IF...Boyd Proves to be the REAL DEAL...what happens with Hillis?

[footstepsfrom#27]

OK...I realize this is VERY premature. So what? Nobody thought Hillis would turn into Riggins either.

Given the history of our anonomous RB's success and the hype surrounding Cory Boyd...plus those amazing highlight reels...let's pose a question for "just in case".

What IF...Boyd is the Truth?

Let's say this kid comes up big on Sunday with 95 yards on 20 carries and scores twice. He follows up the following week with 133 on the ground from 29 carries and 5 pass receptons against the Bills and in week 17 he polaxes the Chuggers D for 165 on 26 carries and scores another TD. The following week in the playoffs he gouges the Colts for 158 more on 25 carries and two more TDs, for a 4 week total of 551 yards on 100 carries and 5 TD's and he's healthy and still running strong...he's a freaking stud.

Here's my question...

Next year would we move Hillis back to FB or play him in tandem with the RBBC at tailback? TWO stud backs who can both carry the ball and who see the field at the same time?...like we face this week BTW...that would be mighty tempting AND it would let us move Larsen back to MLB where I think he's Woodyard waiting to happen. On the other hand it would sure demoralize opposing defenses to see them interchanging as well.

What do you think...? Fullback or tailback for the country boy if Cooked Crack comes up big in the next 4 weeks?

Discuss...

[ludo21]

Hillis' injury lost him the RB spot regardless of how well Boyd does imo...

we will see tho..

[Bronx33]

Hillis has earned his shot at next season IMO just like everybody else but after having RBs drop like flies this season shanny just might keep em all.

[want2bAbronco2]

We need a true RB, hopefully it can be Boyd. Who ever it ends up being Hills should go back to FB, he would add so much to our O with a true RB and him at FB. He can run, block, or move out into the slot!

[Rock Chalk]

IF Boyd gets 551 yards on 100 carries and 5 TDs (not to mention his receiving yards because thats a great asset of his supposedly), he makes the team next year at the start of the heap and wil have to be beaten out in TC.

[sirhcyennek81]

We need a true RB, hopefully it can be Boyd. Who ever it ends up being Hills should go back to FB, he would add so much to our O with a true RB and him at FB. He can run, block, or move out into the slot!


So did TD. Not every running back needs to be fast like Clinton Portis. Doesnt matter in the 4th how fast an RB is, defense eventually gets tired of tackling a 250 lb mountain of rage every play.


:Broncos:

[SonOfLe-loLang]

I assume HIllis will assume an Alstott type role regardless of what happens

[2KBack]

Then it will be one of the most exciting training camps in awhile.

[Kaylore]

It's a two back league anymore and with the way our RB's have gone down this season, I expect to see RBBC. I kind of want to see Hillis at FB still. It seems like we once again need to find one.

[Traveler]

Why all the hype for Boyd? Similar to the hype for Torain.

[Schism]

I see our backs going into next year as follows.

Hillis - RB/FB

Torain - RB

Pure Blocking Fullback - Larsen or else draft someone.

With two spots up for grabs for other RB's.

One pure speed back, and another all-round back as the insurance policy if Torain goes down, which looks likely unfortunately.

You can't not give Hillis carries at RB, he was too good in what we saw from him to go using him as a FB only from here on in. I'd like to see him start games, and aim to give him 10-15 carries a game and let him handle all the short yardage work.

For 3 quarters we have Hillis and Torain/New RB splitting carries, Hillis getting the majority, wearing down defenses. Then 4th quarter we can start moving Hillis around a little bit, confuse the hell out of D's and unleash our speed guy on the tiring defense.

If Boyd looks good then there's a spot there for him as far as I can see, let him compete with Torain to spell Hillis. No way our coaches give up on Torain, they were too high on him and he looked good when he actually did see the field.

The speed back is up for grabs. Selvin and Tatum don't really do it for me. Maybe Alridge can be the guy, but I'd like to see us take a flyer on a speedster at some point late in the draft.

[Rock Chalk]

Why all the hype for Boyd? Similar to the hype for Torain.

Not hype, curiousity.

His highlight reel was inspiring in one respect: He fits Denver's offense ideally. He may or may not turn out to be a good RB, hence the multiple times the word IF was being thrown around (apparently you dont understand the concept of hypothetical).

But this Boyd kid shows heart, grit, determination, vision, power and elusiveness all of which make up for his lack of true speed. With the history of Denver plugging in RBs, he has a very good chance of success here.

[tsiguy96]

It's a two back league anymore and with the way our RB's have gone down this season, I expect to see RBBC. I kind of want to see Hillis at FB still. It seems like we once again need to find one.

hillis played his best in a single back formation, and not only that it spreads out the defense so he can plow over 3-4 people for 10 yards on any given play. we dont need a F at all.

[Rock Chalk]

I see our backs going into next year as follows.

Hillis - RB/FB

Torain - RB

Pure Blocking Fullback - Larsen or else draft someone.

With two spots up for grabs for other RB's.

One pure speed back, and another all-round back as the insurance policy if Torain goes down, which looks likely unfortunately.

You can't not give Hillis carries at RB, he was too good in what we saw from him to go using him as a FB only from here on in. I'd like to see him start games, and aim to give him 10-15 carries a game and let him handle all the short yardage work.

For 3 quarters we have Hillis and Torain/New RB splitting carries, Hillis getting the majority, wearing down defenses. Then 4th quarter we can start moving Hillis around a little bit, confuse the hell out of D's and unleash our speed guy on the tiring defense.

If Boyd looks good then there's a spot there for him as far as I can see, let him compete with Torain to spell Hillis. No way our coaches give up on Torain, they were too high on him and he looked good when he actually did see the field.

The speed back is up for grabs. Selvin and Tatum don't really do it for me. Maybe Alridge can be the guy, but I'd like to see us take a flyer on a speedster at some point late in the draft.

As far as Im concerned, we can cut Torain. Injured in TC then gets a whopping 12 carries before going on IR.

Thats not coincidence, thats fate.

[Br0nc0Buster]

I dont think Boyd will do much, so I am not worried about that.

Hillis has proven he can run effectively, so I think he should be a tailback and get some carries next year regardless of what happens with Boyd.

But if Boyd emerges, then that just means we wont have to draft a RB next year. We can just go with him, Hillis, and Torain

[BroncoMan4ever]

Hillis will never be our main RB after this season. the team will make a package of plays to get him the ball, but he won't be the guy to carry the ball 20-25 times a game.
He will be used next season as a FB. he will get a few carries a game, he will get passes out of the backfield, he will line up as a receiver, TE, slot. his skills will be utilized and the team will try to get the ball in his hands 10-15 times a game, but it won't be as a primary RB.

More than likely we will draft a RB and he will be the guy getting the bulk of the carries

[sirhcyennek81]

As far as Im concerned, we can cut Torain. Injured in TC then gets a whopping 12 carries before going on IR.

Thats not coincidence, thats fate.


Bad luck. Cut him, he signs somewhere else, rushes for 1500 yards and a Superbowl MVP then some wise ass says why'd we ever cut him?


:Broncos:

[Rock Chalk]

Bad luck. Cut him, he signs somewhere else, rushes for 1500 yards and a Superbowl MVP then some wise ass says why'd we ever cut him?


:Broncos:

If I were a betting man Id bet you right now Torain never finishes a full season in teh NFL.

[Schism]

As far as Im concerned, we can cut Torain. Injured in TC then gets a whopping 12 carries before going on IR.

Thats not coincidence, thats fate.

Maybe if Boyd turns out to be awesome then that will be the case, but what are the odds of that?

I'd not be at all upset by Torain being cut, he does seem to be made of biscuts, but I honestly can't see it happening with how high they were on him.

Long as Hillis keeps getting the ball I'm happy though. !Booya!

[sirhcyennek81]

If I were a betting man Id bet you right now Torain never finishes a full season in teh NFL.


I would have to care enough to bet in the first place. Either way not too worried about it.


:Broncos:

[TheReverend]

Let training camp settle it all, and don't draft a RB until day 2!

If anything, this season proved that we don't need a running back. Hillis, Torain both looked great in limited time and will be here next year. Even Pittman looked very good, even though he's most likely done.

[BroncoMan4ever]

I see our backs going into next year as follows.

Hillis - RB/FB

Torain - RB

Pure Blocking Fullback - Larsen or else draft someone.

With two spots up for grabs for other RB's.

One pure speed back, and another all-round back as the insurance policy if Torain goes down, which looks likely unfortunately.


Sorry to burt everyone's bubble, but TORAIN IS NOT GOING TO BE ON THE TEAM NEXT YEAR!!!

he couldn't finish camp, couldn't finish more than a half of a game, why would the team or any fans decide to put any hope or faith in this guy?

we are going to draft a RB, pick up a veteran or keep Pittman, possibly a speed back who went undreafted, and Hillis.

[Taco John]

Hillis will be playing the Mike Anderson Fullback roll next season regardless.

[rugbythug]

Hillis and Quick 6 will make an interesting Matchup problem. Both can split out of the Back field and catch. Either can stay in as a single back. Or keep both in for the Combo of a gut run with a toss fake and vice versa.

[Taco John]

Sorry to burt everyone's bubble, but TORAIN IS NOT GOING TO BE ON THE TEAM NEXT YEAR!!!

he couldn't finish camp, couldn't finish more than a half of a game, why would the team or any fans decide to put any hope or faith in this guy?

we are going to draft a RB, pick up a veteran or keep Pittman, possibly a speed back who went undreafted, and Hillis.



I agree with this. Torain can't be counted on.

[BroncoMan4ever]

If I were a betting man Id bet you right now Torain never finishes a full season in teh NFL.

if i were a betting man i say he never takes another meaningful snap in a Broncos uniform, possibly any NFL uniform.

[Taco John]

Not hype, curiousity.

His highlight reel was inspiring in one respect: He fits Denver's offense ideally. He may or may not turn out to be a good RB, hence the multiple times the word IF was being thrown around (apparently you dont understand the concept of hypothetical).

But this Boyd kid shows heart, grit, determination, vision, power and elusiveness all of which make up for his lack of true speed. With the history of Denver plugging in RBs, he has a very good chance of success here.




Totally agree with this too... Boyd has the full skill set and profile of a successful Denver runner. Whether he cashes in on that potential is another matter entirely. My money is on "he does."

[TonyR]

...and don't draft a RB until day 2!


Amen! Day 1 should be ALL about defense.

[Rock Chalk]

I just want a damn RB to stay healthy. This is the most retarded thing Ive ever seen the Denver RB situation this year.

[footstepsfrom#27]

Totally agree with this too... Boyd has the full skill set and profile of a successful Denver runner. Whether he cashes in on that potential is another matter entirely. My money is on "he does."
Cooked Crack will smoke 'em!

Sorry...

[mr007]

I think there's way too much "Hillis definitely back to FB" nonsense. He's averaged over 5 yards per carry with a long of 19, that's consistent positive yardage that you can't ignore.

I'd like to see single back sets used 80% of the time or more here, we have 2 great tight ends on this team, no reason to keep them off the field by utilizing a FB in the backfield on most downs.

Hillis should definitely get a change through TC at the starting HB gig next year.

[Atlas]

Shanny already said that Hillis reminded him of Dallas Clark. So I imagine hillis will play some RB, FB, H-Back and TE. Shanny will get creative.

[DenverBroncosJM]

We have a speed back he is just hurt too. Alridge


EDIT: Not we the Broncos, Im not on the payroll yet...

[Crushaholic]

Why all the hype for Boyd? Similar to the hype for Torain.

Didn't you know? He has a cool nickname. That MUST mean he's good...;D

[DarkHorse30]

So did TD. Not every running back needs to be fast like Clinton Portis. Doesnt matter in the 4th how fast an RB is, defense eventually gets tired of tackling a 250 lb mountain of rage every play.


:Broncos:

Bingo. I'll take the "4yd per carry/Elway's getting bored" RB everyday over the "20+on one carry/1.7ypc on everything else" RB

[Hercules Rockefeller]

Shanny already said that Hillis reminded him of Dallas Clark. So I imagine hillis will play some RB, FB, H-Back and TE. Shanny will get creative.

Which is why he won't be the #1 RB next season, barring all these injuries again. How many teams out there have a FB that's a threat to do what he does? It adds another dimension to this offense that Shanahan can exploit.

[Smiling Assassin27]

There's something to be said for a battering ram at TB, a la Mike Alstott. Give Hillis a shot.

[19Morton77]

i have read 0 post on this thread but dude has played zero games for zero carries and there is a thread that has him being some stud that overtake Hillis or even the other 6 backs is laughable. Come on, let him play one game before crowning his ass. Hillis will be in the backfield in 09 as a HB or FB.

[Popps]

Again, this all can't be much simpler. Hillis needs to get 15 carries or so a game next year, unless we come up with some back that PROVE he's capable of being a better 1st down runner. From there, we add a back that's got a little more speed and we split up carries.

If Hillis comes back healthy, half of our RB situation is solved. We basically need the Chris Johnson-half of what Tenn has. We have our Lendale White.

[Taco John]

I think there's way too much "Hillis definitely back to FB" nonsense.

Get used to it. That's exactly what's going to happen. Hillis will play the same role Mike Anderson played for this team: Fullback who gets carries.

And for what it's worth, it's not a shabby role to play.

[tsiguy96]

I think there's way too much "Hillis definitely back to FB" nonsense. He's averaged over 5 yards per carry with a long of 19, that's consistent positive yardage that you can't ignore.

I'd like to see single back sets used 80% of the time or more here, we have 2 great tight ends on this team, no reason to keep them off the field by utilizing a FB in the backfield on most downs.

Hillis should definitely get a change through TC at the starting HB gig next year.

yep, he was easily the best back we had on the field this year. averaged 5.7ypc in his last 4 games and ALWAYS got the tough yards. he deserves to go into training camp as the starter.

[Popps]

Get used to it. That's exactly what's going to happen. Hillis will play the same role Mike Anderson played for this team: Fullback who gets carries.

And for what it's worth, it's not a shabby role to play.

Again, you're going to see him line up in single sets as a RB... get used to it.

Will he be labeled a FB? Perhaps. Depends how you define fullback. But, the rush to jam this guy back into novelty-role after he showed himself to be as productive as any back we've had since Portis is just idiotic.

We'll never know, but I have no doubt if Hillis stayed healthy... he would have run for over 100 a game and easily been the starter going into next season.

If he's healthy next camp, he'll get a look at RB and likely show you the same thing.... that he's a HIGHLY effective ball-carrier on 1st and 2nd down and that he makes the offense work.

[Rock Chalk]

i have read 0 post on this thread but dude has played zero games for zero carries and there is a thread that has him being some stud that overtake Hillis or even the other 6 backs is laughable. Come on, let him play one game before crowning his ass. Hillis will be in the backfield in 09 as a HB or FB.

Well IF you read any posts in the thread you would realize that no one is crowning him. ITS A HYPOTHETICAL QUESTION using a LOT of IFs. What IF he shows to be something special, then WHAT HAPPENS?

[Rock Chalk]

Popps, the question is what IF this new guy puts up awesome numbers? What happens in camp next year?

Thats all thsi thread is about.

[Taco John]

Again, you're going to see him line up in single sets as a RB... get used to it.

I'll believe it when I see it. Shanahan has ALWAYS gravitated away from putting the straight ahead runner in a single set, opting to use the cutback runner in that role. The only times he's put the straight ahead runner in a single back set is when he absolutely has to.

I think people are nuts if they think Shanahan is going to completely scrap his offense, which favors cutback runners, because of Hillis. Maybe I'm wrong - like I say, I'll believe it when I see it.

[Popps]

I think there's way too much "Hillis definitely back to FB" nonsense. He's averaged over 5 yards per carry with a long of 19, that's consistent positive yardage that you can't ignore.
.

Shanahan didn't ignore it. That's why he fed him the ball 22 times against the 3rd best run D in the league, and had him on the way to another 100+ yard game the next week before he was injured.

There's a reason Boyd, Bell, Pope etc. weren't seeing any carries.

Again, if we draft the next Jim Brown... we won't need Hillis to carry the ball for us. Until then, we need to continue to give him carries in 1st and 2nd down situations.

WILL Shanahan keep him running the ball? Who knows. Clearly Shanhan doesn't have a real good handle on things at all times or Hillis would have been getting carries earlier. (Along with a bunch of other examples I could give from this year.)

[cmhargrove]

Let's see here. We have one free agent rookie and one seventh round draft pick, check.

I say.

Do whatever the heck you want with them. They could both be studs that carry the ball 15-20 times a game until the other team is bleeding on the ground asking us to stop.

Depth at RB is never a problem. Never.

[2KBack]

you know what's great about Denver? The team is on it's 9th string running back, and there is STILL excitment about the running game. The fact that this is even a viable discussion is amazing.

[Peoples Champ]

Yes, I would say bring back to FB and only use as RB on 3rd and 1. But then teams would know we are running. Or we could use that as a distraction, bring in hillis on 3rd and 1, and bootleg out of it?

[BroncoMan4ever]

Again, this all can't be much simpler. Hillis needs to get 15 carries or so a game next year, unless we come up with some back that PROVE he's capable of being a better 1st down runner. From there, we add a back that's got a little more speed and we split up carries.

If Hillis comes back healthy, half of our RB situation is solved. We basically need the Chris Johnson-half of what Tenn has. We have our Lendale White.

what i see with Hillis isn't as a RB. he is going to be a player for us that lines up everywhere. he will get carries in a game, he will get passes out of the backfield, he will line up as a TE, WR, slot receiver. Shanahan will find ways to get him the ball around 15 times a game, but the majority of his touches won't be as a RB.

[Don Flamenco]

Gosh, Michael Pittman seems like 3 seasons ago.

[Florida_Bronco]

Sorry to burt everyone's bubble, but TORAIN IS NOT GOING TO BE ON THE TEAM NEXT YEAR!!!

he couldn't finish camp, couldn't finish more than a half of a game, why would the team or any fans decide to put any hope or faith in this guy?

I want to come off as a jerk, but this post is serious crap. Not only have you claimed something to be fact (which drives me up the damn wall) but it's also incredibly short sighted and falls into the typical OM "injury prone" mantra.

Shanny is extremely high on Torain, and the kid is very talented. He was looking very good against Cleveland despite getting his first action the week before against the Dolphins.

Both of his injuries this year were flukes that would have done the same damage to any player. He doesn't have any lingering issues, and he's not fragile so lets cut that bull****.

Save for some unexpected problems with his recovery, Torain will come back and be in the mix for the starting job in training camp.

[Popps]

I'll believe it when I see it. Shanahan has ALWAYS gravitated away from putting the straight ahead runner in a single set, opting to use the cutback runner in that role. The only times he's put the straight ahead runner in a single back set is when he absolutely has to.

I think people are nuts if they think Shanahan is going to completely scrap his offense, which favors cutback runners, because of Hillis. Maybe I'm wrong - like I say, I'll believe it when I see it.

Dude, you need to honestly go back and take a good look at Hillis' runs. The guy can absolutely cut back. He's got excellent vision. The fact that he CAN run over people doesn't mean that's all he can do.

Taco, he had three 19 yard runs in one game. That's not some dumpy, plodding fullback falling forward for a couple of yards. The guy is an athlete.

You made the comparison to Mike Anderson, yourself. What you're forgetting is that Anderson started as a RB, and moved to FB... and has a similar skill-set to Hillis. They're very similar runners... with Anderson having a bit more speed and Hillis having a bit more power, but both are/were deceptively effective at making one-cut and getting upfield.

Like I said, if you hadn't had 4-5 games to watch the guy run, I'd understand the incorrect assumptions that this guy is some kind of plodding blocking fullback. But, he ran better than ANY RB we've had this season, including the "starters" from the beginning of the year.

Shanahan won't have to "scrap" anything. His offense worked MUCH better with Hillis banging out 4-6 yards on first downs and busting 10-20 yard runs on a regular basis.

So, your premiss is incorrect. He may well indeed not stick with Hillis as a RB, but if he doesn't... it won't be for the reasons you're assuming.

[Popps]

what i see with Hillis isn't as a RB. .

Then by those standards, Marshall isn't a receiver and Cutler isn't a QB.

A guy performing better than anyone on his team, or anyone at that position for his team in the last several years seems to constitute that position, to me.

But, maybe you have info that I don't.

[Br0nc0Buster]

I remember Shanny also saying that Hillis proved he could be a tailback in this league.

Hopefully that means they keep him there next year.

I dont understand the Dallas Clark comparisons, even if Shanny made them himself.
We already have our Dallas Clark, and his name is Tony Scheffler.

[tsiguy96]

Then by those standards, Marshall isn't a receiver and Cutler isn't a QB.

A guy performing better than anyone on his team, or anyone at that position for his team in the last several years seems to constitute that position, to me.

But, maybe you have info that I don't.

i just dont understand it, he was highly, highly effective as a runner, moreso then anyone we had seen all year. aside from goal line runs, did he have ANY negative yardage plays? or even 0 yard carries? he was GREAT at running the ball with extremely limited practice prior to him trying, so now everyone wants to draft an unknown to replace what was already working.

someone explain this to me: we averaged 1.5 more ppg since he started, including the bomb with oakland, and are 4-5 with him as the starter with him averaging over 5.0ypc. why do we have to move him to another rule on the team? to try and make an offense that is firing on all cylinders even better? with him, we dont NEED a fullback, we can run a single back set, get over 5.0ypc and STILL have 4 recievers on the field (2 TE, 2 WR) to spread the defense out wide. why would you want to get rid of that?

[Dedhed]

Hillis will never be our main RB after this season. the team will make a package of plays to get him the ball, but he won't be the guy to carry the ball 20-25 times a game.
He will be used next season as a FB. he will get a few carries a game, he will get passes out of the backfield, he will line up as a receiver, TE, slot. his skills will be utilized and the team will try to get the ball in his hands 10-15 times a game, but it won't be as a primary RB.

More than likely we will draft a RB and he will be the guy getting the bulk of the carriesOne can only hope.

Regardless of whether Boyd goes off or flames out, Hillis's role should be as outlined above. If we get a legitimate RB and make defenses account for that RB and Hillis on top of Marshall, Royal, Scheffler, Graham, Stokely this offense will be absurd.

I think Hillis talents are too diverse as a FB/HB/TE weapon to be a full time RB. He deserves his own role. Give him 10-15 carries from the single back or T formation or behind Larsen/Lichtensteiger in short yardage/goaline, split him out as a TE for 10-15 plays, and let him lead block for 10-15 plays. With Shanahan's mind Hillis can be a brutal weapon for DCs to account for.

[Br0nc0Buster]

i just dont understand it, he was highly, highly effective as a runner, moreso then anyone we had seen all year. aside from goal line runs, did he have ANY negative yardage plays? or even 0 yard carries? he was GREAT at running the ball with extremely limited practice prior to him trying, so now everyone wants to draft an unknown to replace what was already working.

someone explain this to me: we averaged 1.5 more ppg since he started, including the bomb with oakland, and are 4-5 with him as the starter with him averaging over 5.0ypc. why do we have to move him to another rule on the team? to try and make an offense that is firing on all cylinders even better? with him, we dont NEED a fullback, we can run a single back set, get over 5.0ypc and STILL have 4 recievers on the field (2 TE, 2 WR) to spread the defense out wide. why would you want to get rid of that?

Because apparently he was drafted as a fullback, so gosh darnit that is what position he must stay at

[Dedhed]

There's a reason Boyd, Bell, Pope etc. weren't seeing any carries.


Boyd wasn't even on the roster until a few weeks ago and Pope bruised his ribs against Atl and wasn't healthy. I think you should stick with Bell in that statement. And we all know why Bell wasn't seeing any carries. Nothing to go on here.

[outdoor_miner]

i just dont understand it, he was highly, highly effective as a runner, moreso then anyone we had seen all year. aside from goal line runs, did he have ANY negative yardage plays? or even 0 yard carries? he was GREAT at running the ball with extremely limited practice prior to him trying, so now everyone wants to draft an unknown to replace what was already working.

someone explain this to me: we averaged 1.5 more ppg since he started, including the bomb with oakland, and are 4-5 with him as the starter with him averaging over 5.0ypc. why do we have to move him to another rule on the team? to try and make an offense that is firing on all cylinders even better? with him, we dont NEED a fullback, we can run a single back set, get over 5.0ypc and STILL have 4 recievers on the field (2 TE, 2 WR) to spread the defense out wide. why would you want to get rid of that?

I completely agree with this. I can see us looking for someone to compliment Hillis (whether that person is already on the team - like Alridge - or acquired through the draft)... However, from what I saw, he looks like the perfect back for the Broncos going forward. I loved the one back sets with Hillis gashing teams up the middle (he even looked good taking it outside). We'll see if the coaches agree... I guess there is a possibility they see more value from a hybrid role. However, I say why mess around with that when he appears (in an admittedly small sample size) to be a great runningback.

[Dedhed]

Has anyone in the 'Hillis for unquestioned starting RB' camp wondered why he was moved to FB in college? He came in as a RB and was effective as a starter until Mcfadden and Jones came along.

The Arkansas offense was far better for it as well.

[razorwire77]

Boyd's clips in college make it look like he fits this offense to a tee. The thing that gets me wondering though is why we had to lose an entire roster of backs, and sign Tatum from the mall before he was even given a chance. Hopefully he tears it up the next few weeks.

Speaking hypothetically, this is how I see the RB situation playing out next year.

With Boyd I will reserve judgement until we can see what this kid can do. I also think Shanny takes a flier on a back with day one talent that slides into 4th/5th round

Hillis will be move around power RB /FB/HB, but he will be given an opportunity to start

Young will probably make the team as a change of pace 5-10 carry guy.

Pittman will most likely be cut. An older injured power back, probably won't make the team with this type of depth.

Andre Hall is cut.

Tatum will have to perform really well down the stretch, to avoid going back to the mall. Assuming he finishes the season strong, he will provide depth/challenge and challege Young for a change of pace back.

Ryan will get a chance in camp, but he's is done, imo. If he was a proven NFL back rehabbing from a severe injury that would be one thing, but he hasn't proven anything other than the propensity to get injured. It sucks, because I like the kid, but that upright running style gets you killed unless you're Eric Dickerson.

[Dedhed]

Boyd's clips in college make it look like he fits this offense to a tee. The thing that gets me wondering though is why we had to lose an entire roster of backs, and sign Tatum from the mall before he was even given a chance.


Boyd has only been on the roster for a few weeks. I think he was signed the same week that we picked up Tatum.

[Rock Chalk]

I want to come off as a jerk, but this post is serious crap. Not only have you claimed something to be fact (which drives me up the damn wall) but it's also incredibly short sighted and falls into the typical OM "injury prone" mantra.

Shanny is extremely high on Torain, and the kid is very talented. He was looking very good against Cleveland despite getting his first action the week before against the Dolphins.

Both of his injuries this year were flukes that would have done the same damage to any player. He doesn't have any lingering issues, and he's not fragile so lets cut that bull****.

Save for some unexpected problems with his recovery, Torain will come back and be in the mix for the starting job in training camp.
Torain has a history of injury issues from college and now the pro's. An ACL injury is not a freak injury, they happen in the NFL and they happen to be serious business for running backs.

If you are so confident about Torain, put your money where your mouth is. Donate 1000 dollars to the Orangemane at the end of next season WHEN he doesnt finish the season because he wont. Dude will NEVER be healthy. Just forget about Torain.

[Br0nc0Buster]

Has anyone in the 'Hillis for unquestioned starting RB' camp wondered why he was moved to FB in college? He came in as a RB and was effective as a starter until Mcfadden and Jones came along.

The Arkansas offense was far better for it as well.

Well McFadden was arguably the most talented player in the most talented conference in the country.
Hillis was one of the best runningbacks coming out of highschool, he moved to FB because he was not as good as McFadden.

But you cant always look at what someone did in college in a different system and say "that is all they can do".
Look at what Royal is doing for us, he was not doing that at Virginia Tech as a receiver for reasons that had nothing to do with him.
Also, Houston Nutt for some reason did not really seem to like Hillis.

I look at what Hillis is doing for us right now, and that is averaging 5+ yards a carry while also getting the tough yards.

He can also block and can catch very well, he is the perfect 3rd down back.

[Popps]

Boyd wasn't even on the roster until a few weeks ago and Pope bruised his ribs against Atl and wasn't healthy. I think you should stick with Bell in that statement. And we all know why Bell wasn't seeing any carries. Nothing to go on here.

Again, he's been extremely productive... and provided Shanahan with the best RB this offense has seen since Portis, and an extremely effective first down back.

If you think the fact that he moved positions in college plays into this "argument" you have, feel free to continue the charade.

The guy's gone, so hopefully we'll be able to match his production with someone and not have to go back to the Selvin Youngs of the world.

As for next season... you have no better idea than anyone else what Shanahan will do. He may start Hillis and he may cut him. He's wildly unpredictable and clearly, Shanahan hasn't put the best talent on the field at all times this year.

Also, I think you need to choose your words better. No one has called Hillis an "unquestioned" anything. In fact, the majority of the (logical) folks who understand what they're looking at described him as a 15-20 carry a game guy who needs another back to split carries with. So, the straw-man stuff isn't necessary.

[Popps]

Well McFadden was arguably the most talented player in the most talented conference in the country.
Hillis was one of the best runningbacks coming out of highschool, he moved to FB because he was not as good as McFadden..

Exactly. Let me know when we have a McFadden on our roster, and then we'll discuss who needs carries.

[Florida_Bronco]

Torain has a history of injury issues from college and now the pro's. An ACL injury is not a freak injury, they happen in the NFL and they happen to be serious business for running backs.

A history of injury issues? Where are you getting your information from Alec? The only injuries that I am finding are a sprained ankle (big whoop) in JuCo and then his fractured toe last year. That's hardly "injury issues" even for the OrangeMane.

And Alec, if you don't think his ACL injury was freak, I don't know what to tell you. Not too worried about his recovery either, as with modern medicine players usually come back from ACL's without issue.

If you are so confident about Torain, put your money where your mouth is. Donate 1000 dollars to the Orangemane at the end of next season WHEN he doesnt finish the season because he wont. Dude will NEVER be healthy. Just forget about Torain. Sorry, I'm in the middle of a move and dont have $1000 to risk.

But I tell ya what, come up with some reasonable terms and I'll take your bet.

[BroncoBuff]

I suppose Boyd could explode like Droughns did when filling in unexpectedly. But I think it'll be a "Hillis-Torain World" next year, with Boyd and Pope getting looks in camp.

Even if Andre Hall and Selvin Young come in healthy next summer, at this point nobody can take either one seriously as a feature back, they're just 3rd down specialists. And I'm not sure Tatum Bell is not in the running as a 3rd down guy. He strapped on that harness to play through a painful separated shoulder as a rookie. I don't see Hall or Young playing through injuries like that.

[telluride]

Use 'em both!

Cracker and Crack!
Bam and Jam!
Rock and Roll!
Boom and Buzz!
White Boy and Boyd!

[ZONA]

Hillis will start next year regardless of what Boyd does. He is the ONLY back we have that allows us to have a strong running game with just a single back. I think this team is evolving into the area where we will see more passing plays then running plays. Having 3 WR's on the field with Hillis as a single back just is too good and Shanny knows that. He picks up the blitz to well for us to try another back at that single spot. He's proved he not only gains huge yards by the chunks, he punishes people while doing so. He protect the ball much better then most of the RB's on the team. He's probably the best pass catcher of all the RB's. He just has too much upside not to give him a shot at starting. Shanny even commented that he was sick to see Hillis go off the field like that. I think he knew he finally found something truly special. You could see the genuine dissapointment in his face. I don't think I've seen that when the other backs went out. Frustration yes, this was different.

And, if we do it the ol'e fashioned way, let everybody battle it out in camp and preseason, I still think Hillis would end up winning because I think he is the best RB we have. Period.

[CEH]

Mike Shanahan just told the local radio station Hillis is coming back next year as a RB. The 5.0 ypc has earned him a right to stay at RB.

[Popps]

Mike Shanahan just told the local radio station Hillis is coming back next year as a RB. The 5.0 ypc has earned him a right to stay at RB.

Wow, no move to long-snapper?

Shocking.

[Popps]

But I tell ya what, come up with some reasonable terms and I'll take your bet.

If Alec wins... Bob is banned for a year. If you win, Bob is banned for two years.

[fido]

you know what's great about Denver? The team is on it's 9th string running back, and there is STILL excitment about the running game. The fact that this is even a viable discussion is amazing.

truth

[chickennob2]

Torain has a history of injury issues from college and now the pro's. An ACL injury is not a freak injury, they happen in the NFL and they happen to be serious business for running backs.

If you are so confident about Torain, put your money where your mouth is. Donate 1000 dollars to the Orangemane at the end of next season WHEN he doesnt finish the season because he wont. Dude will NEVER be healthy. Just forget about Torain.

This is absolutely absurd. Torain's injury history versus Adrian Peterson's injury history? AD's is much worse, so would you just give up on him? You know what, you're right, Torain sufferred a season ending injury. What a failure. He must be the only RB Denver has ever had to be put on IR, the injury-prone loser. Oh wait, he's one of five backs THIS YEAR to be put on IR? Well never mind.


The fact that you have given up on him living up to the enormous hype in no way means that a guy getting 5th round money is going to be CUT before the season starts. That is absurd. This whole issue is ridiculous. This "injury prone" label is just naive. The ONLY difference between Torain and every other back that has seen the field for us this year is that Torain managed to come back from one of his injuries, allowing him to suffer a second injury. And I don't care who you are, if you are hit the way Torain was, you WILL tear your ACL. This has nothing to do with toughness. This has nothing to do with some physical flaw of Torain's. This is just how knees work.



As to the topic of the thread, I don't really care. Hillis can do some things in a FB role that no one else on this roster can do. He can do mean, terrible things to defenses. As a RB, his production can likely be about matched by some other back. So it just makes sense to me to have your most talented players on the field at the same time. But either way, if doesn't matter to me. I fully trust that Shanny will be able to know what is best for the team and use each player in the way that best helps the team win. IF thats fulltime running back, great. If that's fulltime FB, great.

[summerdenver]

Mike Shanahan just told the local radio station Hillis is coming back next year as a RB. The 5.0 ypc has earned him a right to stay at RB.

I heard that too. He was asked specifically what will be Hillis's position next year and he said he will come back as the tail back. He also added that Peyton wants to be a tail back and we will give him the chance.

[Bladerunner]

Hillis will start next year regardless of what Boyd does. He is the ONLY back we have that allows us to have a strong running game with just a single back. I think this team is evolving into the area where we will see more passing plays then running plays. Having 3 WR's on the field with Hillis as a single back just is too good and Shanny knows that. He picks up the blitz to well for us to try another back at that single spot. He's proved he not only gains huge yards by the chunks, he punishes people while doing so. He protect the ball much better then most of the RB's on the team. He's probably the best pass catcher of all the RB's. He just has too much upside not to give him a shot at starting. Shanny even commented that he was sick to see Hillis go off the field like that. I think he knew he finally found something truly special. You could see the genuine dissapointment in his face. I don't think I've seen that when the other backs went out. Frustration yes, this was different.

And, if we do it the ol'e fashioned way, let everybody battle it out in camp and preseason, I still think Hillis would end up winning because I think he is the best RB we have. Period.

I pretty much agree with this and a few of the other posts about Hillis in this regard.

I disagree about the 3 WR set though. With Dan Graham starting to appear on the receiving end of Cutler passes with greater frequency lately, I see a "jumbo" package with the greatest downfield threat in the NFL.

Marshall Graham Clady Hamilton Nalen(?) Kuper Harris Sheffler Royal
Cutler
Hillis

This is a set with a freakish combination of power, downfield receiving threats, pass protection, and flexibility. Third and long pulls Graham and adds Stokely.

I don't know if this is the plan or not, but I think it has crazy potential. Marshall, Clady, Graham, and Hillis to the left is a load. Play action off of it will be sweet.

Shanny is a creative guy, and I think he will get Hillis the ball in a variety of ways, but we saw some power out of Hillis that we haven't seen in a while. I think we should take advantage of it.

[BroncoBuff]

Donate 1000 dollars to the Orangemane at the end of next season WHEN he doesnt finish the season because he wont. Dude will NEVER be healthy. Just forget about Torain.
Did somebody say "donate to the OM"?

Don't get me started ...

[Hogan11]

R.b.b.c.

[Florida_Bronco]

If Alec wins... Bob is banned for a year. If you win, Bob is banned for two years.

:thumbsup:
:notworthy

[Atlas]

I remember Shanny also saying that Hillis proved he could be a tailback in this league.

Hopefully that means they keep him there next year.

I dont understand the Dallas Clark comparisons, even if Shanny made them himself.
We already have our Dallas Clark, and his name is Tony Scheffler.

Dallas Clark plays FB and lines up at RB and H-Back along with TE. Scheffler doesn't and can't do all that, Hillis can.

[SportinOne]

For the rest of this season we just plug in whoever has the hot hand.

Next year, we have basically no other offensive position that needs to be filled. So we focus on the defense but get as much talent stockpiled at RB as possible in the offseason and have an open competition in camp and in the preseason for starter.

[Br0nc0Buster]

Dallas Clark plays FB and lines up at RB and H-Back along with TE. Scheffler doesn't and can't do all that, Hillis can.

What cant Scheffler do?
Line up in the backfield and motion wide?

Its not like they hand it off to Clark.

I think Scheffler is just as deadly a receiving threat as Clark, just needs some more experience to get to his level.

But I think you are overlooking one thing.
Hillis can average over 5 yards a carry and run over safeties and linebackers.
Clark cant

[tsiguy96]

Mike Shanahan just told the local radio station Hillis is coming back next year as a RB. The 5.0 ypc has earned him a right to stay at RB.

where/when?

[bombay]

where/when?


On Clough/Evans/armstrong's show today. I heard it as well.

Shanahan said specifically that Hillis has earned a shot at tailback next season.

[CEH]

where/when?

104.3 the fan around 4:00 pm with Sandy Clough asking the question. It was the last question before they congratulated Mike on calling his shot in preseason that "Denver would not miss the playoffs"

[Dedhed]

Well McFadden was arguably the most talented player in the most talented conference in the country.
Hillis was one of the best runningbacks coming out of highschool, he moved to FB because he was not as good as McFadden.

But you cant always look at what someone did in college in a different system and say "that is all they can do".
Look at what Royal is doing for us, he was not doing that at Virginia Tech as a receiver for reasons that had nothing to do with him.
Also, Houston Nutt for some reason did not really seem to like Hillis.

I look at what Hillis is doing for us right now, and that is averaging 5+ yards a carry while also getting the tough yards.

He can also block and can catch very well, he is the perfect 3rd down back.I'm not saying that's all he can do at all. Read my posts, and particularly the one you responded to. When Hillis moved to FB in Arkansas their offense was considerably better with the exact same system because they added two guys who were equal to or better than Hillis at RB and added a FB who could do things that very few FBs can do.

Hillis has earned the right to get a look at the RB spot, but you've basically stated yourself that a legitimate RB should displace Hillis.

[Popps]

On Clough/Evans/armstrong's show today. I heard it as well.

Shanahan said specifically that Hillis has earned a shot at tailback next season.


Again, Shanahan is the same guy that allows John Engleberger a roster spot... so it's never safe to assume he's seeing the right thing. But, offensively... Shanahan isn't an idiot. He's got two functioning eyes and could see that no back since Portis was as effective on first downs ripping off 4-6 yard chunks. That's absolutely invaluable to any coach, but particularly one with a system like ours and a QB like ours. It puts defenses at an extreme disadvantage. 2nd and 5 means we could just as easily be running as throwing.

[Popps]

I'm not saying that's all he can do at all. Read my posts, and particularly the one you responded to. When Hillis moved to FB in Arkansas their offense was considerably better with the exact same system because they added two guys who were equal to or better than Hillis .


A. We're not Arkansas and we certainly don't have any stud RBs... haven't had any since Portis and have only had 2 in the last 20 years. So, banking on the odds that we'll somehow magically make a world-class RB just appear isn't necessary.

B. Even if we did land said superstar-RB, it still provides no legitimate reason to cease giving Hillis carries or to move him to FB full-time. Most teams run a dual-RB program, now... and given our history of RB injuries, we can't have enough capable RBs.

C. Shanahan does NOT use a FB in a traditional role. He has NOT placed any priority on FB in over a decade. We do NOT run a blocking FB on a regular basis.


Hillis has earned the right to get a look at the RB spot, but you've basically stated yourself that a legitimate RB should displace Hillis.

Again, "displace" isn't necessary and is highly unlikely, save some kind of super-stud first round pick. Even then, don't be surprised to see Hillis take 10-12 carries a game or more in some situations.

[Dedhed]

A. We're not Arkansas and we certainly don't have any stud RBs... haven't had any since Portis and have only had 2 in the last 20 years. So, banking on the odds that we'll somehow magically make a world-class RB just appear isn't necessary.

B. Even if we did land said superstar-RB, it still provides no legitimate reason to cease giving Hillis carries or to move him to FB full-time. Most teams run a dual-RB program, now... and given our history of RB injuries, we can't have enough capable RBs.

C. Shanahan does NOT use a FB in a traditional role. He has NOT placed any priority on FB in over a decade. We do NOT run a blocking FB on a regular basis.



Again, "displace" isn't necessary and is highly unlikely, save some kind of super-stud first round pick. Even then, don't be surprised to see Hillis take 10-12 carries a game or more in some situations.This only works based on your opinion that Hillis is a Superstar RB after 6 qtrs of good football. I'm not on that bandwagon with you.

[Los Broncos]

Torain is to fragile, I want to see what Aldridge can do.

Use Hillis as a FB, give him a few carries, pure blocking FB.

Line up as a WR, he has great hands confuse the defense a little.

[socalorado]

Dallas Clark plays FB and lines up at RB and H-Back along with TE. Scheffler doesn't and can't do all that, Hillis can.

Thank You.
So does Chris Cooley. Thats what Hillis can do as well.
The "X" factor player, that defenses have to account for.

[socalorado]

What cant Scheffler do?
Line up in the backfield and motion wide?

Its not like they hand it off to Clark.

I think Scheffler is just as deadly a receiving threat as Clark, just needs some more experience to get to his level.

But I think you are overlooking one thing.
Hillis can average over 5 yards a carry and run over safeties and linebackers.
Clark cant

Clark, like Cooley are multi-talented players. They can block on the line, block as a FB, catch out of the backfield, and go out and line up as a TE/WR/SLOT player and run routes. This causes all kinds of problems for opposing defensive coordinators. They have to account for this specific player on every down.
No defense would take "Mr.Glass" seriously if he lined up at FB, or if he tried to block on the line. He is not a blocking TE. Hes a pass catching, route running TE, in the mold of Wesley Walls.

[Popps]

This only works based on your opinion that Hillis is a Superstar RB after 6 qtrs of good football. I'm not on that bandwagon with you.

Sub "extremely productive back" in for Superstar... and then go back and look at his production for us even before he began running on a regular basis, and then go back and look at his YPC average in college, where he came out considered a "tweener"... part RB, part FB.

No one is calling him a Superstar. But, if you've watched the team as long as some of us have, you quickly understand the value of this type of back.

[SonOfLe-loLang]

Torain is to fragile, I want to see what Aldridge can do.

Use Hillis as a FB, give him a few carries, pure blocking FB.

Line up as a WR, he has great hands confuse the defense a little.

He's not a pure blocking FB. I honestly think he'll be used how Alstott was used. Catching passes out of the backfield, 10 carries (+) a game, split time with a different style runner.

[BroncoMan4ever]

I want to come off as a jerk, but this post is serious crap. Not only have you claimed something to be fact (which drives me up the damn wall) but it's also incredibly short sighted and falls into the typical OM "injury prone" mantra.

Shanny is extremely high on Torain, and the kid is very talented. He was looking very good against Cleveland despite getting his first action the week before against the Dolphins.

Both of his injuries this year were flukes that would have done the same damage to any player. He doesn't have any lingering issues, and he's not fragile so lets cut that bull****.

Save for some unexpected problems with his recovery, Torain will come back and be in the mix for the starting job in training camp.

He seems to be a magnet for fluke injuries.

and not fragile lets see about that, Sat 4 games his sophomore year with an ankle sprain missed 7 games as a senior with a fractured toe, couldn't make it through camp with an elbow injury, hurt his knee after less than a half of actual game contribution.

sorry to say this, but i don't expect to see MR GLASS carry again for us. he will probably get into camp, but he also probably get injured before the preseason, only this time he won't get a roster spot to waist while he recovers.

the team will draft a RB early next year and Torain will be looking for work.

[Dedhed]

Sub "extremely productive back" in for Superstar... and then go back and look at his production for us even before he began running on a regular basis, and then go back and look at his YPC average in college, where he came out considered a "tweener"... part RB, part FB.

No one is calling him a Superstar. But, if you've watched the team as long as some of us have, you quickly understand the value of this type of back.
We've had more backs produce over 6 qtrs than I have fingers, and I'm not disfigured in any way. I've watched this team for longer than most, and unlike some long enough to know that a few good games is nothing to base an opinion on.

Quentin Griffin was more productive over six qtrs than any back in Denver history. We know nothing about Hillis other than he was productive for less than 2 games.

[BroncoMan4ever]

Then by those standards, Marshall isn't a receiver and Cutler isn't a QB.

A guy performing better than anyone on his team, or anyone at that position for his team in the last several years seems to constitute that position, to me.

But, maybe you have info that I don't.

Hillis has more value than just as a RB. he has more talents that if he were used only as a RB would not get used. In the best interest of the team, we should get a workhorse RB in the draft, and use Hillis everywhere.

Hillis, can run the ball, lead block, catch out of the backfield, line up at TE, or WR, or at the slot, as an X-Factor H-Back type of player for this team he could be a very dangerous weapon. I never said he should be relegated to being a FB, but he should not be the primary RB on this team.

Shanahan sees what he can do with Hillis. Over the offseason he will come up with a package of plays specifically to get the ball into Hillis' hands, be it short yardage runs, FB Dives, screens, downfield passes. Next season Hillis won't be our starting RB, but he will be all over the field contributing in a lot of different ways.

Do you realize how dynamic he is? he can get the job done at RB if we had to use him there, but that is just a waste of his talent. he could be so much more than just a power back in a RBBC, why underuse him, when we could find interesting ways to get the ball in his hands while also having him available if we need him to run the ball.

[Br0nc0Buster]

Clark, like Cooley are multi-talented players. They can block on the line, block as a FB, catch out of the backfield, and go out and line up as a TE/WR/SLOT player and run routes. This causes all kinds of problems for opposing defensive coordinators. They have to account for this specific player on every down.
No defense would take "Mr.Glass" seriously if he lined up at FB, or if he tried to block on the line. He is not a blocking TE. Hes a pass catching, route running TE, in the mold of Wesley Walls.

It seems like you are punishing Hillis for being versatile.
Just because Hillis can catch well and block well, does not mean that is all he should do.
Clark and Cooley cannot run the ball like Hillis.
Hillis can help the team by doing those things, but he also can help the team by getting 5 yards a carry with a power running game.

Also if Hillis is just used as a novelty back and a pass catcher, well he will be fighting with Royal, Marshall, Graham, Scheffler, and Stokely for catches.

As a runningback he can help the team by getting 100 yard games and controlling the clock with the lead.

He is like Larry Johnson, but who can also block and catch.

[Popps]

Hillis has more value than just as a RB. he has more talents that if he were used only as a RB would not get used. In the best interest of the team, we should get a workhorse RB in the draft, and use Hillis everywhere.

Hillis, can run the ball, lead block, catch out of the backfield, line up at TE, or WR, or at the slot, as an X-Factor H-Back type of player for this team he could be a very dangerous weapon. I never said he should be relegated to being a FB, but he should not be the primary RB on this team.

Shanahan sees what he can do with Hillis. Over the offseason he will come up with a package of plays specifically to get the ball into Hillis' hands, be it short yardage runs, FB Dives, screens, downfield passes. Next season Hillis won't be our starting RB, but he will be all over the field contributing in a lot of different ways.

Do you realize how dynamic he is? he can get the job done at RB if we had to use him there, but that is just a waste of his talent. he could be so much more than just a power back in a RBBC, why underuse him, when we could find interesting ways to get the ball in his hands while also having him available if we need him to run the ball.

He IS your power-back, as well as a good cut-back runner, and yea... he's dynamic. You're making a great case to keep him there and giving him 20-25 carries... intentionally or not.

Again, I think you're confusing the fact that he can do some other things with the notion that he needs to do those other things.

Terrell Davis was a great special teams player. He also had fantastic hands.
However, we never used him on STs and he didn't catch a lot of passes as his career progressed.

Hillis is obviously no TD, but he's highly effective at running the ball on 1st and 2nd downs. That's light-years more crucial to a coach than a guy who can run a circle route from the FB position, though he very well may do that as well.

Mike Shanahan needs a back to put in in 2nd and 5 on a regular basis. He hasn't had one in years. He found one in Hillis and that's why Shanahan said himself that he'll get a shot at RB, not in some sort of novelty role.

[socalorado]

It seems like you are punishing Hillis for being versatile.
Just because Hillis can catch well and block well, does not mean that is all he should do.
Clark and Cooley cannot run the ball like Hillis.
Hillis can help the team by doing those things, but he also can help the team by getting 5 yards a carry with a power running game.

Also if Hillis is just used as a novelty back and a pass catcher, well he will be fighting with Royal, Marshall, Graham, Scheffler, and Stokely for catches.

As a runningback he can help the team by getting 100 yard games and controlling the clock with the lead.

He is like Larry Johnson, but who can also block and catch.

Larry Johnson!?!?
Hey i am all for Hillis playing RB as much as the next guy, but i think comparing him to LJ is a bit premature.
If he is so much like LJ, then why didnt coach Nutt at ARK have him as the primary RB over Mcfadden and Jones?
I think he could ba an Alstott, but i think hes more suited to the "X"factor/FB role, and DEN should draft another durable RB.
Who knows? maybe your right and he could play as a full time RB. We'll see.

[Br0nc0Buster]

Larry Johnson!?!?
Hey i am all for Hillis playing RB as much as the next guy, but i think comparing him to LJ is a bit premature.
If he is so much like LJ, then why didnt coach Nutt at ARK have him as the primary RB over Mcfadden and Jones?
I think he could ba an Alstott, but i think hes more suited to the "X"factor/FB role, and DEN should draft another durable RB.
Who knows? maybe your right and he could play as a full time RB. We'll see.

I also want Denver to draft another RB to split carries with him.
I think we should get someone with exceptional speed to compliment him.
I dont think he is as good as Larry Johnson, but I think he is comparable.
He can punish defenders and can move the pile like Larry Johnson.

But I wouldnt put too much stock into what Nutt thought of Hillis, I remember reading articles that Nutt had some less than complimentary things to say about Hillis. In fact I think he told some NFL scouts that Hillis would be no good. Plus I never said Hillis was as good or better than McFadden. But I dont see any McFaddens on our team. And I dont think you need elite talent at RBs to win now days, the Patriots won 3 rings with Antwan freaking Smith.

[Spider]

Is Hillis as good as Larry Johnson ?
No Hillis is better ..... he doesnt create Drama , doesnt draw more attention to himself then what he has to , puts the team first and foremost , he may not be as flashy or as pure runner as LJ , but Hillis would be my pick over LJ ......

[socalorado]

I also want Denver to draft another RB to split carries with him.
I think we should get someone with exceptional speed to compliment him.
I dont think he is as good as Larry Johnson, but I think he is comparable.
He can punish defenders and can move the pile like Larry Johnson.

But I wouldnt put too much stock into what Nutt thought of Hillis, I remember reading articles that Nutt had some less than complimentary things to say about Hillis. In fact I think he told some NFL scouts that Hillis would be no good. Plus I never said Hillis was as good or better than McFadden. But I dont see any McFaddens on our team. And I dont think you need elite talent at RBs to win now days, the Patriots won 3 rings with Antwan freaking Smith.

Yes, Nutt did indeed $h!t talk our own Peyton "SOB" Hillis!!!
Next time Spiders in Mississippi, i expect him to pay ol Nutt a visit and let him know just how we all feel about that! (hes the HC at Ole Miss now!)
So we will see! All's i know is i am glad to have all these "problems" with all of these low round, undrafted players.
I cant wait to see the "Josh Bell should be the #2 Cb next year" threads!
Or the "Josh Barrett is our next great SS" thread!
How great are all these young guys!

[lex]

I also want Denver to draft another RB to split carries with him.
I think we should get someone with exceptional speed to compliment him.
I dont think he is as good as Larry Johnson, but I think he is comparable.
He can punish defenders and can move the pile like Larry Johnson.

But I wouldnt put too much stock into what Nutt thought of Hillis, I remember reading articles that Nutt had some less than complimentary things to say about Hillis. In fact I think he told some NFL scouts that Hillis would be no good. Plus I never said Hillis was as good or better than McFadden. But I dont see any McFaddens on our team. And I dont think you need elite talent at RBs to win now days, the Patriots won 3 rings with Antwan freaking Smith.


Didnt they win at least one of those SBs with Cory Dillon? Didnt Cory Dillon have like 1700 yards one of those years? Not only that but any references to NE, should take into consideration that NE made a habit out of cheating in those years. You know its true.

[tsiguy96]

We've had more backs produce over 6 qtrs than I have fingers, and I'm not disfigured in any way. I've watched this team for longer than most, and unlike some long enough to know that a few good games is nothing to base an opinion on.

Quentin Griffin was more productive over six qtrs than any back in Denver history. We know nothing about Hillis other than he was productive for less than 2 games.

are you serious? he had atleast 8 carries in every game starting with the cleveland game and overaged over 5.0ypc. less then 2 games? his best game is the one he got the most carries in, and he was destroying the chiefs until he got injured. im not sure why you keep saying less then 2 games.

[Florida_Bronco]

He seems to be a magnet for fluke injuries.

and not fragile lets see about that, Sat 4 games his sophomore year with an ankle sprain missed 7 games as a senior with a fractured toe, couldn't make it through camp with an elbow injury, hurt his knee after less than a half of actual game contribution.

Oh sweet jesus, let's get real here. An ankle sprain? Are you serious? His other two injuries were broken bones. And he contributed more than a half a game. Remember he was active and playing the whole Miami game.

sorry to say this, but i don't expect to see MR GLASS carry again for us. he will probably get into camp, but he also probably get injured before the preseason, only this time he won't get a roster spot to waist while he recovers. This is just nonsense.

[Broncos24]

Hillis and Quick 6 will make an interesting Matchup problem. Both can split out of the Back field and catch. Either can stay in as a single back. Or keep both in for the Combo of a gut run with a toss fake and vice versa.

I love this idea. This will keep the defense honest.

[tsiguy96]

hillis and aldridge: the real smash and dash

[Popps]

Larry Johnson!?!?
Hey i am all for Hillis playing RB as much as the next guy, but i think comparing him to LJ is a bit premature.

He's not like LJ, that's accurate.


I think he could ba an Alstott,

Comparing him to Mike Alstott is not accurate. In fact, it's wildly inaccurate.
Alstott was big, slow, plodding and could run over people and nothing else. He never had 3 20 yard runs in one game. Hillis did it in less than three weeks as a starter.

Again, if you've watched both play... you should have plenty of information, and shouldn't be comparing the two simply because they both played fullback at one time or another.


If he is so much like LJ, then why didnt coach Nutt at ARK have him as the primary RB over Mcfadden and Jones?

First off, he's not like LJ in a pure sense. I'm not sure why the comparison was made outside of both being bigger backs.

As for why he didn't get playing time in college as a RB... you said it yourself. They had other guys in place of him who were working out. That said, plenty of top college RBs have failed in the NFL... and plenty of back-ups have flourished in the NFL.

Again, what he did in college, high school and pop-warner are irrelevant.

What I care about is what he can do in our system, and the answer is... rip off 4-6 yards on first and second down, and bust off multiple 20 yard runs in a game... many of which include running around and over people.

Shanahan saw it, and that's why the kid's going to get a shot at RB next year. Will we draft-sign someone? Sure, probably so. That doesn't mean Hillis won't be a major part of the equation.

[Br0nc0Buster]

Didnt they win at least one of those SBs with Cory Dillon? Didnt Cory Dillon have like 1700 yards one of those years? Not only that but any references to NE, should take into consideration that NE made a habit out of cheating in those years. You know its true.

Ok lets look at the defending SB Champs.
Brandon Jacobs, Derrick Ward, and Ahman Bradshaw.
None of those guys were first day draft picks.

I am not downplaying the running game, I think it is very important.
But I think now days the league has become a passing league, and running backs are a dime a dozen.
Guys like Peterson, or LT are rare and are worth high draft picks.

But you can get a good runningback every single year in the draft, whereas you cannot get a Ryan Clady, or a Jay Cutler every year.

And then you add in how productive Hillis has been, and I just think blowing high picks on RBs would not be the best use of our draft picks considering how many glaring holes this defense has.
We need someone to share carries with Hillis, not to replace him.

[Popps]

Quentin Griffin was more productive over six qtrs than any back in Denver history. We know nothing about Hillis other than he was productive for less than 2 games.

You've already been corrected about him only playing well in two games.

Beyond that, if your entire argument is that he might not pan out because some other back in our history didn't... great. That's an air-tight case.

[Popps]

Ok lets look at the defending SB Champs.
Brandon Jacobs, Derrick Ward, and Ahman Bradshaw.
None of those guys were first day draft picks..

Go beyond that...

NY Giants - Multiple backs... a bruising runner and some complimentary runners.

Colts - Addai - Certainly no Walter Payton.

Steelers - Multiple backs... including big bruiser.

Patriots - Multiple backs, no mega-star at RB.

Patriots - Multiple backs, no mega-star at RB.

Tampa - Multiple backs, including one bruiser.


Looks to me like you have to go back to the Ravens and Rams to find a clear-cut "feature" back that the team leaned on almost primarily, and Faulk was obviously a multi-talented back.

The new way of the NFL seems to be multiple backs. Hillis fits that mold perfectly. Again, if we land some kind of superstar RB, I'm all for giving him the rock 30 times a game. Until then, we've found an excellent 1st down back and need to use him accordingly.

[BroncoMan4ever]

He IS your power-back, as well as a good cut-back runner, and yea... he's dynamic. You're making a great case to keep him there and giving him 20-25 carries... intentionally or not.

Again, I think you're confusing the fact that he can do some other things with the notion that he needs to do those other things.

Terrell Davis was a great special teams player. He also had fantastic hands.
However, we never used him on STs and he didn't catch a lot of passes as his career progressed.

Hillis is obviously no TD, but he's highly effective at running the ball on 1st and 2nd downs. That's light-years more crucial to a coach than a guy who can run a circle route from the FB position, though he very well may do that as well.

Mike Shanahan needs a back to put in in 2nd and 5 on a regular basis. He hasn't had one in years. He found one in Hillis and that's why Shanahan said himself that he'll get a shot at RB, not in some sort of novelty role.

on the TD point you make. He was an awesome ST player, and had good hands as evidenced by the fact that his first 3 years in the league he averaged around 40 catches a season. But unlike Hillis, those talents were nowhere near the talent he had running the ball. TD was good on ST and good at receiving, but he was GREAT running the ball. Hillis is good running the ball, but could be GREAT receiving the ball.

and i get what you mean completely, by saying he could be a good RB for us. i am simply saying all his talents are more valuable if he isn't used primarily as a RB.
if next season we don't draft a workhorse RB like Shonn Greene, and we went into next season with our current stable of RB's, Hillis is the guy i want getting 20+ carries a game.
I know he could do it and do it well, but i see him being an X-Factor player for us. a guy that causes mismatches all over the field.

Shanahan will be working this offseason on a package of plays specifically designed to get Hillis the ball, in anyway possible be it running as a RB, FB Dives, screens, passes out of the backfield, lining up at TE, WR, or in the slot. he has proven he could be an extremely valuable and dangerous weapon for us.
He can do almost everything you would want on offense, Power back, has good speed, can make the cut backs on runs, could be our workhorse. But in addition to those skills he would use to be a really good RB, he also has the size and strength to line up at TE, he can lead block, he has incredible hands for passes out of the backfield, he could line up at the slot and be a beast to try and tackle for smaller DB's.

The point i am continuing to try and get across is, he could be a really good RB, but he could be a great X-Factor for us.

[BroncoMan4ever]

Go beyond that...

NY Giants - Multiple backs... a bruising runner and some complimentary runners.

Colts - Addai - Certainly no Walter Payton.

Steelers - Multiple backs... including big bruiser.

Patriots - Multiple backs, no mega-star at RB.

Patriots - Multiple backs, no mega-star at RB.

Tampa - Multiple backs, including one bruiser.


Looks to me like you have to go back to the Ravens and Rams to find a clear-cut "feature" back that the team leaned on almost primarily, and Faulk was obviously a multi-talented back.

The new way of the NFL seems to be multiple backs. Hillis fits that mold perfectly. Again, if we land some kind of superstar RB, I'm all for giving him the rock 30 times a game. Until then, we've found an excellent 1st down back and need to use him accordingly.

look at what you also posted about the teams who recently won Super Bowls. they all had really good defenses, or in the case of Indy their defense got really hot right at the end of the season.

the point is, while they do all have multiple RB's who get carries every sunday they all had defenses that carried the load.

point being those teams are slightly more defensive minded(not INDY) unlike us. We are an offensive team, and we need as many playmakers we can get, so our offense can carry our D.

Hillis is a better playmaker at RB than anyone currently on the roster, but he isn't better than a guy like Shonn Greene. If we could get a good RB like Greene, compliment him with speed backs like Alridge or someone like Young 5-10 times a game, and use Hillis as an X-Factor like a version of Chris Cooley that can also run the ball, we have 2 really good playmakers and a complimentary weapon in the backfield instead of just Hillis.

[Dedhed]

are you serious? he had atleast 8 carries in every game starting with the cleveland game and overaged over 5.0ypc. less then 2 games? his best game is the one he got the most carries in, and he was destroying the chiefs until he got injured. im not sure why you keep saying less then 2 games.

Is that 8 whole carries?

All told he was a running back for 16 qtrs. and in that he had one very good game. 5 of those qtrs came against two of the worst teams in football. In only 1 game where he played 4 qtrs did he average over 5.0 ypc. You seem to have discarded the Oakland game as a part of Hillis's resume, where he was uninspiring and averaged 4.3 ypc in an unspeakably bad loss.

We have zero insight into Hillis as a starter when defenses start game planning for him; zero. His success against the Jets probably had as much to do with the Jets thinking that the Broncos weren't even going to attempt to run the ball, and being 100% focused on Cutler.

Any way you slice it, there is way too little evidence to assume that Hillis is a legitimate answer at RB.

[Dedhed]

You've already been corrected about him only playing well in two games.

Beyond that, if your entire argument is that he might not pan out because some other back in our history didn't... great. That's an air-tight case.

Compared to the argument that because he had one great game as a starter he's the next John Riggins that you're espousing. That's your entire argument, but the above is only a fraction of mine.

My real argument is this (you'd know this already if you read btw):
Hillis as FB/TE/HB/RB>>>Hillis as RB.
Broncos offense with Hillis and legit RB in the backfield>>>Broncos O with Hillis alone in the backfield.

[snowspot66]

Just give Hillis the damn ball.

[db56]

Seems to me we have a problem figuring out who the go to guys are going to be next year and what a great problem to have. Not to mention that this is before the draft, when a few more talented runners can be added.

IMO, Hillis more than proved himself and was getting better every game as far as vision and reading the holes. What we were witnessing was just the beginning and hopefully next year will continue.

Torrain, I believe will be back in camp next year and a will compete for carries and the starting job. I dont believe that he is injury prone, I believe that its just bad luck but, he will have to learn to get small and take the punishment with his shoulders and not allow himself to get twisted around and tackled awkwardly.

The Alridge kid looked great in preseason and should be back next year and competing in camp, but because of his size, I just dont see him ever being a 25 carry a game guy and thats unfortunate because the guy looks good.

I seem to be alone on this but I like Andre Hall, He has shown flashes of the ability to be an every down back and to break tackles. The problem is though, when he got his shot this season, he kept fumbling the ball and just didnt seem ready to roll for some reason, something just seemed off.

ATTACK!

[Rock Chalk]

A history of injury issues? Where are you getting your information from Alec? The only injuries that I am finding are a sprained ankle (big whoop) in JuCo and then his fractured toe last year. That's hardly "injury issues" even for the OrangeMane.

And Alec, if you don't think his ACL injury was freak, I don't know what to tell you. Not too worried about his recovery either, as with modern medicine players usually come back from ACL's without issue.

Sorry, I'm in the middle of a move and dont have $1000 to risk.

But I tell ya what, come up with some reasonable terms and I'll take your bet.
ACL injuries are not freak injuries. The occur more than 5 times a year in the NFL, thats not freak, thats one of the most common major injuries.

Fractured his toe, and a sprained ankle and fractured elbow and a torn ACL...in two years. 4 injuries in two years. Three of which cost him significant playing time.

I dont gamble, that's my excuse. I never have and never will. You use the move, that's a decent enough excuse but its just best to say you are a pussy and dont gamble like me.

Ryan Torain is a bust, get over the kid.

[tsiguy96]

Is that 8 whole carries?

All told he was a running back for 16 qtrs. and in that he had one very good game. 5 of those qtrs came against two of the worst teams in football. In only 1 game where he played 4 qtrs did he average over 5.0 ypc. You seem to have discarded the Oakland game as a part of Hillis's resume, where he was uninspiring and averaged 4.3 ypc in an unspeakably bad loss.

We have zero insight into Hillis as a starter when defenses start game planning for him; zero. His success against the Jets probably had as much to do with the Jets thinking that the Broncos weren't even going to attempt to run the ball, and being 100% focused on Cutler.

Any way you slice it, there is way too little evidence to assume that Hillis is a legitimate answer at RB.

you know, besides actually watching him play and watching him plow over 2-3 defenders per carry for 8 yards damn near every carry he had. besides that, 0 evidence.

[tsiguy96]

besides now this whole argument is pointless. hillis will enter training camp as a RB, not FB, and shanahan is good at one thing its picking the best RB to play. if hillis is the best, he will play, if no one really stands out he will split carries but likely be listed as a fullback on the roster.

[lex]

Ok lets look at the defending SB Champs.
Brandon Jacobs, Derrick Ward, and Ahman Bradshaw.
None of those guys were first day draft picks.

I am not downplaying the running game, I think it is very important.
But I think now days the league has become a passing league, and running backs are a dime a dozen.
Guys like Peterson, or LT are rare and are worth high draft picks.

But you can get a good runningback every single year in the draft, whereas you cannot get a Ryan Clady, or a Jay Cutler every year.

And then you add in how productive Hillis has been, and I just think blowing high picks on RBs would not be the best use of our draft picks considering how many glaring holes this defense has.
We need someone to share carries with Hillis, not to replace him.


Theres a problem with your theory. All the teams you want to refer to in making a case for drafting defense, have far better DCs than what Denver has. Meanhwhile, not a lot of teams have coaches with the offensive acumen of Shanahan. So the idea of utility comes into play. If we can make much better use of a RB with a high pick, you could easily make a case for that than using every pick on defensive players who are going to be underutilized because our DC sucks.

[lex]

besides now this whole argument is pointless. hillis will enter training camp as a RB, not FB, and shanahan is good at one thing its picking the best RB to play. if hillis is the best, he will play, if no one really stands out he will split carries but likely be listed as a fullback on the roster.

Which explains why it took so long for Hillis to see time at RB.

[tsiguy96]

Which explains why it took so long for Hillis to see time at RB.

no, it took so long because he was drafted, and played, as fullback, not as running back. he didnt shine until he got carries at RB, which is obvious as shanahan is keeping him at RB next year.

[Br0nc0Buster]

Theres a problem with your theory. All the teams you want to refer to in making a case for drafting defense, have far better DCs than what Denver has. Meanhwhile, not a lot of teams have coaches with the offensive acumen of Shanahan. So the idea of utility comes into play. If we can make much better use of a RB with a high pick, you could easily make a case for that than using every pick on defensive players who are going to be underutilized because our DC sucks.

Or you could say Shanahan can do more with less, and Slowick needs better talent to produce similar results than previous SB defenses.

If Slowick is going to stay at DC, then he needs the players to make plays for him since he cant come up with good schemes.
So I think it is all the more important that we get the talent to overcome his defficiencies.
With the exception of the Dline, I am not so sure we are underutilizing our players on defense though.
I just think Slowick cant come up with good schemes, so he cant overcome bad players.
I am not sure about the Dline though, they do some things that dont make sense to me.

[lex]

Or you could say Shanahan can do more with less, and Slowick needs better talent to produce similar results than previous SB defenses.

If Slowick is going to stay at DC, then he needs the players to make plays for him since he cant come up with good schemes.
So I think it is all the more important that we get the talent to overcome his defficiencies.
With the exception of the Dline, I am not so sure we are underutilizing our players on defense though.
I just think Slowick cant come up with good schemes, so he cant overcome bad players.
I am not sure about the Dline though, they do some things that dont make sense to me.

No. If theres uncertainty about a first round draft pick being as productive as he should because of a bad DC, then its better not to waste the money and get someone who has a better chance of contributing. And then go defense to minimize risk.

[lex]

no, it took so long because he was drafted, and played, as fullback, not as running back. he didnt shine until he got carries at RB, which is obvious as shanahan is keeping him at RB next year.


Sorry, but if Shanahan knew Hillis could run like that, I really question that it would have taken him so long to see the field. Hillis wasnt even starting at FB in several games either.

[Br0nc0Buster]

No. If theres uncertainty about a first round draft pick being as productive as he should because of a bad DC, then its better not to waste the money and get someone who has a better chance of contributing. And then go defense to minimize risk.

That sounds like drafting scared.
Slowick's excuse is that he does not have a lot to work with, and that year 2 is generally when players really understand what they are doing and where they are supposed to be.
We should fix our holes on defense, and if Slowick still cant get good results with elite talent, then we fire him and bring in someone else.

[tsiguy96]

Sorry, but if Shanahan knew Hillis could run like that, I really question that it would have taken him so long to see the field. Hillis wasnt even starting at FB in several games either.

you truly are an idiot, its quite amazing. we have a guy getting 5.0+ ypc, constantly not 2 3 1 0 25 yards, and you morons want to replace him. why, to find someone better? it doesnt get better for our single back 3 WR system. you yourself are admitting that he ran good by saying "if Shanahan knew Hillis could run like that" so why cahnge it? it doesnt make any sense.

[Florida_Bronco]

ACL injuries are not freak injuries. The occur more than 5 times a year in the NFL, thats not freak, thats one of the most common major injuries.

Fractured his toe, and a sprained ankle and fractured elbow and a torn ACL...in two years. 4 injuries in two years. Three of which cost him significant playing time.

I dont gamble, that's my excuse. I never have and never will. You use the move, that's a decent enough excuse but its just best to say you are a p***Y and dont gamble like me.

Ryan Torain is a bust, get over the kid.

Ahhh, I see we are dealing with the Asshat version of Alec today. My mistake for thinking you'd remove your head from your ass long enough to put out a decent take.

[lex]

you truly are an idiot, its quite amazing. we have a guy getting 5.0+ ypc, constantly not 2 3 1 0 25 yards, and you morons want to replace him. why, to find someone better? it doesnt get better for our single back 3 WR system. you yourself are admitting that he ran good by saying "if Shanahan knew Hillis could run like that" so why cahnge it? it doesnt make any sense.

Wow. Where did I say I want to replace Hillis? Youre a fool. All I did was challenge your statement that Shanahan picks the best guy.

[tsiguy96]

Wow. Where did I say I want to replace Hillis? Youre a fool. All I did was challenge your statement that Shanahan picks the best guy.

and like i said, hillis was drafted and played all through training camp as a FB. he did not get normal running reps ( i think 3 in week one and no more after)

not until shanny was forced to start him did hillis start to shine as a RB.

[lex]

That sounds like drafting scared.
Slowick's excuse is that he does not have a lot to work with, and that year 2 is generally when players really understand what they are doing and where they are supposed to be.
We should fix our holes on defense, and if Slowick still cant get good results with elite talent, then we fire him and bring in someone else.

This is year 2 for Slowik. He had his chance (not just in Denver) and he sucks. Time is too precious to waste seasons on guys like this.

[footstepsfrom#27]

Here's what I don't understand about this debate. Why do people think we can't run the ball with a fullback in this offense? ??? From what I can see, this kid has the skills in this offense to be a pro bowl fullback. He does not have those skills as a tailback, though I believe he could still gain 1200 yards in this system.

There is zero reason that Hillis, who has ALL the skills you're looking for in a top notch fullback in a WCO like Denver runs, cannot ALSO run the ball from that spot. As a tailback he lacks only the big time speed to go the distance. His 40 times are reported at around 4.55-4.58 which is still fast enough to play for this kind of offense but why not let this guy play where he can shine even more than he would at tailback AND also carry the ball. A stud runner playing FB who can grind out better than 4.5 ypc, catch the ball with excellent hands and run over people ought to get 15 carries a game plus catch 3-5 safety valve passes. At his present pace that would put him over 100 yards of total offense per game as a fullback. Nobody in the league has that. This would also take a little pressure off whoever starts at RB and keep defenses from keying on one guy only. If we have a true franchise quality starting RB who can handle the ball 20-25 times a game that's 35-40 carries split between them and a few left for somebody like Allrige. This offense ought to be able to dominate through the air in a HUGE way if we have two quality runners pounding the ball.

Another reason for wishing Hillis at fullback is so we can move Larsen to MLB where he belongs. Maybe he's a nice lead blocker but I don't see him catching passes or running the ball for us so why use him there when we have a guy this tough and versitile who can do the job much better? I agree with the idea that Hillis could also move around as a TE or H-back, which also puts pressure on the defense to figure that out too. Tampa played for years with Alstott in a 2 back role where both runners got their carries. There's no reason we can't do the same thing.

[watermock]

Hillis is gone for the year, it's time for some Cooked Crack!

[footstepsfrom#27]

Hillis is gone for the year, it's time for some Cooked Crack!
What was your excuse last time? :giggle:

[MplsBronco]

Get used to it. That's exactly what's going to happen. Hillis will play the same role Mike Anderson played for this team: Fullback who gets carries.

And for what it's worth, it's not a shabby role to play.

You've had some real ****ty takes over the years (Griese) so I imagine this will be added to the list. Glad to see Hillis doesn't have your support because I think he is the man and gives this team a toughness it lacks. Hillis' injury was a freak one and I think he will prove to be durable and tote the rock 30 times a game, ala TD. Also, the guy showed great ball security, no worries about him fumbling. Oh yeah, did you not see the sweep play in the KC game that went for a TD? The guy can do it all. Period.

[tsiguy96]

and quit talking about his 40 times, thats why a TON of great players in teh NFL get overlooked in the draft. 40 yard dash times dont mean anything on the field, with pads and a football in your hand.

[Inkana7]

He'll become a weapon that defenses have to gameplan for. Whether that be at HB, FB, or H-Back. He'll contribute and we'll win a hell of a lot of games.

[footstepsfrom#27]

You've had some real ****ty takes over the years (Griese) so I imagine this will be added to the list. Glad to see Hillis doesn't have your support because I think he is the man and gives this team a toughness it lacks. Hillis' injury was a freak one and I think he will prove to be durable and tote the rock 30 times a game, ala TD. Also, the guy showed great ball security, no worries about him fumbling. Oh yeah, did you not see the sweep play in the KC game that went for a TD? The guy can do it all. Period.
That's exactly why he should play fullback. Ever see Roger Craig? That's who I think Hillis can be.

[Inkana7]

Why not put the Split Back formation back into the playbook? Run it both ways, give us a lot of West Coast options. Bill Walsh loved split backs and used it well.

[Schism]

He should get 10-15 carries from RB a game, and be the starting RB.

Use lots of 3 WR and 2 TE sets, allows us to get Scheffler and Graham on the field at the same time a lot more.

By all means move him around a bit, we need another quality back to split carries with him to do this, and take advantage of how versatile he is. But anyone who thinks this guy shouldn't be carrying the ball as a RB at least 10 times a game is insane, quite frankly.

[tsiguy96]

He should get 10-15 carries from RB a game, and be the starting RB.

Use lots of 3 WR and 2 TE sets, allows us to get Scheffler and Graham on the field a lot more.

By all means move him around a bit, we need another quality back to split carries with him to do this, and take advantage of how versatile he is. But anyone who thinks this guy shouldn't be carrying the ball as a RB at least 10 times a game is insane, quite frankly.

werd :D

this is of course considering we find someone who can handle 20 other carries a game, which i think will be pretty difficult to do so consistently. if hillis got 20 carries a game and another guy like aldridge got 10, it would be pretty sick...

[HooptyHoops]

Hillis is the real deal for this offense....and I would LOVE if Boyd gets the start today that he DOMINATES and that we all really debate this after the win today...I really hope that Boyd shows a spark today!!

[footstepsfrom#27]

NFL defenses are not used to seeing fullbacks that are major offensive weapons. Mostly these guys have been reduced to miniture guards who can snag a pass now and then. But there's absolutely no reason they need to be. Jim Brown led the NFL in rusing as a fullback. Roger Craig rolled up 13,000 yards worth of total offense for the Niners in this offense. Larry Centers caught 827 passes for the Cardinals. In fact, you could make an argument that it's much tougher to find a great versitile fullback capable of rushing for 100 yards in a game or clearing a linebacker on the goal line than it is to find a tailback who can gain 1500 yards. How many truly great weapons play this position in the NFL? We appear to have one and he's PERFECT for this offense. Two backs splitting carries like that could both go over 1000 yards in this offense. We ALWAYS manage to find a tailback who can crank out yardage...when's the last time we had a really outstanding FB who was a major weapon in his own right? I don't think we've ever had one this multi-talented so why not use him to maximum advantage?

[Popps]

Hey, good call Dedhed... our offense "won't miss a beat" without Hillis.

http://happyvalleynews.files.wordpress.com/2008/04/great-job.jpg

[lazarus4444]

We really missed Hillis bad today. In fact, it was pretty pathetic.

[Popps]

We really missed Hillis bad today. In fact, it was pretty pathetic.

What?

Looks to me like we "didn't miss a beat."

I mean, I haven't checked Tatum's YPC but it was probably about as good as Hillis, which ALWAYS means that the two backs have equal value to the offense.

[tsiguy96]

it was very, very sad. there was ZERO threat to run the ball, and as such we couldnt pass for **** because no one was open. they blitzed hard and early, and it threw cutler off his game.

[ludo21]

bump!

Boyd is back!

[go_broncos]

it was very, very sad. there was ZERO threat to run the ball, and as such we couldnt pass for **** because no one was open. they blitzed hard and early, and it threw cutler off his game.

with no running game can we win against Buffalo?

I am nervous.

[Lomax]

Chances are relatively slim that Hillis becomes the every down back regardless of what happens in the next few weeks. I think he fills the role as a power runner/FB tweener but we will look to fill the void at HB until Torain gets better or a star emerges. I wouldn't be surprised to see us grab a RB on the first day of the draft purely as an insurance policy if Torain doesn't work out.

More than anything, this season has stressed the importance of a workhorse running back. After the troubles this season, it would be insane not to move and grab some new blood to line up in the backfield.

[Inkana7]

After watching our running game last week, I'm convince Hillis is what we need at RB. He's a Horse.

[DBroncos4life]

We need a starting RB so bad. Is McGahee going to be cut? 10 bucks says we draft Lucky in the 6th round. ;D

[footstepsfrom#27]

bump!

Boyd is back!
On the roster or like cooked crack?

[Popps]

After watching our running game last week, I'm convince Hillis is what we need at RB. He's a Horse.

Yep. Been saying it for weeks, despite being told around here that our offense is just as effective with Selvin Young. Of course, we saw Selvin go down like he'd been shot Sunday when a defender got within a 3' radius of him. (Remember the air-shoe-tackle?)

Hopefully Hillis returns to full health. If not, we need a 1st down ass-kicker like him to feed the ball. I'm tired of these smallish, scrub "feature" backs we keep swapping out. Give the ball to Hillis (or a Hillis clone) 15 times a game and give 10-12 carries to a speed back. Our offense will tear teams apart.

[footstepsfrom#27]

Chances are relatively slim that Hillis becomes the every down back regardless of what happens in the next few weeks. I think he fills the role as a power runner/FB tweener but we will look to fill the void at HB until Torain gets better or a star emerges. I wouldn't be surprised to see us grab a RB on the first day of the draft purely as an insurance policy if Torain doesn't work out.
How does the word "tweener" describe a 250 pound runner? Why is it so difficult to get people on this board to grasp the concept that fullbacks can carry the ball? Jim Brown was a fullback. He might have been the best ball carrier in NFL history. Hillis is not a tweener he's a FULLBACK who can run the ball for 100 yards a game if given the chance. He has OTHER talents as well and should be used to mazimize all of them.

[montrose]

After watching our running game last week, I'm convince Hillis is what we need at RB. He's a Horse.

How does the word "tweener" describe a 250 pound runner? Why is it so difficult to get people on this board to grasp the concept that fullbacks can carry the ball? Jim Brown was a fullback. He might have been the best ball carrier in NFL history. Hillis is not a tweener he's a FULLBACK who can run the ball for 100 yards a game if given the chance. He has OTHER talents as well and should be used to maximize all of them.

I highly doubt we'll see Hillis back at the FB spot again. Shanahan doesn't value the position that much and in his limited action, Hillis showed his talents were more than (in Shanahan's own words) just a FB. Now I'd like to see Hillis used at FB/H-Back because of his receiving skills and at RB because of his power and burst but I doubt that's what we'll see.

I think the reality is that - especially with us running out of more 2 TE and 3 WR sets than I can remember - we'll see a combination of the Class of '08 Backs. That meaning, I expect Hillis and Torain to be our primary ball carriers next season with Alridge being our Darren Sprolles-type change of pace guy. I'd expect Shanahan to put Larsen back at FB since he'll be active for special teams anyway and we're not using the position that much anymore. Because of the lack of FB usage, Hillis' flexibility to play both positions, and our injury woes this year, we'll probably keep at least one more of the Young/Hall/Bell/Pope group which I'd expect to be Young.

With that, I think (and hope) we're moving to more of a power run game with speed mixed in. As much as I love Hillis' ability to catch passes - I think he and Torain could punish the hell out of defenses with Alridge catching them off guard using his speed. And remember, we've shown to be more of a passing team with Cutler this year anyhow - if we can get back to achieving a 50/50 balance with Hillis and Torain wearing down defenses while Cutler uses the playaction game to eliminate some mistakes - I think our offense will be in great shape.

[HooptyHoops]

I highly doubt we'll see Hillis back at the FB spot again. Shanahan doesn't value the position that much and in his limited action, Hillis showed his talents were more than (in Shanahan's own words) just a FB. Now I'd like to see Hillis used at FB/H-Back because of his receiving skills and at RB because of his power and burst but I doubt that's what we'll see.

I think the reality is that - especially with us running out of more 2 TE and 3 WR sets than I can remember - we'll see a combination of the Class of '08 Backs. That meaning, I expect Hillis and Torain to be our primary ball carriers next season with Alridge being our Darren Sprolles-type change of pace guy. I'd expect Shanahan to put Larsen back at FB since he'll be active for special teams anyway and we're not using the position that much anymore. Because of the lack of FB usage, Hillis' flexibility to play both positions, and our injury woes this year, we'll probably keep at least one more of the Young/Hall/Bell/Pope group which I'd expect to be Young.

With that, I think (and hope) we're moving to more of a power run game with speed mixed in. As much as I love Hillis' ability to catch passes - I think he and Torain could punish the hell out of defenses with Alridge catching them off guard using his speed. And remember, we've shown to be more of a passing team with Cutler this year anyhow - if we can get back to achieving a 50/50 balance with Hillis and Torain wearing down defenses while Cutler uses the playaction game to eliminate some mistakes - I think our offense will be in great shape.

I would love if we could get Torain, Hillis and Alridge back and healthy...that would be a thing of beauty!!:wiggle:

[19Morton77]

He valued FB position when we had a guy named Howard Griffith back there. Hillis has proven he can do everything. If someone is better at Half back then him, play them. I am not afraid to win based on Hillis being the HB but I love the concept of having a tandem back there like the days of 97 and 98. Hillis has shown he can do everything and his injury was on a crazy, athletic catch. Popps loves him to be the next TD, but I think the tandem would work and Shanny can get those old Griffith plays back to the playbook. It worked once.....

[Inkana7]

He valued FB position when we had a guy named Howard Griffith back there. Hillis has proven he can do everything. If someone is better at Half back then him, play them. I am not afraid to win based on Hillis being the HB but I love the concept of having a tandem back there like the days of 97 and 98. Hillis has shown he can do everything and his injury was on a crazy, athletic catch. Popps loves him to be the next TD, but I think the tandem would work and Shanny can get those old Griffith plays back to the playbook. It worked once.....

In 97 Griffith had a whopping 9 carries and 11 catches. In 98 he had 4 carries and 15 catches...

[Popps]

He valued FB position when we had a guy named Howard Griffith back there. .

Dude, someone already corrected you here, so I won't beat it to death... but Hillis is NOTHING like Griffith and Griffith was NOTHING like Hillis.

The fact that they both were/are (could be) fullbacks may confuse people. But, it shouldn't.

As for me wanting Hillis to "be the next TD," I have no idea where you get that garbage. I said Hillis needs 15 or so carries per game, minimum... particularly on 1st down. I've also said we'd do well to have a back to compliment his skill-set.

I've also made it clear that if we someone bump into the next Walter Patyon, I'm obviously thrilled to start him over ANYONE. Until then, Hillis represented the best 1st down RB this team has had in a long time.

Hence, Shanahan has stated he'll resume him in that role when he returns.

[montrose]

He valued FB position when we had a guy named Howard Griffith back there. Hillis has proven he can do everything. If someone is better at Half back then him, play them. I am not afraid to win based on Hillis being the HB but I love the concept of having a tandem back there like the days of 97 and 98. Hillis has shown he can do everything and his injury was on a crazy, athletic catch. Popps loves him to be the next TD, but I think the tandem would work and Shanny can get those old Griffith plays back to the playbook. It worked once.....

Griffith caught a few passes out of the backfield but in general was regarded for his blocking. Now while Hillis' blocking was certainly above what we had for the last few years - it was no where near the level of Howard Griffith's. What Hillis brings to the FB spot is the ability to catch passes out of the backfield which was used in one game - the Miami game. With Stokley in the slot and Scheffler as the #2 TE - I find it unlikely we'd be using a ton of passes to the FB every week. There were several times this year when Hillis was open for big plays but Jay went elsewhere, it's just not a big part of our offense. With that, I personally believe it could be and my hope would be that Hillis would spend some time at both positions - especially since we don't use the FB as much as we used to. However, Shanny's comments and Hillis' success leads me to believe he'll be our primary ball carrier heading into next season, backed up by Torain with Alridge as the change-of-pace man. Hillis could slide to the FB spot when Torain comes into the game (my hope as Hillis looked great from singleback sets) but I imagine when we use a FB we'll probably be looking at Larsen.

[Br0nc0Buster]

I still want us to add another RB via the draft.
Take a mid round flyer on someone with serious speed to help out Torain and Hillis.
I am just not sure about Alridge yet.
Oh and Hillis can still catch balls and do other things besides run the ball, its just with his production it would benefit him and the team to let him run as well.

[19Morton77]

Dude, someone already corrected you here, so I won't beat it to death... but Hillis is NOTHING like Griffith and Griffith was NOTHING like Hillis.

The fact that they both were/are (could be) fullbacks may confuse people. But, it shouldn't.

As for me wanting Hillis to "be the next TD," I have no idea where you get that garbage. I said Hillis needs 15 or so carries per game, minimum... particularly on 1st down. I've also said we'd do well to have a back to compliment his skill-set.

I've also made it clear that if we someone bump into the next Walter Patyon, I'm obviously thrilled to start him over ANYONE. Until then, Hillis represented the best 1st down RB this team has had in a long time.

Hence, Shanahan has stated he'll resume him in that role when he returns.

I never said that you want him to be the next TD. Maybe I give him too much credit to block or gave HG more reps than I remember. Maybe it is remembering the play that HG goes out of the back to catch the pass in the superbowl. All I know and want is that he should be somewhere in the game either at FB or HB but i like the system that can be in place if we have a two back set. If he can block, run, catch or whatever, then use him accordingly. What the hell is wrong with that?

[broncosteven]

I still want us to add another RB via the draft.
Take a mid round flyer on someone with serious speed to help out Torain and Hillis.
I am just not sure about Alridge yet.
Oh and Hillis can still catch balls and do other things besides run the ball, its just with his production it would benefit him and the team to let him run as well.

Like Popps I am tired of the RB garbage they have been bringing in here every year.

I know we need to address Safety and MLB positions but I would not be upset if Shanny went RB in the 1st or 2nd.

If we extend a few more drives we have a better shot vs teams like Carolina.

I miss the days we could close out a close game on O by feeding the ball to a RB.

[PRBronco]

Like Popps I am tired of the RB garbage they have been bringing in here every year.

I know we need to address Safety and MLB positions but I would not be upset if Shanny went RB in the 1st or 2nd.

If we extend a few more drives we have a better shot vs teams like Carolina.

I miss the days we could close out a close game on O by feeding the ball to a RB.

We had that for a few weeks with Hillis! But alas, it was just a taste, like a summer fling at the country club, before she leaves back to her high class life, and you're left a lowly dance instructor.

[tsiguy96]

We had that for a few weeks with Hillis! But alas, it was just a taste, like a summer fling at the country club, before she leaves back to her high class life, and you're left a lowly dance instructor.

yepppp

we would have done better against carolina with the power running game we saw for 3 games. maybe not win but would have fared better. hillis opens up teh passing game so much its sick. cover eddie royal and brandon marshall or stop hillis? either way, youre getting burned somehow.