Champ on special teams ????

[Peoples Champ]

Is it just me , or did anyone see champ on the first kickoff to the Raiders when the guy had a pretty good return. Wasn't that Champ that ran him down and made the tackle?

If it was, I am sick of seeing him on special teams. Not only does it wear him down tired for the rest of the game, but it runs the risk of getting our best DB and our best Defensive player injured. Come on, we have a 30 year old CB and we cant afford to lose him to injury. He is getting older and his stamina might not be as good as when he was younger, so the rest of the game he will just be worn down.

Cant we find some other people that can tackle?

[TheReverend]

Is it just me , or did anyone see champ on the first kickoff to the Raiders when the guy had a pretty good return. Wasn't that Champ that ran him down and made the tackle?

If it was, I am sick of seeing him on special teams. Not only does it wear him down tired for the rest of the game, but it runs the risk of getting our best DB and our best Defensive player injured. Come on, we have a 30 year old CB and we cant afford to lose him to injury. He is getting older and his stamina might not be as good as when he was younger, so the rest of the game he will just be worn down.

Cant we find some other people that can tackle?

Oh please. He's not a blocker on a return unit absorbing a full speed hit, he's playing a safety on kick-off teams to ensure no TD returns. They should even let him have some fun playing gunner on punts.

[enjolras]

It was Champ, and I couldn't disagree more.

Special teams is a HUGE part of winning football games. He's the best tackler on the team, and probably the best athlete. There are 3 phases to the game, not two... why not have your best players out there? 20 yards gained on a return is no different than 20 yards gained on any other play.

[Schism]

I'm surprised we're bothering with a full kick-off/punt coverage unit at all, to be perfectly honest.

Was fully expecting JMFW to saunter out on his own for kick-offs and kick the ball deep before charging downfield and singlehandedly crushing any attempts at a return.

Same for punts, except he does an alley-oop sort of snap to himself, turns and runs back to catch the ball before punting it downfield then charging down to crush the poor man misfortunate enough to field it.

[2KBack]

Best players for every job, that's how you win.

[Kaylore]

Our special teams unit has been notoriously crappy. Other teams in the league make their starters play to make their ST good. If playing Champ is what it takes to get our handicapped unit out of the gutter, than do it.

[SonOfLe-loLang]

Not to mention, this is nothing new. He's played on ST's before.

[oubronco]

Yes it was and on two occasions he took a horrible angle

[Bladerunner]

we can either play scrubs on special teams and continue our run of ineptitude on these plays, or we can face the music, put the A team in and start making improvements...it's no accident that the franchises with the best special teams play use their best players...and it makes a difference...Buffalo and Chicago consistently have game changing plays on special teams

[Triplelefthook]

champ saved two or three TD returns last year on Special Teams. he might have saved one monday night, too. we need him out there

[Orange_Beard]

Champ is a bmf. I bet he would play O if they would let him. Hard to keep a guy like that off the field.

[Beantown Bronco]

Yes it was and on two occasions he took a horrible angle

It's only a horrible angle if the guy gets by you and scores a TD. In neither instance was that the case.

[gyldenlove]

I'm surprised we're bothering with a full kick-off/punt coverage unit at all, to be perfectly honest.

Was fully expecting JMFW to saunter out on his own for kick-offs and kick the ball deep before charging downfield and singlehandedly crushing any attempts at a return.

Same for punts, except he does an alley-oop sort of snap to himself, turns and runs back to catch the ball before punting it downfield then charging down to crush the poor man misfortunate enough to field it.

They can't do that, there is a very real risk that JMFW would kick the ball so far it would actually burn up on reentry into the atmosphere, which would lead to an unseemly amount of flags for delay of game.

[Jason in LA]

He's a football player, so he can play ST. It's a very important part of the game, so they need their best players out there.

[bap454]

champ saved two or three TD returns last year on Special Teams. he might have saved one monday night, too. we need him out there

With out a doubt..... It was a TD if not for Champ. The game was a blow out so it diminishis the point. However if it would have been a close game, we could have lost the game.
Yes Champ did take a bad angle but good lord... that "old man" has still got wheels. Champ just ran him down. Cant recall but Higgins 40 time at the combine was pretty fast... anyone recall?

[gyldenlove]

Koutouvides looked good on every kickoff except the first one, on the first one he kind of slowed down and waited for the returner to cut out from behind the wedge and got blocked out of the play, on the following kickoffs he just ran right into people and made some solid tackles.

[Hamrob]

I think we're a little short at both the receiver and DB groups this year. I mean we really are limited in terms of who can play the gunner. You're certainly not going to use a LB as a gunner...and we kept 8 of them and only 4 CB's.

That being said, I wouldn't risk Champ on ST's. If he goes down...so does our secondary! In regards to the logic that you play your best players on special teams to help you out. That's crap. Let's see if LT is out there next weekend. Or, how about T.O.? It's an unecessary risk that should be avoided.

I mean, haven't we had the entire offseason to improve our special teams units and that's the best we can do? Only the first game...but O'brian doesn't seem to be all we need him to be!

[broncofan2438]

Yea, hes the best tackler on the damn team. Special teams is our weakest point, and if he is saving the game winning return, than so be it

[Peoples Champ]

I agree that he is the best tackler, and he can save touchdowns and might have, but is it worth the risk.


All I am saying is that if he gets hurt on special teams we all might be biting our tounges. Or if he gets burned in the 4th quarter because he is tired?

He might save 2-3 touchdowns on special teams, but if he gets hurt how many touchdowns will that cost us for the season?

[Peoples Champ]

He's a football player, so he can play ST. It's a very important part of the game, so they need their best players out there.


Not really, I bet LT or TO or Ocho Cinco could be the best player on their teams to return kicks, but do they risk their injuries?

And believe me, champ is pretty much making TO / LT kind of money.

[Jason in LA]

Not really, I bet LT or TO or Ocho Cinco could be the best player on their teams to return kicks, but do they risk their injuries?

And believe me, champ is pretty much making TO / LT kind of money.

All three players you named are starting offensive players who do not have the job of tackling people. Champ has great speed and is a great tackler. He's a perfect fit. LT, TO, and 85 wouldn't be a good choice on special teams.

[Peoples Champ]

All three players you named are starting offensive players who do not have the job of tackling people. Champ has great speed and is a great tackler. He's a perfect fit. LT, TO, and 85 wouldn't be a good choice on special teams.



I disagree, Devin Hester was a CB in college, but he was the best athlete on the field, and the fastest, so in the NFL, they made him their returner.

You can mold players based on athletic talent.

LT is the best on the team with speed, vision, great ability to catch, ability to avoid tacklers and break tackles. I dont see how that wouldnt make him good on special teams as a returner. Just like champ uses his abilities to tackle and speed on special teams. I am not saying Champ is not the best player on the special teams (because he is), I am just saying is it worth the risk?

[GoHAM]

The fact is he is not the gunner, nor is he the wedge buster. He was the kickoff safety. His sole job is to make the open field tackle if the returner breaks free and hits the open field. Tire him out? He jogged down to the 40 after the kickoff and waited, then chased down the returner and pushed him out of bounds. How does that tire him out more than covering a post route?

Over reaction. He did what he was supposed to do, saved the touchdown.

[TotallyScrewed]

champ saved two or three TD returns last year on Special Teams. he might have saved one monday night, too. we need him out there

I agree with this. He took a bad angle and had to chase him down rather than hit him dead on but IMO he saved a TD. I don't necessarily like Champ being out there...maybe Boss...but Special Teams was hurting Denver at the start of that game and has been a problem historically.

[Peoples Champ]

The fact is he is not the gunner, nor is he the wedge buster. He was the kickoff safety. His sole job is to make the open field tackle if the returner breaks free and hits the open field. Tire him out? He jogged down to the 40 after the kickoff and waited, then chased down the returner and pushed him out of bounds. How does that tire him out more than covering a post route?

Over reaction. He did what he was supposed to do, saved the touchdown.



I always thought all 10 guys went for the guy with the ball, and the kicker is the saftey?

I might be wrong though. So then we have 9 guys going at the ball and 2 safties, then maybe that is why the returner had a 50 yard return?

[Jason in LA]

I disagree, Devin Hester was a CB in college, but he was the best athlete on the field, and the fastest, so in the NFL, they made him their returner.

You can mold players based on athletic talent.

That's not a very good analogy. CBs typically are returners. There's not much to mold. Teams look for CBs to be returners. Teams don't look to mold their starting RBs/WRs into tacklers. It doesn't make much sense.

[tsiguy96]

The fact is he is not the gunner, nor is he the wedge buster. He was the kickoff safety. His sole job is to make the open field tackle if the returner breaks free and hits the open field. Tire him out? He jogged down to the 40 after the kickoff and waited, then chased down the returner and pushed him out of bounds. How does that tire him out more than covering a post route?

Over reaction. He did what he was supposed to do, saved the touchdown.

werd. he makes the game saving tackle if everyone else messes up, and theres no other player on our roster id want doing that spot. he will not get injured sitting back and waiting.

[Jason in LA]

I always thought all 10 guys went for the guy with the ball, and the kicker is the saftey?

I might be wrong though. But maybe if we have 9 guys going at the ball and 2 safties, then maybe that is why the returner had a 50 yard return?

Nope. The safety on the coverage team hangs back to chase down a returner who breaks containment. It's a pretty safe position. There are gunners on both sides. They are players who go straight to the ball carrier. Everybody else stays in their lanes.

[Peoples Champ]

Nope. The safety on the coverage team hangs back to chase down a returner who breaks containment. It's a pretty safe position. There are gunners on both sides. They are players who go straight to the ball carrier. Everybody else stays in their lanes.


Ya your right, but I am not sure if I agree with that strategy.

