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Popps
12-03-2007, 04:25 AM
Naaa We like The Overgrown Cockeyed Beaver

Well, he's made you his bitches over the last decade. I guess it's a sort of
Stockholm Syndrome.

(Just google it, I don't feel like explaining it to you.)

Broncojef
12-03-2007, 04:25 AM
Shanahan was the right coach at the right time with all the talent and Elway in need of rings. I think the job has passed him by. I love him as a coach but all good things must end and I think we need new direction come next year. I'm not sure even without the injuries our record would be much different. We can never seem to get the solution at DT and have struggled with DE, our Linebackers are subpar and Lynch is hurt on the sidelines more than on the field. The O-Line is probably the biggest concern with Lepsis our anchor now getting beat badly every game. Henry just needs to get suspended to save having to watch the fumbles and Walker may never return to high levels of play. All that said we need to rebuild around Jay and a select few others and I think Shanny's days are now numbered here as well. He's a smart guy and after this season will do the right thing.

The play calling, decision making and discipline this year have been worse than at any other time with the Broncos I can remember and signals Shanny is losing focus and needs to go another direction for the good of the organization.

Killericon
12-03-2007, 04:37 AM
10 whole years since we went back to back? Sweet jesus! In a salary-capped, 32 team league with parity, that's simply unacceptable!

I tell you what guys. I'll hop on board this "WE SUCK SO MUCH, OUR HALL OF FAME COACH HAS TO GO!" bandwagon if we suck this much again next year. Until then, give the man some respect. He's earned a couple mulligans, I think.

Popps
12-03-2007, 04:44 AM
10 whole years since we went back to back? Sweet jesus! In a salary-capped, 32 team league with parity, that's simply unacceptable!

I tell you what guys. I'll hop on board this "WE SUCK SO MUCH, OUR HALL OF FAME COACH HAS TO GO!" bandwagon if we suck this much again next year. Until then, give the man some respect. He's earned a couple mulligans, I think.


Again, I'm playing a lot of devil's advocate here because I like Shanahan... but what he did 10 years ago isn't as relevant as what he's done the past two seasons. We've had 1 quality playoff run in the last decade and that was followed up with a complete franchise collapse, capped with literally the most embarrassing losses (this year) that the team has suffered, arguably going back 30 years.

To me, "he used to be great" isn't a strong argument. Either is "replacing him will be hard, who's out there?"

A real argument for Shanahan's ability would be to defend what's happened the past two seasons and to explain how that puts us closer to a SB ring.

So far, I haven't seen a single person approach the topic that way. It's all "he used to be great" and "replacing him is hard." Or... "STFU YOU DUMBASS!!"

I mean, I love the guy... and honestly, those are probably the arguments I'm using in favor of keeping him. It's about his rep, not what he's doing and at some point, you have to be honest enough with yourself to at least question whether or not that's logical thinking.

Killericon
12-03-2007, 04:54 AM
Again, I'm playing a lot of devil's advocate here because I like Shanahan... but what he did 10 years ago isn't as relevant as what he's done the past two seasons. We've had 1 quality playoff run in the last decade and that was followed up with a complete franchise collapse, capped with literally the most embarrassing losses (this year) that the team has suffered, arguably going back 30 years.

To me, "he used to be great" isn't a strong argument. Either is "replacing him will be hard, who's out there?"

A real argument for Shanahan's ability would be to defend what's happened the past two seasons and to explain how that puts us closer to a SB ring.

So far, I haven't seen a single person approach the topic that way. It's all "he used to be great" and "replacing him is hard." Or... "STFU YOU DUMBASS!!"

I mean, I love the guy... and honestly, those are probably the arguments I'm using in favor of keeping him. It's about his rep, not what he's doing and at some point, you have to be honest enough with yourself to at least question whether or not that's logical thinking.

Complete Franchise Collapse at 5-7? This is where our logic parts ways. Let's suppose we need to start over. What Parts can we keep? We have an awesome pair of corners, workable depth at safety, one good linebacker, solid depth at DE, a young "stud"(That's a reach, I suppose) at DT, a serviceable offensive line, a rising star QB, solid depth at RB and a trio of awesome wideouts. This is not a "complete franchise collapse".

My argument is that some of his great work as a coach was 3 years ago. If you judge the past 3 years as a solitary body of work, he's doing fine. If he sucks again next year, yeah, I'll be on board for moving on. I just think that he deserves another shot. He's earned that much, don't you think?

Tom A Hawk
12-03-2007, 11:19 AM
We are 10 yrs out from the superbowls, this team has crumbled talent wise to its current state, a 6 and 10 team, with brittle veterans and no depth at key positions. Shannahan has lost his touch, at least here in Denver, and the players no longer respond to his leadership.

Its simply time for him to go, although I am sure pat bowlen has a million excuses for him. Think about it, take off your homer glasses and look at whats actually going on at dove valley. His biggest problem is personnel. Do these names mean anything, Ashlie Lelie, George Foster, DJ Williams, Paul Tovesi, Darius Watts, Marcus Nash, Tatum Bell, the list goes on and on, over the last 10 yrs no team has drafted worse than we have, and it shows on our roster. (Especially on Defense), the last couple years have been better and is saving our Offense with marshall, cutler. Paying Gerrard Warren over Trevor Pryce was a huge mistake....

Ed Reed and Steven Jackson could have BOTH been on this roster now!

Free agent wise where do we start, for every good signing we get burned by several others. Dale Carter, Darryl Gardner, now Travis Henry??? Shannahan has sold his soul and taken unnecessary risks on veterans and overpaid mightily, Dre Bly is the next in line to fail. Trading Gerrard Warren was a mistake as well, after Warren had restructured his contract several times, now we have NO run D.

Coaching, ever since kubiak left his offensive playcalling has been atrocious, especially in the redzone, and his coaching staffs have done terrible. How many D coordinators are we going to go through? How many special teams coaches? Time and Time again he gets a free pass on these critical decisions.

Shannahan is still a great coach, but not here, not now, not in Denver anymore, its time for him to go and time for a new voice and a new coaching staff with fresh ideas and fresh motivation!


Sometimes a coach does stay too long. If you want to part ways with Shanahan, send him KC's way. I will take one Shanhan over 20 Herm's any day of the week.

defenseman
12-03-2007, 11:22 AM
Shanahan would get job offers out the ying-yang if he were to be fired. No need to do that. Don't want him coaching another team, especially in the AFC. I'm for downgrading his responsibilities, get a GM, let shanahan 'coach' only..dman

mattbeymvp
12-03-2007, 05:56 PM
Here's a very simple question that somebody needs to answer.

WHAT HAS MIKE SHANAHAN DONE AS A HEAD COACH WITHOUT THE GREATEST QUARTERBACK TO EVER PLAY THE GAME UNDER CENTER?

He's won a single playoff game and one division title. In nine years.

Bronx33
12-03-2007, 06:07 PM
Here's a very simple question that somebody needs to answer.

WHAT HAS MIKE SHANAHAN DONE AS A HEAD COACH WITHOUT THE GREATEST QUARTERBACK TO EVER PLAY THE GAME UNDER CENTER?

He's won a single playoff game and one division title. In nine years.


Sorry to say john wasn't the entire team (yes he was good) and as (other important players left) so did mikes dominance most people understand catching lighting in a bottle is pretty hard and rarely happens and some people expect it every year no matter what. Is it easy to make the playoffs? no it's not and is it easy to win the superbowl? no it's not.

TheDave
12-03-2007, 06:07 PM
Here's a very simple question that somebody needs to answer.

WHAT HAS MIKE SHANAHAN DONE AS A HEAD COACH WITHOUT THE GREATEST QUARTERBACK TO EVER PLAY THE GAME UNDER CENTER?

He's won a single playoff game and one division title. In nine years.

You don't have anything else to do... Do you?

You seriously need to find a new hobby... creating 1,000's of different ways to say "I hate Mike Shanahan" has to get boring at some point... I know I'm tired of it.

Hell even Telluride hates everything about the Bronco's... take a lesson from him, expand your horizon's

DBroncos4life
12-03-2007, 06:15 PM
I would hate to fire Mike and end up with a Norv Turner, Herm Edwards, Cam Cameron, Dick Jauron, or a Scott Linehan,

Eldorado
12-03-2007, 06:23 PM
Here's a very simple question that somebody needs to answer.

