VERY Good article from SI online [Archive] - The Orange Mane

bowtown

07-20-2007, 03:47 PM

This is one of the most thought out and accurate articles I've ever read :~ohyah!:

Musings, observations and the occasional insight as we stare down the start of NFL training camps next week ...

• The Chiefs this summer will be the subject of HBO's excellent NFL training camp reality series Hard Knocks, which will chronicle their doings in River Falls, Wisc., on a weekly basis, the way the Ravens and Cowboys have been chronicled in past preseasons.

How fitting, because I think Kansas City is in for some this year. Hard knocks, that is.

With the possible exception of Atlanta, I don't see any other NFL locale that has more potential storm clouds gathering than K.C. as we enter late July. There has to be at least a sense of building trepidation among Chiefs fans as they review their team's key storylines for 2007:

-- Pro Bowl running back Larry Johnson's likelihood of being a camp no-show in his quest for a new contract extension. L.J. wants L.T. money, and the Chiefs seem unlikely to award him the kind of jackpot San Diego gave LaDainian Tomlinson.

-- The further weakening of the Chiefs' vaunted offensive line, which has been so instrumental to their offensive success in recent years. K.C. lost Pro Bowl perennials Willie Roaf (tackle) and Will Shields (guard) to retirement the past two offseasons.

-- The uncertainty at starting quarterback after the long-delayed trade of Trent Green to Miami. There appears to be the possibility of a less than level-field quarterback competition this preseason, tilting toward the presumed quarterback of the future, Brodie Croyle, over the more productive but less promising veteran, Damon Huard. It almost goes without saying that such situations have the potential to divide a locker room between those veterans who want to win now with Huard, rather than suffer through the inevitable growing pains that Croyle must endure as part of his long-term development.

-- The two-game league suspension for a pair of DUI arrests (reduced from four games) that defensive end Jared Allen must serve in September, which will weaken the Chiefs pass rush for their season-opening two-game road trip to Houston and Chicago. Kansas City's defense needs all the playmakers it can get, so subtracting the productive Allen won't help.

When you add in the fact the Chiefs play in what may be the NFL's toughest division (the AFC West), and the decline of their once-powerful offense (decreased point totals in each of the past three seasons), things seem to be headed in the wrong direction in Kansas City.

Hard knocks ahead, indeed.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2007/writers/don_banks/07/20/snap.judgments/index.html

TheReverend

07-20-2007, 04:02 PM

A+ article on all accounts.

PLOWHORSE

07-20-2007, 04:04 PM

Nothing we haven't read in any other pieces...but the chef slam-fest was classic.

Paladin

07-20-2007, 04:28 PM

Very inspiring read....

Oh, wait. I meant very good read.....

Poor, poor mullets......

Bob's your Information Minister

07-20-2007, 04:36 PM

Sky is falling.

bronco militia

07-20-2007, 04:40 PM

How fitting, because I think Kansas City is in for some this year. Hard knocks, that is.

With the possible exception of Atlanta, I don't see any other NFL locale that has more potential storm clouds gathering than K.C. as we enter late July. There has to be at least a sense of building trepidation among Chiefs fans as they review their team's key storylines for 2007:

]

bwahahaha

atomicbloke

07-20-2007, 04:48 PM

So the gist of the article is that... Chiefs Suck.....

Thanks for telling us what we knew since the human race began....

Dukes

07-20-2007, 06:30 PM

I'd say he was spot on

DukeWoody

07-20-2007, 06:57 PM

Very accurate piece of jurnalisum,spot on all accounts and yes the:chiefssux now,then and forevermore until the end of time...:chefstink :kcbard:

Paladin

07-20-2007, 06:58 PM

Amen.

Bob's your Information Minister

07-20-2007, 07:00 PM

jurnalisum

Aren't there laws against this sort of thing?

DeuceOfClub

07-20-2007, 07:04 PM

Vary standard, nothing we didn’t know before.

One thing is for sure: at the end of the year Herm will be $5,000,000 richer.

DukeWoody

07-20-2007, 07:30 PM

There should be laws against eating a 100 twinkies a day,or farting man yogurt in public, but that doesn't stop you from doing either now does it,you fat assed tub of lard...

DenverBrit

07-20-2007, 07:41 PM

No objective KC fan could disagree.
Trolls, save your breath.

SI finally got something right. :thumbsup:

KCStud

07-20-2007, 08:00 PM

I love being the underdog...

broncosteven

07-20-2007, 08:19 PM

I should start a poll to see when the Chef's call on Jeff George to come in and suit up for a QB spot! Maybe game 6?

Bob's your Information Minister

07-20-2007, 08:26 PM

I should start a poll to see when the Chef's call on Jeff George to come in and suit up for a QB spot! Maybe game 6?

http://chiefs.scout.com/2/631564.html

youcandoit1687

07-20-2007, 10:42 PM

Aren't there laws against this sort of thing?

is that a deflection?

BroncoBuff

07-20-2007, 10:46 PM

They gotta trade LJ, they just gotta. They're obviously starting from the ground up in most places ... get a RB and a 2nd rounder. He's worth an RB and a first, but they won't get that.

Jetmeck

07-21-2007, 12:35 AM

Sky is falling.

Say anything in that article is not so, dipstick.

KCStud

07-21-2007, 01:40 AM

They gotta trade LJ, they just gotta. They're obviously starting from the ground up in most places ... get a RB and a 2nd rounder. He's worth an RB and a first, but they won't get that.

KC needs LJ. He is a big weapon on the offense and would draw a lot of attention away from Brodie Croyle. Even if say LJ did get hurt, it's not like RB is the hardest position to replace. About 90% of the teams in the NFL have good RB's or a good RB combo.
KC's offense has a lot of weapons. LJ, Gonzo, Bowe(we'll see what he can do), a few guys like Wilson and Kennison who are decent contributors. The problem is the core. Brian Waters is a pro bowler but that's about it. The interior line looks to be pretty solid. The OT position needs to get better.

bronco610

07-21-2007, 01:57 AM

KC needs LJ. He is a big weapon on the offense and would draw a lot of attention away from Brodie Croyle. Even if say LJ did get hurt, it's not like RB is the hardest position to replace. About 90% of the teams in the NFL have good RB's or a good RB combo.
KC's offense has a lot of weapons. LJ, Gonzo, Bowe(we'll see what he can do), a few guys like Wilson and Kennison who are decent contributors. The problem is the core. Brian Waters is a pro bowler but that's about it. The interior line looks to be pretty solid. The OT position needs to get better.

