Report: FDA so underfunded, consumers are put at risk

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

More evidence that it's never wise to entrust your government to people who don't believe in government!

Excerpt:

The report details a "plethora of inadequacies" in the agency, including:

•Inadequate inspections of manufacturers, noting that foodmakers are inspected every 10 years.

•A "badly broken" food-import system and food supply "that grows riskier each year." In the past 35 years, FDA inspections of the food supply have dropped 78% due to soaring numbers of products and inadequate FDA funding.

•A depleted FDA staff, which is about the same size as it was 15 years ago despite huge growth in agency responsibilities. Instead of being proactive, the agency is often in "fire-fighting" mode.

•A workforce with a "dearth" of scientists who understand emerging technologies. Turnover rates in some scientific positions at the FDA run twice that of other government agencies.

•An "obsolete" information-technology system.

Continues:

http://www.usatoday.com/money/industries/food/2007-12-02-fda_N.htm?csp=34

[W*GS]

More evidence that it's never wise to entrust your government to people who don't believe in government!

It's far far more dangerous to put the State in the hands of people who worship it.

See: Stalin's USSR, Mao's China, Pol Pot's Cambodia, Hitler's Germany, Ceaucescu's Romania, Kim Jong-Il's North Korea...

[Garcia Bronco]

What a shocker.

[Bronco Bob]

And yet one of these idiot Republicans in the CNN debate was boasting
he would cut the number of federal employees in half. We already
don't have enough people to monitor what's coming into our ports,
to inspect our food, to test for unsafe products, such as those that
contain too much lead, and he wants even less people to do this.
What kind of people support these morons? Oh, wait, I see two in
this thread already.

[Garcia Bronco]

And yet one of these idiot Republicans in the CNN debate was boasting
he would cut the number of federal employees in half. We already
don't have enough people to monitor what's coming into our ports,
to inspect our food, to test for unsafe products, such as those that
contain too much lead, and he wants even less people to do this.
What kind of people support these morons? Oh, wait, I see two in
this thread already.

I agree with him..private companies should be doing this...not the government.

[Bronco Bob]

I agree with him..private companies should be doing this...not the government.

Fox guarding the henhouse. Private companies are just in it for profit,
and to boost the return to their shareholders. The best interests of the
public comes in a far distant priority. Sure I'll bet you can find some
right wing blog about some lazy, corrupt federal employee, but there
are lots of government employees who try to do their best and really
to have the interests of the American people at heart.

[spdirty]

Fox guarding the henhouse. Private companies are just in it for profit,
and to boost the return to their shareholders. The best interests of the
public comes in a far distant priority. Sure I'll bet you can find some
right wing blog about some lazy, corrupt federal employee, but there
are lots of government employees who try to do their best and really
to have the interests of the American people at heart.

yep...I get that feeling every time I go to the DMV.

[Rohirrim]

This sounds like more of the Norquist strategy of the neocons coming to light; ie Don't fight the programs you don't like, just starve them. Of course, if you've blown a trillion dollars on an unnecessary war, how are you going to pay for even those government services you want? Hell, we can't even sustain our military anymore. I can't imagine the condition of our infrastructure, although that bridge collapse in Minnesota gives a good indication.

[Rohirrim]

yep...I get that feeling every time I go to the DMV.

That's odd. I just went into my local DMV office a couple of days ago to get my new registration. The service was fast, courteous, and efficient. I walked out with my new tags actually thinking, "Well, that was easy."

[alkemical]

That's odd. I just went into my local DMV office a couple of days ago to get my new registration. The service was fast, courteous, and efficient. I walked out with my new tags actually thinking, "Well, that was easy."

The DMV in PA's capital is pretty fast. It's like a deli system. You get a # for your "service" (registration, license photo, etc) and then you get buzzed to the counter dealing with that function.

I usually am in/out in 15-20min.

[Spider]

I agree with him..private companies should be doing this...not the government.

is that so ? I wonder how much Money the Feds will have to dump into the stock Market , to cover "Bad decisions " when the private sector screws up and someone gets sued .......

[Bronco Bob]

I too have always been treated courteously and quickly at my DMV.
Of course you cut the staff and obviously you are going to have
a longer wait and pissed off workers having to do the work of
three or four people to take up the slack.
Besides most DMV workers are state employees, not federal.

[alkemical]

I too have always been treated courteously and quickly at my DMV.
Of course you cut the staff and obviously you are going to have
a longer wait and pissed off workers having to do the work of
three or four people to take up the slack.
Besides most DMV workers are state employees, not federal.

Also - i'd like to know if anyone has received ****ty service at say a grocery store, or some other such "private" entity.

People are people - no matter where you work - you have some who are assholes and some who are lazy.

Working for a private company doesn't mean you are a better worker. Trust me - i've spent over 10 years in the private industry and it's just as "bad".

[Bronco Bob]

Also - i'd like to know if anyone has received ****ty service at say a grocery store, or some other such "private" entity.

People are people - no matter where you work - you have some who are a-holes and some who are lazy.

Working for a private company doesn't mean you are a better worker. Trust me - i've spent over 10 years in the private industry and it's just as "bad".

I'll tell you where you get really crappy service. WalMart.
Try returning something there sometime.
Is it any coincidence, in that WalMart employees are notoriously
underpaid and overworked.

[Garcia Bronco]

Fox guarding the henhouse. Private companies are just in it for profit,
and to boost the return to their shareholders. The best interests of the
public comes in a far distant priority. Sure I'll bet you can find some
right wing blog about some lazy, corrupt federal employee, but there
are lots of government employees who try to do their best and really
to have the interests of the American people at heart.

I am not opposed to oversight.

The private company is going to do a better job at reaching compliance than the government ever could. All the government needs to do is perform audits.

[Garcia Bronco]

This sounds like more of the Norquist strategy of the neocons coming to light; ie Don't fight the programs you don't like, just starve them. Of course, if you've blown a trillion dollars on an unnecessary war, how are you going to pay for even those government services you want? Hell, we can't even sustain our military anymore. I can't imagine the condition of our infrastructure, although that bridge collapse in Minnesota gives a good indication.

We spend less than a percent of the GDP on infrastructure. China spends about 8-9 percent as a comparable.

[Garcia Bronco]

The DMV in PA's capital is pretty fast. It's like a deli system. You get a # for your "service" (registration, license photo, etc) and then you get buzzed to the counter dealing with that function.

I usually am in/out in 15-20min.

I **** you not...I walk into the Colorado version of DMV and I took my number....797. Now serving 642. It was like beruit in the place. It's the worst I have ever seen.

[alkemical]

I'll tell you where you get really crappy service. WalMart.
Try returning something there sometime.
Is it any coincidence, in that WalMart employees are notoriously
underpaid and overworked.

Wait, they aren't "state" workers?!? How did you have ****ty service?

[Garcia Bronco]

I'll tell you where you get really crappy service. WalMart.
Try returning something there sometime.
Is it any coincidence, in that WalMart employees are notoriously
underpaid and overworked.

That's more about their processes though. Thay don't want you to return anything. Same thing at Best Buy, Circuit City, Lowes, Home Depot and so on

[W*GS]

Private companies are just in it for profit, and to boost the return to their shareholders. The best interests of the public comes in a far distant priority.

How does one make a profit treating customers with contempt?

[alkemical]

How does one make a profit treating customers with contempt?

No you are right, it comes with treating your employees like ****. ;)

[Rohirrim]

How does one make a profit treating customers with contempt?

You've obviously never dealt with AOL. Ha!

[W*GS]

No you are right, it comes with treating your employees like ****. ;)

Same question:

prompt> echo $query | sed -e 's/customers/employees/g'

[W*GS]

You've obviously never dealt with AOL. Ha!

I'd leave AOL if I was a customer, then.

[alkemical]

Same question:

prompt> echo $query | sed -e 's/customers/employees/g'

You obviously have never really worked for, and/or dealt with many fortune 1000 companies Wags.

[W*GS]

You obviously have never really worked for, and/or dealt with many fortune 1000 companies Wags.

As if all companies are Fortune 1000 companies, and it's illegal to start one's own company...

A friend of mine had a supply of Starbuck's applications available if anyone came into his office to complain about their employment...

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

This sounds like more of the Norquist strategy of the neocons coming to light; ie Don't fight the programs you don't like, just starve them. Of course, if you've blown a trillion dollars on an unnecessary war, how are you going to pay for even those government services you want? Hell, we can't even sustain our military anymore. I can't imagine the condition of our infrastructure, although that bridge collapse in Minnesota gives a good indication.

Bingo.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Fox guarding the henhouse. Private companies are just in it for profit, and to boost the return to their shareholders. The best interests of the public comes in a far distant priority.

Exactly.

When you put private companies in charge of public services, profits trump the public good every time.

You get Halliburton charging $100 per load to do our troops' laundry.

The Bush era is the paradigm example of this failed experiment in privitization.

The billions of taxpayer dollars that have disappeared down the Iraq profiteering hole are the most obvious example.

[orinjkrush]

sorry i know a ton of folks workin at the FDA. good, hard workin people who believe in what they're doing. unfortunately, the scumbag traitorous politicos come in and hamstring them at every turn and prohibit them from protecting consumers or doing their jobs. there are two governments: the professionals, and the itinerant leeches. (help a candidate win a county or state at the polls...get yourself a deputy assistant secretariat!)

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

sorry i know a ton of folks workin at the FDA. good, hard workin people who believe in what they're doing. unfortunately, the scumbag traitorous politicos come in and hamstring them at every turn and prohibit them from protecting consumers or doing their jobs. there are two governments: the professionals, and the itinerant leeches. (help a candidate win a county or state at the polls...get yourself a deputy assistant secretariat!)

"Heckuva Job Brownie" anyone? ;)

[Bronco Bob]

"Heckuva Job Brownie" anyone? ;)

Or Gonzales. Or Rumsfeld. Or Bolten. Now it's gotten so bad the
Senate is keeping a few people around every day just so the
Senate can officially be kept in session and Bush can't make
any more recess appointments.

[alkemical]

As if all companies are Fortune 1000 companies, and it's illegal to start one's own company...

A friend of mine had a supply of Starbuck's applications available if anyone came into his office to complain about their employment...

So then why do you make the claim/assumption that inefficiencies only exist in the gov't apparatus? 'Tis only a point to balance the scales wags, 'tis only a point.

[W*GS]

So then why do you make the claim/assumption that inefficiencies only exist in the gov't apparatus?

If I had done so, your point might have been one.

[alkemical]

If I had done so, your point might have been one.

You say it all the time. You always prop up how much "better" the corporate working force is better than the "government". yet when it comes down to it, both are highly inefficient. Just with business, they can **** over the workers - where in gov't they **** over the tax-payers.

I'm sorry you fail to realize that simple point amongst others (ya know, like people are lazy no matter what - so it doesn't matter where they work. Just like in the corporate world, incompetence is promoted) - But if you had much more interaction with some of the biggest companies on a daily basis you'd understand that side of the paradigm.

[W*GS]

You say it all the time. You always prop up how much "better" the corporate working force is better than the "government".

Not quite.

The market is far more often highly disciplinary on corporations (and employees, for that matter) than the voters are on government. That's all.

[alkemical]

Not quite.

The market is far more often highly disciplinary on corporations (and employees, for that matter) than the voters are on government. That's all.

Only in your "idealistic marketplace" it does, not here in the real world. Since making money appears to be the only real "ethic" these days, i trust corporations as much as i trust the gov't.

[W*GS]

Only in your "idealistic marketplace" it does, not here in the real world.

Market discipline simply doesn't exist anymore at all? How did corporations manage that? I should think that would be news to them - as well as all the non-corporate businesses out there...

[Bronco Bob]

Not quite.

The market is far more often highly disciplinary on corporations (and employees, for that matter) than the voters are on government. That's all.

Ever heard of a writer named Upton Sinclair? He was a muckraker who
wrote a novel in 1906 called The Jungle, which dealt with conditions in the
U.S. meat packing industry and caused a public uproar that partly
contributed to the passage of the Pure Food and Drug Act and the Meat
Inspection Act in 1906. If the market works so well, why did Mr. Sinclair
write his novel? The problem isn't government regulations. The problem
is lack of enforcement of government regulations by not hiring the
people needed to enforce them and not giving the agencies charged
with enforcing them the operating expenses they need. And appointing
incompetent cronies such as Brownie to run them.

[alkemical]

Market discipline simply doesn't exist anymore at all? How did corporations manage that? I should think that would be news to them - as well as all the non-corporate businesses out there...

Wagsy, you really believe that? Wow. That's all i have to say.

[W*GS]

Ever heard of a writer named Upton Sinclair? He was a muckraker who wrote a novel in 1906 called The Jungle, which dealt with conditions in the U.S. meat packing industry and caused a public uproar that partly contributed to the passage of the Pure Food and Drug Act and the Meat Inspection Act in 1906. If the market works so well, why did Mr. Sinclair write his novel?

Sinclair was (unwittingly or not) part of the market that created a solution. Even if that Act had not been written, it's quite likely consumer action would have gone some ways to fixing the situation.

It's not always the case that a law is necessary to correct a market error; think of all the products that have failed to find customers willing to buy them.

The problem isn't government regulations. The problem is lack of enforcement of government regulations by not hiring the people needed to enforce them and not giving the agencies charged with enforcing them the operating expenses they need. And appointing incompetent cronies such as Brownie to run them.

Not all regulations are bad, true. Not all regulations are good, also.

[W*GS]

Wagsy, you really believe that? Wow. That's all i have to say.

Start a company that sells mouse traps for $1 billion per. Make it a corporation, too. Explain how the market won't keep your corporation from being a tremendous success. You only have to sell a few and you'll be rich!

[alkemical]

Start a company that sells mouse traps for $1 billion per. Make it a corporation, too. Explain how the market won't keep your corporation from being a tremendous success. You only have to sell a few and you'll be rich!


Poorly illustrated deflection.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Poorly illustrated deflection.

Has he ever had anything else? ;)

[W*GS]

Poorly illustrated deflection.

Succinct and devastating refutation of your "argument".

[alkemical]

Succinct and devastating refutation of your "argument".

LOL you think far to highly of yourself. LOL.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

LOL you think far to highly of yourself. LOL.

:yep:

To the extent that he believes he has the power to win arguments simply by calling his opponent (or his opponent's claims) a few choice names.

:D

[W*GS]

To the extent that he believes he has the power to win arguments simply by calling his opponent (or his opponent's claims) a few choice names.

That's the only kind of "argument" you ever make. Without smears, slurs, cheap shots and lies, you've got nothing.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

The "I am rubber - you are glue" tactic is SO not working for W*GS here.

:D

[W*GS]

It's never worked for you, and you use it all the time.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Thanks for making my point for me. :thumbsup: