Pac Man Passes the Buck

[Rohirrim]

In his bid to play in the NFL this season, Pacman Jones is using the "everyone does it" defense. NFL commissioner Roger Goodell recently suspended the Tennessee Titans star for the 2007 season because of his multiple run-ins with the law.

http://www.denverpost.com/sports/ci_5841458

[ludo21]

proving once again that he just doesnt get it.

[Tredici]

Jones' attorneys list 21 pages of incidents, 11 involving the Titans, dating to 2000.

So apparently past bad behavior is now to used as the legal basis for current bad behavior. I think I'll go kill a couple people and then say there have already been so many people convicted of murder, no need for another one.

Aye yi yi.

[Smiling Assassin27]

That's NOT the defense you wanna take with Goodell. What a fool.

[Los Broncos]

That's NOT the defense you wanna take with Goodell. What a fool.

Exactly.

[-Slap-]

Leaving aside Pacman's attempts to throw them all under the bus collectively, its absolutely deplorable that 283 NFL players have been arrested since 2007.

[GonzoLays]

What can goodell do to him now? He might as well go all out in his defense and make goodell look bad in the process.

"Oh, so two DUI's, one domestic violence charge and four parking tickets for player X is of no concern to you? What till we release this information and make the rest of the NFL look like a halfway house. I say we deal, Mr. Goodell. It is only in your best interests to do so."

[GonzoLays]

Leaving aside Pacman's attempts to throw them all under the bus collectively, its absolutely deplorable that 283 NFL players have been arrested since 2007.

Then quit watching.

[watermock]

Sure, all players have their posse light up a nightclub at 5 in the morning and have been caught lying about a felony dog fighting kennel.

Whatever. When he gets out of jail in a year or two he can serve his suspension.

What happened to the "I didn't know" BS? I loved the carefully worded lawyer's statement that is simply going to bleed him for every penny he can.

Thanks Mr. Lawyer, for indicting other players making Goodell's work easier.

[watermock]

What can goodell do to him now? He might as well go all out in his defense and make goodell look bad in the process.

"Oh, so two DUI's, one domestic violence charge and four parking tickets for player X is of no concern to you? What till we release this information and make the rest of the NFL look like a halfway house. I say we deal, Mr. Goodell. It is only in your best interests to do so."

Care to place a name on that? Inquiring minds want to know. Why would Goodell be inclined to "Plea Bargain" Gonzo? Pacman's lawyer is going to make him look what...let me guess.

Pacman has getting by with crap for so long he thinks he's immune. His lawyer will fleece him and lose.

[Hotrod]

What can goodell do to him now? He might as well go all out in his defense and make goodell look bad in the process.

"Oh, so two DUI's, one domestic violence charge and four parking tickets for player X is of no concern to you? What till we release this information and make the rest of the NFL look like a halfway house. I say we deal, Mr. Goodell. It is only in your best interests to do so."

I think your girlfriend Vick needs your attention more at the moment. Go defend that dirt bag for awhile.

[watermock]

Vick is making himself look bad without any help from Goodell. I'm confident that this is even more serious and he's waiting for indictments on this.

Your going to have the lawyer make Goodell look bad?

[-Slap-]

Then quit watching.

Who's going to explain the game to weak-kneed fags like you?

[BroncoInferno]

I'm a bit on the fence on this issue. On the one hand, I'm a firm believer in "innocent until proven guilty" and letting due process complete its course before retribution is sought. That fact the Pac-Man was suspended even though he has yet to be convicted of the various charges bothers that sensibility. On the other hand, it is unlikely that an innocent victim of circumstance would land himself in jail nine times. Not sure how I feel about these tougher guidelines for those conflicting reasons.

[Bladerunner]

His defense is valid, but only reinforces the issue that Goodell is aiming to fix.

"Thank you for the information...you have affirmed my assessment that the league needs a good housecleaning. You're the vanguard, congratulations!

[Atwater His Ass]

I'm a bit on the fence on this issue. On the one hand, I'm a firm believer in "innocent until proven guilty" and letting due process complete its course before retribution is sought. That fact the Pac-Man was suspended even though he has yet to be convicted of the various charges bothers that sensibility. On the other hand, it is unlikely that an innocent victim of circumstance would land himself in jail nine times. Not sure how I feel about these tougher guidelines for those conflicting reasons.

Business suspend employees that are under investigation all the time. Pending the ressult of the investigation they may or may not be reinstated. I don't see how this is any different.

[Billy Clyde Puckett]

Then quit watching.

That's what has happened with the NBA and why Goodell is on this mission.

[ozomulsion]

Sure, all players have their posse light up a nightclub at 5 in the morning and have been caught lying about a felony dog fighting kennel.

Whatever. When he gets out of jail in a year or two he can serve his suspension.

What happened to the "I didn't know" BS? I loved the carefully worded lawyer's statement that is simply going to bleed him for every penny he can.

Thanks Mr. Lawyer, for indicting other players making Goodell's work easier.

Football players don't go to jail unless they deal kilo's of Coke(Jamal Lewis).

[GonzoLays]

That's what has happened with the NBA and why Goodell is on this mission.

No, people stopped watching the NBA when it became "too black" for America.

[watermock]

No, people stopped watching the NBA when it became "too black" for America.

Like the NFL Gonzo?

[Billy Clyde Puckett]

No, people stopped watching the NBA when it became "too black" for America.

Wrong again

[-Slap-]

That's why the NBA MVP every year is white, right?

[Atwater His Ass]

Define "too black".

[Hotrod]

Define "too black".


Well in Bonzos world it means

1. I'm losing the argument and look stupid
2. I'm gonna pull the race card and scare people from the issue
3. Look at me

[Williams]

"Thank you for the information...you have affirmed my assessment that the league needs a good housecleaning. You're the vanguard, congratulations!

ROFL!

[TheDave]

From the best i can tell Adam Jones seems to be a world class peice of sh!t... Problem is this "new system" put together by Goodell looks to be extremely arbitrary. The fact of the matter is, every one of these disciplinary actoins taken by the commissioner is going to be appealed in a similiar manner. How lse do you challenge a ruling where one player gets a 10 game suspension for multiple arrests and no convictions and a similiar player is out 8 games for multiple arrests and convictions.

By the way I realize that everyone is just having a good time piling on the guy, but does anyone actuallybelieve that Pacman is the one who put together this appeal. Sure it sounds like he is pointing the finger to get out of trouble, when in all actuality his laywers probably felt this was the best way to proceed.

[Beantown Bronco]

Problem is this "new system" put together by Goodell looks to be extremely arbitrary.

How so?

[TheDave]

How so?

Chris Henry

Arrested 4 times in 14 months on charges ranging from DUI to a weapons charge.

He pled guilty to all 4

Henry previously as suspended 4 games for violation of the NFL's substance abuse policy

Verdict: Suspended 8 games


Adam Jones

Arrested 5 times and questioned by police 10 times since being drafted

Has not been convicted of a crime... yet

Verdict: Suspended 10 games

[BroncsRule]

Well in Bonzos world it means

1. Look at me!
2. Look at me!!
3. Look at me!!!

fixed it for you.

[-Slap-]

From the best i can tell Adam Jones seems to be a world class peice of sh!t... Problem is this "new system" put together by Goodell looks to be extremely arbitrary. The fact of the matter is, every one of these disciplinary actoins taken by the commissioner is going to be appealed in a similiar manner. How lse do you challenge a ruling where one player gets a 10 game suspension for multiple arrests and no convictions and a similiar player is out 8 games for multiple arrests and convictions.

By the way I realize that everyone is just having a good time piling on the guy, but does anyone actuallybelieve that Pacman is the one who put together this appeal. Sure it sounds like he is pointing the finger to get out of trouble, when in all actuality his laywers probably felt this was the best way to proceed.

I'm just glad his lawyers can soak him for more billable hours.

[Tredici]

Well in Bonzos world it means

1. I'm losing the argument and look stupid
2. I'm gonna pull the race card and scare people from the issue
3. Look at me

LOL

Oh Jeez, Hotrod. The only thing you missed is each one should've said:

"Fact " before the numbers.

Pretty much sums up "Oh so Controversial" Boy in a nutshell. Excellent work!

[WoodMan]

I'm a bit on the fence on this issue. On the one hand, I'm a firm believer in "innocent until proven guilty" and letting due process complete its course before retribution is sought. That fact the Pac-Man was suspended even though he has yet to be convicted of the various charges bothers that sensibility. On the other hand, it is unlikely that an innocent victim of circumstance would land himself in jail nine times. Not sure how I feel about these tougher guidelines for those conflicting reasons.

I would agree with you if this were a court of law, but this is Corporate America. Can anyone say Kenneth Lay(Enron), Bernie Ebbers(MCI), or Michael Miliken (Insider trading). These buttheads were all fired or suspended long before they had a court appearance. Why would the NFL do things any differently?

