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View Full Version : If Cutler has a pro-bowl season in 2008, will Denver make the playoffs?


lex
07-05-2008, 11:54 AM
Want to see how strongly people believe Denvers fate is tied to the arm of Jay Cutler.

tsiguy96
07-05-2008, 11:56 AM
or better question, if he has a pro bowl season, will he actually make the probowl?

BroncoBuff
07-05-2008, 12:00 PM
Obviously the playoffs are preferable to Jay in Hawaii ... but the point is: Our emphasis on the running game on offense, coupled with a poor run defense that keeps Jay on the sideline a lot, means Jay will have a hard time running up the kind of raw numbers needed to impress the dimwitted Pro-Bowl voting myopics.

TheReverend
07-05-2008, 12:05 PM
Obviously the playoffs are preferable to Jay in Hawaii ... but the point is: Our emphasis on the running game on offense, coupled with a poor run defense that keeps Jay on the sideline a lot, means Jay will have a hard time running up the kind of raw numbers needed to impress the dimwitted Pro-Bowl voting myopics.

Could not disagree more. The popular vote is the only time it turns into a stat show, and the majority of the popular votes are popularity contests anyways, and not based on stats. 2/3 of the voting comes from players and coaches. If it was all a stat show, no reason Champ goes in this year or from 2003-2004, but the players who line-up against him, and the coaches that re-arrange game plans around him would've placed their votes else-where.

Drek
07-05-2008, 12:13 PM
He won't get enough press if we aren't a playoff competitor, so yes.

Short of Jay putting up 5000 yards, 40 touchdowns, and a QB rating over 100 he has no shot of getting to the Pro Bowl without us being a playoff competitor. Even then it'll be a stretch, the Pro Bowl is too often guys getting rewarded for the previous season's efforts, not the current one.

UltimateHoboW/Shotgun
07-05-2008, 12:25 PM
Its too early to say. If our defense is ok like in the top 15 or so. Then we will be better to say if we could the playoffs.

Popps
07-05-2008, 01:15 PM
We've seen plenty of QBs put up great seasons without playoff success. A solid year from Cutler certainly is part of the puzzle, but this team's success will lie with the defensive front seven.

As you may recall, this team could have been a playoff team LAST year if our defense could get out of their own way.

atomicbloke
07-05-2008, 01:17 PM
If the defense is anything like last year, we won't make the playoffs even if Elway were the QB....

maher_tyler
07-05-2008, 01:27 PM
If the defense is anything like last year, we won't make the playoffs even if Elway were the QB....

I don't think i can get much worse than it was last year?!?! Robertson should give us help in the middle and with a year under Thomas' belt i think we can expect at least average play from the line. The O line will be interesting to watch!!

wolf754life
07-05-2008, 01:35 PM
can't be worse only better, the broncos only get better not worse...........

duh

Hotwheelz
07-05-2008, 01:53 PM
douchey mcdouche

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theAPAOps5
07-05-2008, 02:23 PM
The real question might be is if Cutler has a pro bowl worthy season and they don't make the playoffs will he go? I think the answer is no. It also depends on the defense not just the QB.

NW Bolt Fan
07-05-2008, 02:56 PM
The real question might be is if Cutler has a pro bowl worthy season and they don't make the playoffs will he go? I think the answer is no. It also depends on the defense not just the QB.Why would you say that? If he has a worthy season- he'll go- AND you guys will make the playoffs.

Cito Pelon
07-05-2008, 03:12 PM
I'm curious about how ignorant Bronco fans will fail to see how Reeves=Shanny in how they handled their franchise QB's. You kids that were born in 1983 or later don't have any idea what happened in Elways first 10 years in the League.

Popps
07-05-2008, 03:14 PM
Why would you say that? If he has a worthy season- he'll go- AND you guys will make the playoffs.

It would basically take an injury to Manning and/or Brady, and Palmer numbers-wise is usually in the hunt. Even if Cutler did pull off a monster upset and beat out one of those guys for a spot, there's no guarantee our defense can stop anyone.

We've seen plenty of teams with huge offenses miss the playoffs, and particularly huge passing games.

