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Atlas
08-07-2006, 10:46 AM
I know a lot of people here were slamming poster for slamming these soldiers. Innocent until proven guilty they said, Well, I guess it is very safe to say that the guys need to be severly punished for what they did.

[size=4]Investigator: Drinking preceded killings[/soze]

SoCals link:http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060807/ap_on_re_mi_ea/iraq_rape_slaying_16;_ylt=AnlB0VKHGEltPPQg5m6bNwhs bEwB;_ylu=X3oDMTBiMW04NW9mBHNlYwMlJVRPUCUl

By RYAN LENZ, Associated Press Writer
45 minutes ago



BAGHDAD, Iraq - U.S. soldiers accused of raping and murdering a 14-year-old Iraqi girl drank alcohol and hit golf balls before the attack, an investigator said Monday at a U.S. military hearing to determine whether they should stand trial.

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Criminal investigator Benjamin Bierce said he interviewed one of the accused, Spc. James P. Barker, on June 30, and recorded graphic and brutal details of the alleged assault on March 12.

Bierce was testifying on the second day of the hearing to determine whether five U.S. soldiers must stand trial in the rape-slaying of Abeer Qassim al-Janabi and the killing of her father, Qassim Hamza; her mother, Fikhriya Taha; and her 5-year-old sister, Hadeel Qassim Hamza, in the town of Mahmoudiya, one of the most violent areas in Iraq.

The rape and murders are among the worst in a series of cases of alleged misconduct by U.S. service members that have tarnished the American military.

Barker's sworn and signed statement was submitted as evidence during the hearing and Bierce revealed portions during his testimony.

Barker is accused along with Sgt. Paul E. Cortez, Pfc. Jesse V. Spielman, Pfc. Bryan L. Howard of rape and murder. Another soldier, Sgt. Anthony W. Yribe, is accused of failing to report the attack but is not alleged to have been a direct participant.

Former Pfc. Steven D. Green was discharged from the Army for a "personality disorder" after the incident and was arrested in North Carolina in June on rape and murder charges. He has pleaded not guilty in federal court and is being held without bond.

At Monday's hearing, Pfc. Justin Watt testified that Howard told him before the incident that Green, Cortez and Barker had planned to rape a girl, and Howard was to be the lookout.

"There's nothing I've read that says what to do if your buddies have raped and murdered a family," Watt said.

Another investigator, Michael Hood, testified that he interviewed Spielman, who denied shooting or having sex with anyone in the house. Spielman passed a lie detector test, Hood said.

According to Barker's sworn statement cited by Bierce, Green not only raped the girl but also shot her and her family members after telling his comrades repeatedly that he wanted to kill some Iraqis.

Bierce testified that on the day of the attack, Barker, Cortez, Spielman and Green had been playing cards and drinking Iraqi whiskey mixed with an energy drink. Afterward, they practiced hitting golf balls, Bierce quoted Barker as saying in his statement.

Bierce said Barker's statement made it clear that Green was very persistent about killing some Iraqis and kept bringing up the idea. At some point, they decided to go to the house of Abeer, whom they had seen passing by their checkpoint earlier.

According to Bierce, Barker told him that when they arrived at the house, Abeer and her father were outside. Spielman grabbed Abeer while Green seized her father and took them into the house, Bierce said, quoting Barker. Cortez and Barker also went in.

Green took the father, mother and the younger sister into the bedroom and closed the door, while Abeer remained in the living room with the others.

Barker wrote that Cortez pushed Abeer to the floor, lifted her dress and tore off her underwear while she struggled, Bierce said. Cortez appeared to rape her, according to Barker's statement, Bierce said.

Barker then tried to rape the girl, Bierce said. Suddenly, the group heard gunshots. According to Barker's statement, which was read by Bierce, Green came out of the bedroom, holding an AK-47 rifle, and declared: "They're all dead. I just killed them."

Green put the gun down, then raped Abeer while Cortez held her down; Barker claims Green picked up the AK-47 and shot her once, paused, then shot her several more times, Bierce said.

Barker confirmed he got a kerosene lamp and poured the fuel on the girl's body, Bierce said. The body was set on fire, but Barker does not say who did it. Barker's statement also does not say if Howard or Spielman participated in the rape.

Barker's statement says he grilled chicken wings when they got back to their checkpoint, Bierce testified. A few hours later, Barker wrote, Iraqi soldiers came to report they had found a family murdered.

Since the case became public last month, U.S. officials have said they were concerned it could strain relations with Iraq's new government if Iraqis perceive that the soldiers receive lenient treatment.

The Americans have offered assurances that the case will be pursued vigorously and that the soldiers will be punished if convicted.

The case has already increased demands for changes in an agreement that exempts U.S. soldiers from prosecution in Iraqi courts. And Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki has demanded an independent investigation into the case.

Rigs11
08-07-2006, 11:32 AM
And now for some reaction rightie style;
'Stop bashing the troops waa waa" "You're anti-american"''

Crushaholic
08-07-2006, 11:39 AM
And now for some reaction rightie style;
'Stop bashing the troops waa waa" "You're anti-american"''

My reaction is that it's sad this incident happened. The perpetrators need to be punished, if they are guilty. There are plenty of GOOD people over there doing what they are supposed to be doing...

alkemical
08-07-2006, 02:12 PM
in some ways, by killing the family with the rape included - they saved the family shame from muslim law.

epicSocialism4tw
08-07-2006, 02:15 PM
in some ways, by killing the family with the rape included - they saved the family shame from muslim law.

(rimshot)

alkemical
08-07-2006, 02:40 PM
I like to show that i hate everyone. ;)

Atlas
08-07-2006, 04:01 PM
in some ways, by killing the family with the rape included - they saved the family shame from muslim law.

Well, they still have cousins and uncles and Grandparents that feel plenty of shame. I guess these guys should have done a more thorough job and killed them all.

ant1999e
08-07-2006, 04:46 PM
Give us time.

errand
08-07-2006, 07:31 PM
And now for some reaction rightie style;
'Stop bashing the troops waa waa" "You're anti-american"''

You're a clown, dude. Nobody ever said that if these guys were guilty they shouldn't be punished. We blast your presumption of their guilt. We blast your accusations that soldiers committing atrocities is systemic of the US military.

You weren't there and neither was I....so to speculate on their guilt or innocence is pretty ignorant if you ask me.

For someone who claims to have been there, this eyewitness sure doesn't know alot of what happened. Can't recall who helped in the rape, or who lit the corpse on fire, etc. Wouldn't you expect someone who had committed such a heinous crime would recall alot more details than this? I would. Hell, serial killers can recall all the dumping sites of their victims.


BTW does anyone know if he was offered immunity for his testimony?

spdirty
08-07-2006, 07:52 PM
Man, if these guys actually did this, its horrible. Reminds me of that movie "Casualties of War" with Michael J Fox. Man, I just hope that the monsters that did this get their cummupins. horrible.

Rigs11
08-07-2006, 08:39 PM
You're a clown, dude. Nobody ever said that if these guys were guilty they shouldn't be punished. We blast your presumption of their guilt. We blast your accusations that soldiers committing atrocities is systemic of the US military.

You weren't there and neither was I....so to speculate on their guilt or innocence is pretty ignorant if you ask me.

For someone who claims to have been there, this eyewitness sure doesn't know alot of what happened. Can't recall who helped in the rape, or who lit the corpse on fire, etc. Wouldn't you expect someone who had committed such a heinous crime would recall alot more details than this? I would. Hell, serial killers can recall all the dumping sites of their victims.


BTW does anyone know if he was offered immunity for his testimony?
Actually if you spent actual time reading the posts you would realize that there are alot of people on this board that think we shouldn't question anything that the troops or the goverment do.There are plenty that instantly bring up the "it's war" copout. If I'm a clown, you're the ringleader.

Spider
08-07-2006, 09:24 PM
wish we all was wrong on this .......... everyone knows my stance on Iraq , iwouold blame this on the leadership and not the Marines themselfs ....... lack of dicipline , lack of a safe zone , we dropped these men and women into a meat grinder , getting fire from all sides , not knowing who to trust ........... I know someone will bring up WW2 and say hey blah ,blah, blah ......... well those guys in WW2 were in a totaly different war ,different set of rules ............But these marines will be the whipping boy for the poor planning and execution of Bush's little play thing.......called the Iraqi war ............good men and women going down for that piece of shít .............

mhgaffney
08-07-2006, 10:04 PM
I posted a thread on this last week and the knee jerks blasted me because they didn't like the message. So typical.

The LA Times carried a long article the other day about the 320 proven cases of US atrocities in Viet Nam -- and there were undoubtedly many others -- this was only the total that the army documented. Yet, very little was ever done about it. Sargent Calley was the sacrificial lamb. Meanwhile the officers who gave the orders and the policy makers in Washington who concocted the disastrous war walked away scott free.

And because we as a nation didn't deal with it then we are reliving now in Iraq. History is repeating itself and damn few Americans are aware this is the case.

Atlas
08-07-2006, 10:17 PM
I posted some time ago that what I noticed when I was over there was that Sargents have a lot of power over there even more than Captains because they have the ear and undying loyalty of their men. I saw a lot of sh!t over there where the Sargents and their men did sh!t then just covered for each other and nothing ever came of it. When I heard this I new there would be a Sargent involved (there was 2) because they have the power, authority and arrogance to think that they could get away with it.

I remember some of the meetings we used to have before we went out on convoys and the Lt. would come in and give his speech about United Nations rules of engagement and what procedure was then after the meeting the Sargent running the convoy would have his own meeting with the men and needless to say their definition of rules of engagement was different than the United Nations.

Too me the biggest problem of the Army is the power that Sargents carry and how totally unprofessional some of them are.

L.A. BRONCOS FAN
08-08-2006, 12:13 AM
You're a clown, dude. Nobody ever said that if these guys were guilty they shouldn't be punished.

ROFL!

Like hell you haven't!

Whenever anything like this comes up, your response is invariably "why are you 'casting aspersions' on our brave troops?"

We blast your presumption of their guilt.

Another bullsh_t claim.

Pointing out accusations and evidence to support them isn't the same thing as rendering a verdict.


We blast your accusations that soldiers committing atrocities is systemic of the US military.

:bs:

Show me where anyone on this forum ever said any such thing.

Damn, are lies and bullsh_t like this all Bush supporters like you have left?

Atlas
08-08-2006, 01:45 AM
ROFL!

Like hell you haven't!

Whenever anything like this comes up, your response is invariably "why are you 'casting aspersions' on our brave troops?"



Another bullsh_t claim.

Pointing out accusations and evidence to support them isn't the same thing as rendering a verdict.



:bs:

Show me where anyone on this forum ever said any such thing.

Damn, are lies and bullsh_t like this all Bush supporters like you have left?

Your right. Posting these stories doesn't mean we are communists.

I like how Christian Right say well the terrorist cut off peoples heads all we did was strip them naked and take picures.... It never dawns on them that as Americans we should be better than them. We should be more honorable. The actions of these soldiers shouldn't be defended or excused. Every American should be ashamed at their actions.

It's funny to me how the Christian right in America is so easily ready to accept death and murder. I remember Bush being asked how many Iraqi civilians did he think have been killed and he just kind of shrugged his shoulders and said 30,000. What an ass. Of course he lowballed it by a 2/3 but what do you expect?