Don't get rid of Shanny, change the playbook and let Cutler unleash the fury

[NodJello]

Maybe something like this has been said before and if so – I apologize for posting again. Is there anyone else that would like to see some kind of change in the offense? I am tired of seeing this stuttering and predictable “clock controlling” offense. It’s boring (with the exception of the 4th quarter as we try to stay in the game) and it’s not working. What I would like to see is Shanny to unleash Cutler. Let’s start seeing some big throws, let’s start seeing him really try to force a ball in and make some risky plays. Some of you will say, that’s what we’ve been doing these past 2 games. I disagree. I hated that we lost but I also had to respect GB for the way they finished us. You all know that if we had won the coin toss it would have been run, run, 5 yard quick slant or buttonhook. In short, slowly grinding our way down the field until Elam was called to make the kick. And this definitely has worked for us but must we do the same thing every time?

Look, I don’t know as much about football as most of you so I want to get your take. Feel free to disagree. I just think Cutler would improve so much more rapidly if he really got to in there and “go big”. Sure, he is going to get picked, sure he is going to make bone-headed mistakes and sure we are going to get smoked in a lot of game but … we already are and I would like to see 1.) A more exciting (unpredictable game) 2.) What the kid really is capable of.

Heck, I wish they would have some kind of press-release saying as much because I would like Cutler to feel some heat, to feel like this was his team rather than the guy trying to execute the coach’s call and always having someone else to point the finger at.
The fact is that as bad as the team (especially D) looks right now - a few draft picks are not going to fix the problem and at this point we might as well play to our strengths. This team is going nowhere, for a little while, so let’s give the kid some John Elway experience and really put the game on his shoulders. There's my attempt at a discussion topic.

[Crushaholic]

The bottom line is wins and losses, no matter how big or small. As far as your "go big" comment, the thing I will always remember about Elway is his shovel passes, running for the first down and finding the TE (Sharpe, Chamberlain, etc.), not his throws deep down the field. I had no problem with the offense Monday night except for the sneak that led to the game-tying field goal. Cutler is running the boot very well. He will get better as time goes on, but he doesn't need to take that many chances yet. We don't need his confidence shot, and that's likely to happen with a ton of mistakes.

[rbackfactory80]

I agree let him throw, its what he does. Plus stop freezing up in the red zone. We have not been to get it in running it from anywhere inside the 5.

[rovolution]

Shanny needs to bring out his old "Steve Young Playbook" from back in his 49er OC days and implement it with Cutler.

Less running game, more throwing the football.

[sisterhellfyre]

This team is going nowhere, for a little while, so let’s give the kid some John Elway experience and really put the game on his shoulders. There's my attempt at a discussion topic.

Only problem with that is that the offensive line isn't up to it yet. It takes time for the receivers to get downfield for the big throws. Against the Packers with Kampmann and KGB coming off the corners, Cutler didn't have time to set up and wait for the routes to develop. That's not especially a knock on the line itself, considering that it was the first time that particular lineup had ever played together. Left guard Chris Kuper was in all of his 2nd start, for pete's sake. The line will get better as they work together under game pressure more.

Plus Cutler just isn't far enough along in his development to help out the receivers running deep routes by looking off and faking out the secondary. Cutler gets away with it purely because of the strength of his arm and the velocity of his throws, but he does tend to fix on and watch his intended receiver on at least 1/3rd of called pass plays.

Both of these

Regards,
m.

[Hammer]

I would like to see them go no-huddle once in a while to keep defenses more off balance. Other than that, the go big theory doesnt hold up because the Broncos have no problem moving the ball. They just cant punch it in and thats because the O-line is as weak as its ever been. They cant push anyone around.

[jayman_37]

The offensive line strugges to protect on seven step drops consistently and the speed at receiver is lacking to really attack deep down the field.

[Rock Chalk]

Look man, that's a great idea IF you have a defense that can you know, stop the opposition.

We dont.

Ball control offense is our best defense, period. That is the ONLY reason Shanahan hasnt taken the reigns off Cutler at this point. He knows our defense ****ing sucks.

[Circle Orange]

Careful what you ask for.

a 15% completion rate offense won't get it done. Looks spectacular if you hit it, but if you don't work the middle of the field it won't work.

And Cutler would throw more picks, not less. I think you take shots, but not just for the sake of going deep.

[vancejohnson82]

that's true

if we score in 2 plays it means our swiss cheese Defense gets to trod back on the field and escort the opposing RB down the field

[TheDave]

Look man, that's a great idea IF you have a defense that can you know, stop the opposition.

We dont.

Ball control offense is our best defense, period. That is the ONLY reason Shanahan hasnt taken the reigns off Cutler at this point. He knows our defense ****ing sucks.

100% agree... T.O.P. is everything to us right now. The last thing we need is a couple extra 3-and-outs combined with some short fields (due to turnovers). This offense has it's hands full just trying to stay healthy and let the pieces gel.

Like it or not folks the problems we are having are going to require an off-season to fix.

[BroncoMan4ever]

i am fine with the play calling Shanny is using from the 20 yards line to the 20 yard line, but once we get into the red zone his philosophy changes. he gets to conservative and Denver is forced to bring out Elam.

I love Elam in Denver, but i would like him even more if the only time i saw him was on extra point kicks.

i still say in the red zone we have 2 Big TE, a huge receiver and a few RB/FB with good hands, screw these run plays and sneaks and put the ball up in the corner of the end zone. let these WR and TE make there money, they all have the size and skill nedded to do this.

[backup qb]

Alfred Williams on Playbook was pleading for the broncos to open up against the lions in the no huddle. He feels Jay thrives in that situation. I have mixed feelings on that. Personally, I would like to see Henry/Young rip off some big runs early and then kill them with the play action. I haven't paid much attention to the Lions D this year. Can they stop the run?

[cmhargrove]

I think we only nneed to attempt about 2-4 deep passes a game to make everyone happy. Our Offensive problems now are more about inexperience and execution rather than skill level. We were in the position to score about 2+ more TD's last game, the execution just failed.

With our present playbook and better execution, we can and will score around 30 points per game.

The extra deep balls are about breaking the game open, and keeping the safeties out of our running game. Even if he doesn't complete the passes, it will help us, and if he does...

[yavoon]

I want more pocket passes, more reads, progressions, development w/ touch. not so much rollouts, I don't wanna make another jake plummer:(.

[elsid13]

The WCO offense is designed for short passing game and WR/TE to get big plays on Yards after Catch. That were the explosive plays come from in this offense.

Right now, the only WR that making that happen is Marshall (Walker is out). The rest of our guys are catching the ball and falling down. I like what Stokely brings to the team but he really isn't suited to be a starting WR for this team. He doesn't block great down field for running game and usually can't break a tackle to get the YAC. He great at slot position were the coaching staff envisioned him to play.

Beside last game Culter had completion for 18, 23, 23 and 26 yards. Most of the those were the result of completion with no YAC add in. Those are big plays in the NFL.

[Doggcow]

Cutler just needs to learn how to play every quarter like it's the 4th quarter. Then we'll be invincible on offense.

[Cito Pelon]

As Alec and others have said, maybe the staff wants more ball control, more TOP to protect the D. As elsid said, maybe the philosophy of WCO is ingrained in the O staff's mind where they have a formula that they are not going to go away from since it has produced in the past.

I don't have a problem with attacking further downfield with the passing game. I don't think Shanny does either, actually. I think we have a QB with 12 games under his belt that is comfortable with the underneath stuff that he sees quickly and gets him first downs. Dinger I saw today stated he gets a bit frustrated with Cutler, then has to remember he's a QB with 12 games under his belt. I think Cutler really doesn't understand the middle of the field long where the safeties roam. He's not comfortable with the middle, throws all his INT's in the middle.

Having said all that, I think the staff should look to the middle more when they get to the 35 yd line on the opponent's side of the field. I think they should get on Cutler's ass to look long from that field position. Maybe the staff already is doing that, I don't know. All I know is the O keeps nickle and diming from the 35 on in, and I don't like that. I've seen maybe one or two shots all year into the end zone from the 35, and that just doesn't cut it in the NFL.

