war against moderate islam

[yavoon]

hey, I'm american I like to say "war on..."!

moderate muslims are hard enough to find as is, but there is a concerted effort by leftists and islamists to not let any liberal/moderate muslims actually be heard.

http://www.americanthinker.com/2007/05/moderate_and_radical_muslims_t.html

"The radicals and their Persian Gulf backers now dominate 80% of U.S. mosques and Muslim organizations, according to Sufi leader Hisham Kabbani, whom mainstream Muslim groups blackballed for testifying to the U.S. State Department in January 1999."

[atomicbloke]

hey, I'm american I like to say "war on..."!

moderate muslims are hard enough to find as is, but there is a concerted effort by leftists and islamists to not let any liberal/moderate muslims actually be heard.

http://www.americanthinker.com/2007/05/moderate_and_radical_muslims_t.html

"The radicals and their Persian Gulf backers now dominate 80% of U.S. mosques and Muslim organizations, according to Sufi leader Hisham Kabbani, whom mainstream Muslim groups blackballed for testifying to the U.S. State Department in January 1999."

The world will never run out of idiots.

[Atlas]

yep but of course the President says that this was an unforceable misscalculation. How could they possiblyhave known before had that Iran would give power and guns to the shiites and how would Bush have known they would force threir agenda on everyone. Really How could have Bush possibly seen such a senario. I mean you would have to know history and be able to read books and watch news to understand that this was going to happen. No way Bush coulda known.

[yavoon]

The world will never run out of idiots.

if they were so easy to find why do we need CAIR and why do we have the taxas legislature inviting khomeini supporters? if the world was abound in beautiful liberal muslims why do women in norway get beatan unconscious for pointing out that the imams in mosques support female circumsion, or why do ppl get kicked out of mosques in america for writing into the newspaper saying osama bin laden was a bad guy?

[atomicbloke]

if they were so easy to find why do we need CAIR and why do we have the taxas legislature inviting khomeini supporters? if the world was abound in beautiful liberal muslims why do women in norway get beatan unconscious for pointing out that the imams in mosques support female circumsion, or why do ppl get kicked out of mosques in america for writing into the newspaper saying osama bin laden was a bad guy?

If you were to step away from the media and actually go into the real world around you.... like step into some major universities around the country.... where you will find muslim professors.... or go to some national research labs or NASA or JPL.... you will find muslim scientists.... go make the rounds of corporate america.... you will find muslim executives..... muslim entrepreuners in this country have started startup companies that provide employment to thousands of non-muslims in this country and around the world.... are they all gun totting terrorists? The nature of my job made me interact on a personal level with people of many different religions, muslims being one of them..... i used to have muslim neighbors, had muslim colleagues at the university, had a muslim boss, interviwed with a muslim ceo of a large american firm.... and I have never been beaten up or kicked out of anywhere... I am still alive....

Do I condone extremist muslims? Ofcourse not. The dictators and the fundamentalists are a scourge to humanity and need to eradicated. Such blatant human rights violations are unacceptable in the 21st century.

But to claim that it is hard to find peaceful muslims is an extremely ignorant statement.

[yavoon]

If you were to step away from the media and actually go into the real world around you.... like step into some major universities around the country.... where you will find muslim professors.... or go to some national research labs or NASA or JPL.... you will find muslim scientists.... go make the rounds of corporate america.... you will find muslim executives..... muslim entrepreuners in this country have started startup companies that provide employment to thousands of non-muslims in this country and around the world.... are they all gun totting terrorists? The nature of my job made me interact on a personal level with people of many different religions, muslims being one of them..... i used to have muslim neighbors, had muslim colleagues at the university, had a muslim boss, interviwed with a muslim ceo of a large american firm.... and I have never been beaten up or kicked out of anywhere... I am still alive....

Do I condone extremist muslims? Ofcourse not. The dictators and the fundamentalists are a scourge to humanity and need to eradicated. Such blatant human rights violations are unacceptable in the 21st century.

But to claim that it is hard to find peaceful muslims is an extremely ignorant statement.

nice speech, meaningless, but nice.

and muslim universities where I can find the lovely MSA? yah they're great, never a nicer bunch of supremacists.

and I dont say its hard to find peaceful muslims, when have I ever said that? I said it was hard to find liberal/moderate ones. it seems to me that if the world was truly awash in liberal muslims that just sticking ur hand in a hat u'd be most likely to get one. and yet look who the muslim world is represented by? like that article says 80% of the muslim organizations are run by fundamentalists.

I've posted on this forum about articles where liberal muslims get beatan unconscious, threataned, kicked out of mosques, ostracized, and this is all in the WEST. the highest muslim cleric in australia thinks osama is a swell guy, and thinks women who don't cover up have it coming to them when they're raped.

I dont know if u cared to read the article but take this for example:
"At least anecdotally, the film corroborates the findings of a face-to-face poll of more than 4,384 Muslims, in which about 66% supported radicalism and international Shari'a law"

sharia law is bigoted, mysoginistic, oppressive, violent, cruel, and probably some other nice adjectives.

I'd love it if there were moderate muslims around. I'd love it if the texas legislature could go out and get a real liberal and not a supporter of a completely psychotic bigot like ayatollah khomeini.

[atomicbloke]

nice speech, meaningless, but nice.

and muslim universities where I can find the lovely MSA? yah they're great, never a nicer bunch of supremacists.

and I dont say its hard to find peaceful muslims, when have I ever said that? I said it was hard to find liberal/moderate ones. it seems to me that if the world was truly awash in liberal muslims that just sticking ur hand in a hat u'd be most likely to get one. and yet look who the muslim world is represented by? like that article says 80% of the muslim organizations are run by fundamentalists.

I've posted on this forum about articles where liberal muslims get beatan unconscious, threataned, kicked out of mosques, ostracized, and this is all in the WEST. the highest muslim cleric in australia thinks osama is a swell guy, and thinks women who don't cover up have it coming to them when they're raped.

I dont know if u cared to read the article but take this for example:
"At least anecdotally, the film corroborates the findings of a face-to-face poll of more than 4,384 Muslims, in which about 66% supported radicalism and international Shari'a law"

sharia law is bigoted, mysoginistic, oppressive, violent, cruel, and probably some other nice adjectives.

I'd love it if there were moderate muslims around. I'd love it if the texas legislature could go out and get a real liberal and not a supporter of a completely psychotic bigot like ayatollah khomeini.

It wasn't a speech. It was what I found out in real life. In my life. How many muslims do you know personally? What percentage of them are fundamentalists?

I am not talking about muslim universities. I am talking about american universities, like MIT, Harvard, Stanford, etc. Try to go to their webpages and look up their faculty in departments from Anthropology to Physics. Tell me, are all the muslim faculty you see there fundemantalists? And not all muslim students are members of the MSA, just like not all white students are members of the Baptist Student's Union. The MSA does not represent a majority of muslim students in the universities.

Go to the webpages of NASA, JPL, Los Alamos, etc. Look up the the top scientists in Robotics, Astrophysics, etc. 10% of them will be muslims (and the director of JPL robotics is a muslim). They are terrorists right?

Try to check up the names of the board of directors at major american corporations. Tell me again that the muslim names you will find their are fundamentalists?

I don't dispute the poll you cited. I have nothing but hatred for Sharia law. But are you telling me Sharia law is what all 2 billion muslims in the world adhere to? Are muslims only from Iraq an Iran?

What about muslims who are Americans, Chinese, Australians, Indians, Turkish, Greek, French, British, Canadians, etc? Are you telling me all of them worship Khomeini.

And I have disdain for Islamic fundamentalists. I have family serving in Iraq. But many many muslims I have met in this country, who are also citizens, also have family serving in Iraq.

The only reason you don't meet liberal muslims who dont face problems is because they don't make it into media stories. They make uninteresting or "unsexy" media stories. I will grant you that a high percentage of muslims are fundamentalists rather than moderate/liberal. Higher than say Christians.

But again, to make statements like "all muslims or most muslims are fundamentalists" and "it is very difficult to find liberal/moderate muslims" is out of place. I meet and work with such people almost on a daily basis. Some are colleagues, some are clients, some are subordinates, some are bosses and some are friends. I didn't have to work too hard to meet them.

[atomicbloke]

And I agree with the topic of your thread, there is indeed a war being waged against liberal muslims. Infact, a war is being waged against all liberals and moderates, irrespective of religion. Muslim fundamentalists want to wipe off the face of the earth anyone who is not a muslim fundamentalist.

I just dont agree with your statement that it is very hard to find non-fundamentalist muslims around in your everyday life.

[yavoon]

And I agree with the topic of your thread, there is indeed a war being waged against liberal muslims. Infact, a war is being waged against all liberals and moderates, irrespective of religion. Muslim fundamentalists want to wipe off the face of the earth anyone who is not a muslim fundamentalist.

I just dont agree with your statement that it is very hard to find non-fundamentalist muslims around in your everyday life.

I wasn't necesarily implying everday life, as everyday ppl are incredibly hard to desparage or insult. I was more implying the representative muslim community.

[yavoon]

It wasn't a speech. It was what I found out in real life. In my life. How many muslims do you know personally? What percentage of them are fundamentalists?

I am not talking about muslim universities. I am talking about american universities, like MIT, Harvard, Stanford, etc. Try to go to their webpages and look up their faculty in departments from Anthropology to Physics. Tell me, are all the muslim faculty you see there fundemantalists? And not all muslim students are members of the MSA, just like not all white students are members of the Baptist Student's Union. The MSA does not represent a majority of muslim students in the universities.

Go to the webpages of NASA, JPL, Los Alamos, etc. Look up the the top scientists in Robotics, Astrophysics, etc. 10% of them will be muslims (and the director of JPL robotics is a muslim). They are terrorists right?

Try to check up the names of the board of directors at major american corporations. Tell me again that the muslim names you will find their are fundamentalists?

I don't dispute the poll you cited. I have nothing but hatred for Sharia law. But are you telling me Sharia law is what all 2 billion muslims in the world adhere to? Are muslims only from Iraq an Iran?

What about muslims who are Americans, Chinese, Australians, Indians, Turkish, Greek, French, British, Canadians, etc? Are you telling me all of them worship Khomeini.

And I have disdain for Islamic fundamentalists. I have family serving in Iraq. But many many muslims I have met in this country, who are also citizens, also have family serving in Iraq.

The only reason you don't meet liberal muslims who dont face problems is because they don't make it into media stories. They make uninteresting or "unsexy" media stories. I will grant you that a high percentage of muslims are fundamentalists rather than moderate/liberal. Higher than say Christians.

But again, to make statements like "all muslims or most muslims are fundamentalists" and "it is very difficult to find liberal/moderate muslims" is out of place. I meet and work with such people almost on a daily basis. Some are colleagues, some are clients, some are subordinates, some are bosses and some are friends. I didn't have to work too hard to meet them.

I've known 2 muslims. but I've never given either a quiz on what they believed. not really how a normal conversation goes. its not like ppl who support sharia or beat their wives because god said its ok walk around w/ horns on their head.

and moderate muslims dont make uninteresting media stories. is the girl getting beatan unconscious because she says imams roundly support female circumsion "uninteresting?" or how about this VERY PBS DOCUMENTARY that specifically tries to show us the plight of the active moderate world against the islamists, is that uninteresting? to me thats very interesting atleast, PBS just wont show it because they feel it desparages the islamists too much.

[yavoon]

this has nothing to do w/ this thread, but it is funny so I thought I'd post it:

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/World/Rest_of_World/Malaysian_state_to_hire_ghostbusters/articleshow/2004906.cms

""Perhaps meals or drinks served to the officers were spiked," the state's Islamic department director Abdul Aziz Abdul Rahman was quoted as saying.

"Otherwise, it does not make sense how a person with strong faith can easily be overcome by deviant teachings. This is where exorcism may be needed to flush out the unhealthy elements through spiritual Islamic techniques," he said.

The ghostbusters, also known as "devil doctors" by local residents, are well versed in the Quran and draw inspiration from its verses to exorcise evil spirits, the report said. "