Every year I'm on this board preaching that defense and running games win championships and every single year it pans out to be true. I don't expect this year to be any different.

theAPAOps5
07-05-2008, 03:16 PM
Why would you say that? If he has a worthy season- he'll go- AND you guys will make the playoffs.

Possibly but in the AFC with Peyton Manning, Carson Palmer, and Tom Brady its already difficult. I think Denver has to be winning and in the hunt or else media interest will be sparse save for negative press and it will reflect in the voting.

Now if he is chosen by the coaches thats a different matter.

Cito Pelon
07-05-2008, 03:21 PM
Could not disagree more. The popular vote is the only time it turns into a stat show, and the majority of the popular votes are popularity contests anyways, and not based on stats. 2/3 of the voting comes from players and coaches. If it was all a stat show, no reason Champ goes in this year or from 2003-2004, but the players who line-up against him, and the coaches that re-arrange game plans around him would've placed their votes else-where.

I guess you're saying 'Pro-Bowl' and 'All-Pro' are two different things? Did you have a point there?

Cito Pelon
07-05-2008, 03:31 PM
We've seen plenty of QBs put up great seasons without playoff success. A solid year from Cutler certainly is part of the puzzle, but this team's success will lie with the defensive front seven.

As you may recall, this team could have been a playoff team LAST year if our defense could get out of their own way.

The team could have been a playoff team last year without the worst Bronco D in 40 years. But to win a playoff game you need good ST's also.

NW Bolt Fan
07-05-2008, 03:33 PM
Popps & ApaOps5,

While I agree that those 3 are the front runners (particularly Peyton seems to be a shoe-in), it's not out of the question for someone else to make it. However, I'll agree with you on this- if everything were equal, statswise between Manning, Brady, Palmer, and Cutler, then he probably doesn't make it.

But the fact that 2/3 of the voting comes from players and coaches means it's not strictly a popularity contest. Overall record definitely has something to do with it... LT had the 2nd most yards from scrimmage in NFL history in '03 and missed it... Whatever.

But, I also think one of the 3 "early leaders" is likely going to faulter a bit- probably Palmer. With all the waves "Ocho" has been making, coupled with the fact that their O-line isn't all that great, and their head coach is even worse, it wouldn't surprise me a bit to see him play at a sub-standard level.

I think it'll take A-LOT for Cutler to make it though. He's just got a lot working against him. How will the O-line be this year? Will Marshall actually be recovered and in the form he was last year? Personally, I like a few of your wideout acquistions. D. Jackson has speed and a knack for the endzone, but he'll also probably drop 5 or 6 VERY catchable balls that could have been drive/game/season changers. He's had a history of that in Seattle. I actually like Colbert the best for you guys. When he had a decent QB and didn't have to be "the guy," he plays well- AND he's been known to step it up in some bigger games.

I'm not entirely convinced that Kubiak didn't have a lot of the innovation for the offense despite Shanahans track record. As a gameday coach, I think he's one of the best in the game, but I wonder too, about him juggling too many hats for the team.

Couple all that stuff with the defense coming together, and not putting the offense into big holes, and that's why I see it as a long, LONG uphill road for Cutler. Simply getting the diabetes in check has got to be a HUGE boost for him. If Selvin Young lives up to even 2/3 of his expectations, Cutler plays like many of you think he can, the D does indeed make some progress, then you guys will be a surprise team in the NFL this year. Happens every year...

BroncosinDC
07-05-2008, 03:35 PM
I'm curious about how ignorant Bronco fans will fail to see how Reeves=Shanny in how they handled their franchise QB's. You kids that were born in 1983 or later don't have any idea what happened in Elways first 10 years in the League.

I was born in 85, I remember the SI issue. I remember the disdain for Reeves, hence the reason I tried to engineer some hate for Reeves in the hate poll. I also remember the day Wade became the coach and watching the press conference in the kitchen on our black and white TV. I thought my Dad had won the lottery he was so happy.

Are you referring to him not letting Jay loose? Or the constant emphasis on trying to run first. Because the big difference is a solid running game for us now, open up our passing play book. So in order to let Jay do bootlegs, PA passes we need a running game to make the defense respect it.

tsiguy96
07-05-2008, 03:37 PM
The team could have been a playoff team last year without the worst Bronco D in 40 years. But to win a playoff game you need good ST's also.

well last year, if you look at the GB and chicago game, 2 games that we gave away the win, we could have been a playoff contender..

Cito Pelon
07-05-2008, 03:45 PM
It would basically take an injury to Manning and/or Brady, and Palmer numbers-wise is usually in the hunt. Even if Cutler did pull off a monster upset and beat out one of those guys for a spot, there's no guarantee our defense can stop anyone.

We've seen plenty of teams with huge offenses miss the playoffs, and particularly huge passing games.

Every year I'm on this board preaching that defense and running games win championships and every single year it pans out to be true. I don't expect this year to be any different.

And every year I'm telling you it takes all three phases to win a League Title. I can't argue with a good D and running game, but you need all three phases to win consistently in the playoffs. Good coaching staffs will shut down a two-dimensional team, you gotta have all three phases.

I don't mind a two-dimensional team, they usually can win a Div Title and maybe a Conf Title, and that's nothing to sniff at.

400HZ
07-05-2008, 04:05 PM
With spots one and two pretty well locked up, there is going to be a crowd for that final spot. Roethlisburger, Palmer. Rivers if he carries over his play from the second half of last year. Anderson. Garrard. Definitely some tough competition for the third spot. I don't think Cutler has a chance if the Broncos are sub .500 again.

Cito Pelon
07-05-2008, 04:17 PM
I was born in 85,

Exactly my point. You have no direct reference to Reeves/Elway's first ten years. You were 7 years old when Reeves was fired, barely out of kindergarten. I see a lot of you on this board, kids that have an opinion but it's all second-hand.


I remember the disdain for Reeves, hence the reason I tried to engineer some hate for Reeves in the hate poll. I also remember the day Wade became the coach and watching the press conference in the kitchen on our black and white TV. I thought my Dad had won the lottery he was so happy.

I say there's a lot of ignorant fans out there. How do you win 3 AFC Titles if the HC is a bum? Just got lucky? It was all Elway? Please. Reeves also took Atlanta to the SB with Chris Chandler at QB.

Are you referring to him not letting Jay loose?[QUOTE]

Yeah, certainly.

[QUOTE] Or the constant emphasis on trying to run first.

Certainly.

Because the big difference is a solid running game for us now, open up our passing play book.

You were too young to see Reeves OL's or running game. Reeves=Shanny. Same O philosophy. Reeves taught Shanny pretty good, eh? Except Shanny can't hold Reeves jockstrap winning Titles.

Cito Pelon
07-05-2008, 04:47 PM
well last year, if you look at the GB and chicago game, 2 games that we gave away the win, we could have been a playoff contender..

Good point. Trouble is, SD kicked the living daylights out of us twice, and Oakland once.

BroncoBuff
07-05-2008, 06:19 PM
As you may recall, this team could have been a playoff team LAST year if our defense could get out of their own way.
Yep, run defense in particular. And along those lines, I believe Gerard Warren would've been worth 2 (two) more wins than we had. Maybe even playoffs. I don't mean he would have wn two games in a row, but with his upgrade from Amon Gordon and/or Sam Adams, those nonsense 10-minute drives against us, like vs. Jacksonville, would not have happened.

But the thread digresses. Rev, my point was that if we do not make the playoffs, Jay would need huge numbers. And I'm pretty sure I'm right there. Do you think if we went 8-8, and Jay threw for 3,100 yard, 59%, 20 TD, 9 Int ... that he'd somehow make it to Hawaii? It might be less of a popularity contest than it was, but the truth is nobody's voting for a .500 QB with those numbers.

Orange_Beard
07-05-2008, 06:25 PM
I believe the play-offs are more tied to stopping the run. If our front 7 can shut down the run game and pressure the QB, our CB's can go back to playing pass D.

Jay will get more chance with the ball.

rovolution
07-05-2008, 06:29 PM
no

Carson Palmer and Drew Brees are my shining examples.

Carson is one of the best in the league, but his defense cant play worth squat.

I saw a game last year with the Bengals vs the Browns. Carson threw 6 TD passes in that game.

They lost that ballgame b/c their defense couldnt do diddly poo.