WHAT HAS MIKE SHANAHAN DONE AS A HEAD COACH WITHOUT THE GREATEST QUARTERBACK TO EVER PLAY THE GAME UNDER CENTER?

He's won a single playoff game and one division title. In nine years.

Id call you retarded, but that would be an insult to the mentally handicapped everywhere.

Bronx33
12-03-2007, 06:25 PM
mattbeymvp is just shooting a shotgun at anything and everything.

wolf754life
12-04-2007, 01:31 AM
http://www.denverpost.com/broncos/ci_7619763

AHHHH, one of the best articles yet, more to follow!

Malcontent
12-04-2007, 01:34 AM
How is Shanahan spelled again??

1. Shanaughan
2. Shannnnnnnnnnnnnnnahan
3. Shanihaun
4. Shenanigan
5. Your guess

rovolution
12-04-2007, 01:35 AM
how many screen names does
Telluride have?

Kaylore
12-04-2007, 01:36 AM
What a piece of crap Kiszla is.

SoCalBronco
12-04-2007, 01:37 AM
What a piece of crap Kiszla is.

I wouldn't mind if Kiszla put his dick in a blender and activated it.

TheDave
12-04-2007, 01:43 AM
I wouldn't mind if Kiszla put his dick in a blender and activated it.

Looks like the Survivor game started early this year...

DukeWoody
12-04-2007, 02:11 AM
This sucked donkey ballz..

Los Broncos
12-04-2007, 02:11 AM
I wouldn't mind if Kiszla put his dick in a blender and activated it.

Put it in a Vita-mix blender, set it and forget it!

Wes Mantooth
12-04-2007, 02:14 AM
I wouldn't mind if Kiszla put his dick in a blender and activated it.

Won't do anything if you can't reach the blender part.

Popps
12-04-2007, 02:19 AM
It's over the top, but I wonder how much if it Shanahan would disagree with.

He's said repeatedly that he's disappointed in himself this year.

Is he lying? Does he really mean... "I think I've been great the last couple of years?"

The stuff at the end of the article is a little personal, but it's nothing that hasn't been said around here 1000 times. Shanahan rules with an iron fist, which is great when things are working out. When they're not, people start to ask questions.

BroncoSoja
12-04-2007, 03:39 AM
LOL I love it great article, this part was my farvorite and speaks the truth.

"It starts and ends with Shanahan.

The coach knows X's and O's.

The Broncos need to hire an executive who knows talent.

Would Shanahan ever accept a strong voice to challenge his authority in personnel decisions?

Only if he wants to win the Super Bowl again. Why would Shanahan let foolish pride or a power trip prevent him from earning a spot in the Pro Football Hall of Fame?

The first step in solving the problem is acknowledging you need help."


If Shanny-hand will not quit and will not be fired perhaps we can actually get a real GM and not a puppet that does what his master wants.

Blueflame
12-04-2007, 03:59 AM
This absolutely HAD to have its own new thread, right? ::) It couldn't possibly just be added to the already-existing "Shanahan must go" whinefest......:hitself: :flush:

SoCalBronco
12-04-2007, 04:12 AM
Mike Shanahan is the best thing that has happened to this franchise in 24 years. We've seen the flashes of brilliance and the unbelievable potential of this club this season a few times, especially with all the new and exciting young pieces of the puzzle that have been added by him recently. We have suffered some big time injuries, and there have also been some coaching issues to be fair, among other things, some controllable, some not. The bottom line is that we have a foundation that he has laid here, he's made us younger, while preserving our competitiveness at the same time. There have been a number of things that just didn't go our way this year, but we're on not only the right track, we're on the fast track to elite status. We've gotta make some improvements, and some patience is required, and that's understandable, thats ok.

Shanny is the man. I hope he sticks around 10 more years. Between Shanny and Cutler, we will reclaim our throne really soon. Really soon. :thumbsup:

24champ
12-04-2007, 04:17 AM
I hope we hire Brian Billick to replace Shanny!

[/sarcasm]

Broncomutt
12-04-2007, 09:52 AM
Great article!

Unabashed apologists for Shanahan endlessly chant he has suffered one losing season in Denver. The irrational bashers shout Shanahan has done nothing memorable since John Elway retired.

The truth can be found somewhere in the middle.



Pretty much sums up my feelings exactly.:thumbsup:

Peoples Champ
12-04-2007, 01:15 PM
Great article!

Unabashed apologists for Shanahan endlessly chant he has suffered one losing season in Denver. The irrational bashers shout Shanahan has done nothing memorable since John Elway retired.

The truth can be found somewhere in the middle.



Pretty much sums up my feelings exactly.:thumbsup:





Shanahan has had us in the playoffs , playoff contention, and the afc championship in the post elway era, and i know we have lost many of those including the afc championship, and only have one playoff win, but just think of how many teams can say that they have been in the playoffs that much in the post john elway era, not many, only belicheck and dungy are two that come to mind, maybe bill cower but he has had some bad seasons as well (last year), we are spoiled as fans, just think of atlanta fans, or rams fans, or dolphins fans, or jets fans, or even bears fans (one good year last year), everyone around the league has had terrrible turnover in coaches and have not had the constistancy we have had (excluding colts and pats), even green bay has had bad years, most teams would love to have a year that we are having know, im sure the dolphins would love to be 5-7

Peoples Champ
12-04-2007, 01:31 PM
Shanahan was the right coach at the right time with all the talent and Elway in need of rings. I think the job has passed him by. I love him as a coach but all good things must end and I think we need new direction come next year. I'm not sure even without the injuries our record would be much different. We can never seem to get the solution at DT and have struggled with DE, our Linebackers are subpar and Lynch is hurt on the sidelines more than on the field. The O-Line is probably the biggest concern with Lepsis our anchor now getting beat badly every game. Henry just needs to get suspended to save having to watch the fumbles and Walker may never return to high levels of play. All that said we need to rebuild around Jay and a select few others and I think Shanny's days are now numbered here as well. He's a smart guy and after this season will do the right thing.

The play calling, decision making and discipline this year have been worse than at any other time with the Broncos I can remember and signals Shanny is losing focus and needs to go another direction for the good of the organization.




I dont think that shannahans first super bowl was him just being the right coach with the right talent with Elway at the right time, if you look at our shedule that year we did not blow everone out with talent, we won a lot of close games including the playoff games, we even lost a couple bad ones, im not saying we did not have talent , im just saying that in a lot of these close games, great coaching played a factor

| Week | Opponent | Result | Score |
+--------+-------------------------------+----------+---------+
| 1 | Kansas City Chiefs | W | 19- 3 |
| 2 | at Seattle Seahawks | W | 35-14 |
| 3 | St. Louis Rams | W | 35-14 |
| 4 | Cincinnati Bengals | W | 38-20 |
| 5 | at Atlanta Falcons | W | 29-21 |
| 6 | New England Patriots | W | 34-13 |
| 7 | |
| 8 | at Oakland Raiders | L | 25-28 |
| 9 | at Buffalo Bills | W | 23-20 |
| 10 | Seattle Seahawks | W | 30-27 |
| 11 | Carolina Panthers | W | 34- 0 |
| 12 | at Kansas City Chiefs | L | 22-24 |
| 13 | Oakland Raiders | W | 31- 3 |
| 14 | at San Diego Chargers | W | 38-28 |
| 15 | at Pittsburgh Steelers | L | 24-35 |
| 16 | at San Francisco 49ers | L | 17-34 |
| 17 | San Diego Chargers | W | 38- 3 |
+--------+-------------------------------+----------+---------+


Postseason
AFC Wildcard Game: won 42 - 17 vs. Jacksonville Jaguars
AFC Divisional Playoff: won 14 - 10 at Kansas City Chiefs
AFC Championship Game: won 24 - 21 at Pittsburgh Steelers
Super Bowl: won 31 - 24 at Green Bay Packers

telluride
12-04-2007, 02:49 PM
I dont think that shannahans first super bowl was him just being the right coach with the right talent with Elway at the right time, if you look at our shedule that year we did not blow everone out with talent, we won a lot of close games including the playoff games, we even lost a couple bad ones, im not saying we did not have talent , im just saying that in a lot of these close games, great coaching played a factor

Agreed. But that was a decade ago. I honestly don't think Shanny is the same coach. What this team needs is the new Shanny.

Peoples Champ
12-04-2007, 03:25 PM
Agreed. But that was a decade ago. I honestly don't think Shanny is the same coach. What this team needs is the new Shanny.



Yes it was a decade ago, but in this decade, the post elway era, how many coaches have consistantly had their teams in the playoffs and or in the hunt, i can only think a few coaches with that kinds of consistancy.

orange 4 life
12-04-2007, 07:25 PM
I dont think that shannahans first super bowl was him just being the right coach with the right talent with Elway at the right time, if you look at our shedule that year we did not blow everone out with talent, we won a lot of close games including the playoff games, we even lost a couple bad ones, im not saying we did not have talent , im just saying that in a lot of these close games, great coaching played a factor

| Week | Opponent | Result | Score |
+--------+-------------------------------+----------+---------+
| 1 | Kansas City Chiefs | W | 19- 3 |
| 2 | at Seattle Seahawks | W | 35-14 |
| 3 | St. Louis Rams | W | 35-14 |
| 4 | Cincinnati Bengals | W | 38-20 |
| 5 | at Atlanta Falcons | W | 29-21 |
| 6 | New England Patriots | W | 34-13 |
| 7 | |
| 8 | at Oakland Raiders | L | 25-28 |
| 9 | at Buffalo Bills | W | 23-20 |
| 10 | Seattle Seahawks | W | 30-27 |
| 11 | Carolina Panthers | W | 34- 0 |
| 12 | at Kansas City Chiefs | L | 22-24 |
| 13 | Oakland Raiders | W | 31- 3 |
| 14 | at San Diego Chargers | W | 38-28 |
| 15 | at Pittsburgh Steelers | L | 24-35 |
| 16 | at San Francisco 49ers | L | 17-34 |
| 17 | San Diego Chargers | W | 38- 3 |
+--------+-------------------------------+----------+---------+


Postseason
AFC Wildcard Game: won 42 - 17 vs. Jacksonville Jaguars
AFC Divisional Playoff: won 14 - 10 at Kansas City Chiefs
AFC Championship Game: won 24 - 21 at Pittsburgh Steelers
Super Bowl: won 31 - 24 at Green Bay Packers

only two of the regular season wins were decided by a TD or less, but 2 of the 4 losses WERE less than 7.
also, in the playoffs, our dominant run game COMINED with elways ability to seemingly always complete the 3rd down pass allowed us to keep the clock moving preventing the other team from getting the ball.

remember the pitt game?
the rocket to shannon sharpe that iced it?

nowadays, shanny just runs it and punts. sure, he throws the occasional screen or misdirection pitch, but nothing downfield, and nothing on 1st or 2nd down.
as a result, we give the ball back to the opposition (chicago was a great example) and of course our defense hasnt stopped anyone in crunchtime (not literally, but it feels like it) since superbowl XXXII.

we're 28-28 in games decided by 7 or less since elway retired. compare that with our winning percentage overall, and youll see a noticeable discrepancy.

hey, i LOVE shanahan, but im sick of turtling at the end of games, and im sick of blaming coordinators and qb's.
he's the right man, but he needs to take responsibility, and he needs to let his offense play when protecting a lead down the stretch.

yavoon
12-04-2007, 07:57 PM
I wanna keep shanny. but sometimes I wonder if I wanna keep tenured professor shanny.

Peoples Champ
12-05-2007, 10:33 AM
since there is tonz of great coaches available, how bout lets bring in dan hawkins, he can turn a team around

HAT
10-20-2008, 09:32 PM
Bump For Truth...........

When will you people wake up and realize 10+ years tenured coaches are only in it for the money & FAIL to motivate....FAIL to be innovative....FAIL to lead?

Just to reiterate, PB is partially to blame here since he offered the 'lifetime contract'. Shanny is still my favorite HC & I don't want him to be fired, I want him to walk away gracefully & succeed elsewhere while not wasting the brilliant offense he has assmbled here.


But, but, but....were still in first place!!!!! Mmmmmhmmm.

FAIL

BroncoBen
10-20-2008, 09:35 PM
oh and 2 years ago we were in the AFC championship..I know ths team is alot different than that team..relax the Broncos have alot of young up and coming talent..this isnt the year for superbowl..its a year for growth and development

I have to agree with you... the Broncos need to draft heavy on defense in this years up coming draft.

I know the Broncos will want to compete the rest of the season.. but there is something to be said about a losing season and high draft picks.

HAT
10-20-2008, 09:37 PM
NE and Colts would be nothing without Brady or Manning someday the reality of it will hit home.

Clearly....the Pats suck w/o Brady.

bowtown
10-20-2008, 09:38 PM
I can't believe this has already started.

HAT
10-20-2008, 09:42 PM
I can't believe this has already started.

When will you? 2012?

Just curious.

lazarus4444
10-20-2008, 09:49 PM
I knew this thread would come up. I'm middle of the road on this issue, we'll see how they bounce back.

bowtown
10-20-2008, 09:51 PM
When will you? 2012?

Just curious.

Where have you been the last 4 months jack$$? Just curious, HAT, or should I call you Wolf, or Bob? How about just, Troll? Yeah, that'll do.

MplsBronco
10-20-2008, 09:54 PM
I've been saying this for a couple of years now. Shanny is done here and the Broncos will never win anything of consequence during the remainder of his tenure.

This team has no heart, no fire, no pride and we are seeing way too many nights like tonight. This has been the making for quite sometime. And to all those who want to blame the players, these are Shanny's players. The buck has to stop with him. The only hope is for Shanny to realize enough is enough and walk away.

When was the last time this team faced any adversity in a game and came back? You see us get up on teams 21-3 and blow the lead but never are the roles reversed. This team is gutless and a disgrace.

enjolras
10-20-2008, 09:57 PM
Shannahan's issue continues to be leadership. His teams don't follow him (how many coaches are chastized as 'that little man upstairs'?). So many players leave this team on incredibly bad terms.

It's showing in this teams play. I think Rod Smith held things together based on the string of his personality... now that he's gone there is a huge leadership vacuum. Until Shanny parks his ego and shows that he can lead this team and get it prepared to play every week this team is in real trouble.

It's not about his football knowledge, x's and o's, or ability to put together a game plan. He's among the best in the league when it comes to football. When it comes to coaching he has real problems.

HAT
10-20-2008, 10:08 PM
Where have you been the last 4 months jack$$? Just curious, HAT, or should I call you Wolf, or Bob? How about just, Troll? Yeah, that'll do.


Oh, just trying to make a living here and there in SoCal. How 'Bout you?

Like I mentioned in another thread, I'm just a chicken little noob who claims the sky is falling after every Bronco loss. Don't mind me....after all...you've got more posts than I do.

I have no idea if Wolf still posts here or not & Bob is the biggest forum douche I've ever seen (And that is saying something!)

But just b/c I'm a such a troll....I'll offer up one last thought to chew on:

MIKE SHANAHAN IS MY FAVORITE COACH OF ALL TIME....MAY HE RETIRE IN PEACE OR GO ON TO TURN ANOTHER FRANCHISE AROUND, AMEN!

Old 11-04-2007, 11:12 PM #433
HAT
Seasoned Veteran


Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: The 714
Posts: 251

Default
Not going to harp on today's result or even last weeks b/c my point this entire thread has been the bigger picture.

SB Champ. / Coach / years as coach
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

colts / Dungy / 5th
pitt / Cowher / 13th
NE / Bellicheck / 5th
NE / Bellicheck / 4th
TB / Gruden / 1st
NE / Bellicheck / 2nd
Balt / Billick / 2nd
Stl / Dick4meal / 3rd
Den / Shanny / 4th
Den / Shanny / 3rd
GB / Holmgren / 5th
Dal / Switzer / 2nd
SF / Siefert / 6th
Dal / JJ / 5th
Dal / JJ / 4th
Wash / Gibbs / 11th
NYG / Parcells / 8th
SF / Siefert / 1st
SF / Walsh / 10th

(Got tired of searching after 20 years)

Clearly, it's pretty rare for a 10+ year tenured HC to strike gold....just like it is for a first or second year one. Years 3-6 are the money years.

Makes sense if you think about it. 1st & 2nd year coaches are usually inheriting terrible teams and need time to implement their own brand of football, with personell of their choosing & to build continuity. (Sans Siefert/Gruden). Long time HC's (9.10,11 + years) have either burntout, lost their ability to motivate or the game has just flat passed them by.

