Coyer Appreciation

[Wes Mantooth]

I absolutely hated Coyer when he was here. Thought the gameplan was always too simple and his crew always wore out at the end of the season.

However, if you compare him to Ray Rhodes or Bates thus far, he seemed to turn lemons into lemonade. The D may not have been championship caliber, but he sure did get something for nothing as almost all of his d-line is now gone and suddenly worthless.

[Rock Chalk]

Yeah Im going to give Bates at least a real game or 16 before I start singing Coyer's praises.

[24champ]

Yeah Im going to give Bates at least a real game or 16 before I start singing Coyer's praises.

Concur.

[SoCalBronco]

Coach Coyer is a very good coach who did a great deal without having a whole lot to work with on the DL the last couple years or in the secondary in 2003. I disagree with some things he did (Ian/DJ), but overall, he did a very good job here and I wish him the best in Tampa Bay.

I hope Coach Bates will also have a great deal of success here. I think anytime you are in transition between systems and have alot of pieces that are new it takes a bit of time, but I think we will be fine in this system.

[12th man]

Already giving up on bates with only three games into the preseason? Come on man, give it some time. Bates has always fielded a darn good defense in this league.

[bpc]

He was a good guy and bled orange and blue. Sucks it didn't work out but i'm sure he'll do fine in TB.

I've seen more from the front line in terms of production with Bates at the helm in the preseason than I have in the past three or four seasons. Thats a positive.

This is a work in progress and its going to take time to get it right. I think we've seen some promising things though. We all just have to be patient.

[Hogan11]

I was very disappointed with what I saw past the 1/2 way point of the season during Coyer's time here.....last year especially. I fail to see how another DC's failures can do anything in the way of altering that.

[SonOfLe-loLang]

do you guys ever relax? apparently not

[Steve Prefontaine]

I would rather have a defense that peaks at the end of year, not the beginning.

[TheChamp24]

I hated Coyer's "adjustments" and by adjustments, really just doing the same thing as in the 1st half and hope the other team doesn't do anything different to exploit the weaknesses.
Or if the other team already has exposed the weaknesses, roll out the same defense anyways in hopes the opponent doesn't do the same things again.

[BroncoSoja]

I absolutely hated Coyer when he was here. Thought the gameplan was always too simple and his crew always wore out at the end of the season.

However, if you compare him to Ray Rhodes or Bates thus far, he seemed to turn lemons into lemonade. The D may not have been championship caliber, but he sure did get something for nothing as almost all of his d-line is now gone and suddenly worthless.

Well while im not ready to give up on Bates yet, you did make a interesting point when you said "as almost all of his d-line is now gone and suddenly worthless"...

That really hit home cause its so true, Bates has been shipping out 'guys that don't fit his system' and all but they are guys that have been productive for us in the past and now there suddenly worthless. But the scary part is he is replacing them with guys that seem to be worse.

Only time will tell I guess, but so far so bad...This defense looks horrible right now. When you make the Cleveland Browns QB's (not counting Quinn) look good, something is seriously WRONG!

[Popps]

The real problem is that it looks like Bates may end up trying to do more than Coyer with less talent to work with.

Honestly, we haven't played any real ball yet... but you'd be hard pressed to make any kind of argument that we've got MORE talent now than Coyer had to work with.

Some of it injuries, some of it youth... some of it just bad decisions.

[Elway777]

I think Bates is running the same scheme that the Baltimore Ravens had when they won the superbowl. They had 2 big guys in the middle plus fast de and a great set of linebackers.Williams is not close to being the same player Ray lewis was but will need time to learn the position. Players will need time to adjust to new scheme and should get better as the year goes on. The broncos have not put in blitz packages in pre season so our defence could but more pressure on the qb when the season starts.

[Odysseus]

Coach Coyer is a very good coach who did a great deal without having a whole lot to work with on the DL the last couple years or in the secondary in 2003. I disagree with some things he did (Ian/DJ), but overall, he did a very good job here and I wish him the best in Tampa Bay.

I hope Coach Bates will also have a great deal of success here. I think anytime you are in transition between systems and have alot of pieces that are new it takes a bit of time, but I think we will be fine in this system.

We forget in Denver that Championships do not come easy. I liked Coyer for what he did but I'm still pulling for Bates.

[ShutDownPoster]

But we could sure use his help as a LB coach right now.

[Eli_Cash]

No ill will against Coyer.

The Defense wearing down as the year went on had to stop.

I think the design of the "new" Defense will work well with the Offensive scheme.

Protecting leads was the tragic flaw and I think this defense can counter that.

How the players adjust and how the offense performs in the meantime is the big question.

Count me as not worried but another week 1 loss is a luxury we can't afford....

[24champ]

But we could sure use his help as a LB coach right now.

Maybe I am the only one that thinks this, but he should have stayed at LB and not have been promoted to DC.

[Popps]

Maybe I am the only one that thinks this, but he should have stayed at LB and not have been promoted to DC.

I was vocal that Shanahan needed to go out and get a DC with a little more clout. Bates fits that description, but it hasn't exactly been a rosy start.
We just have to give him time. We gave Coyer a few years, we have to at least give Bates a few games.

Again, I fear more for the talent the guy has to work with than his coaching abilities.

[azbroncfan]

Some people never fail to amaze me. Not even regular season yet and guys are already looking for Bates replacement.

[Atlas]

I absolutely hated Coyer when he was here. Thought the gameplan was always too simple and his crew always wore out at the end of the season.

However, if you compare him to Ray Rhodes or Bates thus far, he seemed to turn lemons into lemonade. The D may not have been championship caliber, but he sure did get something for nothing as almost all of his d-line is now gone and suddenly worthless.

So what you are saying is that you were totally clueless in your slamming of Coyer and my guess is that you will turn out to be totally clueless in your early analysis of Bates, but have at it.

[elsid13]

So what you are saying is that you were totally clueless in your slamming of Coyer and my guess is that you will turn out to be totally clueless in your early analysis of Bates, but have at it.

That one left a mark

[Northman]

Coach Coyer is a very good coach who did a great deal without having a whole lot to work with on the DL the last couple years or in the secondary in 2003.
I hope Coach Bates will also have a great deal of success here. I think anytime you are in transition between systems and have alot of pieces that are new it takes a bit of time, but I think we will be fine in this system.

I wonder if we should have waited to see what he could of done with some of this young talent on the Dline. But like you said, i hope Bates can do something better than what has been shown thus far.

[Vladimir]

Im sure the struggles on our starting defense have nothing to do with a "rookie" middle linebacker. Rookie to the posisition anyways.

I am still believing in Bates' scheme.

[NaptownChief]

If things don't work on defense year after year eventually you have to put the blame on the people responsible for the talent that is in place. Shanny has scurried around to find his fall guy in the past but eventually he has to fall on the sword as he is the main decision maker as to the talent that is in place. He is certainly the one that thought he could make chicken salad out of chicken dung with the pickup of the entire Browns defensive line.

[Odysseus]

So what you are saying is that you were totally clueless in your slamming of Coyer and my guess is that you will turn out to be totally clueless in your early analysis of Bates, but have at it.

Too funnee!!ROFL! I was surprised when Coyer left I wanted to see one more year. I was surprised to how easy it was to get Bates. I thought he's a more proven commodity than Coyer and a little bit of a uptick.

Gentleman, Raider Bill done called us!He caught us waxing nostalgic, getting all teary eyed and laying down on the job. I hope the players aren't as soft as us fans quitting this early in the process.

My calender is circled. Raiders week two.

Jim Bates is still my guy. Shanahan is still my coach. Broncos are always my team.

[Odysseus]

Some people never fail to amaze me. Not even regular season yet and guys are already looking for Bates replacement.

What's that line again? The plane has been delayed fifteen minutes and alreayd we are drawing straws to see which passenger we eat first? We'll be resorting to cannibalism by week two.

[Kaylore]

Calling Coyer's schemes too simple is pretty ignorant. I too wish he had a year with a decent line to actually make some noise.

[Raider Bill]

Everyone wanted Rob Ryan's head on a platter his first season.

[broncsyanks]

i will say this. i will miss coyers all - go blitz package

[Hotrod]

Wait Im getting confused.

By show of hands who has fallen off the wagon before the end of the pre-season???

[Popcorn Sutton]

I am having a hard time wrapping my head around the very first post in this thread.

I find it hard to believe we are drawing any conclusions before we get a crack at the regular season.

[Hogan11]

I never appreciated the strong start to season end fade of the Coyer era.

It was past time for a change and Bates is the Man...give him a chance beyond the vanilla pre-season before you run him out on a rail.

[bronco militia]

I never appreciated the strong start to season end fade of the Coyer era.

.

Don't forget Rhodes and G. Robinson!

Ha!

[Hogan11]

Don't forget Rhodes and G. Robinson!

Ha!

I didn't...but they don't have appreciation threads dedicated to them either.

[azbroncfan]

Since when did good coaches make crap players into stars? Players make coaches.

[PRBronco]

Not signing this. While Coyer seemed like a class act and nice old fella, he played called like a pussy, and that was holding the broncos back imo.

Despite that, I won't deny the fact that he was given sweet f*** all to work with on the D line.

[Odysseus]

Everyone wanted Rob Ryan's head on a platter his first season.

That is true but what is worst the sports heads went after him. I don't remember any of them admitting to being wrong. Good reference post. Rob really did a great job getting the Raiders defense on track.

Any Warren updates?

[Taco John]

I read this stuff, and there are some amazingly bad takes. Like for instance "the defense wore down as the season went on, that had to stop." How in the hell does changing your defensive coordinator fix that?

Don't get me wrong, I'm as up on Bates as anyone, probably more than some as people seem to be jumping ship on the guy. But Bates isn't going to be able to stop the defense from wearing down as the season wears on. That's about the players, and depth.

I don't believe Coyer deserved to lose his job, but his scheme wasn't going to come to fruition here in Denver because we are apparently not going to get serious about the kind of depth we need up front for his scheme to be successful over the season. I think Bates is a great option there, but I think it's going to get worse before it gets better. He's going to have many of the same issues that Coyer had to deal with until we get serious about personnel.

[baja]

The AFC Championship game is what finally did in Coyer. One Pitts. play worked over and over and that killed us in what should have been another SB for us.

Coyer could not come up with an answer which was his problem all along. A few of us called for his head when that became evident.

[Taco John]

What are you talking about? Coyer coached a full season past that AFC Championship! Ha!

[baja]

What are you talking about? Coyer coached a full season past that AFC Championship! Ha!

I still say when the change was made that was a big factor.

Do you think shanny likes losing an almost gimmie SB

Pitt at home and a rematch against Holgram (sp)

[Raider Bill]

That is true but what is worst the sports heads went after him. I don't remember any of them admitting to being wrong. Good reference post. Rob really did a great job getting the Raiders defense on track.

Any Warren updates?



Some of the criticism of Ryan was valid. He had us saddled to that New England 3-4, 4-3, 5-2 scheme and we didn't have any athletic edge players to man the "McGinnest and Vrabel" positions.

Once he put Sapp back at 3 technique in a regular 40 front and played Burgess every down, it started to come together.

Scheme is important, but you can't be so married to it that you put your players in a position to fail.

[Wes Mantooth]

I am having a hard time wrapping my head around the very first post in this thread.

I find it hard to believe we are drawing any conclusions before we get a crack at the regular season.

Let me defend it then. I am not jumping off the Bates bandwagon. My point to this thread is that Coyer had crap for a d-line. This was evident as hardly any of them are on the roster today. All I am saying is give the guy some respect for winning quite a few games with the talent he had. He was a better d-coordinator than I gave him credit for

[Paladin]

After reading the title of this thread, all I can say is: You gotta be sh*tting me!

[Bladerunner]

This thread is generating some real stinkers.

Coyer's success was built on effective blitzing and good run stopping. The old coot was totally unable to adjust to anything that exploited scheme weakness (i.e. soft cb coverage giving up quick outs). Furthermore, his blitz packages became less effective over time (both within and across seasons) as they were more predictable. Lastly, he reverted to an ineffective prevent D too early and too often, giving up big yards and points in the 4th quarters.

Neither the fans nor the head coach are in any posiiton to evaluate Bate's performance in any of these or other D-Coordinator roles. Pre-season doesn't even afford the oppotunity to test the coordinator in such ways, and even if it did, 3-4 games certainly isn't enough time to draw any meaningful conclusions.

Couple all that with the fact that the players are learning and adjusting to a new scheme, and there is almost nothing that can be legitimately claimed about Denver's defensive coordinators at this time...other than Coyer had flaws.

