Where is music headed? [Archive] - The Orange Mane

MechanicalBull

05-07-2007, 09:32 PM

A guy I used to work with said he heard that with Itunes and so on that the CD business will have to change their ways or it will become no more due to so many people downloading music these ways(legally or illegally).

Not sure that will happen but it could. Sort of like the article I read a few years ago where the author predicted some time in the future there will be no cash and everyone will use credit/debit cards even on the purchases that are like only $5.

I really don't even know what is the new "it" style or band out there today. I don't really like that much of the newer stuff and prefer the older rock like lately I've been on a huge Tom Petty fix.

Bronco_Beerslug

05-07-2007, 09:37 PM

Are we headed toward the age of no more CD's? Straight Downloads?
Will someone come out with a new style of music? or maybe even a new instrument?
What do yall think, throw out some ideas :thumbsup:Might be, most people don't care that what they actually are listening to is cranked up noise (music basically devoid of dynamics) instead of music that actually has dynamic range.

Some of the best music ever made is still being reproduced on vinyl today.

Ratboy

05-07-2007, 09:56 PM

What's a CD?

Atwater His Ass

05-07-2007, 10:06 PM

you cant spell rap without crap

ludo21

05-07-2007, 10:12 PM

Good stuff guys!

I agree, Rap is terrible. The lyrics dont apply to me at all, and the music is terrible. Just turn up the bass real loud.... thats all it is.. boring..

Give me more!! I need 2 page essay worth of material ;D

BroncoMan4ever

05-07-2007, 10:19 PM

Are we headed toward the age of no more CD's? Straight Downloads?

Will someone come out with a new style of music? or maybe even a new instrument?

What do yall think, throw out some ideas :thumbsup:

i honestly don't think it has to do with a new type of music or people only wanting to download. the thing is current music sucks balls.

i mean watch 20minutes of MTV at 3 in the morning the only time they do play music and u will be wanting to drive knives into ur ears to end the pain of the garbage streaming out of the tv.

ludo21

05-07-2007, 10:21 PM

i honestly don't think it has to do with a new type of music or people only wanting to download. the thing is current music sucks balls.

i mean watch 20minutes of MTV at 3 in the morning the only time they do play music and u will be wanting to drive knives into ur ears to end the pain of the garbage streaming out of the tv.

Do you think some of the underground stuf that doesnt suck balls will eventually rise up though?

I dont watch MTV caz all they play is Rap crap.. But there is a ton of good stuff out there, just gotta look.

Los Broncos

05-07-2007, 11:34 PM

To give you an idea of where its going, this pic should give a hint.

2KBack

05-07-2007, 11:50 PM

i honestly don't think it has to do with a new type of music or people only wanting to download. the thing is current music sucks balls.

i mean watch 20minutes of MTV at 3 in the morning the only time they do play music and u will be wanting to drive knives into ur ears to end the pain of the garbage streaming out of the tv.

Everyone thinks the music they listen to is good, and what others like sucks balls.

Kaylore

05-08-2007, 12:05 AM

I still buy CD's. I'm not big on pirating.

smalltowngrll

05-08-2007, 12:08 AM

I haven't bought a cd in ages. I download everything and put it on my ipod.

Meck77

05-08-2007, 12:08 AM

I'm pretty sure I still have an 8 track player in the shed. Still hoping they come back!

IHaveALight

05-08-2007, 12:15 AM

I still buy CD's. I'm not big on pirating.

Yes, but we are a dying breed.
We have money to buy our CD's and prefer that because that's what we grew up with and became used to.
Now kids get their music for free. When they do get jobs and can afford to pay for it they won't want to since they can get it for free.

cutthemdown

05-08-2007, 01:13 AM

I'm not sure if I have talked about being into music on the board before or not but I really am into music, live music in particular. Just this weekend I saw Cypress Hill even though the whole pot/rap/rock thing isn't really my thing. I think the biggest change in music will be that people are getting sick of pre recorded tracks, lip synching, sampling etc. Brittany Spears just had a suppossed comeback at some House of Blues Venues around the southland. Too bad I didn't get to go laugh but I heard she didn't sing one line of one song. Remind me how you can have a comeback as a singer and not sing. Rap musicians go out playing to pre recorded tracks and beats and people are also tiring of that. I think the biggest change will therefore be that musicians will have to play their instruments live, actually sing the songs live, and actually write there own material.

I will put one band out there that is pretty different. Pretty fresh. Great musicianship. They have been around for a long time though with a changing lineup. The band is Liquid Soul. They are a combination of r&b/hip hop/funk/jazz/techno. http://www.liquidsoul.com/liquid-soul.htm

smalltowngrll

05-08-2007, 01:20 AM

I still buy CD's. I'm not big on pirating.

I don't pirate the music, I just purchase the dowloads. But, I dowload everything. I like the idea of being able to have it all in one location that I can keep with me. Whatever my mood is, I know I'll have something nearby that will settle my urge for that particular tune.

cutthemdown

05-08-2007, 01:29 AM

I buy music, download music for free, share music, go to concerts. I feel i spend a lot on music and support the bands that I like by going to see them live. But for instance if a band asks me to play a sax solo in some song I don't have, and don't know, I will often just download it.

cutthemdown

05-08-2007, 01:34 AM

I still buy CD's. I'm not big on pirating.

I still enjoy the going to the music store and looking at CD's. Walk around looking at different albums. Maybe have the cute girl at the counter crack a few open and listen to a few tunes. Maybe buy an album or two then head home to listen to them. Crack open a beer, get out the expensive headphones, put up my feet and read the album liners while I listen. This sort of stuff is good stuff.

freak6

05-08-2007, 01:38 AM

cutthemdown

05-08-2007, 02:16 AM

I saw TOOL live again last week. INSANE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I want music to matter again.

Green Day's last album was great. Tools last. Radiohead has another out soon.

Beastie Boys have a all music no vocals cd coming...hmm...

I know a girl who absolutely loves Green Day and anything punk. She took me to see them a few years back and I was pretty impressed with how tight of band they are and their energy. Another band I wouldn't normally go to see that she drug me to were the Foo Fighters. Again pretty tight and good energy.

Killericon

05-08-2007, 02:25 AM

I don't think the concept of the "Album" will ever go away. It's how the music industry runs. Tours are organized around their release. It's how the whole show operates.

As for the actual physical manifestation? It might go the way of the dodo, but I doubt it.

Crushaholic

05-08-2007, 03:23 AM

The idea of being able to pick and choose songs is an attractive one. Most of us have bought CDs (or records) that has a couple of good songs and the rest of it is crap. It's a very good question. As killericon said earlier, the compilation of music currently known as a CD will never completely go away. Entire tours are built around promoting the latest CD.

cq1

05-08-2007, 06:10 AM

I want the best quality sound, so if there are enough good songs, I'll buy the CD.

Bronco_Beerslug

05-08-2007, 09:00 AM

I want the best quality sound, so if there are enough good songs, I'll buy the CD.It won't be anything you download then. A large percentage of CDs released from the mid 90s on were mastered LOUD to the point some clipping (actual loss of music) occurs, explained better here (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Gmex_4hreQ). Further compressing these masterings to MP3 or whatever for downloading and you're getting mostly cranked up noise.

These two waveforms give a good visual of music that has already been "turned up" for you and music that you can turn up and still enjoy all the dynamic range that makes music sound great. The first one is RHCP/Californication/Parallel Universe (1999) (Japan). This album was mastered LOUD. If you crank this album up (and even if you don't) the distortion and clipping is prevalent throughout. Where are the peaks and valleys (dynamic range)?

http://img95.imageshack.us/img95/4917/rhcpparalleluniverseuf3.jpg

The second is Supertramp/Crime of the Century/School (1990) (MFSL). This album is one of the finest mastered albums bar none! When you crank this album up you are still experiencing the wonderful, full, entire dynamic range of the album.

http://img501.imageshack.us/img501/5158/stfg8.jpg

.

-Slap-

05-08-2007, 09:03 AM

To give you an idea of where its going, this pic should give a hint.

No company deserved to go out of business more than Tower Records. I went there during their Going Out of Business Sale and their stuff was still overpriced at 50% off.

Hogan11

05-08-2007, 10:21 AM

The second is Supertramp/Crime of the Century/School (1990) (MFSL). This album is one of the finest mastered albums bar none! When you crank this album up you are still experiencing the wonderful, full, entire dynamic range of the album.

MFSL was top of the line when they were in the reissue business. I have a couple of them and they sound great. Supertramp cranked up though will shatter every window in your house and every eardrum in earshot. How anyone can put up with those falsetto vocals, even at low volume, has always been a total mystery to me.

Hogan11

05-08-2007, 10:22 AM

As a collector, I want the original release in the original packaging whenever possible. I'll only take recordings or downloads as an absolute last resort.

bronco militia

05-08-2007, 10:30 AM

hogan, beer

what I can't figure out is that no one seems to notice (or care?) the sound difference...I'd love to buy an ipod and ditch the cd's, but I think they sound like crap.

Wes Mantooth

05-08-2007, 10:30 AM

you cant spell rap without crap

I think you got that backwards.

Nuggets4

05-08-2007, 10:33 AM

OH NOES! THE MUSIC INDUSTRY IS AWFUL!! IT'S GOING TO HELL! WHERE ARE THE REAL ARTISTS LIKE *INSERT FAVORITE BAND HERE*!!!ONE!!1!!eleven!!

The RIAA has it's head up it's ass. The downloaders have their heads up their asses. Everyone is single handedly doing their part, and yet the industry will move on. Funny how that works.

As for MTV, you do realize there are other options out there, right? Options that actually still play music? *coughManiaTV.com (http://www.maniatv.com/)cough*

Hogan11

05-08-2007, 10:36 AM

hogan, beer

what I can't figure out is that know one seems to notice (or care?) the sound difference...I'd love to buy an ipod and ditch the cd's, but I think they sound like crap.

The casual listener wants conveinence above everything else...most do not care about overall sound quality as long as whatever they're listening to sounds decent to them. Not everyone cares about fidelity or music in general enough to bother with such things.......sad but true.

Traveler

05-08-2007, 10:38 AM

OT: Does anyone else use something similar to this product?

http://www.sondigo.com/sirocco/overview
http://www.sondigo.com/producttour/siroccoptour.swf
It's a wireless audio bridge. I'm an avid collector of music and all my music in digital form on it's own hard drive. This unit allows me to wirelessly access the music on my computer and play it through any of my speakers in my house. Awesome!

Garcia Bronco

05-08-2007, 10:41 AM

hogan, beer

what I can't figure out is that no one seems to notice (or care?) the sound difference...I'd love to buy an ipod and ditch the cd's, but I think they sound like crap.

That's because the format is typically MP3's. MP3 compression ruins the audio because data is lost during compression. IMO when you pay money for MP3's you're paying money for garbage. Making you collection portable is one thing, but selling it as quality music and distributing for free is a terrible thing.

bronco militia

05-08-2007, 10:54 AM

That's because the format is typically MP3's. MP3 compression ruins the audio because data is lost during compression. IMO when you pay money for MP3's you're paying money for garbage. Making you collection portable is one thing, but selling it as quality music and distributing for free is a terrible thing.

I agree 100%....I guess what I'm trying to figure out is why most people don't feal the same way.....

Garcia Bronco

05-08-2007, 10:57 AM

I agree 100%....I guess what I'm trying to figure out is why most people don't feal the same way.....

Who knows...most probably don't care or don't know the difference.

watermock

05-08-2007, 10:59 AM

Hi-Fi, then stereos, then Quad, distinct quad ROCKED especially discrete quad. Many of you probably have never even heard of it. No offense, but it had two stereo needles and were pretty spendy. All decent stereos were at LEAST a thousand. You could double that for a discrete quad system. Anyone who has heard Old Black Water by the Doobies in discrete knows what I'm talking about. Yeah, we have surround sound now, but it's not really the same. Close tho, but CD's aren't master like that to my knowlege, just DVD movies. I'm behind the loop obviously.

I'm no expert on compression, but somehow they eliminate alot of data that you wouldn't reckognize anyway, at least for the common MP3 "affectionado"

Those waveforms show the compression factor of MP3's. It makes the file much smaller I guess. I wouldn't deny that it's incredibly convenient and popular. I haven't jumped into the 21's century yet I guess.

I bought this Panasonic surround sound DVD system about 4 years ago that was 600 bucks. Mistake. Want to know what stereo has heavier speakers and that I got for 100 at a garage sale that I set up for my Yamaha drums with headphones, an Iawa. There is no comparison. It's haunted tho. It will turn itself on and off, go to the time, or to tape or CD all on it's own. Good mini system tho. Loud enough to play the drums to.

I'm a little dissapointed in music today, I grew up in the Ted Nugent, SuperTramp, Pink Floyed, Led Zep etc. era. Even the Beatles...my first album came from the Library, Sgt. Peppers.

I still like the later grunge "seattle" sound like Dishwalla, Tool, old Nirvana, Tool ect. I like quite a few forms of music tho.

I don't know why it wouldn't be pretty easy to make quad home systems again. There will be plenty of space on the new DVD's. It's just twice the data to master.

I have no comment on rap.

orangeatheist

05-08-2007, 11:10 AM

We have money to buy our CD's and prefer that because that's what we grew up with and became used to.

Speak for yourself, ya young whipper-snapper! I grew up on LPs and 45s (even had a 78 of The Chipmunks when I was just a sprout). I miss the great album art of that by-gone era. But more than that, I miss the music. As someone else pointed out, what I listen to is great; what everyone else listens to (especially today) is crap.

Smiling Assassin27

05-08-2007, 11:32 AM

I think Trixter is coming back and will be the next supergroup. Mark it down.

labronx

05-08-2007, 11:34 AM

you cant spell rap without crap
you cant spell rock without crock

bronco militia

05-08-2007, 11:38 AM

I think Trixter is coming back and will be the next supergroup. Mark it down.

lmao.......

freak6

05-08-2007, 11:39 AM

I have an idea, we could combine rap and rock!!!

That'd be so cool.

If only someone would be so brave...

<img src="http://www.cgm.pl/images/news/beastie_boys1.jpg">

Smiling Assassin27

05-08-2007, 11:40 AM

Sorry, there ain't enough gin and weed in the world to make Bono a rapper.

Bronco_Beerslug

05-08-2007, 11:44 AM

MFSL was top of the line when they were in the reissue business. I have a couple of them and they sound great. Supertramp cranked up though will shatter every window in your house and every eardrum in earshot. How anyone can put up with those falsetto vocals, even at low volume, has always been a total mystery to me.So is DCC (http://www.dccblowout.com/dept.asp?dept_id=16-001) and almost all Steve Hoffman masterings as well as masterings done by some other fine sound engineers. The Beatles Dr. Ebbetts Blue Box reissues (every single album) are incredible!
Many SACDs are just awesome too!

And not all Supertramp songs are defined by "falsetto vocals" :)

Many audiophiles and top sound stores use the MFSL of 'Crime of the Century' for testing new sound systems and configurations.

BlaK-Argentina

05-08-2007, 11:49 AM

Mainstream music is definitely going downhill... I can't listen to the radio or watch a music channel on TV because I go nuts trying to understand how so many people can listen to that stuff.
I understand that everyone is in the business to make money, that's how things work unfortunately, but... come on! At least TRY to put something decent out there! Thank God there are still musicians and bands who care about making good music and giving their best for the fans. (Eric Johnson, Andy Timmons, Dream Theater, Pain of Salvation, Rush, Neal Morse, Joe Satriani, Porcupine Tree, Steve Vai, Stu Hamm, Circus Maximus, etc.)

Bronco_Beerslug

05-08-2007, 11:50 AM

Speak for yourself, ya young whipper-snapper! I grew up on LPs and 45s (even had a 78 of The Chipmunks when I was just a sprout). I miss the great album art of that by-gone era. But more than that, I miss the music. As someone else pointed out, what I listen to is great; what everyone else listens to (especially today) is crap.
Heh, heh................

-----------------------------------------------------------

http://www.vinylrecordday.org/images/mural_lg.jpg

http://img355.imageshack.us/img355/8786/albumartpx1.jpg

http://img185.imageshack.us/img185/4980/santanabookfrontresizedo1.jpg

http://img509.imageshack.us/img509/2705/blindfaithdennisdrakerewo2.jpg

http://img458.imageshack.us/img458/2349/kctt3.jpg

.

BlaK-Argentina

05-08-2007, 12:08 PM

I have an idea, we could combine rap and rock!!!

That'd be so cool.

If only someone would be so brave...

<img src="http://www.cgm.pl/images/news/beastie_boys1.jpg">

It's been done. :approve: http://www.goear.com/listen.php?v=04896fc (if you LIKE rap, this song may offend you a bit. ;) )

Definitely not their best work, but still worked well enough. If I can say something about Pain of Salvation is that they're not afraid to do whatever the hell they want. "BE" is one of the best pieces of music ever written, both lyrically and musically. (it's an album, btw) If you haven't heard it, buy it NOW. You won't regret it, even if you have no idea who Pain of Salvation are. One of the most emotional bands out there. I won't even mention Daniel Gildenlow's performance (he's the singer)... mindblowing. That album is proof that there are still people making amazing music these days.

I wish there were more bands like them out there. They have absolutely no limits, and that's refreshing.

ScottXray

05-08-2007, 12:19 PM

Most downloaded "music files" are MP3, which is compressed format.

I do buy from Itunes, but I download the file at the highest bitrate I can
get. Then burn it to CDDA (normal CD ). I then resample at minimum 192kbit (usually 320 kbit/s) for download to my Ipod.

The problem with MP3's , even at the highest quality setting, is they give me a headache, after a few hours. And that is because the {highs} ARE clipped at least a little, and that gives the music a little "tinny" edge, even on the best headphones or sound system. Sort of the same effect that people complained about when the CD was first introduced. There is a harshness to MP3 that eventually makes me turn it off. The real problem is that music is generally heard at such high volumes today that it is always clipped, andthe kids don't know it 's not supposed to be like that. So they accept the MP3 version as "Really really good man!".

As far as there not being any good mass market music out there.....My dad said the same thing about the beatles, stones and late sixties....I can't stand the rap {with very few exceptions} that is popular....but it IS popular.

We are just getting to be OLD FARTS.

Sigh....I've turned into my parent!:giggle:

Spider

05-08-2007, 12:21 PM

Music is heading where the music buying public leads it .........

dbfan21

05-08-2007, 12:24 PM

I don't pirate the music, I just purchase the dowloads. But, I dowload everything. I like the idea of being able to have it all in one location that I can keep with me. Whatever my mood is, I know I'll have something nearby that will settle my urge for that particular tune.

Bump.

Plus, when you buy a CD, there are songs on there that you don't necessarily care for. When downloading onto your computer/iPod, you can ensure that you're only listening to what you like. It's awesome. I take my iPod everywhere.

Bronco_Beerslug

05-08-2007, 12:37 PM

Most downloaded "music files" are MP3, which is compressed format.

I do buy from Itunes, but I download the file at the highest bitrate I can
get. Then burn it to CDDA (normal CD ). I then resample at minimum 192kbit (usually 320 kbit/s) for download to my Ipod.

The problem with MP3's , even at the highest quality setting, is they give me a headache, after a few hours. And that is because the {highs} ARE clipped at least a little, and that gives the music a little "tinny" edge, even on the best headphones or sound system. Sort of the same effect that people complained about when the CD was first introduced. There is a harshness to MP3 that eventually makes me turn it off. The real problem is that music is generally heard at such high volumes today that it is always clipped, andthe kids don't know it 's not supposed to be like that. So they accept the MP3 version as "Really really good man!".

As far as there not being any good mass market music out there.....My dad said the same thing about the beatles, stones and late sixties....I can't stand the rap {with very few exceptions} that is popular....but it IS popular.
We are just getting to be OLD FARTS.
Sigh....I've turned into my parent!:giggle:That's about it. Most people now days haven't ever heard good music on a good sound system.

Rock Chalk

05-08-2007, 12:43 PM

Mountain Bronco

05-08-2007, 12:58 PM

BKK

05-08-2007, 01:40 PM

cheap FM radio on a classic rock station and a fridge full of beer in the garage cant be beat.

bronco militia

05-08-2007, 01:57 PM

You can download FLAC digital audio from some sites that has less compression than MP3, but in order to play it on most portable music players you have to convert to MP3. But at least you can listen to the FLAC format from your computer or home stereo.

you can convert flac to a wave/.cda.......it's cd quality. Nero converts FLAC into a wave/cda or mp3 as you burn.

cutthemdown

05-08-2007, 02:21 PM

I agree 100%....I guess what I'm trying to figure out is why most people don't feal the same way.....

casual listeners=90 percent

Audiophiles=10

cutthemdown

05-08-2007, 02:34 PM

Im not a big music guy really.

I listen to it on the way home from work but the mornings I listen to the Rod Ryan show which is hilarious.

I rarely listen to music at home. All the good music of the past Ive listened to so much I dont want to listen to it anymore and there is very few good bands out there now that its not worth the effort of tracking them down.

This is what happens when people never open their minds up to real music. Eventually you tire of the B/S fed to you by MTV and the radio and just give up. I'm glad that I'm into Jazz because they is always great Jazz to be found.

bronco militia

05-08-2007, 02:35 PM

casual listeners=90 percent

Audiophiles=10

I wouldn't call myself an audiophile....It just seems like i'm the only person in the world that notices the difference from cassete tapes to cd's and cd to mp3. Hell, I even suffer from some hearing loss.

BlaK-Argentina

05-08-2007, 03:23 PM

Hell, I even suffer from some hearing loss.

Heh... me too... I lost some hearing at a FOUR HOUR G3 gig sitting in the front row. Damn you Satriani!! Damn youuu!! :giggle: (and I'm guessing the rehearsals with my band without ear plugs did their part too... it was just a couple of times when I forgot them... but still)

cutthemdown

05-08-2007, 03:44 PM

I wouldn't call myself an audiophile....It just seems like i'm the only person in the world that notices the difference from cassete tapes to cd's and cd to mp3. Hell, I even suffer from some hearing loss.

I can tell the difference for sure. I do know there are good mp3 and bad mp3 also though right? The higher the bit rate or khz something like that? My buddy makes ones that sound really good for mp3. He uses really good software to do his thing, has a great machine, and does it all off pristine condition cds.

cutthemdown

05-08-2007, 03:45 PM

Heh... me too... I lost some hearing at a FOUR HOUR G3 gig sitting in the front row. Damn you Satriani!! Damn youuu!! :giggle: (and I'm guessing the rehearsals with my band without ear plugs did their part too... it was just a couple of times when I forgot them... but still)

I'm glad my band doesn't play that loud. Horn players can't really wear earplugs. We have this thing where it's cool to hear the other players so you can play in tune.

broncosteven

05-08-2007, 03:54 PM

I'm with Beerslug on the Dynamic range issue.

I have 2 Ipod nanos. I was GIVEN them I did not purchase them. I DO NOT download from Itunes store. I load what I want on the Ipod from CD.

I only listen to Ipod when I cut the grass or shovel snow. I have outside mounted speakers & I am sure my neighbors hate me.

BTW I saw Jet last Friday at the Chi-town House of Blues. The best Rock concert I have ever seen. They put on an old school show with great lights & played everything LOUD & WELL. No sloppy drunken rants or ways to hide their lack of ability to play live.

GO SEE JET!

broncosteven

05-08-2007, 03:59 PM

I'm glad my band doesn't play that loud. Horn players can't really wear earplugs. We have this thing where it's cool to hear the other players so you can play in tune.

What do you play? Trumpet, bone, or sax?

Playing in tune is a underrated today.

My 4 year old already can do the solfedge hand signals & starts on C. She is learning the Uke already, her teacher knows Koday methods. I am one proud daddy!

Kid A

05-08-2007, 05:35 PM

I have a lot of my music in mp3 form only, but I certainly prefer to have the cd with original packaging. I'm more of an entire album guy myself. There are exceptions where I might want a single song, but I usually prefer the experience of having the artwork and entire album in my hands. I suppose it depends on the artist and what type of music you like. itunes is so successful because the majority of people just want to listen to the singles they heard on the radio. I personally couldn't imagine being satisfied with that as my music collection, but to each their own.

maher_tyler

05-08-2007, 05:47 PM

There is still a lot of good music out there, me personally like Avenged Seven Fold, 30 Seconds to Mars, The Red Jumsuit Apparatous, Chevelle, Seether, Taproot etc...btw Taproot and Chevelle are pretty bad ass in concert..especially Chevelle..came to So.Dak and still put on a hell of a show. Me as some other people have posted like a lot of the older stuff to like Pink Floyd, Led Zeppelin, Tom Petty, Lynard Skynard..doesn't get much better than Simple Man, Stairway to Heaven, Wish You Were Here etc...i also want to say that MTV sucks donkey dick...90% of the time it's reality TV...wheres the Music in Television?!?!

broncosteven

05-08-2007, 05:50 PM

Ludo,

If you need to fill out the paper more, do a quick read of Ray Bradbury's Pillar of fire & compare the story to this topic & how the margianalization of Albums could case the decline of the world as we know it. Put it through the main characters eyes after he comes back from the dead.

Or compare to Farenheight 451, that is a longer book.

DeusExManning

05-08-2007, 05:57 PM

I own like 2000 CD's but I haven't bought one in 2 years. I miss it. I miss the covers and just listening to a whole album. I really think this will be looked as the death of good music. No more Pink Floyd or Tool's will come around now.

Evenrude

05-08-2007, 05:59 PM

I saw TOOL live again last week. INSANE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I'm going to Tool this Saturday... first timer for me, looking very forward to it.

The problem I see with downloading individual songs is that you miss out on so many that you will never know are good. I know I have purchased several albums because of one or two good songs... only to tire of them and have the rest of the album "grow on me". This works better for some genres than others, but making an album is more than just slapping a bunch of songs together IMO.

ludo21

05-08-2007, 06:03 PM

Good stuff guys!

I find it funny how the older guys here complain about the "quality of sound" of the music.. I mean do you guys have supersonic ears that pick up waves that im missing?

cutthemdown

05-08-2007, 06:08 PM

What do you play? Trumpet, bone, or sax?

Playing in tune is a underrated today.

My 4 year old already can do the solfedge hand signals & starts on C. She is learning the Uke already, her teacher knows Koday methods. I am one proud daddy!

Alto and Tenor sax. I once got to talk to Grover Washington JR (rip) and asked him for advice on making my band sound better. He told me to have the band spend 5 minutes tuning with each other. Then play some scales together. Then rehearse. Best advice I have ever been given on rehearsing.

broncosteven

05-08-2007, 06:13 PM

Good stuff guys!

I find it funny how the older guys here complain about the "quality of sound" of the music.. I mean do you guys have supersonic ears that pick up waves that im missing?

Depends on what you listen to.

I listen to everything but newer Country pop crap.

Jazz & Classical have a wider dynamic range i.e. loud & soft.

Most pop/rock is already compressed so that is harder to notice on MP3's.

Plus if you have no basis to judge from i.e. the uncompressed version you won't be able to tell what real sound is.

Also Ear buds are not the best method for listening.

Bronco_Beerslug

05-08-2007, 06:14 PM

Good stuff guys!

I find it funny how the older guys here complain about the "quality of sound" of the music.. I mean do you guys have supersonic ears that pick up waves that im missing?No, just bigger penises than you MP3 boys. :thanku:

Like it was said earlier, if you don't know any different then you don't know any different. How many people here listen to music on a decent amp/receiver with a nice pair of loudspeakers?

broncosteven

05-08-2007, 06:16 PM

Alto and Tenor sax. I once got to talk to Grover Washington JR (rip) and asked him for advice on making my band sound better. He told me to have the band spend 5 minutes tuning with each other. Then play some scales together. Then rehearse. Best advice I have ever been given on rehearsing.

Which do you tune to:

A440

or

Close enough for Jazz?

LOL

Bronco_Beerslug

05-08-2007, 06:57 PM

Here's a look at some of today's "record players".

-------------------------------------------------------------------

http://img257.imageshack.us/img257/5163/ttbox2mz3.jpg

http://img186.imageshack.us/img186/5748/thorensalbumpicphpwi5.jpg

http://img257.imageshack.us/img257/7892/nottinghamalbumpicphpza1.jpg

http://img361.imageshack.us/img361/816/arcarsonmerrill02kj3.jpg

http://img297.imageshack.us/img297/3846/vipalbumpicphpvr6.jpg

http://img297.imageshack.us/img297/3194/albumpicphpbe1.jpg

cutthemdown

05-08-2007, 07:23 PM

Which do you tune to:

A440

or

Close enough for Jazz?

LOL

440 is a above middle c. We don't tune to that. Usually we tune to concert Bb in all octaves. Then we move up in 3rds usually etc. Whatever. Warm up a bit. PLay some scales then turn on the tuner and play a concert Bb. (g for alto c for tenor) I always try and play every note in the octave because often you can be dead on in tune at one octave, and go flat or sharp as you go up or down. Horn players in the end have to use their ears to stay in tune on any given note. In the end its the ability to play with your ear, combined with a knowledge of scales and chords that separate the players from the posers. Right now I'm not really that good but I am getting a lot better.

cutthemdown

05-08-2007, 07:25 PM

Beerslug I do have a bunch of old vinyl I can't play. Mostly Jazz and Classical stuff. It would be nice to hear them. I've never even listened to them.

Northman

05-08-2007, 07:26 PM

Are we headed toward the age of no more CD's? Straight Downloads?

Will someone come out with a new style of music? or maybe even a new instrument?

What do yall think, throw out some ideas :thumbsup:

Not sure if it will go to straight downloads, they cant control piracy as it is. New Style? Hard to say. For America it is all based on what the media wants to push. I dont pay attention to trends, i stay with the underground stuff. My best guess would be it will stay with the Hip Hop/Rap culture because the new generation sheeple eat it up right now.

cutthemdown

05-08-2007, 07:28 PM

No, just bigger penises than you MP3 boys. :thanku:

Like it was said earlier, if you don't know any different then you don't know any different. How many people here listen to music on a decent amp/receiver with a nice pair of loudspeakers?

I don't have good home stereo equipment but my PA is pretty nice. I have 2 sx500 EV loudspeakers, QSC AMP, Sonic Maximizer, subwoofers, the whole bit. It's not as clean as the high end home stereo stuff though that people spend thousands and thousands on.

ak1971

05-08-2007, 07:35 PM

I'm going to Tool this Saturday... first timer for me, looking very forward to it.

Going to see Tool again tomorrow. They put on a great show. My wife had never heard them till she went the last time, and now shes a fan.

Hogan11

05-08-2007, 07:37 PM

Good stuff guys!

I find it funny how the older guys here complain about the "quality of sound" of the music.. I mean do you guys have supersonic ears that pick up waves that im missing?

Like I said before, the casual listener doesn't care about sound quality or pretty much music in general...they want what they like and in the most convienent format as possible. It's understandable...it's when the ambivilant try to weigh in like authorities, that's what I have a problem with....how can they pretend to care when they basically don't? ???

It's like the "there's been no good music since 1977" types I occasionally encounter...I don't even bother with them anymore because it's impossible to reach them..they are so closed off from giving anything new or different a chance...how can you get anywhere with people like that?

A: You can't, so I just kinda smile at them, nod and move on to another topic.

ZONA

05-08-2007, 07:42 PM

Music is as diverse as the people living in this world. It will evolve always. The other day I heard a song that had underwater whale sounds set to a melodic beat. Pretty cool. There's usually something for everybody so that is the good thing.

Wow..just got a phone call asking if this was the American Embassy.....lol.........anyways.........

The great thing about media today is the many different devices that play music. Vinyl may sound great but not in my 4x4 as I go over bumps larger then most cars. That would skip all day. Even CD's do. So, I go with flash drives (solid state) so it's pure digital and no skipping. Another thing about records is no skipping through 5 songs instantly with a remote to hear a particular song. Sorry, you got to get up and move your needle. The problem I have with downloaded MP3's is most people rip music badly or compress the MP3 too much (down to 92). I rip my own at 320 so my MP3's sound just fine. I also use sound stabalizer. There gets to be a point where it would be so hard to tell the difference in sound quality, especially depending on the type of music. MP3's at 320 sound just fine to me. I can crank it up without distortion and I can hear all the sounds just fine. I have a feeling that people who love records are like people who drive old muscle cars. They feel the vintageness (if that's even a word) accounts for something and they actually feel they can out perform high performance cars of today. They really don't, they just feel good thinking they do. A 69 Camero (no matter how many after market toys you add) will not out peform a top of the line 2007 Ferrari.

Bronco_Beerslug

05-08-2007, 08:15 PM

I don't have good home stereo equipment but my PA is pretty nice. I have 2 sx500 EV loudspeakers, QSC AMP, Sonic Maximizer, subwoofers, the whole bit. It's not as clean as the high end home stereo stuff though that people spend thousands and thousands on.I just seen a pair of EV sx500's used @ Guitar Center for $350 when I was looking at keyboards today.

Beerslug I do have a bunch of old vinyl I can't play. Mostly Jazz and Classical stuff. It would be nice to hear them. I've never even listened to them. You can find used TTs on eBay for reasonable. I just bought a Pioneer PL-12D for $72 that just came tuned out of the shop. When it gets here tomorrow I'll put a decent cartridge on it and I already have a nice enough pre-amp to get quality sound out of it. Can't wait to try it out! It not near as nice (or expensive) as some of those audiophile TTs I posted but it will compare (sound wise to systems costing 10 times as much or more).
Plenty of Thorens, Duals, ARs, etc... on eBay all the time. If you take the time to get a nice pair of speakers and pre-amp with one of those type turntables you can enjoy a slice of heaven again listening to your old vinyl as long as it isn't worn out or damaged.

My next project is going to be a Thorens or AR.

ZachKC

05-08-2007, 08:43 PM

i honestly don't think it has to do with a new type of music or people only wanting to download. the thing is current music sucks balls.

i mean watch 20minutes of MTV at 3 in the morning the only time they do play music and u will be wanting to drive knives into ur ears to end the pain of the garbage streaming out of the tv.

If you just take what MTV gives you then come what may.

There is a lot of amazing work being done. Just dig a little bit.

cutthemdown

05-08-2007, 08:51 PM

[QUOTE=Bronco_Beerslug;1580865]I just seen a pair of EV sx500's used @ Guitar Center for $350 when I was looking at keyboards today.

350 for both is a really good deal. I see them for that much and more a piece all the time.

ludo21

05-08-2007, 09:38 PM

turned in my essay, thread can close now ;D

My best guess would be it will stay with the Hip Hop/Rap culture because the new generation sheeple eat it up right now.

"People, you mean.. sheeple".. Ha!

Bronco_Beerslug

05-08-2007, 09:41 PM

turned in my essay, thread can close now ;D
My best guess would be it will stay with the Hip Hop/Rap culture because the new generation sheeple eat it up right now.

"People, you mean.. sheeple".. Ha!And I'm sure you credited all your sources? :~ohyah!:

rubaiyat

05-08-2007, 10:10 PM

hogan, beer

what I can't figure out is that no one seems to notice (or care?) the sound difference...I'd love to buy an ipod and ditch the cd's, but I think they sound like crap.

This is only going to get more profound. CD's, as mentioned are already digital representations of actual music.

I think they are moving to collecting the music digitally as well now..so add another layer of lost data.

Analogue all the way...though I am willing to accept some loss for on the road.

Bronco_Beerslug

05-09-2007, 09:21 AM

This is only going to get more profound. CD's, as mentioned are already digital representations of actual music.

I think they are moving to collecting the music digitally as well now..so add another layer of lost data.

Analogue all the way...though I am willing to accept some loss for on the road.There are many good sounding CDs but if you don't accept digital replicas of master tapes as "music" then you probably won't agree.

So if I rip my Hoffman DCC Surrealistic Pillow vinyl to my PC and record it to CD, is it digital or analogue. :)

alkemical

05-09-2007, 09:38 AM

There are many good sounding CDs but if you don't accept digital replicas of master tapes as "music" then you probably won't agree.

So if I rip my Hoffman DCC Surrealistic Pillow vinyl to my PC and record it to CD, is it digital or analogue. :)

It'd be digital due to the conversion. Human ear hears in curves, 1s & 0s are blocky.....

but i record in analogue & transfer to digital.

Rohirrim

05-09-2007, 09:39 AM

I somtimes wonder if many of the elements of human culture don't get cheapened by technology. If you think about it, just a hundred years ago, if you wanted to listen to music, you had to play it yourself or go somewhere to hear it played. If you wanted theater, you went out. I wonder if that made it more special to people? More cherished? A more powerful experience?

Even when I was a kid, it was really special to go to the movies. In L.A. they still had these old art deco theaters all over town left over from the thirties. They had red carpets everywhere and chandeliers. They were more like palaces than movie theaters. You'd go to see Lawrence of Arabia on a 70 mm screen and it was an awesome experience seeing those camels traversing huge expanses of desert. Now, you can pop it into a handheld device with a dinky little screen and skip back and forth across scenes as much as you'd like. If you want to hear Mozart, just pop it in and you have a symphony orchestra at your fingertips. Nothing special about it.

alkemical

05-09-2007, 09:39 AM

I love all music - so to me - there's always bad music - and alot of what's commercialized is bad IMO. Not that it's all bad, just alot of it.

I like to just listen to anything - music is for the soul.

Nuggets4

05-09-2007, 10:22 AM

Anyone who doesn't complain about the sound quality of MP3s has never heard music on a good system. Period.

Bronco_Beerslug

05-10-2007, 08:40 AM

It'd be digital due to the conversion. Human ear hears in curves, 1s & 0s are blocky.....
but i record in analogue & transfer to digital.So I wouldn't be listening to the vinyl transfer but a digital reproduction?

Anyone who doesn't complain about the sound quality of MP3s has never heard music on a good system. Period.That would be most younger people today.

alkemical

05-10-2007, 08:53 AM

So I wouldn't be listening to the vinyl transfer but a digital reproduction?

From my understanding - more or less. But i only do it as a hobby, not a professional.

Bronco_Beerslug

05-10-2007, 09:37 AM

From my understanding - more or less. But i only do it as a hobby, not a professional.:) Although it is a digital copy of the vinyl, you are hearing the vinyl if done properly (no discernible difference). I use Goldwave to record and Audition for post processing (track separation, any click or pop repair and dithering). The resulting CD is awesome! Almost always better sounding than any retail CDs.

alkemical

05-10-2007, 09:39 AM

:) Although it is a digital copy of the vinyl, you are hearing the vinyl if done properly (no discernible difference). I use Goldwave to record and Audition for post processing (track separation, any click or pop repair and dithering). The resulting CD is awesome! Almost always better sounding than any retail CDs.

yeah but it's still being digitized. I'm looking at it from a computer guy POV. I can dub tapes onto a PC to still hear the hiss.... ;)

Bronco_Beerslug

05-10-2007, 09:56 AM

yeah but it's still being digitized. I'm looking at it from a computer guy POV. I can dub tapes onto a PC to still hear the hiss.... ;)
:) Here's a great discussion (http://tinyurl.com/2s455g) on vinyl transfers! Some of the posters there are the creators of a lot of audio hardware and some others are music professionals, engineers, etc... Steve Hoffman's forums are great for most any audio questions, information, etc...

DivineLegion

05-10-2007, 09:59 AM

Music is very diverse the problem is people are too lazy to go out and find a sound that they can truely identify with and they just turn the tv to MTV and follow that controlled overmarketed bull****.

Metal is making a comback thats for sure...Thank GOD!

Nuggets4

05-10-2007, 10:13 AM

So I wouldn't be listening to the vinyl transfer but a digital reproduction?

That would be most younger people today.

MOST. I'm 25 and I can tell the difference.

alkemical

05-10-2007, 12:01 PM

Record shops: Used CDs? Ihre papieren, bitte! (http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20070507-record-shops-used-cds-ihre-papieren-bitte.html)

New "pawn shop" laws are springing up across the United States that will make selling your used CDs at the local record shop something akin to getting arrested. No, you won't spend any time in jail, but you'll certainly feel like a criminal once the local record shop makes copies of all of your identifying information and even collects your fingerprints. Such is the state of affairs in Florida, which now has the dubious distinction of being so anal about the sale of used music CDs that record shops there are starting to get out of the business of dealing with used content because they don't want to pay a $10,000 bond for the "right" to treat their customers like criminals.

The legislation is supposed to stop the sale of counterfeit and/or stolen music CDs, despite the fact that there has been no proof that this is a particularly pressing problem for record shops in general. Yet John Mitchell, outside counsel for the National Association of Recording Merchandisers, told Billboard that this is part of "some sort of a new trend among states to support second-hand-goods legislation." And he expects it to grow.

In Florida, Utah, and soon in Rhode Island and Wisconsin, selling your used CDs to the local record joint will be more scrutinized than then getting a driver's license in those states. For retailers in Florida, for instance, there's a "waiting period" statue that prohibits them from selling used CDs that they've acquired until 30 days have passed. Furthermore, the Florida law disallows stores from providing anything but store credit for used CDs. It looks like college students will need to stick to blood plasma donations for beer money.

Why this trend, and why now? It's difficult to say, but to be sure, there is no love lost between retailers who sell used CDs and the music industry. The Federal Trade Commission has scrutinized the music industry for putting unfair pressures on retailers who sell used CDs, following a long battle between the music industry and retailers in the mid 90s. The music industry dislikes used CD sales because they don't get a cut of subsequent sales after the first. Now, via the specter of piracy, new legislation is cropping up that will make it even less desirable to sell second-hand goods. Can laws targeting used DVDs be far behind?

The music industry has never been a big fan of the Doctrine of First Sale, and the rise of digital music sales will only exacerbate the tension between consumers who believe that they "own" what they pay for, and the music industry. As more and more content-oriented goods transition to digital formats that are distributed free of physical formats, this issue is going to get tricky because it will be harder to spot the counterfeits from the authentic products, and consumers will still expect to exercise robust rights with the content that they've paid for with their hard-earned cash.