Will Denver really address DL this year???????

[NFLBRONCO]

Look at last year (Not complaining at all loved our draft) but, look at the top 3
positions wanted

1. QB
2. RB
3. S

You'd think after pass rush problems forever we would have had DL in top 3 needs in 06. So does the 06 wishlist transfer to 07 wishlist if so our top targets would be

1. RB
2. S

[bpc]

Watch SF knock our ass off the ball during the 2nd half of our last game AT HOME. When SF should have been quitting... WE quit. On our own field. We had 6 or 7 games where opposing backs ran for over 100yds.

I rather see Peyton Manning or opposing QB's throw for 300 yds a game against us vs. having some team cram the ball down our throats.

We have a chance to infuse some talent on this DLine. We better pay the piper this year and replenish the talent on our front line.

I can't stand finesse, soft ass defenses. We look like the Colts run defense at times this year.

[NFLBRONCO]

Watch SF knock our ass off the ball during the 2nd half of our last game AT HOME. When SF should have been quitting... WE quit. On our own field. We had 6 or 7 games where opposing backs ran for over 100yds.

I rather see Peyton Manning or opposing QB's throw for 300 yds a game against us vs. having some team cram the ball down our throats.

We have a chance to infuse some talent on this DLine. We better pay the piper this year and replenish the talent on our front line.

I can't stand finesse, soft ass defenses. We look like the Colts run defense at times this year.


I agree 100% with you but, we have been saying this how long about both our lines YEARS. So until I see it happen I'm not expecting much.

[SoCalBronco]

Shanny has ignored the line for years in the draft. We havent even picked a single Day One defensive line prospect since 2002. Not a single one! And even in 2002, that was a 3rd round pick. We have ofcourse, tried to solve the problem through FA, so its not like we havent thrown major resources at it, its just that for various reasons it hasnt worked. Pittman and Jelly got decent contracts, that didnt work, IHOP got a good contract, that didnt work, we paid Warren, he is doing ok. But FA is fraught with risk and you really gotta pay, and you gotta worry about the "I got paid, so now I can be a fat ass" factor. It would be nice if we finally take the safer route, which is the draft. Ofcourse, in the sense that you are gambling on your evaluation system, the draft doesnt appear "safer", but from the perspective that the financial investment, even for mid to late first rounders, isnt that much at all, and you can sink your hook into them for 5,6 years. I mean, look at Warren, he got a 12 million bonus last year I think, you take a kid at Pick 21, your very first pick, and thats prolly just 5 million in total bonus money, or just perhaps slightly higher, maybe 5.5. And they are motivated to get that big second contract. We really need to start focusing on the draft in this area...actually in all areas.....there are already too many big contracts on the Broncos...Cutler's getting paid, Javon's getting paid, Lepsis is getting paid, Hamilton is sorta getting paid... Warren is getting paid, Al is getting paid...Ian is sorta getting paid, Champ is definitely getting paid...I dont think there is money to make big financial investments on the line anyway, its either we make a real draft investment or we keep trying to turn trash into gold. We need to make the draft investment. We really need to stop ignoring the line. 2 picks on Day 1 for the DL.

[NFLBRONCO]

Shanny has ignored the line for years in the draft. We havent even picked a single Day One defensive line prospect since 2002. Not a single one! And even in 2002, that was a 3rd round pick. We have ofcourse, tried to solve the problem through FA, so its not like we havent thrown major resources at it, its just that for various reasons it hasnt worked. Pittman and Jelly got decent contracts, that didnt work, IHOP got a good contract, that didnt work, we paid Warren, he is doing ok. But FA is fraught with risk and you really gotta pay, and you gotta worry about the "I got paid, so now I can be a fat ass" factor. It would be nice if we finally take the safer route, which is the draft. Ofcourse, in the sense that you are gambling on your evaluation system, the draft doesnt appear "safer", but from the perspective that the financial investment, even for mid to late first rounders, isnt that much at all, and you can sink your hook into them for 5,6 years. I mean, look at Warren, he got a 12 million bonus last year I think, you take a kid at Pick 21, your very first pick, and thats prolly just 5 million in total bonus money, or just perhaps slightly higher, maybe 5.5. And they are motivated to get that big second contract. We really need to start focusing on the draft in this area...actually in all areas.....there are already too many big contracts on the Broncos...Cutler's getting paid, Javon's getting paid, Lepsis is getting paid, Hamilton is sorta getting paid... Warren is getting paid, Al is getting paid...Ian is sorta getting paid, Champ is definitely getting paid...I dont think there is money to make big financial investments on the line anyway, its either we make a real draft investment or we keep trying to turn trash into gold. We need to make the draft investment. We really need to stop ignoring the line. 2 picks on Day 1 for the DL.

I'll faint if we use one day 1 pick on DL.

[bpc]

Hell I wouldn't mind seeing us make an investment in a guy like Justin Smith, then turning around and using two or three of our 1st day picks on the DL. Hell, I'll take Smith and then Anderson crammed with Mebane in the middle next to Warren.

I'm not down for overpaying Myers. He is average at best. I'm okay on passing on HB if we can bring a guy like Chris Brown in to challenge Tatum and Mike. I'm all good with our weapons that Cutler has ALTHOUGH, i would like another receiving threat at some point... and at safety, AGE becomes a factor but I think Lynch and Ferguson have one more good season in them AT least... and it will be amazing how much younger they look when we can actually generate a pass rush for them.

I'm saying make a committment and go with. Justin Smith will be as close to a flawless investment as we could have... the young talent on the DLIne is too important for us to pass up this time around.

[NFLBRONCO]

Defensive line: The Broncos likely will look to upgrade here as they have the past couple of seasons. The most likely position will be defensive end. The Broncos got solid production out of Ebenezer Ekuban and Kenard Lang, but Lang was signed to be a backup behind Courtney Brown, who missed the season after another knee surgery.

Brown said recently he is hopeful of coming back. Elvis Dumervil had 8 1/2 sacks as a rookie, but the former Louisville star is more of a specialist.

Several prospective impact free agents play the position. They include Dwight Freeney, Justin Smith, Charles Grant and Patrick Kearney. Some of those players, likely Freeney, will be hit with the franchise tag. The Broncos also could trade up and draft a strong pass rusher such as Clemson's Gaines Adams or Arkansas' Jamaal Anderson.

The Broncos likely will come to a contract extension agreement with Michael Myers, a high-motor, blue-collar worker. Couple him with Gerard Warren and backup Demetrin Veal, and Denver appears set at tackle. DPO

I disagree we need another starter DT badly

[Kaylore]

Look at last year (Not complaining at all loved our draft) but, look at the top 3
positions wanted

1. QB
2. RB
3. S

You'd think after pass rush problems forever we would have had DL in top 3 needs in 06. So does the 06 wishlist transfer to 07 wishlist if so our top targets would be

1. RB
2. S

Actually that's not even close to right. It was:

1. De - Ask all those guys like Alec if they think we wasted our pick on Cutler
2. WR - Remember how desperate we were on this? So desperate we were considering TO?
3. RB - This is right.

Some people wanted a Safety, but it wasn't high on our needs table at the time.

[NFLBRONCO]

Actually that's not even close to right. It was:

1. De - Ask all those guys like Alec if they think we wasted our pick on Cutler
2. WR - Remember how desperate we were on this? So desperate we were considering TO?
3. RB - This is right.

Some people wanted a Safety, but it wasn't high on our needs table at the time.


I heard on several occasions though that Denver wanted Maroney at 15 if they couldn't get Cutler. I loved Cutler pick BTW. I agree on WR but, it was for Vets not #1 pick is what I'm saying.

[Drek]

I heard on several occasions though that Denver wanted Maroney at 15 if they couldn't get Cutler. I loved Cutler pick BTW. I agree on WR but, it was for Vets not #1 pick is what I'm saying.

You really can't evaluate our targets based simply on what we did retroactive to an overpaid FA session and a draft with very skewed weak and strong points.

Shanahan was in the Abraham talks, he pursued Andre Carter. Its clear we saw DE as a position of need. I'm not sure if they still do, I personally think our DEs aren't too bad at this point. Lang and Dumervil both show pass rushing skills, Ekuban had a very good year on the strong side, creating pressure often and being a very good run stopping end. With Brown back and teaming with Ekuban instead of guys like Chukwurah and Engelberger seeing the field as often as they did I think we'd be ok.

The real DL position of weakness is DT. Warren had a very up and down season that probably rates out on the whole as average. Myers had a similar season with fewer high points. Neither creates real pressure on the QB and both disappear too often in the running game. Veal is a very poor backup to boot.

I'd be ok with keeping Myers if he takes a contract in the $1.5-$2M area with no more than a quarter of it as bonus. At that point he is the stop gap DT for a young guy I'm hoping we bring in through the draft. Okoye, Tank Tyler, and Pittlock could all fall to us at 21, and if Branch does declare I'd be more than willing to trade up after him (he's the only player in this draft the Broncos should trade up for).

I think, and hope the FO sees it the same, that our draft board by position should be 1. DT, 2. RB, 3. S. After that we should be looking for best talent available. I'm hoping we go DT in round 1 (ideally Branch, flipping one third to move up), RB in round two (praying for a sliding Bush here) and safety in round 3 (Zbikowski). Then spend the second day adding capable athletes who can make a difference on special teams, first and foremost a young linebacker to help on kick and punt coverage.

[NFLBRONCO]

You really can't evaluate our targets based simply on what we did retroactive to an overpaid FA session and a draft with very skewed weak and strong points.

Shanahan was in the Abraham talks, he pursued Andre Carter. Its clear we saw DE as a position of need. I'm not sure if they still do, I personally think our DEs aren't too bad at this point. Lang and Dumervil both show pass rushing skills, Ekuban had a very good year on the strong side, creating pressure often and being a very good run stopping end. With Brown back and teaming with Ekuban instead of guys like Chukwurah and Engelberger seeing the field as often as they did I think we'd be ok.

The real DL position of weakness is DT. Warren had a very up and down season that probably rates out on the whole as average. Myers had a similar season with fewer high points. Neither creates real pressure on the QB and both disappear too often in the running game. Veal is a very poor backup to boot.

I'd be ok with keeping Myers if he takes a contract in the $1.5-$2M area with no more than a quarter of it as bonus. At that point he is the stop gap DT for a young guy I'm hoping we bring in through the draft. Okoye, Tank Tyler, and Pittlock could all fall to us at 21, and if Branch does declare I'd be more than willing to trade up after him (he's the only player in this draft the Broncos should trade up for).

I think, and hope the FO sees it the same, that our draft board by position should be 1. DT, 2. RB, 3. S. After that we should be looking for best talent available. I'm hoping we go DT in round 1 (ideally Branch, flipping one third to move up), RB in round two (praying for a sliding Bush here) and safety in round 3 (Zbikowski). Then spend the second day adding capable athletes who can make a difference on special teams, first and foremost a young linebacker to help on kick and punt coverage.

Good points here thanks. I was talking about our #1 pick only after we were at 15. I listed 1. QB because we actually drafted Cutler and then Maroney was also an interest from reports over and over if we couldn't get Cutler. I even heard Whitner's name mentioned.

Now the we have some money maybe we can add a FA DL to the mix besides Meyer's. I think we could desperately use a DE and DT upgrade and not settle with just bring back Meyer's and Brown. This is Denver who has drafted 1 DL in round 1 in 12 yrs. We will find out in April how high we rank DL when picks are made.

[Drek]

To be fair to the FO though, when is the last time we saw a quality DL available at our draft positions? By many reports Shanahan had Tommi Harris pretty high on his list a few years ago. The last four or five drafts have been pretty sparse on premier DL talent, most of the best DLs nowadays come from top 15 picks or late round steals who break out or are system fits.

I'd say this draft is deeper at DL than any draft in a while, though that could change if guys underperform at the post-season bowls and combine like many did last year. If we're going to draft DL this is the year to do it.

[NFLBRONCO]

To be fair to the FO though, when is the last time we saw a quality DL available at our draft positions? By many reports Shanahan had Tommi Harris pretty high on his list a few years ago. The last four or five drafts have been pretty sparse on premier DL talent, most of the best DLs nowadays come from top 15 picks or late round steals who break out or are system fits.

I'd say this draft is deeper at DL than any draft in a while, though that could change if guys underperform at the post-season bowls and combine like many did last year. If we're going to draft DL this is the year to do it.

Good points I agree with you here. I'm just really hoping we finally use higher picks to address this area this time not overlook it again.

[Mediator12]

Yes. From what I have heard the DEN DL has graded out well below average this year. Pure and Simple, the DL is going to be the top offseason priority for the FO for the first time in awhile, if ever.

I hope they just go after playmaker's like Grant and Justin Smith in FA, we really need a Dominant LDE. Then, Draft a good solid crop of 2 DL prospects in rounds 1-3. There are some sleeper guys in the third that could be Excellent pro prospects like Dan Bazuin, Ray Mcdonald, and Junior Jarvis Moss.

Plus, the added Junior DL that have declared will push value later in the draft as well into the third tier of the first round for the first time in years. I just hope more junior skill players declare in order to keep pushing the DL farther back and it seems to be happening.

[NFLBRONCO]

Yes. From what I have heard the DEN DL has graded out well below average this year. Pure and Simple, the DL is going to be the top offseason priority for the FO for the first time in awhile, if ever.

I hope they just go after playmaker's like Grant and Justin Smith in FA, we really need a Dominant LDE. Then, Draft a good solid crop of 2 DL prospects in rounds 1-3. There are some sleeper guys in the third that could be Excellent pro prospects like Dan Bazuin, Ray Mcdonald, and Junior Jarvis Moss.

Plus, the added Junior DL that have declared will push value later in the draft as well into the third tier of the first round for the first time in years. I just hope more junior skill players declare in order to keep pushing the DL farther back and it seems to be happening.


Thanks for Info Med

[bpc]

I don't think Warren is bad... I don't think he is incredibly motivated though. I think when he hurt both of his toes it made him play very timid.

I want a mean a$$ mofo cut from the same cloth as John Henderson. That is a mean SOB. He has players smacking him bare-handed in the face. That is something we have truly missed on our line since the super bowls... we haven't had any guys that are hungry and ready to eat. Neil Smith loved the taste of the QB and would stop at nothing to get there. Alfred Williams as well... you could say the same for Keith Traylor. Mike Lodish had a motor that wouldn't stop.

We have too many guys out there that are loafing and okay with just getting blocked. We need more guys like Elvis who love the feeling of knocking the QB on his a$$.

Remake the the DL. Bribe J. Smith in here, draft Anderson, Mebane, and a DT who slides... like Pittcock...

I'll feel very comfortable with Justin Smith, Ekuban, Anderson, Elvis Dumerville, Courtney Brown, Gerrard Warren, Mebane, Pittcock, and Demetrin Veal playing next year for us. We can throw in some guys like Lang as well in case Brown breaks down again.

That is what we SHOULD do.

[Mediator12]

Warren is talented as Hell, but he is a weak minded player. Other things bother him more than playing football. He shows Flashes in games, but his play to play consistency is horrible. When it comes down to it, he struggles to be a playmaker in either the Running or passing games. He should be both.

[Traveler]

We’re told that with a fumble in each of the Broncos’ last three games and an inability to truly distance himself from rookie Mike Bell, Tatum Bell could have trouble landing a roster spot for next season, depending on the team’s activity in free agency and the draft.

It’s early, but it wouldn’t come as a surprise to sources in Denver to see the Broncos package their extra third-round pick from Washington in the Ashley Lelie three-team trade in an effort to move up and land an impact defensive end in the draft.

http://www.profootballweekly.com/PFW/The+Way+We+Hear+It/Whispers/default.htm

[bpc]

Still a long time to go. Let the speculation run rampant.

[azbroncfan]

I want a AP(pipe dream), Lynch(maybe but not likely), or bush in the first then all DL and S. If Bush or Lynch aren't available DL in the first.

[phibacka31]

I would love to see the broncs trade tatum for another pick. Please get him outta here

[Drek]

I would love to see the broncs trade tatum for another pick. Please get him outta here

But what level pick is worth it?

I'm betting Shanahan will see Bell with similar value to Lelie and ask for no less than an early 3rd. Maybe he'd settle for a mid 3rd, but he'd probably want an '08 pick to go with it.

Can't think of many teams who'll be willing to give that for an undeniable playmaker, but one with fumble problems.

As for the DL, Smith would be a great LDE to pick up. He'd push Ekuban down to a bench spot to where he and hopefully a healthy Brown will rotate as Smith's backup and RDE on rushing downs. Lang and Dumervil give us a good pass rushing tandem to play at RDE as well. Then we can look at DT in the draft, ideally taking two, one high who can vie for a starting job and one in the middle of the draft to develop. Keep Meyers if he'll take reasonable money and hope he gets bumped into a backup role.

I think our biggest DL problem, other than horrible DT play, is one dimensional guys like Ekuban and Lang starting, then being spelled by guys like Engelberger and Chukwurah. Our starters last year should have been backups/situational guys and our backups should have only been injury protection guys.

[SoDak Bronco]

Everyone seems to forget all of the good D-lineman Denver has let go. Maybe it was the scheme we were running that put less of an emphasis on pass rush, and more of taking on blockers. Here are a few names: Reggie Hayward, Bertrand Berry, and Trevor Pryce. Can you imagine if Denver could have kept these guys together?? Obviously we couldn't afford too, but I'm just saying these guys played above average/great at times and moved on to have continued success. I think our D-line talent is bad, and the scheme was bad. Hopefully Warren picks it up next year, or gets cut loose, hopefully Bates will bring some new blood and the guys play for a full 60 minutes. I think we need to get BIGGER/at DE, and hopefully draft a stud DE(round 1) and a horse DT(3rd) in the first 4 rounds.