Gumbel in trouble for ripping Upshaw

[Clockwork Orange]

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2556517

NEW YORK -- The job status of Bryant Gumbel, scheduled to be the play-by-play broadcaster on the eight late-season games on the NFL's in-house network, could be the subject of a discussion by NFL officials after Gumbel's suggestion that Paul Tagliabue show his successor "where he keeps Gene Upshaw's leash."

Tagliabue said Monday that incoming commissioner Roger Goodell and Steve Bornstein, who runs the NFL Network, will discuss the remarks after Goodell takes office Sept. 1.

Gumbel addressed his closing remarks on HBO's "Real Sports with Bryant Gumbel" last Tuesday to Goodell.

"Before he cleans out his office," Gumbel said. "Have Paul Tagliabue show you where he keeps Gene Upshaw's leash. By making the docile head of the players union his personal pet, your predecessor has kept the peace without giving players the kind of guarantees other pros take for granted. Try to make sure no one competent ever replaces Upshaw on your watch."

Tagliabue's response: "What Gumbel said about Gene Upshaw and our owners is about as irresponsible as anything I've heard in a long time."

Upshaw did not immediately return a call placed by The Associated Press.

However, a number of owners have said that they thought they had given away too much to the union in a last-minute six-year contract extension that added almost a billion dollars in the league's contribution to the players.

And Upshaw told the AP several weeks ago that he was able to get more from the owners than he had agreed to just a few days before the owners finally agreed on the new deal.

Gumbel, once the host of the NBC pregame show and later co-host of "The Today Show," said when he was hired that no restrictions had been put on his ability to comment on what he sees on the field.

"It's a lot like covering any story," he said. "You see what is front of you and you report on it."

The two-year-old NFL Network will televise eight late-season games on Thursday and Saturday nights this season.

[broncofan]

Gumbel is a complete idiot. Anybody who takes his remarks as witty and hard hitting are fooling themselves. I can't even stand to listen to a word he has to say anymore.

[Garcia Bronco]

Nice. While the show has some good pieces on it from time to time... it would be good to see Bryant get the hook. If I were in charge I would extend it to his brother as well.

[bendog]

Gumbell's right, though.

[-Slap-]

Gumbell's right, though.
He was dead on the money. Upshaw's a marshmallow. It was hilarious the way some folks on this board portrayed him as a wild eyed extremist, hell bent on League destruction a few months ago.

[Atlas]

I like Bryant Gumble. What he said might not be entirely true but it is insightful. I don't think anything will be made of it. In 1997 Denver creamed the Faid 31-3 on Monday night. Al Michaels was ripping into Al Davis, wondering when he would give up control of the Faid and then he started saying that the Faid should change their slogan to "A commitment to mediocrity." Davis was fuming after the game and went after Michaels. I don't even think Michaels apologized for his remarks.

[bronco militia]

"Before he cleans out his office," Gumbel said. "Have Paul Tagliabue show you where he keeps Gene Upshaw's leash. By making the docile head of the players union his personal pet, your predecessor has kept the peace without giving players the kind of guarantees other pros take for granted. Try to make sure no one competent ever replaces Upshaw on your watch."

bwahahahah holly crap, that was awesome

[BigPlayShay]

He may be right about Upshaw, but I don't agree that NFL players should be given guarenteed contracts the way NBA, and MLB players are. It just doesn't make sense for the sport. The risk of injury is far greater in Football to be giving away guarenteed contracts. Signing bonuses should suffice. Health Care after football on the other hand, that is somehting the league needs to do somehting about.

[BroncoSoja]

I dont care if Gumbel is right or wrong I hate the dude and am very happy he finally found a way to hang himself so to speak :yayaya:

[Garcia Bronco]

What ever...if you look at the deal...Upshaw did a great job. Gumbal has no business making a remark like that. Gumbal has no idea what is involved nor is he a player or the union rep for the NFLPA.

[-Slap-]

I respect Gumbel for speaking his mind, without regard to future employment. His HBO show has nothing to do with his commitment to the NFL Network for game coverage later this year. I can't wait until the imperious pricks at the next owner's meeting splutter in anger and I hope they cancel Gumbel's contract and he sues their flabby old mantits off.

[bendog]

He was dead on the money. Upshaw's a marshmallow. It was hilarious the way some folks on this board portrayed him as a wild eyed extremist, hell bent on League destruction a few months ago.
Upshaw's just looking for his mealticket. It should be obvious to anyone remotely paying attention that the people getting obscenely wealthy are the owners. A handful of players get what seems to us huge amounts of money, but compared to the take ... not that much. We have 35 individuals and one quasi public corporation taking 42 or 46%. Not that there's anything un-American about that ... besides their holding cities up for stadiums.

However, what's nasty about Upshaw is that the average NFL guy really is selling his health for not all that much money. More than the avg Joe, sure, but the average career is less than five years. The money's all tilted to a few, and the high draft picks. But, because the owners and the payatons are happy, the lower level guys have no juice. And they won't unless some guy like Marvin Miller comes along.

I thought the Duke was wrong on the strike.

[bronco militia]

I respect Gumbel for speaking his mind, without regard to future employment. His HBO show has nothing to do with his commitment to the NFL Network for game coverage later this year. I can't wait until the imperious pricks at the next owner's meeting splutter in anger and I hope they cancel Gumbel's contract and he sues their flabby old manboobies off.

exactly.......from week to week Upshaw rarely stood behind the players when it came to fines and suspensions.

add in the new CBA, and you can see why Gumbel thinks he rolled over....again.

props to Gumbel..even if I rarely ever agree with him

[Taco John]

I like Gumbel and believe he and Simms are the best duo when it comes to calling a game.

[bronco militia]

I like Gumbel and believe he and Simms are the best duo when it comes to calling a game.

wrong Gumbel..

[-Slap-]

Upshaw's just looking for his mealticket. It should be obvious to anyone remotely paying attention that the people getting obscenely wealthy are the owners. A handful of players get what seems to us huge amounts of money, but compared to the take ... not that much. We have 35 individuals and one quasi public corporation taking 42 or 46%. Not that there's anything un-American about that ... besides their holding cities up for stadiums.

However, what's nasty about Upshaw is that the average NFL guy really is selling his health for not all that much money. More than the avg Joe, sure, but the average career is less than five years. The money's all tilted to a few, and the high draft picks. But, because the owners and the payatons are happy, the lower level guys have no juice. And they won't unless some guy like Marvin Miller comes along.

I thought the Duke was wrong on the strike.

I'm sure they've insulated the process to the point where a Marvin Miller isn't even possible anymore. Lucky for them.

You make a really good point, though. The Payatons are happy and they're really the key to the whole thing. As long as Manning, Ray Ray, Champ and the other top names insist on making 10-20 times more than their teammates, the salary structure will remain broken and the guys at the bottom will get screwed, royally in some cases.

We live in a superstar culture that totally supports this type of arrangment, though. This mindset certainly extends beyond the world of sports as CEOs in this country are paid far more handsomely than their peers in other countries.

[defenseman]

He may be right about Upshaw, but I don't agree that NFL players should be given guarenteed contracts the way NBA, and MLB players are. It just doesn't make sense for the sport. The risk of injury is far greater in Football to be giving away guarenteed contracts. Signing bonuses should suffice. Health Care after football on the other hand, that is somehting the league needs to do somehting about.

Fair take, and one of the reasons that the NFL has done so well to date is the fact that, Guaranteed contracts ARE NOT in the picture. MLB is a joke with these contracts, let alone that the owners and such WILL not reign in the likes of the steinbrenners of the world with some hard nosed rules to level the playing field. "king" george continues you to "buy" all stars, pays the fines, because MLB lets him. I have nothing against him personally, I'd do it to if MLB let me and I had the cash. They do need to level the playing field though, some teams have NO chance, and I mean none. The NFL, on the other hand, can say that the playing field is about as level as it gets, short of the few "idiots" and their poor decisions in charge of football teams. These athletes earn way to much as it is from where I sit..dman

*I know , I know, the owners are raking it in, this is true. But, the players do not carry the burden of the "risk" involved with running a major leauge team, the owners do. The players are employees, thats about it in todays MLB. It is out of the box, especially just before the deadline.

[defenseman]

I'm sure they've insulated the process to the point where a Marvin Miller isn't even possible anymore. Lucky for them.

You make a really good point, though. The Payatons are happy and they're really the key to the whole thing. As long as Manning, Ray Ray, Champ and the other top names insist on making 10-20 times more than their teammates, the salary structure will remain broken and the guys at the bottom will get screwed, royally in some cases.

We live in a superstar culture that totally supports this type of arrangment, though. This mindset certainly extends beyond the world of sports as CEOs in this country are paid far more handsomely than their peers in other countries.

Either you are a superstar, or not. IF you are not, better practice. If you are, better continue to perform at that level, or you are gone. I have no problem with accountability. guys at the bottom getting screwed? Earning 1 or 2 mil a year? Throw me in that briar patch getting paid to play a childs game...dman

[bendog]

I'm sure they've insulated the process to the point where a Marvin Miller isn't even possible anymore. Lucky for them.

You make a really good point, though. The Payatons are happy and they're really the key to the whole thing. As long as Manning, Ray Ray, Champ and the other top names insist on making 10-20 times more than their teammates, the salary structure will remain broken and the guys at the bottom will get screwed, royally in some cases.

We live in a superstar culture that totally supports this type of arrangment, though. This mindset certainly extends beyond the world of sports as CEOs in this country are paid far more handsomely than their peers in other countries.

Yes, football's really no different to society. From who wants to be a millionaire to american idol. My Kid asks me how much something costs sometimes, things like mulitmillion dollar houses, so I tell her, and she says 'where do they get all the money.' LOL

I don't know about Marvin Miller. Fifteen years ago, I'd have said he ruined the game. But 'roids aside, baseball's in fine shape. Sure, the game's different with guys changing teams, but the whole fantasy sports thing grew out of that. No doubt that what happened to Curt Flood was wrong, and the system needed change.

It goes in cycles, so maybe it'll change, but the solid truth of it is that there are maybe 5-10% of the players who are off the charts, physically. If teams simply blackballed the bottom 50% of players, I doubt we'd notice a difference. So, so long as the top stars are cool with it, the bottom level get's screwed. The owners just have to make sure they pay the stars enough to keep them from jumping to the Mexican League or World Football League.

[ludo21]

I respect Gumbel for speaking his mind, without regard to future employment. His HBO show has nothing to do with his commitment to the NFL Network for game coverage later this year. I can't wait until the imperious pricks at the next owner's meeting splutter in anger and I hope they cancel Gumbel's contract and he sues their flabby old mantits off.
'

lol

I have no problem with what he said, i like the defiance he showed.

Whats the over/under he aoplogizes by next week?

[Garcia Bronco]

exactly.......from week to week Upshaw rarely stood behind the players when it came to fines and suspensions.

add in the new CBA, and you can see why Gumbel thinks he rolled over....again.

props to Gumbel..even if I rarely ever agree with him

there is an appeal process for fines and suspensions and the union works ith every player in that regard.

[Bronco_Beerslug]

"Before he cleans out his office," Gumbel said. "Have Paul Tagliabue show you where he keeps Gene Upshaw's leash. By making the docile head of the players union his personal pet, your predecessor has kept the peace without giving players the kind of guarantees other pros take for granted. Try to make sure no one competent ever replaces Upshaw on your watch."
Beautiful, and absolutely true!!!!!!!!!!!!

------------------------------------
Average NBA salary is $4.9 million... guaranteed

Average NFL salary is $1,169,470... NOT guaranteed

Average MLB salary is $2.6 million ... guaranteed

[Mediator12]

Its funny, because it is true and everyone knows it. However, the world no longer tolerates truth, just political correctness.

I have said for years that Upshaw is a horrible union president who is a pawn of the mega Agents, sponsors, and elite players. That being said, the other leagues are wrong on Guaranteed contracts not the NFL Mr. Gumbel.

Upshaw's major Failings:

1. There is no way that the elite Players are worth five, let alone up to fifty, times the guys playing with them. They also make up to 50 times more income from local and national endorsements.

2. The state of Veterans benefits, or more correctly lack of benefits, is laughable.

3. The lack of discipline in a league that has around 60% of its players with some form of Substance abuse problems (yes, the latest figures were THAT high). The fact that 17% of the current players in the nfl (2005 figures) have criminal records and are still employed.

4. Despite highly deceptive propaganda, the lack of a competent support system to help NFL players adapt to the unique stressors of a being a professional athlete is appalling. These guys are handed huge amounts of money that is completely squandered within an average of three years of being out of the league. They are ill prepared to handle the notoriety and spotlight that is focused on them 24/7/365. The rookie symposium is getting better every year, but it is not even close to enough.

[-Slap-]

Either you are a superstar, or not. IF you are not, better practice. If you are, better continue to perform at that level, or you are gone. I have no problem with accountability. guys at the bottom getting screwed? Earning 1 or 2 mil a year? Throw me in that briar patch getting paid to play a childs game...dman
That's not the bottom I'm talking about. Do you think the guys on the end of the roster are all making one or two million a year? Some of these guys who wash out leave the game with little more than lifelong physical ailments and whatever education they received in college.

[-Slap-]

Its funny, because it is true and everyone knows it. However, the world no longer tolerates truth, just political correctness.

I have said for years that Upshaw is a horrible union president who is a pawn of the mega Agents, sponsors, and elite players. That being said, the other leagues are wrong on Guaranteed contracts not the NFL Mr. Gumbel.

Upshaw's major Failings:

1. There is no way that the elite Players are worth five, let alone up to fifty, times the guys playing with them. They also make up to 50 times more income from local and national endorsements.

2. The state of Veterans benefits, or more correctly lack of benefits, is laughable.

3. The lack of discipline in a league that has around 60% of its players with some form of Substance abuse problems (yes, the latest figures were THAT high). The fact that 17% of the current players in the nfl (2005 figures) have criminal records and are still employed.

4. Despite highly deceptive propaganda, the lack of a competent support system to help NFL players adapt to the unique stressors of a being a professional athlete is appalling. These guys are handed huge amounts of money that is completely squandered within an average of three years of being out of the league. They are ill prepared to handle the notoriety and spotlight that is focused on them 24/7/365. The rookie symposium is getting better every year, but it is not even close to enough.
Hey, Garcia, read this twice and apply it to the Droughns thread as well.

[bendog]

Hey, Garcia, read this twice and apply it to the Droughns thread as well.
Yeah, but damn, it's something like 20% for African-Americans. I'm not saying its right. I'm saying society is just crazy. Though a lot of that is just stupid stuff and drugs. But, bottom line, society's coming apart from where it was in the early 60s. Dad's just didn't tolerate it. They'd smack ya silly. Not that that was all a good thing either, though. (-:

[-Slap-]

Yeah, but damn, it's something like 20% for African-Americans. I'm not saying its right. I'm saying society is just crazy. Though a lot of that is just stupid stuff and drugs. But, bottom line, society's coming apart from where it was in the early 60s. Dad's just didn't tolerate it. They'd smack ya silly. Not that that was all a good thing either, though. (-:
They were supposed to smack you just enough to teach you a lesson, but not so much that it got good to them. Fine line, especially when the kid's a smartass.

[Mediator12]

Yeah, but damn, it's something like 20% for African-Americans. I'm not saying its right. I'm saying society is just crazy. Though a lot of that is just stupid stuff and drugs. But, bottom line, society's coming apart from where it was in the early 60s. Dad's just didn't tolerate it. They'd smack ya silly. Not that that was all a good thing either, though. (-:

There is a huge difference between applying numbers from one group to another though when there is a selection process. This is social psychology 101 with attribution errors. The internet fosters more attribution errors through cultural complacency and lack of credibility, but in this case you simply can not apply those numbers from one population to the other and be statistically reliable or valid.

[bendog]

There is a huge difference between applying numbers from one group to another though when there is a selection process. This is social psychology 101 with attribution errors. The internet fosters more attribution errors through cultural complacency and lack of credibility, but in this case you simply can not apply those numbers from one population to the other and be statistically reliable or valid.
Ah, ya sorta missed the pt, there med. I'd hazard a guess that more white kids today have records than in the early 60s. In fact, it'd be a bit more than a guess:-*

btw, in googling re this thread I found this gem. I'm not sure how I feel. I'll think on it.

http://www.injuryhelpline.com/index.rwl?category=news&section=workers+compensation&article=nfl+players+estate+to+receive+14+years+of+ back+benefits+from+retirement+plan&id=830

[Rock Chalk]

racist who said he wasnt watching the Winter Olympics because of the lack of black athletes which has nothing to do with racism but more along the lines that black athletes tend to stay away from cold weather sports for whatever reason. Gumble is no better than Limbaugh in my opinion.

I hope Gumble loses his ****ing job. Whether he is right or not I dont care. He is a racist ****nut that should have been fired a long time ago.

[Rock Chalk]

That's not the bottom I'm talking about. Do you think the guys on the end of the roster are all making one or two million a year? Some of these guys who wash out leave the game with little more than lifelong physical ailments and whatever education they received in college.
Life is risk Slap. If you choose to play professional football, you are taking a risk of getting an injury that may be a lifelong problem for you. If you are a bubble kind of guy in college that may go to the NFL, its probably best you get a good degree in something that will earn you a decent wage, study your ass off so that you know your degree instead of having it handed to you like they do at the football factories they call the SEC.

Im in the camp that doesnt feel sorry for any NFL player, superstar or bubble guy who only lasts one training camp. They went to college, they had more opportunities than most people in this country, what they do with that is their choice and they should be held accountable for it. If they breezed through college on easy classes and got a worthless degree in Communications and then flounder in the NFL, **** em. Should have studied harder and worked on something tangible as a backup plan.

Rod Smith is a great example. Bubble guy who just happened to make it but had a backup plan. Not an idiot, but an intelligent guy who did his work legitimately in school and got a legitimate degree. Forgive me if I feel no sympathy for Portis when, in 15 years he is bankrupt and too ****ing stupid to get a real job because his life in college was handed to him.

[bendog]

Alec, I think you're overlooking something. Primarily, keep in mind that the fact is that there is a union. You can be pro-union, anti-union (and I don't want to be in one myself) or neutral. But there is a union. And the union PREVENTS PLAYERS FROM JUMPING TO A NEW LEAGUE because there's the standard player's contract and MOST IMPORTANTLY the League pays the top stars rock star wages.

No one's talking of 'oh you got hurt and didn't make the nfl.' What they're talking about is that the League and the top tier operate to make sure the bottom rung salaries stay low for guys who maybe last 3-5 years and maybe more.

That's the way the system works today. You can say "well, that's free enterprise." BUT THERE'S THE UNION, SO IT'S NOT ABOUT THE MARKET SETTING THE SALARY. The union bottmo line screws it's own members at the bottom.

Now, I'm ready for an anti-union rant, but again, that's missing the pt.

[Northman]

I like Bryant Gumble. What he said might not be entirely true but it is insightful. I don't think anything will be made of it. In 1997 Denver creamed the Faid 31-3 on Monday night. Al Michaels was ripping into Al Davis, wondering when he would give up control of the Faid and then he started saying that the Faid should change their slogan to "A commitment to mediocrity." Davis was fuming after the game and went after Michaels. I don't even think Michaels apologized for his remarks.


I remember that, that was classic! Ha!

[BroncoBuff]

I despise Bryant Gumbel as a person, but he has a point. And he's not expressing a view others haven't expressed elsewhere. He just said it in a funnier, meaner way.

Imo, it's refreshing ... I'm sick of watching Rich Eisen fellate every player and coach that comes within 100 yards of NFL Network's cameras. And it's a good thing they named Goodell when they did - because if Eisen had made one more cute-sy remark about "his candidacy to become commissioner," I would've projectile-vomited my trachea through the nearest window.

[Hercules Rockefeller]

He and his brother can always go do "Beach Justice" if the NFL won't let him call games.

[Dagmar]

He and his brother can always go do "Beach Justice" if the NFL won't let him call games.
Hilarious!
http://www.skapunkandotherjunk.com/images/Icons/fg_gumbel1.jpg http://www.skapunkandotherjunk.com/images/Icons/fg_gumbel2.jpg

[broncocalijohn]

I cant comment to much on the nFL and Gumbel because i cant watch a sport where there arent any white guys. The NFL looks like a NAACP convention. Gumbel knows what i am talking about.

http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showthread.php?t=38150&highlight=gumbel+olympics

[GonzoLays]

racist who said he wasnt watching the Winter Olympics because of the lack of black athletes which has nothing to do with racism but more along the lines that black athletes tend to stay away from cold weather sports for whatever reason. Gumble is no better than Limbaugh in my opinion.

I hope Gumble loses his ****ing job. Whether he is right or not I dont care. He is a racist ****nut that should have been fired a long time ago.

Wow. Gumble is a racist? hahahaha What did he ever say that was racist?

[Dr. Broncenstein]

"White people like Wayne Brady because he makes Bryant Gumble look like Malcom X" --- Paul Mooney

[Atlas]

Wow. Gumble is a racist? hahahaha What did he ever say that was racist?


For a white guy Gumble seems pretty liberal to me. I never would have thought him hating blacks.

[fdf]

Gumbel is a complete idiot. Anybody who takes his remarks as witty and hard hitting are fooling themselves. I can't even stand to listen to a word he has to say anymore.

He's always had this silly 60's "Power to the People" type spin in pretty much whatever he says. I think he actually believes it. It's kind of hard for me to see Ashley Lelie or Peyton Manning as the oppressed proletariat. But Bryant seems to be able to convince himself about pretty much anything.

[Bronco_Beerslug]

He's always had this silly 60's "Power to the People" type spin in pretty much whatever he says. I think he actually believes it. It's kind of hard for me to see Ashley Lelie or Peyton Manning as the oppressed proletariat. But Bryant seems to be able to convince himself about pretty much anything.
It's pretty obvious he wasn't talking about Manning or Lelie as oppressed wage earners.

[Garcia Bronco]

Hilarious!
http://www.skapunkandotherjunk.com/images/Icons/fg_gumbel1.jpg http://www.skapunkandotherjunk.com/images/Icons/fg_gumbel2.jpg


Gumble and Gumble...hell yeah

[Garcia Bronco]

racist who said he wasnt watching the Winter Olympics because of the lack of black athletes which has nothing to do with racism but more along the lines that black athletes tend to stay away from cold weather sports for whatever reason. Gumble is no better than Limbaugh in my opinion.

I hope Gumble loses his ****ing job. Whether he is right or not I dont care. He is a racist ****nut that should have been fired a long time ago.

He is a racist. That much is certain

[broncogary]

4. Despite highly deceptive propaganda, the lack of a competent support system to help NFL players adapt to the unique stressors of a being a professional athlete is appalling. These guys are handed huge amounts of money that is completely squandered within an average of three years of being out of the league. They are ill prepared to handle the notoriety and spotlight that is focused on them 24/7/365. The rookie symposium is getting better every year, but it is not even close to enough.

You're killing me, Smalls! :welcome:

[sirhcyennek81]

So says Gumbel, the talking head. F'ing A...


:Broncos:

[Rock Chalk]

Alec, I think you're overlooking something. Primarily, keep in mind that the fact is that there is a union. You can be pro-union, anti-union (and I don't want to be in one myself) or neutral. But there is a union. And the union PREVENTS PLAYERS FROM JUMPING TO A NEW LEAGUE because there's the standard player's contract and MOST IMPORTANTLY the League pays the top stars rock star wages.

No one's talking of 'oh you got hurt and didn't make the nfl.' What they're talking about is that the League and the top tier operate to make sure the bottom rung salaries stay low for guys who maybe last 3-5 years and maybe more.

That's the way the system works today. You can say "well, that's free enterprise." BUT THERE'S THE UNION, SO IT'S NOT ABOUT THE MARKET SETTING THE SALARY. The union bottmo line screws it's own members at the bottom.

Now, I'm ready for an anti-union rant, but again, that's missing the pt.
Somehow I doubt that 100K a year is getting screwed bendog, even for minimum wage in teh NFL. If the union bottom line screws its own members, well, yeah thats the union's fault but cry me a freakin river if getting 100K a year is getting screwed. The average income in this country is less than 40K a year and I know damn sure good and well that anyone who has lasted 3-5 years in teh NFL is making more than 40K.

100K a year for 3-5 years and my education I would be rich in 5 years after leaving football. If these stupid ****s dont realize the opportunity they got, even if they are "getting screwed" as you imply, then well, they deserve to be bankrupt.

[Jagrego]

What ever...if you look at the deal...Upshaw did a great job. Gumbal has no business making a remark like that. Gumbal has no idea what is involved nor is he a player or the union rep for the NFLPA.
True and good point. However, in this day and age, if your not making headlines your not making money.

[kappys]

Somehow I doubt that 100K a year is getting screwed bendog, even for minimum wage in teh NFL. If the union bottom line screws its own members, well, yeah thats the union's fault but cry me a freakin river if getting 100K a year is getting screwed. The average income in this country is less than 40K a year and I know damn sure good and well that anyone who has lasted 3-5 years in teh NFL is making more than 40K.

100K a year for 3-5 years and my education I would be rich in 5 years after leaving football. If these stupid ****s dont realize the opportunity they got, even if they are "getting screwed" as you imply, then well, they deserve to be bankrupt.


Alec's on the money with this one. Look ata guy like Glen Cadrez, basically a career backup with is quite wealthy thanks to the fact that the actually saved his money and invested it in real estate rather than squandering it on a "crib" True he isn't the typical NFL player either since he stuck it out quite a few years, but the example is valid.

So the player who washeses out after 2 years in the NFL is left with what? An arthritic knee 500,000 dollars, and a free college education. Compare that to a guy who lets say went to a reasonably priced state school now has $75,000 in debt and a $50,000 a year job. Why should the NFL have to baby these guys their entire lives? Average Americans don't get that. They are expected to live responsibly.

[bendog]

Somehow I doubt that 100K a year is getting screwed bendog, even for minimum wage in teh NFL. If the union bottom line screws its own members, well, yeah thats the union's fault but cry me a freakin river if getting 100K a year is getting screwed. The average income in this country is less than 40K a year and I know damn sure good and well that anyone who has lasted 3-5 years in teh NFL is making more than 40K.

100K a year for 3-5 years and my education I would be rich in 5 years after leaving football. If these stupid ****s dont realize the opportunity they got, even if they are "getting screwed" as you imply, then well, they deserve to be bankrupt.
Whatever you say, Alec. (not)

The fact is the NFL players don't earn what their counterparts do, and the guys getting the minimum first pay taxes and the agent. Moreover, if you've ever seen the guys on an average NCAAI squad, you know you're not talking about a lot of academic scholarship material. Back in Wyo the faculty would joke that but for football most of those guys would either be working in a convenience store or in jail.

Moreover you're saying "well, they make a lot of money" is a: just your view from your cubicle and b: irrelevant to the situation. So, you'd take what they get, but so what. That's not the issue. The issue is whether the union's getting them the best deal they can get.

The idea of a union is to make sure the owners have to pay the absolute most they can and still stay in biz. I know you dislike the idea of unionization, but it's a fact the union exists, and but for the union, the League would fall apart, because there'd be no reason one team couldn't buy more players and no way revenue sharing could legally be ok.

As a union head Upshaw sucks, and he always has. But, his goal has always been to avoid strikes, and he's never tried to build the solidarity between the top stars and regular guys. Contrast the NFL to MLB. In MLB players will say over and over stuff like, 'well, yeah we'd like to cave cause we have a good deal, but we owe it to the guys who came before us who fought for the pay and the guys who will come after us." You NEVER hear an NFL guy say that about his union.

[Garcia Bronco]

If contracts in the NFL were guranteed then they would get paid less because of the nature of the sport.


Average NBA salary is $4.9 million... guaranteed - League plays 83 games - less players per roster than NFL

Average NFL salary is $1,169,470... NOT guaranteed - League plays 16 games - most players per roster

Average MLB salary is $2.6 million ... guaranteed - League plays 100 plus games - less players per roster

[Rock Chalk]

Whatever you say, Alec. (not)

The fact is the NFL players don't earn what their counterparts do, and the guys getting the minimum first pay taxes and the agent. Moreover, if you've ever seen the guys on an average NCAAI squad, you know you're not talking about a lot of academic scholarship material. Back in Wyo the faculty would joke that but for football most of those guys would either be working in a convenience store or in jail.

Whose fault is that? Its the NFLs job now to make sure these kids do their homework and take pride in their own education? Blame the parents, not the NFL union


Moreover you're saying "well, they make a lot of money" is a: just your view from your cubicle and b: irrelevant to the situation. So, you'd take what they get, but so what. That's not the issue. The issue is whether the union's getting them the best deal they can get.

No, what is irrelevant is YOUR lack of information. Upshaw has increased the average NFL salary by 132% over the last 5 years. The MLBs increase in salary has only went up 71%, so how is Upshaw a pet to Tagliabue which is what this whole conversaiton is about? You hating on the owners because they make millions upon millions of dollars? That would be very liberal of you.

The idea of a union is to make sure the owners have to pay the absolute most they can and still stay in biz. I know you dislike the idea of unionization, but it's a fact the union exists, and but for the union, the League would fall apart, because there'd be no reason one team couldn't buy more players and no way revenue sharing could legally be ok.

The idea of the union is to rape business owners as much as they can, period. It USED to be to get fair wages for the work accomplished, but that hasnt been the goal of unions nationwide for over 60 years now.

As a union head Upshaw sucks, and he always has. But, his goal has always been to avoid strikes, and he's never tried to build the solidarity between the top stars and regular guys. Contrast the NFL to MLB. In MLB players will say over and over stuff like, 'well, yeah we'd like to cave cause we have a good deal, but we owe it to the guys who came before us who fought for the pay and the guys who will come after us." You NEVER hear an NFL guy say that about his union.
You are very uninformed. You would never hear most union workers say that about their union. My pops works in a union and he has never said "Hey, I owe it to those guys that came before me" because while what those guys that came before him did was a good thing for the worker, it is in no way relevant to what unions have become in today's society.

[bendog]

Whose fault is that? Its the NFLs job now to make sure these kids do their homework and take pride in their own education? Blame the parents, not the NFL union

No, what is irrelevant is YOUR lack of information. Upshaw has increased the average NFL salary by 132% over the last 5 years. The MLBs increase in salary has only went up 71%, so how is Upshaw a pet to Tagliabue which is what this whole conversaiton is about? You hating on the owners because they make millions upon millions of dollars? That would be very liberal of you.

The idea of the union is to rape business owners as much as they can, period. It USED to be to get fair wages for the work accomplished, but that hasnt been the goal of unions nationwide for over 60 years now.

You are very uninformed. You would never hear most union workers say that about their union. My pops works in a union and he has never said "Hey, I owe it to those guys that came before me" because while what those guys that came before him did was a good thing for the worker, it is in no way relevant to what unions have become in today's society.
Well, you've succiently shown why any American company with competition and unionization is failing, but again that has NOTHIGN to do with professional sports.

but that was a nice thing you did going down to Houston.

[TexanBob]

racist who said he wasnt watching the Winter Olympics because of the lack of black athletes which has nothing to do with racism but more along the lines that black athletes tend to stay away from cold weather sports for whatever reason. Gumble is no better than Limbaugh in my opinion.

I hope Gumble loses his ****ing job. Whether he is right or not I dont care. He is a racist ****nut that should have been fired a long time ago.

The ratings on almost every show he appeared on tanks. That's why he's doing HBO instead of NBC or CBS. HBO has subscibers, not ratings, so they can allow Gumble to spout his bile without fear of retribution. I hope NFL Network cans him though. Who wants to listen to him do play-by-play when he hasn't done it in a quarter-century? I'd rather it be Tim McCarver - and I hate Tim McCarver. He's as relevant to the NFL as Bryant Gumbel.

[Circle Orange]

Gumbell is a loudmouthed, opinionated tool...he's Bob Costas with a glaze.