[broncosteven]

What can goodell do to him now? He might as well go all out in his defense and make goodell look bad in the process.

"Oh, so two DUI's, one domestic violence charge and four parking tickets for player X is of no concern to you? What till we release this information and make the rest of the NFL look like a halfway house. I say we deal, Mr. Goodell. It is only in your best interests to do so."

It is a shame that everyone on this planet does not hold themselves accountable for their actions. It is also a shame that people have little or no respect for others.

Hardwork & keeping your nose clean & your personal life private is not seen as a way to pump up ones REP with his "friends" or "hangers on" how every you see them, in today's climate.

I am reading a book on the 1964 Cleveland Browns, states that the players used their Championship winnings to buy houses in modest neighborhoods and had 2nd jobs during the off season.

Humility is a good character to have.

I am already teaching my 4 year old to be responsible for herself & not others. This way she knows it is not acceptable to tattle on Mary or John when they call others names or toss over $80k on a hooker. She is beginning to understand that their actions are not acceptable & that she should not act that way. She does not have it down 100% but she is only 4.

[broncosteven]

Lee Cantor was a god:

http://maxweber.hunter.cuny.edu/pub/eres/EDSPC715_MCINTYRE/AssertiveDiscipline.html

Assertive discipline is a structured, systematic approach designed to assist educators in running an organized, teacher-in-charge classroom environment. Lee and Marlene Canter, when consulting for school systems, found that many teachers were unable to control undesirable behavior that occurred in their classrooms. The Cantors, rightfully so, attributed this to a lack of training in the area of behavior management. Based on their research and the foundations of assertiveness training and applied behavior analysis, they developed a common sense, easy-to-learn approach to help teachers become the captains of their classrooms and positively influence their students' behavior. Today, it is the most widely used "canned" (prepared/packaged) behavior management program. Assertive discipline has evolved since the mid 70's from an authoritarian approach to one that is more democratic and cooperative.

The Cantors believe that you, as the teacher, have the right to determine what is best for your students, and to expect compliance. No pupil should prevent you from teaching, or keep another student from learning. Student compliance is imperative in creating and maintaining an effective and efficient learning environment. To accomplish this goal, teachers must react assertively, as opposed to aggressively or non assertively.

Assertive teachers react confidently and quickly in situations that require behavior management. They have a few clearly stated classroom rules and give firm, clear, concise directions to students who are in need of outside control. Students who comply are reinforced, whereas those who disobey rules and directions receive negative consequences. Assertive teachers do not see students as adversaries, nor do they use an abrasive, sarcastic, hostile style (a "hostile teacher"). Neither do they react in a passive, inconsistent, timid, non directive manner (a "non-assertive teacher").

Assertive teachers believe that a firm, teacher-in-charge classroom is in the best interests of students. They believe that the students wish to have their behavior directed by the teacher. The Canter's state that society demands appropriate behavior if one is to be accepted and successful. Therefore, no one benefits when a student is allowed to misbehave. Teachers show their concern for today's youth when they demand and promote appropriate classroom behavior. Additionally, educators have the right to request and expect assistance from parents and administrators in their efforts.

More than being a director, assertive teachers build positive, trusting relationships with their students and teach appropriate classroom behavior (via direct instruction...describing, modeling, practicing, reviewing, encouraging and rewarding) to those who don't show it at present. They are demanding, yet warm in interaction, supportive of the youngsters, and respectful when addressing misbehavior. Assertive teachers listen carefully to what their students have to say, speak respectfully to them, and treat everyone fairly (not necessarily equally).



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

How to Use Assertive Discipline

1. Dismiss the thought that there is any acceptable reason for misbehavior (Biologically based misbehavior may be an exception).

2. Decide which rules you wish to implement in your classroom. Devise four or five rules that are specific and easily understood by your students. (For more on making rules, see the home page link on "How to create your own behavior management system")

3. Determine negative consequences for noncompliance (You will be providing a consequence EVERY TIME a student misbehaves). Choose three to six negative consequences (a "discipline hierarchy"), each of which is more punitive or restrictive than the previous one. These will be administered if the student continues to misbehave. The Canters recommend that you NOT continue punishing if talking with the youngster will help to defuse the situation. (For more on making and implementing consequences, see the home page link on "How to create your own behavior management system")

4. Determine positive consequences for appropriate behavior. For example, along with verbal praise, you might also include raffle tickets that are given to students for proper behavior. Students write their names on the cut up pieces of paper and drop them into a container for a daily prize drawing. Even if a student is having a bad day, there is a reason to improve...s/he might get a ticket and have a chance at winning the raffle prize. Others might receive notes of praise to be shown to their parents.
Group rewards are also used. A marble might be dropped into a jar for each predetermined interval that the class as a whole has been attentive and respectful. When the jar is full, a special event is held. Some assertive teachers also write a letter of the alphabet on the board for each period of good group behavior. When the letters spell "Popcorn Party" (or some other activity), that event is held.

5. Conduct a meeting to inform the students of the program. Explain why rules are needed. List the rules on the board along with the positive and negative consequences. Check for understanding. Review periodically.

6. Have the students write the rules and take them home to be signed by the parents and returned (optional depending on age, language of parents, chances of forms being returned, etc.). Attach a message explaining the program and requesting their help.

7. Implement the program immediately.

8. Become skilled in the use of other assertive discipline techniques:
a. Communicate your displeasure with a student's misbehavior, but then be sure to tell the student what to do. For example: "Bill, stop writing and pass your paper forward." Notice that the teacher told the student what not to do, but also told the student what to do. Many students continue to display inappropriate behavior when they have been told to discontinue because they do not know what they should be doing. Now that you have given a direction, you can reinforce the student for compliance or punish him or her for noncompliance. Be sure to add emphasis to your directions by using eye contact, hand gestures, and the student's name.
b. Recognize and quickly respond to appropriate behavior. This quick action will encourage the students to display the desired behavior more often. Be aware that some students may need to be reinforced quietly or non-verbally to prevent embarrassment in front of peers.
c. Learn to use the "broken record" technique. Continue to repeat your command (a maximum of three times) until the student follows your directions. Do not be sidetracked by the student's excuses. For example:
Teacher: "Vince, you have work to do. Get away from that window and sit in your seat."
Student: "But I want to see the cop give that guy a ticket."
Teacher: "I understand, but I want you to sit down now."
Student: "'Just one minute, OK?"
Teacher: "'No, Vince, I want you to sit down now."
Student: "Aw, OK."
Nice kid. If the command is not followed, you might issue a choice to the student. This can be done after the first, second, or third request. Give the student a choice between following the command or facing a consequence for disobedience. For example: "Vince, you have a choice. You can sit down now or you'll sit with me after school (or during recess)." If you find it necessary to implement the consequence, make it clear to the student that he or she made the decision as to which option will occur. The consequence should be administered quickly and in a calm, matter-of-fact manner. In the above situation, you would move through your list of negative consequences until the student complies.
d. Learn to use the "positive repetitions" technique. This is a disguised way of repeating your rules so that all students know what to do (Taken from Kounin's "ripple effect"). Repeat the directions as positive statements to students who are complying with your commands (e.g. "Jason raised his hand to be recognized. So did Harold and Cynthia.").
e. Use "proximity praise" (also borrowed from Kounin). Instead of just focusing on the misbehaving students, praise youngsters near them who are doing the correct thing. It is hoped that the misbehaving students will then model that appropriate behavior (Kounin's "ripple effect"). The comments can be specific and obvious for younger students. More subtle recognition is required for adolescents.
f. Use proximity control...moving toward misbehaving students (younger kids). Invite adolescents into the hallway to talk to avoid embarrassment in front of peers (and the negative behavior that will result if you engage in public chastisement).
g. If kids don't presently possess a desired classroom behavior, teach it to them. This involves more than giving commands. Teach and roleplay to promote responsible behavior

[Garcia Bronco]

Leaving aside Pacman's attempts to throw them all under the bus collectively, its absolutely deplorable that 283 NFL players have been arrested since 2007.

that's what happens when you take punk kids out of a ghetto or hand kids everything for nothing.

[Garcia Bronco]

I'm a bit on the fence on this issue. On the one hand, I'm a firm believer in "innocent until proven guilty" and letting due process complete its course before retribution is sought. That fact the Pac-Man was suspended even though he has yet to be convicted of the various charges bothers that sensibility. On the other hand, it is unlikely that an innocent victim of circumstance would land himself in jail nine times. Not sure how I feel about these tougher guidelines for those conflicting reasons.


due process of law are constitutionally protected...his right to a job in th eNFL doesn't exist. No one has a right to a job. Basically with the union guidelines Roger can do what ever he wants

[broncosteven]

that's what happens when you take punk kids out of a ghetto or hand kids everything for nothing.

This happens to rich and middle class honkeys from suburbia also. Ignorance has no boundaries.

Hence my Reference to the Lee Cantor Method.

Every child should be so lucky to have a structured learning disipline that allows them to define their morals and conduct through self discovery.

Society needs to demand more from people like Paris Hilton and sports stars across all sports.

If you ignore the problem it does not go away it gets worse, festering & growing.

[Hotrod]

Every child should be so lucky to have a structured learning disipline that allows them to define their morals and conduct through self discovery.

.

I think drugging the little bastages more often is a better option.

[broncosteven]

I think drugging the little bastages more often is a better option.

They end up drugging themselves without it!

I implemented this with Abby a few weeks back after she started getting out of control at home on weekends. I realized this was the method that daycare used during the week & she thought that since she was home all day on weekends that she would get a free ride.

I told her my expectations & set a 2 strike rule.

1st day she was in timeout on the 2nd strike over anything she did not do that we asked or anything she did wrong. We offered positive reinforcement when she followed instructions or listened. It was a long day.

The 2nd day I did not have to reprimand. I just told her the 1st time she did something bad that the next time she would go to timeout & she stopped.

People of all ages try to push their limits. They have to learn what is expected and learn how to get satisfaction from following directions. They cannot be told how to act, it takes a self discovery to get someone to make personal changes.

Pac Man needs a self discovery.

[GonzoLays]

Wrong again

Ha, what do you know about the NBA?

Do you really believe white America stopped watching the NBA because the players got in too much trouble? Are you serious?

Tell me, Big Guy, what sort of major discipline problems were the NBA players having that made you stopped watching. All the killings? Rapes? What was the major problem?

[BroncoInSkinland]

Lee Cantor was a god:

http://maxweber.hunter.cuny.edu/pub/eres/EDSPC715_MCINTYRE/AssertiveDiscipline.html

etc...

Really appreciate the link, provides a lot of useful information. I have recently found myself in the position of being an autority figure for several children. I am relatively certain this will help me in that role.

[Hotrod]

Just for the record I dont condone the drugging of school children ;D

I agree with the method to a degree. I also think we craddle our children way to much these days.

[broncosteven]

Just for the record I dont condone the drugging of school children ;D

I agree with the method to a degree. I also think we craddle our children way to much these days.

I know you were not Hotrod! I am ranting!

This acting out by "Adults" bugs me.

Too bad once you are an adult the only authority figure left is your Boss or worse, the police.

[broncosteven]

Really appreciate the link, provides a lot of useful information. I have recently found myself in the position of being an autority figure for several children. I am relatively certain this will help me in that role.

Good luck with your child, just rememeber to talior it to suit the situation. I am far from perfect, this method has helped me also.

[watermock]

Ha, what do you know about the NBA?

Do you really believe white America stopped watching the NBA because the players got in too much trouble? Are you serious?

Tell me, Big Guy, what sort of major discipline problems were the NBA players having that made you stopped watching. All the killings? Rapes? What was the major problem?

You measure accountability in any sport by race? If someone chooses not to watch so what. What do you know about the NBA BTW Gonzo?

Big Guy can choose or not to choose to watch the game, and I will be rooting for the Spurs.

Your trying to run the tables to the meat of the thread completely. It's not about the NBA at all. It was about Adam Jones.

[Hotrod]

Does anyone know if there is a Miss Pacman?

[Northman]

No, people stopped watching the NBA when it became "too black" for America.

:rofl: :rofl:

[gunns]

What can goodell do to him now? He might as well go all out in his defense and make goodell look bad in the process.

"Oh, so two DUI's, one domestic violence charge and four parking tickets for player X is of no concern to you? What till we release this information and make the rest of the NFL look like a halfway house. I say we deal, Mr. Goodell. It is only in your best interests to do so."

Sorry Mr. Jones, we're talking about YOUR situation.

[Northman]

Ha, what do you know about the NBA?

Do you really believe white America stopped watching the NBA because the players got in too much trouble? Are you serious?

Tell me, Big Guy, what sort of major discipline problems were the NBA players having that made you stopped watching. All the killings? Rapes? What was the major problem?


Horrible Fundamentals like teamwork, shooting accuracy, etc.

[gunns]

No, people stopped watching the NBA when it became "too black" for America.

You betcha. That's why I make sure to only watch the Jazz. :stupid: