Stefan Fatsis Hates on the Broncos in his NFL Preview

[telluride]

This kinda sucks, given the good words/feelings we've all afforded his book. But Fatsis files today's Team Preview for Deadspin (http://deadspin.com/5042014/nfl-season-preview-denver-broncos) on the Broncos and slags many of them, including -- amazingly -- Cutler's Dad. Ordinarily I'd just highlight some quotes and let you visit the site, but the thing pissed me off, so screw Fair Use. Here it is in full:


I talked to Jake Plummer the other day. He called to say thanks for sending him a signed copy of my book, in which he plays Shut the Box, rips Mike Shanahan (on page 316; Broncos executives refer to it as Stefan 3:16) and generally demonstrates that he is a funny, caring, admirable, exceptionally grounded badass. Jake said he plans to read it during an upcoming trip to Machu Picchu and the Galapagos Islands—along with the memoir by his late pal Pat Tillman’s mom, Boots on the Ground by Dusk. If I can’t afford to visit the Galapagos, at least my book will.

Jake’s been having what he’d call a “sweet” time since voluntarily ditching the NFL and moving home to Idaho after the 2006 season. He’s got married (to a former Broncos cheerleader), toured Thailand, played some handball, hit a bluegrass festival, backpacked and camped, even cruised around in a motor home. No regrets, except for how it ended it Denver, when Shanahan benched him for then-rookie Jay Cutler despite a 7-4 record and an easy road to the playoffs. “I miss the competition and I miss rolling to my left and throwing the ball into the gap,” Jake said. “But I don’t miss the other bull****.”

Ah, but the NFL is mostly other bull****, at least for those paid to play the game. I know, Drew, fans don’t want to see players as flesh-and-blood people suffering the same workplace indignities and living the same lives of quiet desperation as the rest of us. Fans need to hate, and you can’t hate a guy if you learn that he’s a faithful husband who has roses delivered to his wife every Monday during the season (when he can’t get out of bed because his body feels like it’s been run through a trash compactor), a loving father who invents fantastical bedtime stories for his kids (before the combination of Vioxx and Ambien renders him unconscious) and a progressive thinker who agrees with everything Paul Krugman says (but plans to vote for McCain anyway because he wants to pay fewer taxes). I made up all of those examples.

So, yes, sorry to spoil the fun, but players are people, too. And that’s why it’s impossible to know how the Broncos or anyone else will do this season. It depends on whether an offensive lineman has a hammy, on whether some anonymous running back gains 1,300 yards, on whether a wide receiver has lady trouble, on how the guys in the differently colored jerseys play on Sunday. This prediction sounds pretty authoritative—except that Travis Henry was cut two months ago. Oops! FanNation has some astute analysis: “The Broncos are good.” These experts say Denver will go 9-7. No, 6-10. No, 8-8. You want real numbers? Buy this book, along with mine, of course.

Here’s what I envision for the 2008 Denver Broncos:

It’ll be a breakout year for my buddy tight end Nate Jackson.

On the field? Sure, whatever. But definitely in the creative world. Nate’s already a good writer, and he makes music under the name Jack Nasty, which he swears doesn’t refer to this. Because newspapers have little idea what’s happening on the field during training camp but still have to fill the traditional quota of one news story, one notes column and one profile a day, Nate’s hip-hop stylings earned a profile in the Denver Post this month. The two reporters assigned to the piece—one to write, one to play the fool on a Web video—compared Nate’s music to that of Eminem and Vanilla Ice. Because, you know, they’re white, too!

Obligatory football content: Nate has run with the first unit a lot this summer and should see the most passes of his six-year career. But cuddly, third-year Tony Scheffler should continue developing into an NFL beast. (I kid, Tony; you’re not that cuddly.)

Having diabetes will humanize Jay Cutler.

Eh, no it won’t. Cutler remains aloof with the media, with many of his teammates and with other humans as well. And his father still attends every practice! One day during my time in Denver, I asked the dad a few basic questions about his boy’s background. He looked at me with shock and scorn. ``You haven’t read any of the magazine stories, have you?’’ he said. Really, he did. I wrote it down.

Some additional comments, heretofore unpublished, from my sideline interview with Jay Cutler’s father:

“He was making throws at 10 years old that other kids couldn’t.”

“He picks things up fast. It’s evident here. Contrary to what Sal Paolantonio and others said early on. Where they get their information is beyond me.’’

“Guys like Kiper and Clayton and them, to this day they still can’t get past a quarterback being drafted as high as he was with the record he had. They don’t know talent.”

Obligatory football content: I admit, grudgingly, that Jay Cutler is a good quarterback. I hope he’s playing in Jacksonville soon.

Matt Prater will make some field goals. He’ll also miss some field goals.

When the kid misses them, message boards will flood with comments about how the Broncos never should have let Jason Elam, a 15-year career Bronco (and future Hall of Famer—along with Matt Stover; suck, it Drew), leave as a free agent. When, as he did in practice a few weeks ago, Prater makes a 68-yarder, they will hail Mike Shanahan for letting the over-the-hill Elam hit the road.

Earlier this month, visiting training camp to flog my book, I had lunch with Prater and two baby-faced punters who will remind no one of my ephedra-taking, Saved by the Bell-watching, cabbie-slapping training-camp foil, Todd Sauerbrun, whom I weirdly miss. They all seem like very nice young fellows.

Obligatory football content: Matt Prater has a compact leg swing.

The Broncos will have a leadership vacuum.

Reporters love to write about “intangibles” like leadership, though they can’t define what it means in the context of a locker room because much of what makes a leader is hidden from public view. Plummer was a terrific leader, which in his case involved everything from being the screaming guy whose outstretched palm you slap on the way down the tunnel to passionately lecturing a rookie, as he did in the weight room one day, about the hypocrisy of players who publicly praise God and privately chase women not their wives.

This year’s Broncos don’t have many veterans who have been with the team very long, or players whose talent and personality command instant respect. Champ Bailey is pretty quiet. Dre’ Bly isn’t, but he seems to be more of a joker than a leader. Brandon Marshall is a stud on the field but has been spending a lot of time off the field talking things over with his defense lawyer. The running backs are, as usual, a mystery. And no one will confuse Cutler with Pericles. Does it matter? A surfeit of talent can compensate for a lack of leadership. The Broncos probably don’t possess such a surfeit right now.

Shanahan has whacked about 80 percent of the players I showered with in 2006, including that team’s three bona fide leaders: Plummer, linebacker Al Wilson and safety John Lynch. (Rod Smith, who retired tearfully a few weeks ago, was mostly hurt when I was in camp.) All three were beloved by teammates, and each of their forced departures was as cold as a contract killing. Plummer was benched—wrongly, I maintain—despite amassing a 40-18 record as a starter and taking the Broncos to the brink of a Super Bowl, and then traded even though he told the team he was retiring (which cost him $3.5 million). Wilson was cut after a potentially career-ending spinal injury that resulted in a nasty grievance against the team. Lynch was released amid behind-the-scenes contractual bitterness.

Yeah, football’s a nasty business. But the departures of Plummer, Lynch, Wilson and Smith mean the following players have been Broncos the longest: center Tom Nalen (just had knee surgery; friendlier than he’d ever admit but not a rah-rah guy), guard Ben Hamilton (back after a bunch of concussions; total softy) and long snapper Mike Leach. Leach is a William & Mary grad whom Peter King last year crowned the 1,000th-best player in the NFL. (Leach had lobbied to be last.) Mike Leach has the third-longest tenure on the Broncos. “Scary, huh?” he said to me.

Obligatory football content: Leach’s snaps on placekicks make exactly three and a half revolutions.

Mike Shanahan will tell the media that if the players “do the little things right” they’ll “have a chance to do something special.”

Think what you will about Mike Shanahan, the man knows to handle the media: Say little, divulge less. Sure, people mock his tan and his teeth, but he’s not a terrible guy—just, as one Bronco told me, a guy with a lot of power. And the past two years he’s wielded that power as indiscriminately as at any time in his career, firing his extremely smart and able GM, Ted Sundquist, along with a passel of coaches. Every Broncos team is Shanahan’s team, but this one might as well replace the snorting horse on the helmet with a snorting Shanny. And if it fails? Save the SHANNY-MUST-GO DAMMIT!!!! posts, Broncos fans. Mike Shanahan is your head coach until his contract expires in 2011, and possibly longer.

Obligatory football content: None. Coaches don’t play football.

[Drek]

firing his extremely smart and able GM, Ted Sundquist

What?

Lots of lost credibility with that statement. Either that or our horrible drafting under Ted, and sudden and complete turnaround under the Goodmans, is because smarty Ted was so busy cribbing high schoolers that he didn't pay attention to the collegians.

[SonOfLe-loLang]

haha well the broncos had all that team leadership the year he wasi n training camp and they turned out to be garbage. So whatever

[2KBack]

meh, I appreciate another view, and the guy is a good writer. Sounds like he is just a bit sore because a lot of his buddies aren't around anymore.

He kinda lost me with Sundquist as the Smart and Talented GM.

[loborugger]

Seems to me to be one part sour grapes, one part calling it the way he sees it (which is skewed by his friendships developed in the shower), and one part trying to sound exceptionally smart by comparing Cutler to Pericles - are you serious? At least he knew who Pericles was.

[HILife]

Don't see much wrong with it. Maybe some of it can be miss leading, but to the most part nothing to bad.

[elsid13]

This should be interesting when he visit the site again.

I glad that irks Cutler and his father about what ESPiN said about him not being as good as the Young/Leinart.

[sixtimeseight]

meh, not really much hate, maybe some hard truths but that's about it.

[telluride]

The needless shot at Jay's Dad seemed pretty petty. I bet Fatsis' Dad can go overboard at times about his twerp son's book, too. News flash: Fathers can be proud of their sons. Trying to make Cutler's Dad sound like an ass is bush league.

Also, he "grudgingly" admits Jay's a good QB? Screw you, Fatsis.

[rovolution]

Fatsis is angry his "boys" arent with the organization anymore.

They were given opportunities to continue their careers else where (especially Joke Blunder with the Tampa trade) and they did not take advantage of those opportunities.

Like another poster said a few posts before me, Im also happy cutler and his father are angry with how the media berated him just because he played at Vandy.

All Hail Jay!!!!!!! Shanahan's revenge 2008!!!!!!

BTW this nasty article by Fatsis all but ensures there will be no Hard Knocks about the Broncos.

[skpac1001]

Yeah, that Pericles reference was pretty pretentious, as is his little comment on Denver Post newspaper people. Poor fellow had to come to an NFL camp compliments of Bowlen and Shanahan to pretend to be a NFL player, deal with the backwoods newspapermen and horribly proud players fathers, and be clubby with all the players (only he truely understands Nalen and Hamilton and Plumber). I find his little petnames and descriptions of the players a little creepy also.

[Kaylore]

He kinda lost me with Sundquist as the Smart and Talented GM.

I think we all turned the page with that one. Sundquist kissed the media's rear quarters and was frequently the leakee in when things would hit the media from "an Bronco official." That's why Fatsis is all over his balls. Sundquist probably knew he was done at the end of the season and so cuddled up to Fatsis to make sure he and the book reflected him as a poor, misunderstand savant who was held back by the evil Mike Shanahan. Ask Mediator about Ted Sundquist. He'll have some stories to tell.

[lostknight]

Reading the book it's very clear that he wrote nice things about anyone who would talk to him like he earned his spot in camp. Having recently read his book, while some parts I found interesting, his overall point of view seemed hopelessly biased by his personal taste.

My guess is that he wanted to do a chapter on Jay, and how hard it is to be a NFL QB. Jay would not talk (no doubt waived off by management who rightly point out that authors tend to characterize with a wide, unflattering and often criminally incorrect brush).

Bias blinds him to things like just how horrible Jake's stats where before Shanny benched him. Or that the complete lack of a offense had destroyed our defense, once that once the lock was "picked" against the colts we really had nothing left in the tank.

But on point he is correct - the leaders are gone. But new leaders have emerged, and the team is radically different then any orange and blue team has been in the last twenty years. Jay Cutler owns this team, and he is just starting to cut loose.

There is a reality here - people like Rod Smith and Lynch in the clubhouse where never going to permit Jay to own the team. Not because of anything deliberate on their part - but because age and experience has a way to make one cynical and wise. That cynicism and wisdom protects the elderly, but the only defense of the young is enthusiasm and a sense of immortality. Anyone can look at jay and say - wow - great passer. But you sit on the side lines and watch Rod and John and you feel the aura of their experience. If Jay says to do something, players would still watch Rod and John to make sure the rookie had his head on strait.

Better to let Jay own the team, and learn the lessons the hard way.

[rugbythug]

So by his reckoning Every player ever cut got a raw deal. I get it.

[Mountain Bronco]

That was definetly a nasty article. Why is he pissed at Jay, because the Plummer coudn't get it done? They let that little deuch bag attend practices and write a book and all he does is hate. Strange.

[Kaylore]

The needless shot at Jay's Dad seemed pretty petty. I bet Fatsis' Dad can go overboard at times about his twerp son's book, too. News flash: Fathers can be proud of their sons. Trying to make Cutler's Dad sound like an ass is bush league.

Also, he "grudgingly" admits Jay's a good QB? Screw you, Fatsis.

I agree that was tasteless and unnecessary. Jack Elway was always around the team in one capacity or another and never stopped cheering for his son like a regular fan would. I don't have a problem if someone's parents are defensive about the things critics say about their kids.

And I'm sorry he was so butt hurt about Cutler replacing Jake. Shanahan didn't want Cutler to play that year and did everything he could to prevent it before his play got so crappy that he had no choice. Plummer's the only one who is at fault for Plummer getting benched.

[Ironlung]

Uh...Jake Plummer didn't deserve to get benched!?!? He looked like he was playing QB for the first time ever that year. I was embarrassed as a bronco fan watching him fail at all the throws. His arm makes Chad Penningtons arm look strong. All of you who are going to say we would've made the playoffs if we stuck with him are clueless, sure we were 7-4, but we were 7-4 despite how hideous our QB was playing. We were not going to continue to win games.

[theAPAOps5]

I spoke with Fatsis at camp. He calls Jay aloof but so what many say that about Elway too. The day he was at camp Cutler was supposed to speak at the podium and ended up not coming out. Maybe that had to do with it.

I liked Fatsis but this sounds like typical media drivel. I lost a little respect for the guy with how he took cheap shots.

[Rock Chalk]

I loved Al Wilson, still do, but he had no business on the football field anymore. Case in point, he still doesnt have a job. It would have been cruel to keep him and risk him getting a life threatening injury.

[skpac1001]

Uh...Jake Plummer didn't deserve to get benched!?!? He looked like he was playing QB for the first time ever that year. I was embarrassed as a bronco fan watching him fail at all the throws. His arm makes Chad Penningtons arm look strong. All of you who are going to say we would've made the playoffs if we stuck with him are clueless, sure we were 7-4, but we were 7-4 despite how hideous our QB was playing. We were not going to continue to win games.

I would have taken BVP over Plummer at that point. Maybe even Croyle, but thats a little tougher.

[2KBack]

let's not open up any wounds that are better left closed

[Kaylore]

I loved Al Wilson, still do, but he had no business on the football field anymore. Case in point, he still doesnt have a job. It would have been cruel to keep him and risk him getting a life threatening injury.

That's the thing I don't get. They act like our releasing him was personal when it was even in his best interests to stay out of football. You can't just magically replace an Al Wilson, either. Hopefully we can find a really good Mike in the draft next year.

[Atlas]

meh, I appreciate another view, and the guy is a good writer. Sounds like he is just a bit sore because a lot of his buddies aren't around anymore.

He kinda lost me with Sundquist as the Smart and Talented GM.

Yeah, that was a pretty good read and really nothing you can disagree with and really nothingthat doesn't happen on every NFL team. A good read none-the-less.

