively in recent years.

as a DB's coach he should see and know that lining up our Corners 10 yards off the receiver on 3rd and 7 or less is going to end badly. i would much rather see the DB's play bump and run all game and get beat big occasionally, rather than see the opposition running 15 play drives on us all day. blitz and play bump and run in the secondary and this defense could cause turnovers, or come up with a good play once in awhile, they will also get beat, but they are getting beat now without getting anything good occasionally, plus if they get beat for a quick score it gets the offense back on the field

[elsid13]

another thing that is really annoying is that he was a DB's coach for those years, yet he has our Corners 10 yards off the receiver, and he had Barrett lined up in the stands 10 rows up.

i could understand him not being able to be great with the front 7 as the new DC, but the secondary should look better considering he coached that unit exclusively in recent years.

as a DB's coach he should see and know that lining up our Corners 10 yards off the receiver on 3rd and 7 or less is going to end badly. i would much rather see the DB's play bump and run all game and get beat big occasionally, rather than see the opposition running 15 play drives on us all day. blitz and play bump and run in the secondary and this defense could cause turnovers, or come up with a good play once in awhile, they will also get beat, but they are getting beat now without getting anything good occasionally, plus if they get beat for a quick score it gets the offense back on the field

Slowick is so so afraid of the big play and quick score, he plays the soft coverage. What I don't understand, is that we have an offense that can score with anyone, why worry about giving up a big play once and awhile? It not we have Jake Plummer and no passing game on the other side of the ball.

I heard a great line from TV announcer when they were talking about the 49ers, and thier problem. The guy said you need to have defense and offense that complement each other. If you have high power attacking offense you need to have highly aggressive defense that attempting to get ball back and cause turnovers.

[lex]

This still doesn't change the fact that our offense deserves much of the blame for today's loss. Again, 10 points and 279 yards isn't going to get it done.

Once again, this isnt about one game.

[rastaman]

What do you guys think about the Broncos canning Slowick and perhaps going after the top rated Defensive Coordinators in in Division I? Like say with the from USC, Univ. Fla, top 5 rated Defensive Coord. who coaches a pro style Defense. Am I way off base here?

Comments please.

[lex]

What do you guys think about the Broncos canning Slowick and perhaps going after the top rated Defensive Coordinators in in Division I? Like say with the from USC, Univ. Fla, top 5 rated Defensive Coord. who coaches a pro style Defense. Am I way off base here?

Comments please.

Yeah, I wouldnt mind Denver going after UFs Dline coach or even Strong. Another team's DC that I wouldnt mind is Oregon States. The seem to get a lot out of marginal talent on defense.

[Spider]

Be careful with the sarcasm around here tonight, bro. It's a little slow this evening, if you know what I mean.

LOL ....... no **** .....

[fdf]

"someone defend slowik now"

OK. I'll try. His defense just gave up 30 points to a really good team. Many of the people playing defense for him are not bona fide NFL starters.

The only way we were going to win this game, given our defensive personnel, is if Cutler lit their D up big time. That was unlikely as we had no credible running attack and no way to keep Carolina from flooding the backfield with defenders and daring us to run.

We were outgunned on D and O in almost every respect--and it's a personnel problem. The offense couldn't keep the D off the field and the D is lousy. The outcome of this game was more or less a done deal.

How's that?

[lex]

"someone defend slowik now"

OK. I'll try. His defense just gave up 30 points to a really good team. Many of the people playing defense for him are not bona fide NFL starters.

The only way we were going to win this game, given our defensive personnel, is if Cutler lit their D up big time. That was unlikely as we had no credible running attack and no way to keep Carolina from flooding the backfield with defenders and daring us to run.

We were outgunned on D and O in almost every respect--and it's a personnel problem. The offense couldn't keep the D off the field and the D is lousy. The outcome of this game was more or less a done deal.

How's that?

Poor. Its not about one game. I think most of the people calling for his head would agree that Carolina was one of the toughest teams we've played. But what happened today, has been happening. What happened today was not isolated to today. You only need to look at their ratings to see that.

[Spider]

"someone defend slowik now"

OK. I'll try. His defense just gave up 30 points to a really good team. Many of the people playing defense for him are not bona fide NFL starters.

The only way we were going to win this game, given our defensive personnel, is if Cutler lit their D up big time. That was unlikely as we had no credible running attack and no way to keep Carolina from flooding the backfield with defenders and daring us to run.

We were outgunned on D and O in almost every respect--and it's a personnel problem. The offense couldn't keep the D off the field and the D is lousy. The outcome of this game was more or less a done deal.

How's that?
Not half bad ;D

[enjolras]

It ***IS*** about talent. This is, by far, the least talented Broncos defense since I've been alive (nearly 30 years). We have a completely ineffective front four. A huge problem at middle linebacker. 1 legitimate star at corner. To top it off, we have the absolute worst set of safeties I have ever watched.

Really, how many of these players would start on another team? Outside of DJ Williams and Champ, I don't see much. Maybe Marcus Thomas? Webster wouldn't even be on most NFL rosters.

This idea that we somehow have decent talent and a terrible scheme is laughable. I, just like everyone else, hate what I'm seeing... but firing yet another coordinator isn't the answer. We have to give Slowik the CHANCE to succeed and that means restocking the cupboard. We've turned the offense around in a very short period of time... now it's time to do the same for the defense.

[Taco John]

This is, by far, the least talented Broncos defense since I've been alive (nearly 30 years).


No way. That distinction belongs to either the 88 or 94 teams.

[Beantown Bronco]

tell me why he ever deserves to work in the NFL again?

With a patchwork defense filled with at least 5 or 6 guys that wouldn't start on any other team, this unit held Carolina to far fewer yards and points than Tampa Bay (a top 5 unit coached by a top 3 DC) did just a week ago.

[barryr]

Slowik just isn't much of a DC, but for the Broncos, that's nothing new. Try getting Greg Williams, who is the DC now with the Jags, but may be available after the season. At least he's a proven guy. But since they have had so many lately, I doubt Slowik is let go.

[rastaman]

Sure Slowick will be here next season........Shanny here's the rumors how impatient he's been with his DC's in the past. He's in a catch-22 position.

[Traveler]

Sure Slowick will be here next season........Shanny here's the rumors how impatient he's been with his DC's in the past. He's in a catch-22 position.

Maybe Slowik does the right thing and steps down as DC. One can only hope.

[Beantown Bronco]

You guys really need to cure yourselves of this belief that some big name DC can just come in to an organization and make them great from day one.....or even day two. Without talent, coaching doesn't matter.

The freakin Pats brought in a "proven" top defensive coach in Dom Capers. What happened? Their defense is now by and large a joke. It is clearly the weak point of their team, and we can all agree that their defense has a lot more talent than ours does right now.

And our very own Broncos. They brought in what was considered by most insiders as one of the best special teams coaches in the business. What happened? The unit consistently graded out as one of the worst until this season, when they really made an emphasis on acquiring guys that excelled at special teams. They're still not a top unit, but they are better than they have been.

Again, coaches are nothing without talent.

Do better at evaluating defensive talent in the draft and FA and it almost doesn't make a difference who the DC is (within reason of course).

[Garcia Bronco]

DC has become the "Defense Against the Dark Arts" posiiton at Hogwarts. Either way I think we should stand pat in on this. He tried a gimmick defense today just to get Williams back on the field and we got own. The season is a journey and hopefully we get another win next weekend against the Bills. A team that plays us tough everytime.

[Kaylore]

You guys really need to cure yourselves of this belief that some big name DC can just come in to an organization and make them great from day one.....or even day two. Without talent, coaching doesn't matter.

The freakin Pats brought in a "proven" top defensive coach in Dom Capers. What happened? Their defense is now by and large a joke. It is clearly the weak point of their team, and we can all agree that their defense has a lot more talent than ours does right now.

And our very own Broncos. They brought in what was considered by most insiders as one of the best special teams coaches in the business. What happened? The unit consistently graded out as one of the worst until this season, when they really made an emphasis on acquiring guys that excelled at special teams. They're still not a top unit, but they are better than they have been.

Again, coaches are nothing without talent.

Do better at evaluating defensive talent in the draft and FA and it almost doesn't make a difference who the DC is (within reason of course).

That would be a good point except that Slowik has proven record as a bad defensive coordinator. Again, let's revisit these stats from his last stint as a defensive coordinator...

Fewest Opponent Turnovers, Season 15 16 (1995)
Fewest Passes Intercepted By, Season 8 13 (1980, 1995, 1998)
Fewest Forced Fumbles, Season 11 12 (1995)
Most First Downs Allowed, Passing, Season 228 188 (1995)
Most Yards Allowed, Net Passing, Season 3,943 3,762 (1983)
Most Yards Allowed, Passing, Game 464 448 (2004)
Most TD Allowed Passing, Season 33 31 (1986)
Highest Opponents' Passer Rating, Season 99.1 86.1 (1958)

Hmmm. Does any of this sound familiar? We have a horrible defense that has become a boon to the other team's quarterbacks. It basically allows them to gain confidence because it helps them convert big third downs through the air and keep their QB rating high. It's a defense that feeds the confidence of the other team's offense. The more they play us, the more they believe they're better than they are. We never get interceptions, we never deflect passes. I mean even when a guy's covered he never deflects the ball.

Now I realize we need that power rush end, which Shanahan has been looking for since he found Trevor Pryce, and we're still searching. We also need help at safety and linebacker.

However there is enough talent on this team (seriously) that we should not be this crappy. It's been so bad this year that its become funny to me. It's like watching the keystone cops.

And that dovetails our other problem and that's that I don't trust anyone on the Broncos staff to evaluate defensive talent.

[TheReverend]

DC has become the "Defense Against the Dark Arts" posiiton at Hogwarts. Either way I think we should stand pat in on this. He tried a gimmick defense today just to get Williams back on the field and we got own. The season is a journey and hopefully we get another win next weekend against the Bills. A team that plays us tough everytime.

wtf does that mean?

[Beantown Bronco]

wtf does that mean?

Harry Potter reference. Different teacher of that class in every movie.

[socalorado]

wtf does that mean?

Yeah, I know its monday and all, but WTF does that mean?!?!

[Beantown Bronco]

That would be a good point except that Slowik has proven record as a bad defensive coordinator. Again, let's revisit these stats from his last stint as a defensive coordinator...


I thought we already discredited this argument. There were a ton of circumstances outside his control that went into those rankings.

I'm sure Jim Bates would love to have his entire career judged by his one year in Denver.

[Kaylore]

I thought we already discredited this argument. There were a ton of circumstances outside his control that went into those rankings.

I'm sure Jim Bates would love to have his entire career judged by his one year in Denver.

I must have missed that. If you go back to Slowik's years with the Bears the numbers are similar. I'd love to read how his entire defensive coordinating career has been him being a victim of circumstance, though.

[Beantown Bronco]

I must have missed that. If you go back to Slowik's years with the Bears the numbers are similar. I'd love to read how his entire defensive coordinating career has been him being a victim of circumstance, though.

from his team bio:

Slowik led an aggressive Bears defense that finished in the top half of the NFL in total defense in five of his six seasons. Despite not having a single Pro Bowl player from 1994-98, his defense allowed an average of 312.8 yards per game to rank eighth in the NFL during his time with the club.

How is that "failure"?

[Mountain Bronco]

DJ looks pretty bad today.

Again, probably just a coincidence... but our "starting" LBs return... and the defense goes to hell.

It is absolutely not a coincidence. DJ look horid today and Nate Webster is downright terrible. That was so obvious today.

[Garcia Bronco]

wtf does that mean?

In the Harry Potter world, the villian wants this job, and since the head master won't give him the job he out a curse on it. No one holds the job for more than a year.

[TheReverend]

Harry Potter reference. Different teacher of that class in every movie.

Thanks. By answering my question you made me lose respect for you and Garcia!

[Beantown Bronco]

Thanks. By answering my question you made me lose respect for you and Garcia!

You'd be the first person to have respect for me to lose....

You can thank Little Bean and Littler Bean for the answer.

[Garcia Bronco]

Thanks. By answering my question you made me lose respect for you and Garcia!

LOL.

[Kaylore]

Thanks. By answering my question you made me lose respect for you and Garcia!

Harry Potter is awesome.

[TheReverend]

To each their own. I like playing RPGs, so I'm not really one to talk.

