The problem with the Bronco defense is.......

[Atlas]

???

[Rock Chalk]

Coaching, specifically on the defensive line.

[RhymesayersDU]

That 9 of them suck.

[Rock Chalk]

Didn't you get a perma ban?

[Atlas]

I say that is is the DEs. The DTs actually seem to be holding their own during the game. The DE are getting pushed inside and outside every play. They are not good at the point of attack and they aren't good at rushing the QB. I was hoping Moss and especially Crowder would develop this year but they have hardly been on the field.

Even more so than Safety I think DE is the biggest weakness and getting big studs there should be the top priority even if Denver has to use their first two picks next year on that position they need to do it.

[Rock Chalk]

DEs plus LBs + Safeties.

Replace all of them and the D-line coach and we are in good shape in 3 or 4 years.

[RhymesayersDU]

Didn't you get a perma ban?

Does it look like I did?

[Don Flamenco]

Our D line sucks and our linebackers suck

[RhymesayersDU]

Our D line sucks and our linebackers suck

DJ Williams does not. The rest do.

[cutthemdown]

Coaching, specifically on the defensive line.

Coaching is not the problem it's lack of talent.

[orinjkrush]

shanny can't pick a DC to save his life.

[Los Broncos]

Coaching and no heart.

[Florida_Bronco]

Didn't you get a perma ban?

Unfortunately it does not appear that way. Give it time though, d-bags like him usually seal their fate soon enough.

[lazarus4444]

Lacking most of all in heart, then talent then coaching.

[Ironlung]

They're soft. They play like they don't wanna break a nail, or in Dre Bly's case, doesn't want to get his jersey dirty.

[mr007]

I think it'd be a lot easier to say what's right with our defense. Champ and DJ.

[Ratboy]

Coaching is not the problem it's lack of talent.

Coaching is the main problem. We lack talent in a lot of areas, but our DC and Position Coaches are horrible.

[Ratboy]

I think it'd be a lot easier to say what's right with our defense. Champ and DJ.

I think it's safe to add in Marcus Thomas.

[HEAV]

Coaching is not the problem it's lack of talent.

Talent and consistant scheme/coaching. Too many D-cords, too many systems, not enough time for the players to get the system and learn how to play together.

Talent at safety, Middle Backer, DT, and End.

[gyldenlove]

So many things really.


On the coaching side:
Slowick is a good DB coach, but he is in over his head as a DC and he has no idea what to do with a group of defenders that leave a lot to be desired.

Our DL coach has consistently turned promising talents into disappointing players.

Our DB and LB coaches are not preparing their players to play the way Slowick wants them to play and because of that we end up with safeties not knowing where to line up and middle linebackers playing free safety.

On the player side:
Webster is clearly not fit to start in the NFL anymore, he gets out of position very easily and doesn't react fast enough to the run. He is a below average tackler and couldn't cover Brett Favre on a seam route.

I am just going to address our safeties as a group because they are so mediocre that naming them would be redundant, there is no hope for this group. Positioning is awful, more often than not they get caught running one way when the ball is going the other. Tackling is an issue as is covering skills and I have yet to see any of them make a play where you really thought, that guy knew exactly what was coming.

Engelberger shouldn't start in the NFL, and thankfully they realized that recently. He can't hold up against the run, although he does give a good effort and can make a lot of tackles after the runner gets through the hole he left when he got pushed out of the way. Dumervil is a guy who really only thrives when he gets moved around a lot and gets off the field for about half the plays, he needs to have his legs fresh so he can get around the corner. Thomas and Robertson have been okay, nothing flashy and nothing really awful, but they both come off the field in passing downs and they wear down as the game goes on. Moss finally played with a little spark against the Patriots and can hopefully bring a little pressure. Ekuban has been our best DL, which says a lot, he holds up pretty well against the run and can get some pressure against the pass. The above group however lacks two things, one is star power, we simply have no dominant player who can take the pressure off the rest of the guys, and two is staying power, they wear down over the game and as a result our defense gets walked on in the 4th quarter.

Dre Bly used to be a decent cover corner, he never tackled well and even though he has given the effort in a couple of games he is just too easy to knock off his game with a few runs to his side. To make matters worse the CBs have been asked to play 7-10 yards off the recievers which leads to a lot of completed underneath passes and with Bly and Paymahs poor tackling there is always the risk that a short pass turns long. Paymah has been consistently poor in his coverage and seems to be unable to use his size to his advantage.