Let's see if Shanny can strike gold in 2008 (his 14th year). I don't care if they win it all, go 1 and done in the PO's or finish 6-10 again.....2008 needs to be his last year.

Eldorado
10-20-2008, 10:11 PM
I don't care if they win it all, go 1 and done in the PO's or finish 6-10 again.....2008 needs to be his last year.

Ass(HAT)

Sodak
10-20-2008, 10:22 PM
Why dredge this old **** up? To prove a point? Nobody is going to read through 22 pages of negativity. We know it's bad. Just keep piling on to prove some senseless already obvious point.

HAT
10-20-2008, 10:26 PM
Ass(HAT)


Sweet....Name calling.

Cleary, I CARE about this team each & every September going forward. The minuite 'my' Broncos take a snap, I care. This particular thread however happens to be about the positives & negatives of Mike Shanahan as a 14 year tenured head coach.

Would you like to continue name calling or would you like to offer up some intelligent back & forth as to why you believe 'The Mastermind' is our coach of the future?

I've stated over 10 times in this thread that he is my favorite coach of ALL TIME.

But hey, I had a record sales year in 2004 selling high end building materials in a booming economy. I can only hope that my boss let's me rest on my laurels for the next decade or so.

HAT
10-20-2008, 10:36 PM
Why dredge this old **** up? To prove a point? Nobody is going to read through 22 pages of negativity. We know it's bad. Just keep piling on to prove some senseless already obvious point.

You're right Sodak....

It just sucks when everyone tries to get on their high 'horse' and prove a point.

I just tend to get suckered in when people play the "# of posts" card.

I love MS...Love my Broncos win or lose...Love Cut...Love 'our' ownership...

I just wish Mike would walk away gracefully after this year and hand the reigns over to some young blood (without even knowing who since Kub's & Garrett aren't options). Decade and a half tenured coaches just do not get it done. Especially ones who barely even have a 'coaching tree' after all of these years. (Jeff Fisher not withstanding)

Eldorado
10-20-2008, 10:44 PM
Yeah. 5 turn overs. Definatly shanny's fault.



































Ass(HAT)

MplsBronco
10-20-2008, 10:44 PM
You're right Sodak....

It just sucks when everyone tries to get on their high 'horse' and prove a point.

I just tend to get suckered in when people play the "# of posts" card.

I love MS...Love my Broncos win or lose...Love Cut...Love 'our' ownership...

I just wish Mike would walk away gracefully after this year and hand the reigns over to some young blood (without even knowing who since Kub's & Garrett aren't options). Decade and a half tenured coaches just do not get it done. Especially ones who barely even have a 'coaching tree' after all of these years. (Jeff Fisher not withstanding)


I too like Shanny but I have had a enough. Look at what Landry did at the end of his tenure. That team was crap. The Broncos will never win again with Shanny.

Rather than a young upstart, I want Cowher. Someone who can instill a nastiness and an identity to this team and this defense. Shanny has outfitted the O pretty well and we don't need an offensive genius. We someone strong to give this team a personality and who has an eye for defensive talent.

Natedog24
10-20-2008, 10:46 PM
How cute the bandwagoners are already calling for shanny's head

MplsBronco
10-20-2008, 10:49 PM
How cute the bandwagoners are already calling for shanny's head

It's not bandwagon. Been a fan for 25 years. Tired of watching my Broncos turn into such ****! It's not getting any better. There is no sign it will get better in the coming years. I guess the truth stings.

HAT
10-20-2008, 10:50 PM
How cute the bandwagoners are already calling for shanny's head


"Bandwaggoning since 1977" thank you very much! Does that make me cuter?

TheReverend
10-20-2008, 11:06 PM
It's not bandwagon. Been a fan for 25 years. Tired of watching my Broncos turn into such ****! It's not getting any better. There is no sign it will get better in the coming years. I guess the truth stings.

Since the Patriot act, do you have to register yourself to the government as a retard, or was that not part of the policy?

anon
10-20-2008, 11:11 PM
I wish Shanny was imaginative enough to pretend that every opponent was the Raiders -- that would at least guarantee some intensity and fire from the team.

mattbeymvp
10-21-2008, 02:05 AM
How's it going guys?

broncocalijohn
10-21-2008, 03:42 AM
How's it going guys?

F you matt. You sure werent around for the beginning of the season. You know what happens when you come around. People talk and start getting hungry and then they talk about more viddles. Soon, this will become a food hijack thread because you said, "How's it going guys?"

El Guapo
10-21-2008, 07:35 AM
This is the most pathetic thread ever. Shanny for life! :thumbs:

oubronco
10-21-2008, 07:54 AM
the thing that pissed me off the most was how dumbfounded, clueless and lost shanny looked on the sideline you would've thought he might be pissed and screaming at the team

MplsBronco
10-21-2008, 08:16 AM
Since the Patriot act, do you have to register yourself to the government as a retard, or was that not part of the policy?

FU. How old are you? Which part about what I said constitutes such mature language? Is this team not crap? Are there signs that this team has improved from last year? Care to talk some specifics tough guy?

Circle Orange
10-21-2008, 08:19 AM
LOL, I was waiting for this. Granted, it seemed impossible to consider an ouster of Shanny...but this can't continue, and NO ONE should get a free pass forever. Fortunately there are enough remaining games for them to get traction. But if the team keeps playing erratically, this definitely won't go away.

WakeUpCall
10-21-2008, 08:28 AM
Shanny is the man. I hope he sticks around 10 more years. Between Shanny and Cutler, we will reclaim our throne really soon. Really soon. :thumbsup:


I know this, if you folks want to get rid of him, no matter how bad we hate playing against him, we'd take him in KC in a heart beat...

Broncomutt
10-21-2008, 08:33 AM
I know this, if you folks want to get rid of him, no matter how bad we hate playing against him, we'd take him in KC in a heart beat...

Of course you would.

Mediocre is a step-up for you guys.

TonyR
10-21-2008, 08:39 AM
Until we get a FO that knows how to evaluate and aquire talent, and position coaches that know how to coach them, we're in for a long, bumpy road. This team is dead because of years of one of the worst FO's in the league. There's no quick fix. The first 3 games made us think there was. We were wrong. This team is terrible.

Peoples Champ
10-21-2008, 08:50 AM
Shanahan stays

WakeUpCall
10-21-2008, 08:55 AM
Of course you would.

Mediocre is a step-up for you guys.

Unfortunately, we're lower than that. Short of a new Pres/CEO/GM (replace King-Carl) and Head coach (get rid of Hermeroid), and a new load of talent-scouts, I'm not seeing these goons getting it done any time soon..

ak1971
10-21-2008, 09:05 AM
F you matt. You sure werent around for the beginning of the season. You know what happens when you come around. People talk and start getting hungry and then they talk about more viddles. Soon, this will become a food hijack thread because you said, "How's it going guys?"

speaking of which, I had some of the Mark Shlereth green chili las night..pretty good.

noneubizwax
10-21-2008, 09:07 AM
I dont think you fire shanny but you might demote him to Oline coach or something.

Arkansas Bronco
10-21-2008, 09:21 AM
I dont think you fire shanny but you might demote him to Oline coach or something.

Not this guy again.

dbfan4life
10-21-2008, 09:54 AM
I'm confused. Did Shanahan fumble twice and throw two picks?

noneubizwax
10-21-2008, 10:00 AM
Does anyone else think maybe some of this is a direct result of Shanny not having enough say in personel decissions? Maybe we should get a new X's and O's guy and let Shanny concentrate on FA's and the Draft???

Archer81
10-21-2008, 10:32 AM
Until we get a FO that knows how to evaluate and aquire talent, and position coaches that know how to coach them, we're in for a long, bumpy road. This team is dead because of years of one of the worst FO's in the league. There's no quick fix. The first 3 games made us think there was. We were wrong. This team is terrible.


Terrible is KC or St Louis. Freaking out because the team had a bad loss is not necesarily going to fix anything. It happens. Hard to play consistent offense when your slot receiver and tight end are out and you are missing two of your four running backs, and your starting QB is in and out of the game. It happens. Shrug it off and look forward to the bye week.


:Broncos:

MplsBronco
10-21-2008, 10:37 AM
I'm confused. Did Shanahan fumble twice and throw two picks?

