Your Dream Mock/Offseason Moves

[iforgotmypassword]

I think mine would be considering we lose a majority of our games from here on out mainly because of my first round selection of.....

FIRST ROUND

Chris Long, Virginia, DE
Height: 6-4 Weight: 284

DE is not a big need for us I understand this, but I absolutely love what this kid can bring to our Defense and team as a whole. He's the type of talented, smart, kid you want on your team. He's a leader and a cometetive warrior. John Lynch type character.

SECOUND ROUND

Gosder Cherilus, Boston College, T
Hieght: 6-7 Wieght: 317

Believe it or not, this guy can actually move and play in our scheme. If people think we need a redzone option, this is the best move we can make for our red zone O.


THIRD ROUND (from foxworth getting signed away)

Terrell Thomas, USC, CB/FS/STs
Height: 6-1 Weight: 200

I give props to Socalorado for gettin me to take a closer look at Thomas, who had this to say about him

A jack of all trades, Terrell Thomas can play corner, safety and return specialist. He also returned a blocked field goal for a touchdown in 2006. The leader of USC's locker room.

Another leader type athlete who you build the core of your team with.

FOURTH ROUND
B.J. Raji, Boston College, DT
Height: 6-1 Wieght: 340

Declared Accademically Ineligable for 2008, kind of a turn-off, BC is a tough school? Either way his upside is huge and it fits a need.

FOURTH ROUND

Tom Zbikowski, Nortre Dame, S
Height: 6-0 Wieght: 207

The steal of the draft in my oppinion, comes in, adds depths to the secoundary. He plays the run amazingly well, comes up and makes a hit, replaces Lynch when he's gone. Just a real tough kid.

FIFTH ROUND

Jordan Dizon, Colorado, LB
Height: 6-0 Weight: 225

Screw the size, if you can play, then you can play. Dizon can play.

FIFTH ROUND
Owen Schmitt, West Virginia, FB/TE
Height: 6-3 Wieght: 260

Monster. Improves our ground attack.

SEVENTH ROUND

Kerry Brown, Appalachian State, G
Height: 6-6 Wieght: 310

Runs a 5.16, big, fast, we need OL. Worth a shot.

SEVENTH ROUND
Marcus Harrison, Arkansas, DT
Hieght: 6-3 Wieght: 310

This man runs a 4.98. This man wieghs 310. Another pick to bolster our lines. Huge upside.

Some picks are somewhat of a stretch, but I think Tommy Z and Dizon will drop that far. Thomas probaly wouldn't but could....

This new crop of Broncos would be a talented, competetive bunch with great attitudes..... again building to the CORE of the team.

Next Step. RESIGN OUR PLAYERS. With Stokely recently resigned heres a list of the rest

Hamza Abdullah (RFA) sign
Stephen Alexander (UFA) gone
Ebenezer Ekuban (UFA) Resign cheap
Jason Elam (UFA) sign
Todd Sauerbrunn (UFA)sign
Nick Ferguson (UFA)gone.... we brought in two rookies.
Domonique Foxworth (RFA)get the 3rd rounder for him
Karl Paymah (RFA)sign
Antwon Burton (ERFA)cut
Jamie Winborn (UFA)sign... he's made a impression on me on specail teams.
Chris Myers (RFA)sign cheap to duke it out.
Erik Pears (ERFA)sign cheap to duke it out.
Cecil Sapp (UFA) sign
Nate Jackson (UFA)cut

FREE AGENTS TO BRING IN

1. Boss Bailey, OLB, I'm on the Bailey Brothers bandwagon, I think he's a stud and it's a position we need.

2. Teddy Lehman, MLB, bring him in alongside Baily, another tuff player in my oppinion.

3. Corey Williams, DT, one of the biggest moves in the off-season, will come fairly cheap and will pay off huge.

4. Fred Taylor, RB, downside of his carear and will come cheap, has always been nothing short of a monster WHEN HEALTHY, granted he's has a hard time stayin healthy I think he's worth a cheap contract

5. Bryant Johnson, WR, could develope into a elete WR not being overshawdowed by Boldin and Fitzgerald in Arizona.... the guy is an athlete, he's a Brandon Marshall clone.


ADDRESSING THE OLINE PROBLEM

And it is a problem guys. My solution is simple.

Draft our two guys from above, retain our OL at a low cost as stated above, bring in 10-15 undrafted free agents, and no name free agents, have one hell of a camp where the good players emerge, and go into the season with your best hardnosed tough line. O-lines aren't about having big names, they're about being one legit UNIT, rather than great individual players.

That's my offseason plan as of today, i'd love to hear yours

[bpc]

Shoot, I would be happy if we got a high draft pick, traded back late into the first, picked up a 2nd and ended day one with 3 selections.

1. Otah - OT - Pitt
2. Beau Bell - MLB - UNLV
3. Donnie Avery - WR - Houston

FA:

1. Jordan Gross - RT - Carolina
2. Corey Williams - DT - Green Bay
... hell, if this is a fantasy mock, lets sign Karlos Dansby to play SAM with DJ at Will and Beau at MLB.

[Elway777]

The Broncos sign Corry Williams and Fanaca . Hamilton will retire and Nalen comes back for one more year. The Broncos also sign Ken Hamlin if Lynch retires. Williams knows bates system and Fanaca will bring fire to offensve line. The Broncos trade down with Dallas for a 1 and 2. They also trade Foxworth for a 3. 1. keith Rivers 2a Erin Henderson 2b Dre Moore 3a Donnie Avery . 4a Tra Williams 4b Duane Brown 5a Payton Hillis 5b Brian Johnston 7a Joe Fields 7b Tyrell Johnson. Undrafted free agents signed Todd Blythe, Hugh Charles,Trevor Scott ,Julius Stinson,Brandon Sumrall ,Pedro Sosa and Alley Brousard .

[phibacka31]

I LOVE the idea of bringing in Bryant johnson for WR. He is a good WR with boldin and fitz in front of him. I watched him a lot in college. good Player:thumbsup:

[iforgotmypassword]

After today's game I'm very close to considering changing my first pick, not because of Dumerville we all knew he was a stud, not because Crowder and Moss are only rookies with huge upsides, but because of Josh Mallard.... this guy is making plays, being a force, adding a VERY SOLID de to our mix... without DE in round 1, BCP's first two selections could easily swap for mine..... we bring in a stud OL, not as big but more proven, and we get a monster of a LB..... I donno I just really think Mallard is proving DE is not only not a worry(as it wasn't already) but pushed it back far enough as to not being a worry what so ever

[27atwater]

I try to be realistic, but here is what I'd like to see if we pick at the 13-16 range. Assuming that Kenny Phillips is gone:

OK, here is my first crack at who I want. Bear with me as I am not 100% on where our pix are. I know we lost our #3, but we have a #4 from the Lelie deal and possibly a #4 from the Warren deal since he's met his playing time requirement...giving us 3 #4s I believe. We also have our own #5, but lost #6 for Jimmy Kennedy. We also have 2 #7s for Plummer...so here we go:

Round 1
Dan Connor, LB, Penn State 6'3" 235
Connor can play either inside or out and was uber-productive at Penn State. I like Puz better, but dude can still play ball w/ the best of em. Other options include James Laurinitis (if we get lucky) and Keith Rivers.

Round 2
Eric Young, OG, Tennessee 6'4" 305
Young is big and athletic, a good fit for the Denver system. As I ama homer, I am also a realist. I have zero interest in Hefney, but Young is a very good guard. Has big time experience against SEC competition. Other options include Jon Goff, ILB of Vanderbilt or Kerry Brown, OT of App. State.

Round 4a
Craig Steltz, Safety, LSU 6'2" 209
Steltz is not your typical flashy big time playmaker at Safety, but he is a heady, strong, player who is a stable contributor in the mold of a John Lynch. Has the intangibles to be a great special teamer until it's his turn to supplant Lynch. Other options include Jamar Adams of Michigan or another position.

Round 4b
Dre Moore, DT, Maryland 6'4" 311
Moore would be a nice complement to Marcus Thomas and has a bit more room to grow. Another option is the 324lb Red Bryant of Texas A&M.

Round 4c/5
Beau Bell, OLB, UNLV 6'3" 245
Bell is the bigger LB we have been waiting for. He has tons of potential. Even though I like Connor too, we need options at the LB spot. What we have now just isn't cutting it. Other options include Ezra Butler of Nevada.

Round 5--SLEEPER SPECIAL!!!
Darius Reynaud, WR, West Virginia 5'10" 200
Dude is a flat out player. He is basically the only go to WR on a running team. He is a THREAT! Although short, he is sturdy and stout. He can be a dangerous returnman or be a great complement to our current WR corps. Donnie Avery of Houston is a burner who could fit nicely here as well.

2 pix in round 7
I'd like to take Louis Holmes, DE, Arizona and Anthony Hoke, OLB, Cincinnati.

My Free Agency wish list includes a few cost friendly veteran additions:

Ken Hamlin, Safety, Dallas Cowboys
Jordan Gross, RT, Carolina Panthers
Karlos Dansby, LB, Arizona Cardinals
Justin Smith, DE, Cincinnati Bengals
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[iforgotmypassword]

I notice you mention Kerry Brown as a 2nd round option, I have him in the secound, I've seen Appalachian play this year, watched the National Championship last night, great player. I'd be for takin him at 4a but in the secound?? Considerably high in my oppinion.

If Beau Bell was availble at 4c and we didn't take him I would jump directly off the shanny's a good coach wag to the fire shanny bandwagon.

Darius Reynaud would be a nice addition to our O and a possible pick, but I would rather sign Bryant Johnson from Arizona to completely solidify that possition. Save the pick for another pos.

[27atwater]

I notice you mention Kerry Brown as a 2nd round option, I have him in the secound, I've seen Appalachian play this year, watched the National Championship last night, great player. I'd be for takin him at 4a but in the secound?? Considerably high in my oppinion.

If Beau Bell was availble at 4c and we didn't take him I would jump directly off the shanny's a good coach wag to the fire shanny bandwagon.

Darius Reynaud would be a nice addition to our O and a possible pick, but I would rather sign Bryant Johnson from Arizona to completely solidify that possition. Save the pick for another pos.

Much like the OT that SF traded up w/ New England to get last year, I think Kerry Brown will be this year's quick riser once the combine and workouts come along. JMHO.

[-Slap-]

Beau Bell is going to be off the board by the 40th pick.

[bpc]

Revised:

Renegotiate Lepsis, Nalen, and Hamilton. Try to keep Nalen... if Lepsis is potentially interested in a spot on the bench, he can stay too. I have no faith that Hamilton will be coming back honestly.

Go full-bore at FA's Jordan Gross - OT and Corey Williams - DT.

***Draft***: With the 11th pick, trade back with San Francisco so they can move up and select a QB. Denver picks up the 29th and 35th selections.

1st Round, 29th Pick overall: Pick the best remaining tackle on the board from this order, Jeff Otah, Ryan Clady, Chris Williams, or Sam Baker.

2nd Round, 35th Pick Overall: Draft whoever is available between Beau Bell - MLB or Kentwan Balmer - NT.

2nd Round, 43rd Pick Overall: Assuming that we landed an OT in round 1 and Beau Bell from pick 2a, I would like either the previously mentioned Balmer, Frank Okam - NT or Donnie Avery - WR at this spot. We'll assume Balmer slides here.

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From what I've read, because of playing time, the Gerard Warren 5th round pick that Denver received could turn into a 4th round selection giving us 3 picks. Assuming that our first three selections looked like this:

1. Jeff Otah - OT
Otah is one of the most intriguing senior prospects. He entered the season as a late-round prospect whose size jumped out at scouts coming in to check on Pitt right tackle Mike McGlynn. Over the course of the 2007 season, Otah has surged past McGlynn and dozens of other offensive tackles to be considered one of the elite blockers of the 2008 class.

Otah, who is Nigerian, focused on basketball throughout his prep days, choosing to play football only during his senior year of high school. Otah attended Valley Forge Military Academy. He quickly proved to be one of the top Juco prospects in the country, earning recruiting attention from the likes of Oklahoma, West Virginia, South Carolina, and Maryland.

Otah has started every game the last two seasons at the all-important left tackle position and his improvement has been extraordinary. Otah was particularly impressive this year in a showdown against Chris Long, Virginia's All-American defensive end. Long, a potential top-five selection, is among the country's leaders among defensive linemen in tackles, tackles for loss, and sacks -- and yet was held to only three tackles in his matchup against Otah -- an effort that grabbed the attention of scouts.

Blessed with spectacular size, Otah flashes the combination of strength and foot quickness scouts want in a left tackle. With only five years of experience, he remains a work in progress, but his raw tools and steady improvement could make him a first-round pick.

Rare frame with long limbs and big hands. ... Good initial quickness off the snap. Good overall body strength, with outstanding upper-body strength. ... Surprising foot quickness and balance in pass protection. ... Can mirror the defender. ... Uses his hands well to gain an initial advantage with his hand punch and can control the pass rusher with his long arms and mobility. ... Good strength in the running game. Flashes explosiveness in creating movement at the point of attack. At least adequate body control for a player of his size when blocking on the move. ... Can get to the second level and block linebackers. ... Flashes the nastiness scouts are looking for. ... Good effort. ... Exciting upside considering his size and massive improvement despite only five years of experience in organized football. ... Durable -- has never missed a game due to injury.



2a. Beau Bell - MLB

There may not be an inside linebacker in the country with Bell's combination of size, speed and upside. At 6-feet-2, 248 pounds, Bell has the size teams are looking for in an inside run plugger. He reads the action quickly and attacks the line of scrimmage to stop the run for minimal gain. Bell, whose speed has been estimated in the mid 4.6s, can meet the back at the edge. Bell also shows good instincts in the passing game, as well as the speed to get depth on his drops -- making him a rare true inside linebacker who isn't an obvious liability on passing downs. Of concern is that Bell hasn't always demonstrated the toughness needed to be successful in the NFL. He missed the final five games last season with a sprained ankle that some thought he could have played through. Bell still led UNLV in tackles (76). When the injury occurred, Bell was leading the Mountain West Conference in tackles after finishing fourth in the conference in tackles as a sophomore despite only starting seven of 11 games.

Physical prototype for the inside linebacker position. ... Physically imposing athlete with rare timed speed. ... Cerebral player who reads the action quickly. ... Always around the ball. ... Reliable open-field tackler who generates good pop on his hits. ... Athletic enough to beat most blockers to the ball and has improved his hand usage to disengage. ... Gets good depth on his drops and reads the quarterback's eyes to close on the ball. ... Good short-area burst to make the play when the opportunities present themselves. ... Productive player -- has posted monster numbers each of his three seasons as a starter for UNLV.

2007 Mountain West Conference DEFENSIVE PLAYER OF THE YEAR: UNLV senior linebacker and co-captain Beau Bell (Tustin, CA) was named the Mountain West Defensive Player of the Year as the league announced its official postseason awards on Tuesday. Bell, who was also named First Team All-MWC, is the fourth Rebel in history to earn a league's player of the award on defense, joining two-time winner Jamaal Brimmer (2002, '03/media only), Kevin Thomas (2001) and Aaron Moog (1984). Bell is also the first UNLV linebacker to earn such an honor. "It's a big deal being named the player of the year for this conference because the coaches vote along with the media," said Bell. "We worked hard all year as a team and this is a great way to wrap up my college career. Despite our final record I had a lot of fun playing with these guys and will never forget my senior year as a Rebel." Bell, who leaves UNLV as its second-leading career tackler with 320, became the first player in league history to be named MWC Defensive Player of the Week three times in one season. He turned in the sixth-most tackles in school history with 126 as a senior, which leads the MWC and ranks 20th in the nation. He also stands 11th nationally with 6.58 solo tackles per game. Not just a tackling machine, however, Bell was a playmaker all over the field, tying for fourth in the nation with five forced fumbles and ranking fifth in the MWC with a team-leading four interceptions, including one returned for a touchdown at Wyoming. He also led his team with 9.5 tackles for loss, ranked second with three QB sacks and third on the squad with three pass breakups. - UNLV Sports



3b. Kentwan Balmer - NT

There are few positions NFL scouts are more willing to gamble high-round draft picks on than defensive linemen. In Balmer, there certainly is reason to gamble.

