Dumervil moving to LB?

[Popps]

This has probably been kicked around. Any chance that we drafted him to move to LB?

Elvis Dumervil will get to the quarterback at the next level. He is an outstanding pass rusher, and has the talent to make an impact. Just on what level is the question. His ideal position may be as an outside linebacker in a 3-4 defense, but there may be an adjustment period with such a move. In the more traditional 4-3, he may only amount to a situational pass rusher because of his lack of size. Whatever his role, Dumervil should end up being a contributor in the NFL.

.. and awful lot of scouting reports project him as a potential LB, though mostly in the 3/4. Has anyone had the chance to watch this kid play much?

I just can't see a guy this size beating the NFL's elite tackles head to head. When was the last time you recall a sub-6' , sub 260 DE making a major impact?

Our pass rush is abysmal, so anything he can bring will help. Just wondering if maybe we've got designs on moving him around?

[ludo21]

Shanny said he can play inside and outside. At best he will be our situation guy, and with that speed off the edge i hope he can be Freeny esqu.

[Tombstone RJ]

He'd be an OLB in a 3-4, but I think he's more of an ILB in a 4-3. Interesting player to have.

[DB-Freak]

Question......

How many former DL's have been successful in a 4-3 system as linebackers?

[ludo21]

Question......

How many former DL's have been successful in a 4-3 system as linebackers?


Suggs comes to mind, altho his DE play last season was great.

[Old Dude]

Coyer might experiment with some variation of the so-called "Tampa-2," developed by Dungy. The speed rushing defensive end(s) lines up a little further to the outside (i.e. Feeney) which makes him a little tougher for most OTs to handle. The drawback, of course, is that you give up some run stoppage on the inside, and I don't think the Broncos have much intention of that. But it might work as a changeup.

[Lestat]

my guess is he'll bulk up a bit to around 265 & play DE/hybrid LB

i don't think he'll be a regular DE in his 1st season, he'll likely move around to maximize his pash rush ability

but if he can get atleast 5 sacks i'll be thrilled

[Requiem]

He'd play ILB, not outside in a 4-3. He'll be a pass-rusher for us. Nickel packages. Shanny thinks inside and outside on the line.

[Popps]

Coyer might experiment with some variation of the so-called "Tampa-2," developed by Dungy. The speed rushing defensive end(s) lines up a little further to the outside (i.e. Feeney) which makes him a little tougher for most OTs to handle. The drawback, of course, is that you give up some run stoppage on the inside, and I don't think the Broncos have much intention of that. But it might work as a changeup.

Good theory... very interesting.

One good thing about this kid, at minimum... is that he'll represent our best pass rushing option as a LB, if he does line up there. None of our guys are particularly skilled at rushing the QB. It'll be nice to have someone with an arsenal of moves to send on pass rushes.

[Mediator12]

Coyer might experiment with some variation of the so-called "Tampa-2," developed by Dungy. The speed rushing defensive end(s) lines up a little further to the outside (i.e. Feeney) which makes him a little tougher for most OTs to handle. The drawback, of course, is that you give up some run stoppage on the inside, and I don't think the Broncos have much intention of that. But it might work as a changeup.

The Tampa two is the secondary Coverage OD. Socal has explained it where the MLB drops deeper into the middle of the field and the safety's concentrate outside the hash marks.

The DL you described is commonly called an Eagle Front where the DL leave big gaps inside and the DE's are a step outside the OT's. They run a lot of Tampa two man coverage and the occasional Zone. They did not have the DL speed to play much Eagle last year with Pryce and Brown on the Ends. They may rethink that with Lang, Dumervil, and Engleburger.

[Barry Ramey]

The Broncos rotate their d-linemen anyway, so not like Dumervil will be out there all game long to get worn down or something.

[Raider Bill]

Did he do any LB drills at the combine? He could probably line up at OLB in Bellichek's system where they just hold the edge vs the run and play the flat. In a 4-3 he's purely a weakside guy IMO.

[Jason in LA]

I don't think so. The team is already stacked at LB, and weak at DE.

[brother love]

Here's the thing I like about Elvis.

He is a good power rusher for a shorter DE. He has good leg drive which to me is awesome because he should be able to get underneath tackles pads.
Head to head low man usually wins. That is where most of his sacks came from. He'll be a very good pass rusher for us.