6 TDs in the game and they lost.


Same with Brees last year. He was slinging the rock and putting up the big numbers despite a horribly ineffective Reggie Bush led running game. They lost b/c Jason David was routinely abused by WRs league wide.

Defense has to play their part. IMO it will come down to Bly not getting torched too often and the run d performing effectively. If those things happen, Broncos will be ok b/c i know Jay will only get better from here on out.,

theAPAOps5
07-05-2008, 06:32 PM
I guess you're saying 'Pro-Bowl' and 'All-Pro' are two different things? Did you have a point there?

About as much as your point is coming across with your asshole disposition.

BroncoBuff
07-05-2008, 06:34 PM
Actually ... what about 2005 Jake Plummer? We went 13-3 with a nearly error-free Jake, and no Hawaii.

Problem for Jay and Hawaii is that 2 of best QBs ever are in the AFC. Heck, maybe the best two QBs in league history are here, wins-wise and statistics-wise. So even to make the number THREE Pro Bowl QB, Cutler will have to beat out every single Carson Palmer, Phillip Rivers, Ben Roethlisberger, and now even Derek Anderon and David Garrard. It won't be easy.

watermock
07-05-2008, 06:37 PM
People were pissed because Reeves found out that Shanny and Elway were game planning behind his back. So Danny fired Mike first, then brought in Maddox...or something like that...we eventually got Mike back after he won a ring in SF, but it was fine luck, we almost had a complete purge before we got rid of Phillips to bring iin Shanny, those were dark days.

Phillips should still be here as DC.

theAPAOps5
07-05-2008, 06:37 PM
Didn't Jake end up going to the Pro-Bowl as an alternate that year with Carson Palmer getting hurt?

kdissette
07-05-2008, 08:08 PM
If he has a pro bowl season we have a shot at a wild card spot, but i doubt san diego is ready to give up the division yet, maybe next year though.

Bob's your Information Minister
07-05-2008, 08:13 PM
He'll have a Pro Bowl season racking up yards and points while trying to keep pace with opposing teams' offenses. So, no.

bpc
07-05-2008, 08:15 PM
No. Surprisingly, I think that our passing game and receiving threats will be solid even without BMarsh if he is slow to heal. The problem will sit with the platoon HB situation we have going on, whether or not our starters stay healthy on the OL and our youth catch up to their level of play, and if we can stop the run this year and take some pressure off our pass defense.

We have too many if's this year. The best thing that could happen to Denver is for Cutler to have a HUGE year, Torrain to take over the starting HB position and play well and then still get a decent slot in the draft next year to pick up a playmaker or wide body on defense.

CoopDawg
07-05-2008, 09:09 PM
Actually ... what about 2005 Jake Plummer? We went 13-3 with a nearly error-free Jake, and no Hawaii.

Problem for Jay and Hawaii is that 2 of best QBs ever are in the AFC. Heck, maybe the best two QBs in league history are here, wins-wise and statistics-wise. So even to make the number THREE Pro Bowl QB, Cutler will have to beat out every single Carson Palmer, Phillip Rivers, Ben Roethlisberger, and now even Derek Anderon and David Garrard. It won't be easy.

Exactly, so if Jay is in Hawaii then we make the postseason. Barring injury Manning and Brady are locks for the Pro Bowl squad and deservingly so. Cutler would have to not only put up big stats but he must be leading the Broncos to at least the division title for him to lock up the 3rd spot.

Popps
07-05-2008, 09:33 PM
Sort of shocking that the poll is 56-7. Maybe the voters haven't tuned in for the past ten seasons or so.

Unitas, Montana and Elway could have rotated snaps for us last year and we would have gotten our asses kicked by any team with a decent offense.

You'd think a decade of watching the same thing over and over might convince people that a QB doesn't a football team maketh.

UltimateHoboW/Shotgun
07-05-2008, 10:03 PM
Sort of shocking that the poll is 56-7. Maybe the voters haven't tuned in for the past ten seasons or so.

Unitas, Montana and Elway could have rotated snaps for us last year and we would have gotten our asses kicked by any team with a decent offense.

You'd think a decade of watching the same thing over and over might convince people that a QB doesn't a football team maketh.

Preach brother Popps. Preach from on high the good word. Preach far and wide so all might hear the good news.

BroncoBuff
07-05-2008, 11:07 PM
Re-reading this thread, and I'm afraid we're all discussing different aspects, different issues.

How's this for two simple questions:Will Cutler make the Pro Bowl in 2008? I say no
Will the Broncos make the Playoffs in 2008? I say YES

Popps
07-06-2008, 02:29 AM
Look, there's no question that a great season out of Cutler increases our odds to win games and hence secure a post-season berth. Great QB play obviously can't hurt our cause. But, it's not a QB issue... it's a team issue and specifically a defensive/running game issue.

Now, Shanahan's off-season might not point to that being the case. He went nuts on offense with top picks in the draft, FA receivers, etc. But, Shanahan hasn't exactly had the most stellar track record as of late, anyway.

I think the argument in his defense would be that he went D-heavy last year, though I'm in the camp that says we should have done the same thing again this year. (Though the O-line attention was proper.)

In any case. Cutler needs to improve. He's incredibly gifted. He just needs to de-slop his mechanics a bit. I'd be shocked if he didn't have a great season.
But, again... he's way down the list of things holding this team back.

BroncosinDC
07-06-2008, 04:35 AM
Exactly my point. You have no direct reference to Reeves/Elway's first ten years. You were 7 years old when Reeves was fired, barely out of kindergarten. I see a lot of you on this board, kids that have an opinion but it's all second-hand.




I say there's a lot of ignorant fans out there. How do you win 3 AFC Titles if the HC is a bum? Just got lucky? It was all Elway? Please. Reeves also took Atlanta to the SB with Chris Chandler at QB.

[QUOTE]Are you referring to him not letting Jay loose?[QUOTE]

Yeah, certainly.



Certainly.



You were too young to see Reeves OL's or running game. Reeves=Shanny. Same O philosophy. Reeves taught Shanny pretty good, eh? Except Shanny can't hold Reeves jockstrap winning Titles.

I know Reeves...run run run....Punt until the 4th qtr than let John loose.

A solid run game is the key to a good offense. Reeves almost ran John out of Denver.

KCStud
07-06-2008, 06:33 AM
It will most defintitely be hard for Jay to make the pro bowl. Brady and Manning will almost assuredly get in again barring injury, but neither ever gets injured.

Jay will have to compete against Palmer, Roethlisberger, Rivers, Garrard and most likely Anderson to get in. I don't see Jay getting in just because of the fact that there is 1 spot left and so many good QB's to compete against.
I just don't see him beating out guys like Palmer, Roethlisberger and Rivers who have effective and stronger offense's with better receivers and OL helping them out.

At the end of the season last year a lot of people had Jay rated as the 8th best QB in the AFC behind the QB's listed above.

lex
07-06-2008, 09:34 AM
Wow, this thread went in a million different directions...which is good. But, I guess Im leaning more towards the idea that if Jay has a big season it will count for a lot in terms of getting more wins, with the end result being making the playoffs. I actually also think the offense flows through Jay now more than it does the running game and if Jay has a good season, the running game will also appear to be better.

rovolution
07-06-2008, 10:41 AM
Exactly my point. You have no direct reference to Reeves/Elway's first ten years. You were 7 years old when Reeves was fired, barely out of kindergarten. I see a lot of you on this board, kids that have an opinion but it's all second-hand.




I say there's a lot of ignorant fans out there. How do you win 3 AFC Titles if the HC is a bum? Just got lucky? It was all Elway? Please. Reeves also took Atlanta to the SB with Chris Chandler at QB.

[QUOTE]Are you referring to him not letting Jay loose?[QUOTE]

Yeah, certainly.



Certainly.



You were too young to see Reeves OL's or running game. Reeves=Shanny. Same O philosophy. Reeves taught Shanny pretty good, eh? Except Shanny can't hold Reeves jockstrap winning Titles.




Ha! Ha! Ha! Damn dude. Are you still pissed about buying that Tommy
Maddox jersey?

I understand. i got the Javon Walker #84 and now its a ****ing dust rag.

TheReverend
07-06-2008, 11:00 AM
I guess you're saying 'Pro-Bowl' and 'All-Pro' are two different things? Did you have a point there?

