My new Mock: McFadden falls to Denver

[Cecil Lammey]

http://nfldraftguys.com/features/lammey_mock_draft.php

have at it boys!

[wabbit]

Should McFadden fall out of the top ten, he would almost be worth more to Denver in a position trade (Dallas) than any player could ever deliver on the field.

Jerry Jones thinks McFadden is the missing piece to his little kingdom.

Denver might be able to wrestle two #1 picks for the #12 rather than take McFadden, and honestly, I have some faith that Shanahan would take it & run.

[chanesaw]

I have surprisingly seen several professional mocks that show Darren dropping to 7-13 range. If he's there at 12 we better draft him and keep him. The guy is awesome. We could still load up on OT and DT in later rounds. We need to pick up at least one safety though.

[elsid13]

Groves that high won't happen. And SI had in its rumor section about ATL coaching staff not getting the warm fuzz over Ryan.

[RocBronc]

I'd love McFadden at 12, but I'd also love to win the lottery.... Both have about the same chance of happening.

[ICON]

Flacco a D-1AA QB. I think that he is definitley the 3rd best QB but i dont think there is value for him in the 1st round. I also dont think there is value for Brohm that high so he would still be on the board. I do however think that someone like the Ravens or Dolphins may trade into the first round to get Brohm. i think they both drop to the second due to the fact that Brohm, Flacco, & Henne are all clumped together grade wise so the value just isnt there.

(IMO) Ryan is NOT going to Atl. The Falcons should not be looking for a first round QB especially one who isnt worth a top 3 pick and who isnt even 4th on there big board. They will look for a Qb later in draft or wait till next year to see whats there. Give Them, Ellis or Dorsey.

[Cecil Lammey]

Flacco a D-1AA QB. I think that he is definitley the 3rd best QB but i dont think there is value for him in the 1st round. I also dont think there is value for Brohm that high so he would still be on the board. I do however think that someone like the Ravens or Dolphins may trade into the first round to get Brohm. i think they both drop to the second due to the fact that Brohm, Flacco, & Henne are all clumped together grade wise so the value just isnt there.

(IMO) Ryan is NOT going to Atl. The Falcons should not be looking for a first round QB especially one who isnt worth a top 3 pick and who isnt even 4th on there big board. They will look for a Qb later in draft or wait till next year to see whats there. Give Them, Ellis or Dorsey.

Flacco is my #5 QB (see draftguys.com (http://draftguys.com) for my rankings) so this is very high for him.

but I think each year there are players that are taken way too high (akili smith anyone?) and there are players that slide more than we expect (rodgers, quinn).

The Bears love this kid, however - we must caution ourselves to how much team info we listen to. Alot of it is misinformation.

[peacepipe]

screw that, if Ryan Clady is there you take him. The hell with McFadden,he's another Tatum Bell as far as I'm cocerned. He has alot of hype around him but he's not all he's cracked up to be. Yeah he has big play capability but so did TBell. You want to know another thing they have in common...it doesn't take much to bring them down.

[want2bAbronco2]

how can you call him another Bell? Bell NEVER had a year like Mcfad did in college. Hell 1yr year of Mcfad was almost better then all 3 of Bells. Bell never got the hard yards, never had as many TDs, never was a hiesman run up 2x, cant throw the ball, and cant catch. Thats like saying someone should still give Ryan Leaf a chance, cause he was just as good as Manning in College.

[cmhargrove]

"Mike Shanahan, pick up the white courtesy phone, there is a Mr. Jerry Jones calling for you...."

[clint7]

Mayock on NFL Network also didn't have McFadden going in to Top 10 in his Mock Draft last night. The next 10 picks will be aired on Monday evening (11-20). So I'm not sure if he has him going at Denver's spot or not, but yeah, he didn't have him going in the Top 10 either.

[BroncoBuff]

Mayock on NFL Network also didn't have McFadden going in to Top 10 in his Mock Draft last night. The next 10 picks will be aired on Monday evening (11-20). So I'm not sure if he has him going at Denver's spot or not, but yeah, he didn't have him going in the Top 10 either.
That's exactly right, "Path to the Draft," just watched it an hour ago. If Mayock is right, McFadden might be there.

But I'm opposed in general to drafting RBs high .... we've manufactured them so effectively and for so long now, it seems a waste of a precious (and hopefully rare) high 1st round slot. The highest two RBs we've drafted in the Shanny era (Portis and Bell - both 2nd round), were shipped out for crucial defensive players after each of their second seasons.

So unless we're drafting him to showcase and then trade (doubtful of course), I'm thinking Henry/Young/Hall looks great.

We need DTssss, plural.

[s0phr0syne]

IF McFadden were still there at #12 and we were sure that other teams would kill to get him, could we draft him and then trade for whoever offers up stuff? What is the protocol on how that goes down? Can it occur during the draft itself, or does it happen afterward? The only example that comes to mind right away is the Eli Manning/Peepee Rivers swap, but I don't know exactly how that went down.

[Paladin]

If memory serves: I think the sparkies drafted Manning and then traded him. Probably got more than they should have because of the threat that another team might bid. If Jones was persistent enough, the Broncos could draft McFadden and trade later in the day, an dmight get more than the to 1s........Maybe the 1s and a player.....

[BroncoBuff]

IF McFadden were still there at #12 and we were sure that other teams would kill to get him, could we draft him and then trade for whoever offers up stuff? What is the protocol on how that goes down? Can it occur during the draft itself, or does it happen afterward? The only example that comes to mind right away is the Eli Manning/Peepee Rivers swap, but I don't know exactly how that went down.
You can trade whenever you want ... and that's a great idea. And especialy applicable this year because the time on the clock is being reduced.

If we can't trade back before the draft, fine. Then if McFadden falls to us, we'll prolly get even more for a bird in the hand than if we had traded back before the draft.

[Northman]

Should McFadden fall out of the top ten, he would almost be worth more to Denver in a position trade (Dallas) than any player could ever deliver on the field.

Jerry Jones thinks McFadden is the missing piece to his little kingdom.

Denver might be able to wrestle two #1 picks for the #12 rather than take McFadden, and honestly, I have some faith that Shanahan would take it & run.

My thinking exactly. I still dont see McFadden dropping out of the top 5 but even if he does Dallas is going to give up the farm to get him.

[Northman]

Flacco is my #5 QB (see draftguys.com (http://draftguys.com) for my rankings) so this is very high for him.

but I think each year there are players that are taken way too high (akili smith anyone?) and there are players that slide more than we expect (rodgers, quinn).

The Bears love this kid, however - we must caution ourselves to how much team info we listen to. Alot of it is misinformation.


In defense of Flacco NFL Network has said his stock is rising bigtime and he has looked the best at the Combine so far. Doesnt mean he will be a great NFL Qb but definitely something teams will look at.

[Arkie]

The hell with McFadden,he's another Tatum Bell as far as I'm cocerned. He has alot of hype around him but he's not all he's cracked up to be.

Tatum is too fragile to be the SEC's 2nd all-time career rushing leader. I wish McFadden was coming back. He would have shattered Herschel Walker's record.

[Northman]

Tatum is too fragile to be the SEC's 2nd all-time career rushing leader. I wish McFadden was coming back. He would have shattered Herschel Walker's record.

I was looking at McFadden yesterday and some of his clips and it dawned on me that he reminds me a lot of Walker only better.

[NFLBRONCO]

I still believe he goes 4 or 6

PS

Watch him fall to 7 and NE get blockbuster deal from Dallas

[Dedhed]

I have Mcfadden as my #4 RB, and would not be at all surpised to see him fall out of the top 10. I would also be brick eating mad if the Broncos didn't sell #12 to whoever wanted Mcfadden the most.

[BroncoBuff]

Doesn't "Flacco" translate to "skinny kid" in Spanish?

[brncs_fan]

On a side note, I don't think that there is any scenario out there in which KC does not go after a OT, whether it is Long or Clady.

[want2bAbronco2]

I have Mcfadden as my #4 RB, and would not be at all surpised to see him fall out of the top 10. I would also be brick eating mad if the Broncos didn't sell #12 to whoever wanted Mcfadden the most.

#4? who the heck do you have infront of him?

Kiper/Mayock are 2 of the stupidest draft "experts" I have ever seen. Put the players names on a wall, toss darts and you will be 200x better then there picks.

[Billy Clyde Puckett]

Cecil, you live up North where all of your water comes from wells downstream from Rocky Flats - right?

[Paladin]

Lol!!!!

Do you glow?

[Dedhed]

#4? who the heck do you have infront of him?

Kiper/Mayock are 2 of the stupidest draft "experts" I have ever seen. Put the players names on a wall, toss darts and you will be 200x better then there picks.

I have Mendenhall, Stewart, and Felix Jones in front of him. In my eyes, Mcfadden is a rich mans Tatum Bell and I think he will be only moderately more successful than Tatum. I think he's way over-hyped because he's coming in the wake of AD, and everyone is desperate for an AD.

I think he lacks cut back vision and leg drive, and is a one-dimensional RB who will be a large disappointment in the NFL.

[Arkie]

He's a little more durable than AD

[want2bAbronco2]

I have Mendenhall, Stewart, and Felix Jones in front of him. In my eyes, Mcfadden is a rich mans Tatum Bell and I think he will be only moderately more successful than Tatum. I think he's way over-hyped because he's coming in the wake of AD, and everyone is desperate for an AD.

I think he lacks cut back vision and leg drive, and is a one-dimensional RB who will be a large disappointment in the NFL.

How can you even say Bell and Mc in the same sentence. Bell never was a
2x Heisman runner up. Mendenhall is a 1yr wonder *Mc did it for 3 yrs*. Stewart I really like and have as #2, but doesnt have the #s or speed as Mc. Felix was a back up all his career, not sure how he can be rated over the starter. I can see all the hype with AP last year, but Mc had tons of hype/heisman talk the last 3 yrs.

Don't understand the Mc hating. He has never been hurt, put up outstanding numbers in a big time conf. and did it 3yrs in a row (no 1 yr wonder). If he is there at 12, you run up and knock the announcer over before he even says we are on the clock. The ONLY way you trade someone like him is if you get get say....Dallas 2 #1 picks, there 2nd, and 5th or 2 #1s this year and there #1 next.

[SureShot]

If McFadden is there you take him. I would consider that a "value" pick.

[Kaylore]

Hey Cecil! Hmmm. Looking at this I gotta say some of your picks make too much sense (Al Davis being logical? Ha!) and some not so much.
Here's my thoughts:

Like others, I see us passing on McFadden. Shanahan never takes running backs in the first round. I would rather see us trade down with a team that would want McFadden (like Dallas) than (EDIT) stay at that spot and take McFadden.

I'm surprised at your selection as a steeler fan. You consider Chris Williams a road grader? He's not so big up top and is better at pass protection. You also pass on the one true uber-human plow in Albert. That guy is a mammoth and he looks like that tough-guy Steeler.

I really like your Flacco pick. I just wonder if the Bears are that smart.

I really like DeSean to the niners.

Both Dallas picks make a lot of sense from their need standpoint.

I'm shocked that you don't have the Chiefs going offensive tackle, but you're saying they will go BPA over need. We'll see.

Like I said it's pretty good with a just few head scratchers. Many of them are what they should do rather than what they will do, but there's nothing wrong with that kind of a mock draft! :)

[Cecil Lammey]

Hey Cecil! Hmmm. Looking at this I gotta say some of your picks make too much sense (Al Davis being logical? Ha!) and some not so much.
Here's my thoughts:

Like others, I see us passing on McFadden. Shanahan never takes running backs in the first round. I would rather see us trade down with a team that would want McFadden (like Dallas) than

I'm surprised at your selection as a steeler fan. You consider Chris Williams a road grader? He's not so big up top and is better at pass protection. You also pass on the one true uber-human plow in Albert. That guy is a mammoth and he looks like that tough-guy Steeler.

I really like your Flacco pick. I just wonder if the Bears are that smart.

I really like DeSean to the niners.

Both Dallas picks make a lot of sense from their need standpoint.

I'm shocked that you don't have the Chiefs going offensive tackle, but you're saying they will go BPA over need. We'll see.

Like I said it's pretty good with a just few head scratchers. Many of them are what they should do rather than what they will do, but there's nothing wrong with that kind of a mock draft! :)


thanks Kaylore!

Williams was phenomenal at the Senior Bowl, and talking to his coaches I got a sense for what football means to him. Either OL would be good for me, I just would prefer Williams. Plus Big Ben needs protection!

I can see the Chiefs going with Clady.

I wouldn't be so quick to write off RB in the 1st round. You know coach Shanahan will ALWAYS keep us guessing!


Like I've said many times, doing a mock draft is a lot like fishing. You get some, you miss some, it's a pain in the ass, but it's sort of fun!

Whaddya think of McKelvin/Figurs being on the same return unit?

Broncos fans everywhere are wishing Denver would've taken Figurs like you wanted them to.

[Cecil Lammey]

#4? who the heck do you have infront of him?

Kiper/Mayock are 2 of the stupidest draft "experts" I have ever seen. Put the players names on a wall, toss darts and you will be 200x better then there picks.

I will keep my comments about Mel Kiper to myself, but I can tell you without a doubt that Mike Mayock is ON TOP of his game.

I chat with Mike on and off through the year, and was able to see him at the Shrine Game and Senior Bowl this January. There are only a few people that are as dialed into player evaluation as Mike Mayock.

Sure, he gets some wrong *Alvin Pearman*

but he predicted Aaron Rodgers slide, he predicted the rise of both Jay Cutler and Kevin Kolb.

The guy puts a ton of work in the film room, and it shows. No other draft expert can hold a candle to Mike Mayock.

[Cecil Lammey]

Cecil, you live up North where all of your water comes from wells downstream from Rocky Flats - right?


LOL

I live by Chatfield Resivoir, the water tastes great! :spit:

[Kaylore]

thanks Kaylore!

Williams was phenomenal at the Senior Bowl, and talking to his coaches I got a sense for what football means to him. Either OL would be good for me, I just would prefer Williams. Plus Big Ben needs protection!

I can see the Chiefs going with Clady.

I wouldn't be so quick to write off RB in the 1st round. You know coach Shanahan will ALWAYS keep us guessing!


Like I've said many times, doing a mock draft is a lot like fishing. You get some, you miss some, it's a pain in the ass, but it's sort of fun!

Whaddya think of McKelvin/Figurs being on the same return unit?

Broncos fans everywhere are wishing Denver would've taken Figurs like you wanted them to.

McKelvin seems like overkill in Raven land but makes sense more for his coverage skills and their need for youth there.

Yes, I wanted Figurs. People even made fun of me because I had him going in the third round (which he did). I also thought Anderson was going to be a better DE than Adams, though. At this point it looks like that was wrong. So there's ups and downs.

What I think is interesting in reading your draft is that there are really two kinds of mocks. There is a prediction mock draft versus a "should-do" mock draft. For example we know that Detroit should look at defensive end, tackle, or running back, but Millen will probably take another wide receiver. Ha! Its part of what makes this whole thing fun.

[Dedhed]

How can you even say Bell and Mc in the same sentence. Bell never was a
2x Heisman runner up. Mendenhall is a 1yr wonder *Mc did it for 3 yrs*. Stewart I really like and have as #2, but doesnt have the #s or speed as Mc. Felix was a back up all his career, not sure how he can be rated over the starter. I can see all the hype with AP last year, but Mc had tons of hype/heisman talk the last 3 yrs.

Don't understand the Mc hating. He has never been hurt, put up outstanding numbers in a big time conf. and did it 3yrs in a row (no 1 yr wonder). If he is there at 12, you run up and knock the announcer over before he even says we are on the clock. The ONLY way you trade someone like him is if you get get say....Dallas 2 #1 picks, there 2nd, and 5th or 2 #1s this year and there #1 next.I can compare Mcfadden and Bell because I don't take into account hype such as Heisman runner-up and the like. I look at the tape and production, and base my opinion on what I see there. Mac and Tatum both lack the ability to run between the tackles, lack cut back vision, and go limp on contact. They're both built on speed off the edges.

Jones averaged over 3 yards per carry more than Mcfadden in the exact same offense. That could be explained away by the number of attempts if it was .5-1 yard or if Jones had < 50 carries. Neither of those are the case; Jones had well over 100 carries and averaged almost 9 yards per attempt. Mac fumbles, Jones doesn't. A portion of Mcfadden's numbers came with the benefit of being lined up at the QB spot, which I think delays the reaction of the defense to the running game.

Mcfadden is not a player you can build an offense on. He's much like Reggie Bush in that respect. Mendenhall, Stewart and Jones do have that ability.

[mhgaffney]

Think what we could do with two firsts a la Dallas!!!!

We could draft Williams at 22 -- thereby insuring that Cutler will have an extra 1-2 seconds on most plays to find the open receiver.

Then at 28 we draft Dan Connor to stop the run up the gut.

In the second round we pick the best DT available.

This alone would make for a successful 2008 draft.

[Arkie]

For example we know that Detroit should look at defensive end, tackle, or running back, but Millen will probably take another wide receiver. Ha!

LOL If you would've told me back in 2002 that the Lions were going to spend five top 10 picks on a QB and 4 WRs, I would've thought they were about to have a killer aerial attack. I also would have thought their defense would be lacking. I would've been half right.

[That One Guy]

I love how folks can be spending their time posting on a Broncos message board about how worthless a professional analyst is yet... they're getting paid for people to listen to them, you're not. If you had the football knowledge they do, you'd be in a position to prove yourself more competent than they. So, basically, until you're on TV, coaching somewhere, or in any way being rewarded for your football knowledge... lets try not bashing the pros, you just look like a clown.

Now, for the people of this thread... I think too many people are thinking Parcells going Chris Long is basically a foregone conclusion while I don't think it'll ever happen. I never realized Long was a 3-4 DE, can you really justify a 1-15 team going 3-4 DE with the first overall pick? Might as well be taking a no-role player like Ted Ginn #8 overall on a crappy team... oh wait, they went through that last year. It's time for Miami to get a positive team spin and you need that at a position more influential and impactful than 3-4 DE. If he'd been intended as an OLB, maybe that gets the face time you could appreciate with the #1 overall but not a guy who's role is to almost solely tie up blockers.

Face it fellas, Long will end up a Raider...

As for the people still proposing the Dallas trade, EVERYBODY WANTS THAT TRADE!!! Why would they wait until 12 to pull the trigger when anyone from about 5 on would be willing to give it if a top notch player isn't there at a position of need.

Two teams that I don't think draft spot fits BPA right now and would get excellent value out of a trade down are:

6 - Jets - They're going to a new QB and what makes QB changes work well? If their QB performs. They could get some great tools in the lower end of the 1st round in playmaker positions like, say, WR. They're a team without an awful lot of holes but a general lack of high-end talent and they could best be served by moving back rather than taking BPA and adressing something that's not a need.

7 - NE - They can spot talent with the best of them and there's plenty of late round LBs that could really help them. Gholston would be a Merriman type player for them and would be great but if they could back off and get a good, YOUNG, ILB and CB in the bottom of the 1st... they'd take it. The value in the top 10 seems to be DT and OT and that's not really a need for them.

[Dedhed]

As for the people still proposing the Dallas trade, EVERYBODY WANTS THAT TRADE!!! Why would they wait until 12 to pull the trigger when anyone from about 5 on would be willing to give it if a top notch player isn't there at a position of need.

I was going to speak to this same point. If Mcfadden falls out of the top 5 the phones are going to be ringing for everyone. No one is going to be saying, hey let's wait until he falls to #12 just so we can give the Broncos the deal of a lifetime.

[want2bAbronco2]

I love how folks can be spending their time posting on a Broncos message board about how worthless a professional analyst is yet... they're getting paid for people to listen to them, you're not. If you had the football knowledge they do, you'd be in a position to prove yourself more competent than they. So, basically, until you're on TV, coaching somewhere, or in any way being rewarded for your football knowledge... lets try not bashing the pros, you just look like a clown.


Last time I checked this message board and you were aloud to speak your mind. Seems like lots come to this/other boards and hpye up players or complain about them but I don't see any of them playing for a NFL team. I think Ian is horrible and just about everyone has complained about him, yet no one here plays for a NFL team. Thats part of being a fan of something, you have the right to say things.

I would like to if I get time go back and fine some of the "expert" mock drafts over the last few years and see how close they were. Would be interesting, I use to like Mayocks view most of the time, but not a lot this year.

[mattob14]

I was going to speak to this same point. If Mcfadden falls out of the top 5 the phones are going to be ringing for everyone. No one is going to be saying, hey let's wait until he falls to #12 just so we can give the Broncos the deal of a lifetime.

I agree to an extent, but look at Cleveland last year. Depending on who you beleive, Dallas was the only team that got that trade offer. Why? Because most of the mid-1st teams weren't interested in Quinn, but KC would've taken him with the pick after Dallas' 1st. We may be in a similar situation. I don't see NE (Maroney), Baltimore (MacGahee), Cinci (bigger needs than RB), NO (Bush/McAllister), or Buffalo (Lynch) taking McFadden. Carolina at #13 or Chicago at #14 very well may take him though. If Dallas feels he'll be available at #12, they'll wait, give a lesser package to move up and save money signing the guy (there's a big difference in money between 7 and 12). Also, looking at a potential trade with NE, I really don't know that Dallas would want to deal with NE and potentially strengthen them. After saying all this, I don't see a huge likelihood of the trade happening, but the Broncos pick does make some sense for a trade.

[Northman]

I love how folks can be spending their time posting on a Broncos message board about how worthless a professional analyst is yet... they're getting paid for people to listen to them, you're not. If you had the football knowledge they do, you'd be in a position to prove yourself more competent than they. So, basically, until you're on TV, coaching somewhere, or in any way being rewarded for your football knowledge... lets try not bashing the pros, you just look like a clown.

A lot of these so-called knowledgable analyst have been wrong on many occasions. A good portion of them get their jobs because they've played the game on a professional level but that hardly excludes them from ridicule.

Now, for the people of this thread... I think too many people are thinking Parcells going Chris Long is basically a foregone conclusion while I don't think it'll ever happen. I never realized Long was a 3-4 DE, can you really justify a 1-15 team going 3-4 DE with the first overall pick? Might as well be taking a no-role player like Ted Ginn #8 overall on a crappy team... oh wait, they went through that last year. It's time for Miami to get a positive team spin and you need that at a position more influential and impactful than 3-4 DE. If he'd been intended as an OLB, maybe that gets the face time you could appreciate with the #1 overall but not a guy who's role is to almost solely tie up blockers.

Its not far fetched to think Miami will go with Chris Long. In fact, the chances are heavier now than they were 3 weeks ago. But the loss of Thomas and Taylor plays heavily into the thinking that Miami needs some defensive help drastically. I find it hilarious that you claim that Long couldnt be that much of a impact yet who was Miami's most impactful player? Yep. A DE.

Face it fellas, Long will end up a Raider...

Maybe, maybe not.

[That One Guy]

A lot of these so-called knowledgable analyst have been wrong on many occasions. A good portion of them get their jobs because they've played the game on a professional level but that hardly excludes them from ridicule.



Its not far fetched to think Miami will go with Chris Long. In fact, the chances are heavier now than they were 3 weeks ago. But the loss of Thomas and Taylor plays heavily into the thinking that Miami needs some defensive help drastically. I find it hilarious that you claim that Long couldnt be that much of a impact yet who was Miami's most impactful player? Yep. A DE.



Maybe, maybe not.

This was said under the assumption that they're going to the 3-4 exclusively since Parcells is bringing his own guys as he is. 255 LB Jason Taylor will not be a DE in the 3-4. That's what I was saying, if they intended Long in the conventional 4-3 DE role or OLB then I'd believe it was a perfect fit but as a 3-4 DE, it's throwing away the pick.

And as for pros making picks, yes there's a lot of them that get things wrong. Some by way of a player just busting and some by way of trying to throw out suprises to make a name for themselves if it works out. Most average people though can only regurgitate what they hear on TV or if they are watching film, how many REALLY know what to look for? There's a few here that have played at the college level but most people here have football knowledge limited to what they learn from the tube on Sundays. There's just too much beneath the surface for average Joe to be more qualified to make these assessments than the pros who actually have access to game film, playbooks, etc...

[elsid13]

This was said under the assumption that they're going to the 3-4 exclusively since Parcells is bringing his own guys as he is. 255 LB Jason Taylor will not be a DE in the 3-4. That's what I was saying, if they intended Long in the conventional 4-3 DE role or OLB then I'd believe it was a perfect fit but as a 3-4 DE, it's throwing away the pick.

And as for pros making picks, yes there's a lot of them that get things wrong. Some by way of a player just busting and some by way of trying to throw out suprises to make a name for themselves if it works out. Most average people though can only regurgitate what they hear on TV or if they are watching film, how many REALLY know what to look for? There's a few here that have played at the college level but most people here have football knowledge limited to what they learn from the tube on Sundays. There's just too much beneath the surface for average Joe to be more qualified to make these assessments than the pros who actually have access to game film, playbooks, etc...

Chris Long at 275 is strong enough to play DE in 3/4. And he has the body to add weight. I don't think it would be strange for him to play a position that he dominate from in college at all.

[That One Guy]

Chris Long at 275 is strong enough to play DE in 3/4. And he has the body to add weight. I don't think it would be strange for him to play a position that he dominate from in college at all.

My point though is that a 3-4 DE doesn't have the impact and face time that a franchise that barely escaped going winless will need. How many 3-4 DEs can you name? They might be an important part but I equate it almost to interior lineman... it's just not the sexy pick nor is it a pick that will often be a game changing player. A 1-15 team needs a game changer or a guy who can be the face and lead the franchise... the guy tasked with simply tying up blockers every play wont be a good use of that pick, I don't think. Also, I agree that he can add weight to get up around 300 but that's another risk in taking a player that high that you'll have to change before he can become effective. I just don't really see it happening.

[Northman]

This was said under the assumption that they're going to the 3-4 exclusively since Parcells is bringing his own guys as he is. 255 LB Jason Taylor will not be a DE in the 3-4. That's what I was saying, if they intended Long in the conventional 4-3 DE role or OLB then I'd believe it was a perfect fit but as a 3-4 DE, it's throwing away the pick.

And as for pros making picks, yes there's a lot of them that get things wrong. Some by way of a player just busting and some by way of trying to throw out suprises to make a name for themselves if it works out. Most average people though can only regurgitate what they hear on TV or if they are watching film, how many REALLY know what to look for? There's a few here that have played at the college level but most people here have football knowledge limited to what they learn from the tube on Sundays. There's just too much beneath the surface for average Joe to be more qualified to make these assessments than the pros who actually have access to game film, playbooks, etc...


Like Elsid said i dont think Chris will have a problem in a 4-3 or 3-4 scheme. The guy is the most talented Dline player in the draft this year and one of the best ive seen in a long time. He was the crutch of the Virginia defense and i dont think people truly understand how valuable he was to that team.

As for the comment in bold, yes i know there are some things behind the scenes that the ordinary joe would not know of or understand. But sports coverage in the last 15 years has grown drastically and you hear it all the time how ESPN reports on anything and everything. And now with the NFL Network you as a viewer can also watch what is happening on the field and you can start to see some of the things that you once were not able too.

So although i personally have no interest in being a sportscaster or commentator i dont think it would far stretched to say i could do their job as well as they. A lot of those analyst thought Clarett was going to be an excellent pro but failed to understand that they guy had very poor character and even when he got a chance to perform for a team with a legacy of having great backs his work ethic was poor and then look where he ended up? It just isnt that tough anymore for a ordinary joe or fan to understand the game of football as much as a analyst does. Ive seen plenty of guys on here who have shown more knowledge and work ethic than some of these analysts.

[Punisher]

If McFadden was there and the broncos don't pick him up..I Promise I'll break almost everything in my house out of angry..And someone had a idea of us trading down to the cowboys if we do that I'll break my T.V..

[SureShot]

Sounds like you should just sell your TV now and save yourself the expense.

[Punisher]

Sounds like you should just sell your TV now and save yourself the expense.

Ill just watch the draft and a crappy T.V. :wiggle:

[SureShot]

Make it a small TV, so when huck that sucker you won't hurt your back.

[Punisher]

Make it a small TV, so when huck that sucker you won't hurt your back.

Found one on ebay now i dare the broncos to trade down to the cowboys
http://cgi.ebay.com/Curtis-13-TV-TELEVISION-13-INCH-DVD-COMBO-SMALL-KIDS_W0QQitemZ120229681876QQihZ002QQcategoryZ50604 QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

[SureShot]

Over a $100 for shipping? Damn! Now I really hop e we trade down. I want to see the before and after pictures.ROFL!

[Punisher]

Over a $100 for shipping? Damn

Holy smokes..F that Im going to the Flea Market

[db56]

I've read through all the replies and this is my two cents for what its worth. I will agree that Shanny has found good production out of the rb's that he has drafted or signed as free agents but there has also been alot of them that are just less than mediocre backs, Ahmad Galloway, Sapp, Droughns, Clarett, and sorry to say but Young. just to name of few. For this offense to go from effective to spectacular it needs three positions to be above average, QB, RB, and TE. I have no beef with shanny for making the CP for Bailey trade, but we need another back as explosive as Portis to make our running game special again, while we can get three yards and a cloud of dust with any rb that is plugged in, if Mcfadden has good vision, breakaway speed and a little toughness, our offense could explode.

[Traveler]

I've read through all the replies and this is my two cents for what its worth. I will agree that Shanny has found good production out of the rb's that he has drafted or signed as free agents but there has also been alot of them that are just less than mediocre backs, Ahmad Galloway, Sapp, Droughns, Clarett, and sorry to say but Young. just to name of few. For this offense to go from effective to spectacular it needs three positions to be above average, QB, RB, and TE. I have no beef with shanny for making the CP for Bailey trade, but we need another back as explosive as Portis to make our running game special again, while we can get three yards and a cloud of dust with any rb that is plugged in, if Mcfadden has good vision, breakaway speed and a little toughness, our offense could explode.

Finally, someone who understands that when you have a chance at drafting an established playmaker, you don't pass on it. My hope is that we somehow land Clady, Williams or Albert. But if McFadden is there, it's a no-brainer.

[cmhargrove]

I've read through all the replies and this is my two cents for what its worth. I will agree that Shanny has found good production out of the rb's that he has drafted or signed as free agents but there has also been alot of them that are just less than mediocre backs, Ahmad Galloway, Sapp, Droughns, Clarett, and sorry to say but Young. just to name of few. For this offense to go from effective to spectacular it needs three positions to be above average, QB, RB, and TE. I have no beef with shanny for making the CP for Bailey trade, but we need another back as explosive as Portis to make our running game special again, while we can get three yards and a cloud of dust with any rb that is plugged in, if Mcfadden has good vision, breakaway speed and a little toughness, our offense could explode.

How about RT and LT? (See seasons 1997 & 1998 - Super Bowl Champs).

I agree with you, I love a star RB. Actually, I think we are all forgetting Travis Henry (which is actually a really great value if healthy this year). If we block a little better this year, he probably won't get so banged up. Same goes for Selvin. The reason why Shanahan had such a run with RB's for the last decade? - superior O-line play. Last 2 years - average O-line play.

I won't poo-poo McFadden. However, the O-line needs to be set so you don't break your new toy. Not to mention that Cutler guy.

[socalorado]

I have surprisingly seen several professional mocks that show Darren dropping to 7-13 range. If he's there at 12 we better draft him and keep him. The guy is awesome. We could still load up on OT and DT in later rounds. We need to pick up at least one safety though.

Sweet sig! How badass are those Orange jerseys!

[Kaylore]

How about RT and LT? (See seasons 1997 & 1998 - Super Bowl Champs).

I agree with you, I love a star RB. Actually, I think we are all forgetting Travis Henry (which is actually a really great value if healthy this year). If we block a little better this year, he probably won't get so banged up. Same goes for Selvin. The reason why Shanahan had such a run with RB's for the last decade? - superior O-line play. Last 2 years - average O-line play.

I won't poo-poo McFadden. However, the O-line needs to be set so you don't break your new toy. Not to mention that Cutler guy.

I think this last year the o-line needed help. However two years ago our starting tailbacks were Tatum and Mike Bell. That's really all you need to know about why our running game sucked.

[Northman]

I think this year the o-line needed help. However last year our starting tailbacks were Tatum and Mike Bell. That's really all you need to know about why our running game sucked.

Tatum wasnt with us last year bro. Or did you mean Young?

[Kaylore]

Tatum wasnt with us last year bro. Or did you mean Young?

No, I should have said "two years ago." I still am thinking of this last season as "this season" since the new one hasn't started even though its over and was last year. Sorry.

[Northman]

No, I should have said "two years ago." I still am thinking of this last season as "this season" since the new one hasn't started even though its over and was last year. Sorry.

Hey, its alright. I just have to get on the same wavelength as you. You know, with your higher intellect that can be hard to achieve at times your excellence. :rofl: :thumbsup:

[Kaylore]

Hey, its alright. I just have to get on the same wavelength as you. You know, with your higher intellect that can be hard to achieve at times your excellence. :rofl: :thumbsup:

Or it's this daylight savings stealing my sleep time and making me delirious. Or I'm just stupid....both?:P

[Dedhed]

I've read through all the replies and this is my two cents for what its worth. I will agree that Shanny has found good production out of the rb's that he has drafted or signed as free agents but there has also been alot of them that are just less than mediocre backs, Ahmad Galloway, Sapp, Droughns, Clarett, and sorry to say but Young. just to name of few. For this offense to go from effective to spectacular it needs three positions to be above average, QB, RB, and TE. I have no beef with shanny for making the CP for Bailey trade, but we need another back as explosive as Portis to make our running game special again, while we can get three yards and a cloud of dust with any rb that is plugged in, if Mcfadden has good vision, breakaway speed and a little toughness, our offense could explode.

The 'most special' running game Denver ever had was when we were giving the ball to a 6th rounder.

[Dedhed]

But if McFadden is there, it's a no-brainer.
You mean trading the pick to the highest bidder, right?

[want2bAbronco2]

How about RT and LT? (See seasons 1997 & 1998 - Super Bowl Champs).

I agree with you, I love a star RB. Actually, I think we are all forgetting Travis Henry (which is actually a really great value if healthy this year). If we block a little better this year, he probably won't get so banged up. Same goes for Selvin. The reason why Shanahan had such a run with RB's for the last decade? - superior O-line play. Last 2 years - average O-line play.

I won't poo-poo McFadden. However, the O-line needs to be set so you don't break your new toy. Not to mention that Cutler guy.

I don't agree. We havent had a good running game since CP left. The last 4-5yrs we have gotten "yards" but nothing special. When the game is on the line ie. running out clock, or picking up key 3rd/4th downs we come up short for years. I want a back that on 3rd and 3 you know you are getting it. I think our OT/DT/S/LB/WR need upgrading in that order (OT/DT 1a and 1b) but if someone like McF is there you take him and make fun of the 11 teams infront of you.

[wabbit]

I've read through all the replies and this is my two cents for what its worth. I will agree that Shanny has found good production out of the rb's that he has drafted or signed as free agents but there has also been alot of them that are just less than mediocre backs, Ahmad Galloway, Sapp, Droughns, Clarett, and sorry to say but Young. just to name of few. For this offense to go from effective to spectacular it needs three positions to be above average, QB, RB, and TE. I have no beef with shanny for making the CP for Bailey trade, but we need another back as explosive as Portis to make our running game special again, while we can get three yards and a cloud of dust with any rb that is plugged in, if Mcfadden has good vision, breakaway speed and a little toughness, our offense could explode.


You can't be serious.

Young posted one of the highest YPC in the NFL last year as a rookie. He had to earn his place on the roster after signing as a FA AND played special teams.

The staff believes the one-two punch of a healthy Henry and Young could be an exceptional RB tandem...it's why Mike Bell has fallen so far out of the picture and Sapp was allowed to seek greener pastures.

...but mediocre??...don't think so.

[Dedhed]

You can't be serious.

Young posted one of the highest YPC in the NFL last year as a rookie. He had to earn his place on the roster after signing as a FA AND played special teams.

The staff believes the one-two punch of a healthy Henry and Young could be an exceptional RB tandem...it's why Mike Bell has fallen so far out of the picture and Sapp was allowed to seek greener pastures.

...but mediocre??...don't think so.

I agree, Young looked great running the ball last year, and when you add in what he brings to the passing game he added a lot to the offense for a first year player.

Young was the 3rd most productive rookie rusher behind AD and Marshawn Lynch; behind only AD in yds/carry. When the numbers are right there with only first round talent, "mediocre" doesn't seem like an apt assessment.

[Northman]

I don't agree. We havent had a good running game since CP left. The last 4-5yrs we have gotten "yards" but nothing special. When the game is on the line ie. running out clock, or picking up key 3rd/4th downs we come up short for years. I want a back that on 3rd and 3 you know you are getting it. I think our OT/DT/S/LB/WR need upgrading in that order (OT/DT 1a and 1b) but if someone like McF is there you take him and make fun of the 11 teams infront of you.

Without a good Oline your back wont get those 3 yds. In case you havent noticed the opposing defenses are in our backfield from the word go which has stumped our RB's consistently. McFadden is a nice player but he wouldnt be anymore successful than the backs we have without a Oline to create the holes. Why people dont understand this is beyond me.