venezuela gets its own time zone

[yavoon]

http://in.reuters.com/article/worldNews/idINIndia-30738920071128

"The change will take place a week after Venezuelans vote on Sunday in a referendum on a constitutional reform proposal that would allow Chavez, a Cuba ally leading a self-styled socialist revolution, to run for reelection indefinitely.

Venezuela's clocks will be set to Greenwich Mean Time (GMT) minus 4-1/2 hours, a time zone shared by no other nation."

"The anti-U.S. Chavez has defended the move by arguing the world's hourly divisions were imposed by the United States."

I guess if ur gna go crazy, might as well go all the way. VIVA LA LIBERTAD from american pigdog fascist timezone conspiracies!

[Garcia Bronco]

Wow...what a tard this guy is...I can't believe he leads a nation

[Hotrod]

Ha! Wow LABF's hero is really putting on a show.

[W*GS]

Next, he'll proclaim "2 + 2 = 5", since "2 + 2 = 4" is merely because of Mr. Danger's imperialistically fascistic policies!

[Rohirrim]

Yeah, the U.S. did it. That's why the base longitude was set in Britain (coincidentally, when they were at the height of their control of the seas) and why the world's clocks are set from GREENWICH MEAN TIME, dimwit. This tard is giving Dubya a run for the money in the "Biggest Moron in Charge of a Country" sweepstakes.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Ha! Wow LABF's hero is really putting on a show.

Ha ha ha! :laugh:

Point out W*GS' erroneous claims about Chavez, and suddenly Chavez is my "hero?"

Gotta love that right-wing logic. :giggle:

At any rate, Chavez has a long way to go to catch up with Hotrod's hero when it comes to abuses of power.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

U.S. Companies Behind Anti-Reform Propaganda in Venezuela

November 27th 2007, by Michael Fox - Venezuelanalysis.com

"I voted for Chavez for President, but not now. Because they told me that if the reform passes, they're going to take my son, because he will belong to the state," said Gladys Castro last week, a Colombian immigrant who has lived in Venezuela for 16 years, and cleans houses for a living.

Gladys is not the only one to believe the false rumors she's heard. Thousands of Venezuelans, many of them Chavez supporters, have bought the exaggerations and lies about Venezuela's Constitutional Reform that have been circulating across the country for months. Just a few weeks ago, however, the disinformation campaign ratcheted up various notches as opposition groups and anti-reform coalitions placed large ads in major Venezuelan papers.

The most scandalous was an anonymous two-page spread in the country's largest circulation newspaper, Últimas Noticias, which claimed about the Constitutional Reform:

"If you are a Mother, YOU LOSE! Because you will lose your house, your family and your children (children will belong to the state)."

The illegal ad, which was caught and suspended by the Venezuelan National Electoral Council (CNE) after a few days in the press, has received relatively high-profile attention in the Venezuelan press, and even Chavez joked about it last Friday on the nightly pro-Chavez talk show, La Hojilla. What appears to have gone completely ignored, however, is the fact that the ad itself was placed by an organization which has at its core, dozens of subsidiaries of the largest US corporations working in Venezuela.

Disinformation & Propaganda

The scare tactic against Venezuelan mothers isn't the only piece of misinformation in the anonymous advertisement. Under the title, "Who wins and who loses," it goes on to tell readers that under the new reform, they will lose their right to religion; that 9.5 million people will lose their job; that small, large or cooperative businesspeople will lose their "store, home, business, taxi or cooperative"; that urban, rural and mountain militias are going to replace the National Armed Forces; that students will lose their right to decide what they want to study; that campesinos are going to lose out because they won't be owners of their own land; and that the value of the Venezuelan currency, the Bolivar, is going to drop along with the value of Venezuelan homes, cars, farm lands (finca), and educational studies.

Comments in the ad refer to specific reformed articles in the Constitution, as if providing a reference for readers to verify the claim. Of course, briefly examining the article in reference verifies that each claim is either completely false, or a ridiculous exaggeration and manipulation of the reform. Article 112, for instance, which the advertisement says will take Venezuelan children from their families, in actuality discusses economic development and production.

Last week, after a barrage of illegal propaganda on the part of both the pro and anti reform camps, Venezuela's National Electoral Council (CNE) began to crack down, following through with their promise to regulate the propaganda. In an announcement last week, Tibisay Lucena, President of the CNE made specific reference to the "Who wins and who loses" piece, pointing out its illegality because of the falsities and its anonymity. Although published as an anonymous article, Lucena announced that according to the official tax number (RIF) published with the article, the advertisement was actually placed by the Cámara de Industriales del estado Carabobo (The Carabobo State Chamber of Industry).

The Carabobo State Chamber of Industry (CIEC)

The CIEC is a 71 year-old organization, headquartered in the Carabobo state capital of Valencia, which groups together more than 250 businesses in the region. Among those are dozens of subsidiaries which compose literally a who's who list of some of the largest and most powerful US corporations, including (among others): Ford, General Motors, DaimlerChrysler, Bridgestone Firestone, Goodyear, Alcoa, Shell, Pfizer, Dupont, Cargill, Coca-Cola, Kraft, Novartis, Unilever, Heinz, Johnson & Johnson, Citibank, Colgate Palmolive, DHL and Owens Illinois.

Without a doubt, the region carries important weight with heavy US interests. The new US Ambassador to Venezuela, Patrick Duddy, even said so when he visited Carabobo a few weeks ago on his first official trip within Venezuela.

"Valencia is a very important industrial center with a presence of American companies that create thousands of jobs and that also run social programs that benefit both their surrounding communities and their employees," said Ambassador Duddy.

According to an article on the US embassy website, during his stay in Valencia, Duddy met the board of the Venezuelan-American Chamber of Commerce and Industry, the board of Fedecámaras in Carabobo, and with a number of the above mentioned subsidiaries, including GM, Chrysler, and Ford. He also spent time with the CIEC board, and in particular, then CIEC President Ernesto Vogeler, who also happens to be Chief Executive Officer for Protinal/Proagro, a subsidiary for the Ag Processing, Inc. (AGP), an Omaha-based AG coop.

In a normal state of affairs, this would all seem completely normal: The foreign ambassador meeting with his country's major subsidiaries, and the president of the chamber of industry to which they belong. However, we should briefly remember the role that US businesses have played across Latin America, whether we are talking about the United Fruit Company's destabilization attacks against Guatemala's democratically-elected President Jacobo Arbenz Guzmán in the 1950s, or Anaconda Copper's support of the overthrow of Chile's Salvador Allende in the 1970s. Alcoa, GM, Citibank and most of the above-mentioned companies know how to throw their weight around, be it by technically legal, or more subversive means.

Reforms

Of course, it makes sense why US corporations based in Venezuela would be against the reform. Various articles, if applied, could potentially cut in on potential profits, such as the reform of article 301. Under the 1999 Constitution this article stated:

"Foreign people, businesses, and organisms can not be given more beneficial concessions than those established for national entities."

However, under the reform, the last sentence was cut:

"Foreign investment is subject to the same conditions as national investment."

One can thus infer that national investment may be given more favorable conditions than foreign investment.

Article 115 protects new forms of social and collective property, which anti-reform proponents fear may be used to expropriate private property.

On top of this, the Venezuelan government recently passed new rules on the growing automobile industry in Venezuela, which may have US automobile giants, GM, Chrysler, and Ford nervous about their the foreseeable future in Venezuela. Although car sales in Venezuela have jumped by nearly 300% over the last three years, in an attempt to push for more domestic production, the Venezuelan government has passed new laws regulating the automobile industry, according to an early November article in the Venezuelan daily El Nacional. Among them, the requirement of an "import license" in order to sell foreign cars, the mandate to install natural gas inputs in all vehicles produced after 2007, and the importation of only unassembled motors after 2010, in order to use to use nationally produced motor parts.

Protests in Valencia

According to reports, in Valencia last week, full color CIEC fliers against the reform were passed out during opposition student marches. According to today's major papers, violent protests in Valencia yesterday left one dead, various wounded, and at least 15 detained.

It would be irresponsible to make accusations without evidence, but it is important to be conscious of where our information is coming from, if it is verifiable, and who are the interests involved. This is the case now, only a few days before Venezuela's Constitutional Reform Referendum. Hopefully the Venezuelan people will be able to decipher fact from fiction and make their own educated decision whether to vote "sí" or "no" next Sunday.

Like Gladys Castro, who has reconsidered her staunch position against the reform. As she said last week, when she realized that the rumors she has been hearing are false, "Well, I'm going to read [the reform], think some more, and maybe I will vote for it after all." She's probably not the only one.

http://www.venezuelanalysis.com/analysis/2904

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

The US is counting on Venezuelans remaining malleable, uninformed, and illiterate when it comes to their own constitution and the reforms a-coming. And a very specific sector, in particular, is counting on it: Big Business. They're using the same old scares they used to topple Allende in Chile back in '73: the commie scare, the "they're going to take your child away" one in particular. And of course, the reason is the same: their profits are threatened. They won't be making nearly as high a profit margin at Venezuelan expense.

[Hotrod]

Ha ha ha! :laugh:

Point out W*GS' erroneous claims about Chavez, and suddenly Chavez is my "hero?"

Gotta love that right-wing logic. :giggle:

At any rate, Chavez has a long way to go to catch up with Hotrod's hero when it comes to abuses of power.

My hero is not GWB you tree huggin hippie ;D

[cutthemdown]

Is this a joke?

[ant1999e]

So LABF, tell us what your precious chavez has in store for his people with the reform.

[W*GS]

Point out W*GS' erroneous claims about Chavez, and suddenly Chavez is my "hero?"

Putting up pro-Chavez propaganda, which was comprised of falsehoods, hardly counts as a refutation. Perhaps in your Hugo-love-addled mind, but to the rest of us, your Chavez mancrush is merely embarassing.

At any rate, Chavez has a long way to go to catch up with Hotrod's hero when it comes to abuses of power.

When Bush attempts to alter the Constitution to remain President, you won't be making an ass of yourself with the above remark.

LABF, you've done nothing to show that you're anything other than a useful idiot when it comes to Chavez. Just as Stalin had his supporters in the US in the 30s and 40s (even going so far as to rationalize his death camps, engineered famines, and outright genode); even as Castro had his supporters in the US in the 60s; you're merely following in their footsteps, in being a supporter of a dictatorial scumbag.

When will you far-left loonies ever learn?

[W*GS]

Chavez is counting on Venezuelans remaining scared, malleable, uninformed, and illiterate when it comes to their own constitution and the reforms a-coming.

Fixed it for ya.

It's ironic that many of the same (just and right) criticisms you level against Bush can be made against Chavez, yet you won't go there. Why?

[cutthemdown]

I don't doubt big biz is trying to thwart these reforms. But the scary thing is that Chavez is going to be in power until either he dies, or is overthrown. What a joke the LABRONCOS fan props this guy up and bashes America. I just don't understand not supporting your own country.

[The Lone Bolt]

The propaganda campaign appears to be working! Look at all the people in Venezuela who have been duped!!Yikes!

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/nationworld/2004043724_venezuela30.html


Throng opposes Chávez's proposals

By Seattle Times news services


Opposition supporters attend a rally in Caracas Thursday to protest a referendum on constitutional changes introduced by Venezuela's President Hugo Chávez.

Chávez's power grab
Venezuelan voters decide Sunday whether to make 69 changes to the constitution. Some key changes:

Presidential terms are lengthened from six to seven years. Term limits are eliminated, allowing the president to run for re-election indefinitely.

The Central Bank, which previously had autonomy, comes under control of the president, who would also set monetary policy and administer international reserves.

The official workday is reduced from eight hours to six hours. Workers in the informal economy, such as maids and street vendors, who make up an estimated 45 percent of the labor force, would also get social-security benefits for the first time.

The minimum voting age is reduced from 18 to 16.

Large land estates, or latifundia, are prohibited. More than 2.5 million acres of arable land has already been handed over to poor farmers on the grounds it was underused or that owners lacked adequate titles.

The Associated Press

CARACAS, Venezuela — More than 100,000 people flooded the streets of the capital Thursday to oppose a referendum that would eliminate term limits for President Hugo Chávez and further the socialist leader's agenda for Venezuela.

Blowing whistles, waving placards and shouting "Not like this!" the marchers carried Venezuelan flags as they streamed along Bolivar Avenue to demonstrate their opposition to the proposed constitutional changes, which will be submitted to a vote Sunday.

Venezuelans will vote on 69 proposed changes to nation's 1999 constitution that would, among other things, eliminate presidential term limits, create forms of communal property and give greater power to the presidency.

No official crowd estimates were available, but opposition politician Leopoldo Lopez said about 160,000 protesters filled the avenue, and thousands more spilled over onto surrounding roads. The rally was among the largest by the opposition in recent years.

Chávez, who says the constitutional overhaul is necessary to give more of a voice to the people through community-based councils, plans to lead rallies in favor of the reforms today.

On Wednesday, hundreds of stone-throwing students clashed with police and the Venezuelan national guard in a protest and security forces responded with water cannons and tear gas after a Chávez supporter was shot to death, but there were no immediate reports of violence Thursday.

Chávez, first elected in 1998, already obtained total control of the National Assembly when opponents boycotted the 2005 elections, and lawmakers gave him special powers to enact some laws by decree through next June.

The government cites polls suggesting Chávez has an advantage, while the Caracas polling firm Datanalisis — in a nationwide survey this month — found 49 percent of likely voters opposed Chávez's reforms and 39 percent were in favor.

In the face of possible defeat, Chávez has denounced assassination plots and intensified his diplomatic battles to rally voters while diverting attention from some of the package's unpopular measures.

Chávez severed ties with Colombia on Wednesday to protest President Álvaro Uribe's pushing him out of a mediation role with Colombia's leftist guerrillas.

Chávez also accused CNN of promoting his murder by showing his picture with the caption "Who Killed Him?" which referred to a separate story about the death of U.S. football player Sean Taylor. Chávez also said a sniper trained a laser on him during a recent march.

"This is undoubtedly a tactic to unite supporters around him and pass everyone else off as traitors to the fatherland," said Maruja Tarre, an international-relations expert at Simón Bolívar University in Caracas.

Chávez also recently froze ties with Spain in a flap over King Juan Carlos' telling him to "shut up" at a summit meeting earlier this month.

Some suspect his effort to change the nation's time zone, so that Venezuelans will have to move their clocks back 30 minutes, also is meant to distract attention from the referendum's less-palatable parts.

Chávez took the last nationwide opposition TV station off the airwaves this year, and an opposition newspaper complained the state channel dedicates many hours to propaganda for a "yes" vote compared with a few seconds on the "No" camp.

A student movement that rose up after the TV shutdown has led an outcry against reforms that the opposition political parties, the Roman Catholic Church and human-rights groups denounce as authoritarian.

"We are winning back democracy," Freddy Guevara, a student leader wearing a red T-shirt emblazoned with "No," shouted from a podium at Thursday's rally. "There is no doubt that if everybody goes to vote, we will win."

Chávez has won three presidential elections and a 2004 recall referendum. He staved off a 2002 coup that briefly ousted him from power, and he controls all 167 seats in Congress — after the opposition boycotted an election — and 20 of the 22 state governorships.

"Sunday is going to hinge on turnout," said Mark Feierstein, vice president of Greenberg Quinlan Rosner, a Washington polling firm that has worked in Venezuela. Adding to the uncertainty is speculation that if Chávez concludes he will lose, the Chávez-controlled Supreme Court could delay the vote by agreeing to consider one of the opposition's challenges.

Even supporters are wary of the referendum.

The small Podemos political party — which has six seats in Congress and almost always has supported Chávez — refused to back the proposed changes. Even Chávez's ex-wife, Marisabel Rodriguez, joined the chorus of critics.

But Chávez remains personally popular, with the approval of more than 50 percent of the population. With oil prices hovering around $100 a barrel, Venezuela's oil-dependent economy has boomed, and Chávez is spending the resulting windfall on populist programs. Venezuelans also are snapping up imported computers, whiskey and clothing, driving imports up an astonishing 36 percent compared with a year ago, the Central Bank of Venezuela reports.

Poverty has fallen from 42.8 percent in 1999 to 33.9 percent in 2006, according to Venezuela's census bureau, although progress on unemployment has been mixed.

"The 'comandante' has done so many good things for this country," Aura Eslada, 54, a secretary who wore a red cap and a "Yes with Chavez" T-shirt, said during a march Tuesday.

"The opposition doesn't have anybody better to offer."

But amid the economic plenty, consumers complain that they cannot find eggs, sugar, milk and other basics at supermarkets. Price controls imposed by Chávez have eliminated farmers' profits and caused them to reduce production.

That's one of the signs that, even though Chávez controls nearly all the levers of political power, he has yet to gain total control over this freewheeling country.

Many expect Chávez to nationalize more private holdings, which have included U.S. firms Heinz and Verizon, and try to grab even more power.

Javier Corrales, a political-science professor and Chávez-watcher at Amherst College, said an emboldened Chávez could drive up energy prices further.

"Venezuela is going to be a big, big headache" for the U.S. if Chávez wins the referendum, Corrales said.

After meeting with Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad in Tehran last week, Chávez said the falling dollar was "a sign the U.S. empire is coming down," and called on OPEC countries to use the euro instead. His comments helped push oil prices closer to $100 a barrel.

Whether relations between Venezuela and the United States improve may depend on President Bush's successor. Chávez has professed to getting along better with President Clinton than "the Texan who walks around shooting from the hip."

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

The propaganda campaign appears to be working!

Look at all the people in America in 2004 who were duped!!

Fixed it for ya! :thumbsup:

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

What a joke the LABRONCOS fan props this guy up and bashes America. I just don't understand not supporting your own country.

There you go with the same old "criticizing Bush = bashing America" straw man again.

You are obvioulsy not to be taken seriously.

BTW, isn't it funny how right-wingers construe the refutation of their disinformation and hypocrisy about Chavez as support for the latter?

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

The propaganda campaign appears to be working! Look at all the people in Venezuela who have been duped!!Yikes!

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/nationworld/2004043724_venezuela30.html

http://www.cepr.net/content/view/1372/77/

There is a significant risk that fraudulent polls and other deceptions will be used to challenge the results of Venezuela's referendum, if proposed constitutional reforms are approved this Sunday, according to Center for Economic and Policy Research (CEPR) economist and Co-Director Mark Weisbrot.

"The international media has not always exercised due diligence in its reporting on polling data and elections in Venezuela," said Weisbrot, who has authored papers on previous elections there.

"This opens up the possibility for the use of fake polling, as was done in the last (2004) referendum, to cast doubt on the results if the proposed constitutional reforms are approved," he said.

In 2004, the influential U.S. polling firm Penn, Schoen, and Berland published fake exit polls on the day of the Presidential recall referendum, showing President Hugo Chávez losing by a 59-41 margin.(1) The actual results, which were certified by observer missions from the Organization of American States and the Atlanta-based Carter Center, showed the opposite, with Chávez winning by a margin of 58 to 41 percent.(2)

The fake exit polls were not the only dubious polls that plagued the last referendum. Most of the pre-election polls in 2004 showed the race "too close to call." Although these were conducted by opposition pollsters, most of the international media accepted them in their reporting. As CEPR demonstrated at the time, it is extremely unlikely that a properly conducted poll could have shown a result that was "too close to call."

The election's credibility was also attacked by a widely-cited statistical paper(3) purporting to show evidence of fraud. CEPR showed that this analysis was deeply flawed and provided no such evidence; the Carter Center later commissioned an independent panel of statisticians from U.S. universities, which confirmed CEPR's finding and concluded that there was no statistical evidence of fraud.(4)

Nonetheless, the Wall Street Journal and some Latin American media outlets used this paper and the fake exit polls to claim that the referendum was actually stolen through a clever electronic fraud.(5)

On this basis of such analysis and fake exit polls, most of the opposition rejected the results of the 2004 referendum, and went on to boycott the 2005 national elections.

In the 2006 Presidential election, Penn, Schoen and Berland once again produced questionable polling data showing the race to be in a " very close" just before the election. Other pollsters, including Zogby International, showed an 18-29 point spread favoring Chávez.(6) According to the Miami Herald, this led to the sudden departure of Doug Schoen – who was responsible for the Venezuela polling – on the eve of the election.(7) Chávez won the presidency by a margin of 63 to 37 percent.

"The international media's reporting on the current referendum so far is not encouraging," Weisbrot said. He noted that on November 7th, "almost all of the U.S. and international press reported that pro-Chávez gunmen had fired on a crowd of peaceful protesters returning from a demonstration against the reforms.(8) We now know that this is not at all what happened."(9)

Weisbrot also noted that the media has given wide coverage to a poll by Datanalisis this week showing a defeat for the proposed reforms.(10) The firm's longstanding ties to the opposition, and its serious polling errors in the last referendum, were not mentioned in the press.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

I don't doubt big biz is trying to thwart these reforms. But the scary thing is that Chavez is going to be in power until either he dies, or is overthrown.

Just think: if Chavez was a right-wing dictator who was friendly to Bush's oil buddies then Bush would probably be selling stinger missles to Iran to help finance the Chavez cause! (And people like you would cheer and raise your 'W' pom poms in the air.)


I just don't understand not supporting your own country.

I just don't understand how you can't grasp the difference between supporting your country and supporting a policy, an administration, or a political party.

Either you are being intellectually dishonest or you are not too swift.

[Spider]

Chavez sure is causing alot of you to get your panties all twisted up ...... who gives a **** if he wants his own time zone for his country ?
hell we buy his freaking oil , we help keep him in power

[The Lone Bolt]

Fixed it for ya! :thumbsup:

Another deflection on to bush while avoiding the subject of chavez. Well done!!:thumbs:

[W*GS]

BTW, isn't it funny how right-wingers construe the refutation of their disinformation and hypocrisy about Chavez as support for the latter?

You're slowly backing away from your prior ardent support of Chavez.

Why?

Is it because what the rest of us have known is the truth about the guy is oh-so-slowly sinking in to that paleolefty brain of yours?

[Spider]

You're slowly backing away from your prior ardent support of Chavez.

Why?

Is it because what the rest of us have known is the truth about the guy is oh-so-slowly sinking in to that paleolefty brain of yours?

what I cant figure out is why you fear Chavez so much , Yavbitch has an excuse , he is as stupid as the day is long .......

[W*GS]

I don't "fear" Chavez in the slightest - he's the Venezuelan people's problem. I merely find it amusing that LABF continually covers for him and deflects from him.

LABF doesn't see how Bush and Chavez are a lot alike - a disconnect arising solely from the fact that LABF, as a lefty, cannot see anything wrong with Chavez, because ol' Hugo is a lefty too.

[Spider]

I don't "fear" Chavez in the slightest - he's the Venezuelan people's problem. I merely find it amusing that LABF continually covers for him and deflects from him.

LABF doesn't see how Bush and Chavez are a lot alike - a disconnect arising solely from the fact that LABF, as a lefty, cannot see anything wrong with Chavez, because ol' Hugo is a lefty too.
probably help if I paid more attention to your posting ;D

[Garcia Bronco]

SNL should start making hardcore fun of these guys.

[cutthemdown]

SNL should start making hardcore fun of these guys.

LOL that would be funny!!!! Except they are on strike.