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DukeWoody
07-02-2008, 01:49 PM
Browns, Cowboys, Vikings top O-line rankings

I posted the AFC West and here's the rest..http://sports.espn.go.com/fantasy/football/ffl/story?id=3447747

6. San Diego Chargers
This group struggled to start the 2007 season without C Nick Hardwick in the lineup. Unfortunately for San Diego, it will start the 2008 season without Hardwick, who is coming off foot surgery. However, this is a very good group overall. LT Marcus McNeill started slowly last season, but rebounded quickly. At 6-foot-7, 336 pounds, he has tremendous size, long arms and good athletic ability. McNeill and LG Kris Dielman make up one of the best left sides in the league, and this duo can be dominant at times. There are some concerns on the right side, however, as RG Mike Goff is starting to slow down with age and RT Jeromey Clary, who was a pleasant surprise last year, still needs to further prove himself. This group is better at pass blocking than run blocking, and the Chargers might look to throw more next season.


16. Denver Broncos
The Broncos are well known for the zone scheme they have run so well for so long under Mike Shanahan. They look for mobile, tenacious blockers over mauling, heavy-footed big men. Despite being riddled with injuries in 2007, Denver's line paved the way for its running backs to average a very impressive 4.6 yards per carry. The pass protection wasn't as impressive, but the Broncos added LT Ryan Clady in the first round of the draft to protect Jay Cutler's blind side. Clady will have his growing pains like any other rookie lineman, but he is extremely athletic and has the great, long build coaches look for at this position. He has a chance to become an excellent left tackle. Maybe more importantly, C Tom Nalen will return to lead the line, but age and durability certainly are concerns with him. There is some versatility with the other positions on the line, which gives Shanahan some nice flexibility while creating competition for playing time. Pile-mover Montrae Holland is set at right guard, but left guard and right tackle will be decided in camp. Expect this group to be improved this upcoming season, particularly in pass protection.


29. Oakland Raiders
This isn't the most talented line around and it really lacks star power, but it adapted extremely well to its zone blocking scheme in 2007 and consistently opened holes for the running backs. Line coach Tom Cable deserves kudos for his effort with sub-standard talent. It was a different story in pass protection, though, and this group often was physically outmanned while trying to keep its quarterback upright. This doesn't bode well for JaMarcus Russell, who is a huge target in the pocket and not the most fleet of foot. Russell also needs work on his pocket presence and feel for the pass rush. The Raiders did add Kwame Harris to start at left tackle. While Harris has not yet lived up to being a first-round pick, a change of scenery might do him a world of good. He often makes the game look easy but too often fails to come through. His inconsistencies are maddening. Speaking of underachieving tackles, Robert Gallery clearly fits that description, but he actually is an above-average guard and finally found his niche. Shockingly, the Raiders did not address their offensive line in the draft, and depth is a legitimate concern. While this group showed progress last year, it also wouldn't be surprising if the wheels fell off in 2008.


32. Kansas City Chiefs
Many commended the Chiefs for their selection of Branden Albert with the first-round pick they received in the Jared Allen deal. This isn't meant to condemn that selection one bit, since Albert will fit in somewhere on this line and should help out immediately, but it is amazing that Kansas City didn't bring in more young O-line talent besides Albert in this past draft. Instead, the Chiefs made luxury selections to back up their present offensive stars. The thing to remember is those offensive stars can't realize their potential if the big boys up front are not doing their jobs, and asking an inexperienced quarterback to develop into a legitimate starter without adequate blocking is foolish. This is an offensive line that is going to really struggle to do its job in 2008. There just isn't much talent here, and at this point, the aging Brian Waters is the only lineman who can be considered an above-average football player at this level. If Albert can make it at left tackle, Damion McIntosh should be adequate at right tackle. He doesn't belong on the left side, where he played last year. Optimistically, that adds up to three acceptable starters, but obviously, more are needed.

LOL....faiders at 29 and the chorfs for being the door mat, cellar dwellars...LOL

montrose
07-02-2008, 02:04 PM
I think we'll be better up front this year, but out of the #20's is really pushing it.

epicSocialism4tw
07-02-2008, 02:15 PM
Clady will be a heck of a player for us for 10-15 years.

broncofan2438
07-02-2008, 02:30 PM
I feel our O-line is better than that.....lets see how the season pans out

Kaylore
07-02-2008, 02:41 PM
Chris Kuper and Clady will be much better than done-Lepsis and Pears on the outside. Shoot, I would have taken Kuper at LT and Albert at RT, but this setup seems just fine. Clady is a true LT and Kuper has the size and strength to play RT. His experience starting will help tremendously as well. You throw in Graham as a babysitter for either side and it's not hard to see how things should be better.

epicSocialism4tw
07-02-2008, 02:50 PM
Chris Kuper and Clady will be much better than done-Lepsis and Pears on the outside. Shoot, I would have taken Kuper at LT and Albert at RT, but this setup seems just fine. Clady is a true LT and Kuper has the size and strength to play RT. His experience starting will help tremendously as well. You throw in Graham as a babysitter for either side and it's not hard to see how things should be better.

Hopefully Graham will start earning that ridiculous money that Bowlen is paying him.

Kaylore
07-02-2008, 03:11 PM
Hopefully Graham will start earning that ridiculous money that Bowlen is paying him.

Graham actually played pretty well for us. He was never supposed to be a pass-catcher. He was supposed to be a tackle-light and in that role he thrived. Toward the end of the year our offense really sputtered, and while I think some of it was Jay in the throws of the 'beetus, I think a lot of it was losing Graham to injury.

lex
07-02-2008, 03:19 PM
I think Kuper is solid at the very worst. As a matter of fact (and I said this last preseason) he may be our best OLinemen. And I agree, that Clady (or at least one would hope) should be a big upgrade over Lepsis whose tank was empty last year. I hope that Holland is steady and one of the aging/wounded old timers from last year can hang in there. If that holds true, that would mean we would have four solid to good Olinemen. I dont see how that can be viewed as anything but an upgrade.

lex
07-02-2008, 03:21 PM
Hopefully Graham will start earning that ridiculous money that Bowlen is paying him.

For someone who was playing two positions, Graham was a bargain. He might have been the best OT on the teams last year.

epicSocialism4tw
07-02-2008, 03:52 PM
For someone who was playing two positions, Graham was a bargain. He might have been the best OT on the teams last year.

In the games I reviewed, he was average on the line. Especially in the Steelers game.

wolf754life
07-02-2008, 03:56 PM
broncos best ever! #1 all the way, 13-3 easy! bestus head coach ever! weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!

fan boy love

CoopDawg
07-02-2008, 04:04 PM
Left Tackle - Ryan Clady
Left Guard - Who???
Center - Tom Nalen
Right Guard - Montrae Holland
Right Tackle - Chris Kuper

DukeWoody
07-02-2008, 04:18 PM
Left Tackle - Ryan Clady
Left Guard - Who???
Center - Tom Nalen
Right Guard - Montrae Holland
Right Tackle - Chris Kuper

Take a choice: 1) Ben Hamilton 2) Dylan Gangy 3) Ryan Harris or Chris Kuper if Harris manages to earn the RT spot..There's also Wiegmann and Lichtensteiger in a emergency reserve roll if needed..This line is young with more depth then there's been in a while..i likey :sunshine:

BroncoBuff
07-02-2008, 04:26 PM
You people acting like Ben Hamilton is anything other than a first-rate, near-Pro Bowl level NFL guard make me laugh. He started all 80 games his first five years in the league, and then he has a concussion and you're ready to replace him with a couple of nobodys like Ryan Harris or Dylan Gandy?! ???

If his head is okay, he's the starter, no questions asked.

lex
07-02-2008, 04:47 PM
In the games I reviewed, he was average on the line. Especially in the Steelers game.

Have you ever noticed that the word "facetious" contains all vowels and in alphabetical order?

lex
07-02-2008, 04:50 PM
You people acting like Ben Hamilton is anything other than a first-rate, near-Pro Bowl level NFL guard make me laugh. He started all 80 games his first five years in the league, and then he has a concussion and you're ready to replace him with a couple of nobodys like Ryan Harris or Dylan Gandy?! ???

If his head is okay, he's the starter, no questions asked.

Once you get a concussion you tolerance is diminished and it often becomes easier to get them... and guard may not be the best position for someone who is concussion prone. Im not saying he is 100% but its a very real possibility.

BroncoBuff
07-02-2008, 04:55 PM
For someone who was playing two positions, Graham was a bargain. He might have been the best OT on the teams last year.
Next to Holland, I think he was. Graham had a couple glaring misses, like weakly allowing that sack in San Diego, or dropping a difficult 4th down pass vs. Jacksonville he should have caught .... but overall - if you watch on Tivo - he made a big difference in the run game. In fact, had Graham been on the field for those short-yardage tries inside the 5-yard line against Jax (he was inexplicably out of the game), we probably would've converted 1st and goal inside the 5, and might've won that game.


Daniel Graham is responsible for my favorite moment all season: In the KC game at Invesco, Selvin took he ball running wide left. Jared Allen had the angle on him and was bearing down. But Graham had a better angle, and Allen didn't see him coming .... Graham blindsided Allen with a clean block that literally knocked him into mid-air. :~ohyah!:

But the best part was after the play (and if you have it on Tivo you MUST look it up). It's in the background of the shot, but right after the play, you can see Allen angrily gesturing and barking and pointing toward Graham ... while in the foreground, with his back to Allen, Graham is calmly walking back to the huddle, smiling as wide as possible. It was freaking priceless.

wolf754life
07-02-2008, 06:15 PM
we went 7 and 9, graham got paid, why wouldn't he smile, this team doesn't care, knor does it have the neccessary talent to compete for the superbowl.

BroncoBuff
07-02-2008, 07:12 PM
richard, he was smiling because he bitch-punk-blindsided Jared Allen into mid-air ... and the angry hick was whining and jumping up and down about it.

BroncoBuff
07-02-2008, 07:17 PM
Daniel Graham is responsible for my favorite moment all season: In the KC game at Invesco, Selvin took he ball running wide left. Jared Allen had the angle on him and was bearing down. But Graham had a better angle, and Allen didn't see him coming .... Graham blindsided Allen with a clean block that literally knocked him into mid-air. :~ohyah!:

But the best part was after the play (and if you have it on Tivo you MUST look it up). It's in the background of the shot, but right after the play, you can see Allen angrily gesturing and barking and pointing toward Graham ... while in the foreground, with his back to Allen, Graham is calmly walking back to the huddle, smiling as wide as possible. It was freaking priceless.

A similar joyful moment was in the opener at Buffalo. A couple times Tom Nalen was kinda manhandling rookie LB Paul Posluszny. The replay caught one ... it was away from the play, and Nails had Posluszny by the jersey and was yanking him around like a rag doll :~ohyah!:

Drek
07-02-2008, 07:40 PM
A similar joyful moment was in the opener at Buffalo. A couple times Tom Nalen was kinda manhandling rookie LB Paul Posluszny. The replay caught one ... it was away from the play, and Nails had Posluszny by the jersey and was yanking him around like a rag doll :~ohyah!:

My favorite moments in the Buffalo game was basically every other play when Graham stonewalled Chris Kelsay, he of the big fat new contract, supposedly a DE on the verge of becoming elite. Pears rarely touched him, Graham was blowing him back play after play.

As for our OL, 16th seems like a good ranking to me. We're in a transitional state and could be as bad as in the 20's, or as good as in the top 10. It depends on a variety of factors, primarily how quickly Clady steps into the LT role, how well the winner of the Kuper/Harris battle does at RT, and how healthy we are on the interior. Primarily the health thing because I don't have much doubt that Clady and Kuper/Harris will be an upgrade over broke down Lepsis/Pears at the tackles. If our interior stays healthy we'll have a solid RG in Holland, a solid at worst C in Nalen, and a healthy competition between a proven solid LG (Hambone) and a young guy with good potential and some nice history as a starter on an upper echelon team Gandy). We should be able to find some good options amongst all that and put together a very productive OL.

BroncoBuff
07-02-2008, 08:16 PM
My favorite moments in the Buffalo game was basically every other play when Graham stonewalled Chris Kelsay, he of the big fat new contract, supposedly a DE on the verge of becoming elite. Pears rarely touched him, Graham was blowing him back play after play.
I wish I had seen that or had it on tape. I recall Kelsey didn't do much.

No one can deny Daniel Graham is a major blocking force, good enough to manage at OT in fact. Kinda like Riley Odoms back in the day. And I'm probably the biggest Graham fan around here - he's a Mackey Award winning 2-time All America from CU, I even have a Daniel Graham jersey. But he IS being overpaid. If I can admit that, anybody can.


In fact, had Graham been on the field for those short-yardage tries inside the 5-yard line against Jax (he was inexplicably out of the game), we probably would've converted 1st and goal inside the 5, and might've won that game.
Drek, do you recall this? Cutler tried to run around left end - might've been a broken play, but the left side collapsed and he fell short. I couldn't believe Graham was not on the field.

Oh well ... had we made that 1st down, we wouldn't have Clady. Silver linings.

Cito Pelon
07-02-2008, 08:17 PM
I think the OL is looking fairly good. Naturally Clady and Kory L. have to pan out. Kuper I like as a competitor and as a versatile guy. He may not be All-Pro but I think he's a guy you want on your team. I'm still not understanding why Myers went to Houston unless Shanny has some deal in place with Kubiak and the Smith guy down the road. It just didn't make sense to let Myers go for a sixth and then sign Weigmann as backup to Nalen, seeings how Hamilton was unable to play last year. The kid from Indy seems like a good pickup. Pears is a solid backup at both OT positions.

The numbers game could hurt since Shanny likes to keep so many DL guys on the active roster. This is what has hurt Denver's ST's so bad over the years, all those over-the-hill DL guys that didn't play ST's. Maybe this year there's less DL slots and more OL slots.

Depending on Clady and Kory making a mark, the OL looks pretty good. I'd like to see the ST's make a mark this season also seeings how the roster is younger.

DivineLegion
07-02-2008, 09:13 PM
How is Gandy a nobody, when he started for an awsome Colts line, has playoff and superbowl experience, and is only 26 years old.

If Ben cant go or something happens to Holland we have freaking awsome depth at Guard. Gandy will turn out to be one of our best signings this offseason, and eveyone is totaly overlooking him. We are atleast 3 deep at guard if we absolutly need it...Gandy, Lictenstieger, Kuper,

Cito Pelon
07-02-2008, 09:28 PM
How is Gandy a nobody, when he started for an awsome Colts line, has playoff and superbowl experience, and is only 26 years old.

If Ben cant go or something happens to Holland we have freaking awsome depth at Guard. Gandy will turn out to be one of our best signings this offseason, and eveyone is totaly overlooking him. We are atleast 3 deep at guard if we absolutly need it...Gandy, Lictenstieger, Kuper,

Yeah, the Gandy signing looks good. I hope he can play ST's, we need all the help we can get.

BroncoBuff
07-03-2008, 01:02 AM
I agree Gandy was a very good pickup, and he did start 10 games in 2006, but it was filling in for injury. He was never THE starter.

I think the two best signings are the ones being talked about the least: Marlon McRee and Darrell Jackson. They upgrade their positions far more than Boss Bailey, Dylan Gandy, Casey Weigmann or Niko Koutavides.

KCStud
07-03-2008, 03:25 AM
Wow clearly this guy is following the opinions of others.

KC's OL will be better than the Falcons, Lions, Faiders, Niners, Rams and Ravens at least IMO. I think the Texans are ranked too high as well.

Falcons have Blalock,who was very up and down last year, and Baker.
Lions are already having problems(Cherilous in trouble already).
Faiders OL is a joke.
Niners tied us for most sacks given up. And Staley is moving to LT after giving up 6 sacks last year at RT. I think he needs time, but Rachal is good.
Ravens lost Ogden and Gaither is big, but has lacked technique.
And the Rams have no LT. Barron struggled last season and it showed.

Most people don't realize that KC's problems were from our RT position. Terry and Turley combined gave up more than 12 sacks.

I also like Rudy Niswanger. Smart kid who played really well for us last season. Should be a solid C for years to come.

spdirty
07-03-2008, 09:29 AM
We got a lot of uncertainty on the line so I'd say thats a favorable spot.

nickademus
07-03-2008, 09:48 AM
I am sold give me that off season kool-aide!!!!!! I think our line will be top ten by the end of the year.