Jay Cutler Takes Aim at Another NFL Record

[-Slap-]

As we all know, Jay broke the record shared by Dan Marino and Chuck Conerly by throwing two TDs in his first four starts as a rookie.

That put him in a tie with Mark Rypien for the most consecutive starts with at least two TDs to start an NFL career. Rypien was drafted in 1986, but spent his first two seasons stashed on injured reserve.

[epicSocialism4tw]

The modern sports media atmosphere has created a seemingly infinite number of useless statistics. Of which, this is one.

Cutler does look pretty darn good so far though.

[-Slap-]

The modern sports media atmosphere has created a seemingly infinite number of useless statistics. Of which, this is one.

Cutler does look pretty darn good so far though.

Yeah, achievements which have never been accomplished in 80+ years of NFL competition are useless.

Its so commonplace for NFL quarterbacks to come right into the League and perform well.

[Cito Pelon]

As we all know, Jay broke the record shared by Dan Marino and Chuck Conerly by throwing two TDs in his first four starts as a rookie.

That put him in a tie with Mark Rypien for the most consecutive starts with at least two TDs to start an NFL career. Rypien was drafted in 1986, but spent his first two seasons stashed on injured reserve.

Here's to #6. So far, so good. The kid likes to go downfield, likes to go for the end zone and finds it. The team looks like it has a playoff spot, now it's a matter of who's gonna have the games of their lives if/when they make the playoffs - and that's been a problem with the Broncs for seven consecutive years.

[epicSocialism4tw]

Yeah, achievements which have never been accomplished in 80+ years of NFL competition are useless.
Its so commonplace for NFL quarterbacks to come right into the League and perform well.

The statistic you are looking at is basically a fantasy football statistic, which doesnt tell a whole lot about the player other than than what that means to fantasy football players who will be drafting next year.

You should know as well as anyone that the TD statistics have become glamour stats because of fantasy football. Stats that are telling about the game (yards, touches, completions, etc) have become less important to Joe Schmoe football fan. He just wants fantasy points.

[Florida_Bronco]

The statistic you are looking at is basically a fantasy football statistic, which doesnt tell a whole lot about the player other than than what that means to fantasy football players who will be drafting next year.

You should know as well as anyone that the TD statistics have become glamour stats because of fantasy football. Stats that are telling about the game (yards, touches, completions, etc) have become less important to Joe Schmoe football fan. He just wants fantasy points.

While I disagree with you saying that this stat is useless, I will agree that I hate the impact that fantasy football has had on typical fans.

[-Slap-]

The statistic you are looking at is basically a fantasy football statistic, which doesnt tell a whole lot about the player other than than what that means to fantasy football players who will be drafting next year.

You should know as well as anyone that the TD statistics have become glamour stats because of fantasy football. Stats that are telling about the game (yards, touches, completions, etc) have become less important to Joe Schmoe football fan. He just wants fantasy points.

Spare me the ridiculous doubletalk. I want a quarterback who can put the football in the end zone. If you think "yards, touches(?) and completions" are more important than putting points on the board, you don't understand the most rudimentary aspect of the sport.

http://img346.imageshack.us/img346/4958/c0032916vc0.jpg

[Cito Pelon]

Yeah, achievements which have never been accomplished in 80+ years of NFL competition are useless.

Its so commonplace for NFL quarterbacks to come right into the League and perform well.

The kid can play. But come playoffs Shanny or Coyer will f it up somehow. They may even f it up next week when SF comes to town by starting TB and DW, or trying to play a zone D. They'll play the best "practice players", and that isn't necessarily the best game-day players.

[epicSocialism4tw]

Spare me the ridiculous doubletalk. I want a quarterback who can put the football in the end zone. If you think "yards, touches(?) and completions" are more important than putting points on the board, you don't understand the most rudimentary aspect of the sport.


TD's are important, yes. I'll just leave it at that.

[Taco John]

The modern sports media atmosphere has created a seemingly infinite number of useless statistics. Of which, this is one.




Poor, poor llama... Must be tough watching the Broncos making a playoff run. Why didn't they just listen and give up when you said that they did? How dare they challenge your authority. Well, at least you can still crap on everything good that comes their way. They can't take that from you.

[youcandoit1687]

i think this record means something because first of all, it was held by dan marino, secondly, it means that jay is producing more TDs than any other rookie ever has in that amount of time. i guess this means jay is on pace to break marino's touchdown records, huh?

[Clockwork Orange]

How about the fact that the kid has a 2:1 TD to INT ratio through his first 4 starts? I'd say that's pretty meaningful considering that he's learning on the fly.

[smalltowngrll]

I guarantee you there is probably at least one statistic that no one else has done for almost anyone. Statistics are fun to play with, though. Numbers can make you believe whatever you want them to make you believe.

Don't get on my case, though...I'm not slamming Jay. Just stating the truth about our fabulous system of numbers. ;D

[clean]

I will agree that I hate the impact that fantasy football has had on typical fans.

You're right. Already, there are some fans that believe touchdowns are primarily a fantasy football statistic.

[Atwater His Ass]

The only thing so far I'd like to see Cutler improve on is his completions. The first four games are 10, 17, 21, and 12. He's hitting at 57%. I'd like to see him hit up at 60% which will bring his number of completions up and his yardage.

Really though, he's playing quite well as we all can see. I'm just nit picking at this point.

[B-Love]

There is nothing artificially inflated about Jay's TD throws so far. All were needed; none were contrived.

Seattle - mid range throw to Alexander and an INCREDIBLE cath and run by Brandon Marshall

San Diego - two to Scheffler, albeit a bit lucky on one of them. But that was a mid range ball.

Arizona - two ****ing beauties!! His waggle boot deep throw to Javon may be the throw of the year and his 2nd was a sick pump and go to Rod.

Yesterday - the throw to Scheffler was needed after two failed rushing attempts from in close. And the throw to Javon was another beauty in real bad weather.

All 8 TD's were needed at their times, and not one of them was a forced stat throw.

Real bad take llama; real bad.

[Atwater His Ass]

He could have had 3 last week as well, if Marshall would have been able to hall it in prior to M. Bell's TD run.

[ZONA]

Other then the first throw of the game, not really any bone head mistakes by Cutler. He played well this last game and starting to string a few of those together. He very easily could have had 4 TD's in that game. The long one to Marshall could have been higher softer and in the endzone and the other one to Marshall should have been thrown just behind him a little more so the defensive player couldn't reach it. In time though. I think he's going to be a great QB and I hope Shanny stays coach here for 15 more years. The kid will have amazing stats by the end of it all and hopefully a handfull of SB's also.

[iowa broncofan]

OK, I started this post intending to say, sure, Cutler broke that record he shared with Marino and Connerly, but how many people had ever heard of Connerly before Cutler tied that rookie record? My point was going to be, how special can a record be when shared by (statistically) one of the greatest QB’s ever, and some guy we’ve never heard of. Then I did a little research. Forgive me if I sound like a moron to those of you who know more about NFL history than yours truly, but bear with me… I have a point at the end.

Connerly was no slouch, and being compared to the likes of Marino and Connerly makes the statistic a little more valuable in my eyes.

[Cue the “Power and Glory” CD. Roll the grainy, black & white footage. Somebody go find Harry Kalas.]

Wearing #46, Connerly quarterbacked the New York Giants from 1948-1961. Playing alongside NFL MVP Frank Gifford, and under offensive coordinator Vince Lombardi, Connerly led the Giants to the NFL championship game in 1956, where they routed the Chicago Bears, 47-7. Perhaps Connerly might have been remembered more if not for Johnny Unitas, whose Colts knocked the Giants off in a couple of huge games, including “The Greatest Game Ever Played,” the 1958 NFL Championship game, the first to be televised by a major TV network. Connerly was the NFL MVP in 1959, when he led them to a Championship Game rematch with the Colts, which they lost. Connerly then lost the starting job in 1961 to Y. A. Tittle. (Here’s my source (http://www.sportsencyclopedia.com/nfl/nyg/nygiants.html), if you’re interested.)

So my point is (now), it might be a meaningless statistic. But it’s a meaningless statistic shared by two guys who turned out to be MVP quarterbacks. Oh yeah, I mean, formerly shared by two former MVPs. Now it’s owned by some really calm guy with a rocket arm named Jay Cutler. Heard of ‘im?

[Taco John]

OK, I started this post intending to say, sure, Cutler broke that record he shared with Marino and Connerly, but how many people had ever heard of Connerly before Cutler tied that rookie record? My point was going to be, how special can a record be when shared by (statistically) one of the greatest QB’s ever, and some guy we’ve never heard of. Then I did a little research. Forgive me if I sound like a moron to those of you who know more about NFL history than yours truly, but bear with me… I have a point at the end.

Connerly was no slouch, and being compared to the likes of Marino and Connerly makes the statistic a little more valuable in my eyes.

[Cue the “Power and Glory” CD. Roll the grainy, black & white footage. Somebody go find Harry Kalas.]

Wearing #46, Connerly quarterbacked the New York Giants from 1948-1961. Playing alongside NFL MVP Frank Gifford, and under offensive coordinator Vince Lombardi, Connerly led the Giants to the NFL championship game in 1956, where they routed the Chicago Bears, 47-7. Perhaps Connerly might have been remembered more if not for Johnny Unitas, whose Colts knocked the Giants off in a couple of huge games, including “The Greatest Game Ever Played,” the 1958 NFL Championship game, the first to be televised by a major TV network. Connerly was the NFL MVP in 1959, when he led them to a Championship Game rematch with the Colts, which they lost. Connerly then lost the starting job in 1961 to Y. A. Tittle. (Here’s my source (http://www.sportsencyclopedia.com/nfl/nyg/nygiants.html), if you’re interested.)

So my point is (now), it might be a meaningless statistic. But it’s a meaningless statistic shared by two guys who turned out to be MVP quarterbacks. Oh yeah, I mean, formerly shared by two former MVPs. Now it’s owned by some really calm guy with a rocket arm named Jay Cutler. Heard of ‘im?



This place misses you IBF. Merry Christmas old timer. :wave:

[usedupbraids]

While I disagree with you saying that this stat is useless, I will agree that I hate the impact that fantasy football has had on typical fans.

fantasy football takes the love out the game...... :ouwknow: :ouwknow: :ouwknow:

[iowa broncofan]

This place misses you IBF. Merry Christmas old timer. :wave:

Likewise, TJ. Merry Christmas. Someday, when I'm done with this PhD and have my life back, you'll see me around more. ;D

[Bronco LB 59]

How ironic that Cutler is off to same hot start Marino enjoyed. The Broncos rationale for placing Cutler in there in the first place is they compared it to the same situation surrounding the 1983 Dolphins when Marino took the reins from Dan Strock and David Woodley, both of whom had just led the Dolphins to Super Bowl XVII the year before.

[listopencil]

So my point is (now), it might be a meaningless statistic. But it’s a meaningless statistic shared by two guys who turned out to be MVP quarterbacks. Oh yeah, I mean, formerly shared by two former MVPs. Now it’s owned by some really calm guy with a rocket arm named Jay Cutler. Heard of ‘im?

Yep. Really good post. Cutler has gone way beyond what I expected out of him.

[listopencil]

How ironic that Cutler is off to same hot start Marino enjoyed. The Broncos rationale for placing Cutler in there in the first place is they compared it to the same situation surrounding the 1983 Dolphins when Marino took the reins from Dan Strock and David Woodley, both of whom had just led the Dolphins to Super Bowl XVII the year before.

Ugh. Bad comparison.

[Bronco LB 59]

Ugh. Bad comparison.

Bull****. That was Shanahan's rationale for making the move since the critics cried history was against Denver. Jake Plummer took the team to the AFC Title Game last year (kind of similar to Strock/Woodley 82) and just like the 83 Dolphins, the Broncos couldn't keep the Ferrari sitting in the garage forever.

[listopencil]

Bull****. That was Shanahan's rationale for making the move since the critics cried history was against Denver. Jake Plummer took the team to the AFC Title Game last year (kind of similar to Strock/Woodley 82) and just like the 83 Dolphins, the Broncos couldn't keep the Ferrari sitting in the garage forever.

So you'd like Cutler to advance the team to the SuperBowl this year then never get the team near it again for his entire career?

[-Slap-]

How ironic that Cutler is off to same hot start Marino enjoyed. The Broncos rationale for placing Cutler in there in the first place is they compared it to the same situation surrounding the 1983 Dolphins when Marino took the reins from Dan Strock and David Woodley, both of whom had just led the Dolphins to Super Bowl XVII the year before.

WoodStrock!

[-Slap-]

The only thing so far I'd like to see Cutler improve on is his completions. The first four games are 10, 17, 21, and 12. He's hitting at 57%. I'd like to see him hit up at 60% which will bring his number of completions up and his yardage.

Really though, he's playing quite well as we all can see. I'm just nit picking at this point.

I think 57% is pretty reasonable considering how many deep balls he's throwing. He hasn't really had a good weather game yet, either.

[B-Love]

So you'd like Cutler to advance the team to the SuperBowl this year then never get the team near it again for his entire career?

Guys should be banned from boards for posting such infantile nonsense. When message board debates go the route of a junior high playground, it's never good.

[Bronco LB 59]

So you'd like Cutler to advance the team to the SuperBowl this year then never get the team near it again for his entire career?

The Dolphins didn't go to the Super Bowl when Marino was a rookie.

[B-Love]

Marino came in alot earlier than Jay did. Marino was starting by week 6 I believe; a shootout loss to Joe Ferguson and the Bills.

Actually Marino's first start at home was a loss to the Bills, something the Dolphins had not done since the late 60's I believe. The Dolphins owned the Bills for the entire decade of the 70's, and into the early 80's.

Marino hardly played bad, as he lost the shootout 37-35 or something like that.

Marino earned the start after coming into a Thursday Night, extremely rare, nationally televised game against the Raiders at the LA Coliseum. Trailing 27-0 behind David Woodley, Shula inserted Marino who promptly let two TD drives for a 27-14 final.

Marino started a few weeks after that I think.

[listopencil]

The Dolphins didn't go to the Super Bowl when Marino was a rookie.


So you'd like Cutler to advance the team to the SuperBowl shortly then never get the team near it again for his entire career?

[-Slap-]

I like Dan.

http://img412.imageshack.us/img412/5383/picture371zx2.jpg

[listopencil]

Guys should be banned from boards for posting such infantile nonsense. When message board debates go the route of a junior high playground, it's never good.


You go, girl! You're making Serious Cat very proud.

[B-Love]

The Dolphins didn't go to the Super Bowl when Marino was a rookie.

Thanks to Dave Krieg, Curt Warner, Steve Largent and a ballhawking Seahawk secondary.

The 83 Seahawks knocked Elway and Marino out of the playoffs, but got hammered by Jim Plunkett? Ha ha.

They beat the Faid twice during the 83 season, so the odds of a 3 peat were against them for sure.

[Bronco LB 59]

So you'd like Cutler to advance the team to the SuperBowl shortly then never get the team near it again for his entire career?

I just said the Broncos used the 1983 Dolphins situation as part of the rationale for sticking Cutler into the starting lineup.

WTF does Marino's career have to do with anything here?

[watermock]

How about the fact that the kid has a 2:1 TD to INT ratio through his first 4 starts? I'd say that's pretty meaningful considering that he's learning on the fly.

That is the one stat that trumps the record Jay set Sunday. It's a nice little bit of history and a feather in his cap, but just a stocker ...he will have to pull in the Lunker to sedate this tough room.

Take this for what it's worth...Madden's hero Bret Favre Brett Favre Bret Favre will soon break the all time TD record if he choses to come back. He will also break the all time INT record. He doesn't have a 2/1 interception ratio. 412/272.

Now that I have dived in the homer pool...consider this...We got a crop of recievers/TE that came in right with him. Walker and the rooks, Scheff, and The Marshall. Hixon would be icing on the cake. This is why Shanahan is the Mastermind.

BTW, Jay has a Marino arm, but guess what...he's got legs better than Elway. John didn't even HAVE an ACL. Neither does Hines Ward which is possibly more incredible.

If we win Sunday, we will have gone as far as we have in a decade sans one trip last year to the AFCC. That would of been with a batch of youngsters on offense.

[iowa broncofan]

So you'd like Cutler to advance the team to the SuperBowl shortly then never get the team near it again for his entire career?

The implication here is so weak it defies credible response.

Um, no. Nobody wants a really talented quarterback who can't win a championship. If you recall, we almost had one of those until a few more pieces of the puzzle came together in the mid-90s.

Marino came to an aging team, if I'm not mistaken, which the 2006 Broncos are definitely not. With the exception of Lynch and Rod, the majority of our contributors are either in the infancy or prime of their careers. We will get our running back. Cutler will not be left to do all the lifting himself.

But I'll sure take a QB capable of putting up big numbers over one who isn't. Explain where you differ.

[Bronco LB 59]

Thanks to Dave Krieg, Curt Warner, Steve Largent and a ballhawking Seahawk secondary.

The 83 Seahawks knocked Elway and Marino out of the playoffs, but got hammered by Jim Plunkett? Ha ha.

They beat the Faid twice during the 83 season, so the odds of a 3 peat were against them for sure.

B-Love

How many of the wins do you credit to John Elway and how many to Steve DeBerg in contributing to that 9 win wild card team in 1983?

[Atlas]

BTW, Jay has a Marino arm, but guess what...he's got legs better than Elway. John didn't even HAVE an ACL. Neither does Hines Ward which is possibly more incredible.

If we win Sunday, we will have gone as far as we have in a decade sans one trip last year to the AFCC. That would of been with a batch of youngsters on offense.

He might have better legs than Elway but as of now he doesn't have the pocket awareness Elway had. Elway was a magician back there even in college he was tremendously hard to sack. I haven't seen this from Cutler yet.

[watermock]

Jay's pocket awareness is fine. At least he doesn't turtle like Griese or panic like Jake. Jay is a little more likely to stand in the pocket but can move.

Let's just give credit where credit is due. Win or Lose, the kid can play and we will have gotten him some pressure games. Regardless of how the end game plays out, he's not going to be skittish come next year.

You can't understimate the value of Jay getting into the fray this year IMO. What we said who wanted Jay was that as long as he played as well as Jake, it would be a good move. Jake had more INT's 10/11 ratio.

[baja]

He might have better legs than Elway but as of now he doesn't have the pocket awareness Elway had. Elway was a magician back there even in college he was tremendously hard to sack. I haven't seen this from Cutler yet.

Not sure but I think Elway was the most sacked QB ever.

[watermock]

Not sure but I think Elway was the most sacked QB ever.

I think that's true...but he's reached such Godlike status that facts like that are inconsequential.

[listopencil]

Rather than go back and quote the appropriate posts I'll clear things up before someone has a stroke:

We aren't like the 83 Dolphins. We also no longer have The Ferrari. I was being facetious about the Cutler to Marino comparison.



Carry on.

[Atlas]

Jay's pocket awareness is fine. At least he doesn't turtle like Griese or panic like Jake. Jay is a little more likely to stand in the pocket but can move.

Let's just give credit where credit is due. Win or Lose, the kid can play and we will have gotten him some pressure games. Regardless of how the end game plays out, he's not going to be skittish come next year.

You can't understimate the value of Jay getting into the fray this year IMO. What we said who wanted Jay was that as long as he played as well as Jake, it would be a good move. Jake had more INT's 10/11 ratio.

Mock I agree with you. You just compared Jay favorably to God. So I thought I would point something that God does better than Jay. He had eyes in the back of his head and felt pressure extremely well. Jay hasn't shown that yet. Of course it's still early. Jay is a stud.

[Atlas]

Not sure but I think Elway was the most sacked QB ever.

He was but that is mostly due to the fact he had a poor offensive line and he was a scambling QB. Scrambling QBs are always sacked more because they hang on to the ball longer than pocket passers. That still doesn't take away from the fact that Elway was a magician back there.

[Atlas]

Rather than go back and quote the appropriate posts I'll clear things up before someone has a stroke:

We aren't like the 83 Dolphins. We also no longer have The Ferrari. I was being facetious about the Cutler to Marino comparison.



Carry on.

We have a Ferrari. It just needed some work. BUT believe me Shanny is taking it out of the Garage right now and going to had Jay the Keys.

[listopencil]

We have a Ferrari. It just needed some work. BUT believe me Shanny is taking it out of the Garage right now and going to had Jay the Keys.

I doubt it-but I'd love to see that baby roar out of the garage again.

[-Slap-]

Not sure but I think Elway was the most sacked QB ever.

Due to his longevity and the bad lines he played behind during the middle third of his career.

Anybody who watched Elway in his prime knows his escapability and pocket sense were absolutely stunning. He could also outrun Hall of Fame defenders when necessary. The Monday Night masterpiece against Chicago in 1987 was John at his most elusive.

[-Slap-]

He was but that is mostly due to the fact he had a poor offensive line and he was a scambling QB. Scrambling QBs are always sacked more because they hang on to the ball longer than pocket passers. That still doesn't take away from the fact that Elway was a magician back there.

Randall Cunningham was sacked something like 72 times one season early in his career.

[watermock]

Due to his longevity and the bad lines he played behind during the middle third of his career.

Anybody who watched Elway in his prime knows his escapability and pocket sense were absolutely stunning. He could also outrun Hall of Fame defenders when necessary. The Monday Night masterpiece against Chicago in 1987 was John at his most elusive.

I was at that game. I turned and said..."We're going to the Super Bowl".

[-Slap-]

http://img345.imageshack.us/img345/2738/picture239pg1.jpg

http://img209.imageshack.us/img209/4615/picture355eq1.jpg

[-Slap-]

I was at that game. I turned and said..."We're going to the Super Bowl".

You seemed to be in attendance at all the most memorable games, Mock.

Do you recall we had gone to the Super Bowl against New York the previous year?

[Florida_Bronco]

http://img345.imageshack.us/img345/2738/picture239pg1.jpg

http://img209.imageshack.us/img209/4615/picture355eq1.jpg

If you really want to make your point, you should show John beating a competent defense. Ha!

[epicSocialism4tw]

How about the fact that the kid has a 2:1 TD to INT ratio through his first 4 starts? I'd say that's pretty meaningful considering that he's learning on the fly.

That's a meaningful statistic.

[watermock]

You seemed to be in attendance at all the most memorable games, Mock.

Do you recall we had gone to the Super Bowl against New York the previous year?

Sorry you are dissapointed...I was certainly at that game. 31/29

STFU. Denver fell behind 14-0 early and the Fridge was going in to seal the game...he fumbled, and someone brought it back to the 20. It was on the way other side of the field.

Denver scored 21 points in the second quarter with a last second throw to Nattiel and went off the field to the half up 21/14. Elway ran off the field right in front of me in the 12th row pumping his fist.

Third quarter Denver got shut out again, and Oakland went up 24/21. 4th quarter, we scored ten points. Odd game because each quarter was a shutout.

I don't give a crap what you think Slappy. Your such a prick it's incredle.

I was also at the Bird game on Monday night. I had great tickets and can just go to club seats my cousin has even now but I don't want the drive.

[watermock]

I don't remember if we had gone there the year before...I think that we were playing the Champions...that's what I remember, but I could be wrong. It wasn't that important. Did I say we were playing the SB Champions? I said "We are going to the SB" not "We are going to the SB for the first time in a decade".

buy a vowel.

[watermock]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Super_Bowl_champions#NFL_Championships

[Kaylore]

So you'd like Cutler to advance the team to the SuperBowl this year then never get the team near it again for his entire career?

You're totally missing the point. He never said "Jay Cutler is Dan Marino". The point he's making is a valid one in that there is a precedent for going to a big title game, then losing, then the following year replacing the QB that took you the year before and having his rookie replacement do well. Historically, making the switch the way Shanahan did has proven to be beneficial in certain circumstances. Somehow you missed that entirely and turned it into Cutler = Dan Marino.

[Kaylore]

By the way, I think actually Cutler didn't set the record for first rookie QB to throw two td's in his first four starts, but the first rookie QB to throw two td's in his first four games. A minor point, I know, but somewhat important. Marino took a few snaps here and there in a few games before he was finally named the starter in the sixth game of the year. So he played in games before he officially started and that's why Cutler set the record. Marino actually threw two in his first four starts, so Cutler needs to throw two against the Niners to be able to set the record for starts and games.

[listopencil]

You're totally missing the point. He never said "Jay Cutler is Dan Marino". The point he's making is a valid one in that there is a precedent for going to a big title game, then losing, then the following year replacing the QB that took you the year before and having his rookie replacement do well. Historically, making the switch the way Shanahan did has proven to be beneficial in certain circumstances. Somehow you missed that entirely and turned it into Cutler = Dan Marino.

Keep reading...you'll find the post...keep reading...

[Kaylore]

Keep reading...you'll find the post...keep reading...

I believe this is what you are talking about:

How ironic that Cutler is off to same hot start Marino enjoyed. The Broncos rationale for placing Cutler in there in the first place is they compared it to the same situation surrounding the 1983 Dolphins when Marino took the reins from Dan Strock and David Woodley, both of whom had just led the Dolphins to Super Bowl XVII the year before.

He's comparing situations and starts (or production). Nowhere does he say "Dan Marino is like Jay Cutler" or anything like it.

[Pendejo]

If you really want to make your point, you should show John beating a competent defense. Ha!

I know you're goofing around, but the Chiefs defense in the pictures slap posted was certainly competent. They were flat out good.

[Atlas]

I know you're goofing around, but the Chiefs defense in the pictures slap posted was certainly competent. They were flat out good.

the marty defenses were certainly good. Those Chef teams were tough.

[Kaylore]

Ok I found the real deal here:

http://www.denverbroncos.com/page.php?id=334&storyID=6413
QB JAY CUTLER (2 TDS IN 4 CONSEC. GAMES) - Can become the first player in NFL history to throw at least two touchdowns in each of his first five games with two on Sunday vs. San Francisco. Can also become one of three players in league annals and one of two rookies (Dan Marino, 1983) to throw at least two touchdowns in each of his first five starts with two on Sunday.

[Odysseus]

Ok I found the real deal here:

http://www.denverbroncos.com/page.php?id=334&storyID=6413

He might have had all this happy press without time on the bench. The kid is totally unimpressed with any of his own press at this point. He's had time to evaluate the press, team's defenses and make his mistakes on paper. He would not have done so well starting earlier. Stats can be decieving. The press loves nothing more than to create a hero and destroy one.

[OrangeShadow]

There is nothing artificially inflated about Jay's TD throws so far. All were needed; none were contrived.

Seattle - mid range throw to Alexander and an INCREDIBLE cath and run by Brandon Marshall

San Diego - two to Scheffler, albeit a bit lucky on one of them. But that was a mid range ball.

Arizona - two ****ing beauties!! His waggle boot deep throw to Javon may be the throw of the year and his 2nd was a sick pump and go to Rod.

Yesterday - the throw to Scheffler was needed after two failed rushing attempts from in close. And the throw to Javon was another beauty in real bad weather.

All 8 TD's were needed at their times, and not one of them was a forced stat throw.

Real bad take llama; real bad.

QFT ^5

[-Slap-]

Sorry you are dissapointed...I was certainly at that game. 31/29

STFU. Denver fell behind 14-0 early and the Fridge was going in to seal the game...he fumbled, and someone brought it back to the 20. It was on the way other side of the field.

Denver scored 21 points in the second quarter with a last second throw to Nattiel and went off the field to the half up 21/14. Elway ran off the field right in front of me in the 12th row pumping his fist.

Third quarter Denver got shut out again, and Oakland went up 24/21. 4th quarter, we scored ten points. Odd game because each quarter was a shutout.

I don't give a crap what you think Slappy. Your such a prick it's incredle.

I was also at the Bird game on Monday night. I had great tickets and can just go to club seats my cousin has even now but I don't want the drive.

Uh huh.

Its just kind of amazing how you always managed to wind up in attendance at the most memorable games in club history.

[Archie]

OK, I started this post intending to say, sure, Cutler broke that record he shared with Marino and Connerly, but how many people had ever heard of Connerly before Cutler tied that rookie record? My point was going to be, how special can a record be when shared by (statistically) one of the greatest QB’s ever, and some guy we’ve never heard of. Then I did a little research. Forgive me if I sound like a moron to those of you who know more about NFL history than yours truly, but bear with me… I have a point at the end.

Connerly was no slouch, and being compared to the likes of Marino and Connerly makes the statistic a little more valuable in my eyes.

[Cue the “Power and Glory” CD. Roll the grainy, black & white footage. Somebody go find Harry Kalas.]

Wearing #46, Connerly quarterbacked the New York Giants from 1948-1961. Playing alongside NFL MVP Frank Gifford, and under offensive coordinator Vince Lombardi, Connerly led the Giants to the NFL championship game in 1956, where they routed the Chicago Bears, 47-7. Perhaps Connerly might have been remembered more if not for Johnny Unitas, whose Colts knocked the Giants off in a couple of huge games, including “The Greatest Game Ever Played,” the 1958 NFL Championship game, the first to be televised by a major TV network. Connerly was the NFL MVP in 1959, when he led them to a Championship Game rematch with the Colts, which they lost. Connerly then lost the starting job in 1961 to Y. A. Tittle. (Here’s my source (http://www.sportsencyclopedia.com/nfl/nyg/nygiants.html), if you’re interested.)

So my point is (now), it might be a meaningless statistic. But it’s a meaningless statistic shared by two guys who turned out to be MVP quarterbacks. Oh yeah, I mean, formerly shared by two former MVPs. Now it’s owned by some really calm guy with a rocket arm named Jay Cutler. Heard of ‘im?

Rep... awesome post.

[-Slap-]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Super_Bowl_champions#NFL_Championships

Say, that's handy. Too bad you didn't bust that out before you started telling stories.

;)

[epicSocialism4tw]

There is nothing artificially inflated about Jay's TD throws so far. All were needed; none were contrived.
Seattle - mid range throw to Alexander and an INCREDIBLE cath and run by Brandon Marshall
San Diego - two to Scheffler, albeit a bit lucky on one of them. But that was a mid range ball.
Arizona - two ****ing beauties!! His waggle boot deep throw to Javon may be the throw of the year and his 2nd was a sick pump and go to Rod.
Yesterday - the throw to Scheffler was needed after two failed rushing attempts from in close. And the throw to Javon was another beauty in real bad weather.
All 8 TD's were needed at their times, and not one of them was a forced stat throw.
Real bad take llama; real bad.

No one said that the TD's were superfluous.

[B-Love]

Uh huh.

Its just kind of amazing how you always managed to wind up in attendance at the most memorable games in club history.

I've always thought the same thing. What a chump.

[-Slap-]

I've been to about 15 Bronco games and only one was really memorable. Even then it wasn't a classic game, just lots of fun because we destroyed the Raiders 31-10 on Monday Night.

[orangenblue2]

The modern sports media atmosphere has created a seemingly infinite number of useless statistics.

I'm in agreement with Slap. Since when did throwing touchdowns become a "useless statistic"??? You can really think 'em up Llama...

[Mile High Shack]

I've been to about 15 Bronco games and only one was really memorable. Even then it wasn't a classic game, just lots of fun because we destroyed the Raiders 31-10 on Monday Night.

shoot, I can't even say that

I've only been to 4 games and only 1 of them was "memorable", in 1997, KC vs. Denver, Grbac's 1st year with the Chiefs

the only time I saw Elway, so it is very memorable to me, we won 13-6? I want to say, I know I just said it was memorable, but, I know we won and held them out of the endzone.

The throw John threw to Rod Smith for 80 yards was amazing, TD ran it in later and gave the crowd the salute...amazing

[PLOWHORSE]

Spare me the ridiculous doubletalk. I want a quarterback who can put the football in the end zone. If you think "yards, touches(?) and completions" are more important than putting points on the board, you don't understand the most rudimentary aspect of the sport.

http://img346.imageshack.us/img346/4958/c0032916vc0.jpg

So what play do you run in this instance?...4th and 2 on the 2 yd line.....Blast Cutler up the middle, or that slasher play to Scheffler running by the LBs?

[-Slap-]

So what play do you run in this instance?...4th and 2 on the 2 yd line.....Blast Cutler up the middle, or that slasher play to Scheffler running by the LBs?

I think you do anything but kick a field goal here and they fire you regardless of the outcome of the play.

[BroncoInSkinland]

I'm in agreement with Slap. Since when did throwing touchdowns become a "useless statistic"??? You can really think 'em up Llama...

I am fairly certain he was saying that the consecutive number of first games (or starts) in which a QB throws 2 or more touchdowns is a useless statistic, not the touchdowns themselves. I am putting half of whats being posted these days on hold because it is all merely trampling fellow fans to throw roses at Cutlers feet. Llama even said Jay looks good (understatement IMHO he looks great). I am not sure what else you guys want at this point. Hold on, I mentioned the saviors name without the proper deference. Let me bow down, grovel, say 40 "Hail Elway's", and flagellate myself before continuing. I will return when my fingers are worthy of typing His name. ::)

[epicSocialism4tw]

I am fairly certain he was saying that the consecutive number of first games (or starts) in which a QB throws 2 or more touchdowns is a useless statistic, not the touchdowns themselves. I am putting half of whats being posted these days on hold because it is all merely trampling fellow fans to throw roses at Cutlers feet. Llama even said Jay looks good (understatement IMHO he looks great). I am not sure what else you guys want at this point. Hold on, I mentioned the saviors name without the proper deference. Let me bow down, grovel, say 40 "Hail Elway's", and flagellate myself before continuing. I will return when my fingers are worthy of typing His name. ::)


I believe that I said that Cutler looks "pretty darn good", which is high praise from me. I guess that you are the only guy that read that part! ;D

You are right about my view of the statistic. I think that you are the only person to have put the pieces together.

[Malcontent]

I think you do anything but kick a field goal here and they fire you regardless of the outcome of the play.

I'm sure he's just fishin Slap!

[-Slap-]

I'm sure he's just fishin Slap!

Don't be so sure. Marvin Lewis came out after the game Sunday and swore he was considering going for two points and the victory.

ROFL!

Regarding BroncoInSkinland and AngryVYGroupie, nobody is asking you to say anything. Its fairly obvious this thread is about celebrating the achievements of our fantastic rookie quarterback.

The Chiefs fans are all too dispirited by their team's annual collapse to troll this thread, so feel free to piss in the punchbowl in their stead.

[epicSocialism4tw]

Don't be so sure. Marvin Lewis came out after the game Sunday and swore he was considering going for two points and the victory.
Regarding BroncoInSkinland and AngryVYGroupie, nobody is asking you to say anything. Its fairly obvious this thread is about celebrating the achievements of our fantastic rookie quarterback.
The Chiefs fans are all too dispirited by their team's annual collapse to troll this thread, so feel free to piss in the punchbowl in their stead.


So having criticism about statistics and what their value is has now become "peeing in the punchbowl"?

You sure must like the taste of urine because you seem to fool yourself into drinking it quite often.

That was some nasty punch you were drinking anyway. If I had peed in it, it couldnt have made it any worse.

[-Slap-]

Nobody drank it, though, gayboy. Your pathetic urophagia has gone unrequited. Ask your psychiatrist about this latest problem after he gets done analyzing your Dirk fetish.

[Taco John]

So having criticism about statistics and what their value is has now become "peeing in the punchbowl"?


It's not about their fantasy football value. It's about their historical value. You can downplay it all you like, but in the end, the accomplishment is something that Broncos fans can and SHOULD be proud of, even if they were proven wrong by this kid and are still pouting that Plummer got benched.

There's nothing wrong with celebrating the fact that our QBOTP&F has come out like a bat out of hell.

[SureShot]

It's not about their fantasy football value. It's about their historical value. You can downplay it all you like, but in the end, the accomplishment is something that Broncos fans can and SHOULD be proud of, even if they were proven wrong by this kid and are still pouting that Plummer got benched.

There's nothing wrong with celebrating the fact that our QBOTP&F has come out like a bat out of hell.

QFT

[epicSocialism4tw]

It's not about their fantasy football value. It's about their historical value. You can downplay it all you like, but in the end, the accomplishment is something that Broncos fans can and SHOULD be proud of, even if they were proven wrong by this kid and are still pouting that Plummer got benched.

That's great that Bronco fans can be excited. Everyone here has been excited about Cutler since the draft. I just cant find it in myself to start comparing this kid to the greats when he's played a handful of games. We're basically looking at mediocre play bookended by extremes. One of which was an absolute disaster, and one of which was excellent for a rook.

I will never be convinced that the "this rook scored at least two TD's in a game for his first X starts" is one that reveals anything significant about the player. The significant statistics will be the same for him as they are for every QB, and they arent that glamorous: 3rd down conversions, completion %, efficiency, fourth quarter efficiency, TD/INT ratio, pass yards, etc.

The statistic listed does nothing for me. Sorry. :oyvey:

There's nothing wrong with celebrating the fact that our QBOTP&F has come out like a bat out of hell.

There is nothing wrong with celebrating Bronco successes. I agree. If we celebrate something that isnt grounded in reality, does that make us insane?

[epicSocialism4tw]

Nobody drank it, though, gayboy. Your pathetic urophagia has gone unrequited. Ask your psychiatrist about this latest problem after he gets done analyzing your Dirk fetish.

:slapsilly

[BroncoInSkinland]

Don't be so sure. Marvin Lewis came out after the game Sunday and swore he was considering going for two points and the victory.

ROFL!

Regarding BroncoInSkinland and AngryVYGroupie, nobody is asking you to say anything. Its fairly obvious this thread is about celebrating the achievements of our fantastic rookie quarterback.

The Chiefs fans are all too dispirited by their team's annual collapse to troll this thread, so feel free to piss in the punchbowl in their stead.

Pardon me oh mighty slap, I wasn't aware the Cutler police had achieved this level of control so quickly. I will make sure to PM you in the future to make sure my praise of Jay is worthy. If it is not up to your standards I expect the secret police will be along shortly to break my fingers and prevent further posts.

On a less sarcastic note I AM celebrating the achievements of our rookie quarterback. In case you haven't noticed I am firmly in the Cutler bandwagon and have been since the first SD game. I was merely pointing out the discrepancy between arguing about a trivial bit of football knowledge and the devastatingly increased output of our new offense. I don't even particularly agree with LLama's point, I think that the statistic is interesting from a bookkeeping point of view. I just felt he was being misrepresented.

If you are so upset about a couple of posts on a message board that you want to jump down other fans throats, then maybe YOU are the one who isn't really seeing the potential, both now and in the future of our incredible new QB. Tell ya what, think back over the last couple of games and tell me ANY such stat truely matters in your assessment of Jay Cutlers current impact AND his future potential.

If you are still so wrapped up in the stats that you think this is a creditable slap (no pun intended) at Jay Cutlers talent I will apologize immediately though I still won't agree with your point of view. Personally I don't think Jay needs any invented firsts to raise public perceptions of his abilities. He IS as good as many thought and it is patently obvious even without adding contrived statistics to pad his performances.

P.S. forgive me in the future if I don't wait for you to ASK for me to say something. I am capable of determining on my own when I have something I want to say.

[-Slap-]

Say whatever you want, in as prissy a manner as you please. Feel free to defend angryllama's impugned honor as well. I find him endlessly diverting and I'm sure I'll quickly view your stilted contributions in the same vein.

Cheers.

[Paladin]

Damm! Civilized catfights!!!!!

[BroncoInSkinland]

Prissy and stilted? After reading some of your previous overly verbose posts and reflecting on their tangential nature I'd just like to say pot meet kettle. But if you want to cut the crap I can lose a bit of the prose.

You look for a fight almost every time you post and then have the balls to act suprised when it smacks you upside the head. Show me where Llama said throwing touchdowns was useless. Better yet show me where I "pissed in the punchbowl". You wanted to jerk off Jay and got called on it.

I normally like your takes, but I am really starting to hate the way you put them out there. Go ahead and give me another dismissive bull**** response, I think I will let that one go as the fight really isn't worth it. In the meantime I am sure I will be able to separate the good football takes from the bitter, dissatisfied person making them.

Cheers to you.

[-Slap-]

I could care less what you like or dislike about me. I don't care that you and your boy Llama are so unsophisticated about the sport you feel the need to act bored and jaded about Cutler's accomplishments.

"Jerk off to Jay."

What a big man you are. I'm so ****ing sorry I had the nerve to act like a fan on a fan message board. Way to "call me on it." You sure are too hip for the room there, stud.

I should have realized Cutler's rapid progression is a mundane occurrence, given VY and Leinart's early successes. Rookie quarterbacks set NFL records every year, don't they?

[Blueflame]

It's not about their fantasy football value. It's about their historical value. You can downplay it all you like, but in the end, the accomplishment is something that Broncos fans can and SHOULD be proud of, even if they were proven wrong by this kid and are still pouting that Plummer got benched.

There's nothing wrong with celebrating the fact that our QBOTP&F has come out like a bat out of hell.

Taking Plummer's total numbers and dividing by 11 (games started) gives us the average numbers:

16/29 for 181 yds; 1 td, 1 int and a passer rating of 70.5

Doing the same for Cutler (totals for 4 games, divide by 4) yields the following average numbers:

15/26 for 193 yds; 2 tds, 1 int and a passer rating of 89.8.

Looks pretty clear-cut to me that the rookie does, in fact, give the team a better chance of winning now... as well as in the future... than the veteran.

[B-Love]

If anyone has missed the fact that the Intermediate middle of the field is open to us again, with Jay in there, then they are a fool.

Jay has brought back the Intermediate throws that were such a huge part of 97/98.

God bless Jay. We're not winning a Super Bowl this year, but that's not what it's all about this year. I will watch our playoff game(s), assuming we make it, with such excitement, knowing Jay is getting some critical field time and experience.

I am SO GLAD, we did not go into Camp '07, knowing Jay was our guy, but not having gotten him any experience to date.

[BroncoInferno]

Say whatever you want, in as prissy a manner as you please. Feel free to defend angryllama's impugned honor as well. I find him endlessly diverting and I'm sure I'll quickly view your stilted contributions in the same vein.

Cheers.

Hilarious!

[Killericon]

I could care less what you like or dislike about me. I don't care that you and your boy Llama are so unsophisticated about the sport you feel the need to act bored and jaded about Cutler's accomplishments.

"Jerk off to Jay."

What a big man you are. I'm so ****ing sorry I had the nerve to act like a fan on a fan message board. Way to "call me on it." You sure are too hip for the room there, stud.

I should have realized Cutler's rapid progression is a mundane occurrence, given VY and Leinart's early successes. Rookie quarterbacks set NFL records every year, don't they?

While Jay's been more than I'd ever could've hoped for, and his rookie-record smashing is awesome, I can see his point(Or what I think his point is). Literally every game I have watched this season has featured one of the two teams on a list of all-time teams doing some obscure set of tasks or another. While Jay's record breaking/setting is truly indicative of his talents and success out of the gate, I feel nothing towards it after being desensitized to it all by all these other "Records". I mean...I really don't even care about L.T.2's record-setting season it's gotten so bad.

[Taco John]

I can't believe that our rookie quarterback would come out of the gates with a record breaking series, and we have to literally argue on whether or not it's worth noting and enjoying. Best of all, it's coming from the "why don't you just shut up and enjoy the wins that Jake is delivering us" folks.

Talk about being a stick in the mud.

[Kaylore]

While Jay's been more than I'd ever could've hoped for, and his rookie-record smashing is awesome, I can see his point(Or what I think his point is).

He had one? All I took from it was that some posters on here don't care because they don't believe in enjoying sports or getting excited about young players on general principle. I don't know why they bother to even follow sports if it is such a dark pit of disappointment and woe and they poo-poo anyone trying commend the accomplishments of other players.

What Jay has done hasn't been done before and that's impressive. If someone would like to celebrate that, then great. I don't see what purpose it serves to come into the thread and piss all over it with posts telling everyone it doesn't matter and it's worthless. If it's so worthless to them, then ignore the post.

[Circle Orange]

Damm! Civilized catfights!!!!!

If you guys mudwrestle and argue naked, send me the pic...I wanna make an avatar. :wiggle:

[-Slap-]

If you guys mudwrestle and argue naked, send me the pic...I wanna make an avatar. :wiggle:

I did some nude posting early in my career to pay the bills. I'm not proud of it, but an artist has to make some sacrifices for their craft.

[BroncoInferno]

If you guys mudwrestle and argue naked, send me the pic...I wanna make an avatar. :wiggle:

Hey, you have not started a Redskins thread in a couple of days. Are you sick or something?