[Atlas]

Uh...Jake Plummer didn't deserve to get benched!?!? He looked like he was playing QB for the first time ever that year. I was embarrassed as a bronco fan watching him fail at all the throws. His arm makes Chad Penningtons arm look strong. All of you who are going to say we would've made the playoffs if we stuck with him are clueless, sure we were 7-4, but we were 7-4 despite how hideous our QB was playing. We were not going to continue to win games.

7-4 with Plummer and 2-3 without him.

Denver would have beaten both S.F. and Seattle if Plummer would have started. Did Shanny maybe jump the gun a little early? Maybe, but Denver wasn't going to do anything that year anyway.

[Rock Chalk]

7-4 with Plummer and 2-3 without him.

Denver would have beaten both S.F. and Seattle if Plummer would have started. Did Shanny maybe jump the gun a little early? Maybe, but Denver wasn't going to do anything that year anyway.

Thats how i feel.

We make the playoffs with Plummer.

But it doesnt matter. We get plastered IN the playoffs regardless.

[theAPAOps5]

I feel the way Plummer was sinking he would have played as bad as Cutler and evidence shows that because Plummer comes in and throws a patented lame duck for an INT during the S.F. game.

The problem is the defense was fading because they had been carrying an inept offense all season who continually went 3 and out.

So I think the result would have been the same no matter what. Just my .02 cents! But its history and fans should move on.

[Memento]

From Fastis: Cutler remains aloof with the media, with many of his teammates and with other humans as well.

Hmmm. Was Plummer aloof with the media? Umm, Giant check-o-rama there. Guess Jay-C learned from a pro on that issue (though I kinda like this trait in Plummer/Cutler).

As far as being aloof from teammates and other humans, he seems like a pretty decent kid with his charity foundation and all... active in the community. Can't expect him in his rookie year to be on the top of every 10-year-pro's Christmas list, but he clearly seems to have cliqued with his core group of players from his and subsequent drafts, as the FO continues to rebuild this team.

Seems like he and Marshall are beginning to take the leadership reins.

Time (and wins) will tell.

[yerner]

Yeah, thats about as honest a read on insider info as you'll get. Sure it's from his view point. I also think its funny how many of you guys are so defensive about the Cutler remarks. Why? He doesn't have to be a great guy to be a good player.

[TomServo]

Denver would have beaten both S.F. and Seattle if Plummer would have started.

he didnt start, but plummer had his chance to come in and save the day. and blew his chance so bad shanny obviously thought we had a better chance with a concussed cutler.

[theAPAOps5]

I sent him an email as he told me to contact him any time he had questions. I just wanted to see what his experience with Cutler directly had been besides what was in the book and asked him about the Al Wilson comments.

[Bladerunner]

Reading the book it's very clear that he wrote nice things about anyone who would talk to him like he earned his spot in camp. Having recently read his book, while some parts I found interesting, his overall point of view seemed hopelessly biased by his personal taste.

My guess is that he wanted to do a chapter on Jay, and how hard it is to be a NFL QB. Jay would not talk (no doubt waived off by management who rightly point out that authors tend to characterize with a wide, unflattering and often criminally incorrect brush).

Bias blinds him to things like just how horrible Jake's stats where before Shanny benched him. Or that the complete lack of a offense had destroyed our defense, once that once the lock was "picked" against the colts we really had nothing left in the tank.

But on point he is correct - the leaders are gone. But new leaders have emerged, and the team is radically different then any orange and blue team has been in the last twenty years. Jay Cutler owns this team, and he is just starting to cut loose.

There is a reality here - people like Rod Smith and Lynch in the clubhouse where never going to permit Jay to own the team. Not because of anything deliberate on their part - but because age and experience has a way to make one cynical and wise. That cynicism and wisdom protects the elderly, but the only defense of the young is enthusiasm and a sense of immortality. Anyone can look at jay and say - wow - great passer. But you sit on the side lines and watch Rod and John and you feel the aura of their experience. If Jay says to do something, players would still watch Rod and John to make sure the rookie had his head on strait.

Better to let Jay own the team, and learn the lessons the hard way.

that was a great post...

As for Fatsis...I'm a little surprised that telluride found this so objectionable...he doesn't really say anything all that bad about the Broncos, the article just has a negative tenor about it...like others have said, he seems to be empathetically butt-hurt because Plummer, Lynch, and Wilson have left the team (two of which on their own accord, the third as a medical necessity)...

I don't need him to give a reach around to the Broncos to appreciate his insider perspective and the quality of his writing...

[TheReverend]

It's extremely clear that this article is a reach-around to everyone that was nice to the little guy during his "tenure as a Bronco".

Which is good for a different viewpoint, but we care very little about the people behind the game and care more about Sundays.

[skpac1001]

Hmmm... I am not quite getting the whole insider thing. Besides kicking on the practice field during a previous training camp, kickers position meetings, and a friendship with a bitter Jake, it doesn't appear to me he had any more access to anything a typical reporter doesnt.

[Bladerunner]

It's extremely clear that this article is a reach-around to everyone that was nice to the little guy during his "tenure as a Bronco".

Which is good for a different viewpoint, but we care very little about the people behind the game and care more about Sundays.

pretty much, although I am interested in the people behind the game...I think this bit was pretty interesting, even if he does think that Plummer and Sundquist are better than they were.

[DenverBroncosJM]

Well thanks Fatsis for ruining any chance the fans had of Hard Knocks being in Denver next year.

This is the exact reason why 30 something other teams told him no.

[SonOfLe-loLang]

did Ben Hamilton have a mess of concussions or just one bad one?

[elsid13]

did Ben Hamilton have a mess of concussions or just one bad one?

Just one that put him out. But I wouldn't be surprise that he had number of small ones that he never reported that factor in as problem.

[Ray Finkle]

I think we all turned the page with that one. Sundquist kissed the media's rear quarters and was frequently the leakee in when things would hit the media from "an Bronco official." That's why Fatsis is all over his balls. Sundquist probably knew he was done at the end of the season and so cuddled up to Fatsis to make sure he and the book reflected him as a poor, misunderstand savant who was held back by the evil Mike Shanahan. Ask Mediator about Ted Sundquist. He'll have some stories to tell.

Med....you got some stories to spin!

[Taco John]

Fatsis is in luck. They are still stocking these by the dozen!

[Inkana7]

7-4 with Plummer and 2-3 without him.

Denver would have beaten both S.F. and Seattle if Plummer would have started. Did Shanny maybe jump the gun a little early? Maybe, but Denver wasn't going to do anything that year anyway.

We beat Seattle if Clark doesn't fumble that kickoff.

[Dedhed]

This guy has his panties in a bunch, eh? I waonder if his editor is concerned about the fact that he's failed miserably with the first rule of professional journalism: don't get emotionally attached to your story.

[BlaK-Argentina]

It's extremely clear that this article is a reach-around to everyone that was nice to the little guy during his "tenure as a Bronco".

Which is good for a different viewpoint, but we care very little about the people behind the game and care more about Sundays.

Yes. It's not that I don't care about the players... but come on, football is a business after all. Someone should tell Fatsis that.

[broncofan2438]

**** this guy and **** the media

[BlaK-Argentina]

I waonder if his editor is concerned about the fact that he's failed miserably with the first rule of professional journalism: don't get emotionally attached to your story.

Exactly. :notworthy

[hambone13]

Thats how i feel.

We make the playoffs with Plummer.

But it doesnt matter. We get plastered IN the playoffs regardless.

Wasn't that the point of him being benched? If you're not going to go, then get the rookie some reps. Not to mention, Plummer was playing like horse **** because his precious little feelings were hurt that they drafted a guy that could make the throws he can't, couldn't, wouldn't. He had his chance to win games, won a ton of games because of the people around him as much as his own success. However, the bottom line was, when it came down to the playoff intensity, he didn't have it in him. He didn't have the arm and he couldn't keep the defense of the field when it counted.

[KipCorrington25]

Plummer sucked, glad he's gone and the way he went out like a little bitch it exactly why.

And this poncey little dweeb can go shower with him and Lynch and everyone else he ballwashed.

[hambone13]

that was a great post...

As for Fatsis...I'm a little surprised that telluride found this so objectionable...he doesn't really say anything all that bad about the Broncos, the article just has a negative tenor about it...like others have said, he seems to be empathetically butt-hurt because Plummer, Lynch, and Wilson have left the team (two of which on their own accord, the third as a medical necessity)...

I don't need him to give a reach around to the Broncos to appreciate his insider perspective and the quality of his writing...

There's no quality in journalism that is highly biased and lacks objectivity. Fatsis needs to go hang out with Goodell and help him with his highly objective perspective. That was ridiculous especially from someone that was actually there.

[Dos Rios]

I know a lot of you guys are turned off by Fatsis' tone, but I'm surprised everyone skips over the very real leadership issue Fatsis mentions. Everytime it comes up on this board, not many seem concerned. The team has lost Plummer, Wilson, Lynch, Smith, Elam and Burns lately. After Nalen and Hamilton, Leach has the longest tenure. And with the possible exception of Cutler, none of the current crop of team stars - Bailey, Williams, Marshall - looks like a true leader's personality.

Lostknight's point is a great one - maybe you have to clear out the old guard to let someone like Cutler "own" the team. Dunno. And certainly some newer guys like Graham and Doom seem like they could evolve into leaders. But the total lack of guys like Wilson/Smith/Burns right now is to me the biggest short-term concern. How the hell, for instance, is the defense ever going to turn into a top tier group when DJ Williams is the leader? The guy's a soldier (and a good one), not a general.

And I can't believe anyone would be surprised to hear Cutler is aloof. Love his talent on the field, but you don't have to deify the guy to cheer for him.

[wolf754life]

fatsis is a bitch i would like to kick him in the throat!

[BroncoBuff]

[quote=yerner;2050652]I also think its funny how many of you guys are so defensive about the Cutler remarks. Why? He doesn't have to be a great guy to be a good player.[/pressure of competition. It's obvious Fatsis doesn't get that, which is too bad.

[Man-Goblin]

Bye Bye Hard Knocks in 2009.

[BroncoBuff]

I also think its funny how many of you guys are so defensive about the Cutler remarks. Why? He doesn't have to be a great guy to be a good player.
There's a guy on this board who told me via PM a very negative Cutler story from Fan Fair last year ... won't say who, but it was pretty bad. Doesn't matter much to me really, it must be a seriously royal pain when you can't even stop at a 7-11 without being hounded.

I'm on page 90 of the book ... so far Plummer comes off as a jerk. Not as big a jerk as Sauerbrun though, Todd-haters will love this book ... he's a real ass. As bad as he destroys Sauerbrun though, he practically canonizes Jason Elam. Everybody on this board should read this book ... it's freaking fascinating. Tyler Frederickson, Paul Ernster and Sauierbrun - none of them could stand each other, and they weren't shy about telling the author. Preston Parsons hangs out quite a bit in the evenings with Fatsis ... BTW: whomever here characterized Parsons as a friend of Cutler was wrong. He was a good friend of Plummer actually.

There's also a passage where the team's lady psychologist lectures the roster about the dangers of domestic violence and how the wrong woman can be the most dangerous thing for a young player ... presumably B-Marsh wasn't listening ??? I'll scan in a couple parts if you guys beg enough ....


Anyway, it's sad to see a good journalist like Fatsis lose all objectivity because of tenuous friendships with discarded head-cases like Plummer. But what am I takling about "friendships"? This jock-sniffer was an acquaintance at best ... it doesn't take a licensed clinical psychologist to recognize that Plummer spent all but 6 games in his entire life as the anointed starting quarterback ... he just couldn't stand he pressure of competition. It's obvious Fatsis doesn't get that, which is too bad. In fact, I bet Plummer never reads the book.

And it's sad when a guy like Fatsis pretends he "couldn't afford" a trip to the Galapagos Islands. :oyvey: A Wall Street Journal reporter whose book about Scrabble was briefly a best-seller ... ??? Don't play poor-boy with me, richard.

[sfatsis]

Hey Orange Mane regulars. Stefan Fatsis here. I must say I’m surprised by the vitriol over my Deadspin post but am glad to come aboard here and face the music. As some of you correctly detected, no hate was intended in the piece. A bit of sarcasm, sure, but no hate. It’s Deadspin! It’s supposed to be funny.

Let’s start with Plummer. Do I like Jake? Absolutely. And I respect him enormously. I included him in the post because he was a central figure on the Broncos I knew and what he said reflects a reality of life in the NFL that I wanted to convey at the outset of the piece. I truly didn’t intend to stir the pot about Jake v. Jay (which, by the way, had nothing to do with Jake not being able to stand a little competition; Cutler was as surprised as anyone to have been named starter when he was). Would the Broncos have made the playoff in 2006 with Jake starting? Probably. Would they have won the Super Bowl. Highly unlikely. Does it matter now? Not a bit.

Everything I’ve written about the Broncos is informed, of course, by the three months I spent embedded with the team and by the relationships I formed with everyone from Mike to Ted to Jake to Jay (and Jay’s dad) to 100 other people in the organization that fans have never heard of. Despite what some of you might believe, I had no specific interest in writing about Jay or anyone else in particular on that team. (There are plenty of prominent players who don’t appear much in the book.) As a writer, you go with the most compelling characters, and those who represent the broader points you’re seeking to convey, and who have the most interesting stories to tell. I was fortunate that there were many compelling, thoughtful, intelligent and honest players on the Broncos team that I was privileged to spend time with.

Someone remarked that I didn’t have much more access than any other reporter, which is funny if you know how the NFL treats reporters. In the history of the league, two writers have been allowed to suit up for training camp—George Plimpton and me. In any event, it’s less about physical access than it is what you do with it. I’m proud that so many members of the 2006 team candidly shared their stories and feelings about playing in the NFL, and proud of the reality of pro football I was able to depict.

I’m the furthest thing from a “jock sniffer”—I think the book demonstrates that, and my resume, too—and I’m not “butt-hurt” over what happened to anyone on that team. The NFL, as I say, is a brutal business, and every player who signs up knows that. My point was that the departure of Plummer, Lynch, Wilson and others has left the Broncos with few long-tenured, universally respected leaders—and Plummer was a leader in ways fans didn’t see—and the manner in which they were dismissed wasn’t lost on their teammates. But I also say that it might not matter. The larger point is that, given Mike’s firing of Ted Sundquist—who, like Jake, I know and view differently from how you might know and view him—and the multitude of coaching changes and roster moves, this year’s team truly bears the Mike’s stamp.

Finally, someone remarked about my objectivity (or lack thereof). The Deadspin piece isn’t, obviously, a standard team preview or objective journalism in any way. I make a few observations about football, a few observations about the Broncos, tell a couple of stories and link to Nate Jackson’s MySpace page. You’re free to disagree. That’s what being a passionate fan is about. But I do have a perspective on this organization, and the NFL in general, that few writers get to have. As I tell people, I didn’t write a book about the 2006 Denver Broncos, I wrote a book about the modern NFL. The players who have read it get that. I hope you all do, too.

Enjoy the season.

Thanks.
Stefan

[TheReverend]

Hey Orange Mane regulars. Stefan Fatsis here. I must say I’m surprised by the vitriol over my Deadspin post but am glad to come aboard here and face the music. As some of you correctly detected, no hate was intended in the piece. A bit of sarcasm, sure, but no hate. It’s Deadspin! It’s supposed to be funny.

Let’s start with Plummer. Do I like Jake? Absolutely. And I respect him enormously. I included him in the post because he was a central figure on the Broncos I knew and what he said reflects a reality of life in the NFL that I wanted to convey at the outset of the piece. I truly didn’t intend to stir the pot about Jake v. Jay (which, by the way, had nothing to do with Jake not being able to stand a little competition; Cutler was as surprised as anyone to have been named starter when he was). Would the Broncos have made the playoff in 2006 with Jake starting? Probably. Would they have won the Super Bowl. Highly unlikely. Does it matter now? Not a bit.