[Kaylore]

from his team bio:

Slowik led an aggressive Bears defense that finished in the top half of the NFL in total defense in five of his six seasons. Despite not having a single Pro Bowl player from 1994-98, his defense allowed an average of 312.8 yards per game to rank eighth in the NFL during his time with the club.

How is that "failure"?

"Top half" is average. It also failed to mention it was at the bottom of the league in scoring defense.

[Br0nc0Buster]

from his team bio:

Slowik led an aggressive Bears defense that finished in the top half of the NFL in total defense in five of his six seasons. Despite not having a single Pro Bowl player from 1994-98, his defense allowed an average of 312.8 yards per game to rank eighth in the NFL during his time with the club.

How is that "failure"?

Well maybe Slowick had a head injury since then, because our defense is hardly "aggressive" like that supposed Bears defense he coached

[uplink]

Defending Slowick. Maybe the 10 yard + cushions by the CBs is a measure taken due to the very poor pass rush?

Instead of letting QBs sit in the pocket all day waiting for WRs to open up on long routes, just give them the short stuff and hope they make a mistake before driving all the way down the field.

[tsiguy96]

Defending Slowick. Maybe the 10 yard + cushions by the CBs is a measure taken due to the very poor pass rush?

Instead of letting QBs sit in the pocket all day waiting for WRs to open up on long routes, just give them the short stuff and hope they make a mistake before driving all the way down the field.

poor pass rush is NOT fixed by playing corners 10 yards off and a safety 30 yards off, as we have seen ALL YEAR. its fixed by bringing extra pressure.

[BroncoMan4ever]

Slowick is so so afraid of the big play and quick score, he plays the soft coverage. What I don't understand, is that we have an offense that can score with anyone, why worry about giving up a big play once and awhile? It not we have Jake Plummer and no passing game on the other side of the ball.

I heard a great line from TV announcer when they were talking about the 49ers, and thier problem. The guy said you need to have defense and offense that complement each other. If you have high power attacking offense you need to have highly aggressive defense that attempting to get ball back and cause turnovers.

i could understand that if we weren't giving up big plays and only giving up long drives. i mean with the soft coverages he runs our defense either gives up a 15 play drive, or a 1 play drive, both of which usually end in the end zone.
i am sure that any fan would prefer to see an aggresive scheme that caused turnovers and made plays while also occasionally getting burned than the crap we see now. on the plus side of a quick strike and our defense getting burned quick, we get the offense back on the field.

Coyer's defense of a few years ago with our offense now, would be perfect.

[BroncoMan4ever]

It ***IS*** about talent. This is, by far, the least talented Broncos defense since I've been alive (nearly 30 years). We have a completely ineffective front four. A huge problem at middle linebacker. 1 legitimate star at corner. To top it off, we have the absolute worst set of safeties I have ever watched.

Really, how many of these players would start on another team? Outside of DJ Williams and Champ, I don't see much. Maybe Marcus Thomas? Webster wouldn't even be on most NFL rosters.

This idea that we somehow have decent talent and a terrible scheme is laughable. I, just like everyone else, hate what I'm seeing... but firing yet another coordinator isn't the answer. We have to give Slowik the CHANCE to succeed and that means restocking the cupboard. We've turned the offense around in a very short period of time... now it's time to do the same for the defense.

i am sorry, but the players and talent level are NOWHERE near as bad as our stats say they are. we don't have a defense of pro bowlers, but we have the talent to compete if we had a good scheme.

i mean come on what the hell kind of scheme has your Corners 10 yards off the receiver on a 3rd and 5 and also has your FS lined up in the stands behind the end zone 15 rows up. i understand not wanting to give up the big play, but by lining up Barrett that far off the ball, we were basically playing defense with 10 players.

[BroncoMan4ever]

"Top half" is average. It also failed to mention it was at the bottom of the league in scoring defense.

exactly. i mean as any Broncos fan knows over the past few seasons, yards gained or allowed doesn't necessarily dictate points, because if yards meant anything we would have had the most prolific offense of the past decade, but we don't even though we are near the top of the league in yards gained this past decade.

[mhgaffney]

I saw one play where our D backs were standing around flat footed in the zone coverage. Smith simply ran into an open area between them and made a big catch.

he did this over and over.

Here's my question: why wasn't one of our CBs designated to shadow Smith -- and cover him up close -- like a fly on sh*t?

I mean DUH -- is this rocket science??

[Florida_Bronco]

I mean DUH -- is this rocket science??

Depends. Does the rocket contain mini nukes? ???

[24champ]

Depends. Does the rocket contain mini nukes? ???

According to Gaff the jews are why our Defense sucks.:rofl:

[Los Broncos]

It seems like were better off just blitzing on almost every down.

[uplink]

Defending Slowicks CB/S cushions: He plays in a fantasy league and picks up the OB and receivers opposing the broncos every week?

[ton80]

I hear everyone saying no talent.

If that's the case then which **** should be canned for wasting mutliple draft picks on these no talented defenders???

With this team and this D-line, you just bury your head (in shame for a lack of production from the D-line) and continue drafting d-lineman in the early rounds year after year until you finally start wreaking havoc like Dallas did on Sunday night against the Giants.

Shanny nowhere never ****in deserves to go any ****ing where. Our offense is young, talented, and only missing a running back until the entire league is ****ed, and it's Shanny that put it together.

Patience. Next year is ours and you will want Shanny running things.

[Atlas]

tell me why he ever deserves to work in the NFL again?

It's all about talent. Denver has none. Slowick had to load up for the rush and had to leave the best WR in the NFL in one on one coverage with Bly. It wasn't pretty but I don't think it is necessarily Slowiks fault.

Denver needs to Draft a couple of DTs and a couple of DEs. Let's load up on those positions. There is no way that Ecuban should be Denver's best DE but yet he is.

Denver needs to get pressure on the QB with a 4 man rush but can never do it. How is that Slowik's fault?

[cutthemdown]

I saw one play where our D backs were standing around flat footed in the zone coverage. Smith simply ran into an open area between them and made a big catch.

he did this over and over.

Here's my question: why wasn't one of our CBs designated to shadow Smith -- and cover him up close -- like a fly on sh*t?

I mean DUH -- is this rocket science??

actually they tried to have Bly shadow him for awhile but that wasn't working either.

[BroncoMan4ever]

It's all about talent. Denver has none. Slowick had to load up for the rush and had to leave the best WR in the NFL in one on one coverage with Bly. It wasn't pretty but I don't think it is necessarily Slowiks fault.

Denver needs to Draft a couple of DTs and a couple of DEs. Let's load up on those positions. There is no way that Ecuban should be Denver's best DE but yet he is.

Denver needs to get pressure on the QB with a 4 man rush but can never do it. How is that Slowik's fault?

i get that we don't have the greatest talent along the front 4, but our starting tackles are actually decent, it is the ends that aren't getting the job done. i love Doom but he needs to be a situational pass rusher.

look at the Carolina game, Clady kept Peppers off of Jay, but there was so much worry about him, thagt the other 3 guys on the DL were not as well covered because we took away their best pass rusher. we need a guy who every week commands that notice, and a younger version of Ekuban to start opposite of that guy and bring in Doom on passing downs.

However, people are talking about the secondary play in Carolina like that was an isolated incident and only happened that game, when it has been happening all year.
And with Bly covering Smith, it didn't matter because Slowik's scheme has them lined up so far off the receivers that Smith was able to sit down and wait for the ball without a DB within 5 yards of him.
with a guy like smith, we needed Bly or Bell or whoever was on him on that play, to play him physical, and bump him on the line, make him work to get into his route, and have Safety help over the top. But Slowik decided to keep the 10 yard cushions and have Barrett lined up 30 yards away from the play watching the game.

There is a difference between not wanting a big play to happen and being a gutless no-talent turd.

i mean there were a few plays where Barrett was so far from the action, that we were literally playing defense with 10 players. also, Smith all game was able to move wherever he wanted without a constant shadow on him.

Slowik needs to go, and i don't want to hear any crap about he needs to draft players for his scheme, because i don't care if he drafts the greatest DE, MLB, Safeties, DT, and SAM that the world has ever seen, with his idiocy, they will still suck.

[broncocalijohn]

Harry Potter reference. Different teacher of that class in every movie.

NEEEEEERD!