[Orange_Beard]

I absolutely hated Coyer when he was here. Thought the gameplan was always too simple and his crew always wore out at the end of the season.

However, if you compare him to Ray Rhodes or Bates thus far, he seemed to turn lemons into lemonade. The D may not have been championship caliber, but he sure did get something for nothing as almost all of his d-line is now gone and suddenly worthless.

This is the WEAKEST $HIT! It's the ****ing pre-season.

[bowtown]

What are you talking about? Coyer coached a full season past that AFC Championship! Ha!

Shanny tried to hire Bates that offseason. Bates turned him down.

[Odysseus]

Some of the criticism of Ryan was valid. He had us saddled to that New England 3-4, 4-3, 5-2 scheme and we didn't have any athletic edge players to man the "McGinnest and Vrabel" positions.

Once he put Sapp back at 3 technique in a regular 40 front and played Burgess every down, it started to come together.

Scheme is important, but you can't be so married to it that you put your players in a position to fail.

Bates is going to turn his defense around but I don't believe in magic fairy dust. It's going to take a lot of work, smart decisions and not getting too stuck on one way of going to market. I don't think Ryan sucked as bad as the press overstated but if you don't look at the games it's hard to see. I don't have the luxury to rewatch Broncos games the way I would like but from a quick glance I'm seeing them lose focus too quickly. It's not they are stupid but they seem to have the wrong expectation and their first reaction is wrong. It's going to take awhile to get past that and they might have to do a shift of players during the season to make it over the hump. It's going to be interesting...if I ever get a frigging t.v. again.

[Drek]

I've never understood the whole "Coyer had to turn lemons into lemonade" argument.

Was our DL shoddy? Yeah, but our linebackers were top class and he had Champ Bailey and John Lynch in a secondary that we filled out with three day one draft picks.

Very few teams can put elite talent at every position. We have offensive needs too and the league forces you to work within a salary cap. He was here long enough, playing an active role in all the personell decisions, to effect change. He created a dynamite linebacker crew with a good group of DBs behind them but he never did anything for the front line. Thats on him. You're deluding yourself if you don't think Coyer played a major role in us resigning Ian Gold one season after drafting DJ. That doomed him right there, we'd tied two big salaries and a first round pick up in three starting linebackers when in today's NFL you run a lot of nickel. It was wasted resources and left their hands tied when it came to upgrading the DL.

Now Bates is doing just what Coyer should have. We're sacraficing some of our linebacking play to invest more heavily in the DL. We could've used the Moss pick to get a linebacker, or even Crowder's, but instead we wanted that DL youth movement. We made a commitment to build there and let the talent we had at LB, along with some low cost free agent additions, sufice.

You can't hand out big paydays to every player under the sun, something has got to give financially. For Coyer that was always the DL.

[bowtown]

I've never understood the whole "Coyer had to turn lemons into lemonade" argument.

Was our DL shoddy? Yeah, but our linebackers were top class and he had Champ Bailey and John Lynch in a secondary that we filled out with three day one draft picks.

Very few teams can put elite talent at every position. We have offensive needs too and the league forces you to work within a salary cap. He was here long enough, playing an active role in all the personell decisions, to effect change. He created a dynamite linebacker crew with a good group of DBs behind them but he never did anything for the front line. Thats on him. You're deluding yourself if you don't think Coyer played a major role in us resigning Ian Gold one season after drafting DJ. That doomed him right there, we'd tied two big salaries and a first round pick up in three starting linebackers when in today's NFL you run a lot of nickel. It was wasted resources and left their hands tied when it came to upgrading the DL.

Now Bates is doing just what Coyer should have. We're sacraficing some of our linebacking play to invest more heavily in the DL. We could've used the Moss pick to get a linebacker, or even Crowder's, but instead we wanted that DL youth movement. We made a commitment to build there and let the talent we had at LB, along with some low cost free agent additions, sufice.

You can't hand out big paydays to every player under the sun, something has got to give financially. For Coyer that was always the DL.

Kind of ironic that he is now a DL coach, huh?

[Drek]

Kind of ironic that he is now a DL coach, huh?

I feel bad for Tampa Bay if they leave him in that job. He'll be off chatting with Brooks, June, and Rudd instead of actually coaching the DL. Guy's a phenomenal LB coach, he just doesn't bring the whole scheme a DC should have.