Everything I’ve written about the Broncos is informed, of course, by the three months I spent embedded with the team and by the relationships I formed with everyone from Mike to Ted to Jake to Jay (and Jay’s dad) to 100 other people in the organization that fans have never heard of. Despite what some of you might believe, I had no specific interest in writing about Jay or anyone else in particular on that team. (There are plenty of prominent players who don’t appear much in the book.) As a writer, you go with the most compelling characters, and those who represent the broader points you’re seeking to convey, and who have the most interesting stories to tell. I was fortunate that there were many compelling, thoughtful, intelligent and honest players on the Broncos team that I was privileged to spend time with.

Someone remarked that I didn’t have much more access than any other reporter, which is funny if you know how the NFL treats reporters. In the history of the league, two writers have been allowed to suit up for training camp—George Plimpton and me. In any event, it’s less about physical access than it is what you do with it. I’m proud that so many members of the 2006 team candidly shared their stories and feelings about playing in the NFL, and proud of the reality of pro football I was able to depict.

I’m the furthest thing from a “jock sniffer”—I think the book demonstrates that, and my resume, too—and I’m not “butt-hurt” over what happened to anyone on that team. The NFL, as I say, is a brutal business, and every player who signs up knows that. My point was that the departure of Plummer, Lynch, Wilson and others has left the Broncos with few long-tenured, universally respected leaders—and Plummer was a leader in ways fans didn’t see—and the manner in which they were dismissed wasn’t lost on their teammates. But I also say that it might not matter. The larger point is that, given Mike’s firing of Ted Sundquist—who, like Jake, I know and view differently from how you might know and view him—and the multitude of coaching changes and roster moves, this year’s team truly bears the Mike’s stamp.

Finally, someone remarked about my objectivity (or lack thereof). The Deadspin piece isn’t, obviously, a standard team preview or objective journalism in any way. I make a few observations about football, a few observations about the Broncos, tell a couple of stories and link to Nate Jackson’s MySpace page. You’re free to disagree. That’s what being a passionate fan is about. But I do have a perspective on this organization, and the NFL in general, that few writers get to have. As I tell people, I didn’t write a book about the 2006 Denver Broncos, I wrote a book about the modern NFL. The players who have read it get that. I hope you all do, too.

Enjoy the season.

Thanks.
Stefan

I don't think anyone has a significant issue with what you've said, but some of it is clearly misused by yourself.

You criticize Jay for being aloof, but it was the 2006 season that you spent with the team. How exactly SHOULD a ROOKIE, thrust into a starting role, replacing a BELOVED team leader on a veteran team act? Guns blazing so he can face the inevitable "Who the **** is this kid?" routine?

And I tend to agree with the rest that your comments on Jay's dad were in poor taste. I'm not sure if you're a parent or not, but if you were, wouldn't you be proud of your star QB, multi-millionaire son, and defend him against the likes of reporters much like yourself?

Lastly, on Sunquist, can you define what could possibly give you the impression that he WAS smart and deserving of his job? Because I can assure you as Bronco fans we have ZERO evidence in that direction... and, judging by the crickets heard while he waited for job offers by the phone, apparently we're not the only ones feeling this way.

We understand you built friendships on a personal level, and though the personal level is interesting to us, we're fans... we truly care about the product on the field that affects us (remotely) on Sundays.

[chrisp]

Hey Orange Mane regulars. Stefan Fatsis here. I must say I’m surprised by the vitriol over my Deadspin post but am glad to come aboard here and face the music. As some of you correctly detected, no hate was intended in the piece. A bit of sarcasm, sure, but no hate. It’s Deadspin! It’s supposed to be funny.

Well props to you for coming back on the site to face the music - really, I mean that. I can cope with people saying things I don't like if they're prepared to discuss and defend them, so often the thing i hate about the media is that they drop bombs on teams without being accountable (i.e. when they are later proved to be wrong no-one holds them up for it).

I can also accept that a lot of the perceived negativity in your article is more tone than specific content - implications rather than allegations, which we are free to take as we find, however there is one thing I find truly objectionable and one thing I vehemently disagree with:

THE OBJECTIONABLE: criticising a father for being proud of his son? What is wrong with you? If you get sick of it, walk away, of course he's going to be full of his son's success and potential. We'll know more after this season I feel, but it looks like he's going to be proved right anyway...

THE JUST PLAIN WRONG: Ted Sundquist was the main reason the 2005 Broncos were just not good enough to go further than they did and you'll have to come up with a helluva lot of evidence to convince me that a) he wasn't already a dead man walking by the time you hit camp, and b) he had any talent whatsoever. I'm sure he put the hours in and was a friendly and genial chap, but talent with personnel? Where is he now? Oh yes THE MEDIA - says it all really.

I may buy and read your book, or I may not, and I do feel that overall a lot of what you say is fair comment (plus you have a book to sell so you have to make things sound exciting), however I did want to clarify what I thought was OK and what was not. I get the feeling that a lot of my fellow posters feel the same way i do.

[thumpc]

Hi Stefan, thanks for showing up. Ted must be highly inteligent to hold the GM spot as long as he did. Do you have any insight to our draft philosophy in those years? How much input did Sundquist have then?

[Beantown Bronco]

7-4 with Plummer and 2-3 without him.

Denver would have beaten both S.F. and Seattle if Plummer would have started.

Thats how i feel.

We make the playoffs with Plummer.

Offensive scoring went up by over 10 pts a game once the QB switch was made, and it still wasn't enough to overcome the lack of defensive effort in the second half of the year. Let's end this "make the playoffs with Jake" myth now please.

[TheReverend]

Offensive scoring went up by over 10 pts a game once the QB switch was made, and it still wasn't enough to overcome the lack of defensive effort in the second half of the year. Let's end this "make the playoffs with Jake" myth now please.

The defense didn't "fall apart down the stretch" that season. They quit. The whole team quit.

Does it matter? We're in a better place now because of it.

[sfatsis]

I'll quickly answer a couple of comments and try to come back later.

1. Re the Cutlers: All I can say is how you treat others -- including reporters, embedded writers and fans -- is how you should expect to be treated. Jay Cutler is a fine QB and his father is certainly proud of him. But if you don't show people with a little respect, you won't get much in return. I'm surprised that people find this objectionable (especially compared to what was written about Plummer). Plus, it wasn't as if my notebook was hidden at any moment when I was with the Broncos. Jay could have a long and very prosperous NFL career. But he's still pretty young and, it seems to me, has much to learn.

2. Re Ted: There is one ultimate decision-making authority in this organization, and it's no secret who it is: Mike Shanahan. Draft preparation is a collaborative effort. Can you be sure who made the final calls on who was drafted in any year? Do you think Ted had the ability to overrule Mike? But I have no detailed information about any draft other than 2006 -- which was pretty good, wouldn't you say?

As I write in my book, Ted brought fiscal balance at a time when the Broncos were heading down a rocky path, a more logical approach to contracts, a principled method of dealing with players and agents, plenty of football acumen, and a healthy workplace environment. Did his working relationship with Mike worsen? Absolutely, and you saw the result (which I cover in the epilogue to the book).

Again, I write from the perspective of someone who got to observe these interactions closely for a few months in a single year, and to observe them differently from how you do. I respect Ted and I respect Mike for different reasons. Writers and fans like to place blame -- it's easier that way -- but blame is a tricky thing to place in pro sports, which obviously are a lot more complicated than we know.

Thanks again.

Stefan

[Kaylore]

I don't think anyone has a significant issue with what you've said, but some of it is clearly misused by yourself.

You criticize Jay for being aloof, but it was the 2006 season that you spent with the team. How exactly SHOULD a ROOKIE, thrust into a starting role, replacing a BELOVED team leader on a veteran team act? Guns blazing so he can face the inevitable "Who the **** is this kid?" routine?

And I tend to agree with the rest that your comments on Jay's dad were in poor taste. I'm not sure if you're a parent or not, but if you were, wouldn't you be proud of your star QB, multi-millionaire son, and defend him against the likes of reporters much like yourself?

Lastly, on Sunquist, can you define what could possibly give you the impression that he WAS smart and deserving of his job? Because I can assure you as Bronco fans we have ZERO evidence in that direction... and, judging by the crickets heard while he waited for job offers by the phone, apparently we're not the only ones feeling this way.

We understand you built friendships on a personal level, and though the personal level is interesting to us, we're fans... we truly care about the product on the field that affects us (remotely) on Sundays.
I agree with this. I think most of the Bronco fans agreed with everything except the unnecessary shot taken at Jay's dad (I mean honestly, the guy isn't even in the NFL. He's just a proud father who is defensive of his son's critics. Making him a target in the this whole mess was unfair.) and the Sundquist comment. Beyond that, we didn't disagree with the bulk of your piece.

[Kaylore]

I'll quickly answer a couple of comments and try to come back later.

1. Re the Cutlers: All I can say is how you treat others -- including reporters, embedded writers and fans -- is how you should expect to be treated. Jay Cutler is a fine QB and his father is certainly proud of him. But if you don't show people with a little respect, you won't get much in return. I'm surprised that people find this objectionable (especially compared to what was written about Plummer). Plus, it wasn't as if my notebook was hidden at any moment when I was with the Broncos. Jay could have a long and very prosperous NFL career. But he's still pretty young and, it seems to me, has much to learn.

2. Re Ted: There is one ultimate decision-making authority in this organization, and it's no secret who it is: Mike Shanahan. Draft preparation is a collaborative effort. Can you be sure who made the final calls on who was drafted in any year? Do you think Ted had the ability to overrule Mike? But I have no detailed information about any draft other than 2006 -- which was pretty good, wouldn't you say?

As I write in my book, Ted brought fiscal balance at a time when the Broncos were heading down a rocky path, a more logical approach to contracts, a principled method of dealing with players and agents, plenty of football acumen, and a healthy workplace environment. Did his working relationship with Mike worsen? Absolutely, and you saw the result (which I cover in the epilogue to the book).

Again, I write from the perspective of someone who got to observe these interactions closely for a few months in a single year, and to observe them differently from how you do. I respect Ted and I respect Mike for different reasons. Writers and fans like to place blame -- it's easier that way -- but blame is a tricky thing to place in pro sports, which obviously are a lot more complicated than we know.

Thanks again.

Stefan
I don't think anyone is saying Sundquist is an idiot. However that doesn't make him a good GM. He was brought in to interview at other franchises for open GM jobs before and was never hired. Now he is working for a football rumor website. You won't find anyone here who isn't prepared to level blame at Shanahan for some of the stupid draft and free agent moves, but it is widely known that some of the bigger debacles of late (the Browncos) were the brainchild of Ted Sundquist. Sometimes all it takes to see what someone is really worth is see what other people think of them and in Ted's case the answer is "not a whole lot".

[Hogan11]

I thought Cutler's old man was a riot when I met him.....of course, we were both drunk so maybe that had something to do with it Ha!

[RaiderH8r]

Dude, there are a lot of folks that need to take a breath over this one. Step back and breathe.

First, read the book. It becomes evident early on that there are a multitude of personality types within the NFL but all of them have the same struggles. It's easy as fans to say, "plug him in" or "scrape him off" but it's not that easy. I think the Broncos in his book came off pretty well, the writing was honest and so were they. The piece about Ian Gold in particular, opened my eyes. I think he might be a guy that I could actually get along with. Yeah, he's not the team first, rah rah guy, he's playing a business, he's going to work, he's treating football the same way football treats players. Do I agree with it? Can't say, he's in a unique position and it's tough to be in those shoes (tougher for me now that I've read the book. For the first time in a long time I remember what 2 and 3 a day practices did to a body and a mind and the misery of that came rushing back). But he's 100% honest about it and I can respect that. He didn't hide his agenda behind a facade. And he shared some of his momma's home made cake with the squad. Bad guys don't share momma's home made cake.

It's clear Fatsis does develop a respect and admiration for the players, particularly Jake. Again, I can't blame him. I love Jake, still do. I think he's a guy who had a bit of Vietnam syndrome from his days in AZ and suffered flashbacks from time to time (in the football sense). But Jake was always honest, passionate, and put his best out on the field every day (even though some days that wasn't very good) and most importantly, he commanded the respect of his teammates. I think we give Jake a bad rap and maybe, just maybe, we've got Elway out of our system now. Jake was stuck in a tough spot, we had a chance to get an elite QB in the draft and that doesn't happen often for our club and we took it. I don't regret it, it was a forward looking move by management and Jake was a casualty of that. Jake's moved on, we should too. I sincerely hope Jake is happy in his new life.

I was also unaware of how Sundquist moved up through the organization to become GM. Say what you will about his skills as a GM he brought levity to our cap approach and he's a self made guy. I may not like the moves he made and we may be better off without him, but to call him an idiot is an ill informed judgement.

Al Wilson. I damn near cry every time I think about that guy. I'd lay in traffic if I thought it would get him back to 100% and in a Broncos uni. He deserved a much longer career and much broader appreciation for his talent as a player. I will always exhalt his achievements and what he meant to this club. He's a guy who was too small to play but his heart and spirit were indominable, he'll always be my Adopt a Bronco. Al Wilson eats rocks and sh!ts gunpowder.

Bowlen. Holy Christ I had no idea the guy was that easy going with the players and funny. I wish there were more Bowlen in the book. "Nice f'n boots Mr. B.". "Yeah, these f'ers are ostrich skin you should get some."

I'm about 2/3ds of the way through the book (I got it Monday night) and thoroughly enjoy it. I'll turn the last page, flip the book over, and start again.

[sfatsis]

Ted was fired in the spring, well after the season had ended, a time when GMs aren't normally fired or hired. I'm not saying that he'll definitely get a job next season--I have no inside information--but don't read much into the fact that he hasn't so far. None of us has any idea how much his phone has been ringing. And so what if he's doing some media? So are most other former NFL GMs. Good for Ted, I say, for learning about the NFL's online world from the other side.

Stefan

[TheReverend]

Ted was fired in the spring, well after the season had ended, a time when GMs aren't normally fired or hired. I'm not saying that he'll definitely get a job next season--I have no inside information--but don't read much into the fact that he hasn't so far. None of us has any idea how much his phone has been ringing. And so what if he's doing some media? So are most other former NFL GMs. Good for Ted, I say, for learning about the NFL's online world from the other side.

Stefan

Some work for outlets like ESPN and the NFLN as legitimate analysts.

Others, who shall remain nameless, take jobs at NFL rumor rags.

No one claimed he wasn't a worthwhile capologist, but seriously, a GM's duties entail much more.

I also noticed you referenced the 2006 draft and commented on the success Denver had. I'm sure you've realized those successes came from a certain region our NEW personnel guru was scouting for?

[rovolution]

Ted was fired in the spring, well after the season had ended, a time when GMs aren't normally fired or hired. I'm not saying that he'll definitely get a job next season--I have no inside information--but don't read much into the fact that he hasn't so far. None of us has any idea how much his phone has been ringing. And so what if he's doing some media? So are most other former NFL GMs. Good for Ted, I say, for learning about the NFL's online world from the other side.

Stefan

Mr. Fatsis, loved your book by the way, but not a big fan of your Deadspin piece.

During your time with the Broncos organization, did you happen to meet this burly looking fellow (Jim Goodman)?

http://www.denverbroncos.com/resources/custom/Staff%20Photos/2008/goodman_jim_mug08.jpg


and/or his son (Jeff Goodman)?

http://www.denverbroncos.com/resources/custom/Staff%20Photos/2008/goodman_jeff_mug08.jpg

Did Sundquist make any remarks about these two actually getting to make GM-like decisions and rising above him in the Broncos totem pole of power?


The consensus here at the OM is that these two had much more to do with the recent success we have had in the draft than Sundquist did, particularly in 2006 with Brandon, Elvis, Tony, Kuper, and Jay.

[thumpc]

That's what it comes down to Mr. Fatsis. We just need you to verify that our current front office structure will reel in four or five stars out of each draft, for the next twelve seasons, now that Ted has hit the road.

[broncofan7]

Sfatsis,
I certainly respect you for coming on here and taking the 'live fire' from some on this board. I enjoyed reading your book because you had perspective that all of us would love the chance to have--access to the team, coaches and management on a personal level. I agree with you and not the others on this board, that if Jay's Dad really said ``You haven’t read any of the magazine stories, have you?’’ after you having asked him about what Jay was like growing up in Santa Claus, IN--that is a very pompous and arrogant response--. I am not privy to the questions that you asked Jay's father, but I doubt that you were asking any offensive questions of him. Regarding Jay's aloofness, I appreciate your insight but I can rationalize that characterization due to the simple fact that he was a rookie QB from an unhearalded football school trying to find his place on a 2006 AFC championship game participant. I imagine he is much more vocal, demonstrative and forth coming than he was as a rookie. All in all, YOU were given access that none of US have, and if that is YOUR summary of YOUR experiences, who are WE to argue? Pretty silly in my eyes and a great read for all Bronco fans

[alkemical]

Sfatsis,
I certainly respect you for coming on here and taking the 'live fire' from some on this board. I enjoyed reading your book because you had perspective that all of us would love the chance to have--access to the team, coaches and management on a personal level. I agree with you and not the others on this board, that if Jay's Dad really said ``You haven’t read any of the magazine stories, have you?’’ after you having asked him about what Jay was like growing up in Santa Claus, IN--that is a very pompous and arrogant response--. I am not privy to the questions that you asked Jay's father, but I doubt that you were asking any offensive questions of him. Regarding Jay's aloofness, I appreciate your insight but I can rationalize that characterization due to the simple fact that he was a rookie QB from an unhearalded football school trying to find his place on a 2006 AFC championship game participant. I imagine he is much more vocal, demonstrative and forth coming than he was as a rookie. All in all, YOU were given access that none of US have, and if that is YOUR summary of YOUR experiences, who are WE to argue? Pretty silly in my eyes and a great read for all Bronco fans

I respect this post.

[worm]

Did the Goodman's buy that tie in bulk?

[worm]

The NFL is no different than any other business in the corporate world where there is a lot at stake. There are many different viewpoints, perspectives and strongly held positions.

I could have been the MLB for the Broncos in 2006 and my experiences and opinions of the Denver hierarchy, players and company politics would most probably have been vastly different than Stefan's.

Being embedded in a team for three months doesn't make your viewpoint correct. I have worked side by side with people for a hell of a lot longer than that and we have very different perspectives on the history, politics and value of the company and its C levels.

The Bible According to Fatsis is NOT the definitive, true source on the 2006 Denver Broncos. It is what it is...a compelling read from a specific perspective. Take it or leave it....but don't unilaterally cosign it as the One and Only Truth.

[Rock Chalk]

Offensive scoring went up by over 10 pts a game once the QB switch was made, and it still wasn't enough to overcome the lack of defensive effort in the second half of the year. Let's end this "make the playoffs with Jake" myth now please.
Consider that when Jay took ever the whole team laid down.

Or did you not see it? Even in Jakes last game against KC, the defense played pretty damn good. We lost because Jake played pretty poorly (a common thing in Arrowhead for most Denver QBs throughout our history), but the defense was still playing.

When Jay took over, teh defense laid down. The whole team just gave up with the exception of possibly Rod and Lynch. Everyone was done because everyone knew we were playing for the future.

Im ok with that (now). Its obvious it wouldnt have mattered even had we made the playoffs with Jake at the helm. But what you dont seem to understand is that the team quit when Jay started. They KNEW the season was over. Everyone but the biggest dick sucking Cutler fans on this board knew that season was over. There were high hopes among that crowd, but realistic fans knew Jay was going to struggle when he first got thrust in.

Those 5 games didnt help him the next year either. He struggled mightily last year. Those 5 games werent going to give him the advantage this year either.

This is so tired of a debate too. You can speculate all you want one way or another, and we can do the same, but in the end it really doesnt matter.

What is not a myth is that we were a better team with Cutler that year. How can we be a better team when the team quit on Jay being named the starter (not quit on Jay, the team quit on Shanahan). We were not a great team that year, nor were we last year and we probably wont be great this year. This year, finally after Jay has worked out all his rookie issues that I can see, we might at least be a good team again.

[Beantown Bronco]

Consider that when Jay took ever the whole team laid down.

Or did you not see it? Even in Jakes last game against KC, the defense played pretty damn good. We lost because Jake played pretty poorly (a common thing in Arrowhead for most Denver QBs throughout our history), but the defense was still playing.

When Jay took over, teh defense laid down. The whole team just gave up with the exception of possibly Rod and Lynch. Everyone was done because everyone knew we were playing for the future.

Im ok with that (now). Its obvious it wouldnt have mattered even had we made the playoffs with Jake at the helm. But what you dont seem to understand is that the team quit when Jay started. They KNEW the season was over. Everyone but the biggest dick sucking Cutler fans on this board knew that season was over. There were high hopes among that crowd, but realistic fans knew Jay was going to struggle when he first got thrust in.



Your bolded statements are proved false by the mere fact that the offense scored on average more points with Jay under center than Jake. By definition, the offense could not have quit, otherwise they would've certainly scored less......not more.

I will never argue that the defense didn't quit.

Either way......like you say, it doesn't matter today.

[Atlas]

We beat Seattle if Clark doesn't fumble that kickoff.

OK and Denver beats Seattle if Plummer starts also so what's your point.

[RaiderH8r]

The NFL is no different than any other business in the corporate world where there is a lot at stake. There are many different viewpoints, perspectives and strongly held positions.

I could have been the MLB for the Broncos in 2006 and my experiences and opinions of the Denver hierarchy, players and company politics would most probably have been vastly different than Stefan's.

Being embedded in a team for three months doesn't make your viewpoint correct. I have worked side by side with people for a hell of a lot longer than that and we have very different perspectives on the history, politics and value of the company and its C levels.

The Bible According to Fatsis is NOT the definitive, true source on the 2006 Denver Broncos. It is what it is...a compelling read from a specific perspective. Take it or leave it....but don't unilaterally cosign it as the One and Only Truth.

I don't know that anyone has suggested that is the case, but I could be wrong.

Personally I found it a thoughtful and unique perspective on an NFL team that happens to be my favorite. While most readers don't know of Chad Mustard, Parsons, etc I do and I was interested to get a little insight into their mindsets as the author related them. If another book about the Broncos were to come out that examined the behind the scenes operations I would hop on that too and take it for what it's worth, it's own perspective. Because information of this type is so rare and difficult to come by I treasure each bit that does come down the pipe.

[RaiderH8r]

Consider that when Jay took ever the whole team laid down.

Or did you not see it? Even in Jakes last game against KC, the defense played pretty damn good. We lost because Jake played pretty poorly (a common thing in Arrowhead for most Denver QBs throughout our history), but the defense was still playing.

When Jay took over, teh defense laid down. The whole team just gave up with the exception of possibly Rod and Lynch. Everyone was done because everyone knew we were playing for the future.

Im ok with that (now). Its obvious it wouldnt have mattered even had we made the playoffs with Jake at the helm. But what you dont seem to understand is that the team quit when Jay started. They KNEW the season was over. Everyone but the biggest dick sucking Cutler fans on this board knew that season was over. There were high hopes among that crowd, but realistic fans knew Jay was going to struggle when he first got thrust in.

Those 5 games didnt help him the next year either. He struggled mightily last year. Those 5 games werent going to give him the advantage this year either.

This is so tired of a debate too. You can speculate all you want one way or another, and we can do the same, but in the end it really doesnt matter.

What is not a myth is that we were a better team with Cutler that year. How can we be a better team when the team quit on Jay being named the starter (not quit on Jay, the team quit on Shanahan). We were not a great team that year, nor were we last year and we probably wont be great this year. This year, finally after Jay has worked out all his rookie issues that I can see, we might at least be a good team again.

I once heard Billick say it takes about 30 starts to get a good feel of how a QB will perform in the NFL. Say what you will about Billick but I think the 30 starts point is salient. Which is to say this season and next we should see Jay either blossom or plateau (I don't know that with his raw talent he'll ever truly bust).

