Why No Green Car?

[Rohirrim]

The next time you see one of those commercials put out by Chevron telling you how eco-friendly they are, you know, the ones with the lilting butterflies, grazing deer, and babbling brooks, remember this:http://pppad.blogspot.com/2007/05/nimh-held-hostage-by-chevron-texaco.html

http://www.ev1.org/blomberg.htm

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toyota_RAV4_EV
Whether or not Toyota wanted to continue production, it was unlikely to be able to do so, because the EV-95 battery was no longer available. Chevron had inherited control of the worldwide patent rights for the NiMH EV-95 battery when it merged with Texaco, which had purchased them from General Motors. Chevron's unit won a $30,000,000 settlement from Toyota and Panasonic, and the production line for the large NiMH batteries was closed down and dismantled. Only smaller NiMH batteries, incapable of powering an electric vehicle or plugging in, are currently allowed by Chevron-Texaco.

[Spider]

LOL but big oil has to pay taxes

[Rohirrim]

When Chevron saw the reaction of the market in California to the possibility of a plug in car (not a hybrid!) they had to act quickly. Most of those Toyotas have gone beyond 100,000 miles and are still going.

[Spider]

When Chevron saw the reaction of the market in California to the possibility of a plug in car (not a hybrid!) they had to act quickly. Most of those Toyotas have gone beyond 100,000 miles and are still going.
I am waiting for w*gs TO COME IN HERE AND LECTURE you about the free market we have ;D

[The Lone Bolt]

Ummm . . . the NiMH battery is obsolete. The new Chevy Volt will use Li-Ion batteries and will be able to travel it's first 40 miles on electricity alone.

Read more here: http://gm-volt.com/

And if you have been paying attention you'd notice that several major automakers have announced plans for similar plug-in hybrids or EVs in the next few years (e.g. Mitsubishi MiEV, Subaru Se1).

And then there's Tesla, Aptera, and a host of small startups going into production with EVs and plug-in hybrids.

The EV revolution is coming. There's no stopping it now.

[kappys]

But wait I thought Chevron was looking out for my interestsROFL!

[Spider]

But wait I thought Chevron was looking out for my interestsROFL!

But they are , they are protecting us from terrorist at 4.00 a gallon for fuel , making it to expensive t bring illegals over , and for the ones here to drive ..... Chevron loves us and would never ever do anything ot harm us ........and I said all of that with a strait face ;D

[elsid13]

While I don't think that was deep well planned coordinate conspiracy, I do think that there was deliberate decision by several companies to try to protect market share and income and stop any revolutionary disruptive technology to the status quo. There is no technology excuse why we are in the postion we are in today

[Bronco Bob]

Ummm . . . the NiMH battery is obsolete. The new Chevy Volt will use Li-Ion batteries and will be able to travel it's first 40 miles on electricity alone.

Read more here: http://gm-volt.com/

And if you have been paying attention you'd notice that several major automakers have announced plans for similar plug-in hybrids or EVs in the next few years (e.g. Mitsubishi MiEV, Subaru Se1).

And then there's Tesla, Aptera, and a host of small startups going into production with EVs and plug-in hybrids.

The EV revolution is coming. There's no stopping it now.

Yes, lithium ion is the better way to go anyway. Just mining and refining nickel
alone creates a host of environmental problems.

[Rohirrim]

Ummm . . . the NiMH battery is obsolete. The new Chevy Volt will use Li-Ion batteries and will be able to travel it's first 40 miles on electricity alone.

Read more here: http://gm-volt.com/

And if you have been paying attention you'd notice that several major automakers have announced plans for similar plug-in hybrids or EVs in the next few years (e.g. Mitsubishi MiEV, Subaru Se1).

And then there's Tesla, Aptera, and a host of small startups going into production with EVs and plug-in hybrids.

The EV revolution is coming. There's no stopping it now.

If it is so obsolete, why are all those Toyotas still on the road with 100,000 miles and more on their odometers - and still running? Also notice that Chevron is perfectly happy with "hybrids" just not plug-ins.

[Bronco Bob]

If it is so obsolete, why are all those Toyotas still on the road with 100,000 miles and more on their odometers - and still running? Also notice that Chevron is perfectly happy with "hybrids" just not plug-ins.