It wasn't too long ago our DBs were shoddy. Lots of early round DB busts and no consistency at all. Sure we traded for Champ, but the first season he gave us what he gave Washington, great play without a ton of turnovers and occasionally getting burnt. Then we added Slowik, a move many viewed as the HC giving his buddy a job, and suddenly we find not one, not two, but three solid CBs in the 2nd and 3rd rounds of one draft, Champ starts throwing up DPOY seasons, and the whole unit looks worlds better.

Attributing the surge in big plays from our secondary the last two years to Coyer seems like a quick rush to judgment in my opinion, and that was the biggest thing that turned our D from a good yards against average D that gave up way too many points into a defense that actually stopped people and prevented scores. If it wasn't for that sudden turnaround Coyer probably would've been out last spring.

[Taco John]

I feel bad for Tampa Bay if they leave him in that job. He'll be off chatting with Brooks, June, and Rudd instead of actually coaching the DL. Guy's a phenomenal LB coach, he just doesn't bring the whole scheme a DC should have.

It wasn't too long ago our DBs were shoddy. Lots of early round DB busts and no consistency at all. Sure we traded for Champ, but the first season he gave us what he gave Washington, great play without a ton of turnovers and occasionally getting burnt. Then we added Slowik, a move many viewed as the HC giving his buddy a job, and suddenly we find not one, not two, but three solid CBs in the 2nd and 3rd rounds of one draft, Champ starts throwing up DPOY seasons, and the whole unit looks worlds better.

Attributing the surge in big plays from our secondary the last two years to Coyer seems like a quick rush to judgment in my opinion, and that was the biggest thing that turned our D from a good yards against average D that gave up way too many points into a defense that actually stopped people and prevented scores. If it wasn't for that sudden turnaround Coyer probably would've been out last spring.


Worst, most contradictory take I've ever read on this subject. "Coyer get's credit for all the bad stuff, but damned if I'll give him credit for any of the good stuff."

You could save a lot of hot air by just posting "I don't like Coyer." That's four words. Five if you don't use a contraction.

[Drek]

Worst, most contradictory take I've ever read on this subject. "Coyer get's credit for all the bad stuff, but damned if I'll give him credit for any of the good stuff."

You could save a lot of hot air by just posting "I don't like Coyer." That's four words. Five if you don't use a contraction.

No, I give Coyer tons of credit for what he did with our LBs. He created probably the single best 4-3 LB corps, centered around Wilson, that the NFL has seen over the last few years and he did it despite losing Mobley, then Gold for two years, and then losing both of their replacements not long after. The only stable presence there was Wilson and Coyer, yet they were the best linebackers in the league and carried our defense to top 10 yards against finishes every season by shutting down the run.

He's great with linebackers, hell, he's a linebacker guru. But he didn't do a thing to improve our DL and it took bringing in a former DC who had a lot of success in previous stints as a DB coach as well as two perennial pro-bowlers and three first day draft picks to make our DBs into a crew that could actually change a game once in a while.

I get the feeling a ton of people here would be happy to throw Bates' system out the door and go back to the old routine with Coyer where we hold the opponent's running game in check just to have short passes thrown on us and clock chewed away ending in red zone caves. Then they could talk about how fundamentally sound our defense is and that they just need a season where they catch some good breaks, and watch those 21-17 losses pile up.

[Wes Mantooth]

This is the WEAKEST $HIT! It's the ****ing pre-season.

really? How many of the guys that played under Coyer on that line are still on the team? Our "star" was traded to the Raiders and will be at best a backup. Weak? My point is that I did not give the old guy enough credit. He overacheived with the crew he had.

[400HZ]

I've never understood the whole "Coyer had to turn lemons into lemonade" argument.

Was our DL shoddy? Yeah, but our linebackers were top class and he had Champ Bailey and John Lynch in a secondary that we filled out with three day one draft picks.



