Amobi Okoye - DT - Louisville

[bpc]

Well I'm up way too late and I just got a copy of the Louisville/KSU game sent to me in the mail. I couldn't sleep so I thought I would pop this game on and see whats going on with this guy.

The first thing that comes to my mind is that we should really be trading back if this is a guy that is considered a top 10 football player in this draft. I'll point out the positive first. He looks taller than 6'2" on the football field but of course, this is to scale of everybody else he is playing with. He is supposed to be 310-320 lbs. but he doesn't look like that on the field. He has a thick body but his just looks like he carries his weight really well. At his size, he could add another 20 lbs and not look fat. I would say body wise he is a lot like Tommie Harris but that is where those comparisons should end. Okoye looks like he is strong enough to play on Sunday's especially in the run game. He doesn't really do much but he has these arms that keep offensive linemen at bay and away from his body. It helps him to really read where ball-carriers are going. He is definitely better at playing the run versus the pass. He has athletic ability to really chase down the LOS and get ball-carriers on sweeps which not many DT's can do. He'll hustle in spurts and I would say he does have very good short area quickness.

On to the negative, his pass rushing moves are horrible. He is getting by right now by running into opposing players and hoping they either take a bad step and he gets to their edge or he is stronger than them/over powers his way through them. His bull rush isn't all that good because he stands straight up and loses all of his leverage. I think he can get better at this if he has a good technique coach on the DLine. He has used two moves so far and one is a limp armed rip move which is about as effective as it sounds and then his bull rush. As stated before, he stands straight up on pass plays. This makes it so easy for opposing players to step up and get inside of him and stone him at the LOS. I was expecting him to be a real run stuffing dynamo as well but he isn't on this tape that i'm watching. He has some nice qualities in the run game but if you are looking for a wide bodied defender in Okoye who is going to eat double team blocks and make life hell on opposing run offenses, I don't know if this is your guy. Bates is supposed to be in love with the big fat DT's who take up blocks so I don't know if Okoye will be his cup of tea.

The bottom line: I think that Okoye has a lot of upside. I wonder what he will look like with an additional 20 lbs on a frame that looks slender with 310 on it. I wish he showed more tenacity in terms of playing the game and I would say that he will reach a lot of that potential I just mentioned. I don't think he can help but get better with his pass rush moves but then again... he is getting stoned by schlumps at KSU, the guards in the NFL are going to stone his ass easily. He IS only 19 but this makes him a project that COULD pan out nicely in 2 or 3 years BUT you will be paying him huge bucks as a late mid-first round selection who might not play at all his first season in Denver. If you are looking for an immediate impact out of this guy, you could be waiting awhile. By that time two or three of our vets will be out of their prime or out of the league. I think that is a risky proposition. He hasn't shown me any dominance in any phase of his game or over any one player he faced off against. He projects as a every down player IF he can get his pass rushing moves down. That is a big maybe since he is really raw in that area. I think he has the ability to be a great run defender as he is naturally strong. Then again we are assuming that he will get better. Sometimes these guys with bad habits don't change. That is when it is important to have a good coach.

I'm not in love with Okoye and I personally would rather go for one of the impact safeties if they were there than reaching on this guy ESPECIALLY since they are saying this guy is a top 10-15 player in most drafts. I would rather wait until the 2nd or 3rd round for a guy like Brandon Mebane/DT/Cal who looked a lot better on film to me.

[Drek]

Okoye is getting so much press because he's a four year player who is only 20 years old. Its like a high school kid in the NBA draft, all upside. If he was there at 21 it wouldn't be a bad risk to take, but I've said it before and will say it again, this is a draft deep at the DL, we can get some very good DTs and DEs by trading our first for an '08 first and 2nd or 3rd this year. Then we can move up and get a slider in the late first/early second and still have a good number of first day picks.

[Dedhed]

I don't think you understand the scheme or something, becuase there isn't a better DT in the draft than Okoye. Here are a few things to watch for: 1-The # of times he engages at least two players, and still is moving into the backfield 2-The amount of space there is on the edges due to the attention required inside 3- Okoye dropping into coverage at 317 pounds 4-How often he's moved backwards (even when double teamed) 5-What happens when he isn't doubled.

Saying we should target Brandon Mebane later in tehe draft is exactly the reason why our DL has been terrible since before the millenium.

"Why spend a first rounder when we can get almost as good in the second?" All of our current DL are almost as good as #1 DL, but when you spread that philosophy accross the board you have a crappy line.

I would also suggest that you watch more than a single game before you pass judgement on a guy. Even though, if you pay attention to the things outlined above you'll see that even in the KSU game Okoye displays early 1st round talent.


This kid should be #1 on our draft board; he's that good. He hasn't come close to reaching his potential, and is still the best DT coming out. I would put Branch in the same class, but that's it. This kid will be 25 and a six year vet.

If we really want to improve the DL we need to draft to improve the DL. That means dumping the philosophy of looking for good value guys in the mid/late rounds and bargain bin FAs. There are a very select few players in this draft who would see the field immediately for the Broncos, and Okoye is one of them.

[Dedhed]

Okoye is getting so much press because he's a four year player who is only 20 years old. Its like a high school kid in the NBA draft, all upside. If he was there at 21 it wouldn't be a bad risk to take, but I've said it before and will say it again, this is a draft deep at the DL, we can get some very good DTs and DEs by trading our first for an '08 first and 2nd or 3rd this year. Then we can move up and get a slider in the late first/early second and still have a good number of first day picks.

God, I am sick to death of this attitude.

[want2bAbronco2]

Whats wrong with that attitude? if we got another 2nd and 3rd we could get a DT, DE, FS, SS, and RB or OT. Not to mention if we trade Tatum etc... we could move up to get a better player at that postition. This year is really deep at DT, DE, FS, and SS. We need to get a replacement for Lynch and Ferg. I really like Brandon Merriweather Miami FS and Weddler (sp) SS. I wouldnt be upset to get Dorsey DT LSU in the 1st though.

[Rohirrim]

What worries me about the "Pick Collectors" is that if they managed to get those two number ones for 2008, next year would say, "Hey, we can trade these two number ones for two more number 3s and a top ten in 2009!" ad infinitum ;D I guess it does absolve you of ever having to risk making a number one pick that's a flop.

[Dedhed]

Whats wrong with that attitude? if we got another 2nd and 3rd we could get a DT, DE, FS, SS, and RB or OT. Not to mention if we trade Tatum etc... we could move up to get a better player at that postition. This year is really deep at DT, DE, FS, and SS. We need to get a replacement for Lynch and Ferg. I really like Brandon Merriweather Miami FS and Weddler (sp) SS. I wouldnt be upset to get Dorsey DT LSU in the 1st though.What is wrong with that attitude is that we already have a roster full of mid round value guys who display exactly the talent for where they were drafted. Let's just keep settling for bargain DL and see how much better we get in that area. This team has very few weaknesses, and they should be addressed as early in the draft as possible.

[Drek]

I don't think you understand the scheme or something, becuase there isn't a better DT in the draft than Okoye.

http://media.scout.com/Media/Image/28/281295.jpg

What worries me about the "Pick Collectors" is that if they managed to get those two number ones for 2008, next year would say, "Hey, we can trade these two number ones for two more number 3s and a top ten in 2009!" ad infinitum ;D I guess it does absolve you of ever having to risk making a number one pick that's a flop.

Its not pick collecting, its realizing that truly stand out DL talent goes top ten every year and that anything after that is a project. When a draft is as deep as this one in projects why not move back a little and grab two or three instead of investing first round money in a single guy, while also guaranteeing us the ability to trade up next year for a stand out DL should none of the projects pan out.

I had no desire to trade one of our picks last year when it was clear we had the cap money for a top guy and that Shanahan intended to go get one. Last year's draft looks like a huge success, why not seek to replicate that in '08 while taking advantage of a draft deep in projects at our biggest need position (DL)?

[Dedhed]

http://media.scout.com/Media/Image/28/281295.jpg



Its not pick collecting, its realizing that truly stand out DL talent goes top ten every year and that anything after that is a project. When a draft is as deep as this one in projects why not move back a little and grab two or three instead of investing first round money in a single guy, while also guaranteeing us the ability to trade up next year for a stand out DL should none of the projects pan out.

I had no desire to trade one of our picks last year when it was clear we had the cap money for a top guy and that Shanahan intended to go get one. Last year's draft looks like a huge success, why not seek to replicate that in '08 while taking advantage of a draft deep in projects at our biggest need position (DL)?Okoye is hardly a project. He hasn't reached his potential, but that is a very different story. He would immediately upgrade our DL and would be a steal at #21. I would much prefer that than deferring yet again to bargains, and hoping one pans out. I'd also rather invest money in 1st rounders that can play than in guys that may not even make the team.
We can chose to trade back and take extra mid round players, but let's not complain when our DL doesn't improve any.

Are you implying that you think the front office doesn't seek to replicate a successful draft every year? Of course they do, but the draft is a crap shoot, and despite the occasional late round star your chances are better for finding talent in the first round.

Here are the DL "projects" we've drafted recently

Rick Eason, Bryant McNeal, Dorsett Davis, Aaron Hunt, Paul Toviessi, Clint Mitchell, Reggie Heyward, Jerry Johnson

Sorry, but if those are the types of players you're after, you can count me out.

Compare that to players recently chosen in the second half of round 1

Luis Castillo, Mike Patterson, Vince Wilfork, Marcus Tubbs, William Joseph, Tamba Hali, Mathias Kiwinuka, Erasmus James, Marcus Spears, Kenechi Udeze,
Calvin Pace, Tyler Brayton, Charles Grant

[Broncoman13]

Whats wrong with that attitude? if we got another 2nd and 3rd we could get a DT, DE, FS, SS, and RB or OT. Not to mention if we trade Tatum etc... we could move up to get a better player at that postition. This year is really deep at DT, DE, FS, and SS. We need to get a replacement for Lynch and Ferg. I really like Brandon Merriweather Miami FS and Weddler (sp) SS. I wouldnt be upset to get Dorsey DT LSU in the 1st though.


I like Meriweather's athletic skills. But, there is no way the Broncos would ever select him. He was involved in a shooting incident and the Miami Brawl. Given the recent events in Denver with DWill, I don't think there is any way the Broncos would look his way. That would certainly send the wrong message.

Also, Dorsey is going back to school.

[fontaine]

Why trade down Drek when you're the Broncos?

When was the last time we showed any ability to draft well for mid-late round talent along the DL?

It would be different if we had a history of developing that kind of talent late (such as with OL/RBs). But as far as DL is concerned Denver has been inept and incompetent in drafting talented mid to late round projects.

That last we need is another "super talented" Dorsett Davis, Clint Mitchell or Aaron Hunt, Nick Eason type.

[Drek]

Rick Eason, Bryant McNeal, Dorsett Davis, Aaron Hunt, Paul Toviessi, Clint Mitchell, Reggie Heyward, Jerry Johnson
mid 4th, late 4th, late 3rd, mid 6th, mid 2nd, 7th rounder, late 3rd, late 4th.

You see a trend there? Whole lot of second day picks. Toviessi was the highest pick of the bunch, his career ended due to injury, Hayward was a successful 3rd round pick and Dorsett Davis was the next to last pick of the third round. If you'd stop homering on for your favorite first rounders and read what I'm saying you'd see that what I'm suggesting is using this deep DL draft to take several first day, early second to mid 3rd, DLs, much like we did with CBs two years ago when we last traded our 1st rounder for a future pick.

By the way, McNeal, Eason, and Mitchell are all still in the NFL, not bad for second day picks.

Why trade down Drek when you're the Broncos?

When was the last time we showed any ability to draft well for mid-late round talent along the DL?
When was the last time we showed any ability to draft well at DB before '05? What changed in '05? It was a deep talent pool of DBs that would last through most of the first day so Shanahan made sure to grab a few of them.

In this draft we could see guys like Tank Tyler, Adam Carriker, Quinn Pittcock, Jarvis Moss, Charles Johnson, etc. slide to the late first or early second. In the 3rd we could get experienced DTs like Harrell or Mebane or a great project like Alama-Francis or Baraka Atkins. It just takes a little position jockeying, trading our first for an '08 first and late 2nd/early third, then parlaying a late second and early third into a late first/early second. Grab a slider and get the best available through the rest of the draft. Then we get someone else's lottery ticket for '08 and can assure ourselves of some elite talent next year.

[Elway777]

If the Bronco's trade down it will not be for Mid round picks but for a early second round and Early 3 round pick. Maybe trade down for a late first and late 3 round pick. Useless a great player fall to the Broncos then it would be O.K to trade down. If Okoye makes it to the Broncos then I think he would be a solid pick for the Broncos.I also like Pitcock and He would also be a solid pick for the Broncos. If the Broncos draft de I like Woodley.

[want2bAbronco2]

I like Meriweather's athletic skills. But, there is no way the Broncos would ever select him. He was involved in a shooting incident and the Miami Brawl. Given the recent events in Denver with DWill, I don't think there is any way the Broncos would look his way. That would certainly send the wrong message.

Also, Dorsey is going back to school.


I knew about the brawl, not shooting =/ that sucks. I really think he could be a steal in rnd 2. I didn't know Dorsey went back, thought he was a SR... oh damn.

[bpc]

I don't think you understand the scheme or something, becuase there isn't a better DT in the draft than Okoye. Here are a few things to watch for: 1-The # of times he engages at least two players, and still is moving into the backfield 2-The amount of space there is on the edges due to the attention required inside 3- Okoye dropping into coverage at 317 pounds 4-How often he's moved backwards (even when double teamed) 5-What happens when he isn't doubled.

Well I'm going to be respectful here. I played football for 10 years, all throughout high school and college at the University of Hawaii and another I-AA school. I know what defensive fronts are, I know where Okoye was always lined up on the film. I watched Okoye as well as one person could watch. Honestly, he engaged two offensive linemen only once from what I saw on a pass play. He did not move them into the backfield. On passing downs he stands straight up. Although I will say that he is tougher against the run, I never saw him double teamed, not once. I'm not trying to tear down the guy. If he was the best, I would want Denver to draft him but he just didn't look the way to me. He does have potential. To me though he is a tad overated from the film I watched. If he is drafted top 10, it really says something about the talent in this draft and we should trade back.

Saying we should target Brandon Mebane later in tehe draft is exactly the reason why our DL has been terrible since before the millenium.

Have you watched him play? He plays a lot stronger than Okoye. They are two different players. I would say Mebane is more of a Booger McFarland type, Okoye is built more like a Tommie Harris but don't confuse the two coming out of college... the production and motor seem much different from what I saw.

"Why spend a first rounder when we can get almost as good in the second?" All of our current DL are almost as good as #1 DL, but when you spread that philosophy accross the board you have a crappy line.

I'm rooting for multiple 1st day selections on the DL. The value between mid-1st/late-1st through 3rd round picks in this draft though is not going to be that different. You must find value.

I would also suggest that you watch more than a single game before you pass judgement on a guy. Even though, if you pay attention to the things outlined above you'll see that even in the KSU game Okoye displays early 1st round talent.

I've only seen one game, true. Hopefully I will see more. With what I do I most likely will. I'm not just tearing on Okoye. I"ve been critical of other players as well... most recently Marshawn Lynch. We have to be smart about these picks. It is imperitive that we get this right. If Denver drafts Okoye, they have to realize he will not contribute this next season is a full capacity if at all. He is more raw than T. Pryce when he came out in 1997 and he didn't play until the last game of the season.

This kid should be #1 on our draft board; he's that good. He hasn't come close to reaching his potential, and is still the best DT coming out. I would put Branch in the same class, but that's it. This kid will be 25 and a six year vet.

I haven't watched Branch all that much, a little in the USC tape and I have some being mailed to me as we speak. From what I saw though, the two are not in the same class. Nobody is in the same class as Branch. It is literally Branch and everybody else. In that case, we cannot overvalue a player by position. That would be foolish. There are three very good safeties out there that we would pass up in that scenario which would be stupid.

If we really want to improve the DL we need to draft to improve the DL. That means dumping the philosophy of looking for good value guys in the mid/late rounds and bargain bin FAs. There are a very select few players in this draft who would see the field immediately for the Broncos, and Okoye is one of them.

Response is in the orange.

[mattob14]

bpc, any chance you still have ties to anyone at Hawaii? I'm wondering about Ikaika Alama-Francis and his injury. Have you watched any film on him or heard anything about his injury? He's an intriguing prospect on the DL.

[bpc]

bpc, any chance you still have ties to anyone at Hawaii? I'm wondering about Ikaika Alama-Francis and his injury. Have you watched any film on him or heard anything about his injury? He's an intriguing prospect on the DL.


I still have some ties as some of the players I was with are working in the film deparment or various offices on the team. I talk to the coaches as well.

From what I've heard he has a partially torn pec and he is out for the rest of the all-star games. He is resting up for either the Combine if he can perform or his pro day. Usually UH players will participate in USC's pro day or that is what they have been doing over the past two or three years. They think he should be good to go. He is basically a guy that has a ton of potential, "great body" for the position and is still growing. Then again keep in mind that he has never dominated either. One of those reasons is that he is playing a DE position in a 3-4 defense which causes the DE to have a lot of responsibilities taking up blocks, read and reacting. Its not like a 4-3 where the DE's can just pin their ears back and go.

I have film coming in on him as well and I will be posting it as soon as I break him down. :thumbsup:

This is my favorite time of year.

Any other info you need?

[mattob14]

Thanks bpc! He's a guy I haven't really been able to watch, but he gets good marks from everyone who's watched him on film and you can't ignore the size/speed, especially after he put on 30-40 pounds this year. His stats weren't great, but like you said, he has other responsibilities in the 3-4. Good news on the injury, I just hope he doesn't rise to the point where we won't have a shot at him in round 2.

[bpc]

For what its worth, Kiper was the first to really burst him on the scene about a month/month and a half ago putting him on his top 25. Since then everybody has had him rising on their mocks following suit. Funny how that happens. THere are a lot of good players coming out with triangle numbers that are eye popping. The key is actually finding the football players out of that mix. Hopefully we will find a couple that can impact us immediately.

[Drek]

I have film coming in on him as well and I will be posting it as soon as I break him down. :thumbsup:

This is my favorite time of year.

Any other info you need?

Cool, looking forward to it. He could be a real good sleeper pick in this draft.

[mattob14]

Kiper was definitely ahead of the pack on that one. Since then, I know Scott Wright reviewed film and basically agreed with Mel and a few others have started to sing his praises. The film reviews actually excite me more than the size/speed combo, but those numbers don't hurt at all. I don't know about top 25, but I'd love to see him picked in round 2.

[Dedhed]

Well I'm going to be respectful here. I played football for 10 years, all throughout high school and college at the University of Hawaii and another I-AA school. I know what defensive fronts are, I know where Okoye was always lined up on the film. I watched Okoye as well as one person could watch. Honestly, he engaged two offensive linemen only once from what I saw on a pass play. He did not move them into the backfield. On passing downs he stands straight up. Although I will say that he is tougher against the run, I never saw him double teamed, not once. I'm not trying to tear down the guy. If he was the best, I would want Denver to draft him but he just didn't look the way to me. He does have potential. To me though he is a tad overated from the film I watched. If he is drafted top 10, it really says something about the talent in this draft and we should trade back.
I've only seen the highlights of the KSU game, but I saw him doubled at least once, and in the backfield more than a few times. With 57 seconds left in the 3rd the KSU LT looks inside to double Okoye, and the DE is left with a free run. The QB is forced up in the pocket and Okoye gets the sack. The Miami game is impressive. I'm not recommending spending a top 10 selection on him, but I would love to get him at #21. I'm a fan of trading back only if you have numerous positions to address, but I don't think the Broncos are in that predicament at all. I think with improved line play on both sides of the ball we have the talent to make a run. Otherwise you're just drafting more players than you can field.

Have you watched him play? He plays a lot stronger than Okoye. They are two different players. I would say Mebane is more of a Booger McFarland type, Okoye is built more like a Tommie Harris but don't confuse the two coming out of college... the production and motor seem much different from what I saw.I've seen very little of Mebane, and I've liked what little I've seen. However, I think there's a reason why one is a projected 1st rounder and the other a projected 3rd. I'de love Mebane with the Skins pick, BTW.


I'm rooting for multiple 1st day selections on the DL. The value between mid-1st/late-1st through 3rd round picks in this draft though is not going to be that different. You must find value. I love value, but you need to find players first. Getting good value doesn't mean anything if it doesn't make your team better. Again, I would put a higher onus on value if we needed to address a number of spots.

I've only seen one game, true. Hopefully I will see more. With what I do I most likely will. I'm not just tearing on Okoye. I"ve been critical of other players as well... most recently Marshawn Lynch. We have to be smart about these picks. It is imperitive that we get this right. If Denver drafts Okoye, they have to realize he will not contribute this next season is a full capacity if at all. He is more raw than T. Pryce when he came out in 1997 and he didn't play until the last game of the season. I'm with you 100% on Lynch. I don't think he represents any value to the Broncos, but I'm not with you on Okoye. I think he's an immediate upgrade to our DL.

I haven't watched Branch all that much, a little in the USC tape and I have some being mailed to me as we speak. From what I saw though, the two are not in the same class. Nobody is in the same class as Branch. It is literally Branch and everybody else. In that case, we cannot overvalue a player by position. That would be foolish. There are three very good safeties out there that we would pass up in that scenario which would be stupid. Branch is certainly the most polished and NFL ready DT coming out, and I wouldn't call Okoye a better DT right now, but I think in 2 years Okoye will be a better player. I agree that it would be difficult to pass up a player like Reggie Nelson or Landry, but draft records bear out the fact that the vast majority of lineman on both sides of the ball are found very early in the draft. I think it's easier to find DB sleepers than it is 300+ pound men who are truly athletic.
[/QUOTE]

[Hercules Rockefeller]

What worries me about the "Pick Collectors" is that if they managed to get those two number ones for 2008, next year would say, "Hey, we can trade these two number ones for two more number 3s and a top ten in 2009!" ad infinitum ;D I guess it does absolve you of ever having to risk making a number one pick that's a flop.

Not really. Most who want it know this team will never be in position to get an elite talent in the draft unless something out of the ordinary happens with this team, or they possess another team's 1st round pick. This was a bad year for the Broncos and they are picking 21st. I'd rather not have a 1st for one season with a couple extra picks and 2 1sts the next year that can be used to move up, instead of hoping they get lucky twice in the 20's and find someone who no one thought would be that good.

[Atlas]

I don't think you understand the scheme or something, becuase there isn't a better DT in the draft than Okoye. Here are a few things to watch for: 1-The # of times he engages at least two players, and still is moving into the backfield 2-The amount of space there is on the edges due to the attention required inside 3- Okoye dropping into coverage at 317 pounds 4-How often he's moved backwards (even when double teamed) 5-What happens when he isn't doubled.

Saying we should target Brandon Mebane later in tehe draft is exactly the reason why our DL has been terrible since before the millenium.

"Why spend a first rounder when we can get almost as good in the second?" All of our current DL are almost as good as #1 DL, but when you spread that philosophy accross the board you have a crappy line.

I would also suggest that you watch more than a single game before you pass judgement on a guy. Even though, if you pay attention to the things outlined above you'll see that even in the KSU game Okoye displays early 1st round talent.


This kid should be #1 on our draft board; he's that good. He hasn't come close to reaching his potential, and is still the best DT coming out. I would put Branch in the same class, but that's it. This kid will be 25 and a six year vet.

If we really want to improve the DL we need to draft to improve the DL. That means dumping the philosophy of looking for good value guys in the mid/late rounds and bargain bin FAs. There are a very select few players in this draft who would see the field immediately for the Broncos, and Okoye is one of them.

I like this kid. Is he going to be there at 21? I think he will go earlier.

[Jens1893]

I like this kid. Is he going to be there at 21? I think he will go earlier.

Earliest I´ve seen him go is #9

[Dedhed]

I'm suggesting is using this deep DL draft to take several first day, early second to mid 3rd, DLs, much like we did with CBs two years ago when we last traded our 1st rounder for a future pick.There are a couple of reasons why I don't think it works to dras an analogy between the current DL situation and the 2005 CB situation.
#1- Existing talent. We have a little along the DL. Warren and Ekuban aren't world beaters, but they're much better comparatively than Roc Alexander, Lenny Walls and Jeremy LeSuer. Dumervil, by any account, looked extremely impressive and it appears as though his skills translate to the next level. In 2005 we had absolutely no talent at CB other than Champ. None.

#2-The position- When it comes to DBs, it can make sense to draft a bunch because they can contribute on STs. That isn't the case with DL. Darrent was drafted because of his ability to return kicks, the corner thing was a pleasant surprise. If a DB doesn't see the field as at his position, he can be kept on the roster for STs. That isn't the case with DL, and It doesn't make sense to spend 4 or 5 pick on the DL when you have limited space on the roster where you can stick them if they aren't in the rotation.

#3-The Draft- History bears out the fact that linemen on both sides of the ball are more likely to come from very early in the draft than any other position, and it makes sense. 300# men who can maintain athletic ability are exceedingly rare. Far more so than any other position pre-requisite in the league.

By the way, McNeal, Eason, and Mitchell are all still in the NFL, not bad for second day picks. That's like saying if you drop $100 on the street you wouldn't consider it a loss because, "Hey, someone spent it."


In this draft we could see guys like Tank Tyler, Adam Carriker, Quinn Pittcock, Jarvis Moss, Charles Johnson, etc. slide to the late first or early second. In the 3rd we could get experienced DTs like Harrell or Mebane or a great project like Alama-Francis or Baraka Atkins. It just takes a little position jockeying, trading our first for an '08 first and late 2nd/early third, then parlaying a late second and early third into a late first/early second. Grab a slider and get the best available through the rest of the draft. Then we get someone else's lottery ticket for '08 and can assure ourselves of some elite talent next year.And any and all of those players could amount to greatness, or absolutely nothing, including the lottery pick (is this the NBA all of a sudden?).

I think trading back is a rebuilding approach, and I don't think we should be in that mode at all.

[Atlas]

Earliest I´ve seen him go is #9

He'll never make it to 21. No way.

[bpc]

The difference in what i've seen from Mebane compared to Okoye is that Mebane is a finished product besides technique. He definitely has more polish. Okoye however has higher upside. The thing about upside is sometimes they hit it and sometimes they don't. I've said from the very first post on here that if he is carrying 310-315 lbs he is in remarkable shape for that because with his size, he looks like he could add another 20lbs no problem what so ever. Also I would grade Okoye technique as poor-average at best. He should get better with better coaching in the NFL.

I don't dislike the guy, I just think he could be a big reach early in the 1st round. He has some things going for him though... increased size and strength are possibilities, his technique will get better and he is only 19 which means his prime could be extremely long. It could take two or three years for him to hit that level though.

[bpc]

http://www.viewimages.com/Search.aspx?mid=72170098&partner=Yahoo&epmid=2&phrase=amobi+okoye

He has potential, I do not disclaim that.

[Dedhed]

The difference in what i've seen from Mebane compared to Okoye is that Mebane is a finished product besides technique. He definitely has more polish. Okoye however has higher upside. The thing about upside is sometimes they hit it and sometimes they don't. I've said from the very first post on here that if he is carrying 310-315 lbs he is in remarkable shape for that because with his size, he looks like he could add another 20lbs no problem what so ever. Also I would grade Okoye technique as poor-average at best. He should get better with better coaching in the NFL.

I don't dislike the guy, I just think he could be a big reach early in the 1st round. He has some things going for him though... increased size and strength are possibilities, his technique will get better and he is only 19 which means his prime could be extremely long. It could take two or three years for him to hit that level though.
I think Mebane is more polished, but I'm not convinced he can handle the size at the next level. Size is no concern for Okoye. I think he could play at 330 without losing much. His technique will have to improve, but the thing is; it will. He's a very good player with his current, mediocre, technique. With merely good technique at 330#s I think he'll be an extremely good DT.

I think early first would be a reach, but #21 isn't the early 1st, and I would have a hard time looking past him at that spot. Although Reggie Nelson would be difficult to look past at that spot as well. There are always a few.

[Drek]

There are a couple of reasons why I don't think it works to dras an analogy between the current DL situation and the 2005 CB situation.
#1- Existing talent. We have a little along the DL. Warren and Ekuban aren't world beaters, but they're much better comparatively than Roc Alexander, Lenny Walls and Jeremy LeSuer. Dumervil, by any account, looked extremely impressive and it appears as though his skills translate to the next level. In 2005 we had absolutely no talent at CB other than Champ. None.
Walls had a successful '03 season as a starter before injuries derailed him in '04, many thought he would hold onto that job, until he was owned by both Williams and Foxworth in camp. You start two CBs, and only three play heavily. You start four DLs (two of each) and rotate 6 or more in a given game. Our NFL level talent at DL is as follows: One underachieving starting DT (Warren) two pass rush specalist DEs (Lang, Dumervil), decent starting DE (Ekuban), and an ok, but undersized, run stopping backup (Engelberger). So we don't have vacancies enough to give two or three DLs shots at playing time? How about a second starting level DT, some backup DTs that belong in the league, or an end to play opposite Ekuban on 1st and 2nd downs?


#2-The position- When it comes to DBs, it can make sense to draft a bunch because they can contribute on STs. That isn't the case with DL. Darrent was drafted because of his ability to return kicks, the corner thing was a pleasant surprise. If a DB doesn't see the field as at his position, he can be kept on the roster for STs. That isn't the case with DL, and It doesn't make sense to spend 4 or 5 pick on the DL when you have limited space on the roster where you can stick them if they aren't in the rotation. Where the hell did you get "4 or 5 picks" on DLs? Thats rediculous. 3 tops, just make them higher value picks than the second day crap we have been spending on the position. Also faster DEs can easily play on kickoffs and DLs consistantly play on various special teams units including kick blocking and punt return units (those aren't OLs lining up opposite the punting team). Every type of athlete has a role on special teams.


#3-The Draft- History bears out the fact that linemen on both sides of the ball are more likely to come from very early in the draft than any other position, and it makes sense. 300# men who can maintain athletic ability are exceedingly rare. Far more so than any other position pre-requisite in the league. By very early I hope you mean top 15 picks. DTs taken outside of that have pretty high bust rates across the board and standout DEs come out of the later rounds all the time while late firsts never emerge.

That's like saying if you drop $100 on the street you wouldn't consider it a loss because, "Hey, someone spent it." No, it shows that we weren't just constantly drafting no talent bums, just misusing what talent we did get. Ideally our coaching change will help remedy that, but Bates and Johnson need new blood to work with first.

I think trading back is a rebuilding approach, and I don't think we should be in that mode at all.

I don't think so. This team isn't in need of rebuilding but it is in need of at least one or two big difference makers along with a half dozen role players. We never get in a draft position to take the big difference makers but with two 3rds (one early) we have the ability to stock pile value for next year while still adding a lot of early round talent to give us the depth we need.

You offer no good alternative other than a guy we'd have to tradeup after and overpick. That approach hasn't worked in the past at any position for the Broncos so why will that all of a sudden change? Active teams are the ones that win the draft when you look back a few years down the road. Pioli and Belicheck have realized the value of having two first round picks every few years to guarantee an influx of lower risk elite talent and now New England features one of the most impressive DLs in the league while running a 3-4, a system where DL impact should be marginalized.

If we trade back for an '08 first we can still keep four picks in the first 90 selections. With that we can add a legit RB to compete with Bush, an impact special teamer like Crosby, and probably one or two of the same DLs we'd be arguing over at 21.

And any and all of those players could amount to greatness, or absolutely nothing, including the lottery pick (is this the NBA all of a sudden?). I said lottery ticket, i.e. the odd chance something dramatic happens that ruins their season and throws the pick into the top 10. Big slides happen to good teams all the time.

If there was any chance Okoye would slide to 21 I'd be all for sitting and waiting on him, but he won't. He'll be gone by 15 and we'll be hoping to get Nelson (unlikely), Lynch (very unlikely), Carriker (could be had 6-10 picks later), Tank Tyler (could be had as many as a dozen picks later), etc.. We're praying on a slider or overpicking at 21, its a bad spot in this draft.

[Dedhed]

If there was any chance Okoye would slide to 21 I'd be all for sitting and waiting on him, but he won't. He'll be gone by 15 and we'll be hoping to get Nelson (unlikely), Lynch (very unlikely), Carriker (could be had 6-10 picks later), Tank Tyler (could be had as many as a dozen picks later), etc.. We're praying on a slider or overpicking at 21, its a bad spot in this draft.
You should have actually read my posts.

[Drek]

You should have actually read my posts.

A quick summary:
"Okoye is the best DT in the draft!" No, Branch is, Okoye might be where Branch is now in a year or two.

"He'd be great at pick #21" Yeah, too bad he'll be gone five or six picks sooner at the latest.

"Why trade down? We don't want more crappy second day DLs, we need real talented DLs!" Thats why we trade out, the guys we'll get at 21 are real similar to the guys we could get at 34, or 45, or hell, probably even 60. Second day DLs do suck, second and third rounders though do not. Why not take the chance to exploit the devaluation of future first round picks and find ourselves quite wealthy in next year's draft?

"Where would we play 4 or 5 DLs? They got no places to play on this team." Other than our compete lack of NFL level backups on the DL (Chukwurah, Veal, and Patterson shouldn't be playing minutes for anyone, Engelberger should be an injury sub). Though yeah, 4 or 5 is a bit much, two or three is what I've been talking about.

That about cover it?

[Dedhed]

A quick summary:
"Okoye is the best DT in the draft!" No, Branch is, Okoye might be where Branch is now in a year or two.

"He'd be great at pick #21" Yeah, too bad he'll be gone five or six picks sooner at the latest.

"Why trade down? We don't want more crappy second day DLs, we need real talented DLs!" Thats why we trade out, the guys we'll get at 21 are real similar to the guys we could get at 34, or 45, or hell, probably even 60. Second day DLs do suck, second and third rounders though do not. Why not take the chance to exploit the devaluation of future first round picks and find ourselves quite wealthy in next year's draft?

"Where would we play 4 or 5 DLs? They got no places to play on this team." Other than our compete lack of NFL level backups on the DL (Chukwurah, Veal, and Patterson shouldn't be playing minutes for anyone, Engelberger should be an injury sub). Though yeah, 4 or 5 is a bit much, two or three is what I've been talking about.

That about cover it?
You read all that, and still missed the point. All of what I said was based on us having the #21 selection and taking Okoye if he made it that far. You can say that he won't last, but you don't know that.

If you're such a fan of the rebuilding approach you should root for the Lions. If you're looking for setting up for the 2008 draft, you're in rebuilding mode whether you want to admit that or not.

[Drek]

You read all that, and still missed the point. All of what I said was based on us having the #21 selection and taking Okoye if he made it that far. You can say that he won't last, but you don't know that.

If you're such a fan of the rebuilding approach you should root for the Lions. If you're looking for setting up for the 2008 draft, you're in rebuilding mode whether you want to admit that or not.

I totally understand what you're saying. Lets sit at 21 and pray Okoye, Lynch, or some other pipe dream falls into our laps. I guess you must be a fan of Shanahan's old draft methodology when every year was a crap shoot and we just as often got an overpaid bust as a productive player.

Me? I'm all about taking the quickest path to making the Broncos a dynasty. To do that we need another young difference maker on defense, a reliable RB, and young NFL level depth across the board. You can't get all that in this one draft, but we can cover a big chunk of the young depth and probably grab a second or third round RB, which we've had success with. The only way we get the difference maker is to find a way into the top 10, but I don't want to fall off big to get it. So why not trade our pick this year for a future first and more day one talent in a draft deep in day one DLs? Then next year we'll have the ability to get the much needed difference maker while still adding new players to fill any new holes that might crop up along the way.

I know you think Okoye could be that young difference maker, I'd even agree assuming no big negatives crop up between now and the draft, but realistically we have no chance to get him. Same with everyone's desire for a stud safety. We can't realistically expect Landry or Nelson to slide. Hanging on to a pick hoping someone at our need positions will fall more often than not results in overpicking a backup plan and that hasn't worked out real well for us in the past.

[bpc]

I would take Reggie Nelson every time over Okoye and he could be there for us right now. Most are predicting him to be drafted right around 20. That won't happen after he runs a 4.4.

I would be very happy with Landry or Nelson. I'm just hoping something causes them to slip down to us. Nelson projects as a 'Ed Reed' type of safety with Landry being more of a Bob Sanders/Troy Polumalu type.

[elsid13]

The difference in what i've seen from Mebane compared to Okoye is that Mebane is a finished product besides technique. He definitely has more polish. Okoye however has higher upside. The thing about upside is sometimes they hit it and sometimes they don't. I've said from the very first post on here that if he is carrying 310-315 lbs he is in remarkable shape for that because with his size, he looks like he could add another 20lbs no problem what so ever. Also I would grade Okoye technique as poor-average at best. He should get better with better coaching in the NFL.

I don't dislike the guy, I just think he could be a big reach early in the 1st round. He has some things going for him though... increased size and strength are possibilities, his technique will get better and he is only 19 which means his prime could be extremely long. It could take two or three years for him to hit that level though.

From the reports I read he actually dropped 20 pound over last summer to get in better shape. He basically stopped eating junk food and eating after 1900 hours, which is pretty impressive when consider the whole collage eating pattern and night life.

[Drek]

I'd love to get Nelson or Landry at 21 but I think it'd take some luck to have one of them there as it is now and they're probably going nowhere but up. They have all the odds in their favor, an increased desire for premium safeties around the league, a shallow pool of first round CBs compelling teams in need of secondary help to look at safety, and already high stock with the ability to wow at the combine to go even higher.

If we do stay in the first round we should be looking to move up to the mid-teens so that we're assured of a desirable guy and hoping for a premium slider.

[bpc]

I think we will probably miss out on them too however i'm sure that some teams are going to fall in love with different prospects and reach for them... a la Saints-Chris Naole/Giants-Luke Petigout.

Michael Griffin is also vastly underated as well. The UT DB's coming out the past three or four years have been doing very well. I like Griffin as he has shown ability to support the run (80 tackles), create turnovers (8 total, 4 FF, 4 INT's) and also has 7 blocked punts over his career which is something need more of.

He could be a dark horse for us. I like all three safeties coming out, I think they are all going to do well. Landry will be more of the blitzer/heat seaker of the three, Nelson will create most turnovers and I think Griffin will be a mix of both, with a touch of special teams big plays added in.

I would be very happy with Griffin.

[mattob14]

Something tells me Shanahan may even take Griffin over Nelson, because of his hitting ability. The Broncos have always liked physical safeties and Griffin is more physical than Nelson. If we do take him, though, I'd rather trade down a little bit first.

[mattob14]

I'm surprised by how short some people's memories are. Last year's draft was one of the Bronco's best in years, maybe ever, and it was all set up by the trade with Washington, giving us extra picks in the first and fourth. We would have been lucky to get Cutler last year without them, and there's no way we could have picked up Javon or Sheffler with Cutler, plus we wouldn't have had the pick used on Brandon Marshall. And that's with Washington playing above their heads last year. Had they played like this year, and given us a top-10 pick, it would have been one of the better drafts in the entire league in recent years.

Trading for a future first is not re-building, it's acknowledging that it's hard to consistently pick up premium talent at the end of the first round, where Denver usually picks from. Adding future picks and hoping one turns into a high first allows us to pick up premium talent and keep the team competitive for the long run, not plug a hole with a solid player who will never have the long-term impact we need.

[bpc]

If we could get Griffin at the end of round 1/beg of round 2 then I would be all for trading back.

[Hercules Rockefeller]

Nelson is 9th in Kiper's latest Big Board, he's not going to be around at #21.

[Drek]

If we could get Griffin at the end of round 1/beg of round 2 then I would be all for trading back.

Thats why I'm preaching a trade back mindset. Griffin isn't in Kiper's top 25 or Scouts Inc's top 32. With two other much more hyped premier safeties I could easily see Griffin slide out of the first, making him a great value pick by trading up from 53.

[Dedhed]

The only way we get the difference maker is to find a way into the top 10

That assessment is proven wrong annually.

[Broncoman13]

If you want a Center Fielder type then the choice would be Nelson. If you want somebody that is going to get after the ball, whether it's a run or pass play then the answer is Griffin. Personally, I'd take Griffin over Nelson or Landry, but I've seen a lot more of his games.

Griffin reminds me of Palomalu except a little taller. He's always around the ball (see his 124 and 126 tackles in the last two years) and makes tackles all over the field. He'll pop the hell out of anybody. He's also Johnny on the spot when the ball is in the air (3 and 4 Ints the past two seasons). He'll likely run just as fast as Nelson, but Nelson seems to be the flavor of the month right now.

Reggie Nelson reminds me of Madeiu Williams, but about 20 lbs lighter. That's the main problem I see with Nelson. He's a ballhawk to be sure, but at 180 lbs (some sites list him at 190, Gatorzone lists him at 175) he's not much different (weight wise) than Foxworth was playing at safety and we all saw how that went.

Landry reminds me of Darren Sharper. He'll be a fantastic safety for years to come. He'll likely run in the 4.55 range though and I prefer somebody a little faster... that and he's projected to go about 7 spots higher than our draft position so I'm trying not to think about him at all!

[Requiem]

Looks like Okoye isn't the 317 pound monster we thought he was. Actually, a 287 pound monster; 30 pounds less than what people expected. This actually might hurt him a bit.

[bpc]

Well i'm doing my part to check this guy out further and the same things are really popping up. I think he has very good athleticism at the DT spot but it is now proven that he isn't 315 or even 300 lbs. He is moving fast because he is light in the ass. He continues to pop up and he does not have the technique or the strength to get movement on the interior of the line. I saw him in one on one's get stoned and I just watched the Rutgers film where he is just getting manhandled by regular guys. It will be even worse when he gets to the NFL.

I think taking this guy anywhere in the 1st, heck even the 2nd is a reach. This is just my oppinion but I don't know why he is being ranked so high. I don't see the safe bet that 1st rounders should be.

[Barry Ramey]

Okoye weighed in at less than 290lbs? At 6'1, that looks like an undersized DT to me and I don't think that helps the Broncos that much. Sure, he could put on weight, but I'd rather they get a guy whose a little more finished in his growth than hoping for a guy to do it.

[bpc]

California's Brandon Mebane is making himself millions this week. Considered one of the weaker links on a solid North defensive line, nothing about Mebane this week can be described as weak. He has performed well in pass rush drills, showing an explosiveness that twice knocked West Virginia's Dan Mozes on his back. Mebane wasn't just successful against Mozes -- he was unblockable for most interior linemen, even holding up well against double-teams. Scouts continue to circle his name and question why he didn't stand out like this in previous film. Whether Mebane has under-achieved in the past or simply taken his game to another notch this week, the fact remains he has arguably been the North's most impressive lineman and certainly has been the most positive surprise through two days of practice.

I was interested to see how Amobi Okoye would hold up this week, especially when he weighed in at 287 pounds Monday, a full 25 pounds less than he was listed at with the University of Louisville. The quickness off the snap has remained, but Okoye hasn't played with the power at the point of attack that led some to consider him as a potential nose guard. Okoye has flashed playmaking ability and hasn't been bad this week, but he hasn't yet been the difference-maker some expected. Still, at only 19 years old he has remarkable upside, and has held his own.

Like Okoye, Notre Dame's Victor Abiamiri may have entered the Senior Bowl a bit overrated. Whether because of the attention due to playing for Notre Dame or because he might be the most impressive looking prospect in Mobile getting off the bus, Abiamiri has his share of followers. He flashes rare speed off the edge, quite a statement considering he is nearly 6-feet-5 and weighed in at 270 pounds. That said, too often Abiamiri is stifled at the point of attack and unlike some of the more successful pass rushers here, Abiamiri struggles to make the play when he has been initially locked up. His frame and raw athleticism scream upside, but one would expect that a veteran of 49 games would have more in his pass rush arsenal.

Well I guess we can put the arguement of who has shown out better to rest with this post from nfldraftscout.com. I don't want Okoye in the first because honestly... I don't think he brings very much to the table right now. He is a undersized project.

[ludo21]

ok im still confused.

How the heck is this kid draftable for the NFL? I thought you had to be 21??

or a junior?

[elsid13]

ok im still confused.

How the heck is this kid draftable for the NFL? I thought you had to be 21??

or a junior?

You need to be 3 year out from your graduating high school class

[ludo21]

You need to be 3 year out from your graduating high school class

he is a big boy for sure.

And, thanks.... so was this guy home schooled or what. shheeeshh

[Drek]

ok im still confused.

How the heck is this kid draftable for the NFL? I thought you had to be 21??

or a junior?

Its three years removed from high school graduation actually, and Okoye graduated and enrolled at Louisville at 16.

[Atlas]

I think taking this guy anywhere in the 1st, heck even the 2nd is a reach. This is just my oppinion but I don't know why he is being ranked so high. I don't see the safe bet that 1st rounders should be.

Okoye is 19 years old. You know lots of people found holes with Kobe's game coming from high school to the NBA. This is the same deal except that Okoye played at the College level. My main concern with hm is if he is mature enough to hand the NFL. He might be a genius in the classroom but that doesn't tell anyone of his maturity.

[elsid13]

he is a big boy for sure.

And, thanks.... so was this guy home schooled or what. shheeeshh

He was accelerated in 9th grade - 12 at the time. And he isn't that big, he weight in at 285 or so. A lot smaller then people thought.

[Atlas]

ok im still confused.

How the heck is this kid draftable for the NFL? I thought you had to be 21??

or a junior?

He graduated from college!! He was in college at the age of 16!

[Atlas]

He was accelerated in 9th grade - 12 at the time. And he isn't that big, he weight in at 285 or so. A lot smaller then people thought.

can you imagine if he was going to college this year being a 285 LB 19 year old kid!

He'll be able to put on another 40 LBs and carry it easy.

[elsid13]

Okoye is 19 years old. You know lots of people found holes with Kobe's game coming from high school to the NBA. This is the same deal except that Okoye played at the College level. My main concern with hm is if he is mature enough to hand the NFL. He might be a genius in the classroom but that doesn't tell anyone of his maturity.

Maturity isn't going to be problem with this kid. Everyone talks about how mature he is. The problem is he light in the ass to play in NFL

[Atlas]

Maturity isn't going to be problem with this kid. Everyone talks about how mature he is. The problem is he light in the ass to play in NFL

What are you talking about?? He is 19 years old and he weighs almost as much as Michael Myers. His weight isn't even a concern. Put him on a regimented food program and supplements and he'll add 25 lbs befor ethe first game next year.

[Atlas]

This is from a scouting website.

Defensive Tackle | Senior | Louisville
Amobi Okoye
Height: 6-1 | Weight: 317 | 40-Time: 5.15

Official Bio


Strengths:
Extremely strong...A solid athlete with good measurables...Stout against the run and is able to take on multiple blockers...Gets a good push and will collapse the pocket...Is able to shed blocks and clog up the middle...Shows great instincts for the game and is still developing...Smart player who wants to improve...Still has a ton of potential and he could really be physically molded by a pro strength coach.

Weaknesses:
Doesn't always play with proper leverage...Does not have a great burst of closing speed...Has to develop some additional pass rush moves...Might need to lose a little weight and get in better shape...Is inconsistent and will disappear from the action at times...Still needs a lot of technique work and is not a finished product.

Notes:
Has four years of Division I playing experience but will still only be a 20-year-old rookie in the NFL...A native of Nigeria who tested into the 9th grade as a 12-year-old and played at Louisville as a 16-year-old true freshman in '03...Possible nose tackle in a 3-4 scheme...The NFL Draft has never seen a player quite like this and even though he's a very good prospect now it's his upside that is really intriguing.

[ludo21]

At only age 19, and the body he has, he can easily add that weight in the offseason.

Man, imagine going to college as a 16 yr old kid. wow.

His potential is massive, i hope we get him.

[Atlas]

At only age 19, and the body he has, he can easily add that weight in the offseason.

Man, imagine going to college as a 16 yr old kid. wow.

His potential is massive, i hope we get him.
The site I was looking at had him going #9 to Miami. no way he makes it to Denver.

[elsid13]

This is from a scouting website.

Defensive Tackle | Senior | Louisville
Amobi Okoye
Height: 6-1 | Weight: 317 | 40-Time: 5.15

Official Bio


Strengths:
Extremely strong...A solid athlete with good measurables...Stout against the run and is able to take on multiple blockers...Gets a good push and will collapse the pocket...Is able to shed blocks and clog up the middle...Shows great instincts for the game and is still developing...Smart player who wants to improve...Still has a ton of potential and he could really be physically molded by a pro strength coach.

Weaknesses:
Doesn't always play with proper leverage...Does not have a great burst of closing speed...Has to develop some additional pass rush moves...Might need to lose a little weight and get in better shape...Is inconsistent and will disappear from the action at times...Still needs a lot of technique work and is not a finished product.

Notes:
Has four years of Division I playing experience but will still only be a 20-year-old rookie in the NFL...A native of Nigeria who tested into the 9th grade as a 12-year-old and played at Louisville as a 16-year-old true freshman in '03...Possible nose tackle in a 3-4 scheme...The NFL Draft has never seen a player quite like this and even though he's a very good prospect now it's his upside that is really intriguing.

Official weight at the Senior Bowl is 287. That the first real weight and size you will see on the guy, most of the weight thrown around on the Internet are based on what the school say, and not one roster is every true. Check out Socal's thread for all the weight. Second he still looks light to me, when see him against the rest of the DLine at the Senior Bowl.

Yes he put on weight, but expect him to do it from here to the first game. It takes the guys a full profession off season to add muscle and get in good training program.

[Billy Clyde Puckett]

Not ready to make any final judgements on any player. There is over 3 months of evaluations to come. I do know I have watched this kid produce on the field seeing probably 15 of his games over the last two years.

[SureShot]

Not ready to make any final judgements on any player. There is over 3 months of evaluations to come. I do know I have watched this kid produce on the field seeing probably 15 of his games over the last two years.


Ahhh everyone knows that doesn't matter! I want to know his standing broad jump numbers.:~ohyah!:

[Atlas]

Official weight at the Senior Bowl is 287. That the first real weight and size you will see on the guy, most of the weight thrown around on the Internet are based on what the school say, and not one roster is every true. Check out Socal's thread for all the weight. Second he still looks light to me, when see him against the rest of the DLine at the Senior Bowl.

Yes he put on weight, but expect him to do it from here to the first game. It takes the guys a full profession off season to add muscle and get in good training program.

The scouting report said this. "Might need to lose a little weight and get in better shape.." He lost the weight obviously and he is in better shape. An offseason weight program and he'll have no problem adding weight. He is 10 lbs lighter than Michael Myers and he is 19 years old! He hasn't even really finished filling out yet.

[Atlas]

I just got this off the wire.

Date: 01/24/2007 03:00 PM

BC-FBC--Senior Bowl-Okoye/821
19-year-old Okoye poised to join NFL
By JOHN ZENOR
AP Sports Writer

MOBILE, Ala. (AP) _ Louisville defensive tackle Amobi Okoye wants to be a top 5 pick in the upcoming NFL draft, help his team to the Super Bowl as a rookie and do a good job managing all that money.

Being able to legally grab a beer with his teammates will have to wait a couple of years.

The 19-year-old Okoye will become the youngest player to compete in the Senior Bowl, a showcase for senior NFL prospects set for Saturday.

''This is where I'm supposed to be,'' he said. ''It's nothing new to me.''

Besides, Okoye is hardly an unproven commodity. He signed with Louisville's Bobby Petrino as a 15-year-old in Huntsville, Ala., and grew into a muscular 6-foot-2, 312 pounds.

His resume reads more like a high-tech prodigy than a football player: College at 16. Degree in 3½ years. Job interviews with a couple of dozen prospective employers.

He started school at age 2½, skipped sixth grade and entered high school in Huntsville at 12 after his family moved from Nigeria.

And now on to the NFL, where he'll be facing offensive linemen who were playing high school ball before he was born.

''I'm ready for it,'' said Okoye, a second-team AP All-American. ''It's going to be a challenge. Every time a challenge has been put before me, I've always been ready to accept the challenge and just go out there and do the best I can do.

''It's a lot of money for a 19-year-old. But that was my whole motivation last year. I wanted to be a 19-year-old millionaire. Hopefully I'll be that.''

Okoye is projected as a likely first-round pick, and some NFL mock drafts have him going in the top 10.

It only took one Senior Bowl practice for Okoye to make an impression on North coach Jon Gruden.

''It's really unbelievable. He went out there and was knocking people around. He didn't look like he was 19,'' said Gruden, coach of the Tampa Bay Buccaneers. ''I've just got a tremendous amount of respect for him and how he's been raised. He's obviously a very smart guy to accelerate his academics the way he has. He may be young, but he is not lacking any physical attributes at this point.''

Even with his hat turned backward and a somewhat skimpy goatee, the massive Okoye doesn't look 19. But given his age, teams are also going to gauge his mental maturity along with those physical skills.

''When you look at the tape, the guy's an explosive football player,'' Gruden said. ''He really has a chance to play. You just worry about what he's going to do at night, 10 o'clock with no bed check. That's what I worry about with a 19-year-old kid. I worry about that more than anything else.''

Teenagers with fat paychecks have been far more common in the NBA and pro baseball.

Okoye, however, points out a significant difference. Those guys either are fresh out of high school or have minimal college experience. He has been playing college ball since his first year out of high school and has a degree in psychology.

''I think college is something everybody should go through,'' Okoye said. ''I learned a lot in college. I learned a lot about life, and I grew.''

''He's very mature,'' said running back Kolby Smith, a Louisville and Senior Bowl teammate. ''He's aware of everything that's going on around him. Like they say, he's wise beyond his years.''

Okoye has big ambitions. He's ''shooting for the first five'' draft picks. He would love to follow in the New Orleans Saints' Reggie Bush's footsteps and play for a winning team as a rookie.

''I'm sure he definitely enjoyed his first year going to the NFC championship game,'' Okoye said. ''Maybe I can do something like that and maybe go even further than that, to the Super Bowl.''

He's used to people wondering if he'll be able to handle a big leap in competition and pressures at such a young age.

Okoye said that when Petrino was asked about his youngest signee four years ago, the coach ''said he was going to wait until I started shaving before he played me.

''I went out there and showed him my capabilities and my talent, and he told them he went out and bought me a razor.''

He played in all 13 games as a freshman. But he also showed glimpses of his potential upside with a breakout senior season.

Okoye had 23 tackles and half a sack as a junior. Those numbers jumped to 55 and eight last season, earning him unanimous selection as first-team All-Big East Conference.

Okoye wouldn't mind rejoining Petrino and position coach Kevin Wolthausen, both now with the Atlanta Falcons. The Falcons have the 10th overall pick.

''(Petrino) helped me out with a lot of things and I helped him out with a lot of things,'' Okoye said. ''I think we have a pretty good relationship. My old position coach is here, too. I saw him this week.

''Seeing him kind of brought a smile to my face.''

[Broncoman13]

The kid isn't the type of DT that we need at the moment. We need a big body that can occupy the OL and keep it open for our LB's. Okoye is going to be a great player. Everyone has been talking about him being a leader and encouraging everyone at the Sr. Bowl. He knows he has a strong skillset.

Here's what I see with him. A penetrating DT that will earn his money on 3rd downs early in his career. He has great hands and an explosive first step. That will allow him to really penetrate and be disruptive against the pass. Not to say he won't be a 3 down player, but he's not going to be a great run defender early on. Not for his team. He'll have a good bit of TFL's b/c he can penetrate, but he won't help the LB's behind him much, making him somewhat of a liability against the run. That will only last a year or two though. By the time this kid is 21 and playing in his 3rd season he'll likely be 305#. And the scary part is he'll look thin b/c it will be muscle.

So in short, he IS somewhat of a project right now. He's a guy that will probably get 5 or 6 sacks his rookie year. He'll also have a handful of TFL's, but he won't help a defense improve drastically against the run. Think of a project that will produce initially and could be a John Randle type of player in the future! For those of you that don't remember him, John Randle was 6'1 and listed at 287 lbs. Okoye is Randle all over again. His size is NOT an issue!

[Billy Clyde Puckett]

I doubt the Bronco's get him, but he is the poster boy for all that is good as a fooball player and a great leader they will need on the field. In a couple of years Lynch and Wilson will be gone. Who is going to fill that leadership role? Champ - Maybe, but I think he doesn't want the additional pressure of being the leader. No one else on the D that I can think of can fill that void.

[Billy Clyde Puckett]

http://sports.yahoo.com/ncaaf/news?slug=ap-seniorbowl-okoye&prov=ap&type=lgns

19-year-old Okoye poised to join NFL


By JOHN ZENOR<, AP Sports Writer
January 24, 2007

MOBILE, Ala. (AP) -- Louisville defensive tackle Amobi Okoye wants to be a top 5 pick in the upcoming NFL draft, help his team to the Super Bowl as a rookie and do a good job managing all that money.

Being able to legally grab a beer with his teammates will have to wait a couple of years.

The 19-year-old Okoye will become the youngest player to compete in the Senior Bowl, a showcase for senior NFL prospects set for Saturday.

"This is where I'm supposed to be," he said. "It's nothing new to me."

Besides, Okoye is hardly an unproven commodity. He signed with Louisville's Bobby Petrino as a 15-year-old in Huntsville, Ala., and grew into a muscular 6-foot-2, 312 pounds.

His resume reads more like a high-tech prodigy than a football player: College at 16. Degree in 3 1/2 years. Job interviews with a couple of dozen prospective employers.

He started school at age 2 1/2 , skipped sixth grade and entered high school in Huntsville at 12 after his family moved from Nigeria.

And now on to the NFL, where he'll be facing offensive linemen who were playing high school ball before he was born.

"I'm ready for it," said Okoye, a second-team AP All-American. "It's going to be a challenge. Every time a challenge has been put before me, I've always been ready to accept the challenge and just go out there and do the best I can do.

"It's a lot of money for a 19-year-old. But that was my whole motivation last year. I wanted to be a 19-year-old millionaire. Hopefully I'll be that."

Okoye is projected as a likely first-round pick, and some NFL mock drafts have him going in the top 10.

It only took one Senior Bowl practice for Okoye to make an impression on North coach Jon Gruden.

"It's really unbelievable. He went out there and was knocking people around. He didn't look like he was 19," said Gruden, coach of the Tampa Bay Buccaneers. "I've just got a tremendous amount of respect for him and how he's been raised. He's obviously a very smart guy to accelerate his academics the way he has. He may be young, but he is not lacking any physical attributes at this point."

Even with his hat turned backward and a somewhat skimpy goatee, the massive Okoye doesn't look 19. But given his age, teams are also going to gauge his mental maturity along with those physical skills.

"When you look at the tape, the guy's an explosive football player," Gruden said. "He really has a chance to play. You just worry about what he's going to do at night, 10 o'clock with no bed check. That's what I worry about with a 19-year-old kid. I worry about that more than anything else."

Teenagers with fat paychecks have been far more common in the NBA and pro baseball.

Okoye, however, points out a significant difference. Those guys either are fresh out of high school or have minimal college experience. He has been playing college ball since his first year out of high school and has a degree in psychology.

"I think college is something everybody should go through," Okoye said. "I learned a lot in college. I learned a lot about life, and I grew."

"He's very mature," said running back Kolby Smith, a Louisville and Senior Bowl teammate. "He's aware of everything that's going on around him. Like they say, he's wise beyond his years."

Okoye has big ambitions. He's "shooting for the first five" draft picks. He would love to follow in the New Orleans Saints' Reggie Bush's footsteps and play for a winning team as a rookie.

"I'm sure he definitely enjoyed his first year going to the NFC championship game," Okoye said. "Maybe I can do something like that and maybe go even further than that, to the Super Bowl."

He's used to people wondering if he'll be able to handle a big leap in competition and pressures at such a young age.

Okoye said that when Petrino was asked about his youngest signee four years ago, the coach "said he was going to wait until I started shaving before he played me.

"I went out there and showed him my capabilities and my talent, and he told them he went out and bought me a razor."

He played in all 13 games as a freshman. But he also showed glimpses of his potential upside with a breakout senior season.

Okoye had 23 tackles and half a sack as a junior. Those numbers jumped to 55 and eight last season, earning him unanimous selection as first-team All-Big East Conference.

Okoye wouldn't mind rejoining Petrino and position coach Kevin Wolthausen, both now with the Atlanta Falcons. The Falcons have the 10th overall pick.

"(Petrino) helped me out with a lot of things and I helped him out with a lot of things," Okoye said. "I think we have a pretty good relationship. My old position coach is here, too. I saw him this week.

"Seeing him kind of brought a smile to my face."