Considering my post is talking about the pro-bowl in response to someone's post about the pro-bowl, I have no idea why you're throwing media voted All-Pro into the mix... so did you have a point there?

TheReverend
07-06-2008, 11:01 AM
I'm curious about how ignorant Bronco fans will fail to see how Reeves=Shanny in how they handled their franchise QB's. You kids that were born in 1983 or later don't have any idea what happened in Elways first 10 years in the League.

Congratulations! You're using a decade's worth of sample size and comparing it to 1.3 years worth! That always makes for valid comparisons!

TheReverend
07-06-2008, 11:07 AM
Yep, run defense in particular. And along those lines, I believe Gerard Warren would've been worth 2 (two) more wins than we had. Maybe even playoffs. I don't mean he would have wn two games in a row, but with his upgrade from Amon Gordon and/or Sam Adams, those nonsense 10-minute drives against us, like vs. Jacksonville, would not have happened.

But the thread digresses. Rev, my point was that if we do not make the playoffs, Jay would need huge numbers. And I'm pretty sure I'm right there. Do you think if we went 8-8, and Jay threw for 3,100 yard, 59%, 20 TD, 9 Int ... that he'd somehow make it to Hawaii? It might be less of a popularity contest than it was, but the truth is nobody's voting for a .500 QB with those numbers.

Unless Jay is putting the fear of god in opposing defenses and coaches, doing nearly all of that in the 4th quarter and leading Denver to a nearly perfect record, with those numbers, there's no way he'd get the votes for the 3rd slot. By saying it's not all a stat show, I didn't mean a mediocre year would get him in. The good news is, those stats provided would mean we leaned heavily on the run game and they would put Selvin in the pro-bowl, lol.

BroncoBuff
07-06-2008, 11:14 AM
Look, there's no question that a great season out of Cutler increases our odds to win games and hence secure a post-season berth. Great QB play obviously can't hurt our cause. But, it's not a QB issue... it's a team issue and specifically a defensive/running game issue.
100% true. Proof positive: Jake Plummer's 2005 13-3 season.
2005 - Plummer 16 g- 277-456 60.7% - 3,366 yds - 18 TD, 7 Int = 13-3 Championship game
Or Elway's modest stats in 1984's 13-3, and modest stats in his first 3 Super Bowl seasons:
1984 - Elway 15 g - 214-380 56.3% - 2,598 yds - 18 TD, 15 Int = 13-3
1986 - Elway 16 g - 280-504 55.6% - 3,485 yds - 19 TD, 13 Int = 11-5, Super Bowl
1987 - Elway 12 g - 224-410 54.6% - 3,198 yds - 19 TD, 12 Int = 10-4-1, Super Bowl
1989 - Elway 15 g - 223-416 53.6% - 3,051 yds - 18 TD, 18 Int = 11-5, Super Bowl

BroncoBuff
07-06-2008, 11:24 AM
Reeves also took Atlanta to the SB with Chris Chandler at QB.
And he turned around the New York Giants in 1993 ... from a dismal 6-10 to an 11-5 record, with just an Overtime loss to Dallas in the season finale standing in the way of the Giants winning the East - ahead of the powerful Cowboys. They won one playoff game, but lost to the 49ers. And he accomplished this turnaround with QB management savvy ... his first move that year was to waive starter (and SB winner) Jeff Hostetler and re-install Phil Simms, which obviously worked.

Elway was at least 50% responsible for the Reeves-Elway problems ... he burned with resentment over Marino's stats, and would've thrown on every down if Reeves had allowed it.


In my opinion, Dan Reeves should be in the Hall of Fame. Don't forget he won a Super Bowl as a player, and as a Cowboys assistant coach even before he came to Denver. He participated in SEVEN Super Bowls.

dreasher54
07-06-2008, 11:41 AM
Well i dont think that he has to have a pro bowl season to win the superbowl. we need to get our rushing game back into the top five and our defense needs to stop the run better. because everyone in our division has a big name running back.

BroncosinDC
07-06-2008, 02:49 PM
In my opinion, Dan Reeves should be in the Hall of Fame. Don't forget he won a Super Bowl as a player, and as a Cowboys assistant coach even before he came to Denver. He participated in SEVEN Super Bowls.

He beat the Broncos in the Super Bowl in 1977. Then almost chased off Elway. The best thing he did was lose as Atlanta's head coach in XXXIII.

watermock
07-06-2008, 04:01 PM
Isnt Reeves allready in? He's first ballot. Now the Ring of Fame....

BMarsh615
07-06-2008, 09:08 PM
Defense will lead us to the playoffs. I think Cutler will have a very good year next year but this season hinges on the improvement of our defense.

Top Ten defenses in Points allowed and w/l records
1 Colts 16.4 13-3
2 Steelers 16.8 10-6
3 Bucs 16.9 9-7 (won division)
4 Patriots 17.1 16-0
5 Chargers 17.8 11-5
6 Packers 18.2 13-3
7 Seahawks 18.2 10-6
8 Titans 18.6 10-6
9 Eagles 18.8 8-8
10 Jaguars 19 11-5

lex
07-06-2008, 11:14 PM
Defense will lead us to the playoffs. I think Cutler will have a very good year next year but this season hinges on the improvement of our defense.

Top Ten defenses in Points allowed and w/l records
1 Colts 16.4 13-3
2 Steelers 16.8 10-6
3 Bucs 16.9 9-7 (won division)
4 Patriots 17.1 16-0
5 Chargers 17.8 11-5
6 Packers 18.2 13-3
7 Seahawks 18.2 10-6
8 Titans 18.6 10-6
9 Eagles 18.8 8-8
10 Jaguars 19 11-5


Yeah, but lets not pretend like theres not interplay where scoring points on offense (especially early) makes it easier for the defense in that a) the offense keeps the ball more and b) scoring points makes the opposing offenses more predictable, which helps the defense.

Kaylore
07-07-2008, 12:32 PM
Defense will lead us to the playoffs. I think Cutler will have a very good year next year but this season hinges on the improvement of our defense.

Top Ten defenses in Points allowed and w/l records
1 Colts 16.4 13-3
2 Steelers 16.8 10-6
3 Bucs 16.9 9-7 (won division)
4 Patriots 17.1 16-0
5 Chargers 17.8 11-5
6 Packers 18.2 13-3
7 Seahawks 18.2 10-6
8 Titans 18.6 10-6
9 Eagles 18.8 8-8
10 Jaguars 19 11-5

I tend to agree. A great offense will lead us to the playoffs, but without a good D we'll be one and done again. I also think it's interesting that wherever Coyer goes, the defense is in the top five. Boy, ditching him was stupid. :hitself:

TheReverend
07-07-2008, 12:37 PM
I tend to agree. A great offense will lead us to the playoffs, but without a good D we'll be one and done again. I also think it's interesting that wherever Coyer goes, the defense is in the top five. Boy, ditching him was stupid. :hitself:

Absolutely. Monte Kiffin had nothing to do with it.

Cito Pelon
07-07-2008, 06:38 PM
About as much as your point is coming across with your a-hole disposition.

Good shot. :wiggle:

Cito Pelon
07-07-2008, 06:57 PM
And he turned around the New York Giants in 1993 ... from a dismal 6-10 to an 11-5 record, with just an Overtime loss to Dallas in the season finale standing in the way of the Giants winning the East - ahead of the powerful Cowboys. They won one playoff game, but lost to the 49ers. And he accomplished this turnaround with QB management savvy ... his first move that year was to waive starter (and SB winner) Jeff Hostetler and re-install Phil Simms, which obviously worked.

Elway was at least 50% responsible for the Reeves-Elway problems ... he burned with resentment over Marino's stats, and would've thrown on every down if Reeves had allowed it.


In my opinion, Dan Reeves should be in the Hall of Fame. Don't forget he won a Super Bowl as a player, and as a Cowboys assistant coach even before he came to Denver. He participated in SEVEN Super Bowls.

Agreed.

I guess he'll be a first ballot HOF guy. I think he'll be eligible next year.

Taco John
07-07-2008, 07:10 PM
In 1994, John Elway went to the probowl, leading a 7-9 team that finished 4th in the AFC West.

TheReverend
07-07-2008, 07:23 PM
In 1994, John Elway went to the probowl, leading a 7-9 team that finished 4th in the AFC West.

In 1994, John Elway wasn't fighting Peyton Manning and Tom Brady for roster spots on the pro-bowl.

You can pretty much cancel out Peyton with Marino, but Kelly doesn't match up with that dirty bastard Tommy Terrific. It just wasn't as difficult then for the AFC QBs.

yerner
07-07-2008, 08:01 PM
there needs to be another option. jay doesn't make the probowl and we do make the playoffs. the defense will be back to solid enough. that is all.

BroncoBuff
07-07-2008, 09:40 PM
In 1994, John Elway went to the probowl, leading a 7-9 team that finished 4th in the AFC West.
Why didn't I say that?

lex
08-17-2008, 10:53 AM
I realize its just pre-season but I just wanted to point this out:

From the way Cutler sliced up Dallas this week in the two teams' joint workout and the way he has played in the preseason, watch for him to make a Pro Bowl push this season. If Denver is going to make the playoffs this year, it will be because Cutler arrives.



http://myespn.go.com/blogs/afcwest/0-2-288/Cutler-completes-his-first-12-pass-attempts.html

Also notice how this comment perfectly coincides with the thread topic, which was made a while ago. Wow, Im good.

telluride
08-17-2008, 11:12 AM
Jay's going to have a very good/great year, I think. But no matter how he does I'll give you your AFC pro bowlers right now: Brady, Manning, Farve. Doesn't matter how any of those guys actually play, they'll get in on name/rep alone.

TheDave
08-17-2008, 11:34 AM
It would basically take an injury to Manning and/or Brady, and Palmer numbers-wise is usually in the hunt. Even if Cutler did pull off a monster upset and beat out one of those guys for a spot, there's no guarantee our defense can stop anyone.

We've seen plenty of teams with huge offenses miss the playoffs, and particularly huge passing games.

Every year I'm on this board preaching that defense and running games win championships and every single year it pans out to be true. I don't expect this year to be any different.

I don't disagree with you... BUT... for better or worse I'm expecting to see a pass heavy offense this year. We finally have an offensive line that can handle the pass rush, and an ungodly number of weapons. It's just a hunch but i suspect Shanny is going to spend alot of time spreading teams out with 3 and 4 reciever sets with our tight ends exploiting seams and gaps in the middle of the field. Add to that the new emphasis we are placing on the screen pass and i'm betting cutler has huge numbers this season. Now let's see if it translates into wins.

NW Bolt Fan
03-13-2009, 06:20 PM
Whooops. But props to these posters who knew better:

alanm, bpc, Bronco Yoda, ICON, Iron Clady, JJJ, MrPeepers, obediah, Popps, rovolution, Taco John, wolf754life

Rabb
03-13-2009, 06:27 PM
very nice bump

the best thing is, Denver won as many super bowls as San Diego this year

Popps
03-13-2009, 06:32 PM
Whooops. But props to these posters who knew better:

alanm, bpc, Bronco Yoda, ICON, Iron Clady, JJJ, MrPeepers, obediah, Popps, rovolution, Taco John, wolf754life

Same would apply for this coming season.

NW Bolt Fan
03-13-2009, 07:05 PM
very nice bump

the best thing is, Denver won as many super bowls as San Diego this yearYeah, that never gets old. 8')

NW Bolt Fan
03-13-2009, 07:06 PM
Same would apply for this coming season.
There is NO WAY, your defense can be as bad this year as it's been the past 2 years... Dawkins alone brings accountability to that side of the ball.

Bob's your Information Minister
03-13-2009, 07:14 PM
He'll have a Pro Bowl season racking up yards and points while trying to keep pace with opposing teams' offenses. So, no.

LOOK AT THIS GLORIOUS ****E

BOB IS A GENIUS

theAPAOps5
03-13-2009, 07:42 PM
The real question might be is if Cutler has a pro bowl worthy season and they don't make the playoffs will he go? I think the answer is no. It also depends on the defense not just the QB.

Why would you say that? If he has a worthy season- he'll go- AND you guys will make the playoffs.

I was wrong, NW Bolt corrected me, but then he was wrong! :spit:

azbroncfan
03-13-2009, 07:46 PM
LOOK AT THIS GLORIOUS ****E

BOB IS A GENIUS

Way to go out on a limb doughnut boy.