[Kaylore]

What about our game is making people think we don't throw enough? We passed way more than we ran the ball last game. I think this is more a thing with the team being young and injured than a scheme problem.

[bpc]

You really want to make this place go boom and get on the same level with Indy and New England?

Step out of the circle and make a move to secure CHAD JOHNSON. Cincy is shopping him. Maybe it takes a first rounder... maybe two. It can't be denied that the guy is one of the best deep threats in the league and it would give us the best set of playmakers in the game, a set that could compete and surpass what the Colts and Patriots have on offense. BMarsh can play on one side, Johnson on the other and Javon can play the slot.

Take the leftover draft picks, money and continue to develop the defensive line, especially at DT.

I know it will be debated but if you want to spark this club, make a splash, throw the dice on the table let Cutler have the tools needed to reach the level he can make it too. Indy has lived for years putting money behind their big armed QB. I dont' think the results have been bad as they just got done polishing their first super bowl trophy and have probably averaged 13 wins over the past three or four years.

On offense, we'll have to make a switch in mentality but I don't think it would be a tough one. Selvin Young looked great catching and running with the football. He is potentially the versatile player we haven't seen in Denver at the HB position in Shanahan's time. The Oline will have to work more on pass blocking... pretty much switching the time we spend on run blocking.

The offense could be run similarly to how the 94' 49ers offense was with Ricky Waters.

This is what I would do. We're not going to get anywhere near the top 10 in drafting and the DT position is weak.

[BowlenBall]

I've got to agree with NodJello's original proposal to open up the playbook.

Under the first few years of the Shanny regime, there was a lot more happening downfield. Then, once Elway retired and Griese stepped in, Shanahan modified his playbook to accomodate his weaker arm. Then we brought in Plummer, which continued the trend of running buttonhooks and 5 yard slants.

Honestly, I think Shanny's been castrating his offense for so long that he's forgotten how to draw up the intermediate and long routes. Hopefully, he'll go back and look at some game film from 1996 or 1997 to remind him of what a mobile quarterback with a live arm can do.

[Taco John]

Shanny isn't going anywhere. When he drafted Cutler, he pretty much guranteed himself another 5-7 years. Pat isn't going to do anything to tip the apple cart here. There's too much at stake.

And I agree with those calling for a TOP offense. Cutler needs to learn CONTROL and not learn that he can just freewheel it. That's the quickest way to turning him into an undisciplined mess. Of course people want to see Cutler out there just slinging it, but football is a sport of balance and discipline.

Frankly, I'm enjoying the hell out of this season. It's actually fun to watch these guys develop. The defense isn't great, and is frustrating as hell -- but the young guys on the team show flashes now and again that give me some hope.

I'm not sold on the defensive coordinator at this point. I had expected to see some real improvement by now, and we seem to be getting worse scheme-wise. Here's hoping it gets turned around in November.

[eddie mac]

TOP didn't help us too much against Mr NFL and the Packers considering our D gave up 14 pts in a matter of seconds.

[elsid13]

I think the other problem why this team hasn't been as explosive is the running game really hasn't got into grove. There really hasn't been any really Play Action for the WR to get the opportunity to good down the field.

Beside, there might have been deep options but Cutler might have checked down because those guys were clean like his deep threat.

[cmhargrove]

You really want to make this place go boom and get on the same level with Indy and New England?

Step out of the circle and make a move to secure CHAD JOHNSON. Cincy is shopping him. Maybe it takes a first rounder... maybe two. It can't be denied that the guy is one of the best deep threats in the league and it would give us the best set of playmakers in the game, a set that could compete and surpass what the Colts and Patriots have on offense. BMarsh can play on one side, Johnson on the other and Javon can play the slot.

Take the leftover draft picks, money and continue to develop the defensive line, especially at DT.

I know it will be debated but if you want to spark this club, make a splash, throw the dice on the table let Cutler have the tools needed to reach the level he can make it too. Indy has lived for years putting money behind their big armed QB. I dont' think the results have been bad as they just got done polishing their first super bowl trophy and have probably averaged 13 wins over the past three or four years.