Boss Bailey was not really bad, but he wasn't really good either. He was just sort of there.

Over all this defense has a couple of performers, a couple of servicable players and quite a few underperformers. Realisticly we probably have to accept that we need a MLB, a couple of safeties and at least one DL to go with the new CB we need to replace Bly. On the flip side Webster can hold Blys hand and they can both walk behind most of our defensive coaching staff as they all exit the city and head into the sunset where they so rightly belong.

[TDmvp]

http://saruhouse.com/images/ishibashi/marbles3.jpg

GOT NO MARBLES!!!

[want2bAbronco2]

New Coaching staff, 2 new DE, 1 DT, Mike, Sam, CB, FS, and SS should about cover it. Why we have 2 CB that are good at playing man and we have them play 7-10yds off EVERY F**king play is beyound stupid.

[theAPAOps5]

I would crash the server if I listed all of it. But like Mediator has been saying, while the DC has been a revolving door job there has been one constant. That would be the DL coach Burney has stayed in his job. Yet its the DL that has continuously sucked.

Its like that smelly fart in the room that everyone knows is there but won't open a window to get it out.

[listopencil]

DT, MLB, Safety.

[summerdenver]

I will take bait. There are 2 big issues that stand out to me -
i) Tackling. After seeing Titans/colts yesterday the contrast is startling. Colts are undersized like denver I don't think I have seen them miss tackle till CJ bust out for the TD late in the game. Denvers defense is not even the same country as these teams. Even if Ten DL were to play for den, things won't change a lot if tackling does not improve in the back 7.
ii) Not physical enough. There only 3 guys who are physical on this team. Nate Webster, Larsen and Marshall. Nate does not scare anyone because he is going the wrong way most of the time and Larsen plays on ST.

[Popps]

Unfortunately it does not appear that way. Give it time though, d-bags like him usually seal their fate soon enough.

Taco generally shows enough sack to boot someone like him permanently.
Why he's chosen not to in this case is beyond me. The guy has been posting fake news (including fake injury stories on our own players), going after people's families and just generally contributing nothing to the site for ages.

Maybe his post-count has Taco thinking twice, but it's a little surprising. The boy went on a tirade that finished with posting some of his gay-porn all over Taco's site, and a week later... he's back?

Again, fairly surprising for Taco, who generally takes these kinds of things seriously.

[Dedhed]

1 thing: Cohesion

With the constant changes there is no unity with the defensive unit. We haven't been able to draft to fit the scheme for 3 years because we haven't had the same scheme in back to back years.

We've played a different scheme every week, which even leaves the good players we have wondering where everybody is going to be. You can't develop trust like that, and the lack of trust shows on the field.

[lex]

Coaching. Beyond that, there is no way of knowing specifically what the problem is. The coaching is so bad that it obscures what our true needs are. The coaching makes guys look really bad.

[azbroncfan]

They suck. I'm don't want denver to keep swapping coordinators but Slowik and the rest of the D coaches have been horrible and at this point it wouldn't hurt the D any worse than it is. Talent is seriously lacking too so I personally believe that the it is an all around failure of coaching and talent.

[uplink]

I say change the defensive scheme and raise the tempo with blitzing, press coverage etc.

The 2 times Denver has been very successful under Shannahan have coincided with this type of defense (with Robinson in the Super Bowl years and Coyer when reaching the AFC title game).

Seems this style of defense compliments Shannahan's offense better.

[bpc]

There's no leadership from the front seven. None. DJ is a very good solo player but we are still looking to fill that void of vocal leadership and play that Al Wilson contributed for so long. There is nobody on this defense who will take those screwing up to task when things are going wrong. There is nobody on 4th and 1 who will jump out at you time and time again, defy the odds and make the play.

Coaching is a big part as well. We take our best player arguably on the team (Champ) and basically throw his coverage ability's away on the field. If you have the best CB in the game, we should be much better with our pass defense. Our sacks are up this year if I recall as well.

We gotta fix these issues if we are to improve.

[Atlas]

I say change the defensive scheme and raise the tempo with blitzing, press coverage etc.

The 2 times Denver has been very successful under Shannahan have coincided with this type of defense (with Robinson in the Super Bowl years and Coyer when reaching the AFC title game).

Seems this style of defense compliments Shannahan's offense better.

Not going to do that with Champ out.

[cutthemdown]

Coaching is the main problem. We lack talent in a lot of areas, but our DC and Position Coaches are horrible.

It's really hard as fans for us to say the coaching isn't good. For all we know players aren't doing what they are coached to do. Most of these coaches all run basically the same plays. You have to beat the guy in front of you and if you watch the Broncos defense player by player all you see is guys getting pushed around and over matched physically.

You can't coach a player to take the right angle, all you can do is put him in a decent position to make a play, not leave him 1-1 with a superior talent.

Broncos however even when in position get pushed around and can't make the play. That's not coaching.

The problem with the Broncos is all talent. The defense has 2 for sure starters on it in Champ and DJ. Robertson and Bly maybe. That leaves 7 players on defense who wouldn't be full time starters on most teams.

Doom would be a 3rd down pass rusher on any team with decent dend talent. Webster is a bkup nothing more.

Broncos are lacking a lot on defense. Webster and Doom would be fine if you stuck a stud MLB in there, and a stud dend on the other side. But realistically the Broncos need 2 starting safetys, a MLB, a SSL, Dend to become a good defense.

[yavoon]

you draft a corner and he sucks. so you get a new corner through free agency. he sucks too. at this point you might say "hey, we should evaluate how we select corners." but you also need another corner.

same with defensive coordinators. management needs to evaluate how we end up with these douches. but we still need another.

[Popps]

There's no leadership from the front seven. None. DJ is a very good solo player but we are still looking to fill that void of vocal leadership and play that Al Wilson contributed for so long. There is nobody on this defense who will take those screwing up to task when things are going wrong. There is nobody on 4th and 1 who will jump out at you time and time again, defy the odds and make the play.

Coaching is a big part as well. We take our best player arguably on the team (Champ) and basically throw his coverage ability's away on the field. If you have the best CB in the game, we should be much better with our pass defense. Our sacks are up this year if I recall as well.

We gotta fix these issues if we are to improve.


DJ is a nice player. He's not a guy you build a team around and like you said, certainly not a team leader. Bailey has basically said he's not a vocal guy. You're exactly right... Wilson was the last guy of that ilk we had. Lynch was certainly a leader, but also on the tail end of his career.

As I said in another thread... you can put together a list of guys we've passed on in the past couple of years that is pretty depressing. I don't just mean guys like Abraham, who we passed on and who's making a major impact for his team... but tons of second-tier and reasonably priced FA's and trade options we just choose to ignore for the likes of Sam Adams, Simeon Rice and practice squad players.

The problem remains at the top. This team has zero vision when it pertains to building a defense and has show very little commitment to the idea in general.

[rmsanger]

oy vey! Let's start the discussion with what is not wrong with this Defense or else it's going to be a very long thread.

Champ out/DJ marginalized and Elvis off to a slow start, I would say that nothing is right and everything is wrong.

I'm sure having John Lynch would have helped quite a bit in our run support and Foxy would have been great support for our Nickel package.

[WolfpackGuy]

How much time do you have?

[lex]

It's really hard as fans for us to say the coaching isn't good. For all we know players aren't doing what they are coached to do. Most of these coaches all run basically the same plays. You have to beat the guy in front of you and if you watch the Broncos defense player by player all you see is guys getting pushed around and over matched physically.

You can't coach a player to take the right angle, all you can do is put him in a decent position to make a play, not leave him 1-1 with a superior talent.

Broncos however even when in position get pushed around and can't make the play. That's not coaching.

The problem with the Broncos is all talent. The defense has 2 for sure starters on it in Champ and DJ. Robertson and Bly maybe. That leaves 7 players on defense who wouldn't be full time starters on most teams.

Doom would be a 3rd down pass rusher on any team with decent dend talent. Webster is a bkup nothing more.

Broncos are lacking a lot on defense. Webster and Doom would be fine if you stuck a stud MLB in there, and a stud dend on the other side. But realistically the Broncos need 2 starting safetys, a MLB, a SSL, Dend to become a good defense.

Slowik doesnt shceme pressure very well and part of his problem is the cushion he insists on. The coverage undermines attempts at getting pressure. Bly looks lost plaing zone. Its safe to say that a big part of it is coaching.