Blessed with rare overall athleticism for a man his size, Balmer has enjoyed a breakout senior campaign in 2007 after struggling with consistency throughout his previous years with the Tar Heels. Though statistics can be manipulated to make ridiculous arguments, there is no denying Balmer's improvement as a senior from seasons past. Over the 2005 and 2006 seasons, a span in which Balmer played in 21 games, the big defensive tackle accumulated 33 tackles, 7.5 tackles for loss and 3.5 sacks. Through the first seven games of the 2007 season, Balmer had already racked up 40 tackles, including 5.5 tackles for loss and half a sack.

As his numbers indicate, Balmer isn't a natural pass rusher, lacking the burst off the snap to generate much pressure up front. He does possess good size at the point of attack to fend off double-team blocks. He reads the action quickly and, after being voted a permanent team captain this season, has played with a sense of urgency. He has pursued with passion this season, making many of his tackles down the line of scrimmage.

Rare combination of size and overall athleticism -- especially in terms of his straight-line speed and flexibility. ... Has really matured as a senior, earning permanent team captain honors. ... Role as a leader has apparently paid off as he looks like a different player on film in 2007. ... Flashes quickness at the point of attack. ... Recognizes the action and pursues down the line hard. ... Protects his knees and will go airborne to make the play. ... Good strength at the point of attack to eat up double-teams and allow opportunities for his teammates. ... Reliable open-field tackler with rare agility for a man his size. ... Could be on the verge of realizing his potential.

The Associated Press ACC All-Conference team was released Wednesday and Weldon native and University of North Carolina senior Kentwan Balmer was named to the second-team. Balmer ended his last year in Chapel Hill with 59 tackles, including four solo tackles in Saturdays win over Duke. He also had 9.5 tackles for loss and 3.5 sacks in 2007. He finishes his Carolina career with 93 tackles and seven sacks. The 6-5 295 pound defensive tackle has already earned selections to the Senior Bowl and the Hula Bowl. - Jonas Pope, Roanoke Rapids Daily Herald

[bpc]

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4a. Robert Felton - OG - Arkansas
Robert Felton has been a mainstay on the Arkansas offensive line since his redshirt freshman season in 2004. However, Felton hasn't been a mainstay at one position over that time. The fifth-year senior from Houston has started at four of the five positions on the Razorback line during that time and was on the move once again in Arkansas' 45-31 win over the Bulldogs. "He's always been that way," Markuson said. "He's a smart player. If we didn't think he had the sense to do it, obviously we couldn't use him the way we've been able to. He's a capable guy. He's always accepted his role if the team needed him first. He's always been a team guy. He's been an awesome guy to coach that way." Not only is Felton an awesome guy to coach, he's an agile one. At 6-foot-4, 328 pounds, Felton showed off his agility at the team's preseason media day by doing cartwheels for the cameras. That agility has NFL scouts interested in allowing Felton the opportunity to play football when his days at Arkansas are finished. "They [the NFL ] like that," Markuson said. "Particularly, I've told guys he can snap. He hasn't snapped here in games much, but he can snap the football. He'd be an inside guy there. That in itself might give him a chance to get in a camp. You've just got to see what people are saying in April when that comes around. He has some ability that way, but we'll see. " Felton's abilities allow him to switch positions and his attitude doesn't hurt. "I'll play anywhere," Felton said. "If that's where the team needs me, it's where I'll be. Who doesn't want to stick in one spot ? But if that's my role on the team to play everywhere, that's my role." - Matt Jones, Northwest Arkansas Times

4b. Owen Schmidt - FB - WVA

Teams looking for versatile fullbacks capable of changing games with their running and receiving ability have options with Furman's Jerome Felton and Arkansas' Peyton Hillis. For teams looking for a traditional human sledgehammer at fullback, Schmitt promises to be among the draft's top-rated lead blockers. Like Felton and Hillis, Schmitt is a talented runner and receiver. Where he stands out, however, is the sheer physicality and relentlessness in his blocking. Schmitt has experience at running back and tight end, as well as the traditional lead blocker role, and has the athleticism to allow a creative offensive coordinator to tinker with. His best asset, however, remains his ability to physically remove defenders from the hole.

Well-built athlete. ... Prides himself on working out and it shows in his powerful frame. ... Versatile fullback, capable of helping a team with his running, receiving and blocking. ... Good straight ahead runner with surprising lateral quickness. ... Soft hands out of the backfield as a receiver. ... Reliable enough as a receiver that West Virginia is expected to feature him as a tight end some this season. ... Best attribute is his lead blocking. ... Not only clears holes, he does it with an old school degree of physicality and nastiness.


4c. Wesley Woodard - OLB - UK

First-team All-SEC at Will as selected by league coaches … Named the team's Most Outstanding Defensive Player for 2006 by the Wildcat coaches … Began the season on the watch list for the Butkus Award for the nation's top linebacker … Second in the SEC and 18th nationally in tackles per game, averaging 9.4 per contest … Led team in total tackles (122) and tackles for loss (9.5) … Led the team in tackles in 11 of 13 games during the season, with a season-high 13 stops at Louisville … Paced UK with 12 tackles in the Music City Bowl, including a jarring QB sack, causing a fumble that was recovered by the Wildcats … Earned a place on the SEC Academic Honor Roll.

Lost in the shadow of the dynamic Kentucky offense has been the performance, thus far of Wildcat outside linebacker Wesley Woodyard. Despite the fact that Woodyard earned First Team SEC honors he still entered this season as a virtual unknown outside of Lexington. Woodyard finished second behind only Patrick Willis in average tackles per game in 2006 and he leads the conference this year. In fact, his 11.6 per game average is a full 2.4 tackles a contest better than anyone else in the SEC. At only 6-1, 215 pounds NFL teams are struggling with where they like Woodyard best -- at his customary weakside linebacker position or as an in-the-box strong safety prospect.

5. Julius Stinson - CB - Wyoming

2007 All-Mountain West Conference First Team: DB Julius Stinson concluded his Wyoming career ranked No. 2 in the conference and No. 24 in the nation in interceptions with five on the season. He also ranked second in the MWC and No. 12 in the NCAA in passes defended, with a total of 17 for the year. The native of Victorville, Calif., was one of 12 semifinalists for this year's Jim Thorpe Award, which honors the nation's top defensive back. Stinson was an Honorable Mention All-MWC selection his junior year. - Wyoming Sports

7a. Lance Leggett - WR - Miami

2007 All-Mountain West Conference First Team: DB Julius Stinson concluded his Wyoming career ranked No. 2 in the conference and No. 24 in the nation in interceptions with five on the season. He also ranked second in the MWC and No. 12 in the NCAA in passes defended, with a total of 17 for the year. The native of Victorville, Calif., was one of 12 semifinalists for this year's Jim Thorpe Award, which honors the nation's top defensive back. Stinson was an Honorable Mention All-MWC selection his junior year. - Wyoming Sports

7b. Chauncey Washington - HB - USC

[lookin' glass]

Sold! Get 'em and sign 'em.

[bpc]

Jeff Otah Article:

<a href="http://imageshack.us"><img src="http://img338.imageshack.us/img338/4255/jeffotahmd4.png" border="0" alt="Image Hosted by ImageShack.us"/></a><br/>

Otah stands out on Pitt's line
Friday, October 19, 2007
By Paul Zeise, Pittsburgh Post-Gazette
Pitt's offensive line hasn't been very good this season nor has it played with any consistency.

But that's not the case for senior starting left tackle Jeff Otah, who has been both consistent and played well all season.

Just don't ask him to speak highly of his performances because Otah won't do it.

He said he believes the offensive line is a unit -- five as one -- and if the unit is struggling then no individual player can be having that great a season.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Tomorrow
Game: Cincinnati (6-1) vs. Pitt (2-4), noon.
Where: Heinz Field
TV: WTAE

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"I'm doing a pretty good job, but I have room for improvement. I have [to] stay with my blocks longer and try to get my guy on the ground more to keep him out of the play," said Otah, who is 6 feet 6, 340 pounds. "My goal is to help my team win, so from that standpoint, I have to step [up] my game a lot. There is always room for improvement for our team until we start winning.

"As a unit, we all need to step up because we are the backbone of the team, we are the most experienced group and we must perform well to give this team a chance to win every week."

While Otah won't talk about how well he has played, those around him will.

"Jeff Otah is having an absolutely great year," Pitt coach Dave Wannstedt said. "He is really working hard and he is doing everything he can do to help us win. The thing that is neat about Jeff is that every week brings something new for him because of his inexperience playing football. I mean, every week something will come up that [offensive line coach] Paul Dunn will have to explain to him because he's seeing it for the first time, and that's unusual for seniors, but Jeff just hasn't played a lot of football.

"The only negative I see with Jeff is that I wish we had him for another couple of years because obviously it would help us, but it would help him, too."

It might seem strange for a coach speak of a senior and a player who is in his second season as a starter as being inexperienced. But it applies in Otah's case -- though, he clearly has been a fast learner.

He didn't start playing until he was a senior in high school. Before that, he was a standout in basketball. But when it became apparent he wasn't going to be heavily recruited, he gave football a try.

His size helped him get noticed in football, and he spent the next two seasons learning the basics at Valley Forge Military Academy's junior college. By the time he had finished his sophomore season, he was one of the top junior college tackles in the country and had offers from Oklahoma, South Carolina, West Virginia and Maryland.

Pitt also was in the mix, and the Panthers' immediate need for a left tackle might have helped sway Otah. Other factors were Wannstedt's background in the NFL and Pitt's relative proximity to Otah's home in New Castle, Del.

A couple weeks ago, Otah played an outstanding game against Virginia -- one of the few bright spots in a 44-14 loss -- as he got the better of All-American defensive lineman Chris Long almost every time they went head to head. Then last week, he dominated every player he matched up against in the 48-45 loss to Navy.

Still, if you ask Otah, he didn't play well enough in either game and that's something he is working to correct tomorrow when the Panthers (2-4, 0-1 in the Big East) play host to No. 23 Cincinnati (6-1, 0-1) .

"I obviously didn't play well enough against Virginia because we didn't win," Otah said. "I know there were at least a couple of plays that, had I blocked better, we could have probably scored off of, so I have to get better. I guess you could say I was just OK, but I know I could have played a lot better because the only thing that matters is if the team wins."

<a href="http://imageshack.us"><img src="http://img158.imageshack.us/img158/1400/otahwd2.jpg" border="0" alt="Image Hosted by ImageShack.us"/></a><br/>

[bpc]

Beau Bell Article:

<a href="http://imageshack.us"><img src="http://img337.imageshack.us/img337/2720/bell3ed1.jpg" border="0" alt="Image Hosted by ImageShack.us"/></a><br/>

Rebels’ linebacker Bell gets honors
By Adrian Bradley, Contributing Writer

Published on December 6, 2007

Scroll your eyes across the various nameplates on the lockers in the UNLV Rebels’ football locker room and it’s easy to distinguish the stars. They typically occupy two lockers, not one. And between the countless invitations to post-season all-star games, extra clothes, shoes and iPod speakers, their sheer quantity of stuff exceeds that of their teammates.

It’s a status thing.

For the Rebels, Jeremy Geathers doubles up. So do Mil’Von James, Tony Cade and Fauo Faga. It’s a wonder to some that Beau Bell doesn’t show up to the facility every day mad that he’s not among such names. Considering he just finished the best season of his four-year career as a Rebel and is usually associated with former UNLV stars such as Jamal Brimmer, Eric Wright and Randall Cunningham — he seems most deserving of such benefits.

But when asked why he has only one locker, Bell says, “Because I’m not a star, bro.”
Yeah, sure. Bell has never been more of a star, with 126 tackles and five forced fumbles for a team that won on games after a 2-3 start. Then the blustering linebacker adds, “I’m just an average linebacker.” And he’s not laughing or smiling at all. His face is blank, making it hard to interpret how he really feels.

While Geathers entertains the Rebels with his unprecedented stand-up comedy, Bell tends to keep to himself quiet and focused until he hits the field. He’ll pound his chest to the sideline after a great tackle, or hang his head when he misses one, but he won’t give the guys in the locker room a peak into his game-day rituals.

Geathers believes Bell doesn’t want anyone to know his secret.

“He doesn’t talk much about it,” Geathers said. “Well, whatever his rituals are, they seem to be working.”

The best evidence of Bell’s hard work is hidden deeply in his lone locker, under some old practice cleats and Tustin High School sweat pants. While eating Subway in front of his locker on a recent Tuesday afternoon, Bell reaches down into his locker and pulls out a four-inch-thick notebook. He flips it open to a section labeled “2007 game plans and goals.”

Inside are pages of scouting notes he jotted down during his numerous private film sessions throughout the course of the season.

Not even James, whose lockers are next door, knew that Bell broke down the films in such detail until the cornerback borrowed his notebook one day last season.

“I just do it this way because it’s easier for me to understand,” Bell said. “Nobody knows who I am and the things I do to prepare.”
Building up to each week’s game, Bell jots down tendencies of his opponents and writes down three or four goals, one of which is always “Make plays!”

The most extensive note came before playing San Diego State on Nov. 10, Bell’s last time playing at home in front of UNLV Rebel fans. His goals were: “Make this a game to remember. Stay on my grind. Don’t let up.”

Bell did not disappoint. In the first half, he made history by becoming second in career tackles at UNLV with 297. In the second half, he continued his All-American season by making an amazing play on a receiver to grab his fourth interception of the season — all of which have come in the last four games. He then lateraled the ball to James who returned the turnover 31 yards. Bell finished with nine tackles, a total moving him from 10th to sixth on the Mountain West Conference all-time list.

“Beau Bell is anything but regular. He is the coaches’ example of a blue-collar worker. He is not flashy, he just knows how to get the job done,” said sophomore safety Ryan Tillman.
“I see myself making plays before they happen,” Bell said. “I try to visualize the game and situations I might be in and how I would react.”

Bell also has high expectations for himself. He doesn’t like to miss tackles.

“He is very in tune to what is going on,” said Jason Beauchamp who is set to replace Bell next season. “He is always well prepared for games and I think that’s what gives him confidence.”

Bell will be off to the NFL soon, making an upgrade from the metal chair in front of his locker to a fully wooden furnished locker three times the size as the one he has now. He’ll have some cleaning to do before he leaves the locker room for good. A FedEx envelope of senior bowl invitations are overflowing and flooding into James’s space. No matter how many things Bell collects, you will never hear him ask for another locker.

“I’m just like everybody else. I just want to win games and make plays. I don’t need a big locker to do that.”

Editor’s Note: Adrian Bradley is a member of the UNLV football team.

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[bpc]

Kentwan Balmer Article:

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Balmer has only one speed: full tilt
Tar Heels' senior tackle says he learned early to play as hard as you can


By Bill Cole
JOURNAL REPORTER


Defensive tackle Kentwan Balmer of North Carolina (90) chases quarterback Kyle Wright of Miami.
(AP File Photo)


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CHAPEL HILL

Kentwan Balmer doesn’t like breaks, and he’s not fond of rest.

He has energy and figures he should use it to make himself better. It doesn’t matter to Balmer, a 6-5, 295-pound senior defensive tackle at North Carolina, if he’s playing football, working on the practice field, in the weight room or studying in a classroom.

He isn’t going to take time off when there’s work to be done.

“When you come from a high school like I came from in a small town, you always have to work and go an extra mile,” Balmer said. “You have to give better effort than everybody else. Every play, you have to compete.”

The results showed last Saturday when Balmer delivered the defensive play of the game against Maryland. Tired and aching from playing four quarters, he rushed quarterback Chris Turner and forced an incomplete pass on fourth down with 36 seconds left to seal a 16-13 victory.

This Saturday, Balmer will try to help North Carolina defeat N.C State for the fourth consecutive time. The teams will meet at Carter-Finley Stadium in Raleigh, with kickoff at noon.

“Every time we line up, those guys want to knock our heads off, and we want to knock theirs off,” Balmer said. “It’s going to be a knock-down, drag-out battle on every play, and that’s what you want. That’s what you look for.”

Balmer is one of two defensive players that Coach Butch Davis knows he can depend on on every play. Senior end Hilee Taylor is the other. Davis hasn’t seen either take a play off all season.

“I don’t know that I ever saw or caught Kentwan Balmer ever loafing in a game or practice,” Davis said. “When it’s his turn to take a rep, he’s going a million miles an hour. He’s giving everything he’s got.”

Balmer has played against N.C. State three times. He could tell the defense’s young starters all about the intensity, hostility and name-calling they will encounter but suspects that he won’t have to say a word Friday night or Saturday morning.

“Ain’t really a whole lot you can say,” Balmer said. “They’re hungry. They want it. And that’s half the battle.”

Balmer needed more than three years to reach respected veteran’s status. He fought against big odds many times along the way, sometimes in his hometown of Weldon, a small town in northeastern North Carolina near Roanoke Rapids and a little south of the Virginia line.

Weldon is small enough that most everyone knows everyone and big enough to offer dangerous temptations.

“There’s not that many people and not that many opportunities,” Balmer said. “It can be troublesome at times. Everybody wants to prove a point, you know?”

Balmer attended Weldon High, one of the smallest public schools in the state, and is now one of about 22,000 students at North Carolina. He had seldom encountered the ethnic diversity that he found in Chapel Hill as a freshman but said he found it refreshing.

Balmer also is the first person in his family (he has three older brothers and a younger sister) to attend college. He was one of the top athletes in Weldon High history.

“It was the first time in 20 to 30 years that someone signed a D-I (major-college) scholarship from my school,” Balmer said. “It was kind of a big deal. I know they’re proud of me. Every day I go out there (in football), I know I’m representing them as well as North Carolina. I’m going to give it all I have.”

Balmer grew up a UNC fan. Although he lived in the eastern part of the state, he never disliked N.C. State for being a UNC rival. Duke was the school he despised, especially for its basketball success.

He never understood the sometimes bitter nature of UNC’s rivalry with N.C. State until he played in the game as a freshman. He remembers being overwhelmed because of the size of the crowd. Accustomed to playing in front of 55 people in high school, he suddenly was in front of 54,000.

Balmer persevered. He became a more important player each season. As a junior, he started the last eight games. In the 2006 season finale, a 45-44 win over Duke and John Bunting’s last game as UNC’s coach, Balmer blocked two extra-point kicks, the last with only 2:49 left.

“I had a lot of help; it just didn’t happen overnight,” he said. “Coming in, everybody was expecting the next Julius Peppers. It took awhile to come into my own. It’s been a growing phase. Every day, I’m just trying to get a little bit better for my teammates and for those who helped me get this far.”

Balmer took a quick liking to Davis after the coaching change. He said he could tell immediately that Davis had been a fine player during his Arkansas career and that he knew how to coach.

Line coach John Blake sparked Balmer’s motivation with new techniques and ideas for playing tackle. Balmer is now confident that UNC can win the rest of its games and become bowl eligible. He is enjoying the season so much that he wishes he were a freshman just starting out in the Davis regime.

“These guys don’t know how lucky they are to have a coach like Coach Davis or Coach Blake,” Balmer said. “They’re just blessed. I’m trying to get me another year as we speak. I think about it every day.

“Everything happens for a reason, though, and I’m going to enjoy the time with my teammates and my coaches. It’s been a hell of a ride.”

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Perfect Nose Tackle Technique

[iforgotmypassword]

beau bell is sick, i think almost everyone here can agree on him

just a sidenote, looking at how intent we all are on which players, imagine if this was our job, and then imagine how crazy a war room must be....

[elsid13]

Elsid13 NFL draft

1. Michael Oher – JR Ole Miss (assumption that he coming out) – Big Body LT ( 6' 6" 325 lbs) that has all skills to be the next Pace or Jones. I was extremely impressed with ability to stonewall LSU defense ends and his feet. He will need a year to learning the zone blocking system and coaches are going need to be hands on with him due to learning disability but he will anchor the line and protect Cutler’s blindside for 10 plus years.

Some links on him:
http://www.nfldraftdog.com/2008_nfl_draft/michael_oher.htm
http://olemisssports.com/ViewArticle.dbml?SPSID=12787&SPID=737&DB_OEM_ID=2600&ATCLID=542695&Q_SEASON=2006
http://www.profootballweekly.com/PFW/NFLDraft/Draft+Extras/2007/positionrptOL.ht

a. Other alternative Kenny Philips – safety from the U. Been compared to Ed Reed and Shawn Taylor for while, but did had very down year with the rest of “The U”

2. Shawn Crable – OLB Michigan – SR with a little experience but has all the measurable (6-5 Weight 245) and speed to be very good difference maker in the pro. Ability to hold up at the point attack, rush the passer and decent in zone coverage he will go on first day. Due to size, and speed a team needing OLB in 3-4 defense might rush to get him

Some links on him:
http://profootballexperts.scout.com/a.z?s=211&p=8&c=1&nid=3104015
http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/profile.php?pyid=10055

a. Other alternative - John Greco LT Toledo, Frank Odem (I have feeling that he will drop like the DT from Michigan last year)

3. None

4. A. Eddie Royal – WR VT- At least Garcia will be happy. But a very good WR that doesn’t get the national name recognition but has very good speed; can return kicks/punts and play the slot.

Some links
http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/profile.php?pyid=11782
http://collegefootball.rivals.com/cviewplayer.asp?Player=36406

a. Other alternatives: Darius Reynaud WR/KR WVU started out as running back and it shows at time with his route running, but getting the ball in his hands and has the right mentally to punish defenders, Marcus Monk – big body WR that would fit the WCO mode for Wide Receivers

B. Red Bryant – DT Texas AM. Bryant is a very big body player that would fit right into the Bates DT style. I know that there have been questions about his health and motivation but he seem will worth the risk in the 4th.
Some links
http://msn.foxsports.com/cfb/story/7093580
http://scoreboards.aol.com/football/ncaaf/player/36061/player.aspx

a. Other alternatives: ILB Spencer Larsen Arizona – a play maker that reminds me a lot of Trotter. Not great speed but solid tackler.

5. A. Wilrey Fontenot – CB Arizona. Not great size but would help ease the transition that will occur in the secondary in next couple of years. Will compete on special teams and have chance for the nickel or dime role in year or two.

B. Ryan Torain – Running Back Arizona St- A steal here in the 5th. Has the ability to be the next great running back in Denver. Was out with toe injury but he has the speed and size to push both Henry and Young for starting spot. I really like this kid!!!

6. None

7. At this point you’re looking for development type players and ST. So I not going to spend a lot time on them, because chance are they won’t make the team!

a. Lance Leggett WR Miami – disappointment at Miami but has decent size and speed

b. Bobbie Williams -small school (Bethune Cookman) safety that has athletic ability but not the experience or top of draft skills

[ohiobronco2]

Well since this is a DREAM off season thread.

Sign
Alan Faneca (G)
Corey Williams (DT)
Boss Bailey (LB)

Resign/Gone/Cut
Hamza Abdullah (RFA) Sign
Stephen Alexander (UFA) Gone
Ebenezer Ekuban (UFA) Sign
Jason Elam (UFA) Sign
Todd Sauerbrunn (UFA)Sign
Nick Ferguson (UFA) Sign.
Domonique Foxworth (RFA) Get the 3rd rounder for him in a trade
Karl Paymah (RFA) Sign
Antwon Burton (ERFA) Cut
Jamie Winborn (UFA)Sign
Chris Myers (RFA) Sign
Erik Pears (ERFA) Sign
Cecil Sapp (UFA) Sign
Nate Jackson (UFA) Cut

Draft-This is where the majority of the reaches happen. Trade our first round pick to Chicago for their 1st rounder and 3rd rounders. My thinking is that we finish in the Bottom 10 and Chicago trades up with us in an attempt to draft one of the big 3 QBs in this class. We then package those picks to move up to the 2nd round. This all of course depends on who declares.

(1) Michael Oher (T)-Big Physical LT-Help our Red Zone woes
(2A.) Alex Boone (T) or Eric Young (G)-More Beef and Athleticism to our O-LINE
(2B.) Jonathan Goff (ILB)-Move DJ back to his natural position. This guy is a solid/heady football player.
(3) Dre Moore (DT)-A solid body for the D-Line, has great promise
(4) Donnie Avery (WR)-Good Return Guy, if he runs well he will be long gone before now, but Ryne Robinson fell this far last year.
(4 B.) Ezra Butler (OLB) or J Leman (ILB)
(5) Owen Schmitt (FB)-I could even consider Jehuu Caulcrick depending on how well he blocks, but we really need an excellent blocking fullback.
(5B) Jordan Dizon (OLB)
(7) D Terrell (CB)
(7 B) A Bain (G)

I know this isn't too realistic, but it's all in good fun.

[SoCalBronco]

7a. Lance Leggett - WR - Miami



If we are going to pick a Miami WR in the late rounds, a better choice would be Darnell Jenkins. Leggett is UDFA material.

[lex]

Trade Champ Bailey for two mid 1st (this year and next year). That would give us 4 #1s over two years, so Id trade 2 of them to move up. This is what I would like (depending on where DJ plays):

1. Darren McFadden, RB
1. Jeff Otah, RT
2. Spencer Larsen, ILB (traded down to acquire 3rd)
3. Oniel Cousins, LT
4. Jordy Nelson, WR
4. Tom Zbikowski/Steltz/Barrett
5. Justin Tryon, CB
5. Jeremy Zuttah, G/C/T
7. Brian Witherspoon, CB
7. Paul Raymond, WR

Additionally, I would sign Gibril Wilson and Corey Williams.

[Elway777]

My Dream off season begins with signing Dansby. The Broncos sign Dansby to play middle linebacker then move williams to the wlb . This will allow the Broncos to draft offensive tackle in the first round. Dansby will cost at least 6 million per year,so that would be the Broncos big free agent signing. They also sign Randy Starks for 2 million and Andre Davis for 2 million. They also sign Justin Smiley for around 4 million .The rest of money goes to resigning our own guys.The Broncos trade up with New England our 10 pick plus 2009 first rounder to draft (1). Jake Long ,played for zone blocking team in Michagan so should start from day one 2. Dre Moore, Moore and Starks should from a good tamdem 3a The Broncos trade foxworth for a 3 rounder, James Davis , Davis is perfect fit the Broncos scheme.4a Tony Hills ,Falls because of injury 4b. Tra Williams ,someone to replace Foxworth 4c Quinton Demps5a Caleb Cambell,hard hitting safety 7a Larry Grant,special teams specialist.Grant runs a 4.4 plus blocked 6 kicks last year. May start at the Sam someday. 7b Brian Johnston . The Broncos also add Jerome Felton Tyrell Johnson and Mark fields as un drafted free agents

[socalorado]

Beau Bell is going to be off the board by the 40th pick.

Smartest post of the week.
COSIGN.
He'll be LOOOOOONG GONE BY the 40th pick of the draft. PERIOD!

[socalorado]

Trade Champ Bailey for two mid 1st (this year and next year). That would give us 4 #1s over two years, so Id trade 2 of them to move up. This is what I would like (depending on where DJ plays):

1. Darren McFadden, RB
1. Jeff Otah, RT
2. Spencer Larsen, ILB (traded down to acquire 3rd)
3. Oniel Cousins, LT
4. Jordy Nelson, WR
4. Tom Zbikowski/Steltz/Barrett
5. Justin Tryon, CB
5. Jeremy Zuttah, G/C/T
7. Brian Witherspoon, CB
7. Paul Raymond, WR

Additionally, I would sign Gibril Wilson and Corey Williams.

NIce!! Get the picks and rake someone over the coals while doing it! If theres one thing Shenanigans IS good at, its trades for players or picks! NIce!
Heres mine with the same idea as yours
FA
Spend all available FA dough on
DTs RANDY STARKS(TEN)/COREY WILLIAMS (GB) Shouldnt be too expensive.
G ALAN FANECA(PIT) RT JORDAN GROSS(CAR) Expensive but worth it.

Trade Champ Bailey for two mid 1st (this year and next year). That would give us 4 #1s over two years, so Id trade 2 of them to move up.

1 DARREN MCFADDEN RB ARK
1 BEAU BELL MLB UNLV
2 TERREL THOMAS FS/STs/CB USC
3 LAVELLE HAWKINS WR/STs CAL
4 BRYAN KEHL OLB BYU
4 KEVIN ELLISON SS USC (if he declares, if not, fine,Zibby or Stetzl)
5 JACOB HESTER FB LSU
5 JERREMY ZUTTAH G/C/T RUTGERS
7 BRIAN WITHERSPOON CB STILLMAN
7 PAUL RAYMOND WR/STs BROWN

[socalorado]

My Dream off season begins with signing Dansby. The Broncos sign Dansby to play middle linebacker then move williams to the wlb . This will allow the Broncos to draft offensive tackle in the first round. Dansby will cost at least 6 million per year,so that would be the Broncos big free agent signing. They also sign Randy Starks for 2 million and Andre Davis for 2 million. They also sign Justin Smiley for around 4 million .The rest of money goes to resigning our own guys.The Broncos trade up with New England our 10 pick plus 2009 first rounder to draft (1). Jake Long ,played for zone blocking team in Michagan so should start from day one 2. Dre Moore, Moore and Starks should from a good tamdem 3a The Broncos trade foxworth for a 3 rounder, James Davis , Davis is perfect fit the Broncos scheme.4a Tony Hills ,Falls because of injury 4b. Tra Williams ,someone to replace Foxworth 4c Quinton Demps5a Caleb Cambell,hard hitting safety 7a Larry Grant,special teams specialist.Grant runs a 4.4 plus blocked 6 kicks last year. May start at the Sam someday. 7b Brian Johnston . The Broncos also add Jerome Felton Tyrell Johnson and Mark fields as un drafted free agents

Rumor has it Dansby is getting franchised by ARI.

[lex]

NIce!! Get the picks and rake someone over the coals while doing it! If theres one thing Shenanigans IS good at, its trades for players or picks! NIce!
Heres mine with the same idea as yours
FA
Spend all available FA dough on
DTs RANDY STARKS(TEN)/COREY WILLIAMS (GB) Shouldnt be too expensive.
G ALAN FANECA(PIT) RT JORDAN GROSS(CAR) Expensive but worth it.

Trade Champ Bailey for two mid 1st (this year and next year). That would give us 4 #1s over two years, so Id trade 2 of them to move up.