I'm confused. Isn't this Shanny's team? Hasn't everyone else been run out of town? Why wasn't this team prepared to play? Why does this team show no heart or sense of urgency? These are questions you should be asking yourself and the answers all lead back to one man.

Why was Hall still in the game in any capacity following the fumbles? Why was Winborn still in the game after that atrocious facemask on 3rd and 17? Where is the accountability? Where is Shanny getting in someone's face and tearing them a new one on the sideline? This team is in disarray.

Archer81
10-21-2008, 10:43 AM
I'm confused. Isn't this Shanny's team? Hasn't everyone else been run out of town? Why wasn't this team prepared to play? Why does this team show no heart or sense of urgency? These are questions you should be asking yourself and the answers all lead back to one man.

Why was Hall still in the game in any capacity following the fumbles? Why was Winborn still in the game after that atrocious facemask on 3rd and 17? Where is the accountability? Where is Shanny getting in someone's face and tearing them a new one on the sideline? This team is in disarray.


Easy Maybell, dont stroke out.


:Broncos:

Archer81
10-21-2008, 10:47 AM
I'm confused. Isn't this Shanny's team? Hasn't everyone else been run out of town? Why wasn't this team prepared to play? Why does this team show no heart or sense of urgency? These are questions you should be asking yourself and the answers all lead back to one man.

Why was Hall still in the game in any capacity following the fumbles? Why was Winborn still in the game after that atrocious facemask on 3rd and 17? Where is the accountability? Where is Shanny getting in someone's face and tearing them a new one on the sideline? This team is in disarray.


How long have you been watching the Denver Broncos? Its not Shanahan's job to police grown men. He says this on a daily basis. He treats them like men because they are men. He preaches composure and poise, and believe it or not thats HARD to do during the course of the game all the time. It was a bad night. Being overdramatic and a punk bitch about it doesnt change we lost. Its just a game.

:Broncos:

Peoples Champ
10-21-2008, 10:53 AM
You do not fire a hall of fame coach.

MplsBronco
10-21-2008, 11:51 AM
How long have you been watching the Denver Broncos?
:Broncos:

Probably longer than you have been alive, punk. .

24champ
10-21-2008, 11:54 AM
"Broncos coach for life"- Pat Bowlen.

Archer81
10-21-2008, 12:26 PM
Probably longer than you have been alive, punk. .


Ooh...mature and reasonable response. Grow up.


:Broncos:

MplsBronco
10-21-2008, 01:26 PM
Ooh...mature and reasonable response. Grow up.


:Broncos:

Seriously, how old are you?

MplsBronco
10-21-2008, 01:28 PM
Nevermind. Yep, been a fan for as long as you have been alive.

alkemical
10-21-2008, 01:30 PM
Seriously, how old are you?

I'm going to guess..... 27!

HEAV
10-21-2008, 01:36 PM
You do not fire a hall of fame coach.

Tom Landry

Chuck Knoll (retired/asked to step down)

George Allen

Don Shula (retired/asked to step down)


It happens. Just depends how long ownership allows the decline to happen.

Eldorado
10-21-2008, 01:39 PM
It happens. Just depends how long ownership allows the decline to happen.

Decline....that's funny :-* .

TDmvp
10-21-2008, 01:50 PM
24 pages of this trash ...
Stupid Spoiled Broncos Fans ...

DB Doom
10-21-2008, 02:06 PM
Im the lame lurker guy:welcome: who has nothing to add because usually I'm an idiot who puts his foot in his mouth more than I should,..especially about Denver, I love 'em and I prob was more upset than some of the players Monday night. I come here because this is the main hub for Bronco insight...foresight and when the clock on the wall reads a quarter past midnight..(sorry..)
Shanahan has to reasess the situation, he really does. If you look at the talent across the board..its average. There is no consistancy anywhere. There is no excuse for a Defense to be that bad. Monday night was who the Broncos are, It is amazing to me that they have won the 3 that they have since week one..hey shanny..get a hard on for the rest of the leauge like you do Al and maybe things could even out a little. Watching the offense..it looks so predictable, it seems the key to most games is matchups and they do not do that very well at all. Cutler has regressed and I 100% blame this on Shanahan. He needs to be told to shut his mouth, he keeps writing checks and motivating everyone he faces..If Rivers dumb ass is alive and breathing come week 17...he will get his revenge, its week 8 and you can bank on it. Shanahan has to rein this guy in..scale the book back a little..relax, look what Plummer did with what he was given..I'm just saying this..When I see Bilichek talking to his D on the bench and going over plays and i watch these same players nodding in agreement with him has they walk off the field on a stop...and i see Shanahan..just pacing and glaring and all disconnected and ****...I am not saying I want to see him go, just that he needs to come off the high horse and bring in some serious help coaching and talent evaluating..besides Cutler who hasnt proved jack yet, who is there to build around?..for the life of me I cant figure out how having Champ Bailey doesnt somehow make the Defense better than the worst in the league..wow, being a fan of Denver has not been fun these last 2 and a half seasons (if it wasnt for 2006 imagine how bummed I'd be) and its going to be a whole lot of the same if we dont get some better coachs and get rid of the yes men.

.................crawls back under his rock...

oubronco
10-21-2008, 02:48 PM
Im the lame lurker guy:welcome: who has nothing to add because usually I'm an idiot who puts his foot in his mouth more than I should,..especially about Denver, I love 'em and I prob was more upset than some of the players Monday night. I come here because this is the main hub for Bronco insight...foresight and when the clock on the wall reads a quarter past midnight..(sorry..)
Shanahan has to reasess the situation, he really does. If you look at the talent across the board..its average. There is no consistancy anywhere. There is no excuse for a Defense to be that bad. Monday night was who the Broncos are, It is amazing to me that they have won the 3 that they have since week one..hey shanny..get a hard on for the rest of the leauge like you do Al and maybe things could even out a little. Watching the offense..it looks so predictable, it seems the key to most games is matchups and they do not do that very well at all. Cutler has regressed and I 100% blame this on Shanahan. He needs to be told to shut his mouth, he keeps writing checks and motivating everyone he faces..If Rivers dumb ass is alive and breathing come week 17...he will get his revenge, its week 8 and you can bank on it. Shanahan has to rein this guy in..scale the book back a little..relax, look what Plummer did with what he was given..I'm just saying this..When I see Bilichek talking to his D on the bench and going over plays and i watch these same players nodding in agreement with him has they walk off the field on a stop...and i see Shanahan..just pacing and glaring and all disconnected and ****...I am not saying I want to see him go, just that he needs to come off the high horse and bring in some serious help coaching and talent evaluating..besides Cutler who hasnt proved jack yet, who is there to build around?..for the life of me I cant figure out how having Champ Bailey doesnt somehow make the Defense better than the worst in the league..wow, being a fan of Denver has not been fun these last 2 and a half seasons (if it wasnt for 2006 imagine how bummed I'd be) and its going to be a whole lot of the same if we dont get some better coachs and get rid of the yes men.

.................crawls back under his rock...

exactly how we all feel except the rock thing

TheChamp24
10-21-2008, 02:54 PM
What do you think Titan fans were saying after they saw their team go 5-11 in 2004 and then 4-12 in 2005? Fire Jeff Fisher?

PRBronco
10-21-2008, 03:08 PM
No! Bad unibomber! Put the thread down! Drop it.....

Bronx33
10-21-2008, 03:34 PM
You will all be happy as hell in two years, now burn this thread to the ground.

Cito Pelon
10-21-2008, 04:22 PM
Well, Shanny sure doesn't have much to hang his hat on since 1998. One Div Title, one playoff win. KC and Seattle both won AFC West titles since then, OAK three, SD three. Not an impressive 9 years from Shanny & Co.

His O's consistently fade in the 2nd half and particularly in the 4th Q, his teams consistently fade in the 2nd half of the season. His ST's are consistently in the bottom quarter of the league. He's fielded the worst Bronco D's in 40 years in 2007 & 2008. His glory days were with teams built by previous regimes - Reeves & Phillips - along with some key players he brought in, of course. Since he's been in charge of building his own team he's done poorly.

I guess he could turn it around, but the level of adoration I see around here is flat out ridiculous. Just laughable. Love is blind, I guess.

MplsBronco
10-21-2008, 08:23 PM
Well, Shanny sure doesn't have much to hang his hat on since 1998. One Div Title, one playoff win. KC and Seattle both won AFC West titles since then, OAK three, SD three. Not an impressive 9 years from Shanny & Co.

