Nagin reelected

[spdirty]

http://articles.news.aol.com/news/article.adp?id=20060520044309990001&ncid=NWS00010000000001

New Orleans deserves what they get.







Updated: 12:15 AM EDT


New Orleans Votes to Re-Elect Nagin
By MICHELLE ROBERTS, AP

NEW ORLEANS (May 20) - Mayor Ray Nagin, whose shoot-from-the-hip style was both praised and scorned after Hurricane Katrina, narrowly won re-election over Lt. Gov. Mitch Landrieu on Saturday in the race to oversee one of the biggest rebuilding projects in U.S. history.




--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Watch Video:
Nagin Gives Victory Speech
Landrieu Concedes Race
Nagin Wins Re-Election
Post-Katrina Mayor

Talk About It:
· Post Thoughts


"We are ready to take off. We have citizens around the country who want to come back to the city of New Orleans, and we're going to get them all back," Nagin said in a joyful victory speech that took on the tone of Sunday sermon.

"If we are unified there is nothing we cannot do," he said. "It's time for us to stop the bickering. It's time for us to stop measuring things in black and white and yellow and Asian. It's time for us to be one New Orleans."

With all 442 precincts reporting, Nagin won with 52.3 percent, or 59,460 votes, to Landrieu's 47.7 percent, or 54,131 votes. Results showed he got black votes he needed from scattered residents across the country who voted by fax and absentee ballots, and got a sizable crossover vote from white districts.

Nagin, a former cable television executive first elected to public office in 2002, had argued the city could ill-afford to change course just as rebuilding gathered steam.

His second term begins a day before the June 1 start of the next hurricane season in a city where streets are still strewn with rusting, mud-covered cars and entire neighborhoods consist of homes that are empty shells.

With little disagreement on the major issues - the right of residents to rebuild in all areas and the urgent need for federal aid for recovery and top-notch levees - the race came down to a referendum on leadership styles.

Nagin, a janitor's son from a black, working-class neighborhood, is known for his improvisational, some say impulsive, rhetoric. After Katrina plunged his city into chaos, Nagin was both scorned and praised for a tearful plea for the federal government to "get off their (behinds) and do something" and his now-famous remark that God intended New Orleans to be a "chocolate" city.

In his victory speech, Nagin reached out to President Bush, thanking him for keeping his commitment to bring billions of dollars for levees, housing and incentives to the city.


Most Popular Stories


· Hazing Photos Expose College Scandal
· Witness in Polygamist Case Speaks Out (ABCNews.com)
· Pakistan Set to Hang Acquitted British Man
· Halle Berry Clashes With Disc Jockey
· 'Hobbit' Species Discovery Challenged


And as for Louisiana Gov. Kathleen Blanco, with whom he feuded as his city descended into chaos, Nagin thanked her "for what she's getting ready to do."

" It's time for a real partnership," he said. "It's time for us to get together and rebuild this city."

Landrieu, who served 16 years in the state House before being elected to his current post of lieutenant governor two years ago, is the scion of a political dynasty known as Louisiana's version of the Kennedys. He's the brother of Sen. Mary Landrieu and had hoped to be the first white mayor in a generation, since his father, Moon Landrieu, left office in 1978.

In conceded the race, Landrieu echoed the theme of his campaign - a call for unity.

"One thing is for sure - that we as a people have got to come together so we can speak with one voice and one purpose," he said. "Join with me in supporting Mayor Nagin."

Fewer than half of New Orleans' 455,000 pre-Katrina residents are living in the city, and a large number of blacks scattered by the storm have yet to return.

Evacuees arrived by bus from as far as Atlanta and Houston to vote. More than 25,000 ballots were cast early by mail or fax or at satellite polling places set up around Louisiana earlier in the month - 5,000 more than were cast early in the primary.

Turnout appeared to be on-par with the April 22 primary, when about 37 percent of eligible voters cast ballots.

Nagin, who had widespread support from white voters four years ago, lost much of that support in the primary but got a much stronger showing this time.

Results from Louisiana's Secretary of State's Office showed Nagin carrying majority black precincts and Landrieu winning in majority white ones. But Nagin pulled a significant crossover vote in some heavily populated predominantly white precincts in Uptown New Orleans.

Voter Elliot Pernell was philosophical about his vote for Nagin.

"He's been through the experience already," he said, "and won't make the same mistakes."

Among the first to vote was 61-year-old Alice Howard, who was rescued after three days on her roof following Katrina and evacuated to Houston.

"I want the city to come back," she said. "This is my city. This is home to me. ... I want to make sure the correct person takes care of home."

AP reporters Brett Martel, Kevin McGill and Hank Ackerman contributed to this report.


05/21/06 00:13 EDT


Copyright 2006 The Associated Press. The information contained in the AP news report may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or otherwise distributed without the prior written authority of The Associated Press. All active hyperlinks have been inserted by AOL.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

New Orleans deserves what they get.

That's what the right-wing handjobs said about Katrina.

Pathetic. :pity:

[spdirty]

That's what the right-wing handjobs said about Katrina.

Pathetic. :pity:

When did they say that about Katrina? I have never heard anyone say to the effect that New Orleans residents "deserved" Katrina from anybody, right or left.

[Bronco_Beerslug]

http://articles.news.aol.com/news/article.adp?id=20060520044309990001&ncid=NWS00010000000001
New Orleans deserves what they get.
. What are they going to get?


When did they say that about Katrina? I have never heard anyone say to the effect that New Orleans residents "deserved" Katrina from anybody, right or left.

Fred Phelps (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fred_Phelps) [11] (http://www.godhatesfags.com/featured/20050831_thank-god-for-katrina.html) credits God; God's reason: Homosexuals (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homosexual) "New Orleans, symbol of America, seen for what it is: a putrid, toxic, stinking cesspool of fag fecal matter. [...] Pray for more dead bodies floating on the fag-semen-rancid waters of New Orleans."




Steve Lefemine [12] (http://www.chron.com/cs/CDA/ssistory.mpl/nation/3338642) credits God; God's reason: Abortion (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abortion) (article originally from the Washington Post, as carried on the Houston Chronicle site, also reposted on the ExChristian.net site (http://exchristian.net/2/2005/09/some-say-natural-catastrophe-was.php)) "In my belief, God judged New Orleans for the sin of shedding innocent blood through abortion [...] Providence punishes national sins by national calamities, [...] Greater divine judgment is coming upon America unless we repent of the national sin of abortion."




Reverend Bill Shanks [13] (http://headlines.agapepress.org/archive/9/22005b.asp) credits God; God's reasons: Abortion, debauchery, homosexuals, witchcraft "New Orleans now is abortion free. New Orleans now is Mardi Gras (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mardi_Gras) free. New Orleans now is free of Southern Decadence (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Southern_Decadence) and the sodomites, the witchcraft (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Witchcraft) workers, false religion -- it's free of all of those things now, [...] God simply, I believe, in His mercy purged all of that stuff out of there -- and now we're going to start over again."



"In 1998, Republican icon Pat Robertson warned that hurricanes were likely to hit communities that offended God. Perhaps it was Barbour’s memo that caused Katrina, at the last moment, to spare New Orleans and save its worst flailings for the Mississippi coast."



http://tinyurl.com/r5bvs

[spdirty]

What are they going to get?



Mayor Nagin.

[spdirty]

Fred Phelps (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fred_Phelps) [11] (http://www.godhatesfags.com/featured/20050831_thank-god-for-katrina.html) credits God; God's reason: Homosexuals (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homosexual) "New Orleans, symbol of America, seen for what it is: a putrid, toxic, stinking cesspool of fag fecal matter. [...] Pray for more dead bodies floating on the fag-semen-rancid waters of New Orleans."




Steve Lefemine [12] (http://www.chron.com/cs/CDA/ssistory.mpl/nation/3338642) credits God; God's reason: Abortion (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abortion) (article originally from the Washington Post, as carried on the Houston Chronicle site, also reposted on the ExChristian.net site (http://exchristian.net/2/2005/09/some-say-natural-catastrophe-was.php)) "In my belief, God judged New Orleans for the sin of shedding innocent blood through abortion [...] Providence punishes national sins by national calamities, [...] Greater divine judgment is coming upon America unless we repent of the national sin of abortion."




Reverend Bill Shanks [13] (http://headlines.agapepress.org/archive/9/22005b.asp) credits God; God's reasons: Abortion, debauchery, homosexuals, witchcraft "New Orleans now is abortion free. New Orleans now is Mardi Gras (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mardi_Gras) free. New Orleans now is free of Southern Decadence (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Southern_Decadence) and the sodomites, the witchcraft (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Witchcraft) workers, false religion -- it's free of all of those things now, [...] God simply, I believe, in His mercy purged all of that stuff out of there -- and now we're going to start over again."



"In 1998, Republican icon Pat Robertson warned that hurricanes were likely to hit communities that offended God. Perhaps it was Barbour’s memo that caused Katrina, at the last moment, to spare New Orleans and save its worst flailings for the Mississippi coast."



http://tinyurl.com/r5bvs




Robertson probably thinks he's a prophet now.

And I'm not about to defend anything these idiots said either. Just do me a favor and know that these people do not speak for all christians or right wingers. For whatever reason, I believe on Earth God lets bad things happen to good people and good things happen to bad people. The flood following Katrina happened because the people there elected crap politicians who.

[Bronco_Beerslug]

Mayor Nagin.
What's the problem, is there something wrong with him?

[spdirty]

No...theres nothing wrong with him, he's perfect.

[Bronco_Beerslug]

No...theres nothing wrong with him, he's perfect.
Maybe you can point out why he shouldn't be mayor since you think he isn't qualified.

[DBruleU]

Maybe you can point out why he shouldn't be mayor since you think he isn't qualified.

He just wants a "Chocolate city"...give the guy a break.

::)

[spdirty]

Maybe you can point out why he shouldn't be mayor since you think he isn't qualified.


Oh lets see, the idiotic racist chocolate city comment, the utter failure to improve the levies, instead of showing some leadership, he simply did nothing but whine, the school buses, etc. Im not giving any links, Im not debating with you whether he should be reelected. If you think he is a great mayor, who did a great job, fine. I have my opinion, you have yours.

[Hogan11]

Now that this time wasting sideshow is over, maybe they can get back to rebuilding the city. Honestly, I really don't care who is in charge as long as the job gets done and one of fave places in the country gets back to the way it once was or better.

[Garcia Bronco]

Maybe you can point out why he shouldn't be mayor since you think he isn't qualified.


He failed to act in an emergency to mobilze his people. He failed to have the 'floating city' pump's electrical move above sea level. He failed to gather public resources to save lives in response to a disaster. His police force quit on him during an emergency. His city was looted under his tenure....shall I go on?

If that's what the dummies in NO want...they can have it. I just hope it works out like they plan.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

When did they say that about Katrina? I have never heard anyone say to the effect that New Orleans residents "deserved" Katrina from anybody, right or left.

Then you haven't been paying attention.

Many right-wingers on this board blamed the victims for their fate.

Some idiot even said it was their fault just for choosing to live in NOLA.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Oh lets see, the idiotic racist chocolate city comment, the utter failure to improve the levies...

Nagin didn't "fail to improve the levees" - the funding for the improvement of the levees (for which the Army Corp of Engineers was responsible, BTW) was cut out from under the state of LA - under Bush. Bush and FEMA were warned well in advance re: the high probability of a category five hurricane hitting LA, but Bush ignored the warnings (sound familiar?) and consistently cut funding for improvement of the levees.

[SoCalBronco]

XXXXX DRUDGE REPORT XXXXX SUN MAY 21, 2006 20:00:02 ET XXXXX

DEMOCRATIC NATIONAL COMMITTEE WORKED TO DEFEAT NAGIN

**Exclusive**

The Democratic National Committee (DNC) secretly placed political operatives in the city of New Orleans to work against the reelection efforts of incumbent Democrat Mayor Ray Nagin, the DRUDGE REPORT has learned.

DNC Chairman Howard Dean made the decision himself to back mayoral candidate and sitting Lieutenant Governor Mitch Landrieu (D-LA), sources reveal.

Dean came to the decision to back the white challenger, over the African-American incumbent Nagin, despite concerns amongst senior black officials in the Party that the DNC should stay neutral.

The DNC teams actively worked to defeat Nagin under the auspice of the committee's voting rights program.

The party's field efforts also coincided with a national effort by Democrat contributors to support Landrieu.

Landrieu had outraised Nagin by a wide margin - $3.3 million to $541,980.

Preliminary campaign finance reports indicate many of Landrieu’s contributions came from out of state white Democrat leaders and financiers, including a $1,000 contribution from Sen. Ben Nelson's (D-NE) PAC.

The defeat of Mitch Landrieu is the latest setback for Dean's often criticized field operation.

In his victory speech late Saturday night, Nagin praised President Bush.

"You and I have probably been the most vilified politicians in the country. But I want to thank you for moving that promise that you made in Jackson Square forward," Nagin said.

Developing...

[Garcia Bronco]

Nagin didn't "fail to improve the levees" - the funding for the improvement of the levees (for which the Army Corp of Engineers was responsible, BTW) was cut out from under the state of LA - under Bush. Bush and FEMA were warned well in advance re: the high probability of a category five hurricane hitting LA, but Bush ignored the warnings (sound familiar?) and consistently cut funding for improvement of the levees.


They had funding...they choose to spend it else where. Even the new Levees are only built to with stand a Cat 3 hurricane. Bottom line...the residents there didn't take the proper measures to make sure their city was safe. They also allowed business to eat up valuable wetlands that would absorb a storm surge. Don't try to pin that on the Federal Government. It's a State problem.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

They had funding...they choose to spend it else where.

:bs:

The funding goes directly to the Army Corp of Engineers, who are responsible for improving the levees.

Bottom line...the residents there didn't take the proper measures to make sure their city was safe. They also allowed business to eat up valuable wetlands that would absorb a storm surge. Don't try to pin that on the Federal Government. It's a State problem.

:bs:

It wsn't the "residents" responsibility - it was the responsibility of DHS and FEMA:


Blanco’s letter requesting Emergency aid under the Stafford Act, August 27th:

http://www.bayoubuzz.com/articles.aspx?aid=4843


President Bush legally puts the ball in Chertoff and Howard’s court, August 27th:

http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2005/08/20050827-1.htm


In the event of a terrorist attack, natural disaster or other large-scale emergency, the Department of Homeland Security will assume primary responsibility on March 1st for ensuring that emergency response professionals are prepared for any situation. This will entail providing a coordinated, comprehensive federal response to any large-scale crisis and mounting a swift and effective recovery effort. The new Department will also prioritize the important issue of citizen preparedness. Educating America's families on how best to prepare their homes for a disaster and tips for citizens on how to respond in a crisis will be given special attention at DHS.

http://www.dhs.gov/dhspublic/theme_home2.jsp

[epicSocialism4tw]

Where Guliani is a national hero for showing a genuine commitment to public servitude and great leadership under pressure, Nagin showed us cowardice, how not to fulfill responsibility, how to unapologetically promote a racist philosophy, and how to execute "me first" proirities when the chips are down and your constituents are in the path of certain destruction. Way to go NOLA, you elected one of the worst public officials in history.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Nagin showed us cowardice, how not to fulfill responsibility, how to unapologetically promote a racist philosophy, and how to execute "me first" proirities when the chips are down and your constituents are in the path of certain destruction. Way to go NOLA, you elected one of the worst public officials in history.

:oyvey:

Facts just never intrude in the whacky parallel universe where you live, do they?

Blanco’s letter requesting Emergency aid under the Stafford Act, August 27th:

http://www.bayoubuzz.com/articles.aspx?aid=4843


President Bush legally puts the ball in Chertoff and Howard’s court, August 27th:

http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/relea...20050827-1.htm


In the event of a terrorist attack, natural disaster or other large-scale emergency, the Department of Homeland Security will assume primary responsibility on March 1st for ensuring that emergency response professionals are prepared for any situation. This will entail providing a coordinated, comprehensive federal response to any large-scale crisis and mounting a swift and effective recovery effort. The new Department will also prioritize the important issue of citizen preparedness. Educating America's families on how best to prepare their homes for a disaster and tips for citizens on how to respond in a crisis will be given special attention at DHS.

http://www.dhs.gov/dhspublic/theme_home2.jsp

[epicSocialism4tw]

:oyvey:
Facts just never intrude in the whacky parallel universe where you live, do they?
b]Blanco’s letter requesting Emergency aid under the Stafford Act, August 27th:[/b]
url]http://www.bayoubuzz.com/articles.aspx?aid=4843[/url]President Bush legally puts the ball in Chertoff and Howard’s court, August 27th:
http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/relea...20050827-1.htm
By reposting the same links that you have posted for the past year, you addressed very little in my statement.

Here are the premises:
"Me First" Priorities
Racist Philosophy
Cowardice
Crumbling Under Pressure
Unfavorable evaluation when juxtaposed with Guliani.


Try Again.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

By reposting the same links that you have posted for the past year, you addressed very little in my statement.

I thought perhaps repetition might be they key to comprehension for you.

Apparently, I was wrong.

[Bronco_Beerslug]

By reposting the same links that you have posted for the past year, you addressed very little in my statement.

Here are the premises:
"Me First" Priorities
Racist Philosophy
Cowardice
Crumbling Under Pressure
Unfavorable evaluation when juxtaposed with Guliani.
Try Again.
The Mad Yak chimes in with his usual religious right bias and lack of facts, par for the course though. Amazing the number of people that will defend the Bush regime no matter what facts stare them down!

The amount of ignorance and "tow the party line at any cost" in this country is unbelievable!

[Garcia Bronco]

"
It wsn't the "residents" responsibility - it was the responsibility of DHS and FEMA:"

This in a nutshell is why you are a dumbass and your liberal leanings fail you. It is the the local residents responsilbilty to protect their own back yard. Waiting or depending on the federal government to handle these things is about stupid.

If the moat ain't deep enough for your sand castle....it's your own damn fault when the waves crash over it.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

"This in a nutshell is why you are a dumbass and your liberal leanings fail you.

You have it backwards again:

I just provided facts that refuted your bullsh_t claims.

That would make you the "dumbass."

But we already knew that the first time (on the eve of the hurricane) you blamed the residents of NOLA for their fate.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Amazing the number of people that will defend the Bush regime no matter what facts stare them down!

The amount of ignorance and "tow the party line at any cost" in this country is unbelievable!

No shyte!

What part of "primary responsibility" do these half-wits not understand?

In the event of a terrorist attack, natural disaster or other large-scale emergency, the Department of Homeland Security will assume primary responsibility on March 1st for ensuring that emergency response professionals are prepared for any situation. This will entail providing a coordinated, comprehensive federal response to any large-scale crisis and mounting a swift and effective recovery effort. The new Department will also prioritize the important issue of citizen preparedness. Educating America's families on how best to prepare their homes for a disaster and tips for citizens on how to respond in a crisis will be given special attention at DHS.

http://www.dhs.gov/dhspublic/theme_home2.jsp

[Garcia Bronco]

You have it backwards again:

I just provided facts that refuted your bullsh_t claims.

That would make you the "dumbass."

But we already knew that the first time (on the eve of the hurricane) you blamed the residents of NOLA for their fate.

Yes I did....I was right then...and I'm right now. This didn't happen in a weekend. They knew this would be a problem for over decades going back to when Carter was in office. The residents didn't care...now they do.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Yes I did....I was right then...and I'm right now. This didn't happen in a weekend. They knew this would be a problem for over decades going back to when Carter was in office. The residents didn't care...now they do.

Bullsh*t.

LA is the second-poorest state in the U.S. and depends on federal funding for improvement of the levees.

Bush knew that there was a high probability that a category five hurricane was going to hit NOLA, and he chose to axe federal disaster preparedness funding and to gut FEMA.

The "residents" had nothing to do with this decision.

[Bronco_Beerslug]

No shyte!

What part of "primary responsibility" do these half-wits not understand?
That with the fact WHY the levees failed. I bet most Bush regimers think that was because of city officials too.

[Garcia Bronco]

Bullsh*t.

LA is the second-poorest state in the U.S. and depends on federal funding for improvement of the levees.

Bush knew that there was a high probability that a category five hurricane was going to hit NOLA, and he chose to axe federal disaster preparedness funding and to gut FEMA.

The "residents" had nothing to do with this decision.


If they're the "poorest" state...who's fault is that? Look dude...you can't cover up for a century of corupt practices and throw it on the current federal admin when it's clearly a problem at the state and local level. The residents there elect their government just like everybody else. The residents did have a decision...and they left it in the hands of somebody else. They have to take responsibility...they don't need people like you advocating they did nothing wrong.

[Bronco_Beerslug]

If they're the "poorest" state...who's fault is that? Look dude...you can't cover up for a century of corupt practices and throw it on the current federal admin when it's clearly a problem at the state and local level. The residents there elect their government just like everybody else. The residents did have a decision...and they left it in the hands of somebody else. They have to take responsibility...they don't need people like you advocating they did nothing wrong.
So tell us why the 17th st levee failed, who's fault was that? In fact, who's fault was it for the whole failed levee system, the local or federal government?

[Garcia Bronco]

So tell us why the 17th st levee failed, who's fault was that? In fact, who's fault was it for the whole failed levee system, the local or federal government?


It failed because of the hurricane...they weren't improved years prior because of a lack of attention. Now....they and you can blame all the people sitting in washington they want, but it still doesn't change the fact that their well being depended on the levee functioning correctly as well as the city's pumps. The Electrical for the pumps at all the station were below sea level. Awesome. Putting the electrical above sealevel would have saved the city from the flood, and it wouldn't have cost millions to do it either. The failure to make those improvements alone are squarely on the shoulders of the local government. They didn't care.

This is what happens when you let the federal government get to big and command too many things. People that live 100 miles away from you don't care about your local problems.

I don't remember exactly why the 17th breach occured....I belive the soil in the canal side of the wall was displaced.

[Bronco_Beerslug]

It failed because of the hurricane...they weren't improved years prior because of a lack of attention. Now....they and you can blame all the people sitting in washington they want, but it still doesn't change the fact that their well being depended on the levee functioning correctly as well as the city's pumps. The Electrical for the pumps at all the station were below sea level. Awesome. Putting the electrical above sealevel would have saved the city from the flood, and it wouldn't have cost millions to do it either. The failure to make those improvements alone are squarely on the shoulders of the local government. They didn't care.

This is what happens when you let the federal government get to big and command too many things. People that live 100 miles away from you don't care about your local problems.

I don't remember exactly why the 17th breach occured....I belive the soil in the canal side of the wall was displaced. No, the pumps wouldn't have saved the city, the volume of water couldn't be moved by any number of pumps.

It wasn't because the levees weren't maintained it was because they weren't engineered correctly. Jobs that large can't be performed by local authorities.

Go to the site and read the sidebars and this entire article to get a clearer picture of what happened.

---------------------------------------------------
Why Did the 17th Street Canal Levee Fail?
by David Kestenbaum

The levee failures around New Orleans rank among the worst engineering disasters of all time. Some of the breaches can be blamed purely on the storm -- it was huge, after all.

But investigators are finding that other failures were due to engineering flaws. The London Avenue Canal and the 17th Street Canal both failed when water had only risen part of the way up the wall. Had those walls held, large sections of New Orleans might have stayed dry.

George Sins knows this well. He could see the wall of the 17th Street Canal from his kitchen -- when he had a kitchen. The wall was there at the back of his yard, atop a long mound of earth. The canal was behind it; it ran from Lake Pontrachain, through his neighborhood and on for about two miles. He never gave it much thought.

Sins and his neighbors trusted the wall had been well built. The U.S. Army Corps of Engineers had a reputation for overbuilding things, and the local levee boards sometimes complained that the Corps' standards were too high.

A Televised Water World

When hurricane Katrina threatened, Sins and his wife did the prudent thing and evacuated. After the storm hit, he had one of those weird modern moments: He saw his house on television. News cameras on helicopters were flying over the 17th Street Canal. He could see the circular window on his second floor, but the rest of the house was underwater.

The cameras showed a huge gash in the 17th Street Canal, about four doors down from his home. The canal connected to Lake Pontchartrain a few more blocks down, and water from the lake was pouring into the neighborhood through the gash. And it wasn't stopping. New Orleans was filling up, becoming an extension of the lake. To the east, the London Avenue Canal also broke -- in three places.

When Sins returned home, he found he'd been living closer to nature than he'd fully appreciated, because now it was in his swimming pool. He found fish, crabs and four turtles. "Three of them were gigantic, bigger than a big watermelon," he says, "way too big to get out with a fishing net."

Sins' house is now gutted, and he doesn't hesitate when you ask him whom he blames for all the misery. "The federal government," he says. "Absolutely."

'Hold the Corps Accountable!'

Across the street by a mangled garage door, someone else has hung a banner that reads "Hold the Corps Accountable!"

The Army Corps of Engineers oversaw the entire hurricane-protection system. The Corps is not terribly popular in town these days. One official says employees have been spit at in public meetings. And they don't always wear their bright red shirts with the castles on them when they go out anymore.

Sins believes the Army Corps botched the design for the canal walls. He talks about it as if anyone could have done a better job.
(CONTINUED)
http://tinyurl.com/gbdq4

[bendog]

God damn, you guys shift more blame than either the voters of the bushii "administration."

But what's interesting, imo, is that but for Nagin getting 20% of the white vote, Landreu was mayor. I didn't follow the election, so I don't know why. But, Nagin was the White Guy's candidate in his first campaign.

Keep in mind, it's IMPOSSIBLE to evacuate a million people people from NOLA in 48 hours, esp when you've got upwards of 250K who can't make it out on their own.

There's no doubt the corp screwed up. But, it's impossible to build the levees up river that keep the river from depositing soil to make the marsh like stuff at the mouth of the river. So, the corp is handed an impossible job.

There's no doubt that LA's congressional delegation put economic stuff over storm.

I don't think either Nagin or Landreau has come out for total demolition of the 9th ward to make it a flood plane. If all those people come back, the same thing, or worse, will happen again.

It's not totally unlike the Gulf Coast of Mississippi, where the people who had the lovely Modest single family houses in places like Pass Christian will probably never rebuild. Casinos and Condos are the future. Casinos are replaceable, and condos can be built to washthrough and be insured.

[defenseman]

IF you live below sea level, IF a large hurricane rolls in, well, mother nature doesn't care about how well a city is protected. From where I sit, they have been rolling the dice anyway for years. History has proven that living in a "fishbowl" doesn't bode when big storms roll in (especially below sea level fishbowls), well, history played out again. They re-build , and park themselves in the middle of a fishbowl again, they deserve no assistance. They rolled the dice , and lost. I would not support them with any cash or whatever if they are stupid enough to lose everything "AGAIN", when the logical answer is move to higher ground. Have no sympathy for them if it happens again...dman

*Gravity, water seeking it's on level, pressure of rushing water, etc...etc...etc... are cold hard facts. If you roll the dice with mother nature, she will get you eventually.

[bendog]

IF you live below sea level, IF a large hurricane rolls in, well, mother nature doesn't care about how well a city is protected. From where I sit, they have been rolling the dice anyway for years. History has proven that living in a "fishbowl" doesn't bode when big storms roll in (especially below sea level fishbowls), well, history played out again. They re-build , and park themselves in the middle of a fishbowl again, they deserve no assistance. They rolled the dice , and lost. I would not support them with any cash or whatever if they are stupid enough to lose everything "AGAIN", when the logical answer is move to higher ground. Have no sympathy for them if it happens again...dman

*Gravity, water seeking it's on level, pressure of rushing water, etc...etc...etc... are cold hard facts. If you roll the dice with mother nature, she will get you eventually.

Pretty much agree. Though in Mississippi, people twenty-five feet above sea level lost everything to a thirty foot storm surge, after they'd been told waves don't get that high. Making it more ironic, the insurance companies won't pay off for wind damage, if the water got to their level. Everybody knows the wind blew roofs off before the storm surge took it down to the concrete pad, but unless you've got eyewitness testimony to that effect, the insurance companies have told people to jack off. I think people are getting partial wind payoffs if they had partial flooding, but it's still obvious tha the roof went too.

[Bronco_Beerslug]

There's no doubt the corp screwed up. But, it's impossible to build the levees up river that keep the river from depositing soil to make the marsh like stuff at the mouth of the river. So, the corp is handed an impossible job.

.
No, if the ACE wouldn't have fudged construction guidelines the levees hold and most flooding is avoided.

[bendog]

No, if the ACE wouldn't have fudged construction guidelines the levees hold and most flooding is avoided.
Possibly. But bottom line, so long as the midwest pols demand no flooding up stream, the River becomes a faster more dangerous animal downstream, which in turn destroys the marshland, and makes L. Ponchatrain even more of a problem to levee.

They've to to levy the River, and then levy the Lake, and I don't know how they levy the ocean. Damn city's got water on three sides.

IMO defensman is correct. Geographically, it's not a place for a major American city. It's culturally important, and economically very important.

[defenseman]

The insurance companies? Well , thats another story. Based on current events, IF an insurance company insures anyone in new orleans, florida, mississippi, etc....Hurricane insurance in hurricane prone areas they need to PAY UP!!! If not, they should be sued. Bottom line: if they take a homeowners good hard earned money, they're money is just as good repairing the damage to any home from a hurricane. The home owners need to sue the s**t out of the insurance company , I don't care if they bankrupt them or not, they took money for hurricane insurance, they need to pay out. IF a homeowner DID NOT pay for that type of specific insurance, sorry charlie, you're s**t out of luck. You rolled the dice, and lost...dman

[TailgateNut]

IF you live below sea level, IF a large hurricane rolls in, well, mother nature doesn't care about how well a city is protected. From where I sit, they have been rolling the dice anyway for years. History has proven that living in a "fishbowl" doesn't bode when big storms roll in (especially below sea level fishbowls), well, history played out again. They re-build , and park themselves in the middle of a fishbowl again, they deserve no assistance. They rolled the dice , and lost. I would not support them with any cash or whatever if they are stupid enough to lose everything "AGAIN", when the logical answer is move to higher ground. Have no sympathy for them if it happens again...dman

*Gravity, water seeking it's on level, pressure of rushing water, etc...etc...etc... are cold hard facts. If you roll the dice with mother nature, she will get you eventually.

To address your comment regarding "parking themselves in the middle of a fishbowl again". This happens in many hurricane prone areas of the country. Although the Outer banks of NC aren't below sea level, they are in fact so close to sea level they see flooding almost annually. The homes which are destroyed are rebuilt as soon as the water recedes. This is something only insurance companies can prevent, by not renewing/ re-insuring properties which are destined to be destroyed by mother nature. Residents of these areas will continue to re-build as long as they do not have to foot the bill for their losses.

[bendog]

To address your comment regarding "parking themselves in the middle of a fishbowl again". This happens in many hurricane prone areas of the country. Although the Outer banks of NC aren't below sea level, they are in fact so close to sea level they see flooding almost annually. The homes which are destroyed are rebuilt as soon as the water recedes. This is something only insurance companies can prevent, by not renewing/ re-insuring properties which are destined to be destroyed by mother nature. Residents of these areas will continue to re-build as long as they do not have to foot the bill for their losses.
Aren't the rates for the insurance high enough so the insurance companies don't take losses? Or, are the "inlanders" paying higher rates to keep the Outer Banks insured?

PS, the "chocolate" portions of Nola that flooded weren't insured. That's the issue there, govt housing in flood zones. Nine feet below sea level ... the waters coming in. Ninth ward's flooded over and over again. There are also the places that flooded in Kenner and Metarie. Those areas have not flooded in the past to that degree. I'm not sure what caused that. Levies? Pumps? Both. But those people seem to be down there, scraping the mold out of their houses.

[TailgateNut]

Aren't the rates for the insurance high enough so the insurance companies don't take losses? Or, are the "inlanders" paying higher rates to keep the Outer Banks insured?

PS, the "chocolate" portions of Nola that flooded weren't insured. That's the issue there, govt housing in flood zones. Nine feet below sea level ... the waters coming in. Ninth ward's flooded over and over again. There are also the places that flooded in Kenner and Metarie. Those areas have not flooded in the past to that degree. I'm not sure what caused that. Levies? Pumps? Both. But those people seem to be down there, scraping the mold out of their houses.


I'm not sure how the flood insurance riders work. I just know that while I lived on the east coast, the outer banks were hit on several occasions, and the residents always return to rebuild. Maybe we have some insurance "gurus" who can clarify!

[defenseman]

From where I sit, if you live in a flood prone area, hurricanes, whatever......THEY should foot the bill, not anyone else for the additional cost of insurance. As for constantly rebuilding, I'm not going to comment on the "common sense" factor that appears non existent. If they pay through te nose for the right insurance , fine have at it, BUT the FED GOVT should not have to foot the bill IF it is an obviously flood prone area, I do not want my tax dollars being handed to people that can't make a logical decision based on loss of everything, let alone ones life. Pay the insurance, continue to rebuild, it's like building sand castles at low tide, not real smart if you ask me.....dman

[Smiling Assassin27]

When did they say that about Katrina? I have never heard anyone say to the effect that New Orleans residents "deserved" Katrina from anybody, right or left.

exactly. rhetoric is really ugly sometimes. New Orleans deserved this like India deserved a tsunami. this was something that could not be controlled. an election, on the other hand, can be. what i've seen of Nagin does not compel me to vote for him as he was part of the problem and not part of the solution, IMO. hey, they elected Marion Berry in DC even after he showed his true character. best of luck to New Orleans and Nagin.

[defenseman]

exactly. rhetoric is really ugly sometimes. New Orleans deserved this like India deserved a tsunami. this was something that could not be controlled. an election, on the other hand, can be. what i've seen of Nagin does not compel me to vote for him as he was part of the problem and not part of the solution, IMO. hey, they elected Marion Berry in DC even after he showed his true character. best of luck to New Orleans and Nagin.

they elected him again? If I recall, him and the governor both starting casting stones at the govt. shortly after the hurricane ended. It's all the governments fault....well to each his own. I'm guessing that NO will figure out they made a huge mistake in the near future...dman

[Garcia Bronco]

"No, the pumps wouldn't have saved the city, the volume of water couldn't be moved by any number of pumps.

It wasn't because the levees weren't maintained it was because they weren't engineered correctly. Jobs that large can't be performed by local authorities.

Go to the site and read the sidebars and this entire article to get a clearer picture of what happened."

The reason people claim bad engineering is because they used "I walls" and metal slats(sp) that only extended 25 feet into the ground. The history channel had a great special on it...mock saw it as well. The new walls are to be "t walls" and the slta will go 100 feet deep.

The Pumps were keeping up just fine until they lost electrical....the pumps need electricity to run. It wouldn't have stopped the breach...but the city wouldn't have been 80 percent under water either. Remember...that was the problem....the flooding

[Garcia Bronco]

No, if the ACE wouldn't have fudged construction guidelines the levees hold and most flooding is avoided.

You should see the history channel show iwas talking about...ecuse me...Discovery Channel....it layed it all out.

If you really want to blame someone...blame the French they settled the place.

[Bronco_Beerslug]

You should see the history channel show iwas talking about...ecuse me...Discovery Channel....it layed it all out.

If you really want to blame someone...blame the French they settled the place.
Read that link I gave you. It shows that the base (soil) they used wasn't adequate. This was in the 80's and 90's. That's why two of the main levees failed not they were topped.

[TailgateNut]

Read that link I gave you. It shows that the base (soil) they used wasn't adequate. This was in the 80's and 90's. That's why two of the main levees failed not they were topped.


Attempting to construct a retaining structure which is supported/ counterbalanced by using a permeable material will eventually lead to a failure if moisture is allowed to infiltrate to the supporting material. A suitable "cap" may have prevented the inevitable. I don't know if this was a design flaw or a construction error/ oversight or a combination of both.

[defenseman]

Read that link I gave you. It shows that the base (soil) they used wasn't adequate. This was in the 80's and 90's. That's why two of the main levees failed not they were topped.

And this is GW's fault? I'm thinking not. And, to be honest to build protection for the city of New Orleans protecting it from a cat 5 hurricane, costing Billions and Billions and BILLIONS of dollars of OUR money. JUST, so they can inexplicably live in flood prone area tens of feet below sea level, ON THE OCEAN is just plain stupidity. They want to rebuild? Let them. If I had the opportunity NONE of my tax money would go to them rebuilding, JUST helping them relocate and taking care of those displaced , children and all. Of course, it doesn't matter if it "makes sense" or not, the government doesn't have the intestinal fortitude to call rebuilding certian parts of the city , just plain stupid for fear of being labeled " racists" , which they undoubtedly would be labeled exactly that. When in fact, it's just good engineering sense to avoid the area for the sake of lives and property...dman

[Bronco_Beerslug]

And this is GW's fault?
Nope, but he did cut ACE funding for the levees twice, and did nothing for two days. My point is people trying to blame the local city officials for the levees failing when it was and has been under federal government control.

[defenseman]

too a point I blame one thing, mother nature......there may have been many things the local officials and the government could have done better, HINDSIGHT is 20/20. The fact is , New Orleans is a below sea level fish bowl RIPE for the taking by a huge storm no matter how you stack it. Just plain stupidity to buck mother nature and the engineering requirements of this type of endeavor. Again, americans , in general, love their scapegoats. I'm blaming no one but mother nature. Build there again? Plain idiocy, they have learned what can happen when you sleep in a lions den, why put your pillow down there again? Waste of money and people's lives again will be in the balance..dman

[Garcia Bronco]

Read that link I gave you. It shows that the base (soil) they used wasn't adequate. This was in the 80's and 90's. That's why two of the main levees failed not they were topped.

One was topped...but it displaced the soil on the other side...not the side in the canal. Bottom line...and as you shown...they've known for quite awhile the problems they could face...but they failed to act. Was the response at the federal level great...no....but that failure is at many levels across the board. Had they moved the electrical for the pumps above sea level though...that city wouldn't have been 80 percent submerged...and what flooding they did have would have been cleaned out within 20 hours. That would have saved a ton of lives..property..and faith in the government in the region.

[TailgateNut]

One was topped...but it displaced the soil on the other side...not the side in the canal. Bottom line...and as you shown...they've known for quite awhile the problems they could face...but they failed to act. Was the response at the federal level great...no....but that failure is at many levels across the board. Had they moved the electrical for the pumps above sea level though...that city wouldn't have been 80 percent submerged...and what flooding they did have would have been cleaned out within 20 hours. That would have saved a ton of lives..property..and faith in the government in the region.


.....AND the people in SF know that the "BIG ONE" is coming (they should move or stock up on Super Glue).....and the people on the Outer Banks WILL get hit again( they should not rebuild or have they barrier Islands moved).....
and the Miami Oceanfront is due for a big hit by a hurricane (they should stop building high rise hotels on dynamically compacted sand).....
We're talking about fighting mother Nature, a losing battle at best!

[Garcia Bronco]

.....AND the people in SF know that the "BIG ONE" is coming (they should move or stock up on Super Glue).....and the people on the Outer Banks WILL get hit again( they should not rebuild or have they barrier Islands moved).....
and the Miami Oceanfront is due for a big hit by a hurricane (they should stop building high rise hotels on dynamically compacted sand).....
We're talking about fighting mother Nature, a losing battle at best!


The folks in Iceland do a good job. Bottom line...there is a right way to do it...and a wrong way to do....why do they allow people to keep building costal properties that can be blown down? It's like DMan says...idiocy. Living close to the OBX myself....at least down there they have a plan...and when they say get out...the people get out.

[TailgateNut]

The folks in Iceland do a good job. Bottom line...there is a right way to do it...and a wrong way to do....why do they allow people to keep building costal properties that can be blown down? It's like DMan says...idiocy. Living close to the OBX myself....at least down there they have a plan...and when they say get out...the people get out.


OBX???

[defenseman]

California, big one? Soon enough. What have they done to prepare? I don't know. And honestly, I don't want to contribute one red cent to it either. If they want to live there, let em. The experts say they are due, and when it happens well, it's katy bar the door. Hope they have earthquake insurance. But , short of help with food shelter and medical care, I don't think we should be doing any sort of rebuilding. Sounds like a city or state issue to me. I'm SURE the govt will be blamed for alot of the 20/20 hindsight stuff, being as they are americans. They incur the cost. Outer banks, Miami, etc...etc...etc...hurricane prone areas and they SHOULD be carrying alot of hurricane insurance. And if they are, the insurance companies SHOULD pay out when the time comes. I'm sure the govt will send in disaster aide in the form of food, shelter, and stuff such as that, however, the Govt better not rebuild for them. Thats their cost, not mine...dman

[bendog]

"No, the pumps wouldn't have saved the city, the volume of water couldn't be moved by any number of pumps.

It wasn't because the levees weren't maintained it was because they weren't engineered correctly. Jobs that large can't be performed by local authorities.

Go to the site and read the sidebars and this entire article to get a clearer picture of what happened."

The reason people claim bad engineering is because they used "I walls" and metal slats(sp) that only extended 25 feet into the ground. The history channel had a great special on it...mock saw it as well. The new walls are to be "t walls" and the slta will go 100 feet deep.

The Pumps were keeping up just fine until they lost electrical....the pumps need electricity to run. It wouldn't have stopped the breach...but the city wouldn't have been 80 percent under water either. Remember...that was the problem....the flooding

That is my recollection. Natl Geog also had an article eerily a few months before Katrina. Residents there, and one of my wife's bridesmaid's fathers was an engineer on the levies back in the 1960s and 70s, regularly "joked" about the big one that would kill ten thousand of the lesser socially advantaged, not that they thought there was anything funny about it, but that if/when a cat 4-5 hit head on it would happen and there wasn't/isn't jack ****e anybody can do. There are 12-16 highway lanes leading over the water. Be on one, or stay. How can any govt get all those poor people out? They don't want jobs, but even if they did, they don't have the skills to even get one. They cannot take basic survival measures for themselves. Hell, how are they gonna get to the school bus, when they obviously weren't on the school bus when they were kids and shoulda been on the school bus.

I'm still curious about the vote. Landreau who was running is the son of Moon Landreau, the last white mayor, who also happens to be Mary's daddy. 20% of the white folks voted for Nagin. I'm just curious. It's not so much black/white, to me. Landreau's admin was supposedly terribily corrupt. Mark Moreal, the first black mayor was a reform candidate, and from what I heard he did make things a bit better.

But Nagin's on natl tv taking about how children are being raped in the superdome, and blaming the fed govt, when we know know children in fact were not being raped in the superdome. Now what was happening in the poorer neighborhoods where the gangs were sniping at the cops, God only knows. His admin apparantly told hundreds of cops to not come in to work until the day after Katrina hit. Ummm, how did they think these guys would even get to work, assuming they didn't just 'opt out' of the riots? Then, there's the "chocolate city" crap. If I'm living in NOLA I WANT the gangs to stay in Hou. The Bushs frigging deserve them.

[TailgateNut]

here's a tidbit regarding idependant investigation into leevee failures!


http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/12916214/

[TailgateNut]

California, big one? Soon enough. What have they done to prepare? I don't know. And honestly, I don't want to contribute one red cent to it either. If they want to live there, let em. The experts say they are due, and when it happens well, it's katy bar the door. Hope they have earthquake insurance. But , short of help with food shelter and medical care, I don't think we should be doing any sort of rebuilding. Sounds like a city or state issue to me. I'm SURE the govt will be blamed for alot of the 20/20 hindsight stuff, being as they are americans. They incur the cost. Outer banks, Miami, etc...etc...etc...hurricane prone areas and they SHOULD be carrying alot of hurricane insurance. And if they are, the insurance companies SHOULD pay out when the time comes. I'm sure the govt will send in disaster aide in the form of food, shelter, and stuff such as that, however, the Govt better not rebuild for them. Thats their cost, not mine...dman


I'm still waiting for that "Insurance Guru" to speak up. I was under the impression that part of the flood insurance is goverment funded.???

[Garcia Bronco]

OBX???


Outer Banks

[defenseman]

Tailgate, I believe you are correct however I'm not sure. I'm thinking the govt covers a portion of all disasters to a degree, but it's only a small piece of the pie if you know what I mean...dman

[Garcia Bronco]

I'm still waiting for that "Insurance Guru" to speak up. I was under the impression that part of the flood insurance is goverment funded.???