You better hope he's easy to replace since he "s prob. not going to play for the chefs!!!!!Booya! !Booya!

brncs_fan

07-21-2007, 02:20 AM

KC's offense has a lot of weapons. LJ, Gonzo, Bowe(we'll see what he can do), a few guys like Wilson and Kennison who are decent contributors.

KC's offense has so many weapons that you were able to make it through two credible ones, LJ and Gonzo, before you had to resort to an unproven rookie. From there you moved on to "decent contributors" which don't really count as weapons.

24champ

07-21-2007, 02:29 AM

KCStud

07-21-2007, 02:29 AM

You better hope he's easy to replace since he "s prob. not going to play for the chefs!!!!!Booya! !Booya!

Nobody said he was easy to replace. I think the running game would still be good though with the RB's we have

KCStud

07-21-2007, 02:30 AM

bronco610

07-21-2007, 02:32 AM

Nobody said he was easy to replace. I think the running game would still be good though with the RB's we have

Okay, step away from the Kool-aid youve had enough!!!!
Hilarious! Hilarious! Hilarious! Hilarious! Hilarious!

KCStud

07-21-2007, 02:32 AM

KC's offense has so many weapons that you were able to make it through two credible ones, LJ and Gonzo, before you had to resort to an unproven rookie. From there you moved on to "decent contributors" which don't really count as weapons.

That decent contributor(Kennison) does well against your all world CB almost every time. I would consider him a weapon..

KCStud

07-21-2007, 02:34 AM

Okay, step away from the Kool-aid youve had enough!!!!
Hilarious! Hilarious! Hilarious! Hilarious! Hilarious!

Oh I'm sorry. Here at the Mane Scheffler is a pro bowler, Cutler is god, and apparently LJ couldn't hold Henry's jock..Uhh

Kaylore

07-21-2007, 02:45 AM

Oh I'm sorry. Here at the Mane Scheffler is a pro bowler, Cutler is god, and apparently LJ couldn't hold Henry's jock..Uhh

No one has said those things, liar.

KCStud

07-21-2007, 02:48 AM

No one has said those things, liar.

Actually they have. Would you like me to get the posts saying Scheffler will be better than Gonzo and make the pro bowl over him?

Kaylore

07-21-2007, 02:54 AM

Actually they have. Would you like me to get the posts saying Scheffler will be better than Gonzo and make the pro bowl over him?

Do it! Scheffler could go to the pro bowl and Gonzo's on the decline and will be kept in to block more because your tackles suck. Also he'll be catching passes from a project quarterback who's wet behind the ears and might be starting his first game, so saying he might not make the pro bowl this year is hardly a reach especially with Herm "run-run-pass-punt" Edwards running your offense.

What about those other two comments? You made them up and you know it, liar.

Bob's your Information Minister

07-21-2007, 02:59 AM

Scheffler could go to the pro bowl and Gonzo's on the decline and will be kept in to block more because your tackles suck.

This is just so incredibly ignorant. Gonzo had a career resurgence of sorts last year. Really had a fantastic season. Even WITH our ****ty tackles. And now our tackles have OBVIOUSLY been upgraded, and yet you still come with this tripe. Are you just TRYING to look stupid?

saying he might not make the pro bowl this year is hardly a reach especially with Herm "run-run-pass-punt" Edwards running your offense.

If over-the-hill and slower-than-my-grandma John Lynch can keep making it on based only on reputation, so can Gonzo.

bronco610

07-21-2007, 03:10 AM

Oh I'm sorry. Here at the Mane Scheffler is a pro bowler, Cutler is god, and apparently LJ couldn't hold Henry's jock..Uhh

Okay, thanks for saying so, glad we are on the same page.:thumbsup:

KCStud

07-21-2007, 03:33 AM

Do it! Scheffler could go to the pro bowl and Gonzo's on the decline and will be kept in to block more because your tackles suck. Also he'll be catching passes from a project quarterback who's wet behind the ears and might be starting his first game, so saying he might not make the pro bowl this year is hardly a reach especially with Herm "run-run-pass-punt" Edwards running your offense.

What about those other two comments? You made them up and you know it, liar.

Right here.

http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showthread.php?p=1646714#post1646714

And yes I was sarcastic with the other 2 comments. Let me rephrase one of them. "LJ will get injured this year and decline like Jamal Anderson".

And what makes you think Cutler isn't wet behind the ears? If anything Brodie will use Gonzo as a security blanket.

easymobee

07-21-2007, 03:46 AM

I'd say he was spot on

I'm kind of off and on here sometimes.

I'm wondering what was involved in the bet that Bob welched on as referred to in your sig?

ZachKC

07-21-2007, 03:52 AM

The drama!

Dukes

07-21-2007, 07:41 AM

brncs_fan

07-21-2007, 08:58 AM

That decent contributor(Kennison) does well against your all world CB almost every time. I would consider him a weapon..

Thats funny. Usually weapons get over 1,000 yads receiving in a season, not experice a 20% decrease in their stats.

Kaylore

07-21-2007, 12:32 PM

Right here.

http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showthread.php?p=1646714#post1646714

And yes I was sarcastic with the other 2 comments. Let me rephrase one of them. "LJ will get injured this year and decline like Jamal Anderson".

And what makes you think Cutler isn't wet behind the ears? If anything Brodie will use Gonzo as a security blanket.

Genius, that's a chargers fan. And while many here think Scheffler has pro-bowl potential, he's only entering his second year and will be splitting time with Graham. He also hurt his foot. I have not seen anyone here that's a broncos fan say Scheffler will be in the probowl this year and Gonzo definitely will not.

And thank you for admitting to lame hyperbole on the other two. I'd like to also point out I'm in the minority here on what will happen to LJ, so even that comment I made about his 400+ carries isn't a shared opinion by everyone here. In fact I haven't heard anyone else say that.

We rip on the Chief's Oline, play calling, lack of receivers, poor defensive play, LJ's racism and Herm Edwards' clock management. And all of those are things that Chief fans have expressed disdain about as well so I think we have you guys pegged pretty good.

And who said Cutler wasn't wet behind the ears? Once again you are making stupid assertions about things we think that aren't true and were never said. I will say this on Cutler versus Frayle:

1. Cutler had a crappier offensive line than Croyle and was sacked more than twice as many times as him. Despite this, Cutler never missed a game because of injury his entire career as a four year starter.

2. Both Croyle and Cutler played in the toughest division in college football, but where Croyle was in a rush oriented offense and struggled to stay on the field, Cutler was in a pass oriented one, three year team captain, and particularly his last two years threw more than Croyle ever did, and won offensive player of the year.

3. Cutler was more physically developed than Croyle and because he had better technique and more reps, he was a first round talent whereas Croyle was a project third rounder.

4. Unlike Croyle, Cutler was the primary backup last year and took most of the reps in the preseason. He also started the last four games of the season.

So while Cutler still has a lot of growing to do and is also "wet behind the ears" he is light years ahead of Croyle in reps with the offense, mental development, real game experience and physical development. Croyle could become a good player but right now they aren't even comparable.

DenverBrit

07-21-2007, 12:51 PM

Hilarious! Hilarious! Um..... I hate do break this to you..... but that's a CHARGER FAN!! So, what Bronco fan on this site has ever said Scheffler will be in the probowl? I'll wait............

Ok, now to be fair, you are talking to a 'Stud.'

As most of us know, self proclaimed 'Studs' are clueless. ROFL!

Florida_Bronco

07-21-2007, 03:02 PM

I see KCSheepStud is doing his best to show us how dumb he really is. You guys shouldn't even bother with him, the guy can't even read.

Dukes

07-21-2007, 05:00 PM

I see KCSheepStud is doing his best to show us how dumb he really is. You guys shouldn't even bother with him, the guy can't even read.

Or decipher pictures :rofl:

KCStud

07-21-2007, 05:11 PM

Hilarious! Hilarious! Um..... I hate do break this to you..... but that's a CHARGER FAN!! So, what Bronco fan on this site has ever said Scheffler will be in the probowl? I'll wait............

If I'm not mistaken, SureShot7 is a Bronco fan. When I said it was doubtful that Scheffy makes the pro bowl he says "sit back and watch".

KCStud

07-21-2007, 05:27 PM

I see KCSheepStud is doing his best to show us how dumb he really is. You guys shouldn't even bother with him, the guy can't even read.

Isn't it funny that every Bronco fan/writer on this board is exceptionally good or has no problem at all, but yet any Chiefs fan who comes on here is flamed at by you? Seems to me like you have a hatred for KC fans and anything that any KC fan says that does not compliment the Broncos is supposably dumb...

You can't even have a friendly argument. You show little facts. While others like me provide facts behind my assumptions, you come back calling people names and try belittling them. Here are some examples.

Chiefs fans think McIntosh is an upgrade over Jordan Black because:
A.Black is a true G who played LT
B.Black allowed 13 sacks last season. McIntosh allowed 5.5 sacks last season and 4 before that on an even worse offensive line in Miami.

Don't know about you, but a guy who gave up 7.5 less sacks on an even worse offensive line last year makes me feel a little bit better about the LT situation.

Another one is you saying Brodie Croyle doesn't have a good arm and if I recall correctly you said he has limited arm strength like Plummer.

I come back with a video of Croyle throwing the ball 68 yards in the skills competition beating guys like Vince Young.

Oh and I love how the Bronco fans here claim that Brodie Croyle is an injury waiting to happen, but yet Frank Gore, who has had surgeries on both knees for practically the same injury, not to mention he was also drafted in the 3rd round like Croyle, is never mentioned, but yet he RB which is by far more wear and tear to your legs, not to mention the constant hits he has on his legs from defenders pulling him down every time he runs the ball.

KCStud

07-21-2007, 05:29 PM

I see KCSheepStud is doing his best to show us how dumb he really is. You guys shouldn't even bother with him, the guy can't even read.

Isn't it funny that every Bronco fan/writer on this board is exceptionally good or has no problem at all, but yet any Chiefs fan who comes on here is flamed at by you? Seems to me like you have a hatred for KC fans and anything that any KC fan says that does not compliment the Broncos is supposably dumb...

You can't even have a friendly argument. You show little facts. While others like me provide facts behind my assumptions, you come back calling people names and try belittling them. Here are some examples.

Chiefs fans think McIntosh is an upgrade over Jordan Black because:
A.Black is a true G who played LT
B.Black allowed 13 sacks last season. McIntosh allowed 5.5 sacks last season and 4 in 2005 on an even worse offensive line in Miami.

Don't know about you, but a guy who gave up 7.5 less sacks on an even worse offensive line last year makes me feel a little bit better about the LT situation.

Another one is you saying Brodie Croyle doesn't have a good arm and if I recall correctly you said he has limited arm strength like Plummer.

I come back with a video of Croyle throwing the ball 68 yards in the skills competition beating guys like Vince Young.

Oh and I love how the Bronco fans here claim that Brodie Croyle is an injury waiting to happen, but yet Frank Gore, who has had surgeries on both knees for practically the same injury, not to mention he was also drafted in the 3rd round like Croyle, is never mentioned, but yet he's a RB which is by far more wear and tear on your legs, not to mention the constant hits he has on his legs from defenders pulling him down every time he runs the ball.

theAPAOps5

07-21-2007, 05:31 PM

No just dumb ass trolls like you and Bob get slammed KCDud. It was a skills competition retard not a game. Keep showing that football knowledge you are making Bob look all knowing.

Kaylore

07-21-2007, 05:38 PM

If I'm not mistaken, SureShot7 is a Bronco fan. When I said it was doubtful that Scheffy makes the pro bowl he says "sit back and watch".

Thems is fightin' words!

Inkana7

07-21-2007, 05:39 PM

No just dumb ass trolls like you and Bob get slammed KCDud. It was a skills competition retard not a game. Keep showing that football knowledge you are making Bob look all knowing.

Also; Plummer won the NFL Skills Competition twice with 70+ yard throws. And we know he has a limited arm.

KCStud

07-21-2007, 05:40 PM

No just dumb ass trolls like you and Bob get slammed KCDud. It was a skills competition retard not a game. Keep showing that football knowledge you are making Bob look all knowing.

What does it matter? The statement was made that Croyle has a weak arm. A QB with a weak arm couldn't throw the ball 68 yards.

And I have shown Croyle throwing the deep ball in a game. Try to keep up. 52 yard pass.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=6gba1XZb5bo

Inkana7

07-21-2007, 05:43 PM

What does it matter? The statement was made that Croyle has a weak arm. A QB with a weak arm couldn't throw the ball 68 yards.

And I have shown Croyle throwing the deep ball in a game. Try to keep up. 52 yard pass.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=6gba1XZb5bo

In a skills competition? Yes. Any QB with half an arm could heave a ball 68 yards. And 52 yards isn't impressive one bit.

The funny part is, you think you're winning this argument. Try to keep up.

Bob's your Information Minister

07-21-2007, 05:49 PM

Inkana7

07-21-2007, 05:55 PM

Are you folks seriously trying to argue that Croyle doesn't have a cannon? I mean, a comparison to Jake Plummer is simply laughable. Jake had a wet noodle for an arm. Croyle reminds me a little bit of JP Losman.

Oh, but in a skills competition, Plummer out throws Croyle. So according to KCDud, he must have a better arm.

Dukes

07-21-2007, 05:58 PM

Plummer does have a weak arm, yet you trolls are pounding your chests because Croyle can throw farther than him.

Raise your standards if you want to legitimize your argument

Kaylore

07-21-2007, 06:02 PM

Plummer had a pretty strong arm. His ability to throw on the run long distances is a testament to this as he rarely planted his feet and you get way more power from doing so when you throw. Jake could roll out to his left side and gun the thing on one foot fourty yards down field. That's pure arm strength. He was toward the bottom of the top third of the NFL QB's in arm strength.

Inkana7

07-21-2007, 06:04 PM

It's sheer veloticy that Plummer lacked.

Bob's your Information Minister

07-21-2007, 06:06 PM

He was toward the bottom of the top third of the NFL QB's in arm strength

LMAO...wow.

Kaylore

07-21-2007, 06:27 PM

It's sheer veloticy that Plummer lacked.

Yes but it wasn't because it wasn't "there". He could have had more power but his mechanics sucked and that negatively affects your power and accuracy when you throw.

KCStud

07-21-2007, 06:50 PM

In a skills competition? Yes. Any QB with half an arm could heave a ball 68 yards. And 52 yards isn't impressive one bit.

The funny part is, you think you're winning this argument. Try to keep up.

Than I guess Vince Young has a waterpistol. The point is that Croyle had one of the strongest arms and it has never been a problem for him. It is one of his strengths.
A 52 yard pass is impressive when you beat Reggie Nelson(first round draft pick). If that was Cutler you would would be posting it all day long and you know it...

KCStud

07-21-2007, 06:55 PM

Yes but it wasn't because it wasn't "there". He could have had more power but his mechanics sucked and that negatively affects your power and accuracy when you throw.

That's what the difference between Croyle and Plummer seems to be. Plummer always made poor decisions when throwing the ball. He tried squeezing the ball in a crowd of defenders idk how many times and paid for it neary every time. Plummer tried too hard to make a play. For crying out loud the guy made a left handed pass and threw an INT instead of taking a sack like any other QB would...

sirhcyennek81

07-21-2007, 06:58 PM

Uhh...Plummer doesnt play for us anymore and the chiefs are starting a nobody at QB. Until croyle actually plays in the NFL...hard to say how easy it is for him to throw a 52 yard pass.

:Broncos:

cutthemdown

07-21-2007, 07:03 PM

How far the ball travels is not really a true test. Some qbs have to loft it very high to get 60 yrds downfield. Other Qbs can get it there on a rope. I haven't watched enough of Croyle to make a judgement at this point. A pass can only stay in the air about what? maybe 1-3 seconds or the guy will throw 30 interceptions. These dbacks can cover 40 yrds in 4.5 seconds so really 70 yrd throws that hang in the air just won't get it done. The skills competition for distance should have hang time subtracted from the throw somehow.

WoodMan

07-21-2007, 07:10 PM

I really don't think it matters how far Croyle can throw the ball. Setting up, finding a receiver and getting the ball off is going to be damn near impossible behind that O-line. Whoever starts for the Chef's had better be very mobile and able to throw under pressure, because they are going to see a lot of it. What is a KC Stud? Isn't that an oxymoron? Well maybe not in the pasture. :rofl:

KCStud

07-21-2007, 07:16 PM

Florida_Bronco

07-21-2007, 07:49 PM

Isn't it funny that every Bronco fan/writer on this board is exceptionally good or has no problem at all, but yet any Chiefs fan who comes on here is flamed at by you? Seems to me like you have a hatred for KC fans and anything that any KC fan says that does not compliment the Broncos is supposably dumb...

I don't flame every Chiefs fan. Hell, I like Naptown, Crazyhorse and Tom A Hawk.

You can't even have a friendly argument. You show little facts. While others like me provide facts behind my assumptions, you come back calling people names and try belittling them. Here are some examples.

As usual, you got yourself a little mixed up over your facts. Hell, half the time you don't even know what I'm arguing for/against. Your reading comprehnsion is seriously poor.

Chiefs fans think McIntosh is an upgrade over Jordan Black because:
A.Black is a true G who played LT
B.Black allowed 13 sacks last season. McIntosh allowed 5.5 sacks last season and 4 before that on an even worse offensive line in Miami.

Don't know about you, but a guy who gave up 7.5 less sacks on an even worse offensive line last year makes me feel a little bit better about the LT situation.

Don't think we've ever argued about Black/McIntosh, so that's irrelevant

Another one is you saying Brodie Croyle doesn't have a good arm and if I recall correctly you said he has limited arm strength like Plummer.

I come back with a video of Croyle throwing the ball 68 yards in the skills competition beating guys like Vince Young.

Again, you fail miserably on reading comprehension. I never said Croyle didn't have a good arm, just that he doesn't have this rocket arm you claim he does. Much like Plummer, he has a strong arm and can hit the long ball but not with great velocity.

Oh and I love how the Bronco fans here claim that Brodie Croyle is an injury waiting to happen, but yet Frank Gore, who has had surgeries on both knees for practically the same injury, not to mention he was also drafted in the 3rd round like Croyle, is never mentioned, but yet he RB which is by far more wear and tear to your legs, not to mention the constant hits he has on his legs from defenders pulling him down every time he runs the ball.

Could it be because Frank Gore actually accomplished something at the NFL level?

Bob's your Information Minister

07-21-2007, 07:57 PM

Again, you fail miserably on reading comprehension. I never said Croyle didn't have a good arm, just that he doesn't have this rocket arm you claim he does. Much like Plummer, he has a strong arm and can hit the long ball but not with great velocity.

LMAO. This comparison of Plummer's arm against Croyle's is the poorest, most ignorant evaluation I've ever seen you make. Croyle does indeed have a rocket arm. Plummer's was pathetic. Ask any Arizona fan, or a Broncos fan who isn't delusional.

GreatBronco16

07-21-2007, 08:22 PM

Croyle does indeed have a rocket arm.

ROFL, sorry booby, but this is what a rocket arm really is.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H8FGdz0-OrY

And that was nearly all arm strength with no help from the rest of his body.

When Frayle can turn and make a throw like that, then you can say he has a rocket arm.

It's funny, I've been a Bama fan all my life, and during Croyles' time with the Tide, I never heard anyone refer to his arm as a rocket. But I guess he fueled that bad boy up right after he got drafted.

KCStud

07-21-2007, 10:39 PM

ROFL, sorry booby, but this is what a rocket arm really is.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H8FGdz0-OrY

And that was nearly all arm strength with no help from the rest of his body.

When Frayle can turn and make a throw like that, then you can say he has a rocket arm.

It's funny, I've been a Bama fan all my life, and during Croyles' time with the Tide, I never heard anyone refer to his arm as a rocket. But I guess he fueled that bad boy up right after he got drafted.

I have spoken to a few Bama fans and it seems like his arm is not a problem.

http://mbd.scout.com/mb.aspx?S=14#S=14&F=1016&T=680380

Florida_Bronco

07-21-2007, 10:45 PM

I have spoken to a few Bama fans and it seems like his arm is not a problem.

http://mbd.scout.com/mb.aspx?S=14#S=14&F=1016&T=680380

"Not a problem" and having a rocket arm are NOT mutually exclusive.

KCStud

07-21-2007, 10:57 PM

"Not a problem" and having a rocket arm are NOT mutually exclusive.

Apparently he has a cannon for an arm, not a rocket.

"great kid, cannon for an arm."

"Brodie has a great arm and can really make all of the throws"

"Great, great arm."

"You can't tell by looking at him, but Brodie has a BIG TIME arm. It's unbelievable how much zip he puts on the ball. He can make any throw you need to make."

"BC throws a beautiful deep ball accurately. Strong Arm as he "out-gunned" Vince in the ESPN distance comp by throwing it about 75 yds. in air."

Sounds good to me...

Bob's your Information Minister

07-21-2007, 10:59 PM

The only thing that matters in this discussion is that he ain't Jake Plummer, and his arm bears no resemblance to Plummer's. FIN.

Paladin

07-21-2007, 11:13 PM

Well, the time is a'coming and you'd better hope Breakie Frail has something, otherwise, it is tubesvile for the mullets. Again.....

KCStud

07-21-2007, 11:55 PM

Well, the time is a'coming and you'd better hope Jay Cutler has something, otherwise, it is tubesvile for the hillbillies. Again.....

Likewise

Florida_Bronco

07-21-2007, 11:58 PM

Likewise

Jay Cutler has thrown touchdowns to his own team. Brodie can't say the same. :spit:

KCStud

07-22-2007, 12:02 AM

Jay Cutler has thrown touchdowns to his own team. Brodie can't say the same. :spit:

Jay has also played more than 7 snaps. Wasn't Cutler the same QB who threw 2 INT's in his debut including one of them returned for a TD?

GreatBronco16

07-22-2007, 12:06 AM

I have spoken to a few Bama fans and it seems like his arm is not a problem.

http://mbd.scout.com/mb.aspx?S=14#S=14&F=1016&T=680380

A few Bama fans?? LMAO. I live right in the middle of Roll Tide Country. I have bared witness to many of Bama games, and have spoken to hundreds of Bama fans around this state. Trust me, his arm isn't all you guys are hyping it up to be. Now that is in no way me saying that he has a 'bad' arm.

But hey, jack yourself off to him.

GreatBronco16

07-22-2007, 12:07 AM

Jay has also played more than 7 snaps. Wasn't Cutler the same QB who threw 2 INT's in his debut including one of them returned for a TD?

I don't recall an INT of Cutlers returned for a TD last season, but then again, I don't remember much from last season anyway. We didn't win the big game, so I don't really care about last season.

Bob's your Information Minister

07-22-2007, 12:09 AM

Jay has also played more than 7 snaps. Wasn't Cutler the same QB who threw 2 INT's in his debut including one of them returned for a TD?

You have to understand that Bronco fans will take the slightest statistical data that casts a Chief in negative light and spin it into something it's not.

In 2005 when Larry Johnson fumbled in a game in Denver they tried to turn it into some kind of reasoning for why they "owned" him. I'd say the tables got turned on their ass on that one.

KCStud

07-22-2007, 12:09 AM

A few Bama fans?? LMAO. I live right in the middle of Roll Tide Country. I have bared witness to many of Bama games, and have spoken to hundreds of Bama fans around this state. Trust me, his arm isn't all you guys are hyping it up to be. Now that is in no way me saying that he has a 'bad' arm.

But hey, jack yourself off to him.

Good for you. The coach's, media, scouts, analyst, and fans say he has a very strong arm so I will take their opinions over yours respectively. How can I jack myself off to Croyle when you and all the other fans are already doing so to Cutler dominating one of the worst teams in the league? Hilarious!

Bob's your Information Minister

07-22-2007, 12:10 AM

I don't recall an INT of Cutlers returned for a TD last season.

That's really interesting, because not only did he throw one, he threw TWO of them!!! LOL

Florida_Bronco

07-22-2007, 12:11 AM

Jay has also played more than 7 snaps. Wasn't Cutler the same QB who threw 2 INT's in his debut including one of them returned for a TD?

But he threw a touchdown to his own team first. :wave:

KCStud

07-22-2007, 12:11 AM

I don't recall an INT of Cutlers returned for a TD last season, but then again, I don't remember much from last season anyway. We didn't win the big game, so I don't really care about last season.

Ya it was on Sunday Night Football I believe. Daryll Tapp got the INT

KCStud

07-22-2007, 12:12 AM

But he threw a touchdown to his own team first. :wave:

OMG he threw a TD to his own team first?? CHAMPIONSHIP!!! LOL

Bob's your Information Minister

07-22-2007, 12:16 AM

But he threw a touchdown to his own team first. :wave:

You say that like it means something. What both of these quarterbacks did last year is completely irrelevant.

Florida_Bronco

07-22-2007, 12:17 AM

OMG he threw a TD to his own team first?? CHAMPIONSHIP!!! LOL

Like I said, Brodie can't say the same.

KCStud

07-22-2007, 12:19 AM

Like I said, Brodie can't say the same.

I wouldn't expect Fay to be able to say he threw a TD pass to his own team if he only threw the ball 3 times all year and started from his own 35 yard line...

Florida_Bronco

07-22-2007, 12:30 AM

I wouldn't expect Fay to be able to say he threw a TD pass to his own team if he only threw the ball 3 times all year and started from his own 35 yard line...

If Brodie was any good, he'd have gone in when TrInt went down.

Bob's your Information Minister

07-22-2007, 12:35 AM

If Brodie was any good, he'd have gone in when TrInt went down.

Wow. Another load of BS. How many third-round picks play in Week 2 as rookies? I bet it's less than 1%.

KCStud

07-22-2007, 01:15 AM

If Brodie was any good, he'd have gone in when TrInt went down.

Are you seriously this stupid? Do you know anything about the NFL?

You do know he was a rookie right? He had just finished training camp and preseason and you expect him to come in in the opener?

Wow dumbest post of the year by far!

maher_tyler

07-22-2007, 01:28 AM

Why are KC fans so GD annoying on this board?? So BC can throw it 60 yards in a skills competition none the less, i'm sure theres some john doe in the street who can to but it doesn't make him a good NFL QB!! When BC can make a throw like the one j-Cut made in Arizona, then you can come in here and talk but until he does STFU about his arm strength nobody here could give two ****s, he has done zero nothing noda zilch squat in this league, until he does shut the F' up about it!! When BC can do what Cutler did in his first 5 starts then you can come in here to a BRONCOS fan site and talk ****!!

Again :kcbard: :kcbard: :kcbard:

sirhcyennek81

07-22-2007, 01:32 AM

Are you seriously this stupid? Do you know anything about the NFL?

You do know he was a rookie right? He had just finished training camp and preseason and you expect him to come in in the opener?

Wow dumbest post of the year by far!

Right. Because why put a rookie in early when you have a solid offensive line in front of him and a good rb behind him. The same gameplan they used for Collins they could have used for Croyle. But being a chief fan, this line of logic is beyond you.

:Broncos:

Florida_Bronco

07-22-2007, 01:36 AM

Are you seriously this stupid? Do you know anything about the NFL?

You do know he was a rookie right? He had just finished training camp and preseason and you expect him to come in in the opener?

Wow dumbest post of the year by far!

Well ya know I was trying to bring myself down to your level. Beating you over the head with logic and making fun of your reading skills made me feel like I was smacking around a retard, so I wanted to even the playing field.

I'm kinda worried that I'm not quite there yet. I might have to dumb myself down a little more.

maher_tyler

07-22-2007, 02:02 AM

Well ya know I was trying to bring myself down to your level. Beating you over the head with logic and making fun of your reading skills made me feel like I was smacking around a retard, so I wanted to even the playing field.

I'm kinda worried that I'm not quite there yet. I might have to dumb myself down a little more.
Hilarious! Hilarious! Hilarious!

Bob's your Information Minister

07-22-2007, 02:06 AM

Right. Because why put a rookie in early when you have a solid offensive line in front of him

How in any way was the Chiefs OL solid last year? Croyle would have gotten KILLED.

The same gameplan they used for Collins they could have used for Croyle.

TODD COLLINS? He's in WASHINGTON. :rofl:

BroncoBuff

07-22-2007, 02:56 AM

I don't recall an INT of Cutlers returned for a TD last season.
3 actually .... 1 (horrible one) in preseason in Arizona, Seattle, and SF.

Betcha he doesn't throw 3 all year as a fulltime starter this year though.

Funny story: We used to call three Int Ret TDs a "Blackledge Hat Trick." :~ohyah!:

KCStud

07-22-2007, 03:15 AM

Florida_Bronco

07-22-2007, 03:51 AM

Keep spinning pal...but I guess there is nowhere to go but up for you

Says the guy who can't even read a post and follow along with the discussion.

playing a rookie QB in the opener=waving the white flag

You could have left Huard in for a few games and then brought in the rookie.

KCStud

07-22-2007, 04:41 AM

Says the guy who can't even read a post and follow along with the discussion.

Just admit it. That was a hillariously stupid post that made absolutely no sense.

You could have left Huard in for a few games and then brought in the rookie.

Huard was 5-3 with an 11 TD to 1 INT ratio and the 2nd best QB rating in the NFL. Ever think that's why Brodie never played?

Florida_Bronco

07-22-2007, 05:54 AM

Just admit it. That was a hillariously stupid post that made absolutely no sense.

Let me ask you, KCSheepStud, do you honestly think you've ever come out on top in our little arguments?

Huard was 5-3 with an 11 TD to 1 INT ratio and the 2nd best QB rating in the NFL. Ever think that's why Brodie never played?[/QUOTE]

He was also nothing more than an efficent game manager who forced you to lean on LJ even more than normal. If Croyle was any good, you could have easily justified starting him.

cutthemdown

07-22-2007, 06:46 AM

You say that like it means something. What both of these quarterbacks did last year is completely irrelevant.

Foolish thinking. Cutlers extra reps and game experience for sure put him ahead of Croyles defelopment.

boltaneer

07-22-2007, 07:34 AM

KCStud

07-22-2007, 12:40 PM

Huard was 5-3 with an 11 TD to 1 INT ratio and the 2nd best QB rating in the NFL. Ever think that's why Brodie never played?

You wanna know look back at the posts where I post the facts and you cry like a girl calling me names. Question. Do you ever think before you post?

He was also nothing more than an efficent game manager who forced you to lean on LJ even more than normal. If Croyle was any good, you could have easily justified starting him.

That game manager played a big role in the team getting to the playoffs. Rookie QB's are not good. They never carry the team in year 1. Not even Cutler or you would have made it in the playoffs. Herm wanted to win last year. He played the guy who was gonna help his team win now.
Herm didn't waive the white flag like Ratty did by starting a rookie QB when your team is heading towards the playoffs...

Spider

07-22-2007, 12:46 PM

You wanna know look back at the posts where I post the facts and you cry like a girl calling me names. Question. Do you ever think before you post?

That game manager played a big role in the team getting to the playoffs. Rookie QB's are not good. They never carry the team in year 1. Not even Cutler or you would have made it in the playoffs. Herm wanted to win last year. He played the guy who was gonna help his team win now.
Herm didn't waive the white flag like Ratty did by starting a rookie QB when your team is heading towards the playoffs...
LOL I take it you didnt see the Broncos vs Chiefs game ...... Plummer flat out quit on the team , Surely you are not saying that Herm would coddle a QB that gave up on him .........

KCStud

07-22-2007, 12:49 PM

LOL I take it you didnt see the Broncos vs Chiefs game ...... Plummer flat out quit on the team , Surely you are not saying that Herm would coddle a QB that gave up on him .........

KC ended his career in a place he never won at..

Spider

07-22-2007, 12:54 PM

KC ended his career in a place he never won at..
so then tel me would Herm coddle a QB that gave up on him ?

you stated Herm wanted to win , Shanny waived the white flag , so tell me how does Herm win with a QB that quits on him ?

Inkana7

07-22-2007, 12:55 PM

You wanna know look back at the posts where I post the facts and you cry like a girl calling me names. Question. Do you ever think before you post?

That's exactly what this entire board asks you. From what we've seen so far, the answer is no. And you still think you're winning. You VASTLY overrate your own intelligence.

That game manager played a big role in the team getting to the playoffs. Rookie QB's are not good. They never carry the team in year 1. Not even Cutler or you would have made it in the playoffs. Herm wanted to win last year. He played the guy who was gonna help his team win now.
Herm didn't waive the white flag like Ratty did by starting a rookie QB when your team is heading towards the playoffs...

Ben Roethlisberger and Dan Marino disagree with you. And I wouldn't talk about Herm "wanting to win". When you replace a guy in Damon Huard, who you just pimped out, with a Trent Green who struggled like crazy, I don't rate that coaching decision very highly.

Paladin

07-22-2007, 01:03 PM

Discussing Football with a mullet fan like the dudes hereon is like discussing exercise routines with Jabba the Hutt.....

Spider

07-22-2007, 01:04 PM

Discussing Football with a mullet fan like the dudes hereon is like discussing exercise routines with Jabba the Hutt.....

LOL it was worth a shot ........

sirhcyennek81

07-22-2007, 01:05 PM

How in any way was the Chiefs OL solid last year? Croyle would have gotten KILLED.

TODD COLLINS? He's in WASHINGTON. :rofl:

You are an ass hat. Diaper boy ran 416 times last year, so obviously the plan was to run the ****ing ball as much as possible. That type of gameplan actually helps rookie quarterbacks...since you did the same thing with a 10 year vet last season...why didnt the chiefs do it with Croyle instead?

:Broncos:

Spider

07-22-2007, 01:12 PM

You are an ass hat. Diaper boy ran 416 times last year, so obviously the plan was to run the ****ing ball as much as possible. That type of gameplan actually helps rookie quarterbacks...since you did the same thing with a 10 year vet last season...why didnt the chiefs do it with Croyle instead?

:Broncos:
416 times played 16 games 1 playoff game ......
lets see add 12 , move the 3 over to here because it looks better , carry the 5 ....about 24 carries per game .... pretty solid work load to do every week

Paladin

07-22-2007, 01:31 PM

Herm will have him averaging 27 carries a game IF they get a new contract worked out.....

Dukes

07-22-2007, 01:37 PM

Herm will have him averaging 27 carries a game IF they get a new contract worked out.....

I'd say it's a good possibility they give him another 350+ carries even IF he gets his contract.

They'll get tired of 3 and outs with Croyle

KCStud

07-22-2007, 06:58 PM

Spider

07-22-2007, 07:02 PM

I love it how the hillbilly fans here think Jay Cutler will win them the SB this year, Scheffy will make the pro bowl over Gonzo, and your anorexic first round draft pick will get double digit sacks

Life must be good in a fantasy land :rofl: Hilarious!
tell me was you born this stupid , or is there medication , you take ?
we get to the super bowl , it wont be because of Cutler , it will be our running game and defense

Bob's your Information Minister

07-22-2007, 07:02 PM

That type of gameplan actually helps rookie quarterbacks...since you did the same thing with a 10 year vet last season...why didnt the chiefs do it with Croyle instead?

Because Croyle was not even close to being ready. This isn't rocket science. The Chiefs would not have gone 9-7 with Croyle. Huard was instrumental in several games where we were forced to pass.

Hercules Rockefeller

07-22-2007, 07:03 PM

I love it how the hillbilly fans here think Jay Cutler will win them the SB this year, Scheffy will make the pro bowl over Gonzo, and your anorexic first round draft pick will get double digit sacks

Life must be good in a fantasy land :rofl: Hilarious!

and I love it when a mullet fan is ignorant enough to call another team's fanbase a bunch of hillbillies

Bob's your Information Minister

07-22-2007, 07:07 PM

and I love it when a mullet fan is ignorant enough to call another team's fanbase a bunch of hillbillies

More hills in Denver than KC. ;D

Northman

07-22-2007, 07:10 PM

Inkana7

07-22-2007, 07:13 PM

Are you implying it cant be done? Big Ben anyone? :rofl:

He has some sort of notion that we believe Cutler is a god and everyone else on our roster is a pro bolwer. I have no idea where this comes from. I think it's mainly because he's retarded.

Spider

07-22-2007, 07:14 PM

He has some sort of notion that we believe Cutler is a god and everyone else on our roster is a pro bolwer. I have no idea where this comes from. I think it's mainly because he's retarded.

the real trick is pointing to a chief fan that isnt retarded

Dukes

07-22-2007, 08:17 PM

More hills in Denver than KC. ;D

You mean places like Vail and Aspen

http://www.concierge.com/images/cnt/lists/hotlist06/usa+canada/hyattgrandaspen/aspen_hotel_005p.jpg

You won't find a camaro on cinder blocks within 50 miles. Can you say that?

http://www.pictureninja.com/pages/united-states/colorado/downtown-aspen.jpg

Broncos_OTM

07-22-2007, 10:47 PM

OMG he threw a TD to his own team first?? CHAMPIONSHIP!!! LOL

Cutler was a rookie last year. of course he is gonna screw up. it is understandable. and even may i say expected. croyle has a arm but he must have more then that to be a player in this leauge. were gonna find out this year aint we. i will expect croyle to make mistakes but acting like a rookie QB is not gonna make them is a soft defense. i meant a KC defense

Broncos_OTM

07-22-2007, 10:56 PM

I love it how the hillbilly fans here think Jay Cutler will win them the SB this year, Scheffy will make the pro bowl over Gonzo, and your anorexic first round draft pick will get double digit sacks

Life must be good in a fantasy land :rofl: Hilarious!if denver asked moss to play LDE i would be worried but playing in a system that requires him to play one gap and get up field to the QB i dont care his size because we all know at 250 lbs even 255 it can be done. dumervile kerse haley taylor just to name a few.

Scheffler needs to work on his Blocking. he has all the mesureables to be good. its jsut that he has to work at it.

Noone in this thread said scheffler was better then tony g so quit with the lame attack. of course there are some that dont know football that are gonna make stupid comments on a board weather they be cheif fans or broncos fans. just so happens everytime i open a thread that you and bob make absoloutly no sense and troll and cry everytime something is said.

Broncos_OTM

07-22-2007, 10:58 PM

More hills in Denver than KC. ;D

A big differance between a hill and a Moutain. guess you didnt get the differance.

KCStud

07-22-2007, 11:32 PM

and I love it when a mullet fan is ignorant enough to call another team's fanbase a bunch of hillbillies

Even more hillarious when a hillbilly fan calls KC fans mullet fans when there are very little if any mullets in the area. Also like it how hillbilly fans call Chiefs fans farmers, but yet all the farming is done in Kansas and Oklahoma.
Newsflash: The KC Chiefs reside in Missouri not Kansas

Inkana7

07-23-2007, 12:01 AM

Even more hillarious when a hillbilly fan calls KC fans mullet fans when there are very little if any mullets in the area. Also like it how hillbilly fans call Chiefs fans farmers, but yet all the farming is done in Kansas and Oklahoma.
Newsflash: The KC Chiefs reside in Missouri not Kansas

http://cnnstudentnews.cnn.com/2002/fyi/news/04/22/sb.blues.man/dateline.kansas.city.jpg

By a whole 3 inches.

Bob's your Information Minister

07-23-2007, 12:06 AM

This really looks like a place where hillbillies hang out:

http://img201.imageshack.us/img201/4331/plazalights2223webcs1.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Inkana7

07-23-2007, 12:12 AM

This really looks like a place where hillbillies hang out:

http://img201.imageshack.us/img201/4331/plazalights2223webcs1.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

West Virginia has cities too.

http://www.camcinstitute.org/images/Charleston%20WV%20SJS.jpg

Bob's your Information Minister

07-23-2007, 12:15 AM

Yeah, but do you see any hills in the picture of KC? I don't. I can almost smell the bucktoothed neanderthals in the hills in the WV picture.

Inkana7

07-23-2007, 12:17 AM

Yeah, but do you see any hills in the picture of KC? I don't. I can almost smell the bucktoothed neanderthals in the hills in the WV picture.

To be fair, it IS West Virginia we're talking about.

DenverBrit

07-23-2007, 01:08 AM

To be fair, it IS West Virginia we're talking about.

You're talking to an unemployed, ex-pat Scot who hides in his Mom's basement in Texas, Trolls online all day and plays with Star Wars dolls.

What do you expect to learn? :spit:

ZachKC

07-23-2007, 01:17 AM

Lots of good things out here in KC. It has been fun.

<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/zachishere/531294015/" title="Photo Sharing"><img src="http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1351/531294015_7d5e9ac6da.jpg" width="500" height="333" alt="IMG_7119" /></a>

<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/zachishere/815093715/" title="Photo Sharing"><img src="http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1404/815093715_c9259dc6b1.jpg" width="500" height="221" alt="IMG_9497" /></a>

<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/zachishere/815093127/" title="Photo Sharing"><img src="http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1035/815093127_96543927fb.jpg" width="500" height="241" alt="IMG_9437" /></a>

<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/zachishere/564047423/" title="Photo Sharing"><img src="http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1295/564047423_318aadb64b.jpg" width="500" height="333" alt="IMG_8518-Edit" /></a>