[dbfan21]

Coaching is not the problem it's lack of talent.

New England seems to have less-than-talented players on the defensive side of the ball, especially in the secondary. Yet their coaches are able to put them into position to make plays.

I wish our coaches could do that...

[Orange_Beard]

We are weak up the middle. MLB and safties.

[Mediator12]

It's really hard as fans for us to say the coaching isn't good. For all we know players aren't doing what they are coached to do. Most of these coaches all run basically the same plays. You have to beat the guy in front of you and if you watch the Broncos defense player by player all you see is guys getting pushed around and over matched physically.

You can't coach a player to take the right angle, all you can do is put him in a decent position to make a play, not leave him 1-1 with a superior talent.

Broncos however even when in position get pushed around and can't make the play. That's not coaching.

The problem with the Broncos is all talent. The defense has 2 for sure starters on it in Champ and DJ. Robertson and Bly maybe. That leaves 7 players on defense who wouldn't be full time starters on most teams.

Doom would be a 3rd down pass rusher on any team with decent dend talent. Webster is a bkup nothing more.

Broncos are lacking a lot on defense. Webster and Doom would be fine if you stuck a stud MLB in there, and a stud dend on the other side. But realistically the Broncos need 2 starting safetys, a MLB, a SSL, Dend to become a good defense.

No, its not hard to see if its coaching. Coaching is way more than what you are making it out to be. It starts with Film review and gameplanning. Film Review corrects previous mistakes in the future and Gamplanning allows players to be prepared for the next team and how they should be attacked. Neither of these are getting done in DEN, and the constant tweaking of the Fronts makes Film review corrections and situational adjustments from the previous week practically worthless.

Next, comes installing the gameplan and team adjustments to the team they are playing. When the defenders have openly said they do not know what they are supposed to do in a game, that is a gameplanning issue. You can not keep giving these guys more than they can chew each week. Defense relies on being able to outexecute an offense because the offense dictates the structure of a play based on formation, down and distance, tendency, playmakers, and personnel. The defense has to be in sync on all of these pre-snap and then be able to read their keys and make a play. It is a lot more complicated at the NFL level than many fans could ever realize and these guys are not as bright as necessary in most cases!

As for in game adjustments, how in the hell can they be effective when they have already done more then they can handle in gameplanning? This is something way too many fans over think. Real adjustments come from being able to exploit the teams weaknesses that they have covered from gameplanning. IF the team has weaknesess, this is where they can design something to isolate and exploit them. What has been the case in the past in DEN, is that Shanahan and Coyer were so good week to week in gameplanning that they routinely got early leads and had to sit on their weaknesses as teams adjusted to them. What you are seeing the last 2 years is a lack of gameplanning effectiveness being played out as well. When your gameplan is not effective, there are not any adjustments to make since you have to stop what is already working first.

Then, comes playcalling. Playcalling is an art born out of experience, philosophy, and preparation. It requires getting the film work right and anticipating how the other team would attack you with their strengths. That is a missed part of coaching in a lot of cases. Not being surprised in what the other team is going to do to you is a huge advantage. DEN routinely changes how they attack on offense, and this year they have taken that approach on defense. Unfortunately, the defense is not as proficient in executing these changes as DEN is in running the same play out of a different formation on offense. What happens is a defense that has no play proficiency. They can not outexecute an offense consistently, because they lack proficiency at those plays.

Finally, there is player development. Players come in less technical than ever before because colleges are doing a worse job of teaching technique and developing players total game. The college game has changed a lot and players are not prepapred mentally, technically, and physically as they once were to play in the NFL. Colleges have a roster that is twice the size of an NFL one on Gameday and they use their players much differently throughout a game and season than NFL players.

So, that means there are very few guys who are NFL ready from the draft, yet every fan has expectations of the early round guys being instant contributors. That means that coaches NEED to spend more time in Player development with rookies and FA's who come to a new system. Unfortuantely, what happens is that too many coaches spend the overwhelming majority of their time working on the above things during the season that they neglect individual player development. I gaurantee that DEN's Defensive staff is doing that right now. They are SO concerned that the above stuff is not working they are trying to fix that before developing the individual players adequately. And, if you have not noticed, DEN has a ton of new and Young players on the defense that need individual work on technique, mental preparation, and fluency of the defense. Seriously, when your best remaining defender questions what he is supposed to do play to play and week to week, do you think they are helping the guys who really need help figuring things out?

So, I beg to differ that we can not see if the coaching is working in DEN. Sure, you can lead a horse to water...but in this case they are not finding the water until its already too late if at all ;D This team has talent on the defensive side of the ball, not average talent overall, but enough to play an effective defense if they knew what they were doing and could focus on doing that better every week. That is EXACTLY what I said in preseason. This is a talented group that needs to gel to be AVERAGE. Some people thought they were much better than that. Well, they are not. They could be better than the sum of their parts, instead they are even worse than the sum of their parts. Good Coaches get their playeres to perform the former, not the latter.

[Kaylore]

They allow too many completed passes.
They don't produce turnovers.
They can't stop the run.
They make opposing quarterbacks look like hall of fame legends.
They don't wrap up.
They're horrible on third and long.
Their safeties are the worst in football.
They have too many role-players on the defensive line.
Their coordinator has historically been one of the worst to coach everywhere he's been.

[Kaylore]

They could be better than the sum of their parts, instead they are even worse than the sum of their parts. Good Coaches get their playeres to perform the former, not the latter.
That's what I'm saying. This isn't a world beater defense, but they should be at least average and they aren't even that. They're one of the worst.

[WolfpackGuy]

They allow too many completed passes.
They don't produce turnovers.
They can't stop the run.
They make opposing quarterbacks look like hall of fame legends.
They don't wrap up.
They're horrible on third and long.
Their safeties are the worst in football.
They have too many role-players on the defensive line.
Their coordinator has historically been one of the worst to coach everywhere he's been.


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<img src=http://www.smellypoop.com/v2images/photos/usersubmitted/425.jpg width=250>

[kappys]

Pro Bowlers - Champ Bailey

Above Average Players - DJ Williams, Dre Bly, Marcus Thomas(our best D-lineman already in his 2nd season)

Perfectly Average - Robertson, Ekuban, Boss Bailey, Peterson(for a rotational guy), Doomervil.

Well below Average - Engleberger, Webster

I can't believe they have jobs in the NFL - All our safeties, Moss, Crowder.

Looking at the above list I have to conclude the problem is coaching. The talent is there to field a mediocre defense of some sort - that's all we are hoping for really. That they are this bad suggests the coaches are running a **** scheme or just aren't doing their jobs

[montrose]

One idea I want to throw out - while I would certainly like a new DC, I have my eye on one major free agent (which I almost never do), Nnamdi Asomugha. Nnamdi is playing at about as high a level at the CB position as you can without being Champ circa 2005. Not only is he playing that well, he's doing it in the hell-whole that is Oakland that breeds quitting - and has done the whole thing without really complaining. After listening to him following Kiffin's firing, I think he's really had it there and Adam Schefter said recently there's no way Oakland can really franchise him again. I'd love to steal Asomugha away and, if possible, redo Bly's deal as well. With our defensive line improving, and it should see some more improvement after the draft, I'd love to solidify the secondary by adding Nnamdi and two safeties (one in the draft and one via free agency). Adding Nnamdi would solidify our investment in Champ as well - helping us get the most out of our money spent at the CB position and allowing us to put Champ on #2 WR's as his ages. Just a thought I wanted to throw out...

[kappys]

One idea I want to throw out - while I would certainly like a new DC, I have my eye on one major free agent (which I almost never do), Nnamdi Asomugha. Nnamdi is playing at about as high a level at the CB position as you can without being Champ circa 2005. Not only is he playing that well, he's doing it in the hell-whole that is Oakland that breeds quitting - and has done the whole thing without really complaining. After listening to him following Kiffin's firing, I think he's really had it there and Adam Schefter said recently there's no way Oakland can really franchise him again. I'd love to steal Asomugha away and, if possible, redo Bly's deal as well. With our defensive line improving, and it should see some more improvement after the draft, I'd love to solidify the secondary by adding Nnamdi and two safeties (one in the draft and one via free agency). Adding Nnamdi would solidify our investment in Champ as well - helping us get the most out of our money spent at the CB position and allowing us to put Champ on #2 WR's as his ages. Just a thought I wanted to throw out...

Nnamdi should be a perenial pro-bowler and if he keeps it up he is a HOF candidate. I wholeheartedly support this line of thinking - you never give up on a chance to get a game changer of his caliber regardless of your other needs IMO.

[bpc]

DJ is a nice player. He's not a guy you build a team around and like you said, certainly not a team leader. Bailey has basically said he's not a vocal guy. You're exactly right... Wilson was the last guy of that ilk we had. Lynch was certainly a leader, but also on the tail end of his career.

As I said in another thread... you can put together a list of guys we've passed on in the past couple of years that is pretty depressing. I don't just mean guys like Abraham, who we passed on and who's making a major impact for his team... but tons of second-tier and reasonably priced FA's and trade options we just choose to ignore for the likes of Sam Adams, Simeon Rice and practice squad players.

The problem remains at the top. This team has zero vision when it pertains to building a defense and has show very little commitment to the idea in general.

You know, we just need that flag bearer. The one who wears the defense's soul on his jersey. Wilson was that guy for us. He was the emotional and vocal leader of this defense and his leadership was unquestioned by any on the team.

We now have Bailey and DJ who are good complimentary leader's who do their job and make plays but still nobody who will take this unit to task if something is going wrong, if a guy is out of position, ect. We need to find that sparkplug if we are going to start playing with any heart or find a way to overly stock this defense with a ton of talent to help make up for that.

I hate the way we play defense. We have quote on quote "the best corner in football" which I tend to agree with but we don't take advantage of his cover skills to erase the opposing teams best player or shrink the field for the rest of the defense. We protect him as much as anybody else and half the time on crucial plays, he isn't covering the Randy Moss or TO's of the NFL. He's covering the other guy. I'll never understand that for the life of me.

I watch a team play like Tennessee on Monday Night and they use Cortland Finnigan the way we should use Champ. (from what I've seen, he's one of the best CB's in the league that nobody ever talks about, very good player) Straight up, press coverage. Champ's big and fast for a corner, he should be bumping his guy, knocking him off the route and erasing them from the play. Given, we don't have a great defensive line presence but taking the best player out of the offenses lineup will allow our DL and blitzes longer to hit home.

ANYWAYS, i'm ranting but I hate the way we play defense. We don't show any signs of playing truly aggressive, punch you in the mouth football and thats part of the reason we are soft and get our ass's kicked so often. Shanahan should hang out with his buddy Fisher more to steal what he is doing so successfully on that side of the ball.

[Mediator12]

You know, we just need that flag bearer. The one who wears the defense's soul on his jersey. Wilson was that guy for us. He was the emotional and vocal leader of this defense and his leadership was unquestioned by any on the team.

We now have Bailey and DJ who are good complimentary leader's who do their job and make plays but still nobody who will take this unit to task if something is going wrong, if a guy is out of position, ect. We need to find that sparkplug if we are going to start playing with any heart or find a way to overly stock this defense with a ton of talent to help make up for that.

I hate the way we play defense. We have quote on quote "the best corner in football" which I tend to agree with but we don't take advantage of his cover skills to erase the opposing teams best player or shrink the field for the rest of the defense. We protect him as much as anybody else and half the time on crucial plays, he isn't covering the Randy Moss or TO's of the NFL. He's covering the other guy. I'll never understand that for the life of me.

I watch a team play like Tennessee on Monday Night and they use Cortland Finnigan the way we should use Champ. (from what I've seen, he's one of the best CB's in the league that nobody ever talks about, very good player) Straight up, press coverage. Champ's big and fast for a corner, he should be bumping his guy, knocking him off the route and erasing them from the play. Given, we don't have a great defensive line presence but taking the best player out of the offenses lineup will allow our DL and blitzes longer to hit home.

ANYWAYS, i'm ranting but I hate the way we play defense. We don't show any signs of playing truly aggressive, punch you in the mouth football and thats part of the reason we are soft and get our ass's kicked so often. Shanahan should hang out with his buddy Fisher more to steal what he is doing so successfully on that side of the ball.

Dude, are you seriously happy with One guy? I am not. Not even close. I want the whole freakin' defense to have motivated ass kickers who play because they want to win. Every Elite defense has the entire unit going in the same direction, leadership is great, but the team needs to be able to play the way the leader plays.

This Year those teams are PIT, TEN, BAL, TB, PHI, CAR, and the NYG. Surprise, surprise. Teams with a serious defensive tradition, great coaches, solid systems, and personnel that play better than their abilities because they fit what they do. The players part is what is so important. The coaches drill the hell out of these guys so they can be perfect in their sleep if need be. Injuries are not as devastating since the backups are capable and KNOW their jobs. They are prepared, out execute the offenses weekly, technically sound, continually developing, and the playcalling puts them in places to make plays. These defenses are feared by even the mighty offenses, because they take the fight to them every single play.

That commitment is not here, and I doubt it ever will be as long as Shanahan is here. There is only room for one genius on that sideline and we all know who that is. I just wish he would give his ego a rest and let someone put together a real defense in DEN. This team would be ELITE with a real defense. As it stands, the offense is the only show in town AGAIN.

[DBroncos4life]

coaching over-reacting fans lol

[Haroldthebarrel]

Dude, are you seriously happy with One guy? I am not. Not even close. I want the whole freakin' defense to have motivated ass kickers who play because they want to win. Every Elite defense has the entire unit going in the same direction, leadership is great, but the team needs to be able to play the way the leader plays.

This Year those teams are PIT, TEN, BAL, TB, PHI, CAR, and the NYG. Surprise, surprise. Teams with a serious defensive tradition, great coaches, solid systems, and personnel that play better than their abilities because they fit what they do. The players part is what is so important. The coaches drill the hell out of these guys so they can be perfect in their sleep if need be. Injuries are not as devastating since the backups are capable and KNOW their jobs. They are prepared, out execute the offenses weekly, technically sound, continually developing, and the playcalling puts them in places to make plays. These defenses are feared by even the mighty offenses, because they take the fight to them every single play.

That commitment is not here, and I doubt it ever will be as long as Shanahan is here. There is only room for one genius on that sideline and we all know who that is. I just wish he would give his ego a rest and let someone put together a real defense in DEN. This team would be ELITE with a real defense. As it stands, the offense is the only show in town AGAIN.

So you're basically saying that Shanahan should just find a guy who has the skills and give him time to make it work?

The common denominator between the teams you listed are contingency, stability and then talent.

[ANIMAL24]

coaching sucks. and we have players that should be job less rightnow starting... dammit

[bpc]

Dude, are you seriously happy with One guy? I am not. Not even close. I want the whole freakin' defense to have motivated ass kickers who play because they want to win. Every Elite defense has the entire unit going in the same direction, leadership is great, but the team needs to be able to play the way the leader plays.

This Year those teams are PIT, TEN, BAL, TB, PHI, CAR, and the NYG. Surprise, surprise. Teams with a serious defensive tradition, great coaches, solid systems, and personnel that play better than their abilities because they fit what they do. The players part is what is so important. The coaches drill the hell out of these guys so they can be perfect in their sleep if need be. Injuries are not as devastating since the backups are capable and KNOW their jobs. They are prepared, out execute the offenses weekly, technically sound, continually developing, and the playcalling puts them in places to make plays. These defenses are feared by even the mighty offenses, because they take the fight to them every single play.

That commitment is not here, and I doubt it ever will be as long as Shanahan is here. There is only room for one genius on that sideline and we all know who that is. I just wish he would give his ego a rest and let someone put together a real defense in DEN. This team would be ELITE with a real defense. As it stands, the offense is the only show in town AGAIN.

No, i would like more but whats the chance that you are going to find 11 guys like Al Wilson and get them all on the same unit? There also has to be order, a calming influence as well. Not likely. With our current unit, I would like to start with at least one guy who can command the respect of his fellow players and inspire them in the worst conditions to play their best.

As for the coaching, i agree with you for the mostpart. Shanahan is unwillign to truly bring somebody with a different mindset in here. Ray Rhodes proved that. They clashed early and often. That probably is Shanahan's major weakness. It isn't that we can't find somebody that can coach this defense up, he just isn't on the roster right now and we're going to keep having turnover on that unit until we do.

If i'm Shanahan or hell even Bowlen, I see how much its going to cost to land Jim Johnson and spare no expense to get him as our DC. His ego is in check, lets Reid handle all the other stuff and doesn't really want to pursue a HC job. He plays the exact defense we've been looking for and has tremendous success turning average players into solid defensive units.