[lostknight]

First of all, welcome to the mane, and thanks for charging into controversy head on. Please ignore the stupid one line trolls. They are a side effect of any open forum ;-)


Let’s start with Plummer. Do I like Jake? Absolutely. And I respect him enormously. I included him in the post because he was a central figure on the Broncos I knew and what he said reflects a reality of life in the NFL that I wanted to convey at the outset of the piece. I truly didn’t intend to stir the pot about Jake v. Jay (which, by the way, had nothing to do with Jake not being able to stand a little competition; Cutler was as surprised as anyone to have been named starter when he was). Would the Broncos have made the playoff in 2006 with Jake starting? Probably. Would they have won the Super Bowl. Highly unlikely. Does it matter now? Not a bit.


When there is a elephant in the room, introduce them.

There is a friction between liking specific individuals and building a team of top performers. That friction grows or shrinks depending on if you like the person (or in most of our cases - the media image of the individual) There was considerably more gnashing of teeth when Al Wilson was let go off then there was when Jake Plummer was benched (to be fair, the benching of Plummer was far less controversial in Denver then it was in the National Media).

If performance is king, then the dismissal of Jake (who was immediately outplayed by Jay Cutler, had lost two of the previous three games, and whose time of possession statistics where a huge reason that defense collapsed starting with the Colts game for the rest of the season), John Lynch, Al Wilson, etc makes perfect sense. If character is king Jake also had a problem. To borrow someone else analogy, Jake was Batman in a town that lives for Superman. It's not just a Elway thing - it also helps explain Tulo's popularity, Carmelo's lack of it, and why Jake and the fans always had a bit of a war going on.


In the history of the league, two writers have been allowed to suit up for training camp—George Plimpton and me.


My comment is that I think you were a bit blind to both of these factors because of your friendship with Jake, but also because your book focuses on a central character - you.

I am not bashing that - Personal narratives have a advantage in letting the reader know what it felt like to be in your shoes ("Into Thin Air" being my favorite in this category). It's easy to see the same arrogance and destructive tendencies in Anatoli Boukreev as in Mike Shanahan as you portray him.

But it makes sure that the only way we know people is by their interactions with you. And characterization as a NYT best selling author has weight.


this year’s team truly bears the Mike’s stamp.


Undoubtedly. Mike has no one to hide behind.


Plus, it wasn't as if my notebook was hidden at any moment when I was with the Broncos.


I am reminded a bit of the movie Almost Famous, which in turn is a semi-autobiographical piece. The reporter is always regarded as the enemy, because they no longer can control the image there project to their fans, who expect them to behave in a certain fashion and represent some intangible that we all want to be.

The NFL is as much about Celebrity as it is about Performance. Fans also want it to be about community.

You, as reporters and authors have extreme power over the lives of players when it comes to the celebrity factor. The order of QB's selected in the 2006 draft was almost exactly like the media projected. Doing a quick google search: Vince Young signed a $26.5 million guaranteed money deal. Matt Leinart (drafted one position above Jay) got $14 million. Jay got $11 million. In retrospect, there is no question that on a purely statistical level Jay Cutler is a far better quarterback at this stage, then the other two.

Yet he was the third person drafted. Partially that's on the coaches, but even more so, the effect that media stories can have on where a player is drafted is immense. When coaches diverge from the standard wisdom that the media graciously dispenses from on high, they are questioned. Coaches of course don't always have to respond, but public perception plays a role in their contracts as well.

Is it any wonder that Jay Culter, being the new QB in town in a place where Elway could win any political office in the state just by announcing that he is running, might be more then a little stand offish? Because of how you introduce Jay in your book, as well as the shot taken at his father above - there are people who will completely define their perception of the person, and of the player by the fact that a possibly scared (and perhaps pissed off) rookie might have avoided you in a locker room, or a dad got somewhat annoyed at a reporter he viewed as possibly shortchanging his son.

Again, welcome to the mane. Your comments add a lot of value to this forum, and i look forward to reading any other posts ;-)

[Fedaykin]

Those 5 games didnt help him the next year either. He struggled mightily last year. Those 5 games werent going to give him the advantage this year either.


That's a load of bull****. As expected, Cutler made (and learned from) a lot of bonehead mistakes (e.g. the last second desperation throw while being sacked that ended up going straight up) in those five games. Most of those mistakes were not repeated in '07 and he gained valuable experience with NFL game experience (speed, defenses, etc.), so to claim that those 5 games weren't valuable to him is a crock of ****.

[cutlerfan]

Cutler is a cool guy. I have sat down with him many times just talking. I don't give a rats behind what this writer says. Jay is way cool.

Example I was at Cabana's a bar here in Nashville and Jay and I were talking about the draft. People were asking if they could have their picture with him and he always did. Heck he made his way around the bar talking to people.

Nashville loves Jay. Is it any wonder why he comes here in the off season?

True story!

Here is Jay last year on the bye week.

http://i203.photobucket.com/albums/aa306/bassdb/_PJL0907.jpg

With the Chancellor

http://i203.photobucket.com/albums/aa306/bassdb/twirlers.jpg

With some people in the band - baton girls.

[RaiderH8r]

Cutler is a cool guy. I have sat down with him many times just talking. I don't give a rats behind what this writer says. Jay is way cool.

Example I was at Cabana's a bar here in Nashville and Jay and I were talking about the draft. People were asking if they could have their picture with him and he always did. Heck he made he way around the bar talking to people.

Nashville loves Jay. Is it any wonder why he comes here in the off season?

True story!

He's BMOC in Nashville. He's a damn hero there, of course going there would appeal to him.

More than that though, in '06 he's a kid from Santa Claus, IN who went to Vandy to get an education and happened to be drafted into the NFL by a team defined by one of the greatest QB's ever to lace them up. Is it any wonder he might have been a big wide eyed and awkward during that training camp? I'll cut the kid a little lattitude on that one.

[RaiderH8r]

Whatever else may be right about Cutler...he is one goofy looking sumbitch. But he's our goofy lookin sumbitch so it's all good.

He has GOT to get rid of that southern flop, that thing is brutal. It's a close second to having a mullet.

[cutlerfan]

I go back to when he was a freshman when he beat out Benji Walker for the starting QB.

http://www.vanderbilt.edu/commodores/football/Players/cutler-jay.htm

Here is a ticket stub when Jay was a freshman

http://i203.photobucket.com/albums/aa306/bassdb/firstgame.jpg

[broncofan7]

how fitting that our current franchise QB was born the year that we traded for our 1st Franchise QB.

[Fedaykin]

Whatever else may be right about Cutler...he is one goofy looking sumb****. But he's our goofy lookin sumb**** so it's all good.

He has GOT to get rid of that southern flop, that thing is brutal. It's a close second to having a mullet.

Since when is the NFL a fashion show? As long as he produces, he can wear whatever haircut he wants.

[Inkana7]

how fitting that our current franchise QB was born the year that we traded for our 1st Franchise QB.

Within 1 or 2 days of that event, too.

[theAPAOps5]

Cutler is a cool guy. I have sat down with him many times just talking. I don't give a rats behind what this writer says. Jay is way cool.

Example I was at Cabana's a bar here in Nashville and Jay and I were talking about the draft. People were asking if they could have their picture with him and he always did. Heck he made his way around the bar talking to people.

Nashville loves Jay. Is it any wonder why he comes here in the off season?

True story!

Here is Jay last year on the bye week.

http://i203.photobucket.com/albums/aa306/bassdb/_PJL0907.jpg

With the Chancellor

http://i203.photobucket.com/albums/aa306/bassdb/twirlers.jpg

With some people in the band - baton girls.


I hate to break it to you Cutlerfan but Jay doesn't exactly have the best reputation around Denver. Not for his on the field persona but for his off the field. He has rubbed many people the wrong way.

However, so did John Elway. Actually John Elway still does. It doesn't make any of them less a football player just aren't nice people. But at one point or the other everyone isn't a nice person. Jay got thrust into the spotlight pretty quick there is growing pains involved with that. But its not a lie or misnomer that he has been a major prick to people in public.

[Fedaykin]

But its not a lie or misnomer that he has been a major prick to people in public.

Such as.......

I don't doubt that he rubs some people wrong, but just making the claim that he's a major prick doesn't make it true.