It just seems too easy to block a guy thats sitting back and waiting for the returner to break through and being a safety.

It seems like it would make sense to have that guy to run down and stay in his lane like you say. He would be harder to block that way. And have the kicker be the saftey.

I saw our punter do it very well against the cowboys and put a great hit on Pac Man Jones

[Peoples Champ]

That's not a very good analogy. CBs typically are returners. There's not much to mold. Teams look for CBs to be returners. Teams don't look to mold their starting RBs/WRs into tacklers. It doesn't make much sense.


Then what do you think about this?

LT is the best on the team with speed, vision, great ability to catch, ability to avoid tacklers and break tackles. Wouldnt that make him the best on the team on special teams as a returner. Just like champ uses his abilities to tackle and speed on special teams. I am not saying Champ is not the best player on the special teams (because he is), I am just saying is it worth the risk?

[Peoples Champ]

Not to mention, this is nothing new. He's played on ST's before.



Ya your right, I just thought we would fix it in the offseason. By finding someone else that can tackle and who is fast that isnt the highest paid on the team.

[mr007]

Then what do you think about this?

LT is the best on the team with speed, vision, great ability to catch, ability to avoid tacklers and break tackles. Wouldnt that make him the best on the team on special teams as a returner. Just like champ uses his abilities to tackle and speed on special teams. I am not saying Champ is not the best player on the special teams (because he is), I am just saying is it worth the risk?

A return man is much more succeptible to injury compared to essentially a safety net player on the return.

[Peoples Champ]

If the job is so easy like you guys make it sound (wont tire him out and wont injure him) then why do we have our highest paid player doing it. If it is so easy of a job, we should have another guy that is fast and can tackle doing it that is getting paid a lot less. If we dont have one then it is sad.

[dbfan4life]

Champ should also return kickoffs. He kicks ass at in in Madden!

[Los Broncos]

Yes it was him, if not for him that may of been a TD.

[kappys]

Why don't we just let them score every return so that Champ doesn't have to risk going out on the field and possibly getting injured?

As long as we score every drive and get the 2 point conversions we can win!

[Peoples Champ]

Why don't we just let them score every return so that Champ doesn't have to risk going out on the field and possibly getting injured?

As long as we score every drive and get the 2 point conversions we can win!



Why dont we just improve our special teams so we dont have to put our star Corner on them, (like the eagles with samuels, or the chargers with cromarte)

I know its easier sad that done, but there has to be someone else that can do that easy job of a saftey on kickoff.

[BroncoMan4ever]

i am all for it, if the best special teams players you have on your team are your star players, put them in.
Had Denver's special teams been better last season, not allowing the opposing offense to start out on the 35 every series, Denver would have won a couple more games.
Hell put the entire starting D out there if that is what it takes to keep the opponent having to play a long field.

Not only that, but put starters on the return team too.

Special teams is important

[Jason in LA]

Then what do you think about this?

LT is the best on the team with speed, vision, great ability to catch, ability to avoid tacklers and break tackles. Wouldnt that make him the best on the team on special teams as a returner. Just like champ uses his abilities to tackle and speed on special teams. I am not saying Champ is not the best player on the special teams (because he is), I am just saying is it worth the risk?

That's too much of a reach. It doesn't make sense to have your featured RB on kickoff coverage. It makes perfect sense to have your starting CB on kickoff coverage. Teams all over the league do it. It's part of the game.

[Peoples Champ]

alright, you guys win, but if champ gets hurt on special teams, im coming back

[SoDak Bronco]

Watching the Vikings game they had starting LB's Chad Greenway and Ben Leber on punt coverage. Most teams are playing there starters because these guys are there best athletes. I don't mind Champ being out there.

[Peoples Champ]

Watching the Vikings game they had starting LB's Chad Greenway and Ben Leber on punt coverage. Most teams are playing there starters because these guys are there best athletes. I don't mind Champ being out there.



I always thought it was better to put backups out there, because they are looking to make the team as a starter. They want to make a play that stands out for the coaches, so they are playing even harder.

That is how Terrell Davis was noticed. I read in his book that once he made a huge hit on special teams, Shanny knew he was going to be a player. He was uphill from there. A lot of backups are looking for this opportunity.

[Atlas]

Is it just me , or did anyone see champ on the first kickoff to the Raiders when the guy had a pretty good return. Wasn't that Champ that ran him down and made the tackle?

If it was, I am sick of seeing him on special teams. Not only does it wear him down tired for the rest of the game, but it runs the risk of getting our best DB and our best Defensive player injured. Come on, we have a 30 year old CB and we cant afford to lose him to injury. He is getting older and his stamina might not be as good as when he was younger, so the rest of the game he will just be worn down.

Cant we find some other people that can tackle?

He plays the safety valve because of his speed. Most of the time he won't even see any contact.

[BroncoBen]

That is part of the problem with having a 53-man roster not enought bodies.

But Champ wouldn't have to play special teams if someone would step up to be that 'saftey' value.. maybe one of the rookies will.