Rod Smith Calls The People Morons Asking for a Plummer Cutler Swap

[DBruleU]

http://www.dailycamera.com/bdc/broncos/article/0,1713,BDC_2453_4998681,00.html

Bronco QB threw three interceptions last Sunday

By Associated Press
September 16, 2006

DENVER — The Denver Broncos aren't the only ones expecting to see a different Jake Plummer on Sunday.

While his teammates are rallying around their leader who committed four turnovers in a disheartening loss at St. Louis, the Kansas City Chiefs also are preparing to see Plummer at his ball-control best.



Plummer, who threw just seven interceptions last season, tossed three on Sunday and also fumbled once.

"He had a tough game," Chiefs defensive end Eric Hicks said. "He did have a year that was probably a little bit out of his nature last year because I think he had averaged 20-plus picks the previous eight years (actually 17.6). So, he did a tremendous job last year. He's a gambler. He's going to take some chances, and he did last week. He tried to squeeze some balls in there.

"But we have to expect his best game."

That's what the Broncos are anticipating.

Wide receiver Rod Smith was particularly peeved about all the fans calling for first-round draft pick Jay Cutler to replace Plummer after just one bad game. After all, Plummer is 32-12 as Denver's starter.

"Some of the people saying it, whoever said it, are morons," Smith said. "That's what I think."

Nobody at the Broncos headquarters is pinning all the blame on Plummer, who was pressured relentlessly in the din of the Rams' dome and prevented from doing his trademark bootlegs.

"The guy is a great quarterback, a great teammate, and as I tell our guys every week, it's up to us to make him great," Smith said. "And we didn't do a good job of that last week."

So, what exactly do the Chiefs expect Sunday at Denver, where they haven't won is six years?

"We expect them to run and then run the boot," Hicks said. "They'll try to run it down our throats like they usually do. That's how they se up their play-action passes off that zone running scheme. They'll try to cut it back on us, get us out of position."

Defensive tackle Ryan Sims said Kansas City has spent more time this season defending the bootleg, where the quarterback rolls out on misdirection plays that buy him time to find open receivers.

"This year, we've spent a whole period on nothing but the bootleg. We've never really stressed it the way we've stressed it this year," Sims said. "So, I guess the key to the bootleg is just recognizing it."

Added Hicks: "It's definitely beat us in the past, so there's a sense of urgency about it. Usually it affects us when we're up there at Mile High. They run it very well up there. We usually handle it pretty well down here (at Arrowhead). We're going to try to contain it a little better than we usually do."

Defensive end Jared Allen doesn't think Plummer's dismal debut last week is an indication that he's heading toward the bench and backup status anytime soon.

"No. Good for the Rams. They flushed him and made him make mistakes. That's what we want to do," Allen said.

Asked if he was spending plenty of time preparing for the bootleg, Allen cracked: "I think that would be smart, don't you? That's what they do pretty well. We've got to stop it. That's one thing they beat us with last year."

It's not just the bootleg that concerns the Chiefs' new cornerback, Ty Law.

"When you get two top-notch receivers and a quarterback that can run, you have to be prepared to cover longer than you would normally have to cover," he said.

Both teams are 0-1, so each expects to see a determined opponent on Sunday.

"I think you can always expect to see the best when you are playing the Broncos because of their scheme," Law said. "Any running back that you put in there — and all of them have talent, they do a great job of picking their running backs — but all of those guys can run and get 1,000 or 1,500 yards no matter who you put back there."

[Kaylore]

He also said that the Rams game was the worst offensive performance he's seen.

[-Slap-]

That's what he's supposed to say, stupid.

[Tredici]

Rod's one of the great locker room guys. One of the many things to admire about him. When Cutler's chance comes I hope he has someone equally as upright in his corner.

[usedupbraids]

All said and done broncos win 24-10 i wont lose any sleep over this

[usedupbraids]

Im Going Out Of A Lim Here 15-1 This Season

[Atlas]

I agree. People wanting to see Cutler now are morons... or at least they have no football knowledge.

If Denver is at .500 or less midway through the season then maybe Shanny would make a change. Shanny isn't going to make the same mistake he did in 1999 starting Griese over Brister. Jake will get an opportunity to redeem himself.

[-Slap-]

I agree. People wanting to see Cutler now are morons... or at least they have no football knowledge.

If Denver is at .500 or less midway through the season then maybe Shanny would make a change. Shanny isn't going to make the same mistake he did in 1999 starting Griese over Brister. Jake will get an opportunity to redeem himself.

As bad as Griese sucked, there's no way Shanahan could have started Brister in 1999. The guy completely abandoned all responsibility to the job the second he was named starter and he totally deserved his benching.

[Donk]

Moron (psychology) (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moron_%28psychology%29), a psychology-related term for a person with a genetically determined mental age between 8 and 12

A 8 year-old's judgement is better than Rod's?

[Atlas]

As bad as Griese sucked, there's no way Shanahan could have started Brister in 1999. The guy completely abandoned all responsibility to the job the second he was named starter and he totally deserved his benching.

I don't know I mean Greise led Denver to a 5-11 record. TD had basically a career ending injury because of a Griese int. It was just bad karma all around.

If Denver would have stuck with Brister that year they defiantley would have been a playoff team and TD PROBABLY wouldn't have blown out his knee.... It was just a horrible year for the Broncos.

Another thing If Denver would have stuck with Brister for that year and then looked for another QB in 2000 then Denver wouldn't have wasted all that time and cap space on Griese.

[epicSocialism4tw]

Rod is standing up for his guy. Jake and he have quite a relationship on the field, so one can understand why Rod would back Jake. Rod is option 1, 2, and sometimes 3 in Jake's progression. I cant blame Jake at all because this team has had very little next to Rod for Jake to throw to for Jake's entire career here.

One thing is clear though...Rod has earned the right to have the conch in the realm of controversial issues. Heck, he's earned the right to be a Bronco until he so chooses not to be.

[Dudeskey]

Well Rod's right. We start Cutler, we may as well ****can the season. Plummer has had a history of ****ty season openers. Some we won, some we didn't win. Its almost as bad as the few Cowboy fans calling for the benching of Bledsoe. ****in' morons

[TDforTD]

Props to Smith.

[Bronco Billy]

Thank God for Rod Smith - the voice of reason!

[-Slap-]

If Denver would have stuck with Brister that year they defiantley would have been a playoff team

You've gone completely around the bend.

and TD PROBABLY wouldn't have blown out his knee

Hasn't it dawned on you that TD's blown out ACL wasn't what ended his career? How many athletes have suffered that injury and returned to greatness? How many hundred?

TD's career was like an orange and blue comet that streaked across the skies of NFL stadiums. Brief and brilliant and only seen once a generation. Be grateful for what we had.

Another thing If Denver would have stuck with Brister for that year and then looked for another QB in 2000 then Denver wouldn't have wasted all that time and cap space on Griese.

Except Griese was already on the roster and as soon as Shanahan dumped him Brister washed right back out of football. The Brister benching was inevitable. Perhaps Shanahan owed it to him to let it happen during the regular season, but it was going to happen and happen quickly.

[Atlas]

You've gone completely around the bend.

Maybe



Hasn't it dawned on you that TD's blown out ACL wasn't what ended his career? How many athletes have suffered that injury and returned to greatness? How many hundred?

Sure, but he never did and his finall year he was injured with the same knee problem then he retired.


Except Griese was already on the roster and as soon as Shanahan dumped him Brister washed right back out of football. The Brister benching was inevitable. Perhaps Shanahan owed it to him to let it happen during the regular season, but it was going to happen and happen quickly.

Well, my theory is that Denver moves on without Griese as the starter. Afterall this is all hindisght looking. At first I was pissed Griese started in 1999. Then in 2000 He threw 19 TDs and 4ints and I was behind him. Then I was against him again.

SO in hindsight Denver would have been better off if Brister would have started the '99 season and Denver kept Griese as a talented backup.

[Killericon]

Rod for the HOF.

[BroncoMan4ever]

Wide receiver Rod Smith was particularly peeved about all the fans calling for first-round draft pick Jay Cutler to replace Plummer after just one bad game. After all, Plummer is 32-12 as Denver's starter.

"Some of the people saying it, whoever said it, are morons," Smith said. "That's what I think."



Damn right, i am so glad that the Best of Denver agrees with me that these people calling for Cutler or trading Plummer are morons.

[rovolution]

I don't know I mean Greise led Denver to a 5-11 record. TD had basically a career ending injury because of a Griese int. It was just bad karma all around.

If Denver would have stuck with Brister that year they defiantley would have been a playoff team and TD PROBABLY wouldn't have blown out his knee.... It was just a horrible year for the Broncos.

Another thing If Denver would have stuck with Brister for that year and then looked for another QB in 2000 then Denver wouldn't have wasted all that time and cap space on Griese.

I heard after he was cut by the 49ers, Steve Young was considering coming to Denver to finish his career (he and Shanahan are really good friends from their time in SanFran). imagine how awesome that would have been. Steve Young, McCaffrey, R. Smith, our running game.

[Popps]

Guy like Smith and Lynch want no part of a rookie starting, at this stage in their careers.

Rod's not supid. He knows Plummer is limited. He also knows that they were one game away last season. So, if you're Rod Smith and the coach says "we're putting in the rookie".... he's basically telling you that they're throwing the season away. Not something you want to hear at age 37.

So, when Rod pumps up Jake and calls him a great QB, some of that is the normal company line. But, when he says he wants Jake to start, there's no question that he means it.

[Spider]

I wouldnt mind seeing Cutler start , but I wouldnt pull Jake just yet ...... But then i am one throw the young lion in the fire and see how they do .....

[alphamale72]

Thank you Rod!!.....Jay is the future and hes a stud ...no doubts there.....but for here and now....right now plummers the guy.........he will reel it in....every QB has at least 2or3 bad games every year!!....(brett favre 23 ints last year!!!)....hell settle in and he will produce

[ol number 7]

Thank God for Rod Smith - the voice of reason!
If that were the case they would have 16 QB changes every week. Cutler with a clipboard works for me.

[ol number 7]

Thank you Rod!!.....Jay is the future and hes a stud ...no doubts there.....but for here and now....right now plummers the guy.........he will reel it in....every QB has at least 2or3 bad games every year!!....(brett favre 23 ints last year!!!)....hell settle in and he will produce

Don't think Cutler can grow "THE BEARD" yet !!!Hilarious!

[Spider]

Thank you Rod!!.....Jay is the future and hes a stud ...no doubts there.....but for here and now....right now plummers the guy.........he will reel it in....every QB has at least 2or3 bad games every year!!....(brett favre 23 ints last year!!!)....hell settle in and he will produce

Dont know about you , but I cant wait to see how Cutler handles Pressure .....I am pretty sure we will see Cutler in a few games this year ..........

[Arkie]

The Brister/Greise situation was a little different than the Plummer/Cutler situation. Remember when the team sulked after benching Brister? Multiply that by ten if Plummer gets benched. Griese was in his 2nd year after watching and learning during a Super Bowl year under Elway. Even the 2nd year Griese was more NFL ready than a rookie Cutler.

[tnedator]

That's what he's supposed to say, stupid.

That is not was he is supposed to say. I am sure that Bowlen has had enough of his players antagonizing his fans.

As a good teemmate, it is possible that he is upposed to say "Jake's our QB, we all support him". He is not supposed to say that the fans that are calling for Cutler are morons.

[KipCorrington25]

Blackjack pizza is really bland I know that much.

[Sprout]

"We expect them to run and then run the boot," Hicks said. "They'll try to run it down our throats like they usually do."

LOL

[GonzoLays]

That is not was he is supposed to say. I am sure that Bowlen has had enough of his players antagonizing his fans.

As a good teemmate, it is possible that he is upposed to say "Jake's our QB, we all support him". He is not supposed to say that the fans that are calling for Cutler are morons.

Let me guess...you were one of the guys calling for Cutler.

[worm]

Guy like Smith and Lynch want no part of a rookie starting, at this stage in their careers.

Rod's not supid. He knows Plummer is limited. He also knows that they were one game away last season. So, if you're Rod Smith and the coach says "we're putting in the rookie".... he's basically telling you that they're throwing the season away. Not something you want to hear at age 37.

So, when Rod pumps up Jake and calls him a great QB, some of that is the normal company line. But, when he says he wants Jake to start, there's no question that he means it.

Awesome. I didn't know you knew what Rod thought about so many things.

Do you have his cell phone #...or are you part of some psychic friends hotline together?

[Drek]

Anyone wanting to bench Jake, who has a history of bad opening day games, after one horrible game is a moron.

Anyone trying to argue that Jake didn't have a horrible game though is equally a moron.

Jake's our QB, until the season is in jeopoardy because Jake isn't producing he's the starter.

[Spider]

Anyone wanting to bench Jake, who has a history of bad opening day games, after one horrible game is a moron.

Anyone trying to argue that Jake didn't have a horrible game though is equally a moron.

Jake's our QB, until the season is in jeopoardy because Jake isn't producing he's the starter.
how about the we want Jake to start but we also would love to see What Cutler can do morons ?

[orange 4 life]

good for rod. he's right.

nuff said.

[orange 4 life]

how about the we want Jake to start but we also would love to see What Cutler can do morons ?

pretty shocking if you ask me.

you were one of those people that had a nice "jake the snake" avatar three years ago.
you and many others.

all he's done since then is go 10-6, 10-6, and 13-3.
2:1 td to turnover ratio.
27 tds and 4000 yards in one season.
a probowl nod last year.
a league leader in int. percentage (hear that everyone? he was THE BEST at protecting the ball. #1) last year.
we've caved in in our three playoff losses (mostly because of the defense), but we come into this season with realistic hopes of a superbowl championship...

.....and you wanna see what a rookie can do?

i think you should put that snake avatar back up and not give two sh!ts about what the rookie can do.
not now. not soon.

jake

[orange 4 life]

Awesome. I didn't know you knew what Rod thought about so many things.

Do you have his cell phone #...or are you part of some psychic friends hotline together?

no worm, he just has common sense.

i know thats not the norm amongst the ADD generation, but there are some of us left who have a little.

[Spider]

pretty shocking if you ask me.

you were one of those people that had a nice "jake the snake" avatar three years ago.
you and many others.

all he's done since then is go 10-6, 10-6, and 13-3.
2:1 td to turnover ratio.
27 tds and 4000 yards in one season.
a probowl nod last year.
a league leader in int. percentage (hear that everyone? he was THE BEST at protecting the ball. #1) last year.
we've caved in in our three playoff losses (mostly because of the defense), but we come into this season with realistic hopes of a superbowl championship...

.....and you wanna see what a rookie can do?

i think you should put that snake avatar back up and not give two sh!ts about what the rookie can do.
not now. not soon.

jake

oh I still support Jake , I dont make excuses for him , but i still want him as a starter , but on the same hand I want a glimpse of the future ........So I just wondering where people like me , and there are lot of us morons , fit in is all

[orange 4 life]

oh I still support Jake , I dont make excuses for him , but i still want him as a starter , but on the same hand I want a glimpse of the future ........So I just wondering where people like me , and there are lot of us morons , fit in is all

i dont know buddy.

i guess you fall in the "worried about the future instead of the present" category.

no offense my friend, but i just dont understand it.
ill worry about the future when it gets here.
right now im just worried about this season, and if we're going all the way cutler doesnt fit into the plans for this season, so therefore it seems ludicrous to be talking about him all the time.

[Spider]

i dont know buddy.

i guess you fall in the "worried about the future instead of the present" category.

no offense my friend, but i just dont understand it.
ill worry about the future when it gets here.
right now im just worried about this season, and if we're going all the way cutler doesnt fit into the plans for this season, so therefore it seems ludicrous to be talking about him all the time.

not worried ....... excited would be more like it ........

[Drek]

Come on, there's no need for agruing amongst Bronco fans this weekend! We'll all get what we want, Jake'll play the first half and when we're up by 30 everyone will get to see a whole half of Cutler tearing it up. :D

I love chefies week, its like the 4th of July, thanksgiving, and Christmas all in one. The 4th because its a celebration of great Bronco triumphs in the past, thanksgiving and christmas because a bunch of turkeys show up and give our favorite team tons of presents.

[Popps]

Awesome. I didn't know you knew what Rod thought about so many things.
?

Nah. Not awesome. Just simple 2+2 logic. Quite simple, really.

Thanks, though.

[orange 4 life]

not worried ....... excited would be more like it ........

what about being excited for this season?

shouldnt that supercede excitement for the future?

hey buddy, im excited to see that rocket arm too........in a couple years.

im alot MORE excited to see if we can win it all THIS season.

[orange 4 life]

Come on, there's no need for agruing amongst Bronco fans this weekend!

it sucks.
my draft day meltdown fears are coming true....unfortunately.

[Popps]

i dont know buddy.

i guess you fall in the "worried about the future instead of the present" category.


That's what I don't get.... those who are willing to throw away the season in week 2 to get a rookie some reps when we were one game out last year.

I mean, if Plummer stinks it up for a couple more games, then there's no question what we do.

What's the problem, here? It's really a very simple scenario... and I'll guarantee you Mike Shanahan isn't struggling with what to do.

[orange 4 life]

Nah. Not awesome. Just simple 2+2 logic. Quite simple, really.

Thanks, though.

logic?

these kids dont understand logic popps. makes it pretty tough to relate to 'em.

[Spider]

what about being excited for this season?

shouldnt that supercede excitement for the future?

hey buddy, im excited to see that rocket arm too........in a couple years.

im alot MORE excited to see if we can win it all THIS season.
I am always excited for Broncos football , reguardless of who is QB .........
it isnt his rocket arm i want , we know he has that , I want to see how he does vs a real D ... Calm and cool or bat shít

[Bronco_Beerslug]

it sucks.
my draft day meltdown fears are coming true....unfortunately.
No, our fears of Plummer imploding came true right off the bat this year, continuing right where he left off last year and a whole lot of people don't have confidence in him which should be expected after the way he's performed lately.

Most people believe he can play well enough tomorrow for a Broncos victory over a weaker chiefs team.

[Spider]

That's what I don't get.... those who are willing to throw away the season in week 2 to get a rookie some reps when we were one game out last year.

.

reason you didnt get it cause you either didnt understand what I said , or just ignorent ..........

[elsid13]

I not worried about Plummer he will bounce back and have good season. But I wouldn't mind seeing Cutler come in for single series in controlled situation, much like Reeves did with Vick in Atlanta. Just to get him used to NFL game speed.

[Spider]

I not worried about Plummer he will bounce back and have good season. But I wouldn't mind seeing Cutler come in for single series in controlled situation, much like Reeves did with Vick in Atlanta. Just to get him used to NFL game speed.

Thats all I am talking about , but you got these damn drama queens running around shouting ruin the season , piss away the here and now for the future , yadda, yadda, yadda, .......... We all know Jake will miss a game here or there before he leaves Denver , and having Cutler ready would be a good thing , but you got some people here with thier Skrits hiked up and panties in a wad ......

[Broncobuddy7]

I agree with Rod.

[Bronco_Beerslug]

That's what I don't get.... those who are willing to throw away the season in week 2 to get a rookie some reps when we were one game out last year.
.
What are you talking about? Didn't you already state we can't win a SB with this team? So what's the problem if that's true?

[Popps]

What are you talking about? Didn't you already state we can't win a SB with this team?

Ummm.... no.

[Tredici]

i dont know buddy.

i guess you fall in the "worried about the future instead of the present" category.

no offense my friend, but i just dont understand it.
ill worry about the future when it gets here.
right now im just worried about this season, and if we're going all the way cutler doesnt fit into the plans for this season, so therefore it seems ludicrous to be talking about him all the time.

I fall into the worried about the present category. Is Jake Plummer beyond criticism? I don't think so. After watching the game films Jake himself said he would've booed his performance too.

Maybe when someone says they want Jake to stop making ridiculous left hand hucks and throwing sure picks off his back foot while falling down, that's exactly what it means. WE WANT JAKE TO STOP MAKING THOSE DECISIONS. It doesn't mean bench him and play Cutler. You choose to see the go to Cutler connection. I choose to see people who want to see Jake step it up and play like the 10 year pro he is.

[-Slap-]

That is not was he is supposed to say. I am sure that Bowlen has had enough of his players antagonizing his fans.

As a good teemmate, it is possible that he is upposed to say "Jake's our QB, we all support him". He is not supposed to say that the fans that are calling for Cutler are morons.

I was calling for Cutler and I don't feel antagonized. Smarter people than Rod Smith have called me a moron.

:gimme:

[Bronco_Beerslug]

Ummm.... no.
Really? What's all this talk from you trying to defend Plummer saying we won't win a SB without a championship defense?

[Barry Ramey]

Well put Rod.


Wide receiver Rod Smith was particularly peeved about all the fans calling for first-round draft pick Jay Cutler to replace Plummer after just one bad game. After all, Plummer is 32-12 as Denver's starter.

"Some of the people saying it, whoever said it, are morons," Smith said. "That's what I think."

[Bronco_Beerslug]

Well put Rod.

"Some of the people saying it, whoever said it, are morons," Smith said. "That's what I think."[/B]
LOL

It's OK, a lot of people like you can't see the forest for the trees.

[Popps]

Really? What's all this talk from you trying to defend Plummer saying we won't win a SB without a championship defense?

Well, let's see...

Any game where our defense allows an NFL record for first half points, yardage, or allows scores on the first four drives, I'm usually likely to criticize them.

Weird, huh?

When my radiator goes out and my car stops running, I don't blame my tires, even though they may be in need of an upgrade at some point. If the radiator went out, I wouldn't have gone anywhere, even with new tires.
If I blew a tire FIRST (Rams game) .... well sure, the tires were the problem.

You sure sell yourself as intellectually superior to everyone around here, Slug. I can't imagine being that far beyond us all, you'd need me to explain the difference to you between "defending" a QB when he plays poorly (last Sunday) and accurately assigning priority to problems in a game. (Our defense taking the afternoon off against Pitt.)

[Rigs11]

Ha ha...I told you you were morons.

[Atlas]

it sucks.
my draft day meltdown fears are coming true....unfortunately.

You are correct about that. Of course we wouldn't be having this problem if Jake had played well. Hopefully he will play great this weekend and we can all just stop the idiocy around here.

[Atlas]

I was calling for Cutler and I don't feel antagonized. Smarter people than Rod Smith have called me a moron.

:gimme:

Rod's pretty smart

[Taco John]

TD had basically a career ending injury because of a Griese int.

People who believe that Griese's interception is what ended TD's career are morons.

[Atlas]

People who believe that Griese's interception is what ended TD's career are morons.


OK if Brister would have started the season at QB would have Davis blown his knee out???

NO! Probably not!!

Seems like a pretty common sense statement to make.

I'm not blaming Griese I'm just stating which is pretty much a common sense fact.

[NYBronc]

He blew his knee out in the fourth or fifth game. Brister would have been benched by then and it would have happened exactly how it happened.

[Taco John]

OK if Brister would have started the season at QB would have Davis blown his knee out???

NO! Probably not!!

Seems like a pretty common sense statement to make.

I'm not blaming Griese I'm just stating which is pretty much a common sense fact.


What's wrong? Don't like being called a moron?

[Taco John]

Note that TD retired because he had a degenerative knee condition, and his OTHER knee, not his ACL knee was the culprit at the time... Griese had nothing to do with it.

[Atlas]

Note that TD retired because he had a degenerative knee condition, and his OTHER knee, not his ACL knee was the culprit at the time... Griese had nothing to do with it.

Your pretty defensive about your boy Griese. I didn't know you had this big of a complex over him.

I don't know what knee was degenerative, all I know is that he missed a year and a half because of that knee injury he suffered on Griese's INT, and he was never the same. Spin it any way you want.

Being called a moron doesn't bother me. My wife calls me worse.

[Requiem]

Evolutionary Timeline of Humans:

Homo habilis, Homo erectus, Homo sapiens, Jay Cutler.

[NYBronc]

Your pretty defensive about your boy Griese. I didn't know you had this big of a complex over him.

I don't know what knee was degenerative, all I know is that he missed a year and a half because of that knee injury he suffered on Griese's INT, and he was never the same. Spin it any way you want.

Being called a moron doesn't bother me. My wife calls me worse.

C'mon Atlus it's not a spin. That's a fact. He had a degenerative knee condition in his other knee. We weren't effective on the ground those first four games anyway.

[Atlas]

Evolutionary Timeline of Humans:

Homo habilis, Homo erectus, Homo sapiens, Jay Cutler.

go ahead and slip Homo Ergaster in before homo erectus. They are always left out.

[Atlas]

C'mon Atlus it's not a spin. That's a fact. He had a degenerative knee condition in his other knee. We weren't effective on the ground those first four games anyway.

Will you admit that Davis missed a year and 1/2 because of Greise's INT?? That seems easy enough doesn't it???

[Requiem]

go ahead and slip Homo Ergaster in before homo erectus. They are always left out.

So we're talking about Jay Cutler's great-great-great-great-great-great-great Grandpa?

[NYBronc]

I'll admit he missed a year and a half because of Matt Lepsis and the nature of the game. It's kind of over the top considering all the INTs QB's threw during TD's career. It was a freak play and it did not end his career.

[Atlas]

So we're talking about Jay Cutler's great-great-great-great-great-great-great Grandpa?

something like that

[NYBronc]

I'll admit he missed a year and a half because of Matt Lepsis and the nature of the game. It's kind of over the top considering all the INTs QB's threw during TD's career. It was a freak play and it did not end his career.

With that said, everyone knows the <a href="http://www.dlewis.net/unpublished/chunky_curse.php3">curse </A> of the chunky soup ended TD's career.

[-Slap-]

Evolutionary Timeline of Humans:

Homo habilis, Fred Smerlas http://www.lifeathletes.org/0008/media/mastpics/fred_smerlas.jpg, Homo erectus, Homo sapiens, Jay Cutler.

o

[Hulamau]

i dont know buddy.

i guess you fall in the "worried about the future instead of the present" category.

no offense my friend, but i just dont understand it.
ill worry about the future when it gets here.
right now im just worried about this season, and if we're going all the way cutler doesnt fit into the plans for this season, so therefore it seems ludicrous to be talking about him all the time.

Its all just a bunch of yackin and hand ringing in any event. Cutler is only going to play if and when the situation calls for it. That could be when:

1. Jake goes down (boo)
2. Jake chokes big time (boo)
3. We get a big lead (Yeah baby!)
4 We get way behind and have no choice but pass. (Better than a poke in the eye)

So why is anyone even worried about it? Fortunately Shanny realized that living in the moment as you sugget O4L also includes making present decisions and moves that bolster not only the depth for this year, but gives us the best shot for a bright future as well ...and so, Hallalujah, he stole the gem of the draft!

Itoo want to see both Jake do well AND for Cutler to get some quality time this yar as well, both of which can be realized with a lot of option 3. I just hope it isn't because of option 1 or 2.

I would LOVE to see Jay-Cee play the 4th quarter tommorrow, after we enter the final 15 mintues with a 24 to 28 point lead. Spare Jake the added risk while letting Jay Cut(ler) his teeth while running KC out of the stadium, which that scenario would entail.

I know at some point Shanny is gonna want to give Cutler some solid snaps this year, even if Jake is playing well and we are winning, and its only in everone's best interest that he do so. Otherwise, whenever he does start he'll still have the initial live-bullets learning curve to go through. Might as well get as much of that under his belt this year whether we are winning or losing, preferably of course in a situation that makes everyone happy including Jake and Jay.

[Bronco_Beerslug]

Well, let's see...

Any game where our defense allows an NFL record for first half points, yardage, or allows scores on the first four drives, I'm usually likely to criticize them.

Weird, huh?

When my radiator goes out and my car stops running, I don't blame my tires, even though they may be in need of an upgrade at some point. If the radiator went out, I wouldn't have gone anywhere, even with new tires.
If I blew a tire FIRST (Rams game) .... well sure, the tires were the problem.

You sure sell yourself as intellectually superior to everyone around here, Slug. I can't imagine being that far beyond us all, you'd need me to explain the difference to you between "defending" a QB when he plays poorly (last Sunday) and accurately assigning priority to problems in a game. (Our defense taking the afternoon off against Pitt.)
Try and stay on topic. Did you or didn't you say we can't win the SB without a championship defense (this team)?

[Atlas]

Whatever. I think all you guys are a little to anal.

I like Greise as a QB. I'm the one that said he was going to the Probowl this year.... Hopefully Grossman loses the job soon so Greise can start.

All I was saying was that if Griese didn't start in 1999 Denver wouldn't have been 6-10 and Davis wouldn't have blown out his knee. Too me that seems pretty common sense but hey maybe some people disagree...... somehow???.

[Taco John]

Your pretty defensive about your boy Griese. I didn't know you had this big of a complex over him.


However you want to see it. I think it's moronic to blame other players for freak accidents. I agree with a lot of the criticism of Griese, but the idea that TDs career was finished because of anything Griese did is, in my opinion, moronic



I don't know what knee was degenerative, all I know is that he missed a year and a half because of that knee injury he suffered on Griese's INT, and he was never the same. Spin it any way you want.



There's nothing to spin here. Terrell Davis attempted a return, but the degenerative knee condition affected both his knees. He tried a high risk surgery to try and solve the problem, and it didn't work. It was his non-ACL knee that was giving him the most trouble at the time of his retirement.

[Popps]

Try and stay on topic. Did you or didn't you say we can't win the SB without a championship defense (this team)?


How many times do you want me to answer the same question?

Tell you what, I'll stay on topic... and you pay attention.

Doesn't matter. We're all too stupid here to get, anyway.... right?

[DarkHorse30]

You've gone completely around the bend.



Hasn't it dawned on you that TD's blown out ACL wasn't what ended his career? How many athletes have suffered that injury and returned to greatness? How many hundred?

TD's career was like an orange and blue comet that streaked across the skies of NFL stadiums. Brief and brilliant and only seen once a generation. Be grateful for what we had.


Speaking of around the bend...I agree with your second paragraph, but the first one is loopy. TD's injury ENDED his career. What's the point of debating it?

Also, Smith Rules. He is an inspiration to everybody who knows the way the game should be played.

[maven]

If Cutler was to start and start multiple games, Rod wouldn't be the 1st or 2nd option.

[Taco John]

Speaking of around the bend...I agree with your second paragraph, but the first one is loopy. TD's injury ENDED his career. What's the point of debating it?



Because it's patently false. TD's acl injury didn't end his career, or even have anything to do with his career ending. Terrell Davis had a genetic degenerative knee condition that affected both knees that he needed surgery for. He opted for a very risky micro-puncture surgery that was the effective end of his career. Players come back from ACL all the time. We're witnessing Carson Palmer and Javon Walker doing so this season.

Terrell Davis's acl injury didn't end his career. His degenerative knee condition did.

[Bronco_Beerslug]

How many times do you want me to answer the same question?

Tell you what, I'll stay on topic... and you pay attention.

Doesn't matter. We're all too stupid here to get, anyway.... right?


Your attempts at deflection away from your statements of not being able to win the SB because of our defense are amusing :)

[Barry Ramey]

It's ok, a lot of people like you don't know much about the game of football either LOL


LOL

It's OK, a lot of people like you can't see the forest for the trees.

[Barry Ramey]

As for TD, sure one can say TD wouldn't have had a knee injury if that interception didn't happen. But seems like his knees were not meant for a long career in the NFL, so if that didn't happen, it would have been something else eventually and likely soon.

[Broncos4tw]

I agree that Cutler probably would get eaten alive if he started. I don't think it would "ruin" him, he'd be fine. But Jake is a more solid selection.... if he knocks off the stupid plays.

Plummer always has horrible first games of the year? Why in the hell is that an excuse? He also has horrible playoff games. Does that mean we resign ourselves to never winning the big game with him in there? Rather stupid logic imo.

I'll back Jake as long as we have him back there, but I still think he is incredibly innacurate for an NFL QB. He is very lucky that he only had 7 picks last year. Receivers have to adjust even on simple passes to catch his balls. So while I think that yea, Jake is probably our best bet to make it to the playoffs, I'm not going to mistake him for some football tactician. I'm going to cringe every time he gets under pressure, or throws the ball. The only time I'll feel comfortable is when he is rolling out and no one is waiting for him. That seems to be the only time he can throw reasonably accurate passes.

[-Slap-]

Speaking of around the bend...I agree with your second paragraph, but the first one is loopy. TD's injury ENDED his career. What's the point of debating it?

Anyone who followed the team and possesses a working brain knows Terrell's leg problems went far beyond what happened in the initial injury. I think to profess any other opinion betrays an ignorance of Bronco history.

[Spider]

Anyone who followed the team and possesses a working brain knows Terrell's leg problems went far beyond what happened in the initial injury. I think to profess any other opinion betrays an ignorance of Bronco history.

TD rushed back before his Knee was ready , no question .......2001 TD Racks up 97 vs the Dolphins ..... I thought TD was back for good

[Dedhed]

OK if Brister would have started the season at QB would have Davis blown his knee out???

NO! Probably not!!

Seems like a pretty common sense statement to make.

I'm not blaming Griese I'm just stating which is pretty much a common sense fact.
Sorry, but this is moronic.


If Bob Griese had blown out his knee in his second game as a pro, Mrs. Griese might have left him and then Brian never would have been born. I blame the bastards you didn't take out Bob early in his career thus allowing Brian to be conceived. It's all their fault.

[-Slap-]

As the following article clearly shows, Terrell had multiple issues in both legs that derailed his career.

The truth of the matter is Terrell didn't truly possess the amazing physical tools of some of the other great backs in history. Only a fool would compare his God given athletic gifts to a Jim Brown or an OJ Simpson.

Terrell's greatest gift was his tremendously huge heart and his will to win. That's why he was able to get 100% out of the athletic ability he did have and write his name large in the NFL Record Book. As he did in the hearts of true Bronco fans.

It wasn't Brian Griese or Matt Lepsis or even a blown ACL that wrecked Terrell's career. If anything, it was almost 500 touches (counting post season) in back to back seasons that ruined the guy. Or, and this is what I believe, Terrell's career was meant to be short and brilliant. I'm not going to look back in sadness at what might have been, though, I'm just going to savor the memories of the humble kid who helped us dominate the NFL during back to back championship seasons.

Terrell Davis to have more knee surgery (http://www.nfl.com/teams/story/DEN/4514823)

NFL.com wire reports

ENGLEWOOD, Colo. (Nov. 12, 2001) -- It's back to the sidelines for Denver Broncos running back Terrell Davis.

Two games after returning from right knee surgery, Davis will undergo a surgical procedure on his left knee, coach Mike Shanahan announced Monday.

Shanahan announced at an afternoon news conference that Davis will undergo surgery later Monday for a torn meniscus and be sidelined for seven to 10 days. He added that the oft-injured back, who has missed 30 of the club's past 42 games, would "probably be sidelined for two games."

The latest injury comes only one day after Davis carried 33 times for 83 yards in a 26-16 victory against the San Diego Chargers.

In September, Davis underwent right knee surgery and missed six games before returning Nov. 5 at Oakland. He rushed for 70 yards on 17 attempts against the Raiders and looked to be regaining his old form.

Davis rushed for more than 2,000 yards in 1998 but has been hampered by injuries since. He tore his right anterior cruciate ligament in the fourth game of the 1999 season, sidelining him for the rest of the year. In 2000, he missed 11 games, including a playoff loss at Baltimore, due to ankle and calf problems and a stress reaction in his lower left leg.

Terrell Davis had a three year stretch (96-98) that equals any running back in NFL history.

+--------------------------+-------------------------+
| Rushing | Receiving |
+----------+-----+--------------------------+-------------------------+
| Year TM | G | Att Yards Y/A TD | Rec Yards Y/R TD |
+----------+-----+--------------------------+-------------------------+
| 1995 den | 14 | 237 1117 4.7 7 | 49 367 7.5 1 |
| 1996 den | 16 | 345 1538 4.5 13 | 36 310 8.6 2 |
| 1997 den | 15 | 369 1750 4.7 15 | 42 287 6.8 0 |
| 1998 den | 16 | 392 2008 5.1 21 | 25 217 8.7 2 |
| 1999 den | 4 | 67 211 3.1 2 | 3 26 8.7 0 |
| 2000 den | 5 | 78 282 3.6 2 | 2 4 2.0 0 |
| 2001 den | 11 | 167 701 4.2 0 | 12 69 5.8 0 |
+----------+-----+--------------------------+-------------------------+
| TOTAL | 81 | 1655 7607 4.6 60 | 169 1280 7.6 5 |
+----------+-----+--------------------------+-------------------------+

Extrapolate Terrell's post season statistics over a full 16 game season and you get 2280 yards and 24 TDs @ 5.6 yards a pop.

Year Opp Result | RSH YD TD | REC YD TD
---------------------+-----------------+-----------------
1996 jax L,27-30 | 14 91 1 | 7 24 0
1997 jax W,42-17 | 31 184 2 | 4 11 0
1997 kan W,14-10 | 25 101 2 | 1 17 0
1997 pit W,24-21 | 26 139 1 | 1 2 0
*1997 gnb W,31-24 | 30 157 3 | 2 8 0
1998 mia W,38-3 | 21 199 2 | 1 7 0
1998 nyj W,23-10 | 32 167 1 | 1 12 0
*1998 atl W,34-19 | 25 102 0 | 2 50 0
---------------------+-----------------+-----------------
TOTAL | 204 1140 12 | 19 131 0

http://img57.imageshack.us/img57/4720/picture652cl5.jpg

http://img57.imageshack.us/img57/3430/picture645dq3.jpg

http://img233.imageshack.us/img233/9161/picture649sd2.jpg

http://img119.imageshack.us/img119/3226/picture666wc6.jpg

http://img160.imageshack.us/img160/3056/picture642jo6.jpg

http://img68.imageshack.us/img68/1790/picture647uo0.jpg

http://img233.imageshack.us/img233/1796/picture670rf0.jpg

[Dedhed]

Its all just a bunch of yackin and hand ringing in any event. Cutler is only going to play if and when the situation calls for it. That could be when:

1. Jake goes down (boo)
2. Jake chokes big time (boo)
3. We get a big lead (Yeah baby!)
4 We get way behind and have no choice but pass. (Better than a poke in the eye)

So why is anyone even worried about it? Fortunately Shanny realized that living in the moment as you sugget O4L also includes making present decisions and moves that bolster not only the depth for this year, but gives us the best shot for a bright future as well ...and so, Hallalujah, he stole the gem of the draft!

Itoo want to see both Jake do well AND for Cutler to get some quality time this yar as well, both of which can be realized with a lot of option 3. I just hope it isn't because of option 1 or 2.

I would LOVE to see Jay-Cee play the 4th quarter tommorrow, after we enter the final 15 mintues with a 24 to 28 point lead. Spare Jake the added risk while letting Jay Cut(ler) his teeth while running KC out of the stadium, which that scenario would entail.

I know at some point Shanny is gonna want to give Cutler some solid snaps this year, even if Jake is playing well and we are winning, and its only in everone's best interest that he do so. Otherwise, whenever he does start he'll still have the initial live-bullets learning curve to go through. Might as well get as much of that under his belt this year whether we are winning or losing, preferably of course in a situation that makes everyone happy including Jake and Jay.I think that putting Cutler in at any point early in the season is just going to add fuel to the controversy fire.

I think the entire season is Jake's, and if he doesn't win the SB he's gone. If we get to a point where we're eliminated from making the playoffs, Jake is done.

I'm of the opinion that we should give the ball to Cutler as soon as it's guaranteed we can't win the SB this year, if we ever get to that point. Until that point, this is Jake's team to lead as far as he can take it.

[Bronco_Beerslug]

It's ok, a lot of people like you don't know much about the game of football either LOL
Aren't you one of the football geniuses that blamed our defense for losing last week?

[footstepsfrom#27]

Quote from Jimmy Johson about 5 minutes ago..."I give Jake Plummer about a week and a half...I don't like Plummer".

[Atlas]

Sorry, but this is moronic.


If Bob Griese had blown out his knee in his second game as a pro, Mrs. Griese might have left him and then Brian never would have been born. I blame the bastards you didn't take out Bob early in his career thus allowing Brian to be conceived. It's all their fault.

All I was doing was a retrospective. I was simply stating looking in hindsight that Denver would have been better off if they would have started Brister. I wasn't blaming anyone I was making an observation using hindsight, that is pretty obvious really.

I think people like to argue here just to make themselves feel smarter

[Popps]

Your attempts at deflection away from your statements of not being able to win the SB because of our defense are amusing :)

Your attempts to ignore the direct answer I've given to the same question several times are amusing.

:)

[Popps]

Aren't you one of the football geniuses that blamed our defense for losing last week?

Wow, that's unusual. Beerslug proclaiming his intellectual superiority over someone, again.

Let me ask you something, man. Being so vastly advanced beyond the unwashed masses around here, why would you even bother?

People who are intelligent usually have to put other people's intelligence down a lot. It's a sign of security and confidence.

Anyway, I'll see you in 5 minutes when you ask me the same question again.

[Popps]

Quote from Jimmy Johson about 5 minutes ago..."I give Jake Plummer about a week and a half...I don't like Plummer".

... and what did the other three commentators say, just to be accurate?

(I'll let you know if you don't remember)

[NYBronc]

All I was doing was a retrospective. I was simply stating looking in hindsight that Denver would have been better off if they would have started Brister. I wasn't blaming anyone I was making an observation using hindsight, that is pretty obvious really.

I think people like to argue here just to make themselves feel smarter


People usually argue for the benefit of the facts and for the service of others. I appreciate a post that backs up opinions with facts like this one from Slap.

Quote:
Terrell Davis to have more knee surgery

NFL.com wire reports

ENGLEWOOD, Colo. (Nov. 12, 2001) -- It's back to the sidelines for Denver Broncos running back Terrell Davis.

Two games after returning from right knee surgery, Davis will undergo a surgical procedure on his left knee, coach Mike Shanahan announced Monday.

Shanahan announced at an afternoon news conference that Davis will undergo surgery later Monday for a torn meniscus and be sidelined for seven to 10 days. He added that the oft-injured back, who has missed 30 of the club's past 42 games, would "probably be sidelined for two games."

The latest injury comes only one day after Davis carried 33 times for 83 yards in a 26-16 victory against the San Diego Chargers.

In September, Davis underwent right knee surgery and missed six games before returning Nov. 5 at Oakland. He rushed for 70 yards on 17 attempts against the Raiders and looked to be regaining his old form.

Davis rushed for more than 2,000 yards in 1998 but has been hampered by injuries since. He tore his right anterior cruciate ligament in the fourth game of the 1999 season, sidelining him for the rest of the year. <B>In 2000, he missed 11 games, including a playoff loss at Baltimore, due to ankle and calf problems and a stress reaction in his lower left leg. </B>


Assuming and conveying that this is done because someone wants to feel smarter, they're anal, or they want to have Brian Griese's love child is antagonistic and shallow bro.

Just sayin'

[Atlas]

People usually argue for the benefit of the facts and for the service of others. I appreciate a post that backs up opinions with facts like this one from Slap.

Quote:
Terrell Davis to have more knee surgery

NFL.com wire reports

ENGLEWOOD, Colo. (Nov. 12, 2001) -- It's back to the sidelines for Denver Broncos running back Terrell Davis.

Two games after returning from right knee surgery, Davis will undergo a surgical procedure on his left knee, coach Mike Shanahan announced Monday.

Shanahan announced at an afternoon news conference that Davis will undergo surgery later Monday for a torn meniscus and be sidelined for seven to 10 days. He added that the oft-injured back, who has missed 30 of the club's past 42 games, would "probably be sidelined for two games."

The latest injury comes only one day after Davis carried 33 times for 83 yards in a 26-16 victory against the San Diego Chargers.

In September, Davis underwent right knee surgery and missed six games before returning Nov. 5 at Oakland. He rushed for 70 yards on 17 attempts against the Raiders and looked to be regaining his old form.

Davis rushed for more than 2,000 yards in 1998 but has been hampered by injuries since. He tore his right anterior cruciate ligament in the fourth game of the 1999 season, sidelining him for the rest of the year. <B>In 2000, he missed 11 games, including a playoff loss at Baltimore, due to ankle and calf problems and a stress reaction in his lower left leg. </B>


Assuming and conveying that this is done because someone wants to feel smarter, they're anal, or they want to have Brian Griese's love child is antagonistic and shallow bro.

Just sayin'

So do you think Denver was better off Starting Griese over Brister in 1999??

If you say that yes, starting Griese was the smart thing to do than we disagree.

[NYBronc]

Brister looked horrible in the preseason that year and seemed lackadaisical at best. Griese started the Monday night Miami game hot from what I remember so I thought it was the right move at the time. Bubby to me was a joke.

I agree with you we shouldn't rush Cutler too soon but Griese at that time had a year under his belt and (looking back at the stats) started the season with 250 yards. 3 TDs and no interceptions.

[footstepsfrom#27]

Brister looked horrible in the preseason that year and seemed lackadaisical at best. Griese started the Monday night Miami game hot from what I remember so I thought it was the right move at the time. Bubby to me was a joke.

I agree with you we shouldn't rush Cutler too soon but Griese at that time had a year under his belt and (looking back at the stats) started the season with 250 yards. 3 TDs and no interceptions.
Griese had 2 years of college ball and threw 3 passes in his career before he started...compared to Cutler's 4 years of college and 0 passes in real NFL games...not exactly "a year under his belt", and if anything he had less experience than Cutler since he only played 2 years in college. He carried a clipboard for a year watching Elway.

[NYBronc]

By "a year under the belt" I mean, he had somewhat of a grasp of the system.

I didn't intend to make an analogy between Griese and Cutler. I just wanted to answer Atlas.