1 DARREN MCFADDEN RB ARK
1 BEAU BELL MLB UNLV
2 TERREL THOMAS FS/STs/CB USC
3 LAVELLE HAWKINS WR/STs CAL
4 BO RUUD OLB NEB
4 KEVIN ELLISON SS USC (if he declares, if not, fine,Zibby or Stetzl)
5 JACOB HESTER FB LSU
5 JERREMY ZUTTAH G/C/T RUTGERS
7 BRIAN WITHERSPOON CB STILLMAN
7 PAUL RAYMOND WR/STs BROWN

Id go with Kehl over Ruud and also, if Ellison is a junior and is expected to go in the 4th, it seems more likely he wont declare...hard to say though. Also, if I was going for Beau Bell, Id keep the early 2nd and take him there. But I should really redo mine since its seeming more likely DJ will stay at Mike.

[Billy Clyde Puckett]

Bo Ruud is awful in coverage. He was exploited all year.

[socalorado]

Bo Ruud is awful in coverage. He was exploited all year.

You know what sucks? I had Kehl in there and then i had Dizon and then Kehl and then i went with Ruud just from the fact i think Kehl goes a little higher, OK fine i'll put in Kehl and make it the ultimate mock!!Booya!

[Elway777]

Smartest post of the week.
COSIGN.
He'll be LOOOOOONG GONE BY the 40th pick of the draft. PERIOD! All depends on his combine 40 yard dash

[socalorado]

All depends on his combine 40 yard dash

he'll be fine. guy is a hit/tackle machine. I would just love to get him AND Ezra Butler from Nevada!

[sgbfan]

NIce!! Get the picks and rake someone over the coals while doing it! If theres one thing Shenanigans IS good at, its trades for players or picks! NIce!
Heres mine with the same idea as yours
FA
Spend all available FA dough on
DTs RANDY STARKS(TEN)/COREY WILLIAMS (GB) Shouldnt be too expensive.
G ALAN FANECA(PIT) RT JORDAN GROSS(CAR) Expensive but worth it.

Trade Champ Bailey for two mid 1st (this year and next year). That would give us 4 #1s over two years, so Id trade 2 of them to move up.

1 DARREN MCFADDEN RB ARK
1 BEAU BELL MLB UNLV
2 TERREL THOMAS FS/STs/CB USC
3 LAVELLE HAWKINS WR/STs CAL
4 BRYAN KEHL OLB BYU
4 KEVIN ELLISON SS USC (if he declares, if not, fine,Zibby or Stetzl)
5 JACOB HESTER FB LSU
5 JERREMY ZUTTAH G/C/T RUTGERS
7 BRIAN WITHERSPOON CB STILLMAN
7 PAUL RAYMOND WR/STs BROWN

I like this, as long as a DT is picked up in FA and Harris can do what we hope for at OT. If we got rid of Bailey though, I hope we would be getting a pretty good round 1 and not need to trade up, and maybe a 2 from next year to go with it instead of 2 later 1's. Not going to happen though, as we all know.

[lex]

OK, heres what I would do with DJ staying at Mike given the scenario I described earlier:

1. Darren McFadden, RB
1. Jeff Otah, RT
3. Oniel Cousins, LT (traded 2nd down for a 3rd and 5th)
4. Jordy Nelson, WR, Ret
4. Bryan Kehl, OLB
5. Wesley Woodard, OLB
5. Justin Tryon, CB
5. Jeremy Zuttah, G, C, T
7. Brian Witherspoon, CB, Ret
7. Paul Raymond, WR, Ret

[socalorado]

OK, heres what I would do with DJ staying at Mike given the scenario I described earlier:

1. Darren McFadden, RB
1. Jeff Otah, RT
3. Oniel Cousins, LT (traded 2nd down for a 3rd and 5th)
4. Jordy Nelson, WR, Ret
4. Bryan Kehl, OLB
5. Wesley Woodard, OLB
5. Justin Tryon, CB
5. Jeremy Zuttah, G, C, T
7. Brian Witherspoon, CB, Ret
7. Paul Raymond, WR, Ret

Nice! I like that you have a core for the o-line. I didnt address this in mine. As a matter of fact, i didnt address either lines really in mine except fot Zuttah.
Also, i like Woodyard and Kehl. Woodyard could be projected to play LB in the NFL and he is fast as hell, and good in coverage. Sorta a tweener guy. Lots of CBs to make up for the loss of Champ would bolster the position as well.

[socalorado]

I like this, as long as a DT is picked up in FA and Harris can do what we hope for at OT. If we got rid of Bailey though, I hope we would be getting a pretty good round 1 and not need to trade up, and maybe a 2 from next year to go with it instead of 2 later 1's. Not going to happen though, as we all know.

You may just be suprised. Yesterday DEN dropped their former pro bowl kicker for crying out loud. MAssive overhaul in in the works and anyone who doesnt believe it is just in denial.
I dont even think about this team in terms of needs, i think of it in terms of what DEN DOESNT NEED!! A QB, CB(so far) TE AND DE.
Thats it! DEN has NEEDS in EVERY OTHER AREA!

[Billy Clyde Puckett]

Punter not kicker. The major reason for Saurbraun's release was conflict with the coaches and other players plus the off field distractions.

[socalorado]

Punter not kicker. The major reason for Saurbraun's release was conflict with the coaches and other players plus the off field distractions.


Punter not kicker. ;)
SAUERBRUN not Saurbraun. Hilarious!

[Billy Clyde Puckett]

AKA - dumbass

[lex]

I like this, as long as a DT is picked up in FA and Harris can do what we hope for at OT. If we got rid of Bailey though, I hope we would be getting a pretty good round 1 and not need to trade up, and maybe a 2 from next year to go with it instead of 2 later 1's. Not going to happen though, as we all know.


Ive bounced what Bailey should get off a few different people and the consensus seems to be that he would either get, say, a top 5 and a 2nd or 3rd. Or he would get a mid 1st this year and that teams 1st next year. That would give us 4 firsts over 2 years. We could use one to get McFadden and still have two more firsts.

Also, our defense rests at the feet of our D Line. Weve already invested a ton of draft picks in the Oline and theyre either going to get it done or they aren't and the success of the CBs is dependent on the DLine.

[socalorado]

Ive bounced what Bailey should get off a few different people and the consensus seems to be that he would either get, say, a top 5 and a 2nd or 3rd. Or he would get a mid 1st this year and that teams 1st next year. That would give us 4 firsts over 2 years. We could use one to get McFadden and still have two more firsts.

Also, our defense rests at the feet of our D Line. Weve already invested a ton of draft picks in the Oline and theyre either going to get it done or they aren't and the success of the CBs is dependent on the DLine.

Yeah. The Bailey trade is being bounced around in DAL circles along with the DeAngelo Hall stuff. Jerry wants another elite "Neon" CB to complete his defense, and DAL has 2 1st's in this years draft. Jerry wouldnt think twice with the firepower he has at his disposal. He'll have plenty of players and picks to move back into the 1st in 2009 and get what he wants.
Ken Hamlin will get resigned and Jerry will make a run at either Champ or DeAngelo before the draft.

Also, did you mean "Weve already invested a ton of draft picks in the D-line and theyre either going to get it done or they aren't"
right?

[lex]

Yeah. The Bailey trade is being bounced around in DAL circles along with the DeAngelo Hall stuff. Jerry wants another elite "Neon" CB to complete his defense, and DAL has 2 1st's in this years draft. Jerry wouldnt think twice with the firepower he has at his disposal. He'll have plenty of players and picks to move back into the 1st in 2009 and get what he wants.
Ken Hamlin will get resigned and Jerry will make a run at either Champ or DeAngelo before the draft.

Also, did you mean "Weve already invested a ton of draft picks in the D-line and theyre either going to get it done or they aren't"
right?


Right. I meant DLine. Sorry.

[sgbfan]

You may just be suprised. Yesterday DEN dropped their former pro bowl kicker for crying out loud. MAssive overhaul in in the works and anyone who doesnt believe it is just in denial.
I dont even think about this team in terms of needs, i think of it in terms of what DEN DOESNT NEED!! A QB, CB(so far) TE AND DE.
Thats it! DEN has NEEDS in EVERY OTHER AREA!

I agree that they don't have those needs, but they have some needs that are secondary, OG(C), WR (no need if Walker healthy, Rod as well), RB (this is the one position Denver can always find somebody to fill in respectably).

There priorities are, IMO
1 DT-Just look at what Haynsworth means to Tenn, or what the Will. boys mean to Minn.
2 LB - preferably somebody good at coverage (SLB), not to mention who can tackle. RBs and TE's had their way with our defense all year long.
3 OT - Pears has done OK, but maybe a stud would make a big difference, plus I don't want Mustard in if anybody gets hurt.
4 SS - We still need to cover them TE's and RB's.

Every other position we have people on the squad who can start for the team and do alright.

[DivineLegion]

If Champ left I would only take Dallas' two firsts this season

that would give us three firsts and maybe an extra third or fourth

As long as we draft Antoine Cason out of Arizona with one of those firsts I would be a happy man. That extra third or fourth could insure us Ezra Butler too and shore up part of our outside linebacker problems.

The thing is I would rather not have the best corner to ever play the game leave my team. He needs to be wearing Orange and Blue when he gets his first ring, and his second. This ones for Champ? Hes not going anywhere.:notworthy

[Elway777]

The Bronco sign Isacc Sopoaga (1 million Dollars) and Cory Williams ( 4 million ) The Broncos sign a couple of veteans dt so they can draft Linebackers and Offensive tackles in draft. The Broncos trade down about 5 spots and pick up a 3 rounder. They also receive a late 2 rounder for Foxworth. 1. Ryan Clady, Should start at Rt and could replace Lepsis next year. 2a Erin Henderson, Great tackler and can play any linebacker spot 2b Chis Williams, Clady and Williams could be Denvers bookend tackles for next 10 years. 3a Keenon Burtan,The Broncos steel Burton in the 3 round and should be a insurance policy for Walker. 4a Tracy Porter,Falls becase of Size 4b Tom Zbikowski, head hunter special teams 4c Jemery Lehman ,fall this far why not. 5a Larry Grant, Special team player that could start at WLb some day 7a Joe Fields .another safety with potential 7b Tryell Johnson .The Broncos also cut Henry if the price is right and sign Michael Turner. The Broncos add Tony Richardson for (2 Million.) The Broncos don't spend alot in free agency but save big money for 2009 free agent crop.

[Broncos_OTM]

i would love to have three firsts this year. but man oh man would that eat up all our cap space. best space it over two years. we could also pull a NE and trade our firsts so we could get great avalue out of them

[socalorado]

i would love to have three firsts this year. but man oh man would that eat up all our cap space. best space it over two years. we could also pull a NE and trade our firsts so we could get great avalue out of them

In the trade scenario with DAL it IS spaced over 2 years!

[Northman]

I agree that they don't have those needs, but they have some needs that are secondary, OG(C), WR (no need if Walker healthy, Rod as well), RB (this is the one position Denver can always find somebody to fill in respectably).

There priorities are, IMO
1 DT-Just look at what Haynsworth means to Tenn, or what the Will. boys mean to Minn.
2 LB - preferably somebody good at coverage (SLB), not to mention who can tackle. RBs and TE's had their way with our defense all year long.
3 OT - Pears has done OK, but maybe a stud would make a big difference, plus I don't want Mustard in if anybody gets hurt.
4 SS - We still need to cover them TE's and RB's.

Every other position we have people on the squad who can start for the team and do alright.

Ahhh, what a breath of fresh air. Someone who actually gets it.

[iforgotmypassword]

Mock #2 for me... this involving the Champ trade for two first, with the move up for Mcfadden

1(a) Darren McFadden, RB, Arkansas

cant just replace a few holes and be content with playoff losses, gotta go get the studs and let them grow up together

1(b) Kenny Phillips, FS, Miami

This gives us Hall of Famer number 2 of the draft.

2 DeJuan Tribble, CB, Boston College

Trading away Champ makes us thin at CB, Tribble is a stud. A Playmaker.

3(a) (foxworth getting signed elsewhere)
Heath Benedict, OT, Newberry

Huge Steal, freak athlete, gonna protect Cutler for years to come


3(b) (trading Ian Gold)
Oniel Cousins, OT, UTEP

Cutlers gonna love our third round. Oniel in my oppinion would help our running scheme more then any other player in the draft. This gives us two tackles (6'6, 320---6'5 305) who run under 5 secound 40's.

4(a) Duane Brown, OT, Virginia Tech

I know, I know, too many tackles. But I love all three of these guys and I am very very serious that I think our Oline is horrible and that DT can be addressed much better through FA. This guy will be another good one, all three lineman can play gaurd, and it would be an easy transition in our system.

4(b) Tom Zbikowski, S, Notre Dame
Replaces Lynch a year or so. Head Hunter, plays aggresive.

4(c)Jordan Dizon, Colorado, LB

Get past the size, he's a football player.

5 Owen Schmitt, West Virginia, FB/TE

Puts the excalmation mark on our off-season goal of becoming an elite rushing team again.

7(a) Kerry Brown, Appalachian State, G

May climb in this darft.... anybody watch the Michigan game??

7(b) Marcus Harrison, Arkansas, DT


All upside with this kid.

FREE AGENTS TO BRING IN

1. Boss Bailey
2. Teddy Lehman
3. Corey Williams
5. Bryant Johnson
6. Randy Starks
7. Asante Samuel

If we ditched Henry and Walker, traded Champ, and Ian, structured a couple of other guys, I think this FA list is do-able.

[iforgotmypassword]

SHORT LIST

1(a) Darren McFadden, RB, Arkansas
1(b) Kenny Phillips, FS, Miami
2 DeJuan Tribble, CB, Boston College
3(a) (foxworth getting signed elsewhere) Heath Benedict, OT, Newberry
3(b) (trading Ian Gold) Oniel Cousins, OT, UTEP
4(a) Duane Brown, OT, Virginia Tech
4(b) Tom Zbikowski, S, Notre Dame
4(c)Jordan Dizon, Colorado, LB
5 Owen Schmitt, West Virginia, FB/TE
7(a) Kerry Brown, Appalachian State, G
7(b) Marcus Harrison, Arkansas, DT


FREE AGENTS TO BRING IN

1. Boss Bailey
2. Teddy Lehman
3. Corey Williams
5. Bryant Johnson
6. Randy Starks
7. Asante Samuel

[socalorado]

Mock #2 for me... this involving the Champ trade for two first, with the move up for Mcfadden

1(a) Darren McFadden, RB, Arkansas

cant just replace a few holes and be content with playoff losses, gotta go get the studs and let them grow up together

1(b) Kenny Phillips, FS, Miami

This gives us Hall of Famer number 2 of the draft.

2 DeJuan Tribble, CB, Boston College

Trading away Champ makes us thin at CB, Tribble is a stud. A Playmaker.

3(a) (foxworth getting signed elsewhere)
Heath Benedict, OT, Newberry

Huge Steal, freak athlete, gonna protect Cutler for years to come


3(b) (trading Ian Gold)
Oniel Cousins, OT, UTEP

Cutlers gonna love our third round. Oniel in my oppinion would help our running scheme more then any other player in the draft. This gives us two tackles (6'6, 320---6'5 305) who run under 5 secound 40's.

4(a) Duane Brown, OT, Virginia Tech

I know, I know, too many tackles. But I love all three of these guys and I am very very serious that I think our Oline is horrible and that DT can be addressed much better through FA. This guy will be another good one, all three lineman can play gaurd, and it would be an easy transition in our system.

4(b) Tom Zbikowski, S, Notre Dame
Replaces Lynch a year or so. Head Hunter, plays aggresive.

4(c)Jordan Dizon, Colorado, LB

Get past the size, he's a football player.

5 Owen Schmitt, West Virginia, FB/TE

Puts the excalmation mark on our off-season goal of becoming an elite rushing team again.

7(a) Kerry Brown, Appalachian State, G

May climb in this darft.... anybody watch the Michigan game??

7(b) Marcus Harrison, Arkansas, DT


All upside with this kid.

FREE AGENTS TO BRING IN

1. Boss Bailey
2. Teddy Lehman
3. Corey Williams
5. Bryant Johnson
6. Randy Starks
7. Asante Samuel

If we ditched Henry and Walker, traded Champ, and Ian, structured a couple of other guys, I think this FA list is do-able.

WOW! I didnt even think about Phillips with the 2nd 1st. Nice!
I still want some multi talented guys that can play on STs as well!
I think the start of the overhaul should be with STs guys in the 1st draft of the next 2. PR/KR guys as well.

[sgbfan]

Heres the question, who would everybody rather have, Glen Dorsey or Darren McFadden, assuming no DT in FA. To me its a no brainer, Denver has ALWAYS been able to find a RB. Why waste the $ and the pick, when the improvement won't be that great at RB. I know a stud would be nice, but an UDRFA would do almost as well.

[socalorado]

Heres the question, who would everybody rather have, Glen Dorsey or Darren McFadden, assuming no DT in FA. To me its a no brainer, Denver has ALWAYS been able to find a RB. Why waste the $ and the pick, when the improvement won't be that great at RB. I know a stud would be nice, but an UDRFA would do almost as well.

Where have you been? MIke Bell??!?!?! Pfft...ah no more so called system backs that are going to get the job done. I think those days are officially coming to an end. Which is a major reason why soooo many posters want to revamp the O-Line so bad! Also, check out the red zone issues DEN has. just plain sad really.

Get McFadden and watch the offense just explode!
The ultimate weapon! And he makes Cutlers life sooo much easier.
Teams wouldnt DARE to stack the box with DMAC in the backfield and Cutler at QB. That would be a wicked combo with the FA aquisitions on O-Line i have.

[Northman]

Ok, ill play. If we can get those kind of draft picks this is what i like and feel is reasonable.


1. Sedrick Ellis, DT USC
1. Gosder Cherilus, OT Boston College
3. Tavares Gooden, OLB Miami
4. Eddie Royal, WR/ST Virginia Tech
4. Peyton Hillis, FB Arkansas
5. Jamie Silva, SS, Boston College
5. Jordon Dizon, OLB Colorado
5. Keon Lattimore, RB Maryland
7. Geoff Schwartz, OT Oregon
7. Durant Brooks, P Georgia Tech

[lex]

Ok, ill play. If we can get those kind of draft picks this is what i like and feel is reasonable.


1. Sedrick Ellis, DT USC
1. Gosder Cherilus, OT Boston College
3. Tavares Gooden, OLB Miami
4. Eddie Royal, WR/ST Virginia Tech
4. Peyton Hillis, FB Arkansas
5. Jamie Silva, SS, Boston College
5. Jordon Dizon, OLB Colorado
5. Keon Lattimore, RB Maryland
7. Geoff Schwartz, OT Oregon
7. Durant Brooks, P Georgia Tech

Why even bother taking Lattimore in Rd 5 based on what youve been saying?

[Northman]

Why even bother taking Lattimore in Rd 5 based on what youve been saying?

Your right, he isnt a need. But, if we are to take a back than it would be better in the later rounds when there are still some decent backs to choose from. But, you could easily take another position and i would have no problem with that. ;D

[lex]

Heres the question, who would everybody rather have, Glen Dorsey or Darren McFadden, assuming no DT in FA. To me its a no brainer, Denver has ALWAYS been able to find a RB. Why waste the $ and the pick, when the improvement won't be that great at RB. I know a stud would be nice, but an UDRFA would do almost as well.

Denver has always been able to find a RB if youre content with 1200 yards a season. The teams strength is running the football and its been getting by in this regard on spare parts. When we won SBs our RB had 1700 plus yards. Thats the kind of RB we need...we need a RB who gives us a formiddable running threat against any team in any conditions. We havent had that. Sure, we've had 1200 yard rushers but, big wow.

[socalorado]

Denver has always been able to find a RB if youre content with 1200 yards a season. The teams strength is running the football and its been getting by in this regard on spare parts. When we won SBs our RB had 1700 plus yards. Thats the kind of RB we need...we need a RB who gives us a formiddable running threat against any team in any conditions. We havent had that. Sure, we've had 1200 yard rushers but, big wow.

And to add to this post. I also really just think teams have figured out Shanny's running system. Hey! It was a really good run for like 10 years, but DEN needs a premier superstar back, as well as a revamping of the o-line.
The mike Bells and selvin youngs are yeah, Big wow......

[lex]

Your right, he isnt a need. But, if we are to take a back than it would be better in the later rounds when there are still some decent backs to choose from. But, you could easily take another position and i would have no problem with that. ;D

Youve disqualified yourself on commenting on whether or not drafting a RB is a waste of a pick when you throw Keon Lattimores name out there. Once again, some of you fail to recognize that theres an arms race going on. The 1200 yard back just isnt formiddable enough on the road, in the playoffs, against good teams. Its good enough to beat teams like KC but the Keon Lattimores of the world arent going to take us where we need to go. Again, running is our strength so we should be as good at it as possible. A running game is also the best way to help Jay.

[Northman]

Denver has always been able to find a RB if youre content with 1200 yards a season. The teams strength is running the football and its been getting by in this regard on spare parts. When we won SBs our RB had 1700 plus yards. Thats the kind of RB we need...we need a RB who gives us a formiddable running threat against any team in any conditions. We havent had that. Sure, we've had 1200 yard rushers but, big wow.

Well, lets be fair here lex. The reason we have had a drop in yardage for one RB is because we now use a dual back system. Technically, we dont need too but for some reason shanny has gone in that direction. Minnisota doesnt need to use that system either but yet they do between Taylor and Peterson. Dallas and Jax use a split back system and are successful with it. So you dont necessarily need 1 great back. We just need to improve the line in which they run with.

[NFLBRONCO]

We almost landed CJ last year with tons of needs so I would never rule out McFadden this year. I'd take McFadden in a sec and yes Anubis we need to bolster our OL as well.

[lex]

Well, lets be fair here lex. The reason we have had a drop in yardage for one RB is because we now use a dual back system. Technically, we dont need too but for some reason shanny has gone in that direction. Minnisota doesnt need to use that system either but yet they do between Taylor and Peterson. Dallas and Jax use a split back system and are successful with it. So you dont necessarily need 1 great back. We just need to improve the line in which they run with.

OK, who was our leading rusher in the playoff game against New England and how many yards did he run for?

Who was our leading rusher in the subsequent game vs Pittsburgh and how many yards did he rush for?

In Terrell Davis' last 7 post season games how many times did he rush for over 100 yards?

[Northman]

We almost landed CJ last year with tons of needs so I would never rule out McFadden this year. I'd take McFadden in a sec and yes Anubis we need to bolster our OL as well.

Unfortuantely, McFadden is a pipe dream. It aint happening. He will be taken either by the Pats or the Faid.

[Northman]

OK, who was our leading rusher in the playoff game against New England and how many yards did he run for?

Who was our leading rusher in the subsequent game vs Pittsburgh and how many yards did he rush for?

In Terrell Davis' last 7 post season games how many times did he rush for over 100 yards?


Against New England it was split between Tatum and Mike. Anderson finished with 69 yds on the ground. Dillon finished with 57.

Against Pitt, Anderson finished with 36 yds. Bettis finished with 57.

But again, Anderson and Tatum had been splitting carries all year. TD never split carries. Pitt had Bettis and Parker and won a Super Bowl.

[lex]

Against New England it was split between Tatum and Mike. Anderson finished with 69 yds on the ground. Dillon finished with 57.

Anderson 19 69 3.6
Bell 6 19 3.2

They didnt even break 100 yards combined nor did either have over 4.0 per carry.

Against Pitt, Anderson finished with 36 yds. Bettis finished with 57.

In the Pittsburgh game they did better on the APC but probably because of fewer carries.

Anderson 9 36 4.0
Bell 5 31 6.2

Thats a combined 67 yards. Pathetic.

But again, Anderson and Tatum had been splitting carries all year. TD never split carries. Pitt had Bettis and Parker and won a Super Bowl.

Its pretty clear that even when you combine them, they fall short of what I was describing. Think about it. Shsanahan won a SB with a great running game so if anyone appreciates the value of a running game, its him, yet he put the game at Jakes feet because he knew the running game wasnt what it used to be. If Shanahan believed in the running game, they would have had more than 14 carries vs Pittsburgh.

[mattob14]

Heres the question, who would everybody rather have, Glen Dorsey or Darren McFadden, assuming no DT in FA. To me its a no brainer, Denver has ALWAYS been able to find a RB. Why waste the $ and the pick, when the improvement won't be that great at RB. I know a stud would be nice, but an UDRFA would do almost as well.

I'm as big on building the lines as anyone, but if it came down to these two, I'd take McFadden in a second. He is the best player in this draft and would have a big impact on our offense, I'm just not sure he's worth giving up on Champ for.

[iforgotmypassword]

Heres the question, who would everybody rather have, Glen Dorsey or Darren McFadden, assuming no DT in FA. To me its a no brainer, Denver has ALWAYS been able to find a RB. Why waste the $ and the pick, when the improvement won't be that great at RB. I know a stud would be nice, but an UDRFA would do almost as well.

To me this is a very tough choice.... only because of the can't pick up free-agent DT's clause

we have guys who could play RB next year but certainly no DT's......

Still I'm probaly going Mcfadden....



Also on Anubis's draft. I LOVE Gosder, gonna be a monster. BC pumps out great Oline.

[ohiobronco2]

Well, lets be fair here lex. The reason we have had a drop in yardage for one RB is because we now use a dual back system. Technically, we dont need too but for some reason shanny has gone in that direction. Minnisota doesnt need to use that system either but yet they do between Taylor and Peterson. Dallas and Jax use a split back system and are successful with it. So you dont necessarily need 1 great back. We just need to improve the line in which they run with.

Yeah and during those super bowl years, we had a much better O-Line. We didn't have Lepsis most of last year and haven't had Nalen for a large part of this one. When these guys are not there, our line can't establish any consistency. That is especially important for the young guys. Tell you what, let's trade all of our picks for McFadden and have the line sit on the bench and see how well that works out. Sorry, but some of our linemen were old enough to vote during the FDR administration. Yes, we should address RB at some point in time, but it doesn't appear that this is the time. Really it depends upon who declares. If this draft is heavy with Oline, that's what you concentrate on. If there are alot of Runningbacks, you draft that.

[Northman]

Anderson 19 69 3.6
Bell 6 19 3.2

They didnt even break 100 yards combined nor did either have over 4.0 per carry.



In the Pittsburgh game they did better on the APC but probably because of fewer carries.

Anderson 9 36 4.0
Bell 5 31 6.2

Thats a combined 67 yards. Pathetic.



Its pretty clear that even when you combine them, they fall short of what I was describing. Think about it. Shsanahan won a SB with a great running game so if anyone appreciates the value of a running game, its him, yet he put the game at Jakes feet because he knew the running game wasnt what it used to be. If Shanahan believed in the running game, they would have had more than 14 carries vs Pittsburgh.

Incorrect. Pitt came into the game with one goal in mind. Stop the run and force Jake to win it with his arm which would never happen. And once Jake started turning over the ball and we fell behind it took away any chance of using the running game after that. And we fell behind early in that game.

[Northman]

Yeah and during those super bowl years, we had a much better O-Line. We didn't have Lepsis most of last year and haven't had Nalen for a large part of this one. When these guys are not there, our line can't establish any consistency. That is especially important for the young guys. Tell you what, let's trade all of our picks for McFadden and have the line sit on the bench and see how well that works out. Sorry, but some of our linemen were old enough to vote during the FDR administration. Yes, we should address RB at some point in time, but it doesn't appear that this is the time. Really it depends upon who declares. If this draft is heavy with Oline, that's what you concentrate on. If there are alot of Runningbacks, you draft that.

And im still baffled why some of these guys cant see that. Our Oline is a FAR cry from what it was when TD was running behind it. I dont care which back you have back there it wont change a thing. Beef up the Oline and watch our running game improve immensely with what we have. Bank it.

[ohiobronco2]

And im still baffled why some of these guys cant see that. Our Oline is a FAR cry from what it was when TD was running behind it. I dont care which back you have back there it wont change a thing. Beef up the Oline and watch our running game improve immensely with what we have. Bank it.

I want to see who all comes out for this years draft. I think if this draft is as deep on O-Line talent as everyone believes it will be, we would be foolish not to draft 2 impact Offensive Linemen. I know this may be a pipe dream, but getting a combination of any of the following 2 would be excellet: Oher, Boone, Young, Loadholt, Baker, Otah or Cherilus. Let alone Williams, Hills, Cousins, Richardson or Clady. Now if many of the great Junior RB's stay, we would have our pick of them next year. Stewart (hasn't officially declared, but I bet he is gone), Wells, Mendenhall, Felix Jones, Smith, Rice, or Slaton may all still decide to stay. I would also like to try to pick up Percy Harvin next year. Really we should wait and see.

[Northman]

I want to see who all comes out for this years draft. I think if this draft is as deep on O-Line talent as everyone believes it will be, we would be foolish not to draft 2 impact Offensive Linemen. I know this may be a pipe dream, but getting a combination of any of the following 2 would be excellet: Oher, Boone, Young, Loadholt, Baker, Otah or Cherilus. Let alone Williams, Hills, Cousins, Richardson or Clady. Now if many of the great Junior RB's stay, we would have our pick of them next year. Stewart (hasn't officially declared, but I bet he is gone), Wells, Mendenhall, Felix Jones, Smith, Rice, or Slaton may all still decide to stay. I would also like to try to pick up Percy Harvin next year. Really we should wait and see.

I wouldnt disagree with that. My biggest concern is both Oline and Dline followed by Safety and LB. Those are the major areas of concern for this team in my opinion.

[NFLBRONCO]

I wouldnt disagree with that. My biggest concern is both Oline and Dline followed by Safety and LB. Those are the major areas of concern for this team in my opinion.

I agree those are our biggest needs going into 08 offseason. You never know what Denver will do so although slim I wouldn't rule out McFadden is all we'll see.

[Northman]

I agree those are our biggest needs going into 08 offseason. You never know what Denver will do so although slim I wouldn't rule out McFadden is all we'll see.


I wouldnt be hurt if McFadden was on this team but i just dont see it. I doubt the Pats would pass him up and i know damn sure the Faid wont. Miami? Maybe. But Denver would have to be able to wheel and deal to get in the top 3 at the very least. And it would cost us a lot of draft picks and so on to get there. But like i said, 2 of the teams up there would most likely snag him so it is probably irrelevant.

[NFLBRONCO]

I wouldnt be hurt if McFadden was on this team but i just dont see it. I doubt the Pats would pass him up and i know damn sure the Faid wont. Miami? Maybe. But Denver would have to be able to wheel and deal to get in the top 3 at the very least. And it would cost us a lot of draft picks and so on to get there. But like i said, 2 of the teams up there would most likely snag him so it is probably irrelevant.

True

This team has soo many holes to fill.

[lex]

Incorrect. Pitt came into the game with one goal in mind. Stop the run and force Jake to win it with his arm which would never happen. And once Jake started turning over the ball and we fell behind it took away any chance of using the running game after that. And we fell behind early in that game.