[TonyR]

i am sorry, but the players and talent level are NOWHERE near as bad as our stats say they are. we don't have a defense of pro bowlers, but we have the talent to compete if we had a good scheme.


You might be right but I don't think there's any evidence to support this.

Everybody thinks you just fix the problem by "bringing pressure" and "blitzing" as if it's that easy. You have to have the players who can do it and you have to have players good enough to make plays when the blitz isn't successful. When you bring pressure you expose the defense. It's a high risk/high reward strategy. You have to have the talent to execute it. We don't.

[Traveler]

7 games in which opponents have scored 30 or more points this season with two games to go.

That should enough to move Slowik back to DB coach or relieve of Dc responsibilties after the season.

[TonyR]

7 games in which opponents have scored 30 or more points this season with two games to go.

That should enough to move Slowik back to DB coach or relieve of Dc responsibilties after the season.

I don't disagree. But to play devil's advocate the offense has failed to score 20 or more in 7 games this season. Do we also relieve Bates and/or Shanahan of their responsibilities?

[BroncoMan4ever]

7 games in which opponents have scored 30 or more points this season with two games to go.

That should enough to move Slowik back to DB coach or relieve of Dc responsibilties after the season.

Do we really want him to be associated with the Defense in any capacity anymore?
I can't help but think, that being as he was a DB Coach he would see where his biggest defensive flaw this season is. As a former DB Coach he should be able to put the secondary in a position to not suck.

[PRBronco]

I don't disagree. But to play devil's advocate the offense has failed to score 20 or more in 7 games this season. Do we also relieve Bates and/or Shanahan of their responsibilities?

Naw, you can't really compare them like that. You look at the defense when it's failing, and you can see no one knows what the **** they're doing, anywhere. When the offense is failing you can look and see: maybe jay is forcing his throws that day, maybe he's trying to hard to get it to marshall that day, maybe they're dropping so many into coverage he can't find anyone open that day. It's never a chicken with its head cut off, it's an identifiable problem.

[Beantown Bronco]

As a former DB Coach he should be able to put the secondary in a position to not suck.

And he's done that......it's the position these guys put themselves in 10 seconds after the snap, when the QB finally decides to throw the ball, that's the problem.

[lex]

You might be right but I don't think there's any evidence to support this.

Everybody thinks you just fix the problem by "bringing pressure" and "blitzing" as if it's that easy. You have to have the players who can do it and you have to have players good enough to make plays when the blitz isn't successful. When you bring pressure you expose the defense. It's a high risk/high reward strategy. You have to have the talent to execute it. We don't.

Blitzing is an X and O move...its tactical. It requires understanding how OL's blocking schemes will react to different looks. It also requires mixing things up so the QB doesnt have automated responses...he should have to think and be forced into decisions. Take Cole of Philly and Harrison of Pittsburgh as examples. Those were some obscure names and its no coincidence that both of them play for DCs that are among the best at scheming pressure. If you were to put Cole on Denver, he would likely be a non-entity because Slowik sucks at scheming pressure and doesnt know the pressure points that are dictated by different looks.

[Mediator12]

I don't disagree. But to play devil's advocate the offense has failed to score 20 or more in 7 games this season. Do we also relieve Bates and/or Shanahan of their responsibilities?

Well to be accurate there are 5 levels you are really talking about here. An NFL defense should hold a team below 20 points a game and an NFL offense should be able to score 20 points a game every game. Those are the standards you look at to see game by game success. So from there you can graph the results to see how well each has performed that task.

Offensive levels should be five categories: Above ten points scored (Major success), above five points scored (Above average success), within five points scored (Success), below five points scored (Below average failure), and below 10 points scored (Major Failure).

Same thing with defense but in reverse: Surrender 10 points less (Major success), surrender 5 points less (Above average success), within 5 points scored (Success), surrender 5 points more (Below average failure), surrender 10 points more (Major Failure).

After that, you can adjust each individual peformance against how each team has performed to the average this year to see how effective each unit performed against the competition. Therefore, the offense scoring 16 points against TB would be a below average failure for them. However, TB only gives up 18 points a game so its not really a performance issue as the level of competition they played. Its both, not an either/or kind of thing. This way you grade the team versus what they should be able to do and then versus the level of Competition. We get 4 grades, but not the why.

When you do this this is what you get:

DEN 41 @ OAK 14: Offense gets a Major Success and performance. Defense gets an above average success and a success performance.

SD 38 @ Den 39: Offense gets a major success and performance. Defense gets a major failure and Performance. Also, this is the Infamous Blown Call game :D

NO 32 @ DEN 34: Offense gets a Major Success and Above average performance. Defense gets a major Failure and a success performance.

DEN 19 @ KC 33: Offense gets a sucess and below average performance. Defense gets a Major Failure and Major failure performance.

TB 13 @ DEN 16: Offense Gets a success and success performance. Defense gets an above average success and a major success performance.

JAX 24 @ DEN 17: Offense gets a success and a below average performance. Defense gets a success and a below average performance.

DEN 7 @ NE 41: Offense gets a major Failure and Major Failure Performance. Defense Gets a Major Failure and a Major Failure performance.

MIA 26 @ DEN 17: Offense gets a success and a success performance. Defense gets a below average failure and a below average performance.

DEN 34 @ CLE 30: Offense gets a Major Success and Major Sucess performance. Defense gets a Major Failure and a Major Failure performance.

DEN 24 @ ATL 20: Offense gets a success and Success performance. Defense Gets a Success and a Success performance.

OAK 31 @ DEN 10: Offense gets a Major Failure and Major Failure performance. Defense gets a Major Failure and Major Failure performance.

DEN 34 @ NYJ 17: Offense Gets a Major Success and Major Success performance. Defense Gets a Success and a Major Success performance.

KC 17 @ DEN 24: Offense gets a success and a success performance. Defense gets a Success and a Success performance.

DEN 10 @ CAR 30: Offense gets a Major Failure and Below Average performance. Defense Gets a Major Failure and a Below Average performance.

MAJOR DISCLAIMER: Those are the individual output performances game by game for each unit. This is NOT SCIENTIFICALLY accurrate or reliable, just a measure of how each unit performed against the average and the opponent each game in order to evaluate what team did their jobs and which unit did not in this particular scenario. It has a ton of flaws and is not even close to determing the causality of the performance, just the output itself.



This looks like this for the offense:

Performance to the average: 11 Succesful to 3 Failure results
Maj Success: 5
AA Success: 0
Success : 6
B AV Failure : 0
Maj Failure :3

Performance to the Opponent: 9 Succesful to 5 Failure results
Maj Success: 4
AA Success: 1
Success : 4
B AV Failure : 3
Maj Failure : 2

For the Defense:

Performance to the Average: 6 Successful to 8 Failure results
Maj Success: 0
AA Success: 2
Success : 4
B AV Failure : 1
Maj Failure : 7

Performance to the Opponent: 6 Successful to 8 Failure Results
Maj Success: 2
AA Success: 0
Success : 4
B AV Failure : 3
Maj Failure : 5

I think that would more than answer your counter question.

[Beantown Bronco]

Of course folks need to take into account that those metrics penalize the defense for special teams scores given up and offensive turnovers resulting in points. The defense never even took the field for those, so at least one or two of those games may look like "failures", but in fact may not be.

[Atlas]

Slowik needs to go, and i don't want to hear any crap about he needs to draft players for his scheme, because i don't care if he drafts the greatest DE, MLB, Safeties, DT, and SAM that the world has ever seen, with his idiocy, they will still suck.

Just like Robinson needed to go, Rhodes needed to go, Bates needed to go, at some point it comes down to talent. You can't just keep firing D-coordinators every year.

Get good players in there and if the D still struggles than you know it's the coiaches as of now we don't know if Slowick is a good coach or not. THE TALENT IS NOT THERE!

You said the talent level and DT is pretty good? Maybe in name only. I would expect a good DT to get 3 or 4 sacks. The DEs are bad the LBers are very suspect the Safeties are horrible.

NONE OF THIS IS SLOWICKS FAULT!!

[baja]

Of course folks need to take into account that those metrics penalize the defense for special teams scores given up and offensive turnovers resulting in points. The defense never even took the field for those, so at least one or two of those games may look like "failures", but in fact may not be.

OK lets put it another way then, the defense sucks and the offense is good sometimes. How's that?

[Beantown Bronco]

OK lets put it another way then, the defense sucks and the offense is good sometimes. How's that?

The defense has had good games too. It hasn't sucked from week one through week 15 like some would try to claim.

[Mediator12]

Of course folks need to take into account that those metrics penalize the defense for special teams scores given up and offensive turnovers resulting in points. The defense never even took the field for those, so at least one or two of those games may look like "failures", but in fact may not be.

Yes, they would. Therefore, the big disclaimer.

However, ST's and Def can score points, while the Offense can only prevent points off the board by not comitting costly TO's. The ball swings both ways :D In this case, DEN has not helped its cause either way with a minus 14 TO differential. The Offense has hurt the defense, and the defense has rarely helped the offense except on 2 huge Fumble recovery TD's. There are 4 non-defensive TD's surrendered By DEN and 2 TD's scored by the defense. Let's look at those 6 TD's that skew the points scored argument:

1. The ST's TD against SD, a Major Failure game, that would still be one without the KR to Sproles as they would have still surrendered 31 points in that game.

2. The NO game was a defensive TO TD fumble recovery by Webster. Did not affect the success of the DEN offense though as they still scored 24 points without that. The safety was in this game though, so it would make the defense more competitive against the opponent.

3. The one game truly affected by a non-defensive TD surrendered was MIA. The early Pick 6 By Cutler really put them in a bind and Defensively takes them to a success.

4. The PR TD against OAK would bring them back to a Success on defense by a point, but would still be a major failure against the opponent with 24 points surrendered.

5. The second INT TD was against KC which was a success for the defense anyway as well. No real outcome changes there.

6. The fumble recovery TD @ NYJ was a huge momentum swinger but it would not change the success of the offense in that game either as they scored 27 on the Jets.

So, while theoretically it could change the success ratios in several games, it only changes one against MIA for the defense to a success.

[baja]

"It's the defense - no it's the offense"

Is it my imagination or is this a circular argument that we have every year to explain why we are not a very good team?

[Mediator12]

"It's the defense - no it's the offense"

Is it my imagination or is this a circular argument that we have every year to explain why we are not a very good team?

It certainly has been. That is why I tried to establish some criteria as to how each played every game and look at how that affects the record and performance of the team as a whole.

[TonyR]

Interesting analysis, Mediator.

Certainly our offense is better, and more talented, than our defense. But our offense is still far too inconsistent both within and between games. Our running game is probably a large factor here but our QB also deserves part of the blame.

Our defense fails the most when our offense struggles. As this team is currently constituted the offense has to be more consistent and generally more productive for this team to be win. And this will probably be the case again next year as I don't see this defense being completely rehabbed in one offseason. Too many holes. And Slowik is less of a problem than talent in my opinion.

[BroncoMan4ever]

Just like Robinson needed to go, Rhodes needed to go, Bates needed to go, at some point it comes down to talent. You can't just keep firing D-coordinators every year.

Get good players in there and if the D still struggles than you know it's the coiaches as of now we don't know if Slowick is a good coach or not. THE TALENT IS NOT THERE!

You said the talent level and DT is pretty good? Maybe in name only. I would expect a good DT to get 3 or 4 sacks. The DEs are bad the LBers are very suspect the Safeties are horrible.

NONE OF THIS IS SLOWICKS FAULT!!

Slowik's ****ty scheme with our decent starting DT has them taking up space and not penetrating. Both Robertson and Thomas could penetrate consistantly if the scheme called for it, but Slowik has them taking up space in the middle of the line hoping Doom or Moss, or any other of our ****ty DE's can get to the QB.

ALL OF THIS IS SLOWIK'S FAULT!!!!

[TonyR]

Both Robertson and Thomas could penetrate consistantly if the scheme called for it, but Slowik has them taking up space in the middle of the line hoping Doom or Moss, or any other of our ****ty DE's can get to the QB.

ALL OF THIS IS SLOWIK'S FAULT!!!!

This is not an endorsement for Slowik, as I'd no problem with him being replaced, but is it all Slowik's fault that our DE's suck? Which is it, our DT's not effectively "taking up space" or our DE's not effectively pressuring the QB? Or both? I'm thinking better talent on the D-line would probably amount to this strategy being more effective. But that's just me.