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View Full Version : Conrad Burns ...... He did screw up


Spider
09-01-2006, 07:59 AM
http://www.missoulian.com/articles/2006/07/27/news/local/news04.txt


HELENA - Republican Sen. Conrad Burns chastised a group of firefighters over the weekend for doing a “poor job” of squelching a 92,000-acre blaze near Billings, a state report shows.

Burns and the firefighters - members of the Augusta Hotshots from the George Washington and Jefferson National Forest in Virginia - were at the Billings Logan International Airport awaiting flights, according to Burns and U.S. Forest Service representatives.
Burns approached the firefighters and told them they had “done a poor job” and “should have listened to the ranchers,” according to a report prepared by Paula Rosenthal, a Montana Department of Natural Resources and Conservation employee who was sent to the airport to speak with the senator.

Rosenthal wrote in her report that she received word of an “altercation” occurring between Burns and the hotshot crew. The crew had been in Montana working on the Bundy Railroad fire near Worden.

The 92,000-acre timber, grass and sagebrush fire was contained on July 19 and the 368 people who came to fight it began dispersing a few days later.

Burns had been in Billings to commemorate the new interpretive center at Pompey's Pillar, the sandstone bluff near the Yellowstone River where explorer William Clark scratched his signature 200 years ago this summer. While there, Burns also met with local ranchers affected by the blaze.

Matt Mackowiak, a spokesman for the senator, said he didn't think Burns met with any of the fire bosses who managed the firefighting response.

Instead, he confronted firefighters waiting for their ride back home.

By the time Rosenthal reached the airport, the interaction had ended, and Rosenthal wrote that the senator was sitting alone with his laptop computer. They talked about his concerns.

Burns said he was unhappy that fires are run out of the National Interagency Fire Center in Boise, Idaho, which he called “ridiculous.”

“The government needs to listen to these ranchers,” the report quotes Burns as saying.

Mary Sexton, director of the Department of Natural Resources and Conservation, said in an interview that the National Interagency Fire Center does not run individual fires, but is the national hub for fire information and available resources. Beneath the Boise center are several regional dispatch centers, including one for the northern Rocky Mountains in Missoula.

Individual fires are managed by fire bosses on the ground, Sexton said.

Burns also said he was concerned that fire bosses don't let ranchers fight fire on their own land.

Rosenthal wrote in her report that she told the senator that “private citizens were integral to our success, as were (volunteer fire departments), county governments” and others.

Sexton said that fire teams - the groups of national and local fire experts who come to manage and fight large fires - cannot and do not tell private landowners what to do. They cannot force them to evacuate or not to fight a wildfire on their own land.

However, Sexton said, fire bosses prefer to know where all people working on a fire are - including landowners - and may ask landowners not to help in the interest of safety.

Burns also said he had heard from one rancher that fire crews on the Bundy Railroad fire put a strip of fire retardant on the edge of Bureau of Land Management land, implying that firefighters were more interested in protecting public land than private.

“The toughest part of the conversation was the point where the senator was critical of a firefighter sitting across from us in the gate area,” Rosenthal's report reads. “I offered to the senator that our firefighters make around $8 to $12 an hour and time-and-a-half for overtime. He seemed a bit surprised that it wasn't higher.”

Rosenthal's report said she would take Burns' concerns back to agency officials, and Burns thanked her for taking the time to listen to him.

Dan Jerome, a spokesman for the U.S. Forest Service in Washington, D.C., said the agency has heard from Burns regarding his concerns.

“Essentially, the senator had some issues with a fire and we heard those,” Jerome said. “He talked to the crew about those. Generally, the place to talk about them is with the Forest Service (officials). Meanwhile, the crew is out fighting fire and we're proud of the work they do.”

Jerome said the agency is working to address Burns' concerns.

Mackowiak said Burns has been hearing from Montanans affected by wildfire for weeks.

“As a result, he very responsibly reaches out to policymakers in Washington to make sure that all coordination is being done in the best and most reasonable manner,” he said.

Burns talked to Undersecretary of Agriculture Mark Rey about his concerns, Mackowiak said, and Rey has since personally called the ranchers with whom Burns spoke. The Forest Service is under the U.S. Department of Agriculture.

Burns wants to make sure that fire policy is “adequate and adaptive,” Mackowiak said, and the senator is pushing for emergency assistance for ranchers and landowners affected by the blazes.

Spider
09-01-2006, 08:00 AM
http://www.newwest.net/index.php/city/article/10273/C8/L8
Conrad Burns Issues Apology for Altercation with Firefighters
By Courtney Lowery, 7-28-06

Sen. Conrad Burns has issued a written apology for having an "altercation" at a Billings airport last weekend with members of a hot shot firefighting crew about the management of a 92,000-acre blaze in eastern Montana.

Jennifer McKee of the Lee State Bureau broke the story on Thursday, reporting on an account from state firefighting operations that Burns criticized a member of the Augusta Hot Shots from Virginia for doing a "poor job" and not listening to ranchers.

Today, Lee's Chuck Johnson reports on the Burns apology and includes this little nugget of a quote from Burns in the original report from the Montana Department of Natural Resources and Conservation: Burns, pointing across the airport at a hot shot is quoted as saying, “See that guy over there? He hasn’t done a God-damned thing. They sit around. I saw it up on the Wedge fire and in northwestern Montana some years ago. It’s wasteful. You probably paid that guy $10,000 to sit around. It’s gotta change.’’

At www.wildlandfire.com, firefighters across the nation are reacting to the Burns comments.

loborugger
09-01-2006, 08:53 AM
Pretty interesting. I used to be a Hot Shot. Yelling at a bunch of Shots is like stock holders yelling at corp janitors when the bottom line tanks.

Most Hot Shots work their A$$ES off for GS-3,4, or maybe 5 pay. They risk life and limb for less than 10 bucks an hour (a concept most senators are completely foreign to). Without a doubt, there is waste in fire management. But it comes in the camps, where you have people inflating hours, trying to get hazard pay they arent entitled to, etc. Not on the line.

Its been almost 10 years now... Lets see. First priority was protection of life. 2nd priority is protection of improvements, ie structures both govt and privately owned. 3rd priority is protection of land - both private and public.

Fires arent run outta NIFC in Boise. Resources are managed there. Fires are handled on site.

A 92,000 acre fire is pretty darn big. Most dont make it 1000 acres. In otherwords, this was not an ez fire to put out. On the fires I worked, we always did our best to defend private property. However, most of the fires I worked that involved private property was homes - not ranches. So, it was a smaller chunk of land.

What isnt addressed here is what exactly were the Rancher's complaints? Was it only the prohibition against fighting fire on their own land? I am little surprised that the fire management team didnt allow ranchers to fight fire on their own land. I am also wondering how they would enforce such an edict. I do know this. It was a decision made for safety sake. A 92,000 acre fire has a lot of potential and can take a whole valley in a matter of minutes. If you have people out there you are not in constant communication with, they could get left behind and burned.

A final parting shot. You rarely hear about arguements like this. That is because normally, fires run very smoothly. Even though you have a host of different agencies... Forest Service, Park Service, BLM, BIA, and a whole tons of state and locals, things run very well, and people usually get along pretty well. Much better than any of my other experiences with govt, ie, military, law enforcement, etc.

Spider
09-01-2006, 09:07 AM
Pretty interesting. I used to be a Hot Shot. Yelling at a bunch of Shots is like stock holders yelling at corp janitors when the bottom line tanks.

Most Hot Shots work their A$$ES off for GS-3,4, or maybe 5 pay. They risk life and limb for less than 10 bucks an hour (a concept most senators are completely foreign to). Without a doubt, there is waste in fire management. But it comes in the camps, where you have people inflating hours, trying to get hazard pay they arent entitled to, etc. Not on the line.

Its been almost 10 years now... Lets see. First priority was protection of life. 2nd priority is protection of improvements, ie structures both govt and privately owned. 3rd priority is protection of land - both private and public.

Fires arent run outta NIFC in Boise. Resources are managed there. Fires are handled on site.

A 92,000 acre fire is pretty darn big. Most dont make it 1000 acres. In otherwords, this was not an ez fire to put out. On the fires I worked, we always did our best to defend private property. However, most of the fires I worked that involved private property was homes - not ranches. So, it was a smaller chunk of land.

What isnt addressed here is what exactly were the Rancher's complaints? Was it only the prohibition against fighting fire on their own land? I am little surprised that the fire management team didnt allow ranchers to fight fire on their own land. I am also wondering how they would enforce such an edict. I do know this. It was a decision made for safety sake. A 92,000 acre fire has a lot of potential and can take a whole valley in a matter of minutes. If you have people out there you are not in constant communication with, they could get left behind and burned.

A final parting shot. You rarely hear about arguements like this. That is because normally, fires run very smoothly. Even though you have a host of different agencies... Forest Service, Park Service, BLM, BIA, and a whole tons of state and locals, things run very well, and people usually get along pretty well. Much better than any of my other experiences with govt, ie, military, law enforcement, etc.

well the mere fact these guys run to fight fires , while the rest of us are getting out of the way ,tells you all you need to know .......
I dont know what the Ranchers complaints were , but I know a few Ranchers ( ex bull hauler ) and it could have been anything with them ............

loborugger
09-01-2006, 09:15 AM
This would be a good spot for...

How do you like BushCo now?

Right???

Spider
09-01-2006, 09:19 AM
This would be a good spot for...

How do you like BushCo now?

Right???

republicans in general ........

loborugger
09-01-2006, 09:24 AM
Hey, we wouldnt be lucky enough that Conrad's middle name is Montgomery? If thats the case, we could call him C. Montgomery Burns. That right there captures the whole of my opinion of the US Senate.

Spider
09-01-2006, 09:31 AM
Hey, we wouldnt be lucky enough that Conrad's middle name is Montgomery? If thats the case, we could call him C. Montgomery Burns. That right there captures the whole of my opinion of the US Senate.
LOL .........

bendog
09-01-2006, 10:21 AM
I'm surprised he isn't in charge of FEMA