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View Full Version : Be all you can be , autism be damned


Spider
05-12-2006, 11:17 AM
No reason in the world why autism or other mentaly disabled people cant go to Iraq .... meanwhile operation yellow elephant (college Republicans) who support the war wont fight it .......... but they do send lip balm , thinking hey once the enemy see that our soldiers have nice unchapped lips , they will surrender .......
http://www.mercurynews.com/mld/twincities/news/nation/14519056.htm?source=rss
Pentagon records show that complaints about recruiting improprieties are on pace to reach record highs set in 2003 and 2004. As Army struggles to recruit, abuses mount
Autistic teen signs up for most dangerous job
BY MICHELLE ROBERTS
Newhouse News Service

PORTLAND, Ore. — Jared Guinther is 18. Tall and lanky, he will graduate from high school in June. Girls think he's cute, until they try to talk to him and he stammers or just stands there — silent.

Diagnosed with autism at age 3, Jared is polite but won't talk to people unless they address him first. It's hard for him to make friends. He lives in his own private world.

Jared didn't know there was a war raging in Iraq until his parents told him last fall — shortly after a military recruiter stopped him outside a Portland strip mall and complimented his black Converse All-Stars.

"When Jared first started talking about joining the Army, I thought, 'Well, that isn't going to happen,' " said Paul Guinther, Jared's father. "I told my wife not to worry about it. They're not going to take anybody in the service who's autistic."

But they did. Last month, Jared came home with papers showing that he had not only enlisted, but signed up for the Army's most dangerous job: cavalry scout. He is scheduled to leave for basic training Aug. 16.

Officials are now investigating whether recruiters at a U.S. Army Recruiting Station in Portland improperly concealed Jared's disability, which should have made him ineligible for service.

What happened to Jared is a growing national problem as the military faces increasing pressure to hit recruiting targets during an unpopular war.

Tracking by the Pentagon shows that complaints about recruiting improprieties are on pace to again reach record highs set in 2003 and 2004. Both the active Army and Reserve missed recruiting targets last year, and reports of recruiting abuses continue from across the country.

Violations such as these forced the Army to halt recruiting for a day last May so recruiters could be retrained and reminded of the job's ethical requirements.

The Portland Army Recruiting Battalion Headquarters opened its investigation into Jared's case last week after his parents called the Oregonian and the newspaper began asking questions about his enlistment.

Maj. Curt Steinagel, commander of the Military Entrance Processing Station in Portland, said the papers filled out by Jared's recruiters contained no indication of his disability. Steinagel acknowledged that the current climate is tough on recruiters.

"I can't speak for Army," he said, "but it's no secret that recruiters stretch and bend the rules because of all the pressure they're under. The problem exists, and we all know it exists."

RECRUITER'S PROMISES

Jared lives with his parents in a tiny brown house in southeast Portland.

Paul Guinther, 57, labors 50- to 60-hour weeks as a painter-sandblaster at a tug and barge works. His wife, Brenda, 50, has the graveyard housekeeping shift at a medical center.

The couple got together almost 16 years ago when Jared was 3. Brenda, who had two young children of her own, immediately noticed that Jared was different and pushed Paul to have the boy tested.

Doctors diagnosed him with moderate to severe autism. Jared, whose recent verbal IQ tested very low, spent years in special education classes. It was only as a high school senior that Brenda pushed for Jared to take regular classes because she wanted him to get a normal rather than a modified diploma.

Jared required extensive tutoring and accommodations to pass, but in June he will graduate alongside his younger stepbrother, Matthew Thorsen.

Last fall, Jared began talking about joining the military after a recruiter stopped him on his way home from school and offered a $4,000 signing bonus, $67,000 for college and more buddies than he could count.

Brenda Guinther phoned her two brothers, both veterans. She said they laughed and told her not to worry. The military would never take Jared.

The Guinthers, meanwhile, tried to refocus their son.

They thought it had worked until five weeks ago. Brenda Guinther said she called Jared on his cell phone to check what time he'd be home.

"I said, 'Jared, what are you doing?' 'I'm taking the test,' he said, the entrance test. I go, 'Wait a minute. Who's giving you the test?' He said, 'Corporal.' I said, 'Well let me talk to him.' "

Brenda Guinther said she spoke to Cpl. Ronan Ansley and explained that Jared had a disability, autism. She said Ansley told her he had been in special classes, too — for dyslexia.

"I said, 'Wait a minute, there's a big difference between autism and your problem,' " Brenda said.

Military rules prohibit enlisting anyone with a mental disorder that interferes with school or employment, unless a recruit can show he or she hasn't required special academic or job accommodations for 12 months.

Jared has been in special education classes since preschool. Through a special program for disabled workers, he has a part-time job scrubbing toilets and dumping trash.

Jared scored 43 out of 99 on the Army's basic entrance exam — 31 is lowest grade the Army allows for enlistment, military officials said.

Next Brenda Guinther asked to speak with Ansley's supervisor; she got Sgt. Alejandro Velasco.

She said she begged Velasco to review Jared's medical and school records. He declined, she said, asserting that he didn't need any paperwork.

"He was real cocky and he says, "Well, Jared's an 18-year-old man. He doesn't need his mommy to make his decisions for him.' "

ARMY TO INVESTIGATE

If her son Matthew had enlisted, Brenda Guinther said, she "wouldn't like it, but I would learn to live with it because I know he would understand the consequences."

Steinagel, the processing station commander, told the Oregonian that none of Jared's paperwork indicated he was autistic. If it had, he said, Jared almost certainly would have been disqualified.

On Tuesday, a reporter visited the Army Recruiting Station at the Eastport Plaza Shopping Center, where Velasco said he had not been told about Jared's autism.

Velasco initially denied knowing Jared, but later said he'd spent a lot of time mentoring him because Jared was going to become a cavalry scout. The job entails "engaging the enemy with anti-armor weapons and scout vehicles," according to an Army recruiting Web site.

With the Guinthers' permission, the Oregonian faxed Jared's medical records to the Army Recruiting Battalion commander Lt. Col. David Carlton in Portland, who on Wednesday ordered the investigation

RaiderH8r
05-12-2006, 12:18 PM
So they're taking "Mainstreaming" to the military? I guess if it's good enough for schools...

Spider
05-12-2006, 12:25 PM
So they're taking "Mainstreaming" to the military? I guess if it's good enough for schools...
I see so even if he is mentaly unfit to serve , thats his own tough luck ...... tell me hater would you enter into a contract with someone with autism where they had to give you amonthly payment on a car ?

defenseman
05-12-2006, 01:19 PM
Autism? Ain't happenin. You can't get into the Navy with this....the army? Don't know about that. There is NO WAY, if the navy found out about it, that this individual would be allowed to enter the navy...dman

Spider
05-12-2006, 01:49 PM
Autism? Ain't happenin. You can't get into the Navy with this....the army? Don't know about that. There is NO WAY, if the navy found out about it, that this individual would be allowed to enter the navy...dman
thats because the Navy is a different animal , training for the ships operating system is more complex then shooting a rifle .......

defenseman
05-12-2006, 01:52 PM
Doesn't fit at all. In the heat of battle? then what? In addition, if you are medicated or having to take medication to get by day to day, you are done. Entry into the armed services is pretty much out of the question...dman

RaiderH8r
05-12-2006, 01:57 PM
I see so even if he is mentaly unfit to serve , thats his own tough luck ...... tell me hater would you enter into a contract with someone with autism where they had to give you amonthly payment on a car ?
With autism, he really shouldn't be driving. Except, maybe, to go around the driveway. "I'm a really good driver...yeah...definitely a good driver."

Spider
05-12-2006, 01:57 PM
Doesn't fit at all. In the heat of battle? then what? In addition, if you are medicated or having to take medication to get by day to day, you are done. Entry into the armed services is pretty much out of the question...dman
I agree , they wouldnt let me in the service cause I had an outstanding attempted murder charge ( not as badas it sounds) now they let autism people in ......... I come from a long line of Military people .... all branches of service ..

Spider
05-12-2006, 01:58 PM
With autism, he really shouldn't be driving. Except, maybe, to go around the driveway. "I'm a really good driver...yeah...definitely a good driver."
LOL ...... perhaps , but still as D man said in the heat of battle .............

defenseman
05-12-2006, 01:59 PM
Doesn't wash at all.....I know there is NO WAY this guy could get into the Navy. Hell, if you sleep walk you can't get into the Navy...dman

Spider
05-12-2006, 02:00 PM
Doesn't wash at all.....I know there is NO WAY this guy could get into the Navy. Hell, if you sleep walk you can't get into the Navy...dman
LOL I can see where that would be a severe problem .......

RaiderH8r
05-12-2006, 02:02 PM
LOL ...... perhaps , but still as D man said in the heat of battle .............
There are many who would suggest that Jared be treated equally with all other citizens. And since all other citizens have the right to opt in or out of military service, doesn't it stand to reason that Jared should too?

Spider
05-12-2006, 02:17 PM
There are many who would suggest that Jared be treated equally with all other citizens. And since all other citizens have the right to opt in or out of military service, doesn't it stand to reason that Jared should too?
not when the rest of the unit maybe exposed to an unnessary risk , ie guy talking at the wrong time while in a hot LZ , or shooting radicaly , to many things to facor in , you want someone that is half way stable

defenseman
05-12-2006, 02:30 PM
There are many who would suggest that Jared be treated equally with all other citizens. And since all other citizens have the right to opt in or out of military service, doesn't it stand to reason that Jared should too?

NO, no way in hell. There are somethings you have to be able to count on in the heat of battle. The most important thing is the guy next to you, doesn't matter what the platform is or if engaged on the ground. The guy next to you CAN cost you your life. No way, no way in hell. I would NEVER roll the dice on a medical condition such as this...there is enough variables just getting the job done sometimes, let alone how a person may react under extreme conditions of stress and fatigue....dman

RaiderH8r
05-12-2006, 03:33 PM
NO, no way in hell. There are somethings you have to be able to count on in the heat of battle. The most important thing is the guy next to you, doesn't matter what the platform is or if engaged on the ground. The guy next to you CAN cost you your life. No way, no way in hell. I would NEVER roll the dice on a medical condition such as this...there is enough variables just getting the job done sometimes, let alone how a person may react under extreme conditions of stress and fatigue....dman
I'm not disagreeing with you, just having a little fun. :yayaya: