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24champ
09-25-2007, 02:24 AM
OAKLAND, Calif. – As the San Diego Chargers' presumptive season of triumph unravels like Ryan Leaf under a heckler's spell, it's time to pose a serious question.

Which is more radical – firing a coach after a 14-2 season, or firing one who's 1-2?

I'm not suggesting that Chargers general manager A.J. Smith will relieve Norv Turner of his responsibilities following San Diego's embarrassing 31-24 defeat to the Packers in Green Bay on Sunday. To do so would be to call Smith's own professional credibility into question.

But make no mistake – San Diego's swift fall from the ranks of the NFL's elite is an impending disaster that needs to be dealt with, and soon. And unfortunately for the Chargers and their fans, the coach most qualified to do so is not the man who'll be wearing the headset on San Diego's sideline come Sunday, but the guy whom Smith pushed out last February.

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As Smith promised, Turner is no Marty Schottenheimer, a coach the headstrong general manager detested for his conservative tendencies, corny sayings and propensity for making dubious decisions in playoff games. But Schottenheimer, who last season coached the Chargers to the league's best record before they all but handed a divisional-round playoff victory to the New England Patriots, did serve one vital function in Smith's universe: He was the quintessential scapegoat.

Anytime anything went wrong during Schottenheimer's five-year tenure in San Diego, and even when things didn't go right enough for Smith's liking, the personnel man-turned-GM could blame the coach and Schottenheimer's trademark "Martyball" for the Chargers' failings.

But as Smith flew home from Green Bay on Sunday evening – as when he and the Chargers made their middle-of-the-night escape from New England last Monday morning – he saw the current culprit staring back at him through the reflection in his first-class-cabin window.

In retrospect, was Martyball really so bad? As anyone who has watched San Diego closely knows, A.J.-ball has been even more unsightly. For the Chargers, the future's so dark, they've got to wear headlamps.

All across the NFL, talent evaluators and coaches are appalled at the way San Diego has looked so flat, unprepared and disorganized under Turner. On Sunday at McAfee Coliseum, where Turner flailed as the Raiders' head coach from 2004-05, players and front-office executives talked expansively about his shortcomings and expressed skepticism that he can motivate a Chargers team that played so passionately under Schottenheimer.

"That team is a mess, and you know the players are wondering what the hell is going on," one NFL veteran who played for Turner in Oakland told me Sunday night. "They're looking to Norv for answers and leadership, and they won't get it. Marty had them on edge, ready to play, and they responded to that. And now this? They're a great team but it's not working, and it's not gonna work."

Sure, it's early, and the Chargers theoretically are a talented enough group to shake off their sketchy start and emerge once again as title contenders. But anyone who thinks this is a minor detour on the way to Glendale, Ariz. is either delusional or a white-haired man with the initials "A.J.S." monogrammed onto his dress shirts.

When LaDainian Tomlinson stares blankly ahead and proclaims that his team is "lost," as the star halfback did during his postgame media conference Sunday, you can bet that he and his teammates privately are questioning the direction of the franchise. How can they not, given that they returned virtually everyone from last year's team that ripped up the league?

It isn't hard to deduce what has changed – Schottenheimer's emotional and relentless leadership style has been replaced by Turner's nervous, detached stewardship. That seemed like a plausible trade if you believed Smith's propaganda: that he'd assembled such a talented team in San Diego it could practically run itself, that a skilled play-caller who stayed out of the way was the ideal choice to coach this star-studded ensemble.

I spent several minutes alone with Tomlinson after the Chargers' 38-14 defeat to the Patriots, and I've seldom seen a superstar so bewildered and deflated after a regular-season game. That LT got into an animated verbal exchange Sunday with Philip Rivers after the quarterback ignored him on a third-down play in the third quarter (instead forcing an incomplete pass to tight end Antonio Gates) is another sign that the pressure is starting to get to the team's most important players.

How did things get so toxic? It started when Chargers owner Dean Spanos, despite what he later would term a "dysfunctional" relationship between Smith and Schottenheimer, stayed flaccid after the playoff defeat, watching helplessly for nearly a month as coordinators Cam Cameron and Wade Phillips got head coaching jobs in Miami and Dallas, respectively. Finally – after Schottenheimer asked to hire his brother, Kurt, as the new defensive coordinator – Spanos fired him and essentially appointed Smith, an accomplished talent evaluator with questionable people skills, as the undisputed king.