On offense, we'll have to make a switch in mentality but I don't think it would be a tough one. Selvin Young looked great catching and running with the football. He is potentially the versatile player we haven't seen in Denver at the HB position in Shanahan's time. The Oline will have to work more on pass blocking... pretty much switching the time we spend on run blocking.

The offense could be run similarly to how the 94' 49ers offense was with Ricky Waters.

This is what I would do. We're not going to get anywhere near the top 10 in drafting and the DT position is weak.

If we aren't tossing it deep regularly, Chad Johnson would be a locker room cancer and a media room circus act. Chad will want to go someplace like the Eagles where they throw it deep all the time. Chad Johnson will never be a Bronco.

[Dedhed]

We're 4-3 if Shanny calls a pass play instead of a nancy QB draw.

[theAPAOps5]

We're 4-3 if Shanny calls a pass play instead of a nancy QB draw.

Or even a boot leg, Cutler is good at being patient when on the boot. In the red zone its one of the few places he has shown the check down ability consistently. I would have liked to see the double tight end set with a PA boot and have the RB, TE, WR all leak out.

[Dedhed]

Or even a boot leg, Cutler is good at being patient when on the boot. In the red zone its one of the few places he has shown the check down ability consistently. I would have liked to see the double tight end set with a PA boot and have the RB, TE, WR all leak out.
Yup, i would love to see a stat that shows TD % when we've thrown from inside the 5. I can't think of a time when Cutler didn't find a guy in the endzone on a PA play from down there.

[bpc]

If we aren't tossing it deep regularly, Chad Johnson would be a locker room cancer and a media room circus act. Chad will want to go someplace like the Eagles where they throw it deep all the time. Chad Johnson will never be a Bronco.

WHY AREN'T WE TOSSING IT DEEP REGULARLY? Why did we get a QB with one of the strongest arms in the draft if you just plan on having him run the west coast offense?

We need to go downfield. I've been saying it a bunch on here. Look what attacking downfield does for a team... it causes touchdowns (Favre last week, Cutler the last five games of the season 06') and it draws penalties downfield.

I dispute that Chad Johnson is a cancer in the locker room. He isn't TO. He isn't Randy Moss. The guy wants to get to the endzone. Shoot, I want our WR's to want to get to the end zone as well. He could be a sparkplug for our unit.

[Dedhed]

With Cutler, Walker, Young, Scheffler, Graham, and Marshall I don't see us spending a lot of FA money on ball catchers. I can't see us targeting any FAs on that side of the ball.

We need to sign the best FA LB available, ad draft S and LB early. Then in the later rounds we should draft more LBs.

[banyon]

The problem you guys have with trying to run a control the clock offense is that you need a really elite-level NFL QB to run it like we have with Damon Huard.

[yavoon]

With Cutler, Walker, Young, Scheffler, Graham, and Marshall I don't see us spending a lot of FA money on ball catchers. I can't see us targeting any FAs on that side of the ball.

We need to sign the best FA LB available, ad draft S and LB early. Then in the later rounds we should draft more LBs.

I don't think graham is technically a "ball catcher" so much as a puny offensive lineman.

[Bronx33]

The problem you guys have with trying to run a control the clock offense is that you need a really elite-level NFL QB to run it like we have with Damon Huard.

That post is almost an oxymoron ok ok (it is)

[banyon]

That post is almost an oxymoron ok ok (it is)

I'm joking, can't you tell from my sig? :approve:

Right now there are two trolls on CP (Bob and someone who is potentially even more annoying named "hootie") who have incessantly peppered the forum with their posts about how great Huard is. It's truly ridiculous, but I couldn't help thinking about it when hearing you guys talk about a TOP offense.

[Bronx33]

I'm joking, can't you tell from my sig? :approve:

Right now there are two trolls on CP (Bob and someone who is potentially even more annoying named "hootie") who have incessantly peppered the forum with their posts about how great Huard is. It's truly ridiculous, but I couldn't help thinking about it when hearing you guys talk about a TOP offense.


Yes i was just having fun and yes is saw bobos latest idiot thread.