His O's consistently fade in the 2nd half and particularly in the 4th Q, his teams consistently fade in the 2nd half of the season. His ST's are consistently in the bottom quarter of the league. He's fielded the worst Bronco D's in 40 years in 2007 & 2008. His glory days were with teams built by previous regimes - Reeves & Phillips - along with some key players he brought in, of course. Since he's been in charge of building his own team he's done poorly.

I guess he could turn it around, but the level of adoration I see around here is flat out ridiculous. Just laughable. Love is blind, I guess.


Well said.

footstepsfrom#27
10-21-2008, 08:35 PM
Well, Shanny sure doesn't have much to hang his hat on since 1998. One Div Title, one playoff win. KC and Seattle both won AFC West titles since then, OAK three, SD three. Not an impressive 9 years from Shanny & Co.

His O's consistently fade in the 2nd half and particularly in the 4th Q, his teams consistently fade in the 2nd half of the season. His ST's are consistently in the bottom quarter of the league. He's fielded the worst Bronco D's in 40 years in 2007 & 2008. His glory days were with teams built by previous regimes - Reeves & Phillips - along with some key players he brought in, of course. Since he's been in charge of building his own team he's done poorly.

I guess he could turn it around, but the level of adoration I see around here is flat out ridiculous. Just laughable. Love is blind, I guess.
He's a victim of his own success. Fans caught up in the Superbowl euphoria include Bowlen...who doesn't seem to mind all this. Shanny knows he's secure so he's unlikely to change what he knows.

HEAV
10-21-2008, 08:35 PM
Well, Shanny sure doesn't have much to hang his hat on since 1998. One Div Title, one playoff win. KC and Seattle both won AFC West titles since then, OAK three, SD three. Not an impressive 9 years from Shanny & Co.

His O's consistently fade in the 2nd half and particularly in the 4th Q, his teams consistently fade in the 2nd half of the season. His ST's are consistently in the bottom quarter of the league. He's fielded the worst Bronco D's in 40 years in 2007 & 2008. His glory days were with teams built by previous regimes - Reeves & Phillips - along with some key players he brought in, of course. Since he's been in charge of building his own team he's done poorly.

I guess he could turn it around, but the level of adoration I see around here is flat out ridiculous. Just laughable. Love is blind, I guess.



It's hard for some to let go of the past. It's like the relationship that is in the skids, but you keep remembering the good ole days and still have a hope that it could be that way again.

HEAV
10-21-2008, 08:44 PM
Decline....that's funny :-* .

Decline:
a: to slope downward : descend
b: to bend down : droop
c: to stoop to what is unworthy

... and yes the last three years the fanchise has been in decline.

Imagine if the Raiders and Chef's weren't in the AFC west the past three years. Where would the Broncos be?




Mike Ditka also is a HOFer to have been fired...twice...

anon
10-21-2008, 08:49 PM
I really like Shanny, but I'm not so sure his sterile, corporate approach to football creates a culture of intensity and urgency which seems to be required to bring out the best in NFL athletes.

I think there are some players who possess and can identify with the type of professionalism Shanahan asks of his players, but I think other players need buttons pushed and Shanahan doesn't seem to be able to properly motivate these types of players. When he tries, it often comes off as a bit sarcastic and condescending. And forget about the type of players who need a bit of nurturing, they're instantly put in the dog house: Shanahan doesn't know how to bring those types of personalities along.

Having said that, he is willing to be more patient with what he considers exceptional talent and tries to be loyal to his coaches and players (see BMarsh, Travis Henry, etc). But again, I think part of that is also his emphasis on process and a "professional" environment -- much like how one is likely to get a few warnings from the HR department before being terminated at a typical corporate job.

Though I think players respect him, I think for some players it may be hard to relate to Shanny. He's not the type of personality to elicit a "We're going to war behind Shanny" response. And I think that is part of the problem we have with consistency, without those intense types in the locker room or overwhelming talent, these Broncos, talented as they are, don't "get up" week in and week out.

The one exception is Raider Week, where I feel like the effort, win or lose, has been pretty consistent during Shanahan's time here. And it's no surprise that it's one of those games where Shanahan is able to create a more dynamic motivational environment -- with the historical rivalry and his old grudge match with the Dark Lord.

Ratboy
10-21-2008, 08:53 PM
There valid points on both sides.

Sometimes a change is good, I really like Shanahan, but I could see him stepping down as head coach after this season if we keep declining.

A new coach means a whole new staff, IMO. If Shanahan goes, so does Dennison, Slowik, O'Brien, etc..

~Crash~
10-21-2008, 08:54 PM
hell Coach needs to let coaches coach instead of being up in a booth .

snowspot66
10-21-2008, 09:09 PM
Trying to pass off his success as somebody else's regime is also ridiculous.

The truth is that we are reaping the rewards of a horrible half decade of FO decisions. It's only showing itself these years because all the remnants and reputation of the Super Bowl years are now gone. We could still get by before.

With the Goodman's in charge and a couple of strong drafts I think we'll be getting out of this soon. We hit the corner last year. This year we're turning around it. But it will be another couple years before we get our legs under us and hit the straightaway. Of course a great draft could accelerate that ala 06 and 08.

Atlas
10-21-2008, 09:32 PM
We are 10 yrs out from the superbowls, this team has crumbled talent wise to its current state, a 6 and 10 team, with brittle veterans and no depth at key positions. Shannahan has lost his touch, at least here in Denver, and the players no longer respond to his leadership.

Its simply time for him to go, although I am sure pat bowlen has a million excuses for him. Think about it, take off your homer glasses and look at whats actually going on at dove valley. His biggest problem is personnel. Do these names mean anything, Ashlie Lelie, George Foster, DJ Williams, Paul Tovesi, Darius Watts, Marcus Nash, Tatum Bell, the list goes on and on, over the last 10 yrs no team has drafted worse than we have, and it shows on our roster. (Especially on Defense), the last couple years have been better and is saving our Offense with marshall, cutler. Paying Gerrard Warren over Trevor Pryce was a huge mistake....

Ed Reed and Steven Jackson could have BOTH been on this roster now!

Free agent wise where do we start, for every good signing we get burned by several others. Dale Carter, Darryl Gardner, now Travis Henry??? Shannahan has sold his soul and taken unnecessary risks on veterans and overpaid mightily, Dre Bly is the next in line to fail. Trading Gerrard Warren was a mistake as well, after Warren had restructured his contract several times, now we have NO run D.

Coaching, ever since kubiak left his offensive playcalling has been atrocious, especially in the redzone, and his coaching staffs have done terrible. How many D coordinators are we going to go through? How many special teams coaches? Time and Time again he gets a free pass on these critical decisions.

Shannahan is still a great coach, but not here, not now, not in Denver anymore, its time for him to go and time for a new voice and a new coaching staff with fresh ideas and fresh motivation!

Wolfy-poo are you jumping off the band wagon so soon? If you are that really doesn't make you be nothing but a bandwagoner. If you wou;d have taken your negative stance into the season you would be able to ralley some peopele, but now people just real;ize that you have no real convictioncs and you are just a bandwagon jumper.

HEAV
10-21-2008, 09:39 PM
Wolfy-poo are you jumping off the band wagon so soon? If you are that really doesn't make you be nothing but a bandwagoner. If you wou;d have taken your negative stance into the season you would be able to ralley some peopele, but now people just real;ize that you have no real convictioncs and you are just a bandwagon jumper.



Ummmm the thread is from 10-04-2007...over a year old.

But Wolf had/has solid points.

It's be a mixed grab bag with Shanny the past 10 years. With the last three being flops.

footstepsfrom#27
10-21-2008, 10:35 PM
Shanahan gets a get out of jail free card because he won 2 Lombardis...but can he win another one? The history of this team suggests he's slipping. Certainly that's true on the defensive side of the ball. The problem is...who do you hire instead? It's all a moot point though as long as he's got Bowlen in his corner. We just have to hope he gets lucky one of these times and finds a DC who can actually coach and the new scouting guys can mind defensive talent as well as they have on the offense.

The Rat's not leaving anytime soon.

Cito Pelon
10-22-2008, 06:42 AM
Trying to pass off his success as somebody else's regime is also ridiculous.

The truth is that we are reaping the rewards of a horrible half decade of FO decisions. It's only showing itself these years because all the remnants and reputation of the Super Bowl years are now gone. We could still get by before.

With the Goodman's in charge and a couple of strong drafts I think we'll be getting out of this soon. We hit the corner last year. This year we're turning around it. But it will be another couple years before we get our legs under us and hit the straightaway. Of course a great draft could accelerate that ala 06 and 08.

First you say passing off his success as someone elses' regime is ridiculous, then you go on to say "The truth is that we are reaping the rewards of a horrible half decade of FO decisions. It's only showing itself these years because all the remnants and reputation of the Super Bowl years are now gone."

So basically you agree that when Shanny had to replace players that he inherited from Reeves & Phillips - Elway, Nalen, Sharpe, Atwater, Braxton, Rod, Zimm, etc. - he failed at it. You're just trying to cover it up. Reeves & Phillips gave Shanny a good core of players to work with, when Shanny tried to build a great team all on his own, he's done poorly.

He could still turn it around I guess, but it's flat out ridiculous to try and make out like Shanny's done a great job from 1999-2008.

TheReverend
10-22-2008, 07:27 AM
First you say passing off his success as someone elses' regime is ridiculous, then you go on to say "The truth is that we are reaping the rewards of a horrible half decade of FO decisions. It's only showing itself these years because all the remnants and reputation of the Super Bowl years are now gone."

So basically you agree that when Shanny had to replace players that he inherited from Reeves & Phillips - Elway, Nalen, Sharpe, Atwater, Braxton, Rod, Zimm, etc. - he failed at it. You're just trying to cover it up. Reeves & Phillips gave Shanny a good core of players to work with, when Shanny tried to build a great team all on his own, he's done poorly.

He could still turn it around I guess, but it's flat out ridiculous to try and make out like Shanny's done a great job from 1999-2008.


The players you've listed he's replaced successfully (aside from Atwater and Nalen long term). They're just young. Patience is required with a young football team.

footstepsfrom#27
10-22-2008, 07:55 AM
The players you've listed he's replaced successfully (aside from Atwater and Nalen long term). They're just young. Patience is required with a young football team.
Shanahan has had 10 years to play without Elway and Davis and he's got one playoff win. That's the true mark of his regime post-Superbowls. He gets a pass on replacing Elway...nobody could do that. But his other decisions...notably his ridiculous merry-go-round of DC's punctuated by the bizzarre mid-season reversal on Jim Bates as the low point...they mark him as a failure since Elway left. There's really no other way to see this that doesn't rely on excuses.

oubronco
10-22-2008, 08:53 AM
some dude over at the post


No excuses Shannaham, you had a chance to improve the defense before October 14th, but nobody can change your mastermind. Now, you say that "the priority is in stopping the run". (so why not hire Nolan to help SLOW-VIC with the defense) and what about the pass without Bailey and weak corners and slow safeties) when your precious QB Cutler can only get and average of 19 points. I hope Cutler doesn't use his hand as an excuse from now on when he passes for more pics. How do you explain this to Bowlen? When is Bowlen's patience is going to run out? You may be the Denver's coach and know a lot about football, but you need to LISTEN to other people's advise. (I always liked you, and realize now, that you are stale and need a change of scenery or find a new venue before your record gets worse...go to Florida to coach) you also must realize that we fans are not dumb, we can can look at things objectively too. In the past you hired has beens, not quality players, except for the trade for Bailey and very few others. Why didn't you give a good offer to Patrick Kerney who went to Seattle and had 12 sacks last year? So...you get what you pay for.

If we lose to Miami then you should definitely resign, and Bowlen can get things rolling for next year with a temporary coach. Forget about getting to the playoffs. Then you will be able to spend all your time supervising the building your 35,000 SQ ft. mansion, which you'll need to review all the tape from your loses. Sorry Coach, but my blood pressure rises, my chest gets tight, I lose sleep, I get sick, I cant concentrate, I get mean and unhappy with people around me when we lose a game. Specially, when we get disrepcted by other teams, like the Patriots for example by that margin...and wait until the following Sunday with great expectations. The loss to the Chiefs was a disgrace, and, we wander who prepares this team to battle, because you continue to lose the war in both fronts, Defense and Offense. So why coach, honestly? It's been almost ten (10) since you won a superbowl. I want to experience another before I die! I'm glad you are not leading our troops in Iraq. Don't think you only get ridiculed? Be a fan and find out! I love my Broncos dude. Get your **** together! http://extras.mnginteractive.com/live/media/site36/2007/1004/20071004_024617_face_blank.gif (http://neighbors.denverpost.com/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=19475)
Mike Montalvo (http://neighbors.denverpost.com/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=19475)
Joined: Dec 3
Points: 470 Permanent link to this comment (http://neighbors.denverpost.com/viewtopic.php?p=543210#p543210)Mike Montalvo (http://neighbors.denverpost.com/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=19475) (aka mikemon1) | 4:25 AM

TonyR
10-22-2008, 09:10 AM
The players you've listed he's replaced successfully (aside from Atwater and Nalen long term). They're just young. Patience is required with a young football team.

You really need to take off the blinders and come out of the cocoon. How much more patience? This FO does not know how to build a football team. They've been given too long already. I used to feel the way you do but I've since woken up. It's not going to happen. This team does not have the talent or coaching to compete at a playoff level in this league and it's going to take a lot of drafts and a lot of luck to get there. And this FO has no track record indicating an ability to draft well enough to build a team, and no track record to do well in FA for that matter. Just look at this last offseason's FA!

HAT
11-02-2008, 08:23 PM
*sigh*

Over the last 5 games:

1-4 against teams that are 15-20 (when not playing us) and averaging just a tick over 15 PPG......Yeah, it's all the defenses fault.

HAT
12-30-2008, 10:17 PM
Yeah 13 starters suffer injuries. This team is decimated and you still put the blame on Shanny. There are some stupid ass fans on this site.

I agree wholeheartedly with the last sentence of this post.

McMastermind
09-20-2009, 06:57 PM
Please come back Mike....And bring Slowik with you!!!!!

rastaman
09-20-2009, 08:38 PM
Please come back Mike....And bring Slowik with you!!!!!

Take Shanny back, keep Cutler and hire Mike Nolan as DC.
CHAMPIONSHIP!:pimp:

wolf754life
09-20-2009, 08:42 PM
it was time, today we hit, today we cover, today we make people beat us, and they will........

but they will have to beat us, we WON"T beat ourselves................

goodbye ratahan.

Bronx33
09-20-2009, 08:46 PM
Take Shanny back, keep Cutler and hire Mike Nolan as DC.
CHAMPIONSHIP!:pimp:

That might have happend if mike didn't love slowick so much..

TheReverend
09-21-2009, 04:15 PM
it was time, today we hit, today we cover, today we make people beat us, and they will........

but they will have to beat us, we WON"T beat ourselves................

goodbye ratahan.

Soooooo...

you ever go and get that colonic you were asking about?

Hilarious!Hilarious!Hilarious!Hilarious!

HAT
10-20-2009, 12:43 AM
we are 10 yrs out from the superbowls, this team has crumbled talent wise to its current state, a 6 and 10 team, with brittle veterans and no depth at key positions. Shannahan has lost his touch, at least here in denver, and the players no longer respond to his leadership.

Its simply time for him to go, although i am sure pat bowlen has a million excuses for him. Think about it, take off your homer glasses and look at whats actually going on at dove valley. His biggest problem is personnel. Do these names mean anything, ashlie lelie, george foster, dj williams, paul tovesi, darius watts, marcus nash, tatum bell, the list goes on and on, over the last 10 yrs no team has drafted worse than we have, and it shows on our roster. (especially on defense), the last couple years have been better and is saving our offense with marshall, cutler. Paying gerrard warren over trevor pryce was a huge mistake....

Ed reed and steven jackson could have both been on this roster now!

Free agent wise where do we start, for every good signing we get burned by several others. Dale carter, darryl gardner, now travis henry??? Shannahan has sold his soul and taken unnecessary risks on veterans and overpaid mightily, dre bly is the next in line to fail. Trading gerrard warren was a mistake as well, after warren had restructured his contract several times, now we have no run d.

Coaching, ever since kubiak left his offensive playcalling has been atrocious, especially in the redzone, and his coaching staffs have done terrible. How many d coordinators are we going to go through? How many special teams coaches? Time and time again he gets a free pass on these critical decisions.

Shannahan is still a great coach, but not here, not now, not in denver anymore, its time for him to go and time for a new voice and a new coaching staff with fresh ideas and fresh motivation!

rep?

watermock
10-20-2009, 12:51 AM
*gulp*

HAT
10-20-2009, 12:54 AM
*gulp*

I'm happy you are finally coming around brother Mock.....McBeavis will take us to the promised land.

wolf754life
10-20-2009, 12:57 AM
change is sometimes a necessary element for the survival of an entity..........

i didn't think success would come this quickly or dramatically..........

but i knew the effort, the heart, the desire and the WILL to win would be there right from the very start.

congrats to pat bowlen and joe ellis, the entire team and josh mcdaniels............

we have fire and passion and mile high thunder back in our stadium on sundays.

azbroncfan
10-20-2009, 12:57 AM
*gulp*

**** you you stupid drunk prick. Go eat your peanut butter and root for the vikings. We don't want trash like you in Denver.

broncocalijohn
10-20-2009, 01:55 AM
**** you you stupid drunk prick. Go eat your peanut butter and root for the vikings. We don't want trash like you in Denver.

I think he was agreeing with change is good. We might have Watermock coming around on McDaniels. I cant see him fighting it any longer. Why jump on him in this fashion? If I recall, you did start a thread about how bad our defense still is based on preseason. Ease up.

broncocalijohn
10-20-2009, 01:57 AM
wolf, while we did give you a ton of crap on Shanny, I think many started to be ok with change based on what we heard on his GM duties and the fact that he wouldnt cut from Slowick. I will give you props on sticking with something that was unfashionable and unfavorable to many. Now that we know the facts, you were correct. But i did get hungry a ton of times as your threads were being foodjacked. I also took you off of iggy once we canned mike.

OBF1
10-20-2009, 03:03 AM
I was onboard with Wolf about dumping shanny a few years back. At this point all I can do is thank Mike for getting John and TD together for those 2 magical seasons. It was well past time for him to leave and start over again. Lets give McDaniels the same level of respect that we all gave Shanahan.

Taco John
10-20-2009, 03:14 AM
I was onboard with Wolf about dumping shanny a few years back. At this point all I can do is thank Mike for getting John and TD together for those 2 magical seasons. It was well past time for him to leave and start over again. Lets give McDaniels the same level of respect that we all gave Shanahan.


Word up.

If we're going anywhere right now, we're going there with McDaniels.

desertbronco
10-20-2009, 04:17 AM
Word up x2. Thought we were a dead ship going into this season, though I have been crying for Shanny's head since before the miracle Plummer AFC title game season. I realize I seem like a pussy reactionist fan, but those who know me can tell you that I was calling for a change as early as the first Colts debacle. Things have a time and place, but I admit I was wrong in not seeing how fast McDaniels has changed the basic culture of the team. This is now a hard-playing, hard-hitting team that plays every down hard. Kudos to the new man in charge, we may not win every game (though we have so far) but you have made me think that we have a chance!

broncocalijohn
10-20-2009, 11:05 AM
Word up x2. Thought we were a dead ship going into this season, though I have been crying for Shanny's head since before the miracle Plummer AFC title game season. I realize I seem like a p***Y reactionist fan, but those who know me can tell you that I was calling for a change as early as the first Colts debacle. Things have a time and place, but I admit I was wrong in not seeing how fast McDaniels has changed the basic culture of the team. This is now a hard-playing, hard-hitting team that plays every down hard. Kudos to the new man in charge, we may not win every game (though we have so far) but you have made me think that we have a chance!

THose that know you? You have 18 posts in 4 years. I didnt even know you exist! And dont try to tell me it was people outside of the Mane. There is no broncos life outside of the mane.

azbroncfan
10-20-2009, 11:27 AM
Never thought I would say it but this team is so much better coached than the Shanny teams of the past few years it isn't even funny. Shanny had gone stale and needed a break from football to get his drive back.

gtown
10-20-2009, 11:35 AM
McD has put Shanahan in a corner. Evidence:

1. Half-time adjustments
2. Tailored game plans based on each opponent's strengths and weaknesses
3. QB tutelage
4. Motivation (players genuinely want to play for him)
5. Understands the importance of veteran and vocal leadership (Dawk, Holliday, etc)
6. No pansy training - Practice with pads on, practice in bad weather
7. Situational football - the team just seems to excel when the game is on the line
8. Statistics - understands the correlation between turnover differential and won-loss
9. Stretching!!
10. Ability to pick D-Coordinators
11. This list could go on and on.....

The only thing I wish McD would do would be scripting the first 15 plays.

ZONA
10-20-2009, 11:40 AM
Never thought I would say it but this team is so much better coached than the Shanny teams of the past few years it isn't even funny. Shanny had gone stale and needed a break from football to get his drive back.

And there is no guarantee he will get it back. You like to think so but he wouldn't be the first great coach to win a superbowl who couldn't get it back (Holmgren, Johnson, Gruden, Parcels, Billick, etc..) I know the right thing to do is to wish him success down the road but I can't do that, unless he coaches for an NFC team. If he finds another job in the AFC, I hope he fails.

lazarus4444
10-20-2009, 12:03 PM
I just want him to get a job next year so we don't have to pay his ass.

broncocalijohn
10-20-2009, 12:06 PM
I just want him to get a job next year so we don't have to pay his ass.

why? You getting some rebate check from Bowlen?

Broncomutt
10-20-2009, 12:23 PM
Wolf and Telluride were prophets.

TonyR
10-20-2009, 12:48 PM
8. Statistics - understands the correlation between turnover differential and won-loss


I'll only defend Shanny on this one particular point. He always talked about the importance of turnovers, so he understood, but unfortunately for him (and us) had defenses the past few years that couldn't create any!

wolf754life
10-20-2009, 12:58 PM
Wolf and Telluride were prophets.

amen brother, the Jesuit priests have spoken...........

whats done is done

this team has its soul back!

HEAV
10-20-2009, 01:04 PM
I'll only defend Shanny on this one particular point. He always talked about the importance of turnovers, so he understood, but unfortunately for him (and us) had defenses the past few years that couldn't create any!

talked Shanny did alot of talking over the past 3 years. Josh is a coach where Shanny became a administer. Telling other coaches to fix and find answers.

Josh gets in the meetings,film and works on the field with the players.

HAT
10-10-2010, 12:29 AM
Wolfy-poo are you jumping off the band wagon so soon? If you are that really doesn't make you be nothing but a bandwagoner. If you wou;d have taken your negative stance into the season you would be able to ralley some peopele, but now people just real;ize that you have no real convictioncs and you are just a bandwagon jumper.

Atly-poo...This is my favorite post ever by you. Happy early B-day.

Cito Pelon
10-10-2010, 12:53 AM
Classic bump.

I stand by what I said above on this thread, and I'm wondering what happened to Bronx33?

HAT
10-10-2010, 01:13 AM
Classic bump.

I stand by what I said above on this thread, and I'm wondering what happened to Bronx33?

I blame baja for making me think of this thread..:wave:

In all seriousness...I wasn't trying to be a dick but looking back, it's pretty damn funny to see Atlas of all people play the BW card.

GO BRONCOS!

Archer81
10-10-2010, 01:21 AM
Crazy how much things change.



:Broncos:

_Oro_
10-10-2010, 08:45 AM
Yeah Baja's thread made me think of Wolf too. What happened to that guy? All he did was come on here and bash Shanny, then when Shanny finally got canned he disappeared.

Tombstone RJ
10-10-2010, 09:06 AM
Yeah Baja's thread made me think of Wolf too. What happened to that guy? All he did was come on here and bash Shanny, then when Shanny finally got canned he disappeared.

he's a pretty consistent poster, he's around...

Rock Chalk
10-10-2010, 09:09 AM
he's a pretty consistent poster, he's around...

He's actually not completely unbearable now that Shanahan is gone either. IN fact, I had forgotten that he was the douchenozzle that screamed for Shanny's firing for like a bazillion years.

Tombstone RJ
10-10-2010, 09:25 AM
He's actually not completely unbearable now that Shanahan is gone either. IN fact, I had forgotten that he was the douchenozzle that screamed for Shanny's firing for like a bazillion years.

check out my tag line, you cheeky bastard...