If there is such a thing as government subsidized flood insurance...you can bet it works like anything else the government touches. If you live below sea level..no bank will write a note on a property with out flood insurance...and if you bank with a big bank that does insurance...they'll just force add the premium to your principle.

[defenseman]

Okay, first for the govt. to provide aide it must be declared a disaster area. Second, the govt does provide "aide" but often this is a low interest loan only that the homeowner needs to pay back. The government will not loan money for rebuilding without getting the money paid back by the consumer. There's your answer. The ONLY way to ensure you do not have to pay is Flood insurance from a private company...dman

[defenseman]

Go to Floodsmart.gov.........dman

[defenseman]

In addition, IF you did NOT purchase SPECIFICALLY flood insurance through one of about 80 insurance companies who are backed by the federal government AND you are flooded out. Guess what, your homeowners policy (most likely anyway) does not cover your rebuilding cost. Right now, some of the homes in New orleans were NOT damaged by the wind, however, flooded out. Due to the nature of the natural disaster, the insurance companies have been compelled to pay out for full rebuilding. Guess who is paying for this? why of course, we are. Second, rates are calculated by state, what happens in one cannot affect the other theoretically, and rates are based on potential damage due to future natural disasters (the crystal ball method). That said, the rate you are paying today is based on the predicted disasters of tomorrow, so , in short, the insurance companies will never go broke. Interesting scenario..dman

[TailgateNut]

In addition, IF you did NOT purchase SPECIFICALLY flood insurance through one of about 80 insurance companies who are backed by the federal government AND you are flooded out. Guess what, your homeowners policy (most likely anyway) does not cover your rebuilding cost. Right now, some of the homes in New orleans were NOT damaged by the wind, however, flooded out. Due to the nature of the natural disaster, the insurance companies have been compelled to pay out for full rebuilding. Guess who is paying for this? why of course, we are. Second, rates are calculated by state, what happens in one cannot affect the other theoretically, and rates are based on potential damage due to future natural disasters (the crystal ball method). That said, the rate you are paying today is based on the predicted disasters of tomorrow, so , in short, the insurance companies will never go broke. Interesting scenario..dman

HMMM! wonder what this implies?

[bendog]

"It has to be affordable," Cleaves said. "We had families in Canton that told us they knew they should buy the flood insurance, but they were too poor to pay for it."

Iuppa said that under current federal law, a policy covering $250,000 in flood damage can cost $400 to $500 a year
http://www.bangornews.com/news/templates/?a=134166

ummm, I'm not rich, and when I had to have this insurance when I first bought my house I made a lot less than I do now, but the cost really wasn't that much in relation to the total mortgage/tax issue. When I re-fied, I dropped it. We had a flood in the 70s when the whizbangs who monitor the local damn paniced. I turned out the ditch at the bottom of my yard was "swamped" when the sewers failed. My house is on a hill twenty-five feet above the ditch at the bottom of the front yard. If the damn ever fails, I'll be in deep insurance ****.

From my perspective what's happened is that the feds let people buy in post flood. In some cases that's prolly fair. Iowa and Minny flooded a few years back with "a hundred year's" flood on the upper Miss. With Katrina, brokers had actually told people, "your house is thirty feet above sea level. We don't have tusamis in the Gulf."

When we're talking private insurors, I dunno. Homeowners insurance doesn't cover flood. Post-Katriana the insurance companies in many cases refuse to pay for wind damage, saying instead it was flood, when eveyone knows it was both. Then they wanted to raise rates 200-300% in "the wind plane." Now, 10-100 miles inland, they've had massive claims. I job by two houses with ongoing construction funded from the hurrincane, and I live 100 miles inland, and have no desire to move closer to shore.

But our insurance commissioner is opposing the rate increases on just those in the wind plane, wherever that really is. Instead he says the rising cost should be borne by EVERYONE in the state. Well, I voted against the bastard last time, and will do so next time too.

[Rohirrim]

The biggest earthquake in recorded American history took place in 1811 along the New Madrid fault which runs through Missouri along the Mississippi River. It was estimated at 8.5 and witnesses at the time said the Mississippi River ran backwards. Another quake along that fault could slam every city between St. Louis and Memphis. That fault is on a two hundred year cycle. Many geologists believe that the area is already overdue for a big one. What have those people done about it? Nada.

In the past three centuries, major earthquakes outside of California and Alaska generally occurred in sparsely-settled areas, and damage and fatalities were largely minimal. But some took place in areas that have since been heavily built up. Among them are three earthquakes that occurred in 1811 and 1812 near New Madrid, MO. They are among the Great earthquakes of known history, affecting the topography more than any other earthquake on the North American continent. Judging from their effects, they were of a magnitude of 8.0 or higher on the Richter Scale. They were felt over the entire United States outside of the Pacific coast. Large areas sank into the earth, new lakes were formed, the course of the Mississippi River was changed, and forests were destroyed over an area of 150,000 acres. Many houses at New Madrid were thrown down. "Houses, gardens, and fields were swallowed up" one source notes. But fatalities and damage were low, because the area was sparsely settled then.
http://hsv.com/genlintr/newmadrd/

Keep looking at the West Coast. ;D

[Garcia Bronco]

In addition, IF you did NOT purchase SPECIFICALLY flood insurance through one of about 80 insurance companies who are backed by the federal government AND you are flooded out. Guess what, your homeowners policy (most likely anyway) does not cover your rebuilding cost. Right now, some of the homes in New orleans were NOT damaged by the wind, however, flooded out. Due to the nature of the natural disaster, the insurance companies have been compelled to pay out for full rebuilding. Guess who is paying for this? why of course, we are. Second, rates are calculated by state, what happens in one cannot affect the other theoretically, and rates are based on potential damage due to future natural disasters (the crystal ball method). That said, the rate you are paying today is based on the predicted disasters of tomorrow, so , in short, the insurance companies will never go broke. Interesting scenario..dman


It always takes stuff like this to remind me of how lucky we are to live in this great country, because in other places...most of the places....these allowances would not be afforded by the population as a whole.

[defenseman]

HMMM! wonder what this implies?

I don't think it implies anything. A fact is a fact...dman

[Garcia Bronco]

Flood insurance isn't expensive.....the problem is most Americans don't live within their means.

[bendog]

The biggest earthquake in recorded American history took place in 1811 along the New Madrid fault which runs through Missouri along the Mississippi River. It was estimated at 8.5 and witnesses at the time said the Mississippi River ran backwards. Another quake along that fault could slam every city between St. Louis and Memphis. That fault is on a two hundred year cycle. Many geologists believe that the area is already overdue for a big one. What have those people done about it? Nada.

In the past three centuries, major earthquakes outside of California and Alaska generally occurred in sparsely-settled areas, and damage and fatalities were largely minimal. But some took place in areas that have since been heavily built up. Among them are three earthquakes that occurred in 1811 and 1812 near New Madrid, MO. They are among the Great earthquakes of known history, affecting the topography more than any other earthquake on the North American continent. Judging from their effects, they were of a magnitude of 8.0 or higher on the Richter Scale. They were felt over the entire United States outside of the Pacific coast. Large areas sank into the earth, new lakes were formed, the course of the Mississippi River was changed, and forests were destroyed over an area of 150,000 acres. Many houses at New Madrid were thrown down. "Houses, gardens, and fields were swallowed up" one source notes. But fatalities and damage were low, because the area was sparsely settled then.
http://hsv.com/genlintr/newmadrd/

Keep looking at the West Coast. ;D

I had that thought. Having lived their briefly during the 70s, supposedly the high rises in LA are built to not collapse. Of course .... the levies weren't supposed to ... melt.

But, at the same time, I really question whether my "wind" insurance should be raised to make insurance for someone who chooses to live beachside affordable.

It's a degree of assumed risks I know. I don't get too poed when a co-worker comes down with lung cancer cause they smoked and didn't quit, yet I get really poed when some medicaid guy has a brain injury cause he was too lazy to fasten his seatbelt. Hypocrite? Maybe.

[defenseman]

Flood insurance isn't expensive.....the problem is most Americans don't live within their means.

I would venture to guess a majority of americans do not live with their means. I agree. What percentage? Who knows. They need to enjoy what they SHOULD instead of what they THINK they should, quit keeping up with the Jones'. Their lives would be simplier, trust me, and their kids will thank them later on for it...dman

[Garcia Bronco]

I would venture to guess a majority of americans do not live with their means. I agree. What percentage? Who knows. They need to enjoy what they SHOULD instead of what they THINK they should, quit keeping up with the Jones'. Their lives would be simplier, trust me, and their kids will thank them later on for it...dman


I think more people that own homes can save money and be productive by doing their own yard work. Plus...it's an opportunity to discuss ideas and techniques with the neighbors.

[defenseman]

I do my own yard work. Both my neighbors shell out between 150-200 bucks every 3 weeks or so. Then again, both my boys have plenty of muscle power. When it comes to planting though, they don't know a whole lot. This summer we'll be in training for that. Carrying around some of those damn trees with their huge root balls can be a pain, perfect for my two sons to build some more stamina..dman

*Total backyard landscaping in store for the back yard I'm guessing 4000-4500K in materials. LOTS of backbreaking manual labor, but in the end it will save me a bundle.

[DBruleU]

I do my own yard work. Both my neighbors shell out between 150-200 bucks every 3 weeks or so. Then again, both my boys have plenty of muscle power. When it comes to planting though, they don't know a whole lot. This summer we'll be in training for that. Carrying around some of those damn trees with their huge root balls can be a pain, perfect for my two sons to build some more stamina..dman

*Total backyard landscaping in store for the back yard I'm guessing 4000-4500K in materials. LOTS of backbreaking manual labor, but in the end it will save me a bundle.

My parents have been making me do the same thing sicne I finished finals.

They have recently dropped about 15000k to 20000k to redo their backyard. Lots of rock and a new patio area. Theres alot you can do with 4 acres of land apparently.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

CHRONOLOGY:

Here's a timeline that outlines the fate of both FEMA and flood control projects in New Orleans under the Bush administration. Read it and weep:

*

January 2001: Bush appoints Joe Allbaugh, a crony from Texas, as head of FEMA. Allbaugh has no previous experience in disaster management.

*

April 2001: Budget Director Mitch Daniels announces the Bush administration's goal of privatizing much of FEMA's work. In May, Allbaugh confirms that FEMA will be downsized: "Many are concerned that federal disaster assistance may have evolved into both an oversized entitlement program...." he said. "Expectations of when the federal government should be involved and the degree of involvement may have ballooned beyond what is an appropriate level."

*

2001: FEMA designates a major hurricane hitting New Orleans as one of the three "likeliest, most catastrophic disasters facing this country."

*

December 2002: After less than two years at FEMA, Allbaugh announces he is leaving to start up a consulting firm that advises companies seeking to do business in Iraq. He is succeeded by his deputy, Michael Brown, who, like Allbaugh, has no previous experience in disaster management.

*

March 2003: FEMA is downgraded from a cabinet level position and folded into the Department of Homeland Security. Its mission is refocused on fighting acts of terrorism.

*

2003: Under its new organization chart within DHS, FEMA's preparation and planning functions are reassigned to a new Office of Preparedness and Response. FEMA will henceforth focus only on response and recovery.

*

Summer 2004: FEMA denies Louisiana's pre-disaster mitigation funding requests. Says Jefferson Parish flood zone manager Tom Rodrigue: "You would think we would get maximum consideration....This is what the grant program called for. We were more than qualified for it."

*

June 2004: The Army Corps of Engineers budget for levee construction in New Orleans is slashed. Jefferson Parish emergency management chiefs Walter Maestri comments: "It appears that the money has been moved in the president's budget to handle homeland security and the war in Iraq, and I suppose that's the price we pay."

*

June 2005: Funding for the New Orleans district of the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers is cut by a record $71.2 million. One of the hardest-hit areas is the Southeast Louisiana Urban Flood Control Project, which was created after the May 1995 flood to improve drainage in Jefferson, Orleans and St. Tammany parishes.

*

August 2005: While New Orleans is undergoing a slow motion catastrophe, Bush mugs for the cameras, cuts a cake for John McCain, plays the guitar for Mark Wills, delivers an address about V-J day, and continues with his vacation. When he finally gets around to acknowledging the scope of the unfolding disaster, he delivers only a photo op on Air Force One and a flat, defensive, laundry list speech in the Rose Garden.

So: A crony with no relevant experience was installed as head of FEMA. Mitigation budgets for New Orleans were slashed even though it was known to be one of the top three risks in the country. FEMA was deliberately downsized as part of the Bush administration's conservative agenda to reduce the role of government. After DHS was created, FEMA's preparation and planning functions were taken away.

Actions have consequences. No one could predict that a hurricane the size of Katrina would hit this year, but the slow federal response when it did happen was no accident. It was the result of four years of deliberate Republican policy and budget choices that favor ideology and partisan loyalty at the expense of operational competence. It's the Bush administration in a nutshell.

http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/arc..._09/007023.php

[Hogan11]

Report Targets New Orleans Levee Agency By CAIN BURDEAU, Associated Press Writer
1 hour, 39 minutes ago

NEW ORLEANS - The federal agency responsible for maintaining the city's levees is dysfunctional and needs to be overhauled to prevent future catastrophic flooding, scientists said in a report released Monday.

ADVERTISEMENT

The group also said routine underfunding of the city's levee system was to blame for flooding during Hurricane Katrina.

"You tend to get what you pay for," Dave Rogers, a member of the team of academics who extensively studied the system, said during a news conference.

The team, led by the University of California, Berkeley, looked into what went wrong last August when Katrina's storm surge overwhelmed New Orleans' flood defenses, killing more than 1,300 people.

The scientists have been highly critical of the Corps of Engineers, which was in charge of designing and building the complicated flood-protection system, and recommended setting up an independent oversight agency.

"You can't understand a dysfunctional family from the inside," said Robert Bea, a lead researcher on the team.

Lt. Col. Stan Heath, a Corps spokesman in Washington, D.C., said the agency will evaluate relevant recommendations. A Corps-commissioned report is due out June 1, the first day of hurricane season.

The report on Monday called for an overhaul of the local agencies that oversee flood protection. It took aim at Congress for its piecemeal funding over the past 50 years, and at state and local levee authorities for failing to properly oversee maintenance of the levees.

Bea said it could cost $40 billion over 40 years to build an adequate flood protection system for New Orleans. Since Katrina, Congress has appropriated $3.3 billion for levee work, and President Bush has asked for $3.9 billion more.

The report also said floods overwhelmed levees and flood walls, both on the fringes and inside the city. Breaches were caused by weak soil in the levees, poor engineering and breakdowns in sections where different types of flood protection meet.

The Corps has been working to repair and upgrade the levee system before the start of hurricane season. However, Corps officials said part of the work will not be finished by then.

Raymond Seed, a member of the study team, said engineers must pay attention to other spots in the system that may fail if another hurricane hits New Orleans: "The next weakest link is the one you have to be worried about."

