is calvin johnson this good?

[jtomm]

A month earlier Denver had offered two first-round picks, a second-rounder and two third-rounders, plus veteran linebacker Al Wilson [for the 1.2 pick], but when the Broncos wouldn't substitute another second-round pick for the injured Wilson, Millen turned them down. With that, the bar was set high.
wow! if true, that is absolutely crazy.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2007/writers/peter_king/05/01/nfldraft0507/index.html

[ludo21]

We shall see. I personally think he is, Id easily give up a draft for him.

[Northman]

It is crazy. Johnson is good but not worth all that for a team that is real close to going to the show and needs Defensive help. If Shanny offered that he is off his rocker. Then again, maybe it was a smoke screen and maybe Denver just wanted that pick to see who else would give up the farm for him.

[RkyMtnThunder]

wow! if true, that is absolutely crazy.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2007/writers/peter_king/05/01/nfldraft0507/index.html

yeah

probably a good indication why they couldnt trade out of that spot with anyone. It wasnt like no one was interested in taking CJ.....Millen just asking way too much

[yavoon]

millen probably thought, "holy **** these offers are high, I wonder if calvin is that good? someone get me tape on this calvin kid! I could be a genius for picking him!"

[U GOT JACKED UP]

He definately has all the tools to be a monster in the NFL. But that doesn't always mean u will dominate. If utilized well by mike martz he could catch over 100 passes this year.

[footstepsfrom#27]

Calvin Johnson is a bigger, stronger Randy Moss with Jerry Rice's work ethic. Half our 1st rounders bust anyway...38% of our 2nd rounders also...Johnson would have been a 1500 yard per year receiver and the ultimate weapon for Cutler.

[Man-Goblin]

wow! if true, that is absolutely crazy.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2007/writers/peter_king/05/01/nfldraft0507/index.html

I have a really hard time believing that the Broncos were willing to give up not one, but two drafts for the guy.

[epicSocialism4tw]

Man...Millen is a bigger idiot than I had suspected.

You could address every need on your team with that package.

On the other side, Shanny must be going crazy.

[bronco6maniac84]

I think Calvin Johnson is good, but not that good, probably a reggie wayne type guy... career wise that is.

[ZONA]

I agree - Millen is a tard. Not often do other teams offer their whole draft basically for a guy and Millen could have filled a TON of holes on his team. But I'm sure he thought to himself that everybody else wants the kid, I'm gonna keep him. Good luck Millen, in case you may have forgotten, it takes a team to win, not just one or 2 great players. By the time that team has enough good players to line up with Johnson, he will be a FA and go to another team. Sucker. Don't look for Johnson to have a big year anytime soon. The dude will probably get double and tripple teams all year.

[footstepsfrom#27]

In five years people will have forgotten most of the players Millen could have picked with those selections and Johnson will be tracking towards the Hall of Fame if Detroit can find an arm to get him the ball. It's scary how good this kid could have been in a Mike Shanahan offense with Cutler throwing him the ball.

[Rock Chalk]

He definately has all the tools to be a monster in the NFL. But that doesn't always mean u will dominate. If utilized well by mike martz he could catch over 100 passes this year.

Im almost certain Calvin Johnson went to the most WR friendly coach in the league. Detroit may not be very good, but Martz might be the best man to show the world how good CJ really can be.

[Clockwork Orange]

It's scary how good this kid could have been in a Mike Shanahan offense with Cutler throwing him the ball.

Precisely why Shanahan was willing to give up so much to try and get him. He had visions of Cutler to CJ for the next decade or so dancing in his head.

Would have been a sight to see. :yep:

[atomicbloke]

Thank God he went to the NFC.

That means we will play him only once. This season.

Because the Lions will never make the Super Bowl.

And by the 2011 season, he will be a FA and if Shanny is still around, he will snatch him.

[Tombstone RJ]

The problem with the Lions is they have no run game, a questionable offensive line, and a journeyman QB.

Even if Calvin is all that and a bag of chips, the team, at the very least, needs some kind of a running game to get the offense going. Johnson and Roy Williams present huge match up problems, but if a defense isn't afraid of the run, it will play the pass all day long.

[GonzoLays]

Is Calvin Johnson any better than Randy Moss or Larry Fitzgerald? Look where those two players led their offenses. It's a joke. Yea, the Johnson can run fast and catch the ball, but good lawd, if he makes seven plays a game he will be considered among the best. WR are necessary elements of the game, but they are just a part of the whole and they do not have that great of an impact. If WR's did completely change the complexion of the game, then Arizona would have had the number one offense in the league because you can't beat Fitzgerald/Boldin.

[epicSocialism4tw]

Is Calvin Johnson any better than Randy Moss or Larry Fitzgerald? Look where those two players led their offenses. It's a joke. Yea, the Johnson can run fast and catch the ball, but good lawd, if he makes seven plays a game he will be considered among the best. WR are necessary elements of the game, but they are just a part of the whole and they do not have that great of an impact. If WR's did completely change the complexion of the game, then Arizona would have had the number one offense in the league because you can't beat Fitzgerald/Boldin.

You are correct.

A receiver depends on several other players to be able to have an impact.

In this draft, Detroit could have drafted Brady Quinn at 21, used seconds to move back into the first round to draft someone like Joe Staley, then they could have used their plethora of stockpiled picks to take whoever they wanted in the latter part of the second and in the third round. Then during the next draft, they would have the pick of the litter because of their two firsts.

That's what you call shortsighted mismanagement.

Thank goodness Shanny was rebuffed because he could have set us back pretty badly with that one.

[2KBack]

Not even Jerry Rice in his prime is worth crippling the rest of your team for years to come.

[footstepsfrom#27]

Not even Jerry Rice in his prime is worth crippling the rest of your team for years to come.
In 2003 the only player in a 12 player draft to make Denver's roster wound up havinga negative impact...George Foster...that's 11 immediate busts and 1 delayed bust...2 years later we were one game from the Superbowl. Even an entire draft being dealt away can be overcome in short order with FA and some smart future moves.

[AboveAverage]

I thought about this after the draft, or something similar to this at least. Keep in mind I am a huge CJ homer. Now, would you rather have...

Moss, Crowder, and M. Thomas on the DLine with OT Harris + Keeping our '08 1st

Or

Calvin Johnson

15 years from now I may have wished we had gotten CJ, but I really have to go with option A.

[2KBack]

In 2003 the only player in a 12 player draft to make Denver's roster wound up havinga negative impact...George Foster...that's 11 immediate busts and 1 delayed bust...2 years later we were one game from the Superbowl. Even an entire draft being dealt away can be overcome in short order with FA and some smart future moves.

true, but that year is looked at as a bad thing. Hell even one great player out of that draft and it still would be viewed as mostly a bust. Imagine not even testing the waters.

Imagine if Moss or Thomas end up anchoring the line for years to come, but we waste that on another wideout, when we already have one elite and one potential stud.

Then throw in another 1st rounder the next year.

Too rich for any unproven player.

[Bob's your Information Minister]

Way too many picks for a WR. Jeez.

[epicSocialism4tw]

In 2003 the only player in a 12 player draft to make Denver's roster wound up havinga negative impact...George Foster...that's 11 immediate busts and 1 delayed bust...2 years later we were one game from the Superbowl. Even an entire draft being dealt away can be overcome in short order with FA and some smart future moves.

Not everyone busts in the draft like Shanny. Maybe he was just consolidating bustdom into one player to get it all over with quickly.

[Willynowei]

Somebody here will scream at me for this.

BUT, wide receiver is a low impact position, you have to have two other things going beautifully before the third cog of an offensive machine is even worthy of being considered.

[GonzoLays]

Somebody here will scream at me for this.

BUT, wide receiver is a low impact position, you have to have two other things going beautifully before the third cog of an offensive machine is even worthy of being considered.

I really don't think the difference between Calvin Johnson and Javon Walker is all that great.

You have three tiers of WRs.

1st Tier includes the likes of Fitzgerald, Moss, Walker, Andre Johnson, Ward and Harrison. Put a Javon Walker or Randy Moss in Indy and they are considered among the best in the game.

2nd Tier includes the likes of Eddie Kennison, Darrell Jackson, Antonio Bryant and Mushin Muhammed. Under the right circumstances, in the right situation, with the stars aligned perfectly, they can put up a big season. But due to height, speed, and hands, they are better suited for number twos.

3rd Tier includes the likes of Erik Parker, Sammie Parker, Reche Caldwell, and Ronald Curry. Scrubs that stay around the NFL for some odd reason but nobody knows why.

Johnson will most likely be among the 1st tier, but if you can acquire a Javon Walker for a 2nd round pick or a Randy Moss for a fourth round pick, trading your whole draft away for a guy is quite senseless.

[Bob's your Information Minister]

I think you're overrating Javon Walker.

[epicSocialism4tw]

I think you're overrating Javon Walker.

Nope. Javon Walker is the real deal. He's the total package. He's every other cliche you could throw out there that describes top level athleticism, speed, run after catch ability, smarts, work ethic, leadership, and on-field production.

He's your daddy. Pay him your respects.

[Bob's your Information Minister]

Nope. Javon Walker is the real deal. He's the total package. He's every other cliche you could throw out there that describes top level athleticism, speed, run after catch ability, smarts, work ethic, leadership, and on-field production.

He's your daddy. Pay him your respects.

He's a good receiver but he didn't really put the fear of god into me last year. I suppose that has something to do with having Ty Law on our team.

[2KBack]

He's a good receiver but he didn't really put the fear of god into me last year. I suppose that has something to do with having Ty Law on our team.

More likely it was the fact that Jake Plummer was the one throwing the passes. It'll be different soon. Get ready for flashbacks of TD, Portis and a young Rod Smith.

[Bob's your Information Minister]

More likely it was the fact that Jake Plummer was the one throwing the passes. It'll be different soon. Get ready for flashbacks of TD, Portis and a young Rod Smith.

I suppose that's a good argument, although Javon's stats didn't really go up when Cutler took over.

[Florida_Bronco]

More likely it was the fact that Jake Plummer was the one throwing the passes. It'll be different soon. Get ready for flashbacks of TD, Portis and a young Rod Smith.

Why bother discussing receivers with a Chiefs fan. The last time they had a good WR in KC, he played running back.

[2KBack]

I suppose that's a good argument, although Javon's stats didn't really go up when Cutler took over.

true, but he was also considered the only real offensive threat. If all things go as planned (which is unpredictable), the emergence of the other young offensive players will force teams, including the chiefs to play straight up, which should open things up further for Javon. Though in the end I really don't care who emerges as the biggest threat, just as long as it strikes fear into defenses.

[2KBack]

Why bother discussing receivers with a Chiefs fan. The last time they had a good WR in KC, he played running back.

I'm drunk, I can't be held accountable for my actions

[kmartin575]

I think Calvin Johnson is good, but not that good, probably a reggie wayne type guy... career wise that is.

Huh?

Calvin Johnson is probably the most talented receiver to ever come out in the draft.

Not that good my ass.

[watermock]

In five years people will have forgotten most of the players Millen could have picked with those selections and Johnson will be tracking towards the Hall of Fame if Detroit can find an arm to get him the ball. It's scary how good this kid could have been in a Mike Shanahan offense with Cutler throwing him the ball.

That's an incredibly ignorant perspective as usual. A QB will not have to run 40 times. A WR, maybe 15. Teams needs a QB first.

I'm so amused that you think you can see into the future. Even more amusing is how you stated "If Detroit can find an arm to get him the ball"...but he's going to be headed the HOF in 5 years. Your an idiot once again.

Millen is a confirmed retard that could of started fixing hole and passed. It's not like he needed the final piece of the puzzle with Calvin. He doesn't even have a QB. No running backs, a poor OL, no defense. The team is about 7 players short on starters. Calvin isn't going to make them contenders.

For Denver, he might of taken us to the promised land and given his team a fighting chance to at least save his job with respectability. It''s not like the Norris division is full of juggernauts. Da Bears did their one and out. Hornheads got a good draft. GB is lamenting Moss going to NE.

[Vegas_Bronco]

My question, why didn't the Raiders trade down??? JR would have been there at #3 or #4 or #5 right?

[ton80]

I think you're overrating Javon Walker.


Hey dik $hit. GO *** your mother. I've finally blown my top with u. What would Freud say about a worthless little fag like u. My guess is that he would say he was molested by his father and ***ed in the a$$ by his mother.

Someone please tell me how the ignore function works.

[Clockwork Orange]

My question, why didn't the Raiders trade down??? JR would have been there at #3 or #4 or #5 right?

In order to trade down, there has to be someone willing to meet your price to trade up.

Also, the word was that Cleveland would have taken Russell at #3 had he been there.

[watermock]

enver tried to trade up you moron.

[Clockwork Orange]

I suppose that's a good argument, although Javon's stats didn't really go up when Cutler took over.

No, but Marshall's and Scheffler's did.

Brandon Marshall (missed the opener due to injury)

10 games w/Plummer: 6 receptions, 76 yards, 1 TD

5 games w/Cutler: 14 receptions, 233 yards, 1 TD

Tony Scheffler (was inactive for three games)

8 games w/Plummer: 6 reception, 67 yards, 0 TD's

5 games w/Cutler: 12 receptions, 219 yards, 4 TD's

Those are numbers put up when Cutler was a rookie who was learning on the fly. This year he'll have that experience plus the entire offseason, minicamps, training camp and preseason of working with the first team offense.

Cutler spread the ball around and didn't just try to force it to one guy constantly as Plummer had a habit of doing (mostly with Rod Smith before Walker arrived). The increase in numbers from both of these guys when Cutler took over is what has me confident that the Broncos will have a balanced attack on offense.

I don't care if Walker puts up huge numbers so long as the offense is clicking. With the additions of Travis Henry & Daniel Graham, I think they can make a lot of good things happen

[Bob's your Information Minister]

Hey dik $hit. GO *** your mother. I've finally blown my top with u. What would Freud say about a worthless little fag like u. My guess is that he would say he was molested by his father and ***ed in the a$$ by his mother.

Someone please tell me how the ignore function works.

Thankyou!!! I appreciate that!

[Clockwork Orange]

enver tried to trade up you moron.

I was talking about Oakland, you piss drunk schmuck.

[ton80]

I would expect you to. You are used to that kind of treatment, not just in the cyber world but in the real world. Now go suck Gonzo's dik.

[watermock]

Wrong moron. Shanahan himself said he tried to trade up with Detroit. Buy a vowel.

[watermock]

They were going to trade with Oakland? That's comical. Shanny could of been offered Moss or an 08 seventh and wouldn't of talked.

[watermock]

I would expect you to. You are used to that kind of treatment, not just in the cyber world but in the real world. Now go suck Gonzo's dik.


Fiurt, I don't respond to adolecents, second if if you want to think your important enough for me to respond to you it's amusing. I never even addressed your diaper.