It is correct. When we won Super Bowls teams we had to go on the road at Kansas City when they hadnt allowed a rushing TD all year. Davis had over 100 yards and two TDs. He followed that up by going into Pittsburgh and, once again, going over 100 yards against a staunch Pittsburgh run defense. We were able to dictate terms with our running game. What you described in the Pittsburgh game is anything but that. After the New England game, Shanahan knew we couldnt run the ball if they were expecting it.

[socalorado]

I wouldnt disagree with that. My biggest concern is both Oline and Dline followed by Safety and LB. Those are the major areas of concern for this team in my opinion.

Sounds like alot of areas to fill.
O-line
D-line
safety
LB's
What about the STs now?
Who punting now?
L!LOL!!!!:thumbsup:

[Northman]

It is correct. When we won Super Bowls teams we had to go on the road at Kansas City when they hadnt allowed a rushing TD all year. Davis had over 100 yards and two TDs. He followed that up by going into Pittsburgh and, once again, going over 100 yards against a staunch Pittsburgh run defense. We were able to dictate terms with our running game. What you described in the Pittsburgh game is anything but that. After the New England game, Shanahan knew we couldnt run the ball if they were expecting it.


You comparing apples and oranges Lex. The Bronco team with Elway and company was way better than what we took into the AFCCG against Pitt at home especially at the QB position. Although i understand having a back get over a hundred is big it isnt a the only thing. As i pointed out, even Pittsburgh didnt get a hundred yards in that game and yet they won. They were also using a split back system and still won a Super Bowl. It wouldnt matter if McFadden was on this team, we would still struggle on the defensive side of the ball and that is where a majority of the problems are. You cant pull a New Orleans and waste a entire draft on one player. You cant do it. And it would happen because there is no way Denver is going to move up without giving up a lot to do so.

[Northman]

Sounds like alot of areas to fill.
O-line
D-line
safety
LB's
What about the STs now?
Who punting now?
L!LOL!!!!:thumbsup:

I already told you whose punting. I am.

[socalorado]

I already told you whose punting. I am.

Whew! Nice!

[Northman]

Whew! Nice!

Just wait until you see my 30 yd average. If you werent pulling your hair out then you will be. Ha!

[lex]

You comparing apples and oranges Lex. The Bronco team with Elway and company was way better than what we took into the AFCCG against Pitt at home especially at the QB position. Although i understand having a back get over a hundred is big it isnt a the only thing. As i pointed out, even Pittsburgh didnt get a hundred yards in that game and yet they won. They were also using a split back system and still won a Super Bowl. It wouldnt matter if McFadden was on this team, we would still struggle on the defensive side of the ball and that is where a majority of the problems are. You cant pull a New Orleans and waste a entire draft on one player. You cant do it. And it would happen because there is no way Denver is going to move up without giving up a lot to do so.

Its not apples and oranges when you consider that Im talking about the running game including the running backs and Oline. The teams that won SBs did so by being able to run the ball when and wherever. 2005 exposed how far we had fallen in this regard. Remember, Im also an advocate for drafting offensive linemen after McFadden. I have also said that a lot of guys we get in rounds 1-5 have a good chance at being significant upgrades over what we've had this year. Ive always acknowledged upgrading both, especially when you consider how dependent on the run we have been during years of success.

And as far as whether or not to pick an OL or a RB first, its been widely acknowledged that its a deep draft for Olinemen, meanwhile, there is a bigger drop off from McFadden to the next guy. Also, I consider how many long runs Selvin Young had that he wasnt able to take all the way. McFadden can finish those runs, which is something that isnt dependent on the OLine.

[socalorado]

Its not apples and oranges when you consider that Im talking about the running game including the running backs and Oline. The teams that won SBs did so by being able to run the ball when and wherever. 2005 exposed how far we had fallen in this regard. Remember, Im also an advocate for drafting offensive linemen after McFadden. I have also said that a lot of guys we get in rounds 1-5 have a good chance at being significant upgrades over what we've had this year. Ive always acknowledged upgrading both, especially when you consider how dependent on the run we have been during years of success.

Or go get O-linemen in FA, but draft as well. With 4 1st rounders over the next 2 drafts, these massive overhaul issues with both lines can be addressed.

[lex]

Or go get O-linemen in FA, but draft as well. With 4 1st rounders over the next 2 drafts, these massive overhaul issues with both lines can be addressed.

Oh but wait. Every first round tackle we ever get is going to be George Foster. And its impossible for us to have good offensive linemen without them being UFAs that spend 2 years on the practice squad "learning our system."

You know Im kidding but you know there are a lot of people who think like that.

[RMANCIL]

With Walker getting hurt every year and now Marshall and the staff are at ends perhaps a wr is in your teams future. I do think your OL needs help and this is a very good draft to fix or help it.

[socalorado]

Oh but wait. Every first round tackle we ever get is going to be George Foster. And its impossible for us to have good offensive linemen without them being UFAs that spend 2 years on the practice squad "learning our system."

You know Im kidding but you know there are a lot of people who think like that.

"turnstile" Foster.......:thumbs:

[Northman]

Its not apples and oranges when you consider that Im talking about the running game including the running backs and Oline. The teams that won SBs did so by being able to run the ball when and wherever. 2005 exposed how far we had fallen in this regard. Remember, Im also an advocate for drafting offensive linemen after McFadden. I have also said that a lot of guys we get in rounds 1-5 have a good chance at being significant upgrades over what we've had this year. Ive always acknowledged upgrading both, especially when you consider how dependent on the run we have been during years of success.

And as far as whether or not to pick an OL or a RB first, its been widely acknowledged that its a deep draft for Olinemen, meanwhile, there is a bigger drop off from McFadden to the next guy. Also, I consider how many long runs Selvin Young had that he wasnt able to take all the way. McFadden can finish those runs, which is something that isnt dependent on the OLine.

Its still hard to judge whether our running back corps will improve or remain the same with the current Oline in place. If they were having this kind of performance behind the 98 squad than i would agree with you 100%. But thats not the case so i think instead of spending a lot of extra dough on another back who may or may not be better than what we have its only logical to improve the line first and see where we will be at with Henry and company.

I know that McFadden is a sexy pick but remember, he hasnt proven anything on the pro level yet. Ill play devil's advocate some more. What if we draft McFadden but have to spend other picks in order to get him. And lets say he cost too much to sign without getting any Oline help and he puts up the same numbers as Henry and Young? Than what?

[socalorado]

Its still hard to judge whether our running back corps will improve or remain the same with the current Oline in place. If they were having this kind of performance behind the 98 squad than i would agree with you 100%. But thats not the case so i think instead of spending a lot of extra dough on another back who may or may not be better than what we have its only logical to improve the line first and see where we will be at with Henry and company.

I know that McFadden is a sexy pick but remember, he hasnt proven anything on the pro level yet. Ill play devil's advocate some more. What if we draft McFadden but have to spend other picks in order to get him. And lets say he cost too much to sign without getting any Oline help and he puts up the same numbers as Henry and Young? Than what?

Your not playing devils advocate, your just plain changing the scenario.
The trade has us in a position to land "the ultimate weapon". You can try to poo poo his incredible talent which has been well recognized in the fact thats he's been the Heisman runner up 2 years in a row,(sheesh!) and make it out to be something else, or you can leave the trade the way it is and decide if its worth it.
For crying out loud!, i havent seen a single "DMAC is going to be a bust" thread anywhere! I'm pretty sure the SEC is a fairly competitive conference and he's ready for the big time. Jeez!

[Northman]

Your not playing devils advocate, your just plain changing the scenario.
The trade has us in a position to land "the ultimate weapon". You can try to poo poo his incredible talent which has been well recognized in the fact thats he's been the Heisman runner up 2 years in a row,(sheesh!) and make it out to be something else, or you can leave the trade the way it is and decide if its worth it.
For crying out loud!, i havent seen a single "DMAC is going to be a bust" thread anywhere! I'm pretty sure the SEC is a fairly competitive conference and he's ready for the big time. Jeez!


Settle down, your acting like a little girl again. As i said, im just throwing it out there. Im not saying he is going to be a bust, in fact i just asked a hypothetical question to Lex of a "what if" senario if he doesnt perform any better behind this Oline. Your entire "mock" along with everyone one else's is all Hypothetical Soca. If you want me to respect your ideas and thoughts than please respect mine. Your claim is that McFadden will perform better than what we have, im asking the question what if he doesnt? Ill follow that by saying if he doesnt and we've traded away valuable picks and spent too much money what then? If you dont have a answer than please leave my question for Lex as it was intended for him anyway.

[lex]

Its still hard to judge whether our running back corps will improve or remain the same with the current Oline in place. If they were having this kind of performance behind the 98 squad than i would agree with you 100%.
Thats just it though. With McFadden, youre hedging your bets.


But thats not the case so i think instead of spending a lot of extra dough on another back who may or may not be better than what we have its only logical to improve the line first and see where we will be at with Henry and company.
Once again, who is saying we should not get linemen? In my mock, I have us taking 3. Also, Henry is approaching 30. He may not have a lot of wear and tear but he is still approaching 30. Plus, I can see him getting suspended at any moment. Id rather not pin our hopes to the Keon Lattimores of the world. Not only that, I wasnt really THAT impressed with Henry. You may think the RB doesnt matter if the OLine is good but consider that Derek Loville (or Hebron) often ran the ball in garbage time and the drop off between them and Davis was obvious. Same could be said about Derek Lassic and Sherman Williams when running behing that legendary Dallas Cowboys Oline. The running back matters whether you want to believe it or not.


I know that McFadden is a sexy pick but remember, he hasnt proven anything on the pro level yet. Ill play devil's advocate some more. What if we draft McFadden but have to spend other picks in order to get him. And lets say he cost too much to sign without getting any Oline help and he puts up the same numbers as Henry and Young? Than what?

See, what youre calling "sexy pick" is really the surest thing. And Jay Cutler hadnt proven anything in the NFL before we traded up to get him. Somehow, I doubt that you regret that move.

[socalorado]

Settle down, your acting like a little girl again. As i said, im just throwing it out there. Im not saying he is going to be a bust, in fact i just asked a hypothetical question to Lex of a "what if" senario if he doesnt perform any better behind this Oline. Your entire "mock" along with everyone one else's is all Hypothetical Soca. If you want me to respect your ideas and thoughts than please respect mine. Your claim is that McFadden will perform better than what we have, im asking the question what if he doesnt? Ill follow that by saying if he doesnt and we've traded away valuable picks and spent too much money what then? If you dont have a answer than please leave my question for Lex as it was intended for him anyway.

Well, you are kinda poo pooing McFadden a little hard there dont cha think?
as all the girls out here say, WHATeverrrrr!
haha.
I understand your preformance questions, but jeez cmon, the guys proven he can run against the best of the best so far.
I Do have 4 linemen in my mock. They are aquired soley with the FA money in the offseason. DTs Randy Starks and Corey Williams
and Alan Faneca and Jordan Gross. These 4 players are what every red cent of FA money in my mock would be spent on and nothing else!
Also in the 5th
5 JERREMY ZUTTAH G/C/T RUTGERS
Remember 2 more 1st round picks for the 2009 draft for more possible upgrades at key positions after evaluating the 2008 season with these guys.
I went this way specifically because LEX went with linemen in his draft and Safety and STs i think in FA. I, to add flavor to the scenario did the opposite to add to the possibilities for everyone to consider.

[Northman]

Thats just it though. With McFadden, youre hedging your bets.



Once again, who is saying we should not get linemen? In my mock, I have us taking 3. Also, Henry is approaching 30. He may not have a lot of wear and tear but he is still approaching 30. Plus, I can see him getting suspended at any moment. Id rather not pin our hopes to the Keon Lattimores of the world. Not only that, I wasnt really THAT impressed with Henry. You may think the RB doesnt matter if the OLine is good but consider that Derek Loville (or Hebron) often ran the ball in garbage time and the drop off between them and Davis was obvious. Same could be said about Derek Lassic and Sherman Williams when running behing that legendary Dallas Cowboys Oline. The running back matters whether you want to believe it or not.




See, what youre calling "sexy pick" is really the surest thing. And Jay Cutler hadnt proven anything in the NFL before we traded up to get him. Somehow, I doubt that you regret that move.


Fair enough. But, i have to somewhat disagree with you on the TD vs Derek Loville. Although TD was worlds better than Derek he did do some nice things when replacing TD. Look at the San Fran game in 98 and also the wild card game against Jax. I think we had a like a combined 2-300 yards of rushing yards in that game. Maybe more. If somehow Denver can get McFadden and still have cap space and enough picks to fill the other needs than it would be the draft of the century. But, i just dont see it. But here's to PRAYING you are right. :strong:

[Northman]

Well, you are kinda poo pooing McFadden a little hard there dont cha think?
as all the girls out here say, WHATeverrrrr!
haha.
I understand your preformance questions, but jeez cmon, the guys proven he can run against the best of the best so far.
I Do have 4 linemen in my mock. They are aquired soley with the FA money in the offseason. DTs Randy Starks and Corey Williams
and Alan Faneca and Jordan Gross. These 4 players are what every red cent of FA money in my mock would be spent on and nothing else!
Also in the 5th
5 JERREMY ZUTTAH G/C/T RUTGERS
Remember 2 more 1st round picks for the 2009 draft for more possible upgrades at key positions after evaluating the 2008 season with these guys.
I went this way specifically because LEX went with linemen in his draft and Safety and STs i think in FA. I, to add flavor to the scenario did the opposite to add to the possibilities for everyone to consider.


Im not poo pooing McFadden because i dont like him. Honestly. I just cant not fathom a way for us to land him and still have enough at our disposal to get other areas addressed. Even in your Mock you have someone giving us 2 mid 1st round draft picks for Champ. Even though Champ is worthy of a such trade no one is going to bite. Teams are starting to realize that filling in needs is becoming increasingly more important than one star player. As i pointed out in another thread Reggie Bush was one of the most talented players to come out of the draft last year but he was not the key aquisition to get the Saints into the NFCCG. Most of last year had to do with Brees, and even now with Reggie down Brees has still carried the team. But never the less, i hope you guys are right. We shall see come draft day.

[socalorado]

Im not poo pooing McFadden because i dont like him. Honestly. I just cant not fathom a way for us to land him and still have enough at our disposal to get other areas addressed. Even in your Mock you have someone giving us 2 mid 1st round draft picks for Champ. Even though Champ is worthy of a such trade no one is going to bite. Teams are starting to realize that filling in needs is becoming increasingly more important than one star player. As i pointed out in another thread Reggie Bush was one of the most talented players to come out of the draft last year but he was not the key aquisition to get the Saints into the NFCCG. Most of last year had to do with Brees, and even now with Reggie down Brees has still carried the team. But never the less, i hope you guys are right. We shall see come draft day.

I would also say that a certian 7th round WR was a real nice acquisition for NO as well! Also, doesnt hurt to bolster your defense through the draft with immediate starters such as SS Roman harper,and FS Daniel Bullocks have helped alot as well!
AS for the Champ trade, there is/was rampant discussion between DAL and ATL of a trade of 1 1st round draft pick for DeAngelo Hall when he fell out of favor a few months ago in ATL. Obviously "old Jerry Jones" isnt going to hold off on getting a pure "shutdown" CB for his already very talent laden team.
After getting absolutely scorched by NE he wasnt going to hold off when he has extra picks at his disposal, and the thought of seeing NE again, only this time in the SB, didnt sit well with him apparently.
DeAngelo is NOT a "shutdown" guy IMHO. But thats just me.
Champ Bailey in a trade for 2 1st mid-rounders with a team that has all the tools in place except for one player to defeat NE and WIN the SB?
AND DAL HAS extra picks and you think Jerry is going to actually stop and think about it?!?!?!? Jerry could get DAL back into the 1st round the next year (2009) without a lot of difficulty. DAL is ready for a run to the top, and Jerry isnt known for sitting around and waiting for things to just sorta "pan out"
This trade would happen in a heartbeat!!!

[lex]

Fair enough. But, i have to somewhat disagree with you on the TD vs Derek Loville. Although TD was worlds better than Derek he did do some nice things when replacing TD. Look at the San Fran game in 98 and also the wild card game against Jax. I think we had a like a combined 2-300 yards of rushing yards in that game. Maybe more. If somehow Denver can get McFadden and still have cap space and enough picks to fill the other needs than it would be the draft of the century. But, i just dont see it. But here's to PRAYING you are right. :strong:

With all the garbage time available, due to blowouts back in those days, Denvers backups saw the field a lot. More often than not, the running game slowed down when Davis came out, though.

[Requiem]

Just ask Nick over on Broncomania.

Double take Raji and Shirley to solve our DT problem. Maybe they'll start their own hospital and tavern in or around Colfax. . . :laugh:

[lex]

Just ask Nick over on Broncomania.

Double take Raji and Shirley to solve our DT problem. Maybe they'll start their own hospital and tavern in or around Colfax. . . :laugh:

Wasnt Raji academically ineligible (credits not grades) and not medically ineligible?

[Requiem]

Wasnt Raji academically ineligible (credits not grades) and not medically ineligible?

Something along that order.

[sgbfan]

Where have you been? MIke Bell??!?!?! Pfft...ah no more so called system backs that are going to get the job done. I think those days are officially coming to an end. Which is a major reason why soooo many posters want to revamp the O-Line so bad! Also, check out the red zone issues DEN has. just plain sad really.

Get McFadden and watch the offense just explode!
The ultimate weapon! And he makes Cutlers life sooo much easier.
Teams wouldnt DARE to stack the box with DMAC in the backfield and Cutler at QB. That would be a wicked combo with the FA aquisitions on O-Line i have.

Wow, then we can have games at 35-31, winning about half of them. It might be nice to stop the run without having 9 guys in the box (with the other two, CB's, staring at the RB the whole time). McFadden would be sweet, but Bush would have been as well. . .

I know that any rookie is a risk, but why risk so much on a position that has never been a problem. I'm OK with a 1200 yd back, or 2 700 yard backs, as long as there is a defense to stop the other team. A stud RB would never get the ball if nothing is done at DT, because the other team will have 4 9-minute drives every game.

[lex]

Wow, then we can have games at 35-31, winning about half of them. It might be nice to stop the run without having 9 guys in the box (with the other two, CB's, staring at the RB the whole time). McFadden would be sweet, but Bush would have been as well. . .

I know that any rookie is a risk, but why risk so much on a position that has never been a problem. I'm OK with a 1200 yd back, or 2 700 yard backs, as long as there is a defense to stop the other team. A stud RB would never get the ball if nothing is done at DT, because the other team will have 4 9-minute drives every game.

No. Theres a big difference between McFadden and Bush.

[iforgotmypassword]

We're not talking about only McFadden, were talking about revamping the oline, adding a true blocking fullback, and then throw in the elite running back, McFadden.

[want2bAbronco2]

I try to be realistic, but here is what I'd like to see if we pick at the 13-16 range. Assuming that Kenny Phillips is gone:

OK, here is my first crack at who I want. Bear with me as I am not 100% on where our pix are. I know we lost our #3, but we have a #4 from the Lelie deal and possibly a #4 from the Warren deal since he's met his playing time requirement...giving us 3 #4s I believe. We also have our own #5, but lost #6 for Jimmy Kennedy. We also have 2 #7s for Plummer...so here we go:

Round 1
Dan Connor, LB, Penn State 6'3" 235
Connor can play either inside or out and was uber-productive at Penn State. I like Puz better, but dude can still play ball w/ the best of em. Other options include James Laurinitis (if we get lucky) and Keith Rivers.

Round 2
Eric Young, OG, Tennessee 6'4" 305
Young is big and athletic, a good fit for the Denver system. As I ama homer, I am also a realist. I have zero interest in Hefney, but Young is a very good guard. Has big time experience against SEC competition. Other options include Jon Goff, ILB of Vanderbilt or Kerry Brown, OT of App. State.

Round 4a
Craig Steltz, Safety, LSU 6'2" 209
Steltz is not your typical flashy big time playmaker at Safety, but he is a heady, strong, player who is a stable contributor in the mold of a John Lynch. Has the intangibles to be a great special teamer until it's his turn to supplant Lynch. Other options include Jamar Adams of Michigan or another position.

Round 4b
Dre Moore, DT, Maryland 6'4" 311
Moore would be a nice complement to Marcus Thomas and has a bit more room to grow. Another option is the 324lb Red Bryant of Texas A&M.

Round 4c/5
Beau Bell, OLB, UNLV 6'3" 245
Bell is the bigger LB we have been waiting for. He has tons of potential. Even though I like Connor too, we need options at the LB spot. What we have now just isn't cutting it. Other options include Ezra Butler of Nevada.

Round 5--SLEEPER SPECIAL!!!
Darius Reynaud, WR, West Virginia 5'10" 200
Dude is a flat out player. He is basically the only go to WR on a running team. He is a THREAT! Although short, he is sturdy and stout. He can be a dangerous returnman or be a great complement to our current WR corps. Donnie Avery of Houston is a burner who could fit nicely here as well.

2 pix in round 7
I'd like to take Louis Holmes, DE, Arizona and Anthony Hoke, OLB, Cincinnati.

My Free Agency wish list includes a few cost friendly veteran additions:

Ken Hamlin, Safety, Dallas Cowboys
Jordan Gross, RT, Carolina Panthers
Karlos Dansby, LB, Arizona Cardinals
Justin Smith, DE, Cincinnati Bengals
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ummm yea pretty much what you said! I want Phillips in 1st....mmmmmm stud that can play FS/SS/CB. Connors/Rivers if we can't get him. Also wouldn't mind Long LT Michigan if he slides. I think DT/MLB/SLB/S/LT.RT are the things we really need.

[Northman]

Im not sold on Connor at all as Penn St. was totally overrated all year. A bad Michigan team ran all over them. But i do like your Moore, Bell, and Reynaud picks.

[27atwater]

I've been watching Connor since he was in High School at Strath Haven. Now I will say I was higher on Posluszny (who I also watched at Hopewell) who I still mad that we didn't draft...but Connor is the real deal. DOES NOT MISS TACKLES. And we sorely need a LB who doesn't miss.

[27atwater]

Im not sold on Connor at all as Penn St. was totally overrated all year. A bad Michigan team ran all over them. But i do like your Moore, Bell, and Reynaud picks.

Oh and PSU wasn't overrated. There were simply not very good. Lousy QB, average OL and a DL which is patchwork. Now the LBs and secondary players were studs. Also, you jave to ask yourself...Was Michigan's O bad when they had Hart, etc or did THEIR OVERRATED D get exposed vs some faster schools?

BTW, For what it's worth, I am a Tennesse Vols fans...not PSU.

[Northman]

I've been watching Connor since he was in High School at Strath Haven. Now I will say I was higher on Posluszny (who I also watched at Hopewell) who I still mad that we didn't draft...but Connor is the real deal. DOES NOT MISS TACKLES. And we sorely need a LB who doesn't miss.


Well, considering a lot of mock drafts have us taking him i hope so. But overall i wasnt impressed with the Lions this year.

[Northman]

Oh and PSU wasn't overrated. There were simply not very good. Lousy QB, average OL and a DL which is patchwork. Now the LBs and secondary players were studs. Also, you jave to ask yourself...Was Michigan's O bad when they had Hart, etc or did THEIR OVERRATED D get exposed vs some faster schools?

BTW, For what it's worth, I am a Tennesse Vols fans...not PSU.


Michigan was overrated as well. Mike Hart is great but other than that forget it.

[27atwater]

Agreed. Henne is an A-hole and Long got abused more than the "experts" will admit, but Hart has a manchild for 4 years.

[27atwater]

Well, considering a lot of mock drafts have us taking him i hope so. But overall i wasnt impressed with the Lions this year.

Neither was anyone in PA. They just can't seem to get a dominant O AND D on the field at the same time. When Robinson was at QB, they brought MOST of it together, but that last second loss at Michigan killed em. Otherwise PSU has been a huge disappointment.

[Northman]

Agreed. Henne is an A-hole and Long got abused more than the "experts" will admit, but Hart has a manchild for 4 years.

Actually, i should correct myself, Manningham looks like he will be a baller too. I forgot about him.

[Northman]

Neither was anyone in PA. They just can't seem to get a dominant O AND D on the field at the same time. When Robinson was at QB, they brought MOST of it together, but that last second loss at Michigan killed em. Otherwise PSU has been a huge disappointment.


Well, here is what im wondering. Is it the lack of talent on PSU or is it JoPa? Reason why i ask is in the Michigan game i fully expected them to exploit Michigan's weakness which had been exploited the two games before that. Now, i know that PSU doesnt run the same type of offense but you can gameplan and copycat something like that just so as long as you have a Qb who knows how to handle himself back there. I just wonder if JoPa is past his time. I know he's been a staple there in forever but sometimes coaches start to lose their touch ala Bobby Bowden. Your thoughts?

[27atwater]

Well, here is what im wondering. Is it the lack of talent on PSU or is it JoPa? Reason why i ask is in the Michigan game i fully expected them to exploit Michigan's weakness which had been exploited the two games before that. Now, i know that PSU doesnt run the same type of offense but you can gameplan and copycat something like that just so as long as you have a Qb who knows how to handle himself back there. I just wonder if JoPa is past his time. I know he's been a staple there in forever but sometimes coaches start to lose their touch ala Bobby Bowden. Your thoughts?

If you look solely at the Michigan game, the answer is...Michigan has their #. As simplistic as it sounds, even when PSU is stellar, they can't beat UM. Another part of the issue is QB play. Other than Robinson, there has been noone w/ the combination of smarts and ability since Kerry Collins. The current QB is dumber than dirt. Dude has a cannon and can make all the throws, but can't make quick or even good decisions. The recruiting has been stellar as you will soon see the D will again be badass and the WRs will be one of the top groups in the nation. The biggest complaint that a lot of locals have is the inability to develop the OL as fast as most other major colleges. Noone knows why or if it has anything to do w/ JoePa, but it's been an ongoing problem. Even the blue chip recruits don't really perform til their Junior years.

I don't think JoePa is the problem. As I said, he can still recruit. and still puts out very solid teams. It's just the matter of continuing rather than reloading.

[Northman]

If you look solely at the Michigan game, the answer is...Michigan has their #. As simplistic as it sounds, even when PSU is stellar, they can't beat UM. Another part of the issue is QB play. Other than Robinson, there has been noone w/ the combination of smarts and ability since Kerry Collins. The current QB is dumber than dirt. Dude has a cannon and can make all the throws, but can't make quick or even good decisions. The recruiting has been stellar as you will soon see the D will again be badass and the WRs will be one of the top groups in the nation. The biggest complaint that a lot of locals have is the inability to develop the OL as fast as most other major colleges. Noone knows why or if it has anything to do w/ JoePa, but it's been an ongoing problem. Even the blue chip recruits don't really perform til their Junior years.

I don't think JoePa is the problem. As I said, he can still recruit. and still puts out very solid teams. It's just the matter of continuing rather than reloading.

Ok, well you would know better than i and that sounds fair. Be interesting to see how that defense develops. Dont they usually do well in the RB department as well? Didnt hear much from them in that regard.

[27atwater]

They have a nice freshman coming in but not much else at RB. I think they set themselves back a bit when Lesean McCoy went to Pitt. They have a new QB next year named pat Devlin who should solidify things...but ya never know til they play live.

[sgbfan]

No. Theres a big difference between McFadden and Bush.

Yeah. Bush has played two years in the NFL. He was getting much more praise when he was getting drafted. McFadden, if he is what people think, would be great. But my point was that the defense needs more help than the offense, and the first priority for the defense is DT. If Denver gets a DT in FA, and has the opportunity to pick McFadden, I would be ecstatic, and just hope he isn't the next Reggie Bush. I think he will be good, and would help Denver, they just need help at DT more.

[27atwater]

After some discussion and deliberation, I have adjusted my "dream" offseason

1st, I trade Foxxy to Dallas for Bobby Carpenter. If that doesn't happen, I go after Karlos Dansby to fill a OLB void.

2nd, I focus on Jordan Gross, Ken Hamlin and Corey Williams. None should be bank breakers, although will cost some $$. IF Randy Starks will be a FA, I go after him instead of Williams. Some FA lists don't have him listed.

Based on making these moves, we have improved the LB, S, DT and OT...our 4 biggest weak spots. I then draft:

1-Kenny Phillips, S, Miami
2-Jon Goff, MLB, Vanderbilt
3-Beau Bell, OLB, UNLV...acquired thru trades including our mid round pix and/or Ian Gold.
4a-Jason Shirley, DT, Fresno State
4b-Andrew Bain, OG, Miami
5-Brian Johnston, DE, Gardner-Webb
7a-Darius Reynaud, WR, West Virginia
7b-Henry Smith, DT, Texas A&M

This entire package would add the following by position:
S-Hamlin and Kenny Phillips. Lynch may move on, but if not, he can help groom Kenny.
LB-Carpenter/Dansby, Goff and Bell. All of a sudden we are MUCH bigger at LB. Goff and Bell will also contribute on Special Teams.
DT-Williams/Starks, Shirley, Smith...all bigger options that would work for Bates
DE-Johnston who is very productive at a smaller school, but has the size for running downs.
WR-Reynaud as a 3rd/4th WR option and solid return man.
OL-Gross and the massive, but athletic Andrew Bain. His 340lb body WILL help in the redzone and he is smooth enough to zone block.

[lex]

Yeah. Bush has played two years in the NFL. He was getting much more praise when he was getting drafted. McFadden, if he is what people think, would be great. But my point was that the defense needs more help than the offense, and the first priority for the defense is DT. If Denver gets a DT in FA, and has the opportunity to pick McFadden, I would be ecstatic, and just hope he isn't the next Reggie Bush. I think he will be good, and would help Denver, they just need help at DT more.

First of all, McFadden for practically his whole career has not had a QB and the talent at Arkansas has been middle-of-the-road where the SEC is concerned whereas when Reggie Bush, they had more talent than practically any team they played at all positions including QB. So, when Bush was in the game, the defense had to defend all the other players for USC on the field. This year, Arkansas' leading receiver is their FB. McFadden has carried the load for 3 years being a marked man in the best conference in college FB. Reggie Bush would carry the football like 13 times a game. When Reggie Bush came out of USC there was a big question about whether he could carry the ball 20 times a game and could run in between the tackles. McFadden isnt limited to gimmick plays and only runs outside.

[Northman]

First of all, McFadden for practically his whole career has not had a QB and the talent at Arkansas has been middle-of-the-road where the SEC is concerned whereas when Reggie Bush, they had more talent than practically any team they played at all positions including QB. So, when Bush was in the game, the defense had to defend all the other players for USC on the field. This year, Arkansas' leading receiver is their FB. McFadden has carried the load for 3 years being a marked man in the best conference in college FB. Reggie Bush would carry the football like 13 times a game. When Reggie Bush came out of USC there was a big question about whether he could carry the ball 20 times a game and could run in between the tackles. McFadden isnt limited to gimmick plays and only runs outside.


I agree. Although i dont know what to expect from McFadden he wont be a Reggie Bush. In fact, he is like Chuck Norris and eats 3 bowls of Reggie Flakes every morning. :rofl:

[RMANCIL]

McFadden looks like the best RB to come along in several years including AP . Denver will never get a shot at him. Dallas or Cleveland have much better chance . The Cowboys have two 1st round picks to work with and the Browns could move Brady Quinn along with picks.

You guys need a DT in the worst way , that and stop over paying F.A.

[theAPAOps5]

McFadden looks like the best RB to come along in several years including AP . Denver will never get a shot at him. Dallas or Cleveland have much better chance . The Cowboys have two 1st round picks to work with and the Browns could move Brady Quinn along with picks.

You guys need a DT in the worst way , that and stop over paying F.A.

Yeah the first thing we need to do is stop trying to address the issues with band aids from FA. Shanny needs to continue to draft well and not stretch. But DT is the number 1 priority then Oline, LB, and S.

[RMANCIL]

Yeah the first thing we need to do is stop trying to address the issues with band aids from FA. Shanny needs to continue to draft well and not stretch. But DT is the number 1 priority then Oline, LB, and S.

This draft has a lot of OL and LB in it , the Broncos have a real good shot at helping the roster.

[bpc]

I'm hoping we manage to trade and pick up an additional selection. Preferably 2nd round as the lowest selection we pick up.

I'm in the "Help Cutler category", we'll fix the defense through FA.

1. Otah or best remaining OT.
2. Chris Johnson - HB - ECU
3. Donnie Avery - WR - Houston

Weapons baby... weapons.

[Drek]

McFadden looks like the best RB to come along in several years including AP . Denver will never get a shot at him. Dallas or Cleveland have much better chance . The Cowboys have two 1st round picks to work with and the Browns could move Brady Quinn along with picks.

You guys need a DT in the worst way , that and stop over paying F.A.

The Cowboys have no chance. Name the last team to trade up into the top 5 from the 20's? When the Broncos had two firsts not too long ago the best Shanahan could do was 11th, and we already had one pick in the teens.

And Quinn's value as of now is a early to mid 2nd at best, for a team lacking a 1st rounder thats not a whole lot of trading firepower. The Browns have no chance either.

I'm not saying the Broncos particularly do though. The only way the Broncos could get McFadden is if the Bears, Panthers, and Bengals all finish with worse records, bumping us into the 8 or 9 range, and the Pats decide they aren't willing to trade up after him. Even then I don't see Shanahan giving the '08 1st and '09 1st along with our '08 2nd or Foxworth plus needed to work a trade with St. Louis, Atlanta, or the Jets to get up to that 2nd or 3rd pick. The price will only go up if we have to call Atlanta or NYJ, either one would probably be happy to draft McFadden.

Doesn't realy matter regardless. We have a decent chunk of change tied up in Henry and two good looking young backs in Young and Hall. No way the FO spends big just to get one running back.

[lex]

The Cowboys have no chance. Name the last team to trade up into the top 5 from the 20's? When the Broncos had two firsts not too long ago the best Shanahan could do was 11th, and we already had one pick in the teens.

And Quinn's value as of now is a early to mid 2nd at best, for a team lacking a 1st rounder thats not a whole lot of trading firepower. The Browns have no chance either.

I'm not saying the Broncos particularly do though. The only way the Broncos could get McFadden is if the Bears, Panthers, and Bengals all finish with worse records, bumping us into the 8 or 9 range, and the Pats decide they aren't willing to trade up after him. Even then I don't see Shanahan giving the '08 1st and '09 1st along with our '08 2nd or Foxworth plus needed to work a trade with St. Louis, Atlanta, or the Jets to get up to that 2nd or 3rd pick. The price will only go up if we have to call Atlanta or NYJ, either one would probably be happy to draft McFadden.

Doesn't realy matter regardless. We have a decent chunk of change tied up in Henry and two good looking young backs in Young and Hall. No way the FO spends big just to get one running back.

I was already thinking about the fact that Parcells has already gone on record only a few days ago saying he wouldnt draft a RB in the first round. So from that standpoint, we at least know they arent targeting McFadden unlike the Jets and Falcons. But in any case, I wouldnt be shocked if the Dolphins might be the best team to deal with. If you were Miami, you might consider taking the trade that you mentioned and using the 9 to then trade down some more so they can get more players. The same could be said for the Jets and Falcons but when you have a new GM, I think your more apt to go with numers to get your guys in there.

[Elway777]

I think Walker could be just an average wide receiver because of his Knee the rest of his career .Chad Johnson is on the market. I say the Broncos cut their loses and cut WAlker and trade for Chad Johnson. The Bengals get Foxworth and 10 pick . The Broncos get Chad johnson and Bengals 2 round pick. The Broncos sign Gross and Smiley for offensive line. They also sign Corey Williams and Sapaga for Defensive tackle. The Broncos draft 2a Erin Henderson 2b Chis Williams 4a Beau Bell 4b Tom Zibokski 4c Shannon Tevaga 5a Brian Johnson 7a Joe Fields 7b Jerome Felton . The Broncos are better on both offensive and Defence next year.

[lex]

I think Walker could be just an average wide receiver because of his Knee the rest of his career .Chad Johnson is on the market. I say the Broncos cut their loses and cut WAlker and trade for Chad Johnson. The Bengals get Foxworth and 10 pick . The Broncos get Chad johnson and Bengals 2 round pick. The Broncos sign Gross and Smiley for offensive line. They also sign Corey Williams and Sapaga for Defensive tackle. The Broncos draft 2a Erin Henderson 2b Chis Williams 4a Beau Bell 4b Tom Zibokski 4c Shannon Tevaga 5a Brian Johnson 7a Joe Fields 7b Jerome Felton . The Broncos are better on both offensive and Defence next year.


No way.

[27atwater]

All we need is a diva like to Chad to help Marshall improve his own diva-ness. Great idea.

[Northman]

I think Walker could be just an average wide receiver because of his Knee the rest of his career .Chad Johnson is on the market. I say the Broncos cut their loses and cut WAlker and trade for Chad Johnson. The Bengals get Foxworth and 10 pick . The Broncos get Chad johnson and Bengals 2 round pick. The Broncos sign Gross and Smiley for offensive line. They also sign Corey Williams and Sapaga for Defensive tackle. The Broncos draft 2a Erin Henderson 2b Chis Williams 4a Beau Bell 4b Tom Zibokski 4c Shannon Tevaga 5a Brian Johnson 7a Joe Fields 7b Jerome Felton . The Broncos are better on both offensive and Defence next year.


Its a good thing your not in charge of the Broncos. We would be DOOMED.

[NFLBRONCO]

Denver needs these things sooner or later

1. Stud RB
2. Stud 2 LT and G
3. Stud WR gamebreaker (This WR corp lacks flash Walker and BS miss alot of games)
4. Stud MLB and OLB
5. Stud SS and FS
6. Stud DT

[lex]

Denver needs these things sooner or later

1. Stud RB
2. Stud 2 LT and G
3. Stud WR gamebreaker (This WR corp lacks flash Walker and BS miss alot of games)
4. Stud MLB and OLB
5. Stud SS and FS

Out of all that, the WR is the last piece of the puzzle. If we had the rest we could be a very formiddable team.

[SpringStein]

No DT needed?

[NFLBRONCO]

No DT needed?

I'm getting senile i guess ;D Updated it

[mattob14]

Denver needs these things sooner or later

1. Stud RB
2. Stud 2 LT and G
3. Stud WR gamebreaker (This WR corp lacks flash Walker and BS miss alot of games)
4. Stud MLB and OLB
5. Stud SS and FS
6. Stud DT

Do we really need 10 "Stud" players to contend, though? I agree that all of these are positions of need (I'd add FB too) but we don't need 3 "Stud" LB's. Add a dynamic WLB next to DJ and a solid veteran at SAM and we'll be fine. Same for Safety, we need an impact player back there, but if we can add one difference-maker, we'll be fine with a role-player next to him (especially with our corners). A big-time LT is needed, along with an above-average RT, but I don't think we have to have three "Studs".

The key to building a contending team is adding difference-makers at each level, then filling the remaining spots with a couple of key FA's or draft choices who are solid scheme-type role players. With the salary cap, teams can't afford to sign a roster of star players that looks great on paper.

[NFLBRONCO]

Do we really need 10 "Stud" players to contend, though? I agree that all of these are positions of need (I'd add FB too) but we don't need 3 "Stud" LB's. Add a dynamic WLB next to DJ and a solid veteran at SAM and we'll be fine. Same for Safety, we need an impact player back there, but if we can add one difference-maker, we'll be fine with a role-player next to him (especially with our corners). A big-time LT is needed, along with an above-average RT, but I don't think we have to have three "Studs".

The key to building a contending team is adding difference-makers at each level, then filling the remaining spots with a couple of key FA's or draft choices who are solid scheme-type role players. With the salary cap, teams can't afford to sign a roster of star players that looks great on paper.



No but, they are positions that need upgrades

[Drek]

Add a dynamic WLB next to DJ and a solid veteran at SAM and we'll be fine.

We don't even need a dynamic WLB. We just need two OLBs who can be reliable tacklers and make the right reads. Ideally one will be good in coverage and take the 2nd nickel LB next to DJ.

Bates scheme puts the playmaking focus on the DEs and MLB, our OLBs just need to be reliable. No point making a big commitment there when we won't even make good use of it.

[iforgotmypassword]

We don't even need a dynamic WLB. We just need two OLBs who can be reliable tacklers and make the right reads. Ideally one will be good in coverage and take the 2nd nickel LB next to DJ.

Bates scheme puts the playmaking focus on the DEs and MLB, our OLBs just need to be reliable. No point making a big commitment there when we won't even make good use of it.

This is the problem with our thinking, we think we can plug in players and thats it, "fit the scheme" "Bate's systems" im so sick of that, why can't we get AWESOME players and scheme to thier skills not get decent guys to play our **** scheme that allowed more points then any team in the leuge this year.

GET FREAK ATHLETES

[ayjackson]

GET FREAK ATHLETES

get football players

[iforgotmypassword]

get football players

get good Cordinators

[27atwater]

I think by now even Dan Snider can attest that the best "atheletes" don't equal the best TEAM. This ain't basketball where 1 or 2 players can take over against 2/3 of the league. The system, along with players who fit and buy in, is what the NFL is all about.

[Drek]

This is the problem with our thinking, we think we can plug in players and thats it, "fit the scheme" "Bate's systems" im so sick of that, why can't we get AWESOME players and scheme to thier skills not get decent guys to play our **** scheme that allowed more points then any team in the leuge this year.

GET FREAK ATHLETES

Look at the successful teams in the league this year.

New England, Indy, Jacksonville, Dallas, Green Bay.

What do they all have in common?

There are schemes in place. Without a scheme you can't draft your talent correctly. You're just picking out who looks good in shorts and hoping to find a place for them.

You know what that does? That moves a 15th overall pick WLB over to SLB so that a 220 pound retread can take his job.

Our OL was successful for years because there was a clear plan in place for what types of players worked and how to develop them.

Its what the NFL is all about and why a handful of teams are constantly at the upper echelon while every other team is bouncing up and down, good season followed by bad.

Stick with Bates, bring in Rex Ryan or Ron Rivera, I don't care. Just put a system in place and draft accordingly.

But if we go with Bates' scheme we need to put all of our defensive resources into finding some legitimate DTs and run stopping DEs. The linebackers are not the focus and so we can afford to get just league average production.

In fact, that is one of the positions were we could draft a 4th rounder who many teams perceive as one dimensional (a la Marshall and Dumervil, athlete v. football player respectively) and get ourselves a steal.

[mattob14]

To add to Drek's post, the teams he's listed have been considered among the best-drafting teams in the league the past several years. This isn't due so much to the fact that they have superior scouting and personnel departments, but they draft late-rounders who may not have the best measurables, but fit the scheme. The ability to plug those players in also helps to manage the cap, as there's just no way to have a lineup composed entirely of the freak athlete type of player and afford to re-sign everyone.

[lookin' glass]

Matt, I respectfully disagree with the 'don't have superior scouting and personnel dept.' comment. I'll add to your 'late round' comment further and say they are better at coaching up their players. In NE and Indy's case their salary cap numbers tell me they are able to get players who can perform well for them and they get them to perform well for them at low cost.

[Drek]

Matt, I respectfully disagree with the 'don't have superior scouting and personnel dept.' comment. I'll add to your 'late round' comment further and say they are better at coaching up their players. In NE and Indy's case their salary cap numbers tell me they are able to get players who can perform well for them and they get them to perform well for them at low cost.

They do have a superior scouting department and coach their players better. But thats because the scouts know exactly what to look for and have spent several years now looking for just those skills and the coaches have been turning guys with those skills into NFL players for just as long.

Compare it to standard education. Say we have two schools, one a liberal arts program that takes tons of real bright kids and teaches them a diverse set of skills. The other is a technical institute, brings kids in who's talents focus on specific things, maths and sciences, and so it teaches them primarily nothing but that. So say one kid from school A and one kid from school B both go out into the working world looking to get a job. Who's going to succeed at their job sooner?

Thats the NFL development process in a nutshell but minus the job search. The guys who trained you have already hired you.

Does that mean the student from school A is on the wrong path? No, he's got more upside than the student from school B and will offer more versatility down the road once his many diverse skills reach a professional level. But in the NFL its 3 or 4 years of cheap production before guys are FAs and either need to be paid well or will be lost. Thats just when the guy from school A is hitting his stride.

Now if the differences we were talking about here was one guy becoming a perennial all-pro after 3 years of development, or a guy who is a solid starter one year into his NFL career, its obvious that you're looking to choose the all-pro in waiting. But that isn't where 90% of the draft pool hit their ceiling. Most of them will cap out as slightly above average players.

So for example say we had two different players to choose from, who's careers would follow something like this, where a grade of C is league average:

Player 1
1st year: D
2nd year: D+
3rd year: C-
4th year: C+
5th to 10th: B-

Player 2
1st year: C-
2nd year: C
3rd year: C
4th to 8th: C+

Who would you pick with a 5th round selection? The guy who is going to just be reaching above league average production his final rookie contract year, immediately wanting to get paid, or the guy who gives you a handful of pretty much league average play from day one and is replaceable after that?

There is no point bending over backwards to acquire slightly better than average talent. Instead we should be saving the bankroll for the elite talents and rotating the surrounding pieces as often as necessary to keep them cheap. To do that we need a system that allows us to pick out good fits that will plug into roles quickly. At the same time that is what injury proofs teams like NE and Indy, their most recent drafties are already being groomed to fill the same role as their current starters, so them having to step in a year early won't throw off the rest of their unit.

[mattob14]

Matt, I respectfully disagree with the 'don't have superior scouting and personnel dept.' comment. I'll add to your 'late round' comment further and say they are better at coaching up their players. In NE and Indy's case their salary cap numbers tell me they are able to get players who can perform well for them and they get them to perform well for them at low cost.

Well, Drek's pretty much covered it at this point, but most of your comments actually support what I was saying. Teams like NE and Indy have a system in place where there are fairly defined roles for each position. The scouting departments then look specifically for players that can fill the role asked of each position. Once those players are drafted, they immediately move into an organization/system where there talents can be maximized and the coaching staff takes over.

Do these teams have quality scouting and personnel departments? Of course. Does coaching play a role? Sure it does. But the established systems on both sides of the ball also have a great deal to do with it. The best scouts in the league will have trouble identifying the appropriate talent if the system is constantly changing.