Smith's immediate reaction was to consolidate his power. He brought in Ted Cottrell, whom he knew from his days as a Buffalo Bills assistant scouting director, as the defensive coordinator. His prime criteria in hiring Turner, he of the 59-82-1 career record as a head coach, seemed to be, "Obeys Orders And Recognizes My Ultimate Authority."

Smooth move, A.J.

Because Turner is an accomplished offensive coordinator who has a knack for play-calling, Smith, like others before him, got lured into believing Turner could work the same magic as a head coach. This just in: He can't. And some of us have been saying so for a long time.

Talk to Turner's former players, and this is what they'll tell you: Give the man one job, and he'll do that job well. But give him a big job with multiple responsibilities, and he gets anxious and scattered and has a hard time doing any one thing capably.

That's what we're seeing with San Diego's once-mighty offensive attack so far in 2007. The Chargers have been strangely unable to terrorize defenses with Tomlinson's multifaceted talents, and Turner has shown a penchant for disjointed, conservative play calls at key times. This was true on Sunday when San Diego, leading 21-17, had a chance to put away the Packers but seemed to be playing not to lose while failing to produce a key first down. The Chargers were flat-out brutal in the red zone during their season-opening 14-3 victory over the Chicago Bears and were beyond atrocious against the Patriots.

Under Schottenheimer, this team had an obvious offensive mission statement, enunciated by a line that blew teams off the ball and a halfback who worked in tandem by wearing down deflated defenses. So far, San Diego's identity under Turner is that it doesn't have one.

Defensively, the team has struggled with the transition from the ultra-aggressive Phillips to the tamer Cottrell, though injuries on the defensive line have played a role. Most glaring, the secondary has been shredded on numerous occasions, often because the Chargers haven't been where they're supposed to be. That's coaching, pure and simple.

Coverage breakdowns led to Randy Moss running wide open for a touchdown in the Patriots game and other easy completions by Tom Brady. On Sunday, the Packers' winning points came when Brett Favre threw a sweet slant to Greg Jennings on which cornerback Antonio Cromartie was overly aggressive and strong safety Clinton Hart was caught flat-footed and out of position. Jennings caught the pass in stride and raced to a 57-yard touchdown.

The play evoked memories of Troy Aikman's game-clinching pass to Alvin Harper against the 49ers in the '92 NFC championship game, back when Turner was Dallas' boy-wonder offensive coordinator, and before he and the rest of Jimmy Johnson's high-profile assistants (Dave Wannstedt, whose Pitt Panthers lost to Connecticut on Saturday; Dave Campo; Butch Davis) proved largely ineffective once they got a chance to be in charge, most glaringly in the pros.

Beyond strategic concerns there is the motivation issue, one highlighted after the Patriots game when Gates, an All-Pro performer, said San Diego had come out "flat" for its nationally televised showdown with the team that ended its '06 season. Yeah, guys, why get up for that one when that big tilt at Lambeau was looming?

Even Turner's former players who speak highly of him concede that getting the locker room revved up is not his forte.

"I think Norv's a good coach, a good play-caller who had a tough situation from the jump, because that team lost both its coordinators," Raiders wideout Ronald Curry said after Sunday's game. "He can be a little passive at times, but everybody's got a different approach."

Another former Raiders wideout – a guy named Jerry Rice, who before his emergence as a reality-TV dancing star earned some notoriety as the greatest receiver of all time – was even more pointed in an interview last week on Fox Sports Radio. Pulling the Chargers out of their funk, Rice told hosts Andrew Siciliano and Krystal Fernandez, is "going to be up to their head coach. I don't know if Norv Turner can do that because I've played under him, and I don't know if he's going to be able to motivate that team that way."

In fairness, what does Jerry Rice really know about motivation? Oh, wait, that's right: everything.

So how does San Diego fight its way out of this jam? Well, for starters, the people in charge of the franchise need to stop pretending a problem doesn't exist, and to come up with a bold solution to address it.

Is it so outrageous to think that cutting their losses by firing Turner now – and replacing him with inside linebackers coach Ron Rivera, who interviewed for several head coaching jobs (including San Diego's) after his strong showing as the Bears' defensive coordinator the previous three seasons, could save the Chargers' season?

Perhaps, but is that any more outlandish than getting rid of a coach with a 200-126-1 career regular-season record who was coming off a 14-2 campaign and had the unqualified support of Tomlinson, the league MVP and most important presence in the locker room?

Personally, I don't think so. The Chargers' window of opportunity, once perceived to be vast, is closing up like LT's running lanes, and desperate times call for desperate measures. Here's one that Spanos could implement: fire Turner and Cottrell – and Smith, the man responsible for their presence – and bring back Schottenheimer, today, to try to restore the winning edge the coach worked so hard to instill.

Yeah, I know, it sounds kind of crazy. But if you look at the whole picture, the status quo is even crazier.

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news;_ylt=Atz4kIg8qVqsJQqAevAubKJDubYF?slug=ms-morningrush092407&prov=yhoo&type=lgns

maven
09-25-2007, 02:32 AM
/end thread.

Xenos
09-25-2007, 02:42 AM
OAKLAND, Calif. – As the San Diego Chargers' presumptive season of triumph unravels like Ryan Leaf under a heckler's spell, it's time to pose a serious question.

Which is more radical – firing a coach after a 14-2 season, or firing one who's 1-2?

I'm not suggesting that Chargers general manager A.J. Smith will relieve Norv Turner of his responsibilities following San Diego's embarrassing 31-24 defeat to the Packers in Green Bay on Sunday. To do so would be to call Smith's own professional credibility into question.

But make no mistake – San Diego's swift fall from the ranks of the NFL's elite is an impending disaster that needs to be dealt with, and soon. And unfortunately for the Chargers and their fans, the coach most qualified to do so is not the man who'll be wearing the headset on San Diego's sideline come Sunday, but the guy whom Smith pushed out last February.

ADVERTISEMENT
As Smith promised, Turner is no Marty Schottenheimer, a coach the headstrong general manager detested for his conservative tendencies, corny sayings and propensity for making dubious decisions in playoff games. But Schottenheimer, who last season coached the Chargers to the league's best record before they all but handed a divisional-round playoff victory to the New England Patriots, did serve one vital function in Smith's universe: He was the quintessential scapegoat.

Anytime anything went wrong during Schottenheimer's five-year tenure in San Diego, and even when things didn't go right enough for Smith's liking, the personnel man-turned-GM could blame the coach and Schottenheimer's trademark "Martyball" for the Chargers' failings.

But as Smith flew home from Green Bay on Sunday evening – as when he and the Chargers made their middle-of-the-night escape from New England last Monday morning – he saw the current culprit staring back at him through the reflection in his first-class-cabin window.

In retrospect, was Martyball really so bad? As anyone who has watched San Diego closely knows, A.J.-ball has been even more unsightly. For the Chargers, the future's so dark, they've got to wear headlamps.

All across the NFL, talent evaluators and coaches are appalled at the way San Diego has looked so flat, unprepared and disorganized under Turner. On Sunday at McAfee Coliseum, where Turner flailed as the Raiders' head coach from 2004-05, players and front-office executives talked expansively about his shortcomings and expressed skepticism that he can motivate a Chargers team that played so passionately under Schottenheimer.

"That team is a mess, and you know the players are wondering what the hell is going on," one NFL veteran who played for Turner in Oakland told me Sunday night. "They're looking to Norv for answers and leadership, and they won't get it. Marty had them on edge, ready to play, and they responded to that. And now this? They're a great team but it's not working, and it's not gonna work."

Sure, it's early, and the Chargers theoretically are a talented enough group to shake off their sketchy start and emerge once again as title contenders. But anyone who thinks this is a minor detour on the way to Glendale, Ariz. is either delusional or a white-haired man with the initials "A.J.S." monogrammed onto his dress shirts.

When LaDainian Tomlinson stares blankly ahead and proclaims that his team is "lost," as the star halfback did during his postgame media conference Sunday, you can bet that he and his teammates privately are questioning the direction of the franchise. How can they not, given that they returned virtually everyone from last year's team that ripped up the league?

It isn't hard to deduce what has changed – Schottenheimer's emotional and relentless leadership style has been replaced by Turner's nervous, detached stewardship. That seemed like a plausible trade if you believed Smith's propaganda: that he'd assembled such a talented team in San Diego it could practically run itself, that a skilled play-caller who stayed out of the way was the ideal choice to coach this star-studded ensemble.

I spent several minutes alone with Tomlinson after the Chargers' 38-14 defeat to the Patriots, and I've seldom seen a superstar so bewildered and deflated after a regular-season game. That LT got into an animated verbal exchange Sunday with Philip Rivers after the quarterback ignored him on a third-down play in the third quarter (instead forcing an incomplete pass to tight end Antonio Gates) is another sign that the pressure is starting to get to the team's most important players.

How did things get so toxic? It started when Chargers owner Dean Spanos, despite what he later would term a "dysfunctional" relationship between Smith and Schottenheimer, stayed flaccid after the playoff defeat, watching helplessly for nearly a month as coordinators Cam Cameron and Wade Phillips got head coaching jobs in Miami and Dallas, respectively. Finally – after Schottenheimer asked to hire his brother, Kurt, as the new defensive coordinator – Spanos fired him and essentially appointed Smith, an accomplished talent evaluator with questionable people skills, as the undisputed king.

Smith's immediate reaction was to consolidate his power. He brought in Ted Cottrell, whom he knew from his days as a Buffalo Bills assistant scouting director, as the defensive coordinator. His prime criteria in hiring Turner, he of the 59-82-1 career record as a head coach, seemed to be, "Obeys Orders And Recognizes My Ultimate Authority."

Smooth move, A.J.

Because Turner is an accomplished offensive coordinator who has a knack for play-calling, Smith, like others before him, got lured into believing Turner could work the same magic as a head coach. This just in: He can't. And some of us have been saying so for a long time.

Talk to Turner's former players, and this is what they'll tell you: Give the man one job, and he'll do that job well. But give him a big job with multiple responsibilities, and he gets anxious and scattered and has a hard time doing any one thing capably.

That's what we're seeing with San Diego's once-mighty offensive attack so far in 2007. The Chargers have been strangely unable to terrorize defenses with Tomlinson's multifaceted talents, and Turner has shown a penchant for disjointed, conservative play calls at key times. This was true on Sunday when San Diego, leading 21-17, had a chance to put away the Packers but seemed to be playing not to lose while failing to produce a key first down. The Chargers were flat-out brutal in the red zone during their season-opening 14-3 victory over the Chicago Bears and were beyond atrocious against the Patriots.

Under Schottenheimer, this team had an obvious offensive mission statement, enunciated by a line that blew teams off the ball and a halfback who worked in tandem by wearing down deflated defenses. So far, San Diego's identity under Turner is that it doesn't have one.

Defensively, the team has struggled with the transition from the ultra-aggressive Phillips to the tamer Cottrell, though injuries on the defensive line have played a role. Most glaring, the secondary has been shredded on numerous occasions, often because the Chargers haven't been where they're supposed to be. That's coaching, pure and simple.

Coverage breakdowns led to Randy Moss running wide open for a touchdown in the Patriots game and other easy completions by Tom Brady. On Sunday, the Packers' winning points came when Brett Favre threw a sweet slant to Greg Jennings on which cornerback Antonio Cromartie was overly aggressive and strong safety Clinton Hart was caught flat-footed and out of position. Jennings caught the pass in stride and raced to a 57-yard touchdown.

The play evoked memories of Troy Aikman's game-clinching pass to Alvin Harper against the 49ers in the '92 NFC championship game, back when Turner was Dallas' boy-wonder offensive coordinator, and before he and the rest of Jimmy Johnson's high-profile assistants (Dave Wannstedt, whose Pitt Panthers lost to Connecticut on Saturday; Dave Campo; Butch Davis) proved largely ineffective once they got a chance to be in charge, most glaringly in the pros.

Beyond strategic concerns there is the motivation issue, one highlighted after the Patriots game when Gates, an All-Pro performer, said San Diego had come out "flat" for its nationally televised showdown with the team that ended its '06 season. Yeah, guys, why get up for that one when that big tilt at Lambeau was looming?

Even Turner's former players who speak highly of him concede that getting the locker room revved up is not his forte.

"I think Norv's a good coach, a good play-caller who had a tough situation from the jump, because that team lost both its coordinators," Raiders wideout Ronald Curry said after Sunday's game. "He can be a little passive at times, but everybody's got a different approach."

Another former Raiders wideout – a guy named Jerry Rice, who before his emergence as a reality-TV dancing star earned some notoriety as the greatest receiver of all time – was even more pointed in an interview last week on Fox Sports Radio. Pulling the Chargers out of their funk, Rice told hosts Andrew Siciliano and Krystal Fernandez, is "going to be up to their head coach. I don't know if Norv Turner can do that because I've played under him, and I don't know if he's going to be able to motivate that team that way."

In fairness, what does Jerry Rice really know about motivation? Oh, wait, that's right: everything.

So how does San Diego fight its way out of this jam? Well, for starters, the people in charge of the franchise need to stop pretending a problem doesn't exist, and to come up with a bold solution to address it.

Is it so outrageous to think that cutting their losses by firing Turner now – and replacing him with inside linebackers coach Ron Rivera, who interviewed for several head coaching jobs (including San Diego's) after his strong showing as the Bears' defensive coordinator the previous three seasons, could save the Chargers' season?

Perhaps, but is that any more outlandish than getting rid of a coach with a 200-126-1 career regular-season record who was coming off a 14-2 campaign and had the unqualified support of Tomlinson, the league MVP and most important presence in the locker room?

Personally, I don't think so. The Chargers' window of opportunity, once perceived to be vast, is closing up like LT's running lanes, and desperate times call for desperate measures. Here's one that Spanos could implement: fire Turner and Cottrell – and Smith, the man responsible for their presence – and bring back Schottenheimer, today, to try to restore the winning edge the coach worked so hard to instill.
Yeah, I know, it sounds kind of crazy. But if you look at the whole picture, the status quo is even crazier.

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news;_ylt=Atz4kIg8qVqsJQqAevAubKJDubYF?slug=ms-morningrush092407&prov=yhoo&type=lgns

God I hope not. What Norv did on Sunday against the Packers was exactly what Marty has always done in close games and against good opponents.
Really, Dean should have just fired Marty right after the playoff game. It would have saved everyone a lot of misery.

boltaneer
09-25-2007, 02:48 AM
It's funny about all the "they shouldn't have fired Marty" talk going on in the media now, especially when most of those guys were the ones calling for his head after the playoff loss last season. Gotta love the hypocrites in the media.

But I liked Marty. He did a GREAT job rebuilding this team from the horrible state it was in. And I was really disappointed to see him go but I understand that a change needed to happen to take that next step. If he couldn't do anything with the situation and team he had last year, when is he ever going to win the big one?

Norv doesn't seem to be the answer but I'm willing to be patient and see if he can turn things around. The offense is starting to look much better. The defense is what is killing them.

Atlas
09-25-2007, 02:51 AM
That is a great article.

That would be totally crazy if Spanos fired Turner and Smith and brought back Marty....... but that would be a great move for the Chargers.

Atlas
09-25-2007, 02:52 AM
God I hope not. What Norv did on Sunday against the Packers was exactly what Marty has always done in close games and against good opponents.


Yeah, except more times than not Marty won those games.

24champ
09-25-2007, 02:52 AM
God I hope not. What Norv did on Sunday against the Packers was exactly what Marty has always done in close games and against good opponents.
Really, Dean should have just fired Marty right after the playoff game. It would have saved everyone a lot of misery.

Is the heat on AJ Smith in San Diego Xenos?

SteveTensi13
09-25-2007, 02:58 AM
I'm in the camp, if there is one, that the Bolts will turn things around. They have too much talent to be playing like this despite Norv Turner. Of course, I thought Bush's second term would be better than his first and look how that turned out!!

boltaneer
09-25-2007, 03:00 AM
Is the heat on AJ Smith in San Diego Xenos?

The national media seems to be running with that angle but I haven't really heard of any talk like that here.... yet. Guys on Charger message boards are pissed at AJ but they're not ready to run him out of town.

If the Chargers keep losing I imagine that kind of talk will start up but honestly, fans realize how valuable AJ Smith is to the Chargers. There will be heat on AJ if that happens but it would not be wise at all to get rid of the man who built this team over one mistake.

Blueflame
09-25-2007, 03:16 AM
All I know is that there is no way I'd ever want Norv Turner to become the Broncos' HC....he's a very good OC, but he has essentially failed every time someone promoted him to HC.

Merlin
09-25-2007, 07:57 AM
I'm in the camp, if there is one, that the Bolts will turn things around. They have too much talent to be playing like this despite Norv Turner. Of course, I thought Bush's second term would be better than his first and look how that turned out!!
LOL ROFL!

I few of us saw this coming before the season even begun (and before Bush got re-elected :D). Norv is at best a mediocre HC, and any GM that would give him a team as talented as SD to run she be either fired or placed on a VERY strong leash. SD's performance is no accident, and those who patiently are waiting for things to turn around are blissfully ignorant. They should be immobilized by despair and begging God for any help out of this spiraling downfall.

I must say though, the view from here is immaculate...thanks! :)

socalorado
09-25-2007, 08:54 AM
It's funny about all the "they shouldn't have fired Marty" talk going on in the media now, especially when most of those guys were the ones calling for his head after the playoff loss last season. Gotta love the hypocrites in the media.

But I liked Marty. He did a GREAT job rebuilding this team from the horrible state it was in. And I was really disappointed to see him go but I understand that a change needed to happen to take that next step. If he couldn't do anything with the situation and team he had last year, when is he ever going to win the big one?

Norv doesn't seem to be the answer but I'm willing to be patient and see if he can turn things around. The offense is starting to look much better. The defense is what is killing them.

The one weird saving move that has sort of gone unoticed was that Ron Rivera was hired as the LB coach. I always thought that was a "below his ability" job for him. Wasnt he the defensive coordinator in CHI?
Hes the one i DONT want to be given the HC. I think that guy could turn that team around in a heartbeat if given the chance. I mean the team has the weapons, but there is NO veteran leadership whatsoever. And NO, the FB is not a leader.
Its almost like Rivera was brought in to sort of be Smith's secret safety valve if the "Mr Roper" thing doesnt work out, ya know?

maher_tyler
09-25-2007, 08:56 AM
It's funny about all the "they shouldn't have fired Marty" talk going on in the media now, especially when most of those guys were the ones calling for his head after the playoff loss last season. Gotta love the hypocrites in the media.

But I liked Marty. He did a GREAT job rebuilding this team from the horrible state it was in. And I was really disappointed to see him go but I understand that a change needed to happen to take that next step. If he couldn't do anything with the situation and team he had last year, when is he ever going to win the big one?

Norv doesn't seem to be the answer but I'm willing to be patient and see if he can turn things around. The offense is starting to look much better. The defense is what is killing them.

They should have kept him around for 1 more year and see what happened, just imo!!

Xenos
09-25-2007, 12:19 PM
They should have kept him around for 1 more year and see what happened, just imo!!

Last year's sucess happened because he was largely dependant on the coordinators. It's not that he wasn't a good game day coach, it was that he was nonexistent during gameday. In fact, it was only after the Baltimore loss, and a small mini riot led by McCardell, that Marty left total control to Cam.
I'm pretty sure if they had fired him right away, then Wade Phillips would have been hired instead.

But it's useless for us to complain right now. It's still only the third game and they could turn it around. Because we're not going to get rid of them if they continue to do badly until the season is over.

Atwater His Ass
09-25-2007, 12:32 PM
Anyone who isn't a Charger's homer was saying it before the season. How can you lose a HC, OC, and DC from a 14-2 team, and NOT feel that impact? This isn't a surprise.

I love how the media one hand will give so much credit to a good coaching staff and what it means to a team, but on the other hand when SD loses every meaningful coach in 1 off-season they don't think they'll miss a beat. Foolish.

Paladin
09-25-2007, 12:37 PM
They cannot let Norv go!!! We need him!!! He is important to the continued success of the team......


I mean the success of the Broncos, of course......

400HZ
09-25-2007, 04:30 PM
Dumping Marty was the right move, but hiring Norv Turner was not. Marty is getting too much credit right now from the national media.

Norv and Cottrell are bad, but would Marty and Kurt Schottenheimer be any better? I don't think so. Spanos should have moved faster and promoted Wade, then promoted Greg Manusky, and then made some type of move for an offensive coordinator. It still wouldn't be as good as the Marty-Cam-Wade trio, but it would have been better than seeing labia-neck studder about improvements he saw after getting beat down two weeks in a row.

boltaneer
09-25-2007, 05:37 PM
Dumping Marty was the right move, but hiring Norv Turner was not. Marty is getting too much credit right now from the national media.

Norv and Cottrell are bad, but would Marty and Kurt Schottenheimer be any better? I don't think so. Spanos should have moved faster and promoted Wade, then promoted Greg Manusky, and then made some type of move for an offensive coordinator. It still wouldn't be as good as the Marty-Cam-Wade trio, but it would have been better than seeing labia-neck studder about improvements he saw after getting beat down two weeks in a row.

I completely agree that Marty had to go. Like I said earlier, I like Marty but how many chances does he need to finally win a big game?

But the thing about this whole situation is that there really weren't any good choices out there, even before Marty got fired. I'm glad they didn't go with Cameron because I just had a feeling he wouldn't cut it as a head coach. He's dealing with a lack of talent right now in Miami but they just look flat out terrible. Lots of people keep throwing Wade's name in the mix and though he's looking good in Dallas, the dude is no better than Marty and can't win a playoff game.

Next year isn't going to be any better as far as veteran head coaches go. Cowher and Parcells won't come to San Diego. Fisher was a good possibility but the Titans finally woke up and gave him an extension. I don't see any coaches who look to be on the hot seat as good fits here (Gruden, Del Rio, Coughlin, Fox?) Is Romeo Crennel on the hot seat? He could be an interesting possiblity even though he hasn't done jack in Cleveland. I still think Martz would be a good choice but for some reason he was never on San Diego's radar.

If Norv flops, I think it's time to just go with new blood.

24champ
09-25-2007, 05:45 PM
I completely agree that Marty had to go. Like I said earlier, I like Marty but how many chances does he need to finally win a big game?

But the thing about this whole situation is that there really weren't any good choices out there, even before Marty got fired. I'm glad they didn't go with Cameron because I just had a feeling he wouldn't cut it as a head coach. He's dealing with a lack of talent right now in Miami but they just look flat out terrible. Lots of people keep throwing Wade's name in the mix and though he's looking good in Dallas, the dude is no better than Marty and can't win a playoff game.

Next year isn't going to be any better as far as veteran head coaches go. Cowher and Parcells won't come to San Diego. Fisher was a good possibility but the Titans finally woke up and gave him an extension. I don't see any coaches who look to be on the hot seat as good fits here (Gruden, Del Rio, Coughlin, Fox?) Is Romeo Crennel on the hot seat? He could be an interesting possiblity even though he hasn't done jack in Cleveland. I still think Martz would be a good choice but for some reason he was never on San Diego's radar.

If Norv flops, I think it's time to just go with new blood.

I don't think it will happen, but it would sure as hell be interesting if Gruden got hired by the Chargers.

Cito Pelon
09-25-2007, 07:47 PM
Marty got a raw deal. Smith and Spanos floundered around, never had control of the situation. Nobody knows what went on behind the closed doors, it's possible Marty shot himself in the foot when speaking privately with Smith and Spanos, got cheeky and arrogant. Who knows? What came out of it - scrambling to hire an HC, and OC, a DC, assistant staff - after the hiring season was done was one of the bigger FO f'ups in 20-30 years.

I thought when it happened that Norv really shafted SF, because that late in the hiring season they then had to find another OC.

400HZ
09-25-2007, 09:26 PM
Marty got a raw deal. Smith and Spanos floundered around, never had control of the situation. Nobody knows what went on behind the closed doors, it's possible Marty shot himself in the foot when speaking privately with Smith and Spanos, got cheeky and arrogant. Who knows? What came out of it - scrambling to hire an HC, and OC, a DC, assistant staff - after the hiring season was done was one of the bigger FO f'ups in 20-30 years.

I thought when it happened that Norv really shafted SF, because that late in the hiring season they then had to find another OC.

Ya, I wish he had stronger morals.

theAPAOps5
09-25-2007, 09:28 PM
Ya, I wish he had stronger morals.

I bet alot of charger fans are wishing that right now.

Punisher
09-25-2007, 09:35 PM
i knew before the season started this was going to happend to the bolts they have a new staff its going to take time to get use to.