[broncocalijohn]

That's what the right-wing handjobs said about Katrina.

Pathetic. :pity:
LABF, what is pathetic the fact that once again blacks voted for a total incompetent fool who loved to throw the blame around for his horrible leadership. I told you before that for 90% of blacks vote for the "D" no matter what the person has done in politics or life. Chalk this one up as another "retarded" vote and no i dont need a white hood. RETARDED is the label those citizens deserve! THE THREAD WAS STARTED AS TO ASk HOW THE CITIZENS OF NO could reelect this Nagin guy. LABF loves to jump on the Bush is the problem line. Nice hijacking the thread. Regardless of Bush's f up, he isnt up for reelection! Jus tanswer the question to start. Stop backing Nagin becasue of his "D" by his name and know that he was horrible before the hurricane, during and after. He isnt a leader and the voters screwed up.

[Bronco_Beerslug]

LABF, what is pathetic the fact that once again blacks voted for a total incompetent fool who loved to throw the blame around for his horrible leadership. I told you before that for 90% of blacks vote for the "D" no matter what the person has done in politics or life. Chalk this one up as another "retarded" vote and no i dont need a white hood. RETARDED is the label those citizens deserve! THE THREAD WAS STARTED AS TO ASk HOW THE CITIZENS OF NO could reelect this Nagin guy. LABF loves to jump on the Bush is the problem line. Nice hijacking the thread. Regardless of Bush's f up, he isnt up for reelection! Jus tanswer the question to start. Stop backing Nagin becasue of his "D" by his name and know that he was horrible before the hurricane, during and after. He isnt a leader and the voters screwed up.

So you're saying all the black voters are retarded? BTW do you happen to know how many white voters voted for him?

[bendog]

So you're saying all the black voters are retarded? BTW do you happen to know how many white voters voted for him?
What's funny is that he seems to not know that in his first election Nagin was actually the candidate supported by the white biz community, and in fact, the man in a millionare media exec, and reportedly was a goper before entering politics. What is interesting to me is that despite his relative incompetence, and use of the race card, 20% of the whites still voted for him over Moon Landreau's son.

[broncocalijohn]

So you're saying all the black voters are retarded? BTW do you happen to know how many white voters voted for him?

Only the ones who voted for him. Whites are included but i brought up blacks because a previous thread where i bashed blacks for voting "D" at a 90% clip. Just pointing out another dumbass, retarded vote by them as a group.

[defenseman]

Only the ones who voted for him. Whites are included but i brought up blacks because a previous thread where i bashed blacks for voting "D" at a 90% clip. Just pointing out another dumbass, retarded vote by them as a group.

I honestly wish, if the above is true, the average american no matter what their skin tone, would QUIT VOTING PARTIES. Get informed on the candidate, if you don't like the choices, write in "Bill O'rielly" or something. Ok, how about "Ralph Nader"......by not voting "straight ticket" you hopefully at least partially alleviate the politician posturing to get a certian groups vote. I'm sick of the whole thing.......dman

[broncocalijohn]

I honestly wish, if the above is true, the average american no matter what their skin tone, would QUIT VOTING PARTIES. Get informed on the candidate, if you don't like the choices, write in "Bill O'rielly" or something. Ok, how about "Ralph Nader"......by not voting "straight ticket" you hopefully at least partially alleviate the politician posturing to get a certian groups vote. I'm sick of the whole thing.......dman
that is why we need a 3rd party. I believe if it happens it will be a Conservative party that appeals to real republicans that arent high on the hog and southern democrats. Bush and McCain is making this a future reality.

[W*GS]

No one could predict that a hurricane the size of Katrina would hit this year, but the slow federal response when it did happen was no accident. It was the result of four years of deliberate Republican policy and budget choices that favor ideology and partisan loyalty at the expense of operational competence.

You're forgetting the decades of government (mis)management of the entire lower Mississippi and the NO region. If Katrina had struck NO 4 years ago, or 6 years ago, or 10 years ago, the result would have been much the same.

[defenseman]

You're forgetting the decades of government (mis)management of the entire lower Mississippi and the NO region. If Katrina had struck NO 4 years ago, or 6 years ago, or 10 years ago, the result would have been much the same.

it seems to me, that the state , and the local populace need to shoulder some of the blame on this. They, IMHO, needed to find a way to get it done. And they didn't. California is now in trouble with dike problems and cities not nearly up to speed wrt a major earthquake. What have they done "themselves" to get their house in order to protect their own state citizens?...dman

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

So you're saying all the black voters are retarded?

This wouldn't be the first time he's said something like this.

He makes no attempt to disguise his racist views.

[Spider]

I was in Lumberton Mississippi not to long ago , if Nagin was running in Miss , I dont think he gets 5% of the vote , but then the Chocolate city comment probably did him in there

[Bronco_Beerslug]

Only the ones who voted for him. Whites are included but i brought up blacks because a previous thread where i bashed blacks for voting "D" at a 90% clip. Just pointing out another dumbass, retarded vote by them as a group.
So do you have the number of blacks and whites that voted for each candidate or are you just calling the whole black community in the U.S. retarded for voting for democrats (and any whites who do too)?

[spdirty]

So do you have the number of blacks and whites that voted for each candidate or are you just calling the whole black community in th eU.S. retarded for voting for democrats?


Want me to spell it out for you?? God, he was saying that anyone who votes straight party line with no consideration as to who the candidate is, they are retarded dumb asses. Same goes for those who voted for Nagin.

[Bronco_Beerslug]

Want me to spell it out for you?? God, he was saying that anyone who votes straight party line with no consideration as to who the candidate is, they are retarded dumb asses. Same goes for those who voted for Nagin.
I'm not God but that's not exactly what he was saying but I'll let him try and and explain it again.

[Spider]

Want me to spell it out for you?? God, he was saying that anyone who votes straight party line with no consideration as to who the candidate is, they are retarded dumb asses. Same goes for those who voted for Nagin.
if you dont mind ........ I need to learn to speel better anyhow ;D

[spdirty]

I'm not God but that's not exactly what he was saying but I'll let him try and and explain it again.


OK, I'll give it another shot...and Ill explain it the way you see it. "Man, those blacks are soooo dumb and stupid they only voted for that idiot cuz he wanted a cholcolate city. Should be a vanila city if you ask me. Thats why Bush blew up the levees. And we need to get rid of the gays too. stupid wife better have those holes cut in my sheets right this time. Women are so dumb. Their place is barefoot, pregnant, and in the kitchen. Oh, time to go. Got a cross burning at 7 tonight."

Happy?

[Spider]

OK, I'll give it another shot...and Ill explain it the way you see it. "Man, those blacks are soooo dumb and stupid they only voted for that idiot cuz he wanted a cholcolate city. Should be a vanila city if you ask me. Thats why Bush blew up the levees. And we need to get rid of the gays too. stupid wife better have those holes cut in my sheets right this time. Women are so dumb. Their place is barefoot, pregnant, and in the kitchen. Oh, time to go. Got a cross burning at 7 tonight."

Happy?
So what are you saying ?

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

So do you have the number of blacks and whites that voted for each candidate or are you just calling the whole black community in the U.S. retarded for voting for democrats (and any whites who do too)?

He's saying that blacks (or, in his words, 90% of blacks) are retarded for voting Dem. He said the exact same thing not too long ago on another thread.

He wouldn't be the first wingnut on this board who has expressed this sentiment.

The implication is the 90% of blacks are too stupid to know which side their bread is buttered on.

[spdirty]

if you dont mind ........ I need to learn to speel better anyhow ;D


Only because Im in a good mood.;D

O-N-L-Y T-H-E O-N-E-S W-H-O V-O-T-E-D F-O-R H-I-M. W-H-I-T-E-S A-R-E I-N-C-L-U-D-E-D B-U-T I B-R-O-U-G-H-T U-P B-L-A-C-K-S B-E-C-A-U-S-E A P-R-E-V-I-O-U-S T-H-R-E-A-D W-H-E-R-E I B-A-S-H-E-D B-L-A-C-K-S F-O-R V-O-T-I-N-G "D" A-T A 9-0% C-L-I-P. J-U-S-T P-O-I-N-T-I-N-G O-U-T A-N-O-T-H-E-R D-U-M-B-A-S-S, R-E-T-A-R-D-E-D V-O-T-E F-O-R T-H-E-M A-S A G-R-O-U-P.

[Spider]

Only because Im in a good mood.;D

O-N-L-Y T-H-E O-N-E-S W-H-O V-O-T-E-D F-O-R H-I-M. W-H-I-T-E-S A-R-E I-N-C-L-U-D-E-D B-U-T I B-R-O-U-G-H-T U-P B-L-A-C-K-S B-E-C-A-U-S-E A P-R-E-V-I-O-U-S T-H-R-E-A-D W-H-E-R-E I B-A-S-H-E-D B-L-A-C-K-S F-O-R V-O-T-I-N-G "D" A-T A 9-0% C-L-I-P. J-U-S-T P-O-I-N-T-I-N-G O-U-T A-N-O-T-H-E-R D-U-M-B-A-S-S, R-E-T-A-R-D-E-D V-O-T-E F-O-R T-H-E-M A-S A G-R-O-U-P.
I got it you got laid ...............Iam a genius

[spdirty]

I got it you got laid ...............Iam a genius
Actually, she left to go to her cult meeting for 2 hours, so I have the house all to myself.!Booya!

[Spider]

Actually, she left to go to her cult meeting for 2 hours, so I have the house all to myself.!Booya!
Knuckle babies ;D

[Bronco_Beerslug]

OK, I'll give it another shot...and Ill explain it the way you see it. "Man, those blacks are soooo dumb and stupid they only voted for that idiot cuz he wanted a cholcolate city. Should be a vanila city if you ask me. Thats why Bush blew up the levees. And we need to get rid of the gays too. stupid wife better have those holes cut in my sheets right this time. Women are so dumb. Their place is barefoot, pregnant, and in the kitchen. Oh, time to go. Got a cross burning at 7 tonight."

Happy?

You missed again, I'll wait for him to explain what he meant.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Drudge a bullsh*tter?

Gosh, who woulda thunk?

Drudge 'retracts' story on Howard Dean after receiving letter from DNC lawyer

Conservative heavyweight Matt Drudge has all but retracted a story about Democratic National Committee chairman Howard Dean after receiving a letter from the DNC's lawyers, RAW STORY can report.

Saying he took the DNC at their word -- and declining to mention the fact he had received a letter from a DNC lawyer asking him to take the story down -- Drudge posted an update to a story claiming that Chairman Dean had intervened in the New Orleans mayoral race. His update noted that the DNC had vehemently denied the report.

"The DRUDGE REPORT takes chairman Dean and his spokesman at their word," Drudge wrote. He did not offer an explicit retraction.

DNC communications director Karen Finney said the move came only after the Committee's lawyer had penned a note to Drudge asking him to take the story down.

http://www.rawstory.com/news/2006/Drudge_retracts_story_on_Dean_after_0522.html

[spdirty]

Drudge a bullsh*tter?

Gosh, who woulda thunk?

Drudge 'retracts' story on Howard Dean after receiving letter from DNC lawyer

Conservative heavyweight Matt Drudge has all but retracted a story about Democratic National Committee chairman Howard Dean after receiving a letter from the DNC's lawyers, RAW STORY can report.

Saying he took the DNC at their word -- and declining to mention the fact he had received a letter from a DNC lawyer asking him to take the story down -- Drudge posted an update to a story claiming that Chairman Dean had intervened in the New Orleans mayoral race. His update noted that the DNC had vehemently denied the report.

"The DRUDGE REPORT takes chairman Dean and his spokesman at their word," Drudge wrote. He did not offer an explicit retraction.

DNC communications director Karen Finney said the move came only after the Committee's lawyer had penned a note to Drudge asking him to take the story down.

http://www.rawstory.com/news/2006/Drudge_retracts_story_on_Dean_after_0522.html


Dude, sorry, but you can't believe that either.

http://www.drudgereportarchives.com/data/2006/05/22/20060522_214359_flash5noo.htm









XXXXX DRUDGE REPORT XXXXX MON MAY 22, 2006 16:26:02 ET XXXXX

DNC: WE DID NOT PICK LANDRIEU OVER NAGIN

The Democratic National Committee strongly denies it placed political operatives in the city of New Orleans to work against the reelection efforts of incumbent Democrat Mayor Ray Nagin.

Well-placed DRUDGE REPORT sources claimed DNC Chairman Howard Dean made the decision to back mayoral candidate and sitting Lieutenant Governor Mitch Landrieu (D-LA).

The DNC says the report is "unequivocally and absolutely false."

DNC Communications director Karen Finney explained: "The DNC does not as a policy get involved in Democratic primaries... The only thing that the DNC did was a campaign helping ensure that displaced voters had an opportunity to vote."

The DRUDGE REPORT takes chairman Dean and his spokesman at their word.

-----------------------------------------------------------
Reports are moved when circumstances warrant
http://www.drudgereport.com for updates
(c)DRUDGE REPORT 2006
Not for reproduction without permission of the author

[Spider]

Dude, sorry, but you can't believe that either.

http://www.drudgereportarchives.com/data/2006/05/22/20060522_214359_flash5noo.htm









XXXXX DRUDGE REPORT XXXXX MON MAY 22, 2006 16:26:02 ET XXXXX

DNC: WE DID NOT PICK LANDRIEU OVER NAGIN

The Democratic National Committee strongly denies it placed political operatives in the city of New Orleans to work against the reelection efforts of incumbent Democrat Mayor Ray Nagin.

Well-placed DRUDGE REPORT sources claimed DNC Chairman Howard Dean made the decision to back mayoral candidate and sitting Lieutenant Governor Mitch Landrieu (D-LA).

The DNC says the report is "unequivocally and absolutely false."

DNC Communications director Karen Finney explained: "The DNC does not as a policy get involved in Democratic primaries... The only thing that the DNC did was a campaign helping ensure that displaced voters had an opportunity to vote."

The DRUDGE REPORT takes chairman Dean and his spokesman at their word.

-----------------------------------------------------------
Reports are moved when circumstances warrant
http://www.drudgereport.com for updates
(c)DRUDGE REPORT 2006
Not for reproduction without permission of the author

LOL told you Drudge was full of shít ................He always has been always will be , only reason he is read is his hatred for Clinton , much like the way we hate Bush ....... Except times were good under Clinton , while Bush is the worst president ever

[spdirty]

LOL told you Drudge was full of shít ................He always has been always will be , only reason he is read is his hatred for Clinton , much like the way we hate Bush ....... Except times were good under Clinton , while Bush is the worst president ever

But you said that you can't believe any story on drudge.

http://www.drudgereportarchives.com/..._flash5noo.htm

How could you believe this?

[Spider]

But you said that you can't believe any story on drudge.

http://www.drudgereportarchives.com/..._flash5noo.htm

How could you believe this?
you cant Drudge hadto pull the story .... I wont click your link I refuse to give that piece of shít any traffic

[spdirty]

you cant Drudge hadto pull the story .... I wont click your link I refuse to give that piece of shít any traffic


Come on, click it, you know you want to.

[Spider]

Come on, click it, you know you want to.
Ha! just as soon do the knuckle shuffle on the ole piss pump

[spdirty]

CLICK IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!

http://www.drudgereportarchives.com/..._flash5noo.htm
http://www.drudgereportarchives.com/..._flash5noo.htm
http://www.drudgereportarchives.com/..._flash5noo.htm
http://www.drudgereportarchives.com/..._flash5noo.htm
http://www.drudgereportarchives.com/..._flash5noo.htm

[Spider]

CLICK IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!

http://www.drudgereportarchives.com/..._flash5noo.htm
http://www.drudgereportarchives.com/..._flash5noo.htm
http://www.drudgereportarchives.com/..._flash5noo.htm
http://www.drudgereportarchives.com/..._flash5noo.htm
http://www.drudgereportarchives.com/..._flash5noo.htm
nope

[spdirty]

nope

Do you have a pet of any kind?

[Spider]

Do you have a pet of any kind?
Half Collie Half Chow , Lab , 3 freaking dumbass worthless cats had to 2 rotties , but they was too big , gave them to a buddy of mine where they could run instead of being locked up ........ Oh and adamn Bird that never shuts up , boo coo bucks on a damn fish aquiarium that all it does is take money

[spdirty]

Half Collie Half Chow , Lab , 3 freaking dumbass worthless cats had to 2 rotties , but they was too big , gave them to a buddy of mine where they could run instead of being locked up ........ Oh and adamn Bird that never shuts up , boo coo bucks on a damn fish aquiarium that all it does is take money
hmmmmm, now wouldn't it be a shame if something "unexpected" happened to one of those cuddly creatures?

NOW CLICK IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

http://www.drudgereportarchives.com/..._flash5noo.htm
http://www.drudgereportarchives.com/..._flash5noo.htm
http://www.drudgereportarchives.com/..._flash5noo.htm
http://www.drudgereportarchives.com/..._flash5noo.htm
http://www.drudgereportarchives.com/..._flash5noo.htm
http://www.drudgereportarchives.com/..._flash5noo.htm
http://www.drudgereportarchives.com/..._flash5noo.htm
http://www.drudgereportarchives.com/..._flash5noo.htm
http://www.drudgereportarchives.com/..._flash5noo.htm
http://www.drudgereportarchives.com/..._flash5noo.htm

[Spider]

hmmmmm, now wouldn't it be a shame if something "unexpected" happened to one of those cuddly creatures?

NOW CLICK IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

http://www.drudgereportarchives.com/..._flash5noo.htm
http://www.drudgereportarchives.com/..._flash5noo.htm
http://www.drudgereportarchives.com/..._flash5noo.htm
http://www.drudgereportarchives.com/..._flash5noo.htm
http://www.drudgereportarchives.com/..._flash5noo.htm
http://www.drudgereportarchives.com/..._flash5noo.htm
http://www.drudgereportarchives.com/..._flash5noo.htm
http://www.drudgereportarchives.com/..._flash5noo.htm
http://www.drudgereportarchives.com/..._flash5noo.htm
http://www.drudgereportarchives.com/..._flash5noo.htm
Screw them damn animals ........... pretty damn worthless ..........

[spdirty]

Screw them damn animals ........... pretty damn worthless ..........

Well, thats a nice rig in your avatar there. You have one just like it right?

[Spider]

Well, thats a nice rig in your avatar there. You have one just like it right?
you touch my truck ........ I would plant you 6 feet under

[broncocalijohn]

This wouldn't be the first time he's said something like this.

He makes no attempt to disguise his racist views.

Wrong LABF. I call it as I see it. People that voted (mostly white) for Jimmy Carter (at least a good guy) after he f ed up USA in his first term were mild retarded and all those that stand by people like Ted Kennedy after his driving/murder in the 60s were total white retarded. Retardedness has no color barriers. It affects all races. So i guess i "hate" whites too. I know, I know dont attack blacks just whites because the P.C. crowd are too liberal and think blacks cant stand on their own. That is the real racist. EQUAL RETARDNESS FOR ALL RACES AND COLOR!

[bendog]

you touch my truck ........ I would plant you 6 feet under
drag him. (-:

[broncocalijohn]

I'm not God but that's not exactly what he was saying but I'll let him try and and explain it again.
After being called a racist, I retracted that comment in a prevoius thread at least 3 weeks ago (LABF might remember the thread). I pointed out that of the 90%, some are democrats and follow politics but vote demo. I lowered the retard blacks to under 50% i believe. Search and find the thread. The whole topic was based on blacks voting for corrupt politicians because they are a "D". They proved it again with the vote for the racist Nagin. Try disputing that.

[broncocalijohn]

Half Collie Half Chow , Lab , 3 freaking dumbass worthless cats had to 2 rotties , but they was too big , gave them to a buddy of mine where they could run instead of being locked up ........ Oh and adamn Bird that never shuts up , boo coo bucks on a damn fish aquiarium that all it does is take money
there is a food chain there to "cut down" on your animals. Bird wont chirp again and then cats will be found torn apart with your dogs having a grin on their grill.

[NOLA Bronco]

Holy shmolies, there are some uninformed people on here.

bendog, LA Broncos Fan, and beerslug - thanks for fighting the good fight.

Those of you who wish to bash NOLA or the mayor, I guess you formed your opinion on what you see in the national news or in the AP reports, so I can't really fault you there. You get the perspective the national media wishes to portray, the same as after the storm. If you compared local reports to the ones from cnn, msnbc, and fow, you would see a wide variety of difference.

Those of you who think the country shouldn't help rebuild, well I can simply say that the port of NO is extremely vital to the commerce of this country, and where it to shut down, you would see some serious problems arise.

Nah, Nagin isn't the greatest thing since sliced bread, but if you are familiar with the situation, you would understand why he was much better than the last mayor, and how the events of Katrina didn't rest on his shoulders. There was a breakdown on all levels. The ones who had the capability to actually do something in the time need, the feds, didn't. That is an undisputable fact.

Those of you who bash the mayor probably saw him make his stupid comments on TV. So what? Who doesn't say stupid crap? The president does it on a daily basis. Nagin panders to what ever crowd he is in front of, because he is a business man. Do you people even know about any of the good things he did Pre-K or is doing now?

New Orleans was probably better prepared for this kind of a disater than most places. Nearly a million people left, eventhough a high percentage of us never thought the levees would break.

If you want NOLA and LA to be self sufficient - then gives us our fair share of oil revenues and gives us some relief so people can afford to live here again. Oh, and let us change the drinking age back to 18 where it deserves to be, without taking the federal highway money.

For those of you who disagree, lets just say I have front row seat and a much better view. You are in the cheap seats.

[Spider]

drag him. (-:
Naw thats letting him off to easy , he touches my house , he is dating my sister , make no mistake about that ;D

[spdirty]

Naw thats letting him off to easy , he touches my house , he is dating my sister , make no mistake about that ;D

You won't know where I am. Im super sneaky.

[Spider]

You won't know where I am. Im super sneaky.
I guess you havent heard of the NSA ;D

[broncocalijohn]

Holy shmolies, there are some uninformed people on here.

bendog, LA Broncos Fan, and beerslug - thanks for fighting the good fight.

Those of you who wish to bash NOLA or the mayor, I guess you formed your opinion on what you see in the national news or in the AP reports, so I can't really fault you there. You get the perspective the national media wishes to portray, the same as after the storm. If you compared local reports to the ones from cnn, msnbc, and fow, you would see a wide variety of difference.

Those of you who think the country shouldn't help rebuild, well I can simply say that the port of NO is extremely vital to the commerce of this country, and where it to shut down, you would see some serious problems arise.

Nah, Nagin isn't the greatest thing since sliced bread, but if you are familiar with the situation, you would understand why he was much better than the last mayor, and how the events of Katrina didn't rest on his shoulders. There was a breakdown on all levels. The ones who had the capability to actually do something in the time need, the feds, didn't. That is an undisputable fact.

Those of you who bash the mayor probably saw him make his stupid comments on TV. So what? Who doesn't say stupid crap? The president does it on a daily basis. Nagin panders to what ever crowd he is in front of, because he is a business man. Do you people even know about any of the good things he did Pre-K or is doing now?
New Orleans was probably better prepared for this kind of a disater than most places. Nearly a million people left, eventhough a high percentage of us never thought the levees would break.

If you want NOLA and LA to be self sufficient - then gives us our fair share of oil revenues and gives us some relief so people can afford to live here again. Oh, and let us change the drinking age back to 18 where it deserves to be, without taking the federal highway money.

For those of you who disagree, lets just say I have front row seat and a much better view. You are in the cheap seats.

I bolded a bad excuse for his actions. I noticed a private copmpany place all of their equipment high in their yard to avoid being flooded. Nagin has a nice, thick book on flooding disasters where it says to use buses. Not only did he not use them, he let them flood. He made excuses and pushing the blame game and then put out the racist card to save his A$$. I saw what i needed to see. At a local level, he failed in his own backyard. No excuse. Dont tell me he was at least better than the LAST GUY. They had a chance to get new leadership and failed.

[Garcia Bronco]

Holy shmolies, there are some uninformed people on here.

bendog, LA Broncos Fan, and beerslug - thanks for fighting the good fight.

Those of you who wish to bash NOLA or the mayor, I guess you formed your opinion on what you see in the national news or in the AP reports, so I can't really fault you there. You get the perspective the national media wishes to portray, the same as after the storm. If you compared local reports to the ones from cnn, msnbc, and fow, you would see a wide variety of difference.

Those of you who think the country shouldn't help rebuild, well I can simply say that the port of NO is extremely vital to the commerce of this country, and where it to shut down, you would see some serious problems arise.

Nah, Nagin isn't the greatest thing since sliced bread, but if you are familiar with the situation, you would understand why he was much better than the last mayor, and how the events of Katrina didn't rest on his shoulders. There was a breakdown on all levels. The ones who had the capability to actually do something in the time need, the feds, didn't. That is an undisputable fact.

Those of you who bash the mayor probably saw him make his stupid comments on TV. So what? Who doesn't say stupid crap? The president does it on a daily basis. Nagin panders to what ever crowd he is in front of, because he is a business man. Do you people even know about any of the good things he did Pre-K or is doing now?

New Orleans was probably better prepared for this kind of a disater than most places. Nearly a million people left, eventhough a high percentage of us never thought the levees would break.

If you want NOLA and LA to be self sufficient - then gives us our fair share of oil revenues and gives us some relief so people can afford to live here again. Oh, and let us change the drinking age back to 18 where it deserves to be, without taking the federal highway money.

For those of you who disagree, lets just say I have front row seat and a much better view. You are in the cheap seats.


LMAO...you live in the dump of dumps before the hurricane got there. Nagin is an idiot along with yourself if you voted for him.

"Those of you who wish to bash NOLA or the mayor, I guess you formed your opinion on what you see in the national news or in the AP reports, so I can't really fault you there. You get the perspective the national media wishes to portray, the same as after the storm. If you compared local reports to the ones from cnn, msnbc, and fow, you would see a wide variety of difference."

What does this have to do with the dumbasses re-electing this moron?

"Those of you who think the country shouldn't help rebuild, well I can simply say that the port of NO is extremely vital to the commerce of this country, and where it to shut down, you would see some serious problems arise. "

No one said get rid on the ports.


"Nah, Nagin isn't the greatest thing since sliced bread, but if you are familiar with the situation, you would understand why he was much better than the last mayor, and how the events of Katrina didn't rest on his shoulders. There was a breakdown on all levels. The ones who had the capability to actually do something in the time need, the feds, didn't. That is an undisputable fact."

Critical failures in judgment and lack of priorities caused many of the problems that the city faced in the days after. Included, but not limited to...property destruction and loss of life. The federal government is not clean on this either...but god man...not using the resources at his disposal should be considered a crime...and you morons elected him again. Idiots

"Those of you who bash the mayor probably saw him make his stupid comments on TV. So what? Who doesn't say stupid crap? The president does it on a daily basis. Nagin panders to what ever crowd he is in front of, because he is a business man. Do you people even know about any of the good things he did Pre-K or is doing now?"

How about if I said the NOLA is better off as a 2% milk city? Doesn't matter what he's done....he's a complete failure based on the events around Katrina. He's got a book to follow and the dumbass never made anybody read it.

"New Orleans was probably better prepared for this kind of a disater than most places. Nearly a million people left, eventhough a high percentage of us never thought the levees would break."

Bull****...the people down there can't find there ass with either hand. Obviously. I don't know if you remember...but the city was almost 80 percent submerged...if that's prepared...I'd hate to see up-prepared.

"If you want NOLA and LA to be self sufficient - then gives us our fair share of oil revenues and gives us some relief so people can afford to live here again. Oh, and let us change the drinking age back to 18 where it deserves to be, without taking the federal highway money."

LOL...give?...why don't you try to actually earn something first. Katrina proved how irresponsible your state and local government really is and how dumb the population is down there. Especially in NOLA. Working for an insurance agent...I know much about what the crooks down there do...cheap seats my ass.


Having said all that...I hope it works out for the best. Seriously. It should...most of the illiterate criminals NOLA has brought to life are now living in other cities.

[Bronco_Beerslug]

Having said all that...I hope it works out for the best. Seriously. It should...most of the illiterate criminals NOLA has brought to life are now living in other cities.

There it is in a nutshell NOLA. Ignorance, bigotry and racism rearing it's pretty head to show you how stupid you are for living in NO. How could you have any idea what actually is going on there since you live there and the "political experts" making these wonderful comments don't?

[NOLA Bronco]

I bolded a bad excuse for his actions. I noticed a private copmpany place all of their equipment high in their yard to avoid being flooded. Nagin has a nice, thick book on flooding disasters where it says to use buses. Not only did he not use them, he let them flood. He made excuses and pushing the blame game and then put out the racist card to save his A$$. I saw what i needed to see. At a local level, he failed in his own backyard. No excuse. Dont tell me he was at least better than the LAST GUY. They had a chance to get new leadership and failed.

You couldn't be more wrong.

Use buses for what? Damn, over 90% found a way out. Of those that stayed, many of them could have left. Heck, some even drove to the Superdome. People chose to stay for several reasons. Pets, elderly, and hurricane fatigue. Some people were tired of leaving. Those people put trust in the federally built levee and flood system.

Do even know where the buses were being stored? No. They were at a place that would only flood if a particluar flood wall broke. A place that had not flooded in decades, if it all. One of the other problems was also that transportation workers left town. Houston had this same problem.

How many would have died, if the mayor didnt insist on opening up the superdome? You can't begin to understand the utter chaos this city was working under. No Power, no drinkable water, little to no communication ability, and dirty water everywhere.

You heard the chocolate city comment and assumed he was playing a race card. Do you even know what he was talking about? He was responding to some rich white business owners specifically who had called to eliminate some areas of town. And he called out Uptown. Do you know what part of town that is? Do you know the racial breakdown of the area?

The problems of NOLA go way beyond the mayor and have existed since well before he was in office. He has done quite a few great things to make this city better.

You think Mitch Landrieu would have been better? Why? What was so special about him? In all honesty, the two are very similar.

No one would have been prepared on a local level for a disaster of this magnitude. Locals are still amazed that so many people did take the warnings and did leave.

Those of you who have never lived here, or weren't here afterwards, really have no clue. You can't see destuction for as far as you can see.

[NOLA Bronco]

LMAO...you live in the dump of dumps before the hurricane got there. Nagin is an idiot along with yourself if you voted for him.

How about if I said the NOLA is better off as a 2% milk city? Doesn't matter what he's done....he's a complete failure based on the events around Katrina. He's got a book to follow and the dumbass never made anybody read it.

Bull****...the people down there can't find there ass with either hand. Obviously. I don't know if you remember...but the city was almost 80 percent submerged...if that's prepared...I'd hate to see up-prepared.

LOL...give?...why don't you try to actually earn something first. Katrina proved how irresponsible your state and local government really is and how dumb the population is down there. Especially in NOLA. Working for an insurance agent...I know much about what the crooks down there do...cheap seats my ass.

Having said all that...I hope it works out for the best. Seriously. It should...most of the illiterate criminals NOLA has brought to life are now living in other cities.

Oh my. You are clueless. I am not sure you understand the magnitude of the destruction. Have you seen it? Do your friends have to live in FEMA trailors and get free clothes at the Salvation army?

Why are people so far away intent on blaming this on the mayor? His job was to get people out, and if they couldn't get out, gives them the means to get to safety. Over 90% of the city left. Thousands sought refuge in the superdome because he demanded it be open. They just put in a new field and scoreboard, you think the dome officials wanted people there? You can only help the people who want to be helped. And you flocks in far off places have no idea what it takes to evacuate an entire city. Why is it only people who aren't here are really complaining about the buses and getting people out? People here realize how successful the evacuation was.

The issue is with the aftermath. Once the flood walls broke, NOLA and the state no longer had the ability to much, because they were limited in resources. The federal government had the resources. They has water sitting in trucks in texas. Heck, even now there are trailors sitting in Arkansas that should be sitting in people's yards. Instead, those people sleep in their gutted homes. It was apalling that it took days to get people out. How in the world could the feds not be ready to respond? They had days to get ready.

And when I talk about money, LA has earned it. For years we have been asking for money to rebuild wetlands and strengthen levees. We have demanded our fair share of the off shore oil drilling that has helped cause the problems with our wetlands. We have asked for the closure of MR GO because of its harmful affects. These are all things we have earned. And we have a right to federal help, just like the people everywhere else. We certainly deserve it more than people in a middle eastern country. How about we take care of our own for once.

One thing I have learned is that if you don't really know something about a subject, the best thing is to keep your yap shut. Some of you people don't live and breathe this hurricane everyday. It doesn't affect your everyday life. You don't see the direct result of efforts being made. You don't go to meetings where community planning is discussed. You don't see the healthcare shortage in this city. And you certainly don't see the people working hard everyday to rebuild their lives. You dont see any of it. You see what the press puts out and form an opinion on it. And you call us stupid and morons? Never a judge a man or the situation til you have walked in his shoes.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

There it is in a nutshell NOLA. Ignorance, bigotry and racism rearing it's pretty head to show you how stupid you are for living in NO. How could you have any idea what actually is going on there since you live there and the "political experts" making these wonderful comments don't?

No kidding.

Garcia Bronco is the epitome of all three (ignorance, bigotry and racism.)

No wonder a sociopath like Bush was able to dupe so many people into voting for him.

At any rate, the reason the rightards hate Nagin is simple: He's a reminder of one of the greatest failures of the Bush presidency, viz., the botched federal response to Katrina. These idiots think that if they just keep attacking Nagin they can deflect attention from our collective memory of Bush golfing and playing guitar and hamming for the cameras while the residents of NOLA died in the streets on live television.

[broncocalijohn]

No kidding.

Garcia Bronco is the epitome of all three (ignorance, bigotry and racism.)

No wonder a sociopath like Bush was able to dupe so many people into voting for him.

At any rate, the reason the rightards hate Nagin is simple: He's a reminder of one of the greatest failures of the Bush presidency, viz., the botched federal response to Katrina. These idiots think that if they just keep attacking Nagin they can deflect attention from our collective memory of Bush golfing and playing guitar and hamming for the cameras while the residents of NOLA died in the streets on live television.

Not at all LABF. We already talked to death on a previous thread on the screwups of the local and Federal government. This thread is on nagin getting reelected. He failed. Simple. You, LABF want to turn this around on federal when Nagin blew it in many ways. Once again, YOU, not us, are speaking of what this thread was about while you try to hijack it. If you want to dig up the thread on the Disaster from months ago, do it. Keep this thread for what it is.

[NOLA Bronco]

Not at all LABF. We already talked to death on a previous thread on the screwups of the local and Federal government. This thread is on nagin getting reelected. He failed. Simple. You, LABF want to turn this around on federal when Nagin blew it in many ways. Once again, YOU, not us, are speaking of what this thread was about while you try to hijack it. If you want to dig up the thread on the Disaster from months ago, do it. Keep this thread for what it is.

And people in California really shouldn't make judgements about what happens in another city thousands of miles away when they are so uninformed and don't live there. I cant begin to understand why people in your state would elect Arnold your governor, since I am not there, but you won't see me making comments about it.

Your blanket statement of "Nagin failed" is filled with ignorance and ignores the fact that if you understood the situation, you would see it was an impossible task that no one person with limited resources should be blamed for. Not to mention how remarkable it was that so many people were saved.

Who should have been elected?

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Not at all LABF. We already talked to death on a previous thread on the screwups of the local and Federal government. This thread is on nagin getting reelected. He failed. Simple. You, LABF want to turn this around on federal when Nagin blew it in many ways. Once again, YOU, not us, are speaking of what this thread was about while you try to hijack it. If you want to dig up the thread on the Disaster from months ago, do it. Keep this thread for what it is.

That's a crock of shyte.

The thread was about Nagin's re-election until the reich-wingers started up with the same old scapegoating of Nagin to deflect the blame that rightly belongs to Bush and FEMA.

You can't seem to wrap your brain around the fact that DHS and FEMA - not Nagin - were primarily responsible for the response to Katrina - even when the facts are presented to you.

[broncocalijohn]

I know how FEMA screwed up and I never said they did not. A mayor that has lived in his town for years knows a lot more than the federal government for access of supplies, roads, etc. LABF, are you saying Nagin did a good job before, during and after the Katrina disaster? I know it might be tough for you to point any of your digits at a guy/girl that has a "D" by there ballot. Please inform us on your opinion.

[Spider]

I dont know what kind of Job Nagin did , but I have been to NOLA a few times , culture of coruption , Nagin had to know about it , I havent been to NOLA since the katrina , but those people in N.O. knows who did what ............ and if they reelect him , thats their right .........

[Spider]

Very corrupt cops in New Orleans , much like our self admitted New Mexico corrupt Cop Steve Tensi 13 ........

[NOLA Bronco]

I know how FEMA screwed up and I never said they did not. A mayor that has lived in his town for years knows a lot more than the federal government for access of supplies, roads, etc. LABF, are you saying Nagin did a good job before, during and after the Katrina disaster? I know it might be tough for you to point any of your digits at a guy/girl that has a "D" by there ballot. Please inform us on your opinion.


Huh, you are making no sense? Access to supplies and roads? What does that mean? FEMA and the corps drew the flood maps and had a better idea of what could happen.

Yes, Nagin did a good job before the storm.

Nagin was probably no better or worse than anyone else during or after. I am not saying he couldn't have done better and been better prepared. I am saying no one could have grasped the magnitude of the situation.

Do you know anyone who works for him? Do you know anyone who lived through the aftermath? Did you see what happened with your own eyes?

You can't begin to judge a man, until you have walked in his shoes.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Huh, you are making no sense? Access to supplies and roads? What does that mean? FEMA and the corps drew the flood maps and had a better idea of what could happen.

Yes, Nagin did a good job before the storm.

Nagin was probably no better or worse than anyone else during or after. I am not saying he couldn't have done better and been better prepared. I am saying no one could have grasped the magnitude of the situation.

Do you know anyone who works for him? Do you know anyone who lived through the aftermath? Did you see what happened with your own eyes?

You can't begin to judge a man, until you have walked in his shoes.

:thumbsup:

Once again, NOLA Bronco puts the smackdown on the know-nothings.

http://cagle.msnbc.com/working/060524/parker.jpg

[errand]

Nawlins is right on up there with Washington DC....re-elected a clown that failed them time and time again...and yet...he's back in office to do it again. Hey Nawlins this advice is free..."lie with dogs...you wake up with fleas'

What I find odd is that LA...and especially Nawlins' has been run almost exclusively by the Dems. And if the noise coming from the likes of LABF and Spider are true...it should have been a Utopia there. I mean, how can a state ran by a bunch of Dems be so poorly handled?

BTW, after the evacuation of the city, Houston has seen it's crime rate soar...while NO's has watched it's crime rate drop. Coincidence? I think not.

[errand]

Huh, you are making no sense? Access to supplies and roads? What does that mean? FEMA and the corps drew the flood maps and had a better idea of what could happen.

Yes, Nagin did a good job before the storm.

Nagin was probably no better or worse than anyone else during or after. I am not saying he couldn't have done better and been better prepared. I am saying no one could have grasped the magnitude of the situation.

Do you know anyone who works for him? Do you know anyone who lived through the aftermath? Did you see what happened with your own eyes?

You can't begin to judge a man, until you have walked in his shoes.

All I know is, if I were told that a Cat5 hurricane was coming...I wouldn't be caught dead in a city under sea level...I don't care how well the levees are built. I'm not saying you're stupid if you don't leave...but wouldn't ya have to be?

If nobody could have grapsed the magnitude of the situation, and that's a pass for Nagin....then why bash anyone else for what happened?

We know that the cops who worked for him quit...after they looted the place. And the entire country saw the aftermath....and gave and gave and gave 'til it hurt. And what was the American people's reward for being so generous? The city of Nawlins just held out it's hand again...and re-elected a mayor that basically said "Caucasians aren't welcomed"...afterall he wants a 'chocolate city" remember?

As for judging someone before walking in their shoes....do we have any former presidents on the mane this day and age?

[NOLA Bronco]

All I know is, if I were told that a Cat5 hurricane was coming...I wouldn't be caught dead in a city under sea level...I don't care how well the levees are built. I'm not saying you're stupid if you don't leave...but wouldn't ya have to be?

If nobody could have grapsed the magnitude of the situation, and that's a pass for Nagin....then why bash anyone else for what happened?

We know that the cops who worked for him quit...after they looted the place. And the entire country saw the aftermath....and gave and gave and gave 'til it hurt. And what was the American people's reward for being so generous? The city of Nawlins just held out it's hand again...and re-elected a mayor that basically said "Caucasians aren't welcomed"...afterall he wants a 'chocolate city" remember?

As for judging someone before walking in their shoes....do we have any former presidents on the mane this day and age?

Is it really easy to judge the situation from where you are, by getting your info from TV? Reality here is different. All you know about Nagin is what you saw on TV. The chocolate city comment, if you knew the situation, was not directed at all white people. It was a specific dig at a few rich guys who were trumpeting the fact that some of the poor black people were gone. It was not the blanket statement it appeared.

And New Orleans isn't asking for any more than any other city would be asking for in a time following devastation of this magnitude. No other place has had something like this happen on this large of a scale. And this is america, where all americans deserve help. People say they don't want to help because of the people and criminals who take advantage of the situation. Well, speaking for the majority of the population who is honest, hardworking, and taxpaying, I simply say a big FU. To turn your back on the people that need help in your own country means you may as well be spitting on the flag.

My ire is saved for the feds because they are the ones who actually have the resources to make things happen. The local govt was told that FEMA was ready to move in on a moments notice. We were told that troops were ready for security. Well, they weren't. I can't walk in Bush's shoes. But I do find it hard to believe that the head man in charge wasn't getting good enough information to do his job better. People sat at the convention center for 4-5 days. How does that happen in today's world?

Because of the outdated FEMA flood maps, no one knew where the water was going to stop if flooding occurred. Nagin didn't have troops and endless supplies. Yeah some of the cops let us down, but most didn't. They spent day picking bodies out of the water. They stood guard at hospitals while people were shooting at helicopters trying to evacuate people.

I keep stressing it and it seems to be falling on deaf ears. It is absolutely impossible to understand the sheer magnitude of the situation if you didn't see the before and after. Devastation for as far as you can see. This is no simple task. FEMA had this at the top of their list of worst possible disasters for years. The threat was imminent, yet they stood far away, caught up in politics.

All I know is that the people who keep bringing up how big of a clown Nagin is, don't really understand the situation. I am not going to make judgements about who you people elect as your leader, because I don't live there and am not informed. How can you people not do the same?

[errand]

Is it really easy to judge the situation from where you are, by getting your info from TV? Reality here is different. All you know about Nagin is what you saw on TV. The chocolate city comment, if you knew the situation, was not directed at all white people. It was a specific dig at a few rich guys who were trumpeting the fact that some of the poor black people were gone. It was not the blanket statement it appeared.

And New Orleans isn't asking for any more than any other city would be asking for in a time following devastation of this magnitude. No other place has had something like this happen on this large of a scale. And this is america, where all americans deserve help. People say they don't want to help because of the people and criminals who take advantage of the situation. Well, speaking for the majority of the population who is honest, hardworking, and taxpaying, I simply say a big FU. To turn your back on the people that need help in your own country means you may as well be spitting on the flag.

My ire is saved for the feds because they are the ones who actually have the resources to make things happen. The local govt was told that FEMA was ready to move in on a moments notice. We were told that troops were ready for security. Well, they weren't. I can't walk in Bush's shoes. But I do find it hard to believe that the head man in charge wasn't getting good enough information to do his job better. People sat at the convention center for 4-5 days. How does that happen in today's world?

Because of the outdated FEMA flood maps, no one knew where the water was going to stop if flooding occurred. Nagin didn't have troops and endless supplies. Yeah some of the cops let us down, but most didn't. They spent day picking bodies out of the water. They stood guard at hospitals while people were shooting at helicopters trying to evacuate people.

I keep stressing it and it seems to be falling on deaf ears. It is absolutely impossible to understand the sheer magnitude of the situation if you didn't see the before and after. Devastation for as far as you can see. This is no simple task. FEMA had this at the top of their list of worst possible disasters for years. The threat was imminent, yet they stood far away, caught up in politics.

All I know is that the people who keep bringing up how big of a clown Nagin is, don't really understand the situation. I am not going to make judgements about who you people elect as your leader, because I don't live there and am not informed. How can you people not do the same?

Well why don't you enlighten us with the great deeds of Mr. Nagin? So far all you've done is make excuses for his failures.

Devastation? You want to talk about devastation? How is it the people of Florida got diddly squat from anyone including the feds when they had not one, but 3 hurricanes hit them consecutively within a month's time almost?

They got crapola when Andrew level most of south Florida as well.

The city of NO isn't asking for any more than any other city would ask? The feds have spent almost $200,000 per resident not to mention the donations made by others. Hell, the UAE donated $100 million to Katrina relief....

On a side note, what moron builds a city below sea level next to a gulf, where hurricanes hit every year? Just wondering ...

As for the chocolate comment...are you saying it's OK to make racist comments if you only direct it at a few instead of all?

I highlighted one of your quotes and have to say why don't you demand as much from your own mayor?

You keep saying nobody knew the magnitude of this disaster..and yet you keep bitching about FEMA and Bush. And yet your mayor who lives in NO, works in NO, is briefed on every situation that happens in NO, and who should know more about NO than I dunno,...say, the president of the US, gets a pass from you. I won't even start in on the failures of your govenor who could have sent in LNG troops and declared a state of emergency. The feds come in after the state can't handle it...not prior.

You say the threat was imminent, and yet you're giving Nagin a pass for standing idly by....who had more at stake in NO? Nagin the mayor did if you ask me.

And BTW, when the people of NO shoot at helicopters trying to rescue people, and then go before congress and testify they heard explosions and allege that Bush blew up levees because he hates black people....well, let's just say it doesn't leave your city in a good light.

Neither did the free for all that broke out in Houston when FEMA started handing out $2,000 ATM cards.....that the refugees spent on tatoos, lap dances, spinners, etc. instead of paying their bills. The good news is, they didn't spend it on plasma TV's....those, they just plain looted.

There was even an incident @ a Walmart where two NO residents tried to take the donation jar off a register saying "It's our money....it's for Katrina people ain't it?"

And while it might not be fair, the perception is that the people of NO don't appreciate the help they have received from the American people, via donations or their hard earned tax dollars.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

You keep saying nobody knew the magnitude of this disaster..and yet you keep b****ing about FEMA and Bush.

Everytime you deny the fact that Bush and FEMA were primarily responsible for the response to Katrina (it says so right there in DHS's policies and procedures - look it up!) you just expose yourself as a 'tard.

Further, Bush was warned that there was a high probability that a category five hurricane would hit NOLA, and Bush did nothing (sound familiar?) by way of preparation.

Well, I can't say that he did nothing - he slashed the Army Corp of Engineers' funding for improvement of the levees and gutted FEMA.

[Garcia Bronco]

There it is in a nutshell NOLA. Ignorance, bigotry and racism rearing it's pretty head to show you how stupid you are for living in NO. How could you have any idea what actually is going on there since you live there and the "political experts" making these wonderful comments don't?

LMAO....

[Garcia Bronco]

"Oh my. You are clueless. I am not sure you understand the magnitude of the destruction. Have you seen it? Do your friends have to live in FEMA trailors and get free clothes at the Salvation army?"

My company insures a great deal of property there. I know much about it and surveyed some of it.

"Why are people so far away intent on blaming this on the mayor? His job was to get people out, and if they couldn't get out, gives them the means to get to safety. Over 90% of the city left. Thousands sought refuge in the superdome because he demanded it be open. They just put in a new field and scoreboard, you think the dome officials wanted people there? You can only help the people who want to be helped. And you flocks in far off places have no idea what it takes to evacuate an entire city."

I used to live in the Outer Banks and Virginia Beach. I'm fully aware of what it takes to evac a city.

"Why is it only people who aren't here are really complaining about the buses and getting people out? People here realize how successful the evacuation was."

Probably because in other parts of the country ....we are used to using school buses.

"The issue is with the aftermath. Once the flood walls broke, NOLA and the state no longer had the ability to much, because they were limited in resources. The federal government had the resources. They has water sitting in trucks in texas. Heck, even now there are trailors sitting in Arkansas that should be sitting in people's yards. Instead, those people sleep in their gutted homes. It was apalling that it took days to get people out. How in the world could the feds not be ready to respond? They had days to get ready."

The had two days to get ready A...and B the destruction was so wide spread and there was a loss of communications.

"And when I talk about money, LA has earned it. For years we have been asking for money to rebuild wetlands and strengthen levees. We have demanded our fair share of the off shore oil drilling that has helped cause the problems with our wetlands. We have asked for the closure of MR GO because of its harmful affects. These are all things we have earned. And we have a right to federal help, just like the people everywhere else. We certainly deserve it more than people in a middle eastern country. How about we take care of our own for once."

Then the people of the city shouldn't have let the wetlands be destroyed by business....but you allowed that to happen...you and your fellow citizens. How about you do like most of the contry and take care of yourselves from time to time.

"One thing I have learned is that if you don't really know something about a subject, the best thing is to keep your yap shut. Some of you people don't live and breathe this hurricane everyday. It doesn't affect your everyday life. You don't see the direct result of efforts being made. You don't go to meetings where community planning is discussed. You don't see the healthcare shortage in this city. And you certainly don't see the people working hard everyday to rebuild their lives. You dont see any of it. You see what the press puts out and form an opinion on it. And you call us stupid and morons? Never a judge a man or the situation til you have walked in his shoes."

It does affect all of us....you and the state of LA haven't been through anything that the rest of us haven't been through in some way shape of form....just remember...an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure and when you re-elect an inept mayor....you are sticking with the disease. I'm wasn't calling everybody stupid or moron...just you...on thie issue of defending chocolate Nagin

[Garcia Bronco]

"Because of the outdated FEMA flood maps, no one knew where the water was going to stop if flooding occurred. Nagin didn't have troops and endless supplies. Yeah some of the cops let us down, but most didn't. They spent day picking bodies out of the water. They stood guard at hospitals while people were shooting at helicopters trying to evacuate people. "


Yep...those are your peeps

[bendog]

"Oh my. You are clueless. I am not sure you understand the magnitude of the destruction. Have you seen it? Do your friends have to live in FEMA trailors and get free clothes at the Salvation army?"

My company insures a great deal of property there. I know much about it and surveyed some of it.

"Why are people so far away intent on blaming this on the mayor? His job was to get people out, and if they couldn't get out, gives them the means to get to safety. Over 90% of the city left. Thousands sought refuge in the superdome because he demanded it be open. They just put in a new field and scoreboard, you think the dome officials wanted people there? You can only help the people who want to be helped. And you flocks in far off places have no idea what it takes to evacuate an entire city."

I used to live in the Outer Banks and Virginia Beach. I'm fully aware of what it takes to evac a city.

"Why is it only people who aren't here are really complaining about the buses and getting people out? People here realize how successful the evacuation was."

Probably because in other parts of the country ....we are used to using school buses.

"The issue is with the aftermath. Once the flood walls broke, NOLA and the state no longer had the ability to much, because they were limited in resources. The federal government had the resources. They has water sitting in trucks in texas. Heck, even now there are trailors sitting in Arkansas that should be sitting in people's yards. Instead, those people sleep in their gutted homes. It was apalling that it took days to get people out. How in the world could the feds not be ready to respond? They had days to get ready."

The had two days to get ready A...and B the destruction was so wide spread and there was a loss of communications.

"And when I talk about money, LA has earned it. For years we have been asking for money to rebuild wetlands and strengthen levees. We have demanded our fair share of the off shore oil drilling that has helped cause the problems with our wetlands. We have asked for the closure of MR GO because of its harmful affects. These are all things we have earned. And we have a right to federal help, just like the people everywhere else. We certainly deserve it more than people in a middle eastern country. How about we take care of our own for once."

Then the people of the city shouldn't have let the wetlands be destroyed by business....but you allowed that to happen...you and your fellow citizens. How about you do like most of the contry and take care of yourselves from time to time.

"One thing I have learned is that if you don't really know something about a subject, the best thing is to keep your yap shut. Some of you people don't live and breathe this hurricane everyday. It doesn't affect your everyday life. You don't see the direct result of efforts being made. You don't go to meetings where community planning is discussed. You don't see the healthcare shortage in this city. And you certainly don't see the people working hard everyday to rebuild their lives. You dont see any of it. You see what the press puts out and form an opinion on it. And you call us stupid and morons? Never a judge a man or the situation til you have walked in his shoes."

It does affect all of us....you and the state of LA haven't been through anything that the rest of us haven't been through in some way shape of form....just remember...an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure and when you re-elect an inept mayor....you are sticking with the disease. I'm wasn't calling everybody stupid or moron...just you...on thie issue of defending chocolate Nagin
comparing the outer banks to nola exposes your ignorance. no offense, but there it is.

[Garcia Bronco]

comparing the outer banks to nola exposes your ignorance. no offense, but there it is.


How so Ben? Are you talking sheer number of people? Yes Nola would have more...but the concept of using the resources available and being prepared are the same. Don't be the grasshopper...be the ant.

[NOLA Bronco]

Well why don't you enlighten us with the great deeds of Mr. Nagin? So far all you've done is make excuses for his failures.

Devastation? You want to talk about devastation? How is it the people of Florida got diddly squat from anyone including the feds when they had not one, but 3 hurricanes hit them consecutively within a month's time almost?

They got crapola when Andrew level most of south Florida as well.

The city of NO isn't asking for any more than any other city would ask? The feds have spent almost $200,000 per resident not to mention the donations made by others. Hell, the UAE donated $100 million to Katrina relief....

On a side note, what moron builds a city below sea level next to a gulf, where hurricanes hit every year? Just wondering ...

As for the chocolate comment...are you saying it's OK to make racist comments if you only direct it at a few instead of all?

I highlighted one of your quotes and have to say why don't you demand as much from your own mayor?

You keep saying nobody knew the magnitude of this disaster..and yet you keep b****ing about FEMA and Bush. And yet your mayor who lives in NO, works in NO, is briefed on every situation that happens in NO, and who should know more about NO than I dunno,...say, the president of the US, gets a pass from you. I won't even start in on the failures of your govenor who could have sent in LNG troops and declared a state of emergency. The feds come in after the state can't handle it...not prior.

You say the threat was imminent, and yet you're giving Nagin a pass for standing idly by....who had more at stake in NO? Nagin the mayor did if you ask me.

And BTW, when the people of NO shoot at helicopters trying to rescue people, and then go before congress and testify they heard explosions and allege that Bush blew up levees because he hates black people....well, let's just say it doesn't leave your city in a good light.

Neither did the free for all that broke out in Houston when FEMA started handing out $2,000 ATM cards.....that the refugees spent on tatoos, lap dances, spinners, etc. instead of paying their bills. The good news is, they didn't spend it on plasma TV's....those, they just plain looted.

There was even an incident @ a Walmart where two NO residents tried to take the donation jar off a register saying "It's our money....it's for Katrina people ain't it?"

And while it might not be fair, the perception is that the people of NO don't appreciate the help they have received from the American people, via donations or their hard earned tax dollars.

Ok, so you want to know some of the good stuff he did.

1 - Cleaned up city hall. He opened the books which have led to indictments of several past officials. Eliminated a lot of the red tape when it came city functions, such as building permits and marriage licenses. Also, more available places to get the parish mandated break tags.

2 - Got maintenance done in the city. Pot holes were being filled, streets being repaved, new traffic lights, etc. Blighted houses were being demolished so the property could be resold. He also spearheaded the drive to get the citys communication systems out of the 1970's.

3 - He lobbied a great deal for movie industry deals in the city. Several pictures where filmed here recently, and prjects were in the works for a Holywood south pre-k.

4 - Was instrumental in the hiring of the first decent school superintendant in decades. The new super hired an outside firm to do an audit of the books which found millions of misplaced and unauthorized transactions. Of course, he got run off because they parents didn't think he understood the plight of the black man in NOLA (he was white). Nonetheless, Nagin chastised people for the treatment of this man who would have done wonders.

5 - Nagin also created a sense of constant inprovement. He wasn't happy at just doing a few things. He was constantly at odds with city council, who is more currupt than you can imagine.

Before Katrina, no one would have ever considered running against him. he was popular, because everyone was benefiting - more jobs, higher real estate, etc. And things were getting better, which was a vibe you can only get by seeing it in person. There was construction, beautification projects, and other things that were adding to the city. He even wanted to eliminate the rule that said you had to be a resident to be a cop here to help with crime. The city council, of course, was opposed.

I am not saying he is flawless. He opens his mouth too much and he panders to the crowd he is in front of. But his task after the storm was something no one ever had to face. Anyone who comes after him will always do better, because they can learn from his mistakes. He put too much faith in the corp and the levees, but so did all people and businesses. No one was prepared for this event. I don't see how anyone could have been fully prepared for the evacuation of over a million people and the utter chaos and destruction that ensued. Mix in the fact that most people were away from their homes (or what they had left) for more than month, and you have a scenario that is totally unprecedented. The superdome was provided as a shelter due to the mayors insistance. How many of those people would have died? A lot of people were sick of leaving, and a lot wouldn't leave without there pets or elderly relatives. You can't make people leave. The city did the best it could, other than telling people to leave earlier. Remember, it wasn't just NOLA, but the whole area that was evacuating. The state didn't have enough shelters, even if they did force people out.

Unless you live here and understand this place, you just can't understand the how crazy this situation is. If you think the chocolate city comment was a racist comment, then you dont understand the situation. Don't take his words literally.

There are people from any city that would have reacted the same way the shmucks from NOLA did. There is no justification. Heck, I remember riots and looting in Denver after the Rodney King debacle.

Oh, if you look, the older parts of NOLA are above sea level. When the city expanded, they went into marchland. And that wouldn't be as big of an issue if the wetlands hadnt gone to ****. Also, other cities flood too. To build on water in low lying areas is what you did when you founded a city centuries ago.

My issue with Bush and Fema has to do soley on the recovery efforts. They had resources that they said were ready, the state nor the city had the resources. The govt didnt step up, and thats a fact. To focus on not getting the people out before hand is completely ridiculous, because no matter where it is, unless it is an island of 20 people, you are always going to have people who stay and have to be rescued.

Listen, this is not a cut and dry thing. I don't think Nagin is the best thing since sliced bread. But to think anyone else could have done differently is simply being ignorant to the situation. The task of being NOLA mayor is different than most cities. Little victories in some places would look like monumental tasks here.

Yeah, there are stupid people from NOLA running their mouth in front of congress. Is is right? No. But if you are going to believe only the things you see on TV, then you are spitting on every hardworking, taxpaying, american trying to get their life back together. Those are the people who you should think about, not the ones looting. I know I would be.

[W*GS]

Some facts about Katrina and New Orleans:

http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v441/n7093/full/441556b.html

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

comparing the outer banks to nola exposes your ignorance...

...which isn't hard to do. :oyvey: