Many of you see real trouble ahead, escalating war, what do you plan to do about it?

[baja]

Enlist

build a bomb shelter

live self sufficiently in a remote place

wave the flag

run for president

What??

[REB]

Protect my family and ride it out.

[Dudeskey]

Call my congressman/ Senators frequently and tell them to stop being a bunch of pussies & do more than just a lousy non-binding resolution

[N.O.Bronco]

b1tch and moan on meassageboards!!!!

[Bronx33]

Well iam going to continue to be an american and support our troops iam going to respect others opinions and not pretend my opinion is 100% correct 24/7 on this board.

[Bronco_Beerslug]

Well iam going to continue to be an american and support our troops iam going to respect others opinions and not pretend my opinion is 100% correct 24/7 on this board.You're a good man Bronx! Reflecting on your philosophy wouldn't do me any harm when I get into the occasional pissing match. :)

[REB]

Call my congressman/ Senators frequently and tell them to stop being a bunch of pussies & do more than just a lousy non-binding resolution


And get a letter 6 months later "knowing how you feel" but we're gonna do what we damn well please anyhow. Thanx for caring and let me know if you have any other "feelings" about anything so I can send you a letter telling you once again how I really don't give a **** how you think or feel.

Go ahead..try it.

[REB]

b1tch and moan on meassageboards!!!!

LOL

[REB]

Well iam going to continue to be an american and support our troops iam going to respect others opinions and not pretend my opinion is 100% correct 24/7 on this board.


I'm with him but I'm going to protect my family first.

[Bronco_Beerslug]

Many of you see real trouble ahead, escalating war, what do you plan to do about it?


-------------------------------------------------------------


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[Cito Pelon]

Baja, my friend, you're on a doom and gloom thing lately. Is that what this thread was about? Your doom and gloom energizes me some to be more positive. Thanks.

Whatever the premise of the thread, I plan on thinking big, maybe it works out, maybe it doesn't.

[baja]

If you think I'm doom and gloom check this out

http://armageddononline.tripod.com/bible.htm

[N.O.Bronco]

If you think I'm doom and gloom check this out

http://armageddononline.tripod.com/bible.htm

havent people been using the bible since like 665 to predict the end of the world like every year? Even if the loony was right, i doubt the war would be covered and done within just 1 year.

i dont think your doom and gloom, just pretty pessimistic like me. It feels like when i was in school like it was never gonna get done with, that even with only two yerars left it felt like an eternity. thats how i feel with Bush right now.

[baja]

havent people been using the bible since like 665 to predict the end of the world like every year? Even if the loony was right, i doubt the war would be covered and done within just 1 year.

Not that I buy the scenario but a lot of events are falling into place

[N.O.Bronco]

Not that I buy the scenario but a lot of events are falling into place

yea my post in the Putin thread summed up my ultra fears at the moment. Though id like to believe my thoery is a little more realisitc, although hopefully doesnt come to fruition.

[Cito Pelon]

yea my post in the Putin thread summed up my ultra fears at the moment. Though id like to believe my thoery is a little more realisitc, although hopefully doesnt come to fruition.

Yup, things could get ugly, things could improve. Who knows? I actually appreciate the doom and gloom and stuff. Contrary jerk that I am, it energizes me to be more positive.

Ace.............

[mhgaffney]

Thanks Baja!

For the opportunity to toot my horn.

First of all, escaping to the Carrib is a very bad idea. It's no escape at all. Why? The depleted uranium nano particles the US military has released into the Iraqi theatre -- in desert storm and during the ongoing fiasco in Iraq -- are being carried on the westerlies across N Africa and the Atlantic into the Carib and Gulf of Mexico region.

These nano particles do not settle out of the air. No, they migrate on the wind -- like floating emissaries of death.

The Carib and Gulf of Mexico region has been hit by the highest rates of diabetes in the USA. And expect worse in the future. All manner of chronic diseases. Remember, the half life of DU is 4.5 BILLION years.

You think diabetes is a dietary problem? Think again.

I agree with Urinal (what a name -- keep it coming)

We must flood Congress in the coming days with a popular unstoppable avalanche. Call your man or woman in Washington via the capitol Hill switchboard.,

202- 224 - 3121

Tell him or her: No war against Iran! Congress must legislate a line in the sand. Bush must know if he attacks he will be impeached.

It just might work. (smile)

[Bronco Bob]

.
Remember, the half life of DU is 4.5 BILLION years.



The thing to keep in mind is that isotopes of elements with a long half life
aren't very radioactive. While highly radioactive isotopes of elements have
a very short half life, so they aren't around for very long.
Think of it as a bucket with a small hole in it vs a bucket with
a large hole in it. And depleted uranium is even less
radioactive than pure uranium because the more radioactive
U-235 has been extracted out, leaving the relatively inert U-238
behind. And U-238 emits radiation in the form of alpha particles,
which are basically just ionized helium atoms. Being that they
are relatively slow and bulky as compared to beta particles
and gamma rays, they don't penetrate very far. A piece of
paper effectively blocks alpha particles. Did you know that
before the 1940's the main use of uranium was as a pigment
to color glass?

(BTW, did you know Bismuth, the stuff in Pepto-Bismol, is slightly
radioactive? It has a half life of 19 billion billion years.)

[cutthemdown]

The thing to keep in mind is that isotopes of elements with a long half life
aren't very radioactive. While highly radioactive isotopes of elements have
a very short half life, so they aren't around for very long.
Think of it as a bucket with a small hole in it vs a bucket with
a large hole in it. And depleted uranium is even less
radioactive than pure uranium because the more radioactive
U-235 has been extracted out, leaving the relatively inert U-238
behind. And U-238 emits radiation in the form of alpha particles,
which are basically just ionized helium atoms. Being that they
are relatively slow and bulky as compared to beta particles
and gamma rays, they don't penetrate very far. A piece of
paper effectively blocks alpha particles. Did you know that
before the 1940's the main use of uranium was as a pigment
to color glass?

(BTW, did you know Bismuth, the stuff in Pepto-Bismol, is slightly
radioactive? It has a half life of 19 billion billion years.)

What's the half life on Chuck Norris's tears?

[TailgateNut]

If you think I'm doom and gloom check this out

http://armageddononline.tripod.com/bible.htm

I wonder if he consulted Nostredamus before spewing that shiat!

[Spider]

Enlist

build a bomb shelter

live self sufficiently in a remote place

wave the flag

run for president

What??

Call MacGyver ........... ;D

[ak1971]

Enlist

build a bomb shelter

live self sufficiently in a remote place

wave the flag

run for president

What??

build mini nukes

[Spider]

build mini nukes

did we use them all on 9-11 ?

[alkemical]

I'm going to stick it out in the USA and try to preserve the knowledge aquired from many contacts. I'd also like to some day open a school of mysteries.....

[cutthemdown]

I'll tell you what most of these complainers will do. They will complain and moan but not do one thing about it except vote Democrat next election. I for one think it will be a good thing to have liberals in charge for a few years. It's never good when one ideaology dominates for too many years in a row. The thing is though that I bet most of the problems that liberals champion will still be problems even if they get the white house and congress. Things just don't change that much when it comes to your everyday life.

[NYBronco]

I'm sure the NFL won't allow any war to interfere with gameday.

[cbs1177]

If trouble is looming then I like most Americans will max out their credit cards and use all available credit to live life to the fullest and then when the clock ticks down to zero and keeps going be stuck with all the bills for another 120 years. I think this is the best way to avoid the end of life itself merely max out your credit cards they will not let you die.

[defenseman]

I'll tell you what most of these complainers will do. They will complain and moan but not do one thing about it except vote Democrat next election. I for one think it will be a good thing to have liberals in charge for a few years. It's never good when one ideaology dominates for too many years in a row. The thing is though that I bet most of the problems that liberals champion will still be problems even if they get the white house and congress. Things just don't change that much when it comes to your everyday life.

Liberals will be the downfall of the country. Moderates / Conservatives is where we need to go. Liberals will screw it up, trust me...dman

*Just like straight conservative is no good either. Need a mix , a good mix.

[alkemical]

Liberals will be the downfall of the country. Moderates / Conservatives is where we need to go. Liberals will screw it up, trust me...dman

*Just like straight conservative is no good either. Need a mix , a good mix.


Oh puhlease

[fontaine]

The thing to keep in mind is that isotopes of elements with a long half life
aren't very radioactive. While highly radioactive isotopes of elements have
a very short half life, so they aren't around for very long.
Think of it as a bucket with a small hole in it vs a bucket with
a large hole in it. And depleted uranium is even less
radioactive than pure uranium because the more radioactive
U-235 has been extracted out, leaving the relatively inert U-238
behind. And U-238 emits radiation in the form of alpha particles,
which are basically just ionized helium atoms. Being that they
are relatively slow and bulky as compared to beta particles
and gamma rays, they don't penetrate very far. A piece of
paper effectively blocks alpha particles. Did you know that
before the 1940's the main use of uranium was as a pigment
to color glass?

(BTW, did you know Bismuth, the stuff in Pepto-Bismol, is slightly
radioactive? It has a half life of 19 billion billion years.)

The more I read of Bronco Bob the more impressed I am.

I thoroughly believe I've found the message board's equivalent of yin and yang:

Bronco Bob and mhgaffney! Not sure which is which though.

:rofl:

[defenseman]

Oh puhlease

Mark my words, the country goes liberal, we are screwed...dman

[TailgateNut]

Mark my words, the country goes liberal, we are screwed...dman


We're already screwed, it's just that the right wants us to believe the "pot o' gold" is alive and well. Just take a look at what the "conservative right" has done to this country, and then try to tell me with a straight face that liberals have and will **** it up!
What a tool!

[defenseman]

We're already screwed, it's just that the right wants us to believe the "pot o' gold" is alive and well. Just take a look at what the "conservative right" has done to this country, and then try to tell me with a straight face that liberals have and will **** it up!
What a tool!

Need a reasonable mix. Moderate, conservative and liberal. Go totally liberal, we're screwed. Simple as that..dman

[Spider]

Mark my words, the country goes liberal, we are screwed...dman

Have you been paying attention ?

[alkemical]

Mark my words, the country goes liberal, we are screwed...dman



So it's conservative or else more or less, eh?

**** man, the founding fathers were "liberals" to the crown.

[defenseman]

Have you been paying attention ?

absolutely, and if we continue to swing left long term, we are undoubtedly screwed. I gaurantee it....dman

[Spider]

absolutely, and if we continue to swing left long term, we are undoubtedly screwed. I gaurantee it....dman

screwed how ?

[defenseman]

So it's conservative or else more or less, eh?

**** man, the founding fathers were "liberals" to the crown.

You , of all people need to read ALL of my post(s). All of them. IF we swing totally liberal, we are, I have NO DOUBT, screwed...dman

*A simple mix would be fine with me. Too much of anything is not good, especially liberal.

[alkemical]

You , of all people need to read ALL of my post(s). All of them. IF we swing totally liberal, we are, I have NO DOUBT, screwed...dman

*A simple mix would be fine with me. Too much of anything is not good, especially liberal.



This early in the AM, i have no time to read all the posts ;) j/k -

i did now - so now i'm going to be a smart ass and say "sooooooory" lol

[TailgateNut]

You , of all people need to read ALL of my post(s). All of them. IF we swing totally liberal, we are, I have NO DOUBT, screwed...dman

*A simple mix would be fine with me. Too much of anything is not good, especially liberal.


The one item which needs to be clarified is, WHO IS WE? Do you speak of yourself, your family, the righties, the rich, WHO is screwed?.
I tend to think someone wouldn't be screwed!

[defenseman]

The one item which needs to be clarified is, WHO IS WE? Do you speak of yourself, your family, the righties, the rich, WHO is screwed?.
I tend to think someone wouldn't be screwed!

ALL of us. I believe, the very "liberal" among us propose changes that support setting the table for an all out attack on the US. In all respects I might add. One must maintain a solid military in today's world, this is an absolute must. Not doing so, invites new enemies. Second, while we are tied up in iraq presently, this is just the beginning. Many islamofacists will continue to build from within and overseas to slowly acclimate their ways to different cultures eventually absorbing them from within, all in the name of allah. If you allow them (islamo facists..terrorists)to continue in europe and elsewhere, we WILL go at it again. Wait till they attack us again and again, on our own soil, it's going to be tough going.
the moderate muslims of this country and others must make a stand soon. And WE need to make sure they have the ability to do so. If not, the extremists will snuff out any dissent, and we are in trouble. A purely liberal approach would not allow us to aide the moderate muslims in our country or abroad. Without that, we are in big trouble..dman

*In short, the purely liberal approach would welcome an attack. And because we would wait until very late to take up arms (unabated dialogue and diplomacy), it would be very , very damaging to our country and our way of life. In short, I'm thinking the far left would be fine with speaking farsi, as WE are the "enemy" of all mankind. We are not, never were, see...Kim jong il...see "little hitler"...and others. they are despots to be sure, and continue to be..

[TailgateNut]

ALL of us. I believe, the very "liberal" among us propose changes that support setting the table for an all out attack on the US. In all respects I might add. One must maintain a solid military in today's world, this is an absolute must. Not doing so, invites new enemies. Second, while we are tied up in iraq presently, this is just the beginning. Many islamofacists will continue to build from within and overseas to slowly acclimate their ways to different cultures eventually absorbing them from within, all in the name of allah. If you allow them (islamo facists..terrorists)to continue in europe and elsewhere, we WILL go at it again. Wait till they attack us again and again, on our own soil, it's going to be tough going.
the moderate muslims of this country and others must make a stand soon. And WE need to make sure they have the ability to do so. If not, the extremists will snuff out any dissent, and we are in trouble. A purely liberal approach would not allow us to aide the moderate muslims in our country or abroad. Without that, we are in big trouble..dman

*In short, the purely liberal approach would welcome an attack. And because we would wait until very late to take up arms (unabated dialogue and diplomacy), it would be very , very damaging to our country and our way of life. In short, I'm thinking the far left would be fine with speaking farsi, as WE are the "enemy" of all mankind. We are not, never were, see...Kim jong il...see "little hitler"...and others. they are despots to be sure, and continue to be..



90% horsedookie. The "liberals" as you put it are not out to allow an all out attack, nor do they intend to neglect the need for a strong, well trained and supplied military.

They are however intelligent enough to not jump on every scare tactic and ride it off to war.

At times you sound just like Oxicontin Boy! Just shoveling ****.

[defenseman]

90% horsedookie. The "liberals" as you put it are not out to allow an all out attack, nor do they intend to neglect the need for a strong, well trained and supplied military.

They are however intelligent enough to not jump on every scare tactic and ride it off to war.

At times you sound just like Oxicontin Boy! Just shoveling ****.

Always resorting to personal attacks? It's amazing to me how one can feel empowered by commenting in a disparaging manner to those that disagree. That said...let me clarify my position a bit....

In my opinion, they don't "recognize" the threat, nor do they understand how to put the puzzle together. My opinion is it will take a nice slow progression throughout europe and the ME, eventually, once positioned to do the right kind of damage, they will strike. You don't need to jump into war, agreed, BUT to continuously yap dialogue gets you nowhere. You must be willing to attack sometimes. you MUST be proactive and you MUST be willing to take the fight to them, not wait for it. I am firmly convinced they do NOT have the intestinal fortitude to take the fight to the enemy IF they force our hand and it is obvious we are in for a tussle. Just like the "terrorists" are convinced that america doesn't have the stomach to "truly" fight a war. to a degree, they are right. and, the liberals are part of the reason from where I sit. Partially because many base some judgement on "polls" and partially because, as I said, they can't put the puzzle together. If they aren't willing to keep it off of US soil, they won't get my vote. simple as that..dman

[Spider]

Always resorting to personal attacks? It's amazing to me how one can feel empowered by commenting in a disparaging manner to those that disagree. That said...let me clarify my position a bit....

In my opinion, they don't "recognize" the threat, nor do they understand how to put the puzzle together. My opinion is it will take a nice slow progression throughout europe and the ME, eventually, once positioned to do the right kind of damage, they will strike. You don't need to jump into war, agreed, BUT to continuously yap dialogue gets you nowhere. You must be willing to attack sometimes. you MUST be proactive and you MUST be willing to take the fight to them, not wait for it. I am firmly convinced they do NOT have the intestinal fortitude to take the fight to the enemy IF they force our hand and it is obvious we are in for a tussle. Just like the "terrorists" are convinced that america doesn't have the stomach to "truly" fight a war. to a degree, they are right. and, the liberals are part of the reason from where I sit. Partially because many base some judgement on "polls" and partially because, as I said, they can't put the puzzle together. If they aren't willing to keep it off of US soil, they won't get my vote. simple as that..dman
LOL not to be an ass here , but dont you throw out personal insults when you say libs cant understand ? or we are all screwed if Libs take over ?
Iraq is living proof Cons dont understand

[BABronco]

Listen to ppl b**ch about Bush being the cause of the end of the world

[defenseman]

LOL not to be an ass here , but dont you throw out personal insults when you say libs cant understand ? or we are all screwed if Libs take over ?
Iraq is living proof Cons dont understand

I must admit, I have "once in a blue moon" , but it is far the minority. And, I am not proud of it when I do , I do my utmost to stay on as even a keel as possible. Ergo, yep I'm guilty on very , very few occassions. I always feel very bad later. Hate when I lose my internet temper.

On that note, will iraq be living proof it was the appropriate action IF we end up on the right end of the stick? Many would say never, I disagree. the iraqiis though, need to stand up and be counted soon though. I grow tired of their non-commitment in some respects..dman

[defenseman]

Listen to ppl b**ch about Bush being the cause of the end of the world

I'm assuming ppl is "people". And yes, Bush is an easy target to lay all the blames that need to be laid. And yet, we had lots of shots at numerous terrorists in the past, and flat out blew it. But, that's water under the bridge I guess...dman

[alkemical]

I'm assuming ppl is "people". And yes, Bush is an easy target to lay all the blames that need to be laid. And yet, we had lots of shots at numerous terrorists in the past, and flat out blew it. But, that's water under the bridge I guess...dman

Of course - uhhh - we helped overthrow the shah and create an islamic terror state - that - uhhh - is biting us in the ass today.

[freak6]

Bush - douche - clueless puppet. Rummy was an incompetent buffon taking orders from the clueless dumbass, and made it worse by trying to make history and put himself on a pedestal like Khan, Hannibal, and Napoleon. Bushes underlings like Feith, Wolfiwitz, Condi, all incompetent yuppies war-mongering CHICKEN-HAWK clowns. It is easily the worst administration in history.

What am I going to do about? I already re-enlisted, I was supposed to go officer, but I can't make myself do it because I can't commit myself to a Joint Chiefs that is ignored over and over. So I am going to go to law school and see if I can't get into politics after that.

Chicken-Hawk bchs make me sick, as they send more and more into the pit.

[TailgateNut]

90% horsedookie. The "liberals" as you put it are not out to allow an all out attack, nor do they intend to neglect the need for a strong, well trained and supplied military.

They are however intelligent enough to not jump on every scare tactic and ride it off to war.

At times you sound just like Oxicontin Boy! Just shoveling ****.

Always resorting to personal attacks? It's amazing to me how one can feel empowered by commenting in a disparaging manner to those that disagree. That said...let me clarify my position a bit....

In my opinion, they don't "recognize" the threat, nor do they understand how to put the puzzle together. My opinion is it will take a nice slow progression throughout europe and the ME, eventually, once positioned to do the right kind of damage, they will strike. You don't need to jump into war, agreed, BUT to continuously yap dialogue gets you nowhere. You must be willing to attack sometimes. you MUST be proactive and you MUST be willing to take the fight to them, not wait for it. I am firmly convinced they do NOT have the intestinal fortitude to take the fight to the enemy IF they force our hand and it is obvious we are in for a tussle. Just like the "terrorists" are convinced that america doesn't have the stomach to "truly" fight a war. to a degree, they are right. and, the liberals are part of the reason from where I sit. Partially because many base some judgement on "polls" and partially because, as I said, they can't put the puzzle together. If they aren't willing to keep it off of US soil, they won't get my vote. simple as that..dman

Read what you wish. I said "at times you sound like Rush" that's the truth,like it or not! You DO spew the same BS he does. Libs don't know ****, they'll allow them to attack here,....BLAH,BLAH,BLAH.

The only damn reason the "Libs" as you put it are against this war, is because there was NO REASON TO GO TO WAR other than the lies which were conjured up by the ALLMIGHTY CONSERVATIVES.

I assume your "PROACTIVE" plan would be to attack the following: North Korea, Iran, Venezuela, China, Pakistan, and any other damn country which may or may not have any Islamic/ muslim extremist living within it's border, just because they may at some time in the future think about attacking us.

PUT THE F-ing alert status on red and leave it there! There will always be people on earth who do not like us. I wonder why.............

[defenseman]

Bush is a complete douche, he is a clueless puppet. Cheney is a war mongering lieing dkhead mthrfkr. Rummy was an incompetent buffon taking orders from the clueless dumbass, and made it worse by trying to make history and put himself on a pedestal like Khan, Hannibal, and Napoleon. Bushes underlings like Feith, Wolfiwitz, Condi, all incompetent yuppies war-mongering CHICKEN-HAWK clowns. It is easily the worst administration in history.

What am I going to do about? I already re-enlisted, I was supposed to go officer, but I can't make myself do it because I can't commit myself to a Joint Chiefs that is ignored over and over. So I am going to go to law school and see if I can't get into politics after that.

Chicken-Hawk bchs make me sick, as they send more and more into the pit.

I'm retiring....30 yrs is enough. Becoming an officer is not all it's cracked up to be , trust me..dman

[freak6]

<img src="http://www.president-bush.com/texas-chickenhawks.jpg">

[freak6]

I'm retiring....30 yrs is enough. Becoming an officer is not all it's cracked up to be , trust me..dman

I want to lead Marines and increase the scope of my responsibility as vast and I can make it, because I know I can be successful at it, and win battles. Unfortunately, put into an unwinnable situation comprises the integrity of the mission, and I refuse to to try and make wine out of sewage water.

[alkemical]

This thead is an example...
of why the world will not change
since everyone is hell bent
on sticking sticks up their asses

- copyright - JMA

[defenseman]

[QUOTE=defenseman;1478832]

Read what you wish. I said "at times you sound like Rush" that's the truth,like it or not! You DO spew the same BS he does. Libs don't know ****, they'll allow them to attack here,....BLAH,BLAH,BLAH.

The only damn reason the "Libs" as you put it are against this war, is because there was NO REASON TO GO TO WAR other than the lies which were conjured up by the ALLMIGHTY CONSERVATIVES.

I assume your "PROACTIVE" plan would be to attack the following: North Korea, Iran, Venezuela, China, Pakistan, and any other damn country which may or may not have any Islamic/ muslim extremist living within it's border, just because they may at some time in the future think about attacking us.

PUT THE F-ing alert status on red and leave it there! There will always be people on earth who do not like us. I wonder why.............

My point, I do not believe that true liberals have the intestinal fortitude to go to war. Even if it is the absolute last possible solution. Pitching diplomacy while an AK -47 is being shoved up your right nostril is not my idea of getting the job done, and thats where I believe the libs are, partially due to how GW handled Iraq I might add. So we've painted ourselves into the corner we are in right now to a degree. However, we'll see how it ends up. Being proactive, and attacking, are two different things. We've had multiple occassions to knock off terrorists around the world prior to 9/11, and we did NOTHING. these are pieces of the puzzle that MUST be played. If not, the puzzle changes to quickly and you are starting from square one. I'm guessing in the future to be successful, we must be proactive and opportunistic when an item avails itself. Not doing anything though, when a "bad guy" is offered up, well, it's just plain stupidity. We do need to get the rest of the world engaged, which I might add, is getting more difficult by the year based on the advances islamo facism is predicating in europe and the ME. They won't be satisfied with that, trust me, they'll head our way when the time is right, unless we cut them off at the knees. Simple as that.......dman

[defenseman]

I want to lead Marines and increase the scope of my responsibility as vast and I can make it, because I know I can be successful at it, and win battles. Unfortunately, put into an unwinnable situation comprises the integrity of the mission, and I refuse to to try and make wine out of sewage water.

good luck to you. I've lead countless sailors on countless missions beneath the ocean, won many battles. Becoming an officer was a step down for me, not up. "unwinnable"? Not familiar with that word, nor am I familiar with "can't". We did stuff we had no business doing, but somehow, it always got done. I wouldn't be here if it hadn't come to pass...dman

[TailgateNut]

[QUOTE=TailgateNut;1478881]

My point, I do not believe that true liberals have the intestinal fortitude to go to war. Even if it is the absolute last possible solution. Pitching diplomacy while an AK -47 is being shoved up your right nostril is not my idea of getting the job done, and thats where I believe the libs are, partially due to how GW handled Iraq I might add. So we've painted ourselves into the corner we are in right now to a degree. However, we'll see how it ends up. Being proactive, and attacking, are two different things. We've had multiple occassions to knock off terrorists around the world prior to 9/11, and we did NOTHING. these are pieces of the puzzle that MUST be played. If not, the puzzle changes to quickly and you are starting from square one. I'm guessing in the future to be successful, we must be proactive and opportunistic when an item avails itself. Not doing anything though, when a "bad guy" is offered up, well, it's just plain stupidity. We do need to get the rest of the world engaged, which I might add, is getting more difficult by the year based on the advances islamo facism is predicating in europe and the ME. They won't be satisfied with that, trust me, they'll head our way when the time is right, unless we cut them off at the knees. Simple as that.......dman


So all of our wars were fought by true conservatives? Crock of ****!

[defenseman]

[QUOTE=defenseman;1478903]


So all of our wars were fought by true conservatives? Crock of ****!

Just stating what I see on the horizon. Twist it anyway you desire, I prefer to fight the "away" game, not the "home" game when it comes to terrorism...dman

[TailgateNut]

[QUOTE=TailgateNut;1478915]

Just stating what I see on the horizon. Twist it anyway you desire, I prefer to fight the "away" game, not the "home" game when it comes to terrorism...dman


Okee Dokee Nostradamus.

I wonder how many of your fellow "semen";D were liberals. I'm not twisting a damn thing, just wondering where you get all of this "insight".

[defenseman]

[QUOTE=defenseman;1478919]


Okee Dokee Nostradamus.

I wonder how many of your fellow "semen";D were liberals. I'm not twisting a damn thing, just wondering where you get all of this "insight".

The majority are not liberals. This is a unscientific observation. My "insight"? Being as I've been the duty "whooping stick" for the last 29 years or so, I lean hard on past experience and the way "liberal" folks have dealt with us and specifically how we are allowed to "engage" so to speak. In short, see very few with a liberal belief/background utilizing the military properly. We are there to defend, but "defend" is a broad term. My b***h is being tasked with a mission, and then being forced to tie one hand behind our back. That ticks me off, either your in or not, keep it simple..dman

[alkemical]

"The tragedy of modern war is not so much that young men die but that they die fighting each other--instead of their real enemies back home in the capitals." ~ Edward Abbey

[Cito Pelon]

Need a reasonable mix. Moderate, conservative and liberal. Go totally liberal, we're screwed. Simple as that..dman

Marginalize the Far Left and Far Right. They're both just a bunch of nuts, IMO. Trouble is between them they make up what, 30-40% of the voting public?

[Rohirrim]

The America that our founding fathers kicked into gear is already gone. Eisenhower gave us our last warning, in 1960. We did nothing. Now it's an oligarcy, a corporatocracy, a colonial power, an imperial power, a government that serves the military/industrial complex hand in glove, whose chief goal is to continue its domination of world oil reserves. When we wake up and refuse to fight, they will hire mercenaries to "protect us" and to "protect our way of life." We only complain because it's our own people dying over there. When it ceases to be "our people" we will stop complaining. More than 60% of Americans are opposed to this war. That means nothing.

We have already crossed the Rubicon. Now, like Julius, Augustus and Tiberius, we will continue to use the idioms of the republic, even though the republic is long buried. Sorry, Ben. We could not keep it.

[baja]

This thead is an example...
of why the world will not change
since everyone is hell bent
on sticking sticks up their asses

- copyright - JMA

I don't know about anyone else but I have no desire to stick a stick up my ass.

[baja]

The America that our founding fathers kicked into gear is already gone. Eisenhower gave us our last warning, in 1960. We did nothing. Now it's an oligarcy, a corporatocracy, a colonial power, an imperial power, a government that serves the military/industrial complex hand in glove, whose chief goal is to continue its domination of world oil reserves. When we wake up and refuse to fight, they will hire mercenaries to "protect us" and to "protect our way of life." We only complain because it's our own people dying over there. When it ceases to be "our people" we will stop complaining. More than 60% of Americans are opposed to this war. That means nothing.

We have already crossed the Rubicon. Now, like Julius, Augustus and Tiberius, we will continue to use the idioms of the republic, even though the republic is long buried. Sorry, Ben. We could not keep it.

This is the very sad truth that is why I started this thread to see where people were at as to the seriousness of the situation. Most just make jokes and go on their merry way in complete denial of what is staring them in the face (see Ro's post) others want to lash out in fear and a few do see the great threat we present to the rest of the world. We would never be in this present situation had we not attacked Iraq, what a huge mistake that was.

I think Obama might be the man to lead this country out of the quagmire but I doubt anyone can at this point as Ro said we indeed have crossed the Rubicon. Those of us that see this I again ask what is your plan relative to you and your families? I really does feel like the end times and holy shiit I never thought I would type those words in seriousness. Unfortunately we have a lot of people in power on both sides that feel as Dman does, kick ass and take names. This will not work. Somehow we need to become less threatening to the rest of the world. In the past we had many people and nations that did not like us but they did respect us for what we stood for, that is gone now. They fear us now and the Dmen of the world will strive to do to us what Dman longs to do to them. It's a bad setup to be sure. I suggest fervent prayer.

[TailgateNut]

This is the very sad truth that is why I started this thread to see where people were at as to the seriousness of the situation. Most just make jokes and go on their merry way in complete denial of what is staring them in the face (see Ro's post) others want to lash out in fear and a few do see the great threat we present to the rest of the world. We would never be in this present situation had we not attacked Iraq, what a huge mistake that was.

I think Obama might be the man to lead this country out of the quagmire but I doubt anyone can at this point as Ro said we indeed have crossed the Rubicon. Those of us that see this I again ask what is your plan relative to you and your families? I really does feel like the end times and holy shiit I never thought I would type those words in seriousness. Unfortunately we have a lot of people in power on both sides that feel as Dman does, kick ass and take names. This will not work. Somehow we need to become less threatening to the rest of the world. In the past we had many people and nations that did not like us but they did respect us for what we stood for, that is gone now. They fear us now and the Dmen of the world will strive to do to us what Dman longs to do to them. It's a bad setup to be sure. I suggest fervent prayer.

All of the hatred toward us has been fueled by our arrogant attitude of superiority. Yes we are a mighty power, but what we lack is intelligent leadership.
As you stated, the Dman type of mentality will eventually lead us to another, quite possible final world war.
Our arrogance will be our downfall if we do not harness the power of our "DECIDERS"!

[defenseman]

All of the hatred toward us has been fueled by our arrogant attitude of superiority. Yes we are a mighty power, but what we lack is intelligent leadership.
As you stated, the Dman type of mentality will eventually lead us to another, quite possible final world war.
Our arrogance will be our downfall if we do not harness the power of our "DECIDERS"!

Having blinders on, and not recognizing the "enemy", could also lead to another nasty war. IF, we are not careful, that unseen "enemy" will most assuredly bite us in the A$$. Nothing wrong with having a big stick and using it when you must. IF, you are not willing to use the "big stick", I suggest commence learning another language, the end could be right around the corner...dman

[Bronco_Beerslug]

I'm retiring....30 yrs is enough. Becoming an officer is not all it's cracked up to be , trust me..dmanYou are an officer?

[TailgateNut]

Having blinders on, and not recognizing the "enemy", could also lead to another nasty war. IF, we are not careful, that unseen "enemy" will most assuredly bite us in the A$$. Nothing wrong with having a big stick and using it when you must. IF, you are not willing to use the "big stick", I suggest commence learning another language, the end could be right around the corner...dman

Good F-ing grief.

Recognizing an enemy and striking at everything that goes "boo" are two different things.

..and yes I'd like to use a bick stick on some of the people who are just plain clueless. Beat some sense into their empty craniums!

[defenseman]

You are an officer?

Selected on one occassion, turned down the commission. The community I'm attached to had very little to offer me with respect to leadership positions at the time, a carrier would have been nice but there you go, so I turned down the commission. On another occassion, pulled my package the day prior to the board convening , they were rather upset, but it was the right thing to do. You can effect numerous quality changes in any organization if you go about it correctly, hard to give that up once you have the horsepower to navigate sub ops day to day and motivate sailors beyond their own percieved capabilities. Very rewarding. Just couldn't give it up once it came down to show time..dman

[defenseman]

Good F-ing grief.

Recognizing an enemy and striking at everything that goes "boo" are two different things.

..and yes I'd like to use a bick stick on some of the people who are just plain clueless. Beat some sense into their empty craniums!

A quality mature approach to a percieved problem. Congrats...dman

[Bronco_Beerslug]

Selected on one occassion, turned down the commission. The community I'm attached to had very little to offer me with respect to leadership positions at the time, a carrier would have been nice but there you go, so I turned down the commission. On another occassion, pulled my package the day prior to the board convening , they were rather upset, but it was the right thing to do. You can effect numerous quality changes in any organization if you go about it correctly, hard to give that up once you have the horsepower to navigate sub ops day to day and motivate sailors beyond their own percieved capabilities. Very rewarding. Just couldn't give it up once it came down to show time..dman

So in the Navy they can just "select" you and bam, you're an officer?

[TailgateNut]

A quality mature approach to a percieved problem. Congrats...dman

What the **** are you talking about. A perceived problem. You are the one with the boogie man syndrome.

You blabber daily about your idea of what some would consider an attempt to scare the rest of the world into a corner, because they may be harboring a terrorist or a terrorist in the making or someone who may eventually give birth to a possible terrorist. You have the same attitude GWB has, and in my opinion are just as clueless as to what would make us a less likely target of those who currently wish to harm us.
Your strike first mentality is the same thing that got us into this f-ing mess in Iraq.

[defenseman]

So in the Navy they can just "select" you and bam, you're an officer?

You must put in a "package", a resume' of sorts to a board which convenes on for the most part an annual basis. However, not anyone can become an officer, competition is extremely stiff and sustained superior performance is an absolute must, both at sea and other assignments. Of note though, senior officers often target the "extremely high quality" amongst the enlisted ranks are urge they consider transition to the officer community. In short, it's not an easy thing to transition from enlisted to officer in the US Navy. However, it is do-able if one has credentials...dman

*It was tough turning it down, but, had to stick with my convictions.

[Bronco_Beerslug]

You must put in a "package", a resume' of sorts to a board which convenes on for the most part an annual basis. However, not anyone can become an officer, competition is extremely stiff and sustained superior performance is an absolute must, both at sea and other assignments. Of note though, senior officers often target the "extremely high quality" amongst the enlisted ranks are urge they consider transition to the officer community. In short, it's not an easy thing to transition from enlisted to officer in the US Navy. However, it is do-able if one has credentials...dman

*It was tough turning it down, but, had to stick with my convictions.Never heard of a such thing, I guess times change. When I was in you "just couldn't be commissioned". I turned down OCS twice but that didn't mean you're automatically an officer if you accepted. That only meant someone was offering you a chance at taking the training and schooling required to become an officer.

[defenseman]

What the **** are you talking about. A perceived problem. You are the one with the boogie man syndrome.

You blabber daily about your idea of what some would consider an attempt to scare the rest of the world into a corner, because they may be harboring a terrorist or a terrorist in the making or someone who may eventually give birth to a possible terrorist. You have the same attitude GWB has, and in my opinion are just as clueless as to what would make us a less likely target of those who currently wish to harm us.
Your strike first mentality is the same thing that got us into this f-ing mess in Iraq.

You are reminding me of the rubber band powered prop on a balsa wood plane. Pretty wound up today are we?..dman

*You have your opinion on the world today, I have mine. If you choose to characterize mine in such a manner, that is your take, not mine. What you "assume" to be my thought process is off the mark. Yours, nor my point of view won't be changing drastically anytime soon, short of a catastrophic event or epipheny changing it. Again, there is nothing wrong with having a big stick, and using it when you have to.

[bendog]

I didn't comment because I don't see what there is that can be done, besides vote dem next time (and Miss isn't gonna go dem). But I'll vote for Obama in the primary.

Iran's going to be the dominant influence in Iraq. That's a done deal. Nothing anyone, of any party, can do to change that. There is a civil war going on now. The only question is whether the shiaa are now shooting at our troops, along with the sunni. After we leave, Syria and Iran will pressure a peace, with the Saudis supporting some accomodation for the sunni.

[defenseman]

Never heard of a such thing, I guess times change. When I was in you "just couldn't be commissioned". I turned down OCS twice but that didn't mean you're automatically an officer if you accepted. That only meant someone was offering you a chance at taking the training and schooling required to become an officer.

Lots and lots of talent, often head and shoulders above presently commissioned officers, exist in the enlisted ranks. Especially from the leadership and managerial point of view. Very very few Ogangers enter the navy with the tools to get the job done. They need to be trained, and in most cases, the quality training is promulgated by a senior NCO, not another officer...dman

*In the Navy, the CNO may issue direction, but trust me, the "chiefs" run the navy. It's always been that way, always will have to be to have success.

[Rohirrim]

I suggest anyone who is interested watch a little film called, "Why We Fight." It's illuminating. If you have On Demand, it might still be in one of your film menus. Starz was showing it.

I doubt if there is any American in history that you could name who knew more about the military/corporate structure than Eisenhower. He spent his last address to the country warning us about what was happening. And yet, even he unwittingly assisted in the demise of American foreign policy and the strengthening of the military/industrial complex. To share one, small story:

The democratically elected president of Iran, Mossadeq, became furious when he found out that BP was robbing his country blind and stealing Iran's oil. He moved to shut off the spigot and nationalize Iran's oil. The Brits turned to the U.S. and convinced Eisenhower that Mossadeq was a communist in league with the USSR (which he wasn't - he was a strict nationalist, just like Ho Chi Minh). Eisenhower ordered the CIA to overthrow Mossadeq. The docs have been declassified and the NY Times has published them. You can read all the nasty little details here. (http://www.library.cornell.edu/colldev/mideast/ciairan.htm) Talk about getting an education!

We replaced Mossadeq with the Shah. We then sent in CIA operatives and Israel's Mossad, who helped create the Shah's secret police. "The CIA, along with the Israeli Mossad, proceeded to help the Shah set up his vicious secret police, SAVAK, which tortured dissidents until the Islamic revolution of Ayatollah Khomeni overthrew the Shah in 1979."

Is there any surprise that the Iranian people despise us? (http://www.fff.org/comment/com0501i.asp) In 1953, they were looking forward to a bright future, they had a popularly elected leader who they loved, and who was bringing Iran into the forefront of the region as a sovereign power. We destroyed all of that and placed those people under the thumb of a murderous oppressor for thirty years. And once the Iranian people rose up and overthrew the Shah, we began propping up Saddam and goading him to declare war on Iran. Now look what we've done to our own puppet, Saddam?

This is only one example of what we've done since WWII. Read about what we've done in Chile, in Central America, in Africa, in Europe, in SE Asia. We are carbon copies of Rome. At home, we celebrate how we are the most enlightened, free people on earth. Abroad, we are a carnivorous empire, and freedom be damned if it stands in the way of us taking what we want. http://www.fff.org/freedom/0992c.asp

Our ideals are only for home consumption. They are not for export. In the days of the English, Spanish and French empires the modus operandi was described as "the Cross and the Sword." The American version is the corporation and the sword. We don't pursue the control of the world's oil because our country can't live without it. We pursue it because our military machine can't exist without it. Because our standing army, and idea that even Washington despised, cannot live without it.

It's no different from Rome. We send our legions around the world to steal resources and wealth, and we send that wealth back to our shores so that our people can enjoy that greatest standard of life of any civilization in history, inconceivable to the majority of the world.

As the conservative Felix Morley stated in 1954, "To my thinking there is little doubt that from now on it is our republican institutions, rather than our imperial policy, which will be modified." That's how it's gone down.

It doesn't really matter how we feel about it, but we could at least stop fooling ourselves that we represent the values of our founding fathers. That's a stain on their legacies.

Watch that film. The Bush cabal is the first that has thrown off the curtain and openly espouses U.S. world domination and the value to the U.S. of a state of constant war. No more pussy-footin around. Like Richard Perle points out at the end of the film, those who think things will go back to "normal" once the neo-cons are thrown out are fooling themselves. "We are a different people now," says Perle.

[Spider]

I will check it out ........ I dont know why we want to rule the world , doesnt make much sense to me ........

[TailgateNut]

I will check it out ........ I dont know why we want to rule the world , doesnt make much sense to me ........

Visions of grandeur by uninformed/ hard headed leaders!

[Bronco_Beerslug]

Lots and lots of talent, often head and shoulders above presently commissioned officers, exist in the enlisted ranks. Especially from the leadership and managerial point of view. Very very few Ogangers enter the navy with the tools to get the job done. They need to be trained, and in most cases, the quality training is promulgated by a senior NCO, not another officer...dman

*In the Navy, the CNO may issue direction, but trust me, the "chiefs" run the navy. It's always been that way, always will have to be to have success.I wasn't questioning that, I was wondering how an enlisted man could become an officer overnight.

[Spider]

Visions of grandeur by uninformed/ hard headed leaders!

thats true .........most politicians cant even run this country right , I dont know what gives them the Idea they can run the world

[TailgateNut]

Quote from Rohs' post above says it all!

"At home, we celebrate how we are the most enlightened, free people on earth. Abroad, we are a carnivorous empire, and freedom be damned if it stands in the way of us taking what we want."


The bitter truth of the arrogance!

[TailgateNut]

I wasn't questioning that, I was wondering how an enlisted man could become an officer overnight.

It's the NAVY!ROFL!

[alkemical]

thats true .........most politicians cant even run this country right , I dont know what gives them the Idea they can run the world

See my Signature quote by Mr. Abbey.

[Spider]

It's the NAVY!ROFL!

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[Spider]

sorry I couldnt resist

[bendog]

One change is that when the neocons came to power, Russia was a debtor nation. Now they aren't, and they're restarting their military industrial capacity.

But in general Rohirrim's right. By the perception that our military might can bring stability, other countries loan us the money for both our federal deficits as well as corporate bonds, and buy equity in our corporations, to keep our own economy expanding and sell us the spice and cheap goods made by poor people.

No election will change that. We'll go the way of Britain, as China and Brazil become economic superpowers. Or, perhaps, we'll do something to raise wages and mandate private savings.

[defenseman]

I wasn't questioning that, I was wondering how an enlisted man could become an officer overnight.

You need to attend some Navy sponsored schools, however the individuals selected are minumum E6 and with at least 8 years in the navy. Most selected are CPO's with 10-16 years in the navy. Lots of time on the pond is what it comes down to. Lots of experience...dman

*ALOT of them have their bachelors degree in addition to the rest of the background.

[defenseman]

It's the NAVY!ROFL!

Bottom line is there is nothing overnight about it, takes years to get to that point..dman

[Rohirrim]

I wasn't questioning that, I was wondering how an enlisted man could become an officer overnight.

My father was a Master Sargeant in the Marine Corps and in Korea they gave him a battlefield commission and made him a first lieutenant. Actually, he didn't want the promotion, but they didn't give him a whole hell of a lot of choice. He ended up retiring a captain after his twenty something were up. But he never wanted to be an officer and was never happy about it.

[Bronco_Beerslug]

You need to attend some Navy sponsored schools,Ah, you really just can't become an officer overnight.

So you when you made the comments below you actually meant you decided you didn't want submit your resume to attend the training and school that it takes to become an officer?


Selected on one occassion, turned down the commission
so I turned down the commission.

On another occassion, pulled my package the day prior to the board convening , they were rather upset, but it was the right thing to do.

[Bronco_Beerslug]

My father was a Master Sargeant in the Marine Corps and in Korea they gave him a battlefield commission and made him a first lieutenant. Actually, he didn't want the promotion, but they didn't give him a whole hell of a lot of choice. He ended up retiring a captain after his twenty something were up. But he never wanted to be an officer and was never happy about it.Yeah, I never heard of commissioning an enlisted man other than the battlefield.

[TailgateNut]

Bottom line is there is nothing overnight about it, takes years to get to that point..dman

Don't get your panties in a bunch. I understand the concept. Prior to bidding the Army adieu, I made W.O. in the same manner. Education, experience and drive does have it's rewards.
It's the C.O.'s and their mentality (or lack thereof) which drove me from the military.
It actually sounds like you and I joined the service about the same time (yr).
I just didn't stick around as long!

[Rohirrim]

The only WOs I ever saw were chopper pilots. Were you one of those, Tailgate? Craziest bunch of mofos I ever met. ;D

[Meck77]

live self sufficiently in a remote place



Just made that change with a move. Not because of world politics but traffic/pollution/ too many wacked out people in the big city. The thought of living in a remote mountain town gives me a small sense of peace of mind I suppose.

I was more fearful of getting hit by some insane driver on I-70 than some armageddon scenario Baja can come up with. lol Wow I'm starting to sound like Slug bagging on Denver. Love that city but man I can't remember the last time I got a headache simply by driving thru it. Not sure WTF was going on last weekend but it was terrible.

Anyhow my plan:

Vote
Pay my taxes
Start my fish farm this spring/some other farming "self sufficient" stuff
Get to a Broncos game when I can
Get my fishing pole in the river/pond and wait for Baja's doom day to happen.

It it happens while I'm typing this post I'll be fine with that. If it happens in 10 years I'll be fine with that. If I die an old man fishing all the better.

:welcome:

[Spider]

Just made that change with a move. Not because of world politics but traffic/pollution/ too many wacked out people in the big city. The thought of living in a remote mountain town gives me a small sense of peace of mind I suppose.

I was more fearful of getting hit by some insane driver on I-70 than some armageddon scenario Baja can come up with. lol Wow I'm starting to sound like Slug bagging on Denver. Love that city but man I can't remember the last time I got a headache simply by driving thru it. Not sure WTF was going on last weekend but it was terrible.

Anyhow my plan:

Vote
Pay my taxes
Start my fish farm this spring
Get to a Broncos game when I can
Get my fishing pole in the river/pond and wait for Baja's doom day to happen.

It it happens while I'm typing this post I'll be fine with that. If it happens in 10 years I'll be fine with that. If I die an old man fishing all the better.

:welcome:

word ........ thats how I felt when I left Denver ...... I just took it a step further then you is all ;D

[Bronco Bob]

Lots and lots of talent, often head and shoulders above presently commissioned officers, exist in the enlisted ranks. Especially from the leadership and managerial point of view. Very very few Ogangers enter the navy with the tools to get the job done. They need to be trained, and in most cases, the quality training is promulgated by a senior NCO, not another officer...dman

*In the Navy, the CNO may issue direction, but trust me, the "chiefs" run the navy. It's always been that way, always will have to be to have success.

That's the fact, Jack. About the only time I interacted with officers when I was
in the Navy was to salute them when on shore. The chiefs and petty
officers ran the day to day operations. Our OE seemed more interested
in selling his daughter's Girl Scout cookies than anything to do with
electronics, as far as I could tell.

[TailgateNut]

The only WOs I ever saw were chopper pilots. Were you one of those, Tailgate? Craziest bunch of mofos I ever met. ;D

Huey jockey, reporting for duty!

I loved my job, just didn't like all the rules!

[defenseman]

Ah, you really just can't become an officer overnight.

So you when you made the comments below you actually meant you decided you didn't want submit your resume to attend the training and school that it takes to become an officer?

Two reasons: 1) Assignment in my field of expertise emcompassed nearly zero leadership type positions at the time, they had a great need for a certian "flavor" of officer I wasn't interested in being. 2) I would have given up a cubic butt ton of influence, from that point of view, it was a major step down with respect to guiding the day to day operations at whatever command I was attached to. Not un-like Rohirrim's master sgt marine father, came to the realization that I enjoyed my job description way to much to step down and have anyone attempt to give me a rudder order. Bottom line is, to be quite honest, I don't take orders well. However, I do accomplish nearly any mission 100% of the time, IF you don't attempt to tell me how to do it. gotten myself in trouble on a couple of occassions for taking such a tact. But, live and learn..dman

*I've been on boats where I was in the old man's state room giving him all kinds of grief at least once or twice a week, just pointing out he was being stupid. Can't necessarily get away with that as a JO.

As far as the training and school, I could care less about that. If I had wanted to get commissioned, the schooling, from my perspective would have been a speed bump on the road, easily negotiated.

[Rohirrim]

Huey jockey, reporting for duty!

I loved my job, just didn't like all the rules!

Some of the best people who ever wore a uniform. Salute!

[defenseman]

Huey jockey, reporting for duty!

I loved my job, just didn't like all the rules!

Yep, you fellas had your fun for sure. Kind of a crazy lot, not unlike "boat" sailors. However, SEALS and EOD are out there man. I mean sometimes I just shake my head and go wow..dman

*My son is in training for SEALS presently. PT's like a demon. Smart son of a gun to boot. 500meter swim (combat stroke) 9:00 min/ 80 + Pushups/ 80+ situps/15 + pullups/ 1 and 1/2 mile run in 8:30 mins. Full PT done in series, with a 5 min break between each phase of the PT. Looking forward to seeing if he can negotiate the "mental" exercise of BUDS..

[bendog]

I dunno. In 1972, they made me register for the draft. And yes it made me damn nervous. In 1974 they offered to let me take vocational tests to get into some specialty that would give me skills. In 1976, they offered to let me play in a field kitchen. In 1978, they said I was officer material, but wouldn't let me drive a M-60 in Germany or be a scuba diver off Greece.

[freak6]

*My son is in training for SEALS presently. PT's like a demon. Smart son of a gun to boot. 500meter swim (combat stroke) 9:00 min/ 80 + Pushups/ 80+ situps/15 + pullups/ 1 and 1/2 mile run in 8:30 mins. Full PT done in series, with a 5 min break between each phase of the PT. Looking forward to seeing if he can negotiate the "mental" exercise of BUDS..

What's a combat stroke? Can he just float on his back and bicycle?

That does sounds like a good warmup though! I don't get the 5 minute rest period, I was unaware Al Qaeda respected our the use of our 3 timeouts per half in combat. lmao

[freak6]

good luck to you. I've lead countless sailors on countless missions beneath the ocean, won many battles. Becoming an officer was a step down for me, not up. "unwinnable"? Not familiar with that word, nor am I familiar with "can't". We did stuff we had no business doing, but somehow, it always got done. I wouldn't be here if it hadn't come to pass...dman

How do we win in Iraq though? My position is we already did, and there is no point trying to keep what is left of the citizens from killing eachother. Police we are NOT.

[freak6]

Re-enlist bonuses for all marines now.

Stupid war.

[defenseman]

What's a combat stroke? Can he just float on his back and bicycle?

That does sounds like a good warmup though! I don't get the 5 minute rest period, I was unaware Al Qaeda respected our the use of our 3 timeouts per half in combat. lmao

Combat stroke is used by combat swimmers to cover long distances expending the least amount of energy getting there. cover same distance with alot less strokes and faster. According to the SEALS I know, it saves them alot of energy and they can cover the distance very quickly..dman

*I don't know the stroke personally however a seal friend of mine taught it to my son.

[Spider]

I just got done moving some pipe from 1 yard to the other , while I was out an old Buddy of mine called few years older then me , but he served under reagan , got out in 2001 , he claims Reagan was the best to serve for Bush jr needs an ass whooping .......... any vets here agree ?

[freak6]

I just got done moving some pipe from 1 yard to the other , while I was out an old Buddy of mine called few years older then me , but he served under reagan , got out in 2001 , he claims Reagan was the best to serve for Bush jr needs an ass whooping .......... any vets here agree ?

Reagan probably was good to serve under, lots of high morale back then, no real wars, just lots of posturing. Bush Jr. needs something...

[Spider]

Reagan probably was good to serve under, lots of high morale back then, no real wars, just lots of posturing. Bush Jr. needs something...

pretty much what he said .........

[freak6]

Combat stroke is used by combat swimmers to cover long distances expending the least amount of energy getting there. cover same distance with alot less strokes and faster. According to the SEALS I know, it saves them alot of energy and they can cover the distance very quickly..dman

*I don't know the stroke personally however a seal friend of mine taught it to my son.

I bet it is a modified side stroke, long stoke with a scissor kick.

Yep, I was right.

http://www.military.com/NewContent/0,13190,Smith_100903,00.html

I can do it, but when I was testing out to become the highest level, they said my scissor leg kick was backwards somehow. It does work really well.

I wonder if any triathletes have tried it.

[defenseman]

Reagan probably was good to serve under, lots of high morale back then, no real wars, just lots of posturing. Bush Jr. needs something...

You have no idea what it was like, saying hail mary's occurred quite frequently....but that's a story for years and years from today....dman

[Rohirrim]

Reagan probably was good to serve under, lots of high morale back then, no real wars, just lots of posturing. Bush Jr. needs something...

You obviously don't remember Grenada. :wiggle:

[defenseman]

You obviously don't remember Grenada. :wiggle:

Most presidents have their debacles, Carter, Clinton they all have fallen short on some spec op type missions...dman

[bendog]

Combat stroke - what the US Army needs to get out of Iraq (-:

[freak6]

You have no idea what it was like, saying hail mary's occurred quite frequently....but that's a story for years and years from today....dman

I don't I was a kid. So you were carrying out Red October missions in the 80s vs Russia? Crazy.

[defenseman]

I don't I was a kid. So you were carrying out Red October missions in the 80s vs Russia? Crazy.

It was very interesting work, to say the least...dman

*The nineties had it share also, trust me.

[Rohirrim]

Combat stroke? I remember that. It's what you hear at night in the barracks when you can't get to sleep. ;D

[defenseman]

Combat stroke? I remember that. It's what you hear at night in the barracks when you can't get to sleep. ;D

:thumbsup: ..dman

[TailgateNut]

Combat stroke? I remember that. It's what you hear at night in the barracks when you can't get to sleep. ;D

That's what the guy on "FireWatch" was doing!

[yavoon]

has anyone catalogued a good disaster list?

I can't tell if I"m gna die from peak oil, global warming/flooding, asteroids, thermonuclear war, or just get my head chopped off by a guy screaming allah ackbar.

it'd be depressing if it wasn't so confusing!

[Bronco Bob]

has anyone catalogued a good disaster list?

I can't tell if I"m gna die from peak oil, global warming/flooding, asteroids, thermonuclear war, or just get my head chopped off by a guy screaming allah ackbar.

it'd be depressing if it wasn't so confusing!

In no particular order, in addition to the ones you listed:

Gamma ray bursts

Yellowstone or another caldera erupting.

A pandemic, either natural or via germ warfare

The earth's magnetic field collapses

Machine rebellion

Giant solar flare

Alien invasion (the UFO kind)

A black hole wandering into solar system

Generically modified crops go amok and wipe out food supply

[alkemical]

you forgot famine due to massive bee death.

[Bronco Bob]

you forgot famine due to massive bee death.

It would limit the varieties of foods, but most grains; wheat, corn, rice, oats,
are wind pollinated, and potatoes are grown from tubers, so we'd still have bread and meat and potatoes. Mostly fruit would be affected. Don't think this would cause a massive human die-off.

[alkemical]

It would limit the varieties of foods, but most grains; wheat, corn, rice, oats,
are wind pollinated, and potatoes are grown from tubers, so we'd still have bread and meat and potatoes. Mostly fruit would be affected. Don't think this would cause a massive human die-off.



I dunno about that. Once you imbalance one part of the ecosystem, others follow.

[Cito Pelon]

. . . . . . ..The Bush cabal is the first that has thrown off the curtain and openly espouses U.S. world domination and the value to the U.S. of a state of constant war. No more p***Y-footin around. Like Richard Perle points out at the end of the film, those who think things will go back to "normal" once the neo-cons are thrown out are fooling themselves. "We are a different people now," says Perle.

We are a different people today in many ways. nice post. I look at the US history since 1941 as "keeping the lid on". Trying to keep the planet from exploding through diplomacy and some use of power. Didn't work out to the satisfaction of a lot of the US populace.

So as you pointed out, Bush and his cabal came along and - with the adamant support of 50% of the US population - took pretty much the complete opposite approach.

We'll see how it works out for the US and the planet as a whole. Certainly the whole geopolitical landscape has changed. Could be a good thing, could be a bad thing. But basically, that's how human history is. The old power-structures get shaken up drastically once in a while, and what comes out of it nobody knows.

I think we're at that point now. I'm a big believer in the Hegelian Dialectic. The old power-structures are the Thesis, an Antithesis arises in conflict to the Thesis, out of that conflict comes a new Synthesis. Then the Synthesis becomes the new Thesis, and so on and so on.

Every new Thesis goes through a period of "keeping the lid on", but it never lasts. Phases like the Pax Romanica and the Pax US eventually get overthrown, it's inevitable. The best you can do is try to stay relevant, manage the change, stay competitive, don't go into the tank.

We'll see how the US manages what I think is moving from the old Thesis to a new Synthesis.

[Cito Pelon]

Anybody watching this Presidents' Day deal on the History Channel? Pretty interesting refresher in US History.

[yavoon]

Anybody watching this Presidents' Day deal on the History Channel? Pretty interesting refresher in US History.

the Grant one sounds familiar.

[Rohirrim]

We are a different people today in many ways. nice post. I look at the US history since 1941 as "keeping the lid on". Trying to keep the planet from exploding through diplomacy and some use of power. Didn't work out to the satisfaction of a lot of the US populace.

So as you pointed out, Bush and his cabal came along and - with the adamant support of 50% of the US population - took pretty much the complete opposite approach.

We'll see how it works out for the US and the planet as a whole. Certainly the whole geopolitical landscape has changed. Could be a good thing, could be a bad thing. But basically, that's how human history is. The old power-structures get shaken up drastically once in a while, and what comes out of it nobody knows.

I think we're at that point now. I'm a big believer in the Hegelian Dialectic. The old power-structures are the Thesis, an Antithesis arises in conflict to the Thesis, out of that conflict comes a new Synthesis. Then the Synthesis becomes the new Thesis, and so on and so on.

Every new Thesis goes through a period of "keeping the lid on", but it never lasts. Phases like the Pax Romanica and the Pax US eventually get overthrown, it's inevitable. The best you can do is try to stay relevant, manage the change, stay competitive, don't go into the tank.

We'll see how the US manages what I think is moving from the old Thesis to a new Synthesis.

Thanks for your comments. I like that idea of the dialectic. I'm for goal oriented dialectics. I would like to aim for a particular synthesis, say, peace, for example. ;D

[Cito Pelon]

Thanks for your comments. I like that idea of the dialectic. I'm for goal oriented dialectics. I would like to aim for a particular synthesis, say, peace, for example. ;D

Yeah, me too. Humans aren't geared that way mentally, though. Seems to me the only phases in human history where there is "peace" so to speak, is after somebody steps up and kicks the crap out of all the troublemakers with dreams of grandeur. Just flat out destroys their ability to wage war. Just flat out razes their country to the ground. Like the Allies did to Japan and Nazi Germany. But out of that came the USSR's and Red China's Permanent Seats on the UN Security Council, which has thrown a wrench into the gears for a while.

Hell, I don't know. It's a grind. Just a great big meat-grinder that never stops, nobody knows if, when, or where the ride will stop. Hence Baja starting this thread, eh?

Which is why I focus on the long goal of conquest. Conquest is in the human spirit, so the long goal is to conquer the solar system. If we could get the Big Players to focus on that, it might provide a respite from the planetary conquest, short goal bickering.

Hell, it's a grind, bro.

[alkemical]

I'm wondering if one of our boats that are in alert in the Gulf will be attacked soon.... just a hunch.

[Spider]

I'm wondering if one of our boats that are in alert in the Gulf will be attacked soon.... just a hunch.

if it isnt in dock , and attacked , first suspicion ....... Russia and China , Iran doesnt have anything that will get near it .......

[defenseman]

I'm wondering if one of our boats that are in alert in the Gulf will be attacked soon.... just a hunch.

Don't see that one happening. They would welcome our rebuff, and I'm thinking , they don't want to go there..dman

[alkemical]

Don't see that one happening. They would welcome our rebuff, and I'm thinking , they don't want to go there..dman

Oh i didn't say Iran would attack one of our boats, i just said one of our boats (i'm expecting) to be attacked. But i never stated by whom.

[defenseman]

Oh i didn't say Iran would attack one of our boats, i just said one of our boats (i'm expecting) to be attacked. But i never stated by whom.

I never said Iran either. However, don't see anyone stirring the pot in such a manner. It simply would not be in anyone's best interest to start lobbing ordanance here and there about the ME..dman

[TailgateNut]

I'm wondering if one of our boats that are in alert in the Gulf will be attacked soon.... just a hunch.

We've been known to do some real sneaky ass ****! I'm with you on this one.

[alkemical]

I never said Iran either. However, don't see anyone stirring the pot in such a manner. It simply would not be in anyone's best interest to start lobbing ordanance here and there about the ME..dman


Oh there most definitly is a benifit to someone's interests.

[defenseman]

We've been known to do some real sneaky ass ****! I'm with you on this one.

We are going to attack ourselves? Is that what you meant? If so, not a chance ...dman

[defenseman]

Oh there most definitly is a benifit to someone's interests.

Who?..dman

[alkemical]

Who?..dman

War is big business Dman. I mean, "Peace sells, but who's buying?".....

[TailgateNut]

We are going to attack ourselves? Is that what you meant? If so, not a chance ...dman

Gullible, is what comes to mind.

[defenseman]

Gullible, is what comes to mind.

gullible in that we would attack ourselves? I would agree with that, not a chance of it happening though.....dman

[defenseman]

War is big business Dman. I mean, "Peace sells, but who's buying?".....

I'm not "buying" that in the least..dman

[TailgateNut]

Sure it wont happen, at least not in front of witnesses. I would have thought that you, of all people, would be aware of some of the clandestine operations which have always been part of our SOP.

[defenseman]

Sure it wont happen, at least not in front of witnesses. I would have thought that you, of all people, would be aware of some of the clandestine operations which have always been part of our SOP.

I know nothing of generating such operations, nor have I ever seen as such..dman

[alkemical]

I'm not "buying" that in the least..dman

Really?

Maybe you should look into the money generated via War....

[alkemical]

I know nothing of generating such operations, nor have I ever seen as such..dman

Uhm, didn't you reply to the CIA thread where people are charged with kidnapping people to torture them?

[defenseman]

Uhm, didn't you reply to the CIA thread where people are charged with kidnapping people to torture them?

CIA operations, and kidnapping. Not surprising. You are talking about attacking our own forces, sorry, not buying it..dman

[TailgateNut]

I know nothing of generating such operations, nor have I ever seen as such..dman

I've made companies shoot at their own during exercises in the Mojave years ago. They didn't even know they did until after the debriefings!

Hell you could have just as easily been one of my "toys"!

Never say never!

[TailgateNut]

CIA operations, and kidnapping. Not surprising. You are talking about attacking our own forces, sorry, not buying it..dman

Doesn't take much to get the ball rolling in the "right" direction. A little incident can quickly excalate into the intended result!