Williams will focus on strong side

[SoCalBronco]

broncos notes
Williams will focus on strong side
By Tom Kensler
Denver Post Staff Writer



Why would anybody fiddle with a Broncos defense that yielded just 16.1 points per game last season and returns every starter except Trevor Pryce?

The fun answer is: Football coaches simply can't help themselves.

The real answer is: There always is room for improvement.

Mike Shanahan's latest tweak has linebacker D.J. Williams staying put. Williams, a third-year pro, will remain on the tight end side (strong side) this season, Shanahan said.

That will enable veteran Ian Gold to stay on the weak side. Williams and Gold played both positions last season while flanking middle linebacker Al Wilson.

"D.J. and Ian flip-flopped last year, so this is a little something we're doing different," Shana- han said Friday after a two-hour team workout at Dove Valley.

Although the Broncos' linebacker corps rates among the NFL's best, the hope is that the trio will become even more effective when each player is able to concentrate on one set of responsibilities.

Williams' statistical production fell dramatically last season compared with his spectacular debut season. As a 2004 rookie playing mostly on the weak side, Williams became the first Bronco in 32 years to lead the team in tackles, joining Tom Graham (who tied Lyle Alzado in 1972) as the only rookies in franchise history to accomplish that. Of his 114 stops in the regular season, 82 were unassisted.

Last season, after Gold returned to the Broncos, Williams slid to sixth on the team in regular-season tackles with 68, including 44 solo.

Regardless of Williams' slimmer stats, Shanahan said the former first-round draft choice from Miami played "very well" last season.

"Stats don't always reflect how well a guy plays," Shanahan said. "Sometimes they just reflect where the point of attack was."

Williams declined an interview request, but Shanahan said the California native never became discouraged. The Broncos secured early leads in many games last season and Williams often became the odd man out - coming off the field when the defense switched to a nickel package.

"Players know when they're playing well and doing their job; they don't have to be told that," Shanahan said. "D.J. did a really good job and he knew that."

Still, linebackers with 68 tackles don't earn many Pro Bowl votes. Perhaps settling into one spot will get Williams more involved this fall. A 6-foot-1, 242-pounder, Williams can hold his ground better against tight ends than the 6-foot, 223-pound Gold.

"I'm looking




--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Advertisement


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------




for D.J. to have a great year," Shanahan said. "He can run. He's a great athlete. He's done a great job since he's been here."
In 2004, Williams ranked third in voting for NFL defensive rookie of the year, behind winner and former University of Miami teammate Jonathan Vilma, a linebacker with the New York Jets, and Houston Texans cornerback Dunta Robinson.

Williams became the only rookie to earn an NFL defensive player of the week honor, in Week 16. A former USA Today national high school defensive player of the year, Williams recorded more than five tackles in only three of 16 regular-season games last season.

"D.J.'s time will come," Wilson said. "He's definitely going to be the man."

Learning curve

Shanahan said rookie quarterback Jay Cutler is progressing on schedule.

"It's a learning process, but he's done a good job," Shanahan said Friday as the first week of team camp workouts concluded. "It's just going to take a lot of repetitions."

Nothing in the Broncos' playbook has been held back from Cutler, a first-round pick from Vanderbilt.

"We've thrown it all at him, and after next week, Jay will need to study for two or three weeks," Shanahan said.

Asked whether Cutler must learn three or four times as much as he did at Vandy, Shanahan grinned.

"Oh, I'd say much more than that," he said.

Cutler joked that he planned to curl up with a good book this weekend - the Broncos' playbook.

Footnotes

The team camp concludes with workouts Tuesday, Wednesday and Thursday. ... Disgruntled fifth-year wideout Ashley Lelie continued to be AWOL. When Shanahan was asked by a media member if Lelie's status had changed, the coach replied, "I don't know, you tell me."

Tom Kensler can be reached at 303-820-5456 or tkensler@denverpost.com.

http://www.denverpost.com/broncos/ci_3897645


thwack :thumbsdow :cuss: :bash: :gus: :moody:

Its ok, just wait three more years, it wont be that long. I feel terrible for him, but at least he is dealing with it the right way, just doing as he is told the best he can. ****ing Shanny, you will regret this ****, I can promise you. And here I was hoping the staff would wake the **** up. Instead, he wont even get ANY chances on the weak side.

[Drek]

Why should he play weakside? Please explain that. Weakside is for scrubs. Strong side covers the TE, a growing weapon throughout the league and a major weapon in the AFC West. Ian can't, DJ can. I don't see why you hate DJ playing strong side so much, he's going to contribute more to the team playing from the strong side.

[bpc]

I think its funny how there isn't any quotes from DJ about the move. :) I think his thinking might be very much like Socal's. There is no doubt though... you make more plays on the weakside.

[youcandoit1687]

i agree with drek. weakside makes the plays and DJ could def do that but gold does it about equally well. strongside makes some plays and covers the TE which williams does way better than gold. gold is a great will and i believe the coaches have it right unless we get somebody better than gold. id just assume we leave DJ at sam or mike when al retires(years off i know but still). the point is we have a pretty young LB corps, play it to its best AS A WHOLE

[Ray Finkle]

I could really give a crap what DJ thinks as long as he performs....He didn't have the impact two years ago at WS that Gold did last year. It's a team game and sometimes you have to suck it up and play where the coaches ask you to. He is getting paid big bucks to play a game so I don't give a s**t what he thinks as long as he performs...

[Billy Clyde Puckett]

Why should he play weakside? Please explain that. Weakside is for scrubs. Strong side covers the TE, a growing weapon throughout the league and a major weapon in the AFC West. Ian can't, DJ can. I don't see why you hate DJ playing strong side so much, he's going to contribute more to the team playing from the strong side.

Yep and he will go to the Pro bowl this year as a SSLB. Sure his "numbers" are down, but his value is way up. Individual stats, especially on defense, mean nothing.

[12th man]

I think its funny how there isn't any quotes from DJ about the move. :) I think his thinking might be very much like Socal's. There is no doubt though... you make more plays on the weakside.
If you think about it, DJ hardly ever speaks to the media. ever. Kind of weird for a star out of "The U."

[cutthemdown]

broncos have 2 weakside linebackers and one of them plays strongside. It's not a problem because are linebacking is based on speed more then size at all 2 linebacker spots. Al Wilson wasnt suppossed to be able to play middle remember? People said he was too small and too short but heart wins out over size sometimes. I think Gold and Williams fit into that mold.

[12th man]

broncos have 2 weakside linebackers and one of them plays strongside. It's not a problem because are linebacking is based on speed more then size at all 2 linebacker spots. Al Wilson wasnt suppossed to be able to play middle remember? People said he was too small and too short but heart wins out over size sometimes. I think Gold and Williams fit into that mold.
me too. DJ did alright last year at his new spot, nothing spectacular but solid. I think he's going to be better this year. Plus the guy is a beast and has heart, so I think he's going to be great at that spot. Things are where they need to be. I don't think Ian is as good as DJ in coverage, both do extremly well on the weakside, making plays and getting to the qb,but DJ is better than Ian on the strongside. Otherwise, shanny would put DJ back on the weakside. It worked out ok last year, and this year should be better just cause DJ will know is position a little better.

[-Slap-]

broncos have 2 weakside linebackers and one of them plays strongside. It's not a problem because are linebacking is based on speed more then size at all 2 linebacker spots. Al Wilson wasnt suppossed to be able to play middle remember? People said he was too small and too short but heart wins out over size sometimes. I think Gold and Williams fit into that mold.
It would be nice to have a linebacker we could line up and point at the quarterback that offenses would have to account for without stifling laughter. Gold is only effective as a blitzer if the offense has no idea he's coming.

[Cito Pelon]

'"Stats don't always reflect how well a guy plays," Shanahan said. "Sometimes they just reflect where the point of attack was."'

So teams were attacking wherever Gold was, is that what he is saying?

"The Broncos secured early leads in many games last season and Williams often became the odd man out - coming off the field when the defense switched to a nickel package."

So, does Ian play in nickel, and DJ's on the sideline? If that's the case, I guess I just have to say the coaches know better what will work for the team. I was under the impression DJ is a better all-around player than Gold, though.

[Play2win]

I bet DJ comes in with a little more mass on him. I bet he starts to fit into the pure SSLB Role. I bet he will be a weapon against all the new wrinkles in today's "Innovative" NFL offenses. GOLD has extreme suddenness. Al Wilson is, well, Al Wilson. We get a big, strong DT next to Warren, who knows, maybe VEAL can develop into that guy... Then our D will be able to combat a lot of the things offenses try to do nowadays... and get lots of TURNOVERS!!! :militia:

[Play2win]

'"Stats don't always reflect how well a guy plays," Shanahan said. "Sometimes they just reflect where the point of attack was."'

So teams were attacking wherever Gold was, is that what he is saying?


NO. GOLD just gets to the play better than most. Suddenness. GOLD has it.

The play doesn't make GOLD. GOLD makes the Play. Hence the word PLAYMAKER...

This Trio I think has a good combination of different strengths and skills that support each other exceedingly well. And they all share one thing in common: S P E E D

[cutthemdown]

It would be nice to have a linebacker we could line up and point at the quarterback that offenses would have to account for without stifling laughter. Gold is only effective as a blitzer if the offense has no idea he's coming.
This has merit but really in a 4-3 linebacking doesnt blitz all that much. What we need is for our front 4 to get pressure without blitzing.

[Kaylore]

I actually believe that DJ can be a top flight Sam linebacker. I just think he would rather play Wil. Hopefully he becomes one of the best.

[SoCalBronco]

It would be wise for Shanahan to draft a few LBs in the next couple of drafts. You always gotta plan ahead. Not in the first round ofcourse, but maybe in the mid rounds. Get some more youngsters on the roster and let them learn for a few years so that you dont have a major crisis when the entirety of the current group is gone roughly all at the same time (Gold will probably not be gone, as he will be about 31 at that point, but definitely on the downside, without a good deal of his current speed).

[watermock]

The only problem with moving D.J. to Sam is going to be the same one we are having with Lelie. Thats the major reason I was confused about the move for Gold. Gold is perfectly capable no matter what Slappy says, it's just that D.J is obviously unhappy but he's biting his tounge. If you wern't such a Hurricane homer I could take you a bit more seiously, but I agree that it might be hard to keep him here.

[Cito Pelon]

NO. GOLD just gets to the play better than most. Suddenness. GOLD has it.

The play doesn't make GOLD. GOLD makes the Play. Hence the word PLAYMAKER...

This Trio I think has a good combination of different strengths and skills that support each other exceedingly well. And they all share one thing in common: S P E E D

Well, I tell you what, if I was a DC, I'd be looking to make plays on Gold more often than on DJ. Gold can be suckered and moved out of the way a lot more easily than DJ.

[Garcia Bronco]

Well, I tell you what, if I was a DC, I'd be looking to make plays on Gold more often than on DJ. Gold can be suckered and moved out of the way a lot more easily than DJ.


And you'd be looking to get beat too.

[Cito Pelon]

And you'd be looking to get beat too.

I just don't see Gold as a solid LB. DJ can play either side, Gold has to be protected. The bang for the buck isn't there with Gold.

[Play2win]

I think gold is going to create alot of turnovers this year. He closes soooo fassstttt... He'll make plays next year...

[SportinOne]

I just don't see Gold as a solid LB. DJ can play either side, Gold has to be protected. The bang for the buck isn't there with Gold.

Weak side is considered easier, therefore the worst player should play there.. that's Ian.

Bang for the buck? what are you talking about

[SoCalBronco]

Unfortuneatly, there does not seem to be a viable remedy for this problem even if the staff were to come to its senses. :(

[youcandoit1687]

Weak side is considered easier, therefore the worst player should play there.. that's Ian.

Bang for the buck? what are you talking about

no, not neccessarily. weakside is generally the faster of the two players and therefore the smaller. strongside is the bigger, not as fast player of the two. not sure the speed but DJ has about 20 lbs on gold so DJ should be strongside. just by looking, i say gold is faster but dunno there

and to all you gold haters...ok, so we move DJ to weak, who do we put at strong, burns? chukwurah? gold isnt big enough. unless you want us to draft or trade, we have the best fits curently in place

[SoCalBronco]

no, not neccessarily. weakside is generally the faster of the two players and therefore the smaller. strongside is the bigger, not as fast player of the two. not sure the speed but DJ has about 20 lbs on gold so DJ should be strongside. just by looking, i say gold is faster but dunno there

and to all you gold haters...ok, so we move DJ to weak, who do we put at strong, burns? chukwurah? gold isnt big enough. unless you want us to draft or trade, we have the best fits curently in place

That's precisely the problem. We can't really fix this situation and that's Shanny's fault.

Your right, we cant move him back right now because Gold would be a huge liability at Sam. The cost of this ofcourse is to rob DJ of his greatest asset against the run, which is pursuit. He is best used playing in space, not playing at Sam. We aren't playing to the player's strengths (with one exception, he is strong and can hold steady at the point of attack, which is usually on the strongside).

We also can't cut or trade Gold because of the cap hit. He got a bonus of slightly over 8 million and there has only been 1 year of proration. So there is basically no way out right now. One future option, which should be considered after this season, is to trade DJ. His signing bonus was about 5 million, coming in two parts. After this year, (given that he would have played 60% of his contract) if we were to trade him, we'd take a hit (only on paper) of only 2 million. That would benefit all the parties. Denver would very likely get value commensurate with DJ's real worth (he is highly regarded in league circles), as opposed to the fractional benefit they are getting from him now since he is out of position and off the field half the time, and he would go to a team that would use him properly and allow him to flourish. Everyone's a winner.

[~Crash~]

If DJ is so good why can he not be as big a playmaker as Romo ? Romo made a deference !!! if DJ is so all world he can also make a difference!!!!

[bcbronc]

That's precisely the problem. We can't really fix this situation and that's Shanny's fault.

Your right, we cant move him back right now because Gold would be a huge liability at Sam. The cost of this ofcourse is to rob DJ of his greatest asset against the run, which is pursuit. He is best used playing in space, not playing at Sam. We aren't playing to the player's strengths (with one exception, he is strong and can hold steady at the point of attack, which is usually on the strongside).

We also can't cut or trade Gold because of the cap hit. He got a bonus of slightly over 8 million and there has only been 1 year of proration. So there is basically no way out right now. One future option, which should be considered after this season, is to trade DJ. His signing bonus was about 5 million, coming in two parts. After this year, (given that he would have played 60% of his contract) if we were to trade him, we'd take a hit (only on paper) of only 2 million. That would benefit all the parties.

i don't think dj at sam is quite the negative that you seem to. i thought dj started to look much more comfortable on the strong side as the year drew on. i full expect to see him make some plays this season. i don't look at the linebacker situation as 'gold over dj', i look at it as 'dj over spragan'.

bringing gold back into the lineup allowed us to drastically improve our talent at sam. considering we have the league's two top TEs and two of the top running games in our division, and we run a defensive scheme that focus's on our linebackers, it's important to have talent at all three spots. dj at sam is in no way a negative situation to be in.

[Hulamau]

Why should he play weakside? Please explain that. Weakside is for scrubs. Strong side covers the TE, a growing weapon throughout the league and a major weapon in the AFC West. Ian can't, DJ can. I don't see why you hate DJ playing strong side so much, he's going to contribute more to the team playing from the strong side.


Only that DJ may become the next Lelie who doenst make a peep for 3 or 4 years, but is quietly stewing over not being used the way he expects and hopes, and takes the first train out of dodge when he gets the chance.

Hopefully, Shanny has learned on that front and maybe his proping DJ here so much is a step inht eright direction intended to help smooth out any possible disgruntled feelings later.

Last years DJ even said to the press that he prefered the weak side or middle but would play where they asked him to. Between Big Al's timely comments this week and Shannys, it sounds like they might be trying to address the situation positively before it becomes a problem.

Its interesting that DJ refused to comment.

[SoCalBronco]

i don't think dj at sam is quite the negative that you seem to. i thought dj started to look much more comfortable on the strong side as the year drew on. i full expect to see him make some plays this season. i don't look at the linebacker situation as 'gold over dj', i look at it as 'dj over spragan'.

bringing gold back into the lineup allowed us to drastically improve our talent at sam. considering we have the league's two top TEs and two of the top running games in our division, and we run a defensive scheme that focus's on our linebackers, it's important to have talent at all three spots. dj at sam is in no way a negative situation to be in.

I dont buy into that whole "everyone was trying to get a matchup on Spragan in 2004, so now we are strong everywhere which helps us against the division's TEs" argument. We wouldnt make huge investments in all of the LBs for that purpose if we were going to be in Nickel defense half the time (and therefore one of them wouldnt be on the field) instead of leaving all three LBs on the field. If your going to play Nickel that much, than you shouldnt be making a large investment in all your LBs.

[SoCalBronco]

Only that DJ may become the next Lelie who doenst make a peep for 3 or 4 years, but is quietly stewing over not being used the way he expects and hopes, and takes the first train out of dodge when he gets the chance.

Hopefully, Shanny has learned on that front and maybe his proping DJ here so much is a step inht eright direction intended to help smooth out any possible disgruntled feelings later.

Last years DJ even said to the press that he prefered the weak side or middle but would play where they asked him to. Between Big Al's timely comments this week and Shannys, it sounds like they might be trying to address the situation positively before it becomes a problem.

Its interesting that DJ refused to comment.

Well, he doesnt usually speak to the media anyway, so its not really out of character for him. However, I would take issue with your comment that they are trying to address the issue up front. They arent "addressing" anything. They are just engaging in some nice talk, while the substantive problem is the same (actually worse, since there will be no splitting of time). Making the problem worse, while prefacing it with some praise isnt addressing it. That's probably why he isnt commenting, they are waiting for him to say something acknowledging their comments and he won't, which is good. Shanahan sometimes needs to learn to fully appreciate all angles of a situation before making a decision, as opposed to making rash decisions without thinking of the effects and how it will change the dynamic. This entire situation will be beneficial for Shanahan in the respect that it will hopefully incentivize him to think things through a little better in his future decisions.

[bcbronc]

I dont buy into that whole "everyone was trying to get a matchup on Spragan in 2004, so now we are strong everywhere which helps us against the division's TEs" argument. We wouldnt make huge investments in all of the LBs for that purpose if we were going to be in Nickel defense half the time (and therefore one of them wouldnt be on the field) instead of leaving all three LBs on the field. If your going to play Nickel that much, than you shouldnt be making a large investment in all your LBs.

i wasn't meaning it in a "everybody always trying to match up spragan" kind of way. i just mean that i think dj is a much better LB than donnie is, and i'd much rather have a LB corp that can afford to play dj at the sam position.

and i think the reason we ran so much nickel last season was other teams went with spread offenses to get one of our linebackers off the field. when your second and third corners are rookies, that's good strategy for opposing coaches. and then the success of our big nickel package meant dj missed more snaps.

but dj hardley counts as a large investment for this coming season. i'm not sure what his final cap number is, but his base salary is less than $500 000. i don't remember what his guaranteed money was but i doubt his number is more than $2m for next season. thats <2% of the cap, hardly a huge investment for a sam.

[SoCalBronco]

i wasn't meaning it in a "everybody always trying to match up spragan" kind of way. i just mean that i think dj is a much better LB than donnie is, and i'd much rather have a LB corp that can afford to play dj at the sam position.

and i think the reason we ran so much nickel last season was other teams went with spread offenses to get one of our linebackers off the field. when your second and third corners are rookies, that's good strategy for opposing coaches. and then the success of our big nickel package meant dj missed more snaps.

but dj hardley counts as a large investment for this coming season. i'm not sure what his final cap number is, but his base salary is less than $500 000. i don't remember what his guaranteed money was but i doubt his number is more than $2m for next season. thats <2% of the cap, hardly a huge investment for a sam.

From what Mediator has posted before, we have run a large percentage of Nickel Defense even before this year, so I dont think it was a matter of protecting the rookies. But the point you made about opposing offenses spreading us out to get a LB off the field is also instructive. Why would we invest this much in our LBs, when, by mere formation, the other team could force one off the field. On the issue of investments, I refer to both monetary investments (Wilson and to a lesser extent Gold) as well as very recent high draft pick investments (DJ). In sum there is alot of recently used assets tied up in one area.

[bcbronc]

From what Mediator has posted before, we have run a large percentage of Nickel Defense even before this year, so I dont think it was a matter of protecting the rookies. But the point you made about opposing offenses spreading us out to get a LB off the field is also instructive. Why would we invest this much in our LBs, when, by mere formation, the other team could force one off the field. On the issue of investments, I refer to both monetary investments (Wilson and to a lesser extent Gold) as well as very recent high draft pick investments (DJ). In sum there is alot of recently used assets tied up in one area.


but it's also the focal point of our defense. like pryce said, the defensive line is just human road blocks keeping guys off the linebackers. the defense is set up to have the linebackers make plays. its the whole chain link cliche. our defense is really only as good as our linebackers. its been pretty rare in the shanny era, no matter who the DC has been, not to have 3 above average linebackers.

i really have no beefs at all having arguably the best linebacking corp in the league.

[watermock]

I respect you opinions SoCal, and have agreed with most of your points, but you need to get of this Miami obsession. It's clouding your judgement.

[SoCalBronco]

but it's also the focal point of our defense. like pryce said, the defensive line is just human road blocks keeping guys off the linebackers. the defense is set up to have the linebackers make plays. its the whole chain link cliche. our defense is really only as good as our linebackers. its been pretty rare in the shanny era, no matter who the DC has been, not to have 3 above average linebackers.

i really have no beefs at all having arguably the best linebacking corp in the league.

I certainly don't mind having three good linebackers. I usually am not a fan of concentrating a whole lot of resources in one area, but having three good backers is definitely a good thing. I just wish that we could get the absolute most out of each of them. We get that from Wilson. Last year, we took away from what Gold does well by having him play part time Sam. Last year, we took alot away from what DJ does well by having him play majority of the time Sam and half the time benchwarmer. Its nice to say we have three good LBs, but by the very nature of the arrangement, it is impossible to be getting anywhere near the optimum result from the group. In addition, we will lose all three at roughly the same time.

[watermock]

I thought we would use more 3-3-5 but that never happened. We went 4-2-5. That's what I would do, especially if we are short a DT.

[SoCalBronco]

I respect you opinions SoCal, and have agreed with most of your points, but you need to get of this Miami obsession. It's clouding your judgement.

This isnt Miami homerism. These are legitimate arguments on their own. This deal is a bad deal independent of which teams I like. Its a horrible arrangement and reflects very poorly on Shanahan's decision making ability and lack of foresight. It has little bearing on Miami. I hate Jonathon Vilma. I hate Ray Lewis. I hate Warren Sapp. I dont homer every Miami player. Did you see me getting angry when they drafted Kuper and Eslinger because I thought it was a threat to Chris Myers? Ofcourse not. That's because I didnt.

[watermock]

Well, first off I wouldn't worry about late second day picks too much. You have been whining about Williams for a year now. Gold played extremely well. Fact is the problem will come up when Williams contract does. That's the black sheep looming.

[SoCalBronco]

Fact is the problem will come up when Williams contract does. That's the black sheep looming.

So? The problem is of Shanny's own creation, so let him deal with it. He will have to sleep in the bed he made for himself.

[SportinOne]

It's not that hard to understand...

Ian: Strong Weakside, Weak Strongside
DJ: (potentially) All Pro Weakside, (potentially) Strong Strongside

you're only as strong as your weakest link... this way, no weak links

[ozomulsion]

Well, he doesnt usually speak to the media anyway, so its not really out of character for him. However, I would take issue with your comment that they are trying to address the issue up front. They arent "addressing" anything. They are just engaging in some nice talk, while the substantive problem is the same (actually worse, since there will be no splitting of time). Making the problem worse, while prefacing it with some praise isnt addressing it. That's probably why he isnt commenting, they are waiting for him to say something acknowledging their comments and he won't, which is good. Shanahan sometimes needs to learn to fully appreciate all angles of a situation before making a decision, as opposed to making rash decisions without thinking of the effects and how it will change the dynamic. This entire situation will be beneficial for Shanahan in the respect that it will hopefully incentivize him to think things through a little better in his future decisions.

Rep
I won't hold my breath.

[youcandoit1687]

It's not that hard to understand...

Ian: Strong Weakside, Weak Strongside
DJ: (potentially) All Pro Weakside, (potentially) Strong Strongside

you're only as strong as your weakest link... this way, no weak links

exactly what ive been saying. as for DJ being happy, that needs to take a backseat to the main goal of making the team better. i dont know DJ personally by any means, but i do kno that if the guy has a bad mentality, shanny will take care of it by getting rid of him/trading him/silencing him, etc.

if we find a way to get a natural Sam and do something with gold that doesnt give us a big cap hit, then go for it but i believe that, DJ is a player and will play wherever he is told to play, happy or not, and with him playing Sam and Gold at Will, we are pretty damn well off and should stick wit hthat

[watermock]

BTW, Vilma led the NFL in tackles.

[BroncoInferno]

'"Stats don't always reflect how well a guy plays," Shanahan said. "Sometimes they just reflect where the point of attack was."'

So teams were attacking wherever Gold was, is that what he is saying?

"The Broncos secured early leads in many games last season and Williams often became the odd man out - coming off the field when the defense switched to a nickel package."

So, does Ian play in nickel, and DJ's on the sideline? If that's the case, I guess I just have to say the coaches know better what will work for the team. I was under the impression DJ is a better all-around player than Gold, though.

DJ opened the season last year as the primary nickle player but had some problems with play recognition (a weakness that was noted when he came out of college), and so lost the primary duties to Gold. I'm sure as DJ continues to improve, he'll get more chances in the nickle role, and thus see an improvement in his numbers.

[BroncoInferno]

From what Mediator has posted before, we have run a large percentage of Nickel Defense even before this year, so I dont think it was a matter of protecting the rookies. But the point you made about opposing offenses spreading us out to get a LB off the field is also instructive. Why would we invest this much in our LBs, when, by mere formation, the other team could force one off the field. On the issue of investments, I refer to both monetary investments (Wilson and to a lesser extent Gold) as well as very recent high draft pick investments (DJ). In sum there is alot of recently used assets tied up in one area.

Well, remember last season we generally built leads that put the opposition in pass first mode, thus part of the reason we were in the nickle much of the time. As I said, I have no doubt that DJ will get the opportunity to win back the primary nickle spot that he lost to Gold last season because of his inconsistency with play recognition. If he does, his numbers will look more impressive. It will be up to DJ to improve on his primary weakness and take the spot from Gold. I'm confident he can do that.

[chrisp]

There was also some talk from Shanny earlier in the offseason about using DJ to spell big Al a bit, particularly in the Nickle situations. Reasoning being that he ain't getting any younger, so it might be wise to keep him fresh for those crunching 3rd-and-1 stops rather than burning him out chasing younger faster guys all over the place on 3rd-and-10....

Don't know how it will all play out, s'pose a lot will come down to how things run in the camps.

[delany]

It will all come down to money. (doesn't everything?)

If DJ gets the huge contract after his rookie deal...and even more-so if the Broncos re-write the contract with one year still remaining...then all will be well in Bronco-land.

If the Broncos try to play games and short-change DJ because he has been a good soldier and not made waves..and try to defend this line of reason by pointing at the statistics.....then the ramifications would go well beyond DJ and leak into a league-wide perception of how Denver treats its players.

I really can't see Denver screwing this up.

Pay him as one of the top LBs in the league and then use him as you see fit.

The only thing that is hurt then is DJ's chance at football immortality with the HOF...and DJ hasn't spoke up on how important that aspect of the game is to him.

[chrisp]

As a top-20 first round draft pick his rookie contract wouldn't have been for shoddy money, so DJ's money situation isn't really going to be an issue this offseason.

...next offseason, going into a contract year its a different story...

[bendog]

How people can say Gold is a good will when my frigging sister is more a threat to blitz is mystifying. Den's best blitz package is a joke of either Champ or Lynch.

[BroncoInferno]

How people can say Gold is a good will when my frigging sister is more a threat to blitz is mystifying.

I guess Shanny is an idiot then. He obviously thinks Gold is a very good WILL. Based on his play last season, any objective observer can see he's right.

[bendog]

Gold sucks at pass rushing. Live with as we all must. shanny's track record on defense is not something to crow about.

[BroncoInferno]

Gold sucks at pass rushing.

Pass rushing is not supposed to be a primary responsibility for a LB in a 4-3 scheme (ideally, anyway). He is a very productive player in other areas more essential to the position.

Live with as we all must. shanny's track record on defense is not something to crow about.

C'mon, Gold had a very productive 2005 campaign. Give the man some credit.

[Taco John]

Why should he play weakside? Please explain that. Weakside is for scrubs. Strong side covers the TE, a growing weapon throughout the league and a major weapon in the AFC West. Ian can't, DJ can. I don't see why you hate DJ playing strong side so much, he's going to contribute more to the team playing from the strong side.



Uhh :kiddingme :saywhat:

[bendog]

Uhh :kiddingme :saywhat:
Yeah, I just never will understand why saying by to Spragans and not spending on a DE was the logical thing to do.

[BroncoInferno]

Yeah, I just never will understand why saying by to Spragans and not spending on a DE was the logical thing to do.

Because Spragans stunk and was a liability in coverage. We now have a dynamic, versatile trio at LB.

[Taco John]

C'mon, Gold had a very productive 2005 campaign. Give the man some credit.


I'll give him a little credit. I liked the guys attitude and his energy on the field.

And now I'll give DJ credit. He's a better weakside linebacker than Ian Gold, and it hurt our defense to jerk with him. It's going to be a real shame to see him split for a team that will play him in his proper position.

[fontaine]

Gold sucks at pass rushing. Live with as we all must. shanny's track record on defense is not something to crow about.

In fairness to DJ/Gold and our coaches last year, they had to deal with:

Randy McMichael,
Gates twice,
Gonzo twice,
Cooley,
Jason Witten,
Jeremy Shockey,
LJ Smith,
Watson/Graham,
and Todd Heap.

With all these great TEs, sometimes you just don't get opportunities to use your LBers to blitz the passer when they have to patrol the middle and make sure these guys don't get open.

I'm sure Coyer would have loved to unleash DJ/Gold against the QB more but when our OLBs are faster than our safeties (Lynch, Fergy) then you're forced to use those guys in coverage and use Lynch in blitzes.

Backa$$wards if you ask me but unavoidable. I think this is why we experimented with using Brandon in strong nickel to cover the TE and it worked to some extent but it was more for deeper coverage I think, with the OLBs still doing the gritty work underneath across the middle.

[BroncoInferno]

I'll give him a little credit. I liked the guys attitude and his energy on the field.

And now I'll give DJ credit. He's a better weakside linebacker than Ian Gold,

You're wrong. DJ certainly has the potential to be a better weakside LB, but you have to live up to that potential. DJ still has problems with play recognition, which is why he lost the job as the primary nickle backer role to Gold. He was given a fair shot at that spot and couldn't hold onto it. That's why his numbers suffered. If he improves in that respect, he'll get more snaps in the nickle and his numvers will improve.


and it hurt our defense to jerk with him. It's going to be a real shame to see him split for a team that will play him in his proper position.

LOL That is just biased nonsense. We had our best defense since the last Super Bowl squad and a big reason was the addition of Gold, not just because of what he brings to the table, but because of how you can use the three of them (Gold, DJ, Wilson) as a unit. To say it hurt the defense is preposterous and cannot be substantiated by any objective analysis. In fact, all evidence points to the contrary.

[fontaine]

I don't see what the big deal is with the possibility of DJ Williams bolting after his contract is up.

Good LBers, starting caliber LBers are available late into the 2nd round these days (tatapu, dansby etc), and if DJ is upset enough to leave the team based on his playing position then so be it (I'm not saying he is) - Our FO has proven that it can find solid players at LB anyway.

For every one Lelie, there are several players every year that are delighted to be in Denver because of the way this organization is perceived around the NFL.

[Taco John]

You're wrong. DJ certainly has the potential to be a better weakside LB, but you have to live up to that potential. DJ still has problems with play recognition, which is why he lost the job as the primary nickle backer role to Gold. He was given a fair shot at that spot and couldn't hold onto it. That's why his numbers suffered. If he improves in that respect, he'll get more snaps in the nickle and his numvers will improve.


LOL LOL LOL

I'm absolutely not wrong... In his rookie year, DJ was a better linebacker than Gold was last year. Check the stats. They'll tell the same story.

DJ is better than Gold.




LOL That is just biased nonsense. We had our best defense since the last Super Bowl squad and a big reason was the addition of Gold, not just because of what he brings to the table, but because of how you can use the three of them (Gold, DJ, Wilson) as a unit. To say it hurt the defense is preposterous and cannot be substantiated by any objective analysis. In fact, all evidence points to the contrary.


Gold didn't bring us anything last year that we didn't have the year before.

[youcandoit1687]

I guess Shanny is an idiot then. He obviously thinks Gold is a very good WILL. Based on his play last season, any objective observer can see he's right.

youre damn right, lets fire him and tell him to take the trophies with him!
dude, bendog:

GOLD AT A GLANCE:
• Led the team in total tackles (106), solo tackles (81) and assists (25) as well as tying for the team lead with two fumble recoveries.
• Led the team in tackles six times, more than any other Bronco. Had at least a share of the team lead in tackles four consecutive times and six of seven games, spanning Oct. 23 at N.Y. Giants until Dec. 11 vs. Baltimore.
• Started all 16 games on a defense which yielded the second-fewest rushing yards (1,363) in the league en route to yielding the third-fewest points (258), the lowest Broncos figure in the Mike Shanahan era.
• Part of a defense which yielded 10-or-fewer points seven times, including just 37 points over the season’s last four games.

he also had a decent three sacks, and wilson had three sacks as well so iwouldnt say we dont have blitzers and lynch is known league wide as one of the best blitzing safeties and 4 sacks. in case you havent realized, our weakness on pass rush is the DLine and IMO, gold is not a problem

[BroncoInferno]

LOL LOL LOL

I'm absolutely not wrong... In his rookie year, DJ was a better linebacker than Gold was last year. Check the stats. They'll tell the same story.

DJ is better than Gold.

Stats are misleading, particularly at LB. Wilson's numbers were not as good in 05 as they were in 04, yet by all accounts it was probably his best season. That is superficial way to judge things. DJ has problems with properly diagnosing a play. That is why he was taken off the field in nickle situations and why his numbers suffered. He actually had that job at the beginning of the season, then lost it to Gold. DJ is not better than Gold at this point.

Gold didn't bring us anything last year that we didn't have the year before.

Wrong. Gold gave us three LBs with great versatility, thus giving the D more flexibility and skill. In 04 we had two players of the caliber and one very mediocre liability in Spragan. Give me a break.

[bendog]

Because Spragans stunk and was a liability in coverage. We now have a dynamic, versatile trio at LB.
And our DEs suck now. I'd rather have a journeyman Mike and a stud Will and a pass rush. JMO

[fontaine]

Any WLB worth his salt in a 4-3 defense should lead his team in tackles. That's the nature of the position.

The real story is in how many big plays the WLB made like ints, stuffs behind the line of scrimmage, sacks, forced fumbles and passes defensed.

I don't know how DJ's rookie year stacks up with Gold in that regard.

[Taco John]

Wrong. Gold gave us three LBs with great versatility, thus giving the D more flexibility and skill. In 04 we had two players of the caliber and one very mediocre liability in Spragan. Give me a break.


Mmmmmhmmmm... And the results were about the same as the year previous, only with a weaker weakside linebacker than we had the year before.

Gold didn't make our defense any better. We took a budding star WLB and moved him over to a position where he played average so that we could make room for an above average WLB.

We'd have been better off either signing a DE, or a real SLB than bringing Gold in.

[youcandoit1687]

Stats are misleading, particularly at LB. Wilson's numbers were not as good in 05 as they were in 04, yet by all accounts it was probably his best season. That is superficial way to judge things. DJ has problems with properly diagnosing a play. That is why he was taken off the field in nickle situations and why his numbers suffered. He actually had that job at the beginning of the season, then lost it to Gold. DJ is not better than Gold at this point.



Wrong. Gold gave us three LBs with great versatility, thus giving the D more flexibility and skill. In 04 we had two players of the caliber and one very mediocre liability in Spragan. Give me a break.

and part of the reason that DJ had huge tackle numbers was because he was playing with spragan not instead of gold playing with al and DJ. also, they ran DJ's way more earlier in the season when he was jsut a rook. cant yall grasp the concept that the coaches are trying different things in camp at this time of the year(were the broncos, we do crazy ****) and if they found that they had a sam solution and could put DJ at will, hell, they would have done it. i think it is clear cut that our best LB corps has Al at mike, gold at will, and DJ at sam. Al is obvoius, gold is fast but not strong enough for sam so DJ plays sam.

[BroncoInferno]

Mmmmmhmmmm... And the results were about the same as the year previous, only with a weaker weakside linebacker than we had the year before.

Gold didn't make our defense any better. We took a budding star WLB and moved him over to a position where he played average so that we could make room for an above average WLB.

Wrong again. Laughably wrong. In fact, we allowed 256 points last season, the lowest total in the Shanny era. That includes the two Super Bowl seasons. We were second in the league in TOs after a couple of seasons being one of the worst. Certainly, Gold was not the only reason for that, but to claim he did not play his part in improving the unit is assinine.

[Taco John]

I'm not saying he didn't play his part. I'm saying his part was no better than what we were getting from the position before he came. And this improvement you're talking about is the difference of 4 touchdowns. We had 31 TDs against us in 2005, vs. 35 TDs in 2004. I mean... Come on... ::) Laughably wrong indeed.

[Kaylore]

Mediator has said the same things about DJ that Bronco Inferno has said in this post about play recognition and Gold out-playing him. I'm inclined to lean toward their prognosis.

[BroncoInferno]

I'm not saying he didn't play his part. I'm saying his part was no better than what we were getting from the position before he came. And this improvement you're talking about is the difference of 4 touchdowns. We had 31 TDs against us in 2005, vs. 35 TDs in 2004. I mean... Come on... ::) Laughably wrong indeed.

256 points allowed...lowest total in the Shanny era. Considering all the close games we lost in '04, 4 TDs was probably the difference between a wild card road game and winning the division. And, in your glib response, you conviently leave out the dramatic and crucial improvement in TOs, which put the offense in a lot of good situations. Gold played a big part in that improvement. Gold/Wilson/DJ is a big improvement over DJ/Wilson/Spragan. Big improvement. There is really no reasonable debate to the contray.