Coyer made your linebackers look better than they really were. Just like in 2005 when he made Gerrard Warren look like a decent NFL player. The truth of the matter is that Coyer's front 7 was on the bottom rung of talent, but he got good production out of them. I'm not sure how you all felt about Kenard Lang, Gerrard Warren, Mike Myers, etc but from an outside perspective they looked absolutely terrible as individual players. Ian Gold and DJ Williams were no better than average. Yet even with a lack of talent, Coyer came up with gameplans and schemes that turned the unit as a whole into a pretty good one. I know the cover 0 gave San Diego and other clubs absolute fits for a while. I felt like Coyer's problem was that he ran out of adjustments that he could make to camouflage his lack of talent. Perversely, that's what he was criticized for last year. You have to realize that there are only so many adjustments you can make with players like Lang, Warren, etc.

My old neighbor and I discussed this a lot last year. He's about as die hard a Bronco fan as you'll find. He always invited me over to watch the games on his enormous High-def TV. This guy absolutely hated Larry Coyer the second half of last year, but apart from the "stop playing prevent!" argument, which almost every fan base bitches about, he couldn't name any solutions. It's not like Coyer's halftime adjustments could include replacing your front 7 with talented players. What did you want him to do? Now I'm not trying to say that Coyer was a genius or is a top coordinator or anything, but you have to admit that he did a very good job during his years considering what he had to work with. It was a very weak move by Shanahan scapegoating Coyer last year, especially considering that he used basically the entire 2006 draft on his offense - an offense that wasn't any good for most of the year.

[broncs2bowl]

I absolutely hated Coyer when he was here. Thought the gameplan was always too simple and his crew always wore out at the end of the season.

However, if you compare him to Ray Rhodes or Bates thus far, he seemed to turn lemons into lemonade. The D may not have been championship caliber, but he sure did get something for nothing as almost all of his d-line is now gone and suddenly worthless.

you make me wanna...........LALA........no actually u make me SICK. Its only been 3 preseason games man.

[broncs2bowl]

Coyer made your linebackers look better than they really were. Just like in 2005 when he made Gerrard Warren look like a decent NFL player. The truth of the matter is that Coyer's front 7 was on the bottom rung of talent, but he got good production out of them. I'm not sure how you all felt about Kenard Lang, Gerrard Warren, Mike Myers, etc but from an outside perspective they looked absolutely terrible as individual players. Ian Gold and DJ Williams were no better than average. Yet even with a lack of talent, Coyer came up with gameplans and schemes that turned the unit as a whole into a pretty good one. I know the cover 0 gave San Diego and other clubs absolute fits for a while. I felt like Coyer's problem was that he ran out of adjustments that he could make to camouflage his lack of talent. Perversely, that's what he was criticized for last year. You have to realize that there are only so many adjustments you can make with players like Lang, Warren, etc.

My old neighbor and I discussed this a lot last year. He's about as die hard a Bronco fan as you'll find. He always invited me over to watch the games on his enormous High-def TV. This guy absolutely hated Larry Coyer the second half of last year, but apart from the "stop playing prevent!" argument, which almost every fan base b****es about, he couldn't name any solutions. It's not like Coyer's halftime adjustments could include replacing your front 7 with talented players. What did you want him to do? Now I'm not trying to say that Coyer was a genius or is a top coordinator or anything, but you have to admit that he did a very good job during his years considering what he had to work with. It was a very weak move by Shanahan scapegoating Coyer last year, especially considering that he used basically the entire 2006 draft on his offense - an offense that wasn't any good for most of the year.

U is equal to DIP****....haha, our LBs were talented. Al Wilson is beast, DJ Williams is very talented, Ian Gold is an above average to good lb. Our dline on the other hand was pretty talent less although warren did have talent but is just a bum

[Wes Mantooth]

you make me wanna...........LALA........no actually u make me SICK. Its only been 3 preseason games man.

Dude, do you notice turnover on the d-line? I am stating that Coyer made a bunch of scrubs into a pretty good unit. I was completely expecting Warren and Lang make the team before camp started. Now they are gone. Warren may not even make the Raider squad and he was our star. I did not give him enough credit before and am trying to make up for it now.

I do know that I made a comparison to Bates now and I will give you that-- that was not fair. However, my point was that I wanted to give props to Coyer for what he did with the squad he had.

[baja]

Worst, most contradictory take I've ever read on this subject. "Coyer get's credit for all the bad stuff, but damned if I'll give him credit for any of the good stuff."

You could save a lot of hot air by just posting "I don't like Coyer." That's four words. Five if you don't use a contraction.

What's with you today? No way you can know if this is a valid point or not. I believe this is a great point made by Derk;

"It wasn't too long ago our DBs were shoddy. Lots of early round DB busts and no consistency at all. Sure we traded for Champ, but the first season he gave us what he gave Washington, great play without a ton of turnovers and occasionally getting burnt. Then we added Slowik, a move many viewed as the HC giving his buddy a job, and suddenly we find not one, not two, but three solid CBs in the 2nd and 3rd rounds of one draft, Champ starts throwing up DPOY seasons, and the whole unit looks worlds better."

[baja]

really? How many of the guys that played under Coyer on that line are still on the team? Our "star" was traded to the Raiders and will be at best a backup. Weak? My point is that I did not give the old guy enough credit. He overacheived with the crew he had.

Question is were they Coyer's guys or were they forced upon him by FO.

[elsid13]

What's that line again? The plane has been delayed fifteen minutes and alreayd we are drawing straws to see which passenger we eat first? We'll be resorting to cannibalism by week two.

Looks like I am going vegan

[baja]

Coyer made your linebackers look better than they really were. Just like in 2005 when he made Gerrard Warren look like a decent NFL player. The truth of the matter is that Coyer's front 7 was on the bottom rung of talent, but he got good production out of them. I'm not sure how you all felt about Kenard Lang, Gerrard Warren, Mike Myers, etc but from an outside perspective they looked absolutely terrible as individual players. Ian Gold and DJ Williams were no better than average. Yet even with a lack of talent, Coyer came up with gameplans and schemes that turned the unit as a whole into a pretty good one. I know the cover 0 gave San Diego and other clubs absolute fits for a while. I felt like Coyer's problem was that he ran out of adjustments that he could make to camouflage his lack of talent. Perversely, that's what he was criticized for last year. You have to realize that there are only so many adjustments you can make with players like Lang, Warren, etc.

My old neighbor and I discussed this a lot last year. He's about as die hard a Bronco fan as you'll find. He always invited me over to watch the games on his enormous High-def TV. This guy absolutely hated Larry Coyer the second half of last year, but apart from the "stop playing prevent!" argument, which almost every fan base b****es about, he couldn't name any solutions. It's not like Coyer's halftime adjustments could include replacing your front 7 with talented players. What did you want him to do? Now I'm not trying to say that Coyer was a genius or is a top coordinator or anything, but you have to admit that he did a very good job during his years considering what he had to work with. <b> It was a very weak move by Shanahan scapegoating Coyer last year, especially considering that he used basically the entire 2006 draft on his offense - an offense that wasn't any good for most of the year.</b>

<b>Weak!! scapegoating!! </b>


Shanahan has wanted Bates for a while now, tried to hire him last season in fact, so when Bastes said yes Shanny said hell yes.

[BroncoSoja]

Coyer made your linebackers look better than they really were. Just like in 2005 when he made Gerrard Warren look like a decent NFL player. The truth of the matter is that Coyer's front 7 was on the bottom rung of talent, but he got good production out of them. I'm not sure how you all felt about Kenard Lang, Gerrard Warren, Mike Myers, etc but from an outside perspective they looked absolutely terrible as individual players. Ian Gold and DJ Williams were no better than average. Yet even with a lack of talent, Coyer came up with gameplans and schemes that turned the unit as a whole into a pretty good one. I know the cover 0 gave San Diego and other clubs absolute fits for a while. I felt like Coyer's problem was that he ran out of adjustments that he could make to camouflage his lack of talent. Perversely, that's what he was criticized for last year. You have to realize that there are only so many adjustments you can make with players like Lang, Warren, etc.

My old neighbor and I discussed this a lot last year. He's about as die hard a Bronco fan as you'll find. He always invited me over to watch the games on his enormous High-def TV. This guy absolutely hated Larry Coyer the second half of last year, but apart from the "stop playing prevent!" argument, which almost every fan base b****es about, he couldn't name any solutions. It's not like Coyer's halftime adjustments could include replacing your front 7 with talented players. What did you want him to do? Now I'm not trying to say that Coyer was a genius or is a top coordinator or anything, but you have to admit that he did a very good job during his years considering what he had to work with. It was a very weak move by Shanahan scapegoating Coyer last year, especially considering that he used basically the entire 2006 draft on his offense - an offense that wasn't any good for most of the year.


Game Set Match

GG

Thats all folk's

The End.