[Odysseus]

A high motor guy is something the Broncos have been missing for awhile. This could be fun. If they start hiding him and Warren all over the place. Fire up the Browncos and let's see what's under the hood.

[Maximus]

I find this thread humorous... Some of the people who are saying that Bumville will move to LB told me I didn't know what I was talking about in the chat room during the draft Ha!

Again he's too small to play DE in the NFL 5'11... not happening on the end!!!

[Odysseus]

What's a chat room?

[-Slap-]

The Tampa two is the secondary Coverage OD. Socal has explained it where the MLB drops deeper into the middle of the field and the safety's concentrate outside the hash marks.
Courtesy of Bud Carson, through Tony Dungy. That's one reason I was glad to see us (almost) sign Nate Webster. We need a backup MLB who can duplicate the Jack Lambert like depth we ask out of Al Wilson on his pass drops. That really made the drafting of Terry Pierce seem odd. Even if the guy hadn't been a stiff, there's no way his skill set would have enabled him to fill in for Wilson in those kinds of sets.

[-Slap-]

One reason Bud's cover 2 worked so effectively in Pittsburgh was because the Steelers' defensive personnel was uniquely designed to execute it. Makes sense, since the architect of the scheme had those guys in mind when he devised the concept.

First off, the Steelers had a badass front four. This enabled their speedy linebackers to run wild, without any pass rush responsibilities. As intimidating as Jack Lambert was, he played in the 220s. Jack Ham wasn't a real big guy, either. Their main attributes were speed and intelligence. Blount and Johnson were big physical corners who played better with the ball in front of them and knew it was their job to punish WRs who caught the ball short. Lambert and Ham were really the key, though. Lambert got tremendous depth on his drops and Ham could lock down any tight end in the league without help. This enabled the Steelers to play a cheap shot sonofabitch like Mike Wagner at free safety while Donnie Shell was like a mini linebacker at strong safety.

[Killericon]

God no. I hate the 3-4, and I hate Elvis at LB. NO ****ING WAY.

[Mediator12]

I find this thread humorous... Some of the people who are saying that Bumville will move to LB told me I didn't know what I was talking about in the chat room during the draft Ha!

Again he's too small to play DE in the NFL 5'11... not happening on the end!!!

Yeah, Freeney has really struggled hasn't he? I am 5'11 and Freeney maybe is an inch taller with jacked up nike's ;D

[Odysseus]

Yeah, Freeney has really struggled hasn't he? I am 5'11 and Freeney maybe is an inch taller with jacked up nike's ;D

Med,
If this guy is ANYTHING like Dwight Freeney the Broncos are going to have fun with this guy!

[footstepsfrom#27]

I just can't see a guy this size beating the NFL's elite tackles head to head. When was the last time you recall a sub-6' , sub 260 DE making a major impact?
Booger McFarland is about the same...a shade under 6 feet and he's a stud in the middle of the line. A short guy usually has concerns with height because they usually have shorter arms, but supposedly this dude has long arms. I gotta think that if he's able to put up these kind of numbers, he's got the talent to play.

[Popps]

Booger McFarland is about the same...a shade under 6 feet and he's a stud in the middle of the line. A short guy usually has concerns with height because they usually have shorter arms, but supposedly this dude has long arms. I gotta think that if he's able to put up these kind of numbers, he's got the talent to play.

McFarland is a 6', 300 lb tackle. Dumervil is (in theory) an end, and almost 50 lbs lighter. He'd also be going up against larger, better equipped pass protectors on the edge.

Believe me, no one wants this kid to work out more than I do. I'm just saying on the surface, he's not going to project to DE in the NFL... I don't care what he did against college kids.

We drafted a guy named Aaron Hunt a few years back who held the all-time big-12 sack record. He was an absolute monster in college. He didn't project well into the pros, he was taken in the 6th round...and no one has heard from him since.

I'll be interested in reading what Coyer has in store for the kid. Hopefully this was well thought out.

[watermock]

I think I have come up with the appropriate nickname.

http://www.navy.gov.au/publications/trade/jun05/tazziedevil.jpg

[broncohaven]

Shanny said he can play inside and outside. At best he will be our situation guy, and with that speed off the edge i hope he can be Freeny esqu.
To clarify, Shanahan was referring to the inside and outside of the defensive line, not the back of it. Even mentioned he could play nose tackle.

[DB-Freak]

http://web.bryant.edu/~langlois/ecology/gorilla.jpg

[Raider Bill]

To clarify, Shanahan was referring to the inside and outside of the defensive line, not the back of it. Even mentioned he could play nose tackle.


In the ACC maybe. :rofl:

[footstepsfrom#27]

McFarland is a 6', 300 lb tackle. Dumervil is (in theory) an end, and almost 50 lbs lighter. He'd also be going up against larger, better equipped pass protectors on the edge.
McFarland is supposed to be bigger since he's a tackle. More to the point, how many DT's are under 6' either? I think he's the only one. If Dumervil is 258 as he's listed, he's only 10 pounds lighter than Freeney. He probably puts that on when he gets to the NFL. He could be basically the same size as Freeney, and I don't see why he can't play at DE at that weight, since there are quite a few DE's in that area. If he has long arms, he's probably not going to be that handicapped IMO.

[Tombstone RJ]

Feeney is listed at 6'1" 268lbs. That probably means he's right at 6'

[labronco]

http://web.bryant.edu/~langlois/ecology/gorilla.jpg
LOL

[Odysseus]

Defensive Awards

Lombardi Award - Best Lineman/ Linebacker
Elvis Dumervil - Louisville
Rodrique Wright - Texas
A.J. Hawk - Ohio St
Frank Coyle’s Selection - A.J. Hawk

Nagurski Award - Top Defender
Elvis Dumervil (DE) - Louisville
Tamba Hali (DE) - Penn St
Haloti Ngata (DT) - Oregon
DeMeco Ryans (LB) - Alabama
Jimmy Williams (CB) - Virginia Tech
Frank Coyle’s Selection - Elvis Dumervil

Nagurski Award - Top Defender
Elvis Dumervil (DE) - Louisville
Tamba Hali (DE) - Penn St
Haloti Ngata (DT) - Oregon
DeMeco Ryans (LB) - Alabama
Jimmy Williams (CB) - Virginia Tech
Frank Coyle’s Selection - Elvis Dumervil

---How you going to keep a guy off the field like this? Wabbit says that Coyer isn't creative. Med agrees with him. I hope this meat and potatoes defense finds a way to help this guy stay on the field.

[kmartin575]

McFarland is supposed to be bigger since he's a tackle. More to the point, how many DT's are under 6' either? I think he's the only one. If Dumervil is 258 as he's listed, he's only 10 pounds lighter than Freeney. He probably puts that on when he gets to the NFL. He could be basically the same size as Freeney, and I don't see why he can't play at DE at that weight, since there are quite a few DE's in that area. If he has long arms, he's probably not going to be that handicapped IMO.

DT Mike Patterson of the Eagles is also 5'11". Dumervil may be similar in size to Freeney, but he does not have near the speed. Dumervil ran a 4.75 at the combine.

[Ballhawk]

DT Mike Patterson of the Eagles is also 5'11". Dumervil may be similar in size to Freeney, but he does not have near the speed. Dumervil ran a 4.75 at the combine.

Elvis said that he wasn't 100% when he ran at the combine and that 4.65 is what he usually runs.

[thumpc]

The Broncos of the 80s had Greg Kragen as nosetackle under Joe Collier.

[BroncoInferno]

Believe me, no one wants this kid to work out more than I do. I'm just saying on the surface, he's not going to project to DE in the NFL... I don't care what he did against college kids.

I think Shanny has already indicated he'll stay on the line, and even mentioned that he thought he could play some tackle. In terms of his size, what may offset that is he has unusally long arms for his size. This is why shorter DL usually fail...shorter arms, not the heighth itself.

[Gcver2ver3]

would i sound bias in saying elvis is the best defensive player drafted this year?


nahhh...;D


you heard it here 1st...defensive rookie of the year...

[chrisp]

I just think its exciting - yes, he has a downside in his lack of height which is why he was in the 4th round as opposed to the 1st, but he also has supreme talent, so although he could blow out completely, on the other hand he could turn out to be special. Nobody knows right now which way it will go and anybody who says they do is either a liar or an idiot...

They said Al Wilson was too short when we drafted him - sometimes these things don't matter and sometimes they do.

One thing is sure: we probably have a little more wriggle room to take a risk on a guy like this than other teams do with more need areas.

Added to which all he has to do is be a useful pass-rushing specialist to help our 3rd-down defense and he's more than justified the pick. If he goes on to become an every-down player or anything like that then that's just the icing on the cake.....

[55CrushEm]

Again he's too small to play DE in the NFL 5'11... not happening on the end!!!

If you want to get technical.....I read he's 5'11 3/4"....so he's closer to 6' than he is 5' 11".....

Dwight Freeney is listed as 6' 1".....a whopping ONE inch taller !! So don't tell me that this guy can't excel at DE until we've seen him play that position in the NFL......

Furthermore, it's already been said that he has very long arms for his size.....Shanny said he has arm length of someone who is 6'3" or 6'4".....couple this with his motor, and "never give up on any play" work ethic.....and I argue that this guy has a very good chance of being an effective DE......

[Rock Chalk]

I find this thread humorous... Some of the people who are saying that Bumville will move to LB told me I didn't know what I was talking about in the chat room during the draft Ha!

Again he's too small to play DE in the NFL 5'11... not happening on the end!!!
Its mostly because no one gives a rats ass about Raider fans.

Though I happen to agree with you.

[footstepsfrom#27]

DT Mike Patterson of the Eagles is also 5'11". Dumervil may be similar in size to Freeney, but he does not have near the speed. Dumervil ran a 4.75 at the combine.
As noted, he's run faster than that, but I don't think the 40 time for a DE is that significant anyway. If you're DE ever has to run 40 yards it's only because he's either taking it the other way or chasing somebody who is. A quick first step and a great closing burst coupled with the technique to disengage from a 340 pound OT are a lot more important.

NFL teams overanalyze these guys. Forget all this crap. Can he play football or not? It seems pretty obvious he can.

[55CrushEm]

As noted, he's run faster than that, but I don't think the 40 time for a DE is that significant anyway. If you're DE ever has to run 40 yards it's only because he's either taking it the other way or chasing somebody who is. A quick first step and a great closing burst coupled with the technique to disengage from a 340 pound OT are a lot more important.

NFL teams overanalyze these guys. Forget all this crap. Can he play football or not? It seems pretty obvious he can.

Great points......and didn't he say his hammy was hurt at the combine, anyway?

[footstepsfrom#27]

Great points......and didn't he say his hammy was hurt at the combine, anyway?
Right. He's apparently run in the 4.65-4.68 range in the past. He's got the speed, and from what I understand, he's also got a variety of escape moves that most college DE's have not developed. I find it interesting that people focus on his sacks, claiming that he only beat college OT's so he won't be an every down lineman in the NFL (of course Mario Williams also beat college OT's). But this guy also led the country in forced fumbles as well. That obviously has nothing to do with height. If you force 11 fumbles, you're a big time hitter, and it doesn't matter whether you're going against college guys or not, you're doing something to cause those fumbles. I think this guy may turn out to be a DE in the mold of another 4th round draft pick that came out of college undersized but possessing an ultra high motor and a 500 pound bench press. It worked out pretty well...

Lyle Alzado.

[Popps]

http://web.bryant.edu/~langlois/ecology/gorilla.jpg

Is this guy a free agent? I say bring him in. Good balance, long arms, and probably a natural variety of pass-rush moves. (Swim move, head slap, etc.)

Plus, he'd bring up the curve on the Wonderlic scores.

[Mediator12]

Is this guy a free agent? I say bring him in. Good balance, long arms, and probably a natural variety of pass-rush moves. (Swim move, head slap, etc.)

Plus, he'd bring up the curve on the Wonderlic scores.

Personally, I think he could rewrite the DE position from that 4 point stance ROFL!

[Odysseus]

Is this guy a free agent? I say bring him in. Good balance, long arms, and probably a natural variety of pass-rush moves. (Swim move, head slap, etc.)

Plus, he'd bring up the curve on the Wonderlic scores.

He looks like a wife beater. Sure hate to see that guy with roid rage.

[bronco militia]

He looks like a wife beater. Sure hate to see that guy with roid rage.


bwhahaha

[Mediator12]

He looks like a wife beater. Sure hate to see that guy with roid rage.

You think that guy is married :rofl: LOL

He has got kids in three different Jungles from what I hear ;D

[ludo21]

To clarify, Shanahan was referring to the inside and outside of the defensive line, not the back of it. Even mentioned he could play nose tackle.


yep, thats what i meant as well.

IMO, Dumervill is best suited at DE on passing downs, then go from there. Maybe he beefs up for DT, but he seems to small for that.

[long beach bronco]

In training camp, Elvis is going to win one of the DE positions and be an absolute terror this season. Why do you think Marcus Vick tried to stomp on him, because he was back there making Marcus' life miserable on every snap. I think we found a diamond in Elvis. Plus he has a chip on his shoulder...........Lord have mercy, our pass rush will be just fine.

[DBroncos4life]

No he's not.:wave:

[long beach bronco]

Yes he will ;)

[bendog]

Question......

How many former DL's have been successful in a 4-3 system as linebackers?
didn't ware of Dullass and that asskicker stud SD got do it last year?

Grads did it.

[DB-Freak]

didn't ware of Dullass and that asskicker stud SD got do it last year?

Grads did it.
I didnt know Dallas and the Chargers played 4-3.

[Ballhawk]

I didnt know Dallas and the Chargers played 4-3.

Neither do they :rofl:

[Tom G]

Feeney is listed at 6'1" 268lbs. That probably means he's right at 6'

Freeneys pre draft numbers, presumably from the combine:
6-0 and 7/8, 268, 4.65

[Odysseus]

You think that guy is married :rofl: LOL

He has got kids in three different Jungles from what I hear ;D

:rofl: I bet one of them is in Hotlanta. (Atlanta, Ga)

[bendog]

I didnt know Dallas and the Chargers played 4-3.
Elvis Dumervil will get to the quarterback at the next level. He is an outstanding pass rusher, and has the talent to make an impact. Just on what level is the question. His ideal position may be as an outside linebacker in a 3-4 defense, but there may be an adjustment period with such a move. In the more traditional 4-3, he may only amount to a situational pass rusher because of his lack of size. Whatever his role, Dumervil should end up being a contributor in the NFL.

This was the premise of the thread, smart ass

[Odysseus]

Freeneys pre draft numbers, presumably from the combine:
6-0 and 7/8, 268, 4.65

I think I'm going to put my hands of my eyes and pretend I didn't read this. I don't want to fall start sobbing uncontrollably over the fact we might have actually drafted an impact defensive player.

[DBroncos4life]

Freeneys pre draft numbers, presumably from the combine:
6-0 and 7/8, 268, 4.65
Man I wonder how he took off .3 seconds from his 40 time. People here claimed he runs a 4.3 40!

[DB-Freak]

Elvis Dumervil will get to the quarterback at the next level. He is an outstanding pass rusher, and has the talent to make an impact. Just on what level is the question. His ideal position may be as an outside linebacker in a 3-4 defense, but there may be an adjustment period with such a move. In the more traditional 4-3, he may only amount to a situational pass rusher because of his lack of size. Whatever his role, Dumervil should end up being a contributor in the NFL.

This was the premise of the thread, smart ass
Sorry if you thought I was mocking you.

I just don't think he would be the LB that the Broncos would like.

[bendog]

Sorry if you thought I was mocking you.

I just don't think he would be the LB that the Broncos would like.
It was a good question, and I did misread your post. I went back and checked a little. Dave Robinson was a two way end at Penn State and is in HOF as a packer linebacker. I'm not sure if there are any current dl/linebacker conversions. It's an interesting question. I don't think grads had the horizontal movement to be a mlb in a 4-3. I'm sort of busy, but its a good trivia question

[Cito Pelon]

Forget all this crap. Can he play football or not? It seems pretty obvious he can.

That's the way I look at it. John Randle had a pretty good nfl career, and he basically just attacked all the time and enjoyed the competition. This Dumervil kid could be like that. It depends on his competitiveness. I'm sure there's a lot of kids that hit the NFl, and they just get overwhelmed by the complexity and the skill of the guys they have to go against, and they give up. And there's some kids that refuse to give up, they keep their confidence and contribute.

[kmartin575]

It would be a waste to move him to linebacker. The Broncos already have good linebackers, they just need a good pass rush, especially with the loss of Pryce. I think Dumervil can be good, but I don't think he is as good as the 20 sacks would suggest. He was an almost complete non-factor at the senior bowl and did not look good at all.

[Drek]

Man I wonder how he took off .3 seconds from his 40 time. People here claimed he runs a 4.3 40!
4.48 actually.

4.48 in the 40-yard dash … 37-inch vertical jump … 455-pound bench press … 650-pound squat … 325-pound power clean … Bench presses 225 pounds 28 times … 32 3/4-inch arm length … 9 3/4-inch hands … Right-handed.

NFL Draft Page (http://www.nfl.com/draft/2002/profiles/freeney_dwight.htm)

[SureShot]

I find this thread humorous... Some of the people who are saying that Bumville will move to LB told me I didn't know what I was talking about in the chat room during the draft Ha!

Again he's too small to play DE in the NFL 5'11... not happening on the end!!!

I just can't believe 1inch or 1 1/2 can make or break a player with the "want". ESPN lists Freeny at 6-1 and Dumervil 6-0 go figure.

Before the draft there was a lot of talk about combine, or workout "freaks". I believe most of the posters wanted FOOTBALL PLAYERS.

Give him a shot, he almost had as many sacks last year as the Broncos combined.

[wabbit]

The Broncos drafted a DT a few years back by the name of Jerry Johnson.

The guy was a terror in college & widely seen as an absolute steal by the Broncos in the 3rd-4th round...can't remember.

Johnson was 6-1...and a bust at the NFL level.

Karl Mecklenberg was a 12th round selection in '83...a classic 'tweener' who made his career on his hybrid role.

It can be done.

I like the Dumervil pick...I just hope the defensive coaches figure out a way to use him other than simply lining him up over an NFL tackle.

[BroncoBuff]

This has probably been kicked around. Any chance that we drafted him to move to LB?

Elvis Dumervil will get to the quarterback at the next level. He is an outstanding pass rusher, and has the talent to make an impact. Just on what level is the question. His ideal position may be as an outside linebacker in a 3-4 defense, but there may be an adjustment period with such a move. In the more traditional 4-3, he may only amount to a situational pass rusher because of his lack of size. Whatever his role, Dumervil should end up being a contributor in the NFL.

.. and awful lot of scouting reports project him as a potential LB, though mostly in the 3/4. Has anyone had the chance to watch this kid play much?

I just can't see a guy this size beating the NFL's elite tackles head to head. When was the last time you recall a sub-6' , sub 260 DE making a major impact?

Our pass rush is abysmal, so anything he can bring will help. Just wondering if maybe we've got designs on moving him around?

How about just plug him into the slot Patrick Chukwurah had last season?

Passing downs, and he comes off th edge, sometimes standing, sometimes hand on the ground.

[Odysseus]

The Broncos drafted a DT a few years back by the name of Jerry Johnson.

The guy was a terror in college & widely seen as an absolute steal by the Broncos in the 3rd-4th round...can't remember.

Johnson was 6-1...and a bust at the NFL level.

Karl Mecklenberg was a 12th round selection in '83...a classic 'tweener' who made his career on his hybrid role.

It can be done.

I like the Dumervil pick...I just hope the defensive coaches figure out a way to use him other than simply lining him up over an NFL tackle.

I remember everyone being high on Jerry Johnson around here. I didn't think that much of him and felt that maybe I was wrong or didn't see something that was obvious to the whole known world. I was wrong. I was right.

I don't remember anybody being high on Mecklenberg when he got here. The was a smattering of praise.

I think Elvis might be a poor man's Lionel Dalton as a DT. Average at best but if it's a gambit and teams bite even if he gets smoked on the line and we stop the play we win. Chess not checkers.

[Cito Pelon]

I just can't believe 1inch or 1 1/2 can make or break a player with the "want". ESPN lists Freeny at 6-1 and Dumervil 6-0 go figure.

Before the draft there was a lot of talk about combine, or workout "freaks". I believe most of the posters wanted FOOTBALL PLAYERS.

Give him a shot, he almost had as many sacks last year as the Broncos combined.

Want to is a big deal. The all-time "wanted to" NFL players that nobody wanted in the first 3-4 rounds would be an All-Star team. You also need a coaching staff that gives the kids a chance to play.

Kyle Johnson is a guy that these geniuses in the FO need to keep in mind. The kid was cut, then brought back after MA had the groin in 2004. You have to let these kids play in real games. Coaching staffs, they play it safe a lot. Just look at last year with the Broncs. MA starting every game, Dayne maybe they should have risked starting him. Putzier starting every game, Duke maybe they should have risked starting him. Both those guys are gone fast after the season, maybe they should have risked Dayne and Duke last year? Hard to call that, you go with your best percentage.

[BroncoBuff]

I think Elvis might be a poor man's Lionel Dalton as a DT.
Am I missing something here? Dalton? Not just you, ESPN's talking about him at NT, to. I though Elvis weighed about 252 ....

[Atlas]

This has probably been kicked around. Any chance that we drafted him to move to LB?

Elvis Dumervil will get to the quarterback at the next level. He is an outstanding pass rusher, and has the talent to make an impact. Just on what level is the question. His ideal position may be as an outside linebacker in a 3-4 defense, but there may be an adjustment period with such a move. In the more traditional 4-3, he may only amount to a situational pass rusher because of his lack of size. Whatever his role, Dumervil should end up being a contributor in the NFL.

.. and awful lot of scouting reports project him as a potential LB, though mostly in the 3/4. Has anyone had the chance to watch this kid play much?

I just can't see a guy this size beating the NFL's elite tackles head to head. When was the last time you recall a sub-6' , sub 260 DE making a major impact?

Our pass rush is abysmal, so anything he can bring will help. Just wondering if maybe we've got designs on moving him around?

You know Popps this Dumervil guy reminds me of another undersized DE/LB that played for Denver.
http://halloffamememorabilia.com/images/products/MM-08PHMEC415med.jpg
I seem to remember him being a pretty good player.

[Odysseus]

Am I missing something here? Dalton? Not just you, ESPN's talking about him at NT, to. I though Elvis weighed about 252 ....

A little DT is dependent on reading the offense perfectly everytime. If you know exactly what the offense is going to do you still have to execute to stop them. Since that is not always easy it's a risky move.

In a dream world you want 4 DT who are fast enough to play DE. In the real world you have specialists who handle single assignment roles. Elvis is a single serving DT. You could put him on the nose on 3rd and long he could tie up OL or get the sack. It depends on the QB. It depends on the OL vulnerability. It depends on how far we are ahead in points.

Who knows. I just like saying the name....Elvis.

If Marcus Vick makes the Dolphins I think it would be fun for them to have a reunion...of sorts.

[Odysseus]

This here is that Bobby Bouche' (AKA The Waterboy) fella you was thinking about! He said in a recent press interview that he'll probably only get 15 sacks his first year since it's the NFL but he hopes to get back up to 30 sacks by the end of next year.

My favorite during the season quote would be to see Trent Green openly weeping going "Oh dear God. Please don't hurt me!!" Of course the clip pans to Brody Croyle passing out and Bob pissing himself...twice.

[Ballhawk]

The 11 forced fumbles is a number that stands out to me because it indicates that he has pop in his hits. Ya we have guys that can drag down a QB but I miss those "Pops" that Atwater use to put on the QB.

[Drek]

The 11 forced fumbles is a number that stands out to me because it indicates that he has pop in his hits. Ya we have guys that can drag down a QB but I miss those "Pops" that Atwater use to put on the QB.
Long arms and real good stripping technique caused most of the fumbles that I've seen him force.

Here's my thing, when people chide him for being short/light:

Freeney - 6'1", 250-260
Jason Taylor - 6'6", 255
Terrell Suggs - 6'3", 260
Robert Mathis - 6'2", 235

Only two (Umenyora, Van Den Boch) of the top 5 sackers last season weighed over 268, an attainable weight for Dumervil. Their heights range from 6'2" (Burgess, 260 lbs) to 6'5" (Rice, 268 lbs).

Now I'm not saying that Dumervil is a lock for NFL success, or that its even realistic to expect the kind of success the players I've listed have had. However, he has a wingspan equal to most of these guys (32 and 3/4"), thats the number one need for height at DE, keeping tackles from getting their hands on your body.

In my opinion Dumervil would work well in either a rush OLB role in a 3-4, or as a weakside DE in a 4-3. In the later however his team would need to have a spread front 4 when he's in, lining him up directly over the tackle is crazy. Coincidentally Coyer has been talking about spreading the line and we have linebackers who're more than capable of covering any disadvantages it would present to our run coverage.

I don't think he'll put up 10 sacks a season like Freeney, but he could be a solid contributor with 4-6, and that'd be pretty valuable to this team.

[defenseman]

I tend to agree with Maximus. Right now? No, I don't see this guy as a DE. Agreed, right now he is too small. Not height wise, but weight wise. IF he is too play DE, he must get bigger. I think 265 is too small, more like 270+. The OL in this leauge are pretty good, even with a great motor, he needs more weight behind it. The height part? Personally I believe that is overrated. Being short in height , I