No one said the NiMH battery wasn't a workable technology.
Just that the Lithium-Ion is a better technology that doesn't
have the environmental impact that mining and refining nickel
has. Eventually the NiMH battery would have been phased out
anyway. Cars like the Tesla have been designed from the
ground up to use L-ion, because it packs more power to weight
and lasts longer.

[Rohirrim]

Yes, lithium ion is the better way to go anyway. Just mining and refining nickel
alone creates a host of environmental problems.

Like drilling oil doesn't? Then I wonder why Chevron killed it? If it was not a threat, who cares? If they didn't want to bother utilizing the technology themselves, why didn't they just work out a licensing agreement with Panasonic and Toyota instead of suing them and shutting down the large battery technology manufacture? Companies agree to such patent licensing agreements every day. And why did Chevron allow the smaller battery technology to go ahead? Because it can only be used in hybrids?

[Rohirrim]

Another point:
Solar rooftop systems on every roof in America. Each person, on average, has 1000 square feet of roof area, enough for 100 square meters of solar system. After allowance for shade, roof configuration, etc., this enables a solar system of at least 20 square meters per person, or 2 kilo-Watts to 4 kilo-Watts per person -- more than enough to power 100 miles of Electric car driving per day. This solves the daytime peak power problem, and simultaneously helps cool the homes under the roofs. This "EV-PV" is no fantasy, it's reality for those driving Electric cars, using the money saved from gas to pay for their rooftop solar systems.

[Drek]

Ummm . . . the NiMH battery is obsolete. The new Chevy Volt will use Li-Ion batteries and will be able to travel it's first 40 miles on electricity alone.

Read more here: http://gm-volt.com/

And if you have been paying attention you'd notice that several major automakers have announced plans for similar plug-in hybrids or EVs in the next few years (e.g. Mitsubishi MiEV, Subaru Se1).

And then there's Tesla, Aptera, and a host of small startups going into production with EVs and plug-in hybrids.

The EV revolution is coming. There's no stopping it now.

The Chevy Volt is a piece of **** PR move.

Chevy doesn't tell you that their original body design scored basically identical wind tunnel results forward and backward.

Chevy is about a decade behind on the green car market, pretty much as bad as Ford, and they're only making half hearted attempts at even catching up.

[enjolras]

If it is so obsolete, why are all those Toyotas still on the road with 100,000 miles and more on their odometers - and still running? Also notice that Chevron is perfectly happy with "hybrids" just not plug-ins.

I have a friend who still has a Betamax player.

[Rohirrim]

I have a friend who still has a Betamax player.

The point being made is that the technology has proven to be very successful and at the right price and every person who has one is very happy with it and yet there is a campaign to discredit these batteries and these cars. Smells like tobacco company stink to me.

[The Lone Bolt]

The Chevy Volt is a piece of **** PR move.

Chevy doesn't tell you that their original body design scored basically identical wind tunnel results forward and backward.

Chevy is about a decade behind on the green car market, pretty much as bad as Ford, and they're only making half hearted attempts at even catching up.

The Volt has been approved for production. That means they are making it, period.

And the production model (unlike the prototype) has a drag coefficient very close to a Prius.

If you think that it's just a PR stunt then you have not done any research on it.

[MO<1>]

Another leftist conspiracy theory! Has the left given up on Roswell yet?

[Rohirrim]

Another leftist conspiracy theory! Has the left given up on Roswell yet?

Yeah, there's no court case in the Federal Record called Cobasys vs. Toyota/Panasonic. It's all just made up. Moron.

[Spider]

Another leftist conspiracy theory! Has the left given up on Roswell yet?

Happy hour over so soon ?

[MO<1>]

Yeah, there's no court case in the Federal Record called Cobasys vs. Toyota/Panasonic. It's all just made up. Moron.

Sue happy people always make things up! Then they start the name calling. Then they attack people that are not in their same herd of sheep. Any Nippon bashing in your past? Seek counseling. Please post a link from anywhere besides moveon.org to make LABronco happy!;)

[Bronco Bob]

Like drilling oil doesn't?

Like lithium batteries don't


Then I wonder why Chevron killed it? If it was not a threat, who cares? If they didn't want to bother utilizing the technology themselves, why didn't they just work out a licensing agreement with Panasonic and Toyota instead of suing them and shutting down the large battery technology manufacture? Companies agree to such patent licensing agreements every day. And why did Chevron allow the smaller battery technology to go ahead? Because it can only be used in hybrids?

How should I know. Maybe they are just stupid and didn't realize everyone is going lithium.