View Full Version : cringe-inducing offensive ineptitude
does anyone know why shanahan and kubiak started dumbing down this offense midway through last season, when Plummer was supposedly having the best year of his career? Plummer's deficiencies were well known during his first 2 years here, yet shanahan didn't seem to actually start removing whole sections of the playbook from the gameplan until midway through last season. is there some watershed moment from last season that i'm not remembering? because this dumbing down of the offense is not something that started only after Cutler was drafted. go back and watch the games from the 2nd half of last season, and you'll see that the play calling had become pretty vanilla and uninspiring already.
was it to preserve Plummer's confidence during his streak of throws without an INT? or did they suddenly realize that last year's team was a legit SB contender and therefore, they could no longer allow Plummer to be careless with the football? or some other reason?
ludo21
10-18-2006, 10:01 PM
No idea.
But, they need to open it up a little more.
Paladin
10-18-2006, 10:07 PM
Another sleep-inducing tirade regarding the O and the lack of execution therof, and which further leads to the eleventy millionth cry from the deep dark corners of the mind of one newbie who has not paid attention to the eleventy million posts that say the nearly the same, substantially the same or exactly the same mind-numbing mantras of the forgoing and long-suffering membership that currently comes from the apparent thread-reading challenged newbie.
I shall abandon this thread. I hope you all have a great eleventy millionth and one time heron with respect to the herein oft repeated subject.
Bronco Bob
10-18-2006, 10:09 PM
No idea.
But, they need to open it up a little more.
Even at the expense of losing games?
Would you rather Plummer/Cutler throw for 300 yards in
a game and the Broncos lose 14/21 because three picks
got returned for TDs or the Bronco win 10 - 3 because
there were no picks and the ball only went 100 yards.
Florida_Bronco
10-18-2006, 10:11 PM
Another sleep-inducing tirade regarding the O and the lack of execution therof, and which further leads to the eleventy millionth cry from the deep dark corners of the mind of one newbie who has not paid attention to the eleventy million posts that say the nearly the same, substantially the same or exactly the same mind-numbing mantras of the forgoing and long-suffering membership that currently comes from the apparent thread-reading challenged newbie.
I shall abandon this thread. I hope you all have a great eleventy millionth and one time heron with respect to the herein oft repeated subject.
:rofl: :giggle: :thumbs: :thanku:
at this point, i'd be ecstatic to see just ONE shovel pass from the shotgun on 2nd down against a defense not ready for it... it'd be something to remind me of the good old days when the Broncos offense not only had the talent to move the ball at will, but also the creative coaching and offensive scheming that had come to embody Denver Broncos football.
i do think the loss of Mike Anderson is having a bigger effect than anticipated. i like Tatum Bell, but we're 5 games into the season and i haven't any RB bust off a long run. last year, it seemed like we got one of those every week.
Another sleep-inducing tirade regarding the O and the lack of execution therof, and which further leads to the eleventy millionth cry from the deep dark corners of the mind of one newbie who has not paid attention to the eleventy million posts that say the nearly the same, substantially the same or exactly the same mind-numbing mantras of the forgoing and long-suffering membership that currently comes from the apparent thread-reading challenged newbie.
I shall abandon this thread. I hope you all have a great eleventy millionth and one time heron with respect to the herein oft repeated subject.
smug much?
funny how the strawman is pulled out by the usual crowd on every thread with even a hint of blasphemy against the Temple of Plummer.
i'll use small words so that Paladin can understand. this.. is... not... a.. plummer... vs... cutler... thread...
cutler is not ready to start. period. it's plummer for the whole season barring injury. no reason to even debate that point (except for fun). what i want to know is why did the dumbing down of the offense start LAST YEAR during Jake's supposed breakthrough season. this year is a continuation of that. something happened around the mid point of last season that caused a shift to a much more conservative offensive mindset. maybe it didn't have anything to do with plummer at all... who knows... i don't. but somebody here on OM probably does and i'm curious.
and besides, that's the point of a forum about the Broncos... to discuss the Broncos. some smug posters seem to have forgotten this simple fact.
DenverBrit
10-18-2006, 10:28 PM
I miss the Lelie threads.
isn't lelie disgruntled in atlanta too? i'm sure there are threads about him on the falcons sites. deju vu all over again.
Lev Vyvanse
10-18-2006, 10:43 PM
at this point, i'd be ecstatic to see just ONE shovel pass from the shotgun on 2nd down against a defense not ready for it...
Hey slow down there Dan.
Tredici
10-18-2006, 10:48 PM
Even at the expense of losing games?
Would you rather Plummer/Cutler throw for 300 yards in
a game and the Broncos lose 14/21 because three picks
got returned for TDs or the Bronco win 10 - 3 because
there were no picks and the ball only went 100 yards.
That's funny. Considering we've seen Cutler throw one interception during preseason but we've seen Jake heave 21 of them during games that count.
Hard to have a pass go for a touchdown the other way when all the passes in the game plan are of 2 to 5 yards. Hey! Maybe thats why the ball only goes for 100 yards and no picks! Probably not because the Coaches are worried about the guy on the bench throwing anything.
azbroncfan
10-18-2006, 10:48 PM
My honest opinion is that even if Lelie stayed, plummer doesn't read D's good enough past his 1st or 2nd read to make the 3 wr set of lelie, smith, walker super effective. Plummer is good within the system when the read the play was designed for is open, but when its not look out this is when he struggles. You hardly ever see plummer look left, look right , back left TD. This is what Elite QB's are able to do such as Manning Brady etc. The way the O is being run now might as well throw Cutler in there. He move the ball in all the Preseason games.
Bronco Bob
10-18-2006, 10:57 PM
That's funny. Considering we've seen Cutler throw one interception during preseason but we've seen Jake heave 21 of them during games that count.
If we are basing Jake vs Cutler on pre-season performance, Jake had
zero interceptions in the pre-season. Extrapolating that, does
that mean Cutler would have 42 ints in games that count?
Hey slow down there Dan.
:P ...29 years rooting for the Broncos and that's the one image burned into my brain. Elway using his leg to give the snap count from the shotgun and then a quick shovel pass.
anything to break up the monotony of:
- 3 yard run by Tatum Bell to the left on 1st down.
- incomplete pass to Rod Smith on 2nd down.
- incomplete pass to the TE on 3rd down.
- punt.
as an aside, maybe it's time for shanahan to stop scripting the plays on the opening drive. they don't seem to be fooling the defense anymore. perhaps there's too much film on shanahan offenses now and defenses are no longer suprised by any wrinkles shanahan introduces into the gameplan from week to week.
My honest opinion is that even if Lelie stayed, plummer doesn't read D's good enough past his 1st or 2nd read to make the 3 wr set of lelie, smith, walker super effective. Plummer is good within the system when the read the play was designed for is open, but when its not look out this is when he struggles. You hardly ever see plummer look left, look right , back left TD. This is what Elite QB's are able to do such as Manning Brady etc. The way the O is being run now might as well throw Cutler in there. He move the ball in all the Preseason games.
is this because of poor line play (no time) or do you think the QB is to blame?
Taco John
10-18-2006, 11:43 PM
is this because of poor line play (no time) or do you think the QB is to blame?
It wasn't something that happened in the middle of the season. It started in San Diego... Maybe even Miami, but who can say for sure as bad as the entire team was that day.
The reason it happened was because the year previous, Shanahan started to open up the playbook towards the middle of the 2004 season, at which point Plummer started to take a serious nose-dive and went on an interception throwing spree that cost us the division championship. He ended up leading the league in interceptions. Turnovers are something that Shanahan doesn't tolerate so well, because his offense is geared towards ball control.
This isn't something that suddenly happened in the middle of the season. It was the offseason plan that was drilled into him all summer.
Circle Orange
10-19-2006, 04:54 AM
Another sleep-inducing tirade regarding the O and the lack of execution therof, and which further leads to the eleventy millionth cry from the deep dark corners of the mind of one newbie who has not paid attention to the eleventy million posts that say the nearly the same, substantially the same or exactly the same mind-numbing mantras of the forgoing and long-suffering membership that currently comes from the apparent thread-reading challenged newbie.
I shall abandon this thread. I hope you all have a great eleventy millionth and one time heron with respect to the herein oft repeated subject.
What are you trying to say? :mullet1:
55CrushEm
10-19-2006, 06:32 AM
funny how the strawman is pulled out by the usual crowd on every thread with even a hint of blasphemy against the Temple of Plummer.
i'll use small words so that Paladin can understand. this.. is... not... a.. plummer... vs... cutler... thread...
:rofl: Nice.....
Dedhed
10-19-2006, 08:08 AM
I think its a simple matter of the defense getting continually better. Shanahan is a pretty smart guy, and I think he realizes that the fewer opportunities he gives Jake to make mistakes, the better. With this years D he's not going to give him many chances at all.
missingnumber7
10-19-2006, 09:17 AM
We are 6 weeks into the season...save some stuff for later guys...duh.
Bronx33
10-19-2006, 09:36 AM
Iam just hoping i don't have to cringe too much come this sunday.
Paladin
10-19-2006, 11:29 AM
What are you trying to say? :mullet1:
LOL!!!!
I do believe that the anemic performance of the O has been stomped into the dust by the jackboots of those with excessive needs to gripe, and those who want to pose the dire circumstanaces for shock and/or "me, too" value. Hence the chattering verbosity of nabobs of smuggish unsold buyers of the current events, none of whom will ever be "sold" on the value of any play, player or record or sincerity. The faults of the O play have been ground into ant-sized bites by the grinder of emotionally-driven drivel that simply clogs the brain synapses with mind-boggling statistical trivia and cheesy nostalgia of days and players gone by, and nostalgia and yearnings for players yet to come who will eventually prove that what ails the francise is the lack of attention to "those who know" delivered passionatly with out regard to published comments by those who know....
There are other avenues available for expressing unconditional support for the local francise which does not entail the requirement of belief that every twitch of a players' arse portends pending doom or even slight discomfort. It would behoove many hereon to simply allow players to play, coaches to coach and the administrators to administrate. It seems inconceivable that those paid minions do not have any (none, zero, zilch, nada, nein, nyet or clueless) cognitiions of what is going on with the O and/or the D of the aforementioned local francise. But then, I am not sold on the idea that "they" are doing anything to correct what the untold millions on this planet "KNOW" instinctively and completely are the specific points that require immediate and critical redress.
But what do I know? You speaka too fasta for me.............
;D
jonny1
10-19-2006, 02:17 PM
Wow, the return of Spiro Agnew! LOL LOL
SprintRightOption
10-19-2006, 02:49 PM
Who am I?
John Galt is the Prime Mover. He turns the motor of the world. He came up with an engine so remarkable that it actually runs on static electricity.
That kind of machine is what scientists refer to as a Perpetual Motion Machine. But that doesn't get in the way of Russian Objectivist Libertarian chicks very often in their philosophical writings.
John Galt doesn't like Socialism. Smart guy. And what happens when the Prime Mover, the Atlas holding the immense weight of the world on his shoulders must endure the bull**** mind drain of Socialism? He shrugs.
Or in John Galt's case, he takes his ball and goes home to someplace in the Rocky Mountains with a giant reflective mirror that hides it from the air. And eventually he goes on to bang some Railroad tramp named Dagny Taggert and make her be his maid, then gets tortured on television by Socialists, watches them all collapse, and returns to the world.
John Galt is a bad ass. He smokes cigarettes with a dollar sign on them, and believes in the Gold Standard. Do not **** with John Galt!
BroncoSoja
10-19-2006, 05:53 PM
does anyone know why shanahan and kubiak started dumbing down this offense midway through last season, when Plummer was supposedly having the best year of his career? Plummer's deficiencies were well known during his first 2 years here, yet shanahan didn't seem to actually start removing whole sections of the playbook from the gameplan until midway through last season. is there some watershed moment from last season that i'm not remembering? because this dumbing down of the offense is not something that started only after Cutler was drafted. go back and watch the games from the 2nd half of last season, and you'll see that the play calling had become pretty vanilla and uninspiring already.
was it to preserve Plummer's confidence during his streak of throws without an INT? or did they suddenly realize that last year's team was a legit SB contender and therefore, they could no longer allow Plummer to be careless with the football? or some other reason?
Take a look at Plunkets stats prior to Nov 13 last season and then after... Don't know if that game or the one before had any lasting effect on him in some way.. All I do know is that Plummer didn't have a 'career' season as some like to spew, he had a 'career' half of a season. The other half was below average, at best.
watermock
10-19-2006, 06:35 PM
Here's to the Army.
And here's to the Corps;
Here's to the Flag flying up on the hill.
And the bird flying over our door;
Stand by with your glasses all brimming,
Here's health, and here's how, and here's luck.
And here's to the Casles of Silver we wear,
And 'the Eagle that looks like a Duck'.
I propose a toast to the Engineer Corps.
I'm feasting on turkey bologna and old grapes when I have braut in waiting...no matter.
Oh well, Kitty cat loves grapes...oh wait...those are cans of friskies.