Why Waste a #2 Pick on Reggie Bush When Devin Hester is Available?

[epicSocialism4tw]

No one will ask this question in the media, and you will not see Hester's dramatic game winning return replayed over and over on commercial advertisements for Sportscenter. This was the second TD return for this kid.

Reggie Bush is a glorified punt returner. Devin Hester is the best punt returner in the NFL right now at 13.6 yds/return. Hester has 2 TD's, one of them won a game on MNF.

[ludo21]

Bush is on pace to catch 100 balls for them. And he will only get better running the football this season.

What has Hester done for his D?

[BroncoInferno]

That's all Hester does, though, return kicks. I think 5 games is a little too early to say which rookies will be most valuale long term.

[BroncoFiend]

No one will ask this question in the media, and you will not see Hester's dramatic game winning return replayed over and over on commercial advertisements for Sportscenter. This was the second TD return for this kid.

Reggie Bush is a glorified punt returner. Devin Hester is the best punt returner in the NFL right now at 13.6 yds/return. Hester has 2 TD's, one of them won a game on MNF.

Isn't Bush leading the league in receptions?

[epicSocialism4tw]

Bush is 13th among all NFL RB's at 7.5 yards/catch. The NFL's top receiving RB's average 11.9 and 9.6 yd/catch.

Bush is a Brian Westbrook starter kit.

[-Slap-]

Reggie Bush won the Heisman he was supposed to win.

http://espn-ak.starwave.com/photo/2006/1017/ncf_u_peterson_275.jpg

[BroncoInferno]

Bush is 13th among all NFL RB's at 7.5 yards/catch. The NFL's top receiving RB's average 11.9 and 9.6 yd/catch.

Bush is a Brian Westbrook starter kit.

We're talking about 5 games, llama. Are you really going to draw conclusions from that? Besides, being a Brian Westbrook type is far from an insult.

[epicSocialism4tw]

We're talking about 5 games, llama. Are you really going to draw conclusions from that? Besides, being a Brian Westbrook type is far from an insult.

Brian Westbrook is a role player. He's not a #2 pick.

[BroncoFiend]

Considering McCallister is on the team as well right now it's hard to look at what Bush has done and question his #2 pick status.

If anything I see Reggie Bush as a Marshall Faulk type not a Westbrook type. In my opinion, that is worth a #2 pick, especially to a team like the Saints.

[epicSocialism4tw]

I dont see how anyone can come to the conclusion that Reggie Bush will provide anything that merits the #2 pick in the draft.

Bush is averaging 3.0 yds/carry. That's good for 24th in the NFC and places him behind fellow rookies:
Jerious Norwood - 7.5
Maurice Jones-Drew - 5.2
DeAngelo Williams - 5.1
Joseph Addai - 4.6
Laurence Maroney - 4.3
Mike Bell - 4.1
Vernand Morency - 3.3

That places him 8th in ypc for rookies alone.

[BroncoInferno]

I dont see how anyone can come to the conclusion that Reggie Bush will provide anything that merits the #2 pick in the draft.

I don't see how anyone can come to that conclusion after 5 games.

[epicSocialism4tw]

I don't see how any can come to that conclusion after 5 games.

He is what he is.

He's not an every down player.

He's a receiver out of the backfield.

He's a punt returner.

He's not a between-the-tackles player.

He's a pitch-out, dump off RB.

RB is the easiest position to diagnose after a player's initial showing in the NFL. Your tendancies are instinctive and you memorize the least complicated parts of the offense.

Im not saying that he will not be a player that contributes. What Im saying here is that 1) he has not lived up to the hype, and 2) he will not live up to the hype. He is much more Eric Metcalf than Barry Sanders.

[Smiling Assassin27]

I dont see how anyone can come to the conclusion that Reggie Bush will provide anything that merits the #2 pick in the draft.

Bush is averaging 3.0 yds/carry. That's good for 24th in the NFC and places him behind fellow rookies:
Jerious Norwood - 7.5
Maurice Jones-Drew - 5.2
Joseph Addai - 4.6
Laurence Maroney - 4.3
Mike Bell - 4.1
Vernand Morency - 3.3

That places him 7th in ypc for rookies alone.

he's on pace to have over 100 catches...he already has merited the #2 pick in the draft. going by yards per carry is a foolish measuring stick for this guy since he is more versatile than anyone you've listed here.

[BroncoInferno]

Well, you've convinced me. Angryllama says after five games Bush is role player, I guess it must be so. He might as well retire now.

[epicSocialism4tw]

he's on pace to have over 100 catches...he already has merited the #2 pick in the draft. going by yards per carry is a foolish measuring stick for this guy since he is more versatile than anyone you've listed here.


They are throwing alot of balls to him, but he's not doing alot with them. 7.5 yds/catch and 0TD's through 5 games is not anything to be overly proud of.

[BroncoInferno]

They are throwing alot of balls to him, but he's not doing alot with them. 7.5 yds/catch and 0TD's through 5 games is not anything to be overly proud of.

7.5 yards results in three first downs for every four touches. It might not be mind blowing, but it's effective (not to mention presumptious of you to assume that that average won't ever improve).

[epicSocialism4tw]

7.5 yd/catch would not put him in the NFL's top 85 players.

[epicSocialism4tw]

7.5 yards results in three first downs for every four touches. It might not be mind blowing, but it's effective (not to mention presumptious of you to assume that that average won't ever improve).

We arent talking about potential, which ESPiN has sold you on. We are talking about reality.

[TheReverend]

Considering this has become the Reggie Bush fight thread Ill copy my post from the other thread to here... llama is right, Reggie makes his money on endorsements and hype, NOT as an incredible football player... because he isnt.

"Actually Id have to say THAT is as ignorant as they come. This is supposed to be a game changing player, who by the way is playing the easiest position for rookies to jump right into, averaging 3 ypc... and you CANT blame that on the offensive line considering Deuce is popping 5 a carry. Yes he has caught some balls against LB match-ups... at this rate he might end up a worse version of Brian Westbrook.

If he's such a threat to score everytime he touches the ball then why, out of 118 touches, has he only scored once (on an UNTOUCHED punt return right up the sideline, mind you)?! Find the average scores of players with 118 touches and youll see that Reggie is FAR below average.

Im no Mario Williams advocate either, given time this whole situation will work out and then we'll know. Until then, Reggie's gonna have to learn he's not so flashy now that he plays with the big boys."

[BKK]

Oh No, not another X factor.

[epicSocialism4tw]

Oh No, not another X factor.

We have a winner!

[TexanBob]

Even last December, I pegged Bush as Eric Metcalf 2.0.

Left in my mind is the Monday Nighter against the Falcons when the Saints had the ball at the Atlanta one-yard-line and decided to give Reggie his long-awaited first touchdown. He took two handoffs and got nowhere. He is simply not ever going to be a between-the-tackles running back.

Props, at least, to the Saints for realizing what Reggie is and asking him to do what he does best which is to dance and try to outrun individuals at the perimeter. I think Peyton realized in the Falcons game that Bush is going to be a PR machine and a buzz machine but he will always be an incomplete running back.

[maven]

No one will ask this question in the media, and you will not see Hester's dramatic game winning return replayed over and over on commercial advertisements for Sportscenter. This was the second TD return for this kid.

Reggie Bush is a glorified punt returner. Devin Hester is the best punt returner in the NFL right now at 13.6 yds/return. Hester has 2 TD's, one of them won a game on MNF.

I wanted Denver to draft him for this reason.

I wonder who will have more TD's by the end of the season. Jake or Devin?

Current count:

Devin: 2

Jake: 3

[Northman]

No one will ask this question in the media, and you will not see Hester's dramatic game winning return replayed over and over on commercial advertisements for Sportscenter. This was the second TD return for this kid.

Reggie Bush is a glorified punt returner. Devin Hester is the best punt returner in the NFL right now at 13.6 yds/return. Hester has 2 TD's, one of them won a game on MNF.



Its not being asked because no one cares.

[Northman]

I dont see how anyone can come to the conclusion that Reggie Bush will provide anything that merits the #2 pick in the draft.




He's helped the Saints to a 5-1 record and single handidly beat the Bucs whereas the Cardinals kicker actually choked.

[epicSocialism4tw]

He's helped the Saints to a 5-1 record and single handidly beat the Bucs whereas the Cardinals kicker actually choked.


Sure. Forget the fact that there were still 4 minutes left in the game after the return. Forget that the Saints D made the stop for the punt, and after the punt.

Also forget that that games MVP Deuce McAllister had 123 yards rushing and a TD.

[epicSocialism4tw]

Its not being asked because no one cares.

Certain people believe whatever advertisers tell them to.

[maven]

Certain people believe whatever advertisers tell them to.

Sportscenter doesn't get overly excited for a punt returner.

Bush returns punts, catches passes, and runs the ball.

[Northman]

Sure. Forget the fact that there were still 4 minutes left in the game after the return. Forget that the Saints D made the stop for the punt, and after the punt.

Also forget that that games MVP Deuce McAllister had 123 yards rushing and a TD.



So Hester has a great run for a TD on a Punt and you proclaim him the best thing since slice bread. But..... Bush has a similiar play and yet he shouldnt have been the #2 pick? Since your going by facts remember that the Saints did force a punt while the Bears did not. Had Rackers made the Kick would you have still posted this silly thread? Likely not.

[Northman]

Certain people believe whatever advertisers tell them to.


So now your a draft genius? Funny, i never saw you post anything on how the Saints should of taken Devin over Bush. Frankly im not a Saints or Bears fan so the fact that either one gets any pub is not my concern. For me personally, Hester isnt the hero of that game. The Bears Defense is. So who will be your hero next week?

[epicSocialism4tw]

So now your a draft genius? Funny, i never saw you post anything on how the Saints should of taken Devin over Bush. Frankly im not a Saints or Bears fan so the fact that either one gets any pub is not my concern. For me personally, Hester isnt the hero of that game. The Bears Defense is. So who will be your hero next week?

Sometimes people can be completely oblivious to obvious things. For example, you have put together some abstraction here that has nothing to do with the thread.

[Northman]

Sometimes people can be completely oblivious to obvious things. For example, you have put together some abstraction here that has nothing to do with the thread.



Your questioning the Saints for taking Bush at #2 but yet the team is 5-1 and winning. The Bears take Hester at whatever pick and they are winning. So who really cares about who went where? Is your point that the Saints would be undefeated if they had Hester? Are you a Bush hater or something? I just dont see the point in comparing the two when both clubs are winning.

[maven]

Im not saying that he will not be a player that contributes. What Im saying here is that 1) he has not lived up to the hype, and 2) he will not live up to the hype. He is much more Eric Metcalf than Barry Sanders.

Okay. I didn't think he was worth the #2 overall pick as well. But, the Saints went and made the selection. Not sure what you're trying to get out of this thread.

[epicSocialism4tw]

Okay. I didn't think he was worth the #2 overall pick as well. But, the Saints went and made the selection. Not sure what you're trying to get out of this thread.

Here have been the arguments that have attempted to validate Bush as a legit #2 pick:

1) He catches alot of passes.

2) His team is winning, therefore he must be doing alot to help that because we see his picture all over TV.

3) He returned a punt for a TD to help win a game.


Im sorry, but those are some of the weakest arguments that I have seen on the internet, and that's saying alot.

[TheReverend]

Your questioning the Saints for taking Bush at #2 but yet the team is 5-1 and winning. The Bears take Hester at whatever pick and they are winning. So who really cares about who went where? Is your point that the Saints would be undefeated if they had Hester? Are you a Bush hater or something? I just dont see the point in comparing the two when both clubs are winning.

Uhhhh... no... his point is Reggie wasn't worth the #2 pick... he's not claiming Hester should've been #2 either... he's saying the Saints could've strengthened their football at another and more needed position and grabbed a PR later in the draft to have just as much impact. That's what he's saying... along his frustration at Reggie's overhype.

[Broncoman13]

Here have been the arguments that have attempted to validate Bush as a legit #2 pick:

1) He catches alot of passes.

2) His team is winning, therefore he must be doing alot to help that because we see his picture all over TV.

3) He returned a punt for a TD to help win a game.


Im sorry, but those are some of the weakest arguments that I have seen on the internet, and that's saying alot.


Why don't you add this one to that mix... it's more than true and has every kind of similarity to Michael Vick that you can think of! THE SAINTS HAVE SOLD OUT THERE ENTIRE HOME SCHEDULE FOR THE FIRST TIME IN WHAT? 20 YEARS. That right there is worthy of the #2 overall pick. No ifs, and, or buts about it. It may not equate to stellar play on the field, but his ability for highlights will keep asses in the seats, and whether we want to admit it or not...THAT is what the NFL is all about! Michael Vick is never going to be a top 5 or even a top 10 QB in the NFL. But he'll continue to make highlight plays every two or three games and that will keep butts in the seats. Making him well worth the #1 pick in the draft back in 2001(or whenever it was).

[Northman]

Uhhhh... no... his point is Reggie wasn't worth the #2 pick... he's not claiming Hester should've been #2 either... he's saying the Saints could've strengthened their football at another and more needed position and grabbed a PR later in the draft to have just as much impact. That's what he's saying... along his frustration at Reggie's overhype.



For starters here is the thread title Why Waste a #2 Pick on Reggie Bush When Devin Hester is Available?


Firstly, That is a insinuation as too why pick Reggie at #2 when Devin is Available. It doesnt mention anything about taking Devin later in the draft nor does he state that in his initial post.

Secondly, Reggie is sharing the backfield with another good back so naturally his touches will be limited.

Thirdly, the Saints are 5-1 so i would say that they already upgraded the positions they needed too. And so they took Reggie because he is a playmaker.

Fourthly, its only been 5 games what exactly was he expecting? 25 Tds?

Furthermore, why would Llama be frustrated with Reggie's hype? Who gives a ****?

[epicSocialism4tw]

Why don't you add this one to that mix... it's more than true and has every kind of similarity to Michael Vick that you can think of! THE SAINTS HAVE SOLD OUT THERE ENTIRE HOME SCHEDULE FOR THE FIRST TIME IN WHAT? 20 YEARS. That right there is worthy of the #2 overall pick. No ifs, and, or buts about it. It may not equate to stellar play on the field, but his ability for highlights will keep asses in the seats, and whether we want to admit it or not...THAT is what the NFL is all about! Michael Vick is never going to be a top 5 or even a top 10 QB in the NFL. But he'll continue to make highlight plays every two or three games and that will keep butts in the seats. Making him well worth the #1 pick in the draft back in 2001(or whenever it was).


Okay, now were getting somewhere Oskie.

He puts butts in the seats, and makes people tune in. He's basically a media prop to increase business. He's more of a cash cow than he is a legit NFL player. There is very little correlation between his production and his value. He's more Mike Vick than he is Terrell Davis.

[Northman]

Here have been the arguments that have attempted to validate Bush as a legit #2 pick:

1) He catches alot of passes.

2) His team is winning, therefore he must be doing alot to help that because we see his picture all over TV.

3) He returned a punt for a TD to help win a game.


Im sorry, but those are some of the weakest arguments that I have seen on the internet, and that's saying alot.



Where's your thread on Mario Williams? Through 5 games Mario has been invisible and Texans have a losing record. Bush has shown the ability to at least make plays and his team has a winning record. Sounds like Reggie must of pissed in your wheaties or something cause you sure have a hard on for bashing the guy.

[maven]

He puts butts in the seats, and makes people tune in. He's basically a media prop to increase business. He's more of a cash cow than he is a legit NFL player.

What is wrong with that? Last I checked the NFL was in the entertainment business.

[BroncoInferno]

We arent talking about potential, which ESPiN has sold you on. We are talking about reality.

How is potential not relevant to worthiness of the #2 overall pick when you're talking about a guy who's 5 games into his career? Mario Williams has barely done anything for the Texans so far. Does that mean he's already a bust?

ESPN has sold me on nothing; I just haven't seen enough to draw any conclusions. If he's still averaging 3.0 YPC at the end of the season, you may be onto something.

[TheReverend]

Why don't you add this one to that mix... it's more than true and has every kind of similarity to Michael Vick that you can think of! THE SAINTS HAVE SOLD OUT THERE ENTIRE HOME SCHEDULE FOR THE FIRST TIME IN WHAT? 20 YEARS. That right there is worthy of the #2 overall pick. No ifs, and, or buts about it. It may not equate to stellar play on the field, but his ability for highlights will keep asses in the seats, and whether we want to admit it or not...THAT is what the NFL is all about! Michael Vick is never going to be a top 5 or even a top 10 QB in the NFL. But he'll continue to make highlight plays every two or three games and that will keep butts in the seats. Making him well worth the #1 pick in the draft back in 2001(or whenever it was).

Well done, Oskie. First person supporting Reggie being worth the #2 pick that's made sense... I stand corrected... the ticket sales, jersey sales and probably even an increase in TV revenue was well worth it.

[Northman]

Well done, Oskie. First person supporting Reggie being worth the #2 pick that's made sense... I stand corrected... the ticket sales, jersey sales and probably even an increase in TV revenue was well worth it.




Your right, i forgot that all #2 round picks won their first Super Bowl in the first 5 weeks of their career. Hilarious! Hilarious! Hilarious! Hilarious! Hilarious! Hilarious! Hilarious!

[TheReverend]

Your right, i forgot that all #2 round picks won their first Super Bowl in the first 5 weeks of their career. Hilarious! Hilarious! Hilarious! Hilarious! Hilarious! Hilarious! Hilarious!

What are you talking about? Go have another and sit in the corner with Mock.

[yavoon]

I think reggie will get better and as luck has its a really good compliment for drew brees who is a dump off whore.

[SoCalBronco]

Go Devin!

[NOLA Bronco]

So I was in the stands for the Saints-Eagles game. I will say, without a doubt, that it damn near seems (when watching in person) that Reggie is nearly able to bust loose on every play. Besides the punt return, the play in the Tampa game with him diving and staying in the air for the first down was plain sick. His speed in person is awesome. The kid is 21 and will only get better once he realizes he can't just run around players like he did in college. He is still faster than most everyone, but he needs some time to get used to the speed of the D. He is filling the role most of the time of decoy. Because the Saints put him and Deuce in the game at the same time it makes up for the fact that the offensive line stinks. And those of you bagging on Brees - I saw him throw some mighty fine long balls to Horn and Colston.

Brian Westbrook? Eric Metcalf? Come on now. I gotta go now, but I would love to keep talking about this.

[Xenos]

So I was in the stands for the Saints-Eagles game. I will say, without a doubt, that it damn near seems (when watching in person) that Reggie is nearly able to bust loose on every play. Besides the punt return, the play in the Tampa game with him diving and staying in the air for the first down was plain sick. His speed in person is awesome. The kid is 21 and will only get better once he realizes he can't just run around players like he did in college. He is still faster than most everyone, but he needs some time to get used to the speed of the D. He is filling the role most of the time of decoy. Because the Saints put him and Deuce in the game at the same time it makes up for the fact that the offensive line stinks. And those of you bagging on Brees - I saw him throw some mighty fine long balls to Horn and Colston.

Brian Westbrook? Eric Metcalf? Come on now. I gotta go now, but I would love to keep talking about this.

That's exactly why he's so important. Teams are so afraid of him busting one that they never stack the line. He's a great decoy that gives Brees time to throw, which is more than I can say for their oline.

[Broncoman13]

Go Devin!

I remember wanting to use a 2nd on the kid... somebody here (SOCAL!!!) told me that was too early. The kid has great talent and he's raw. If not for being raw he would've likely been a first round pick. Just my opinion, but I think he would have been the answer to our punt and kick return needs in addition to being our 4th CB. Perhaps not worth a 2nd round pick, but based on the fact that it would allow us to have two option at punt returner and a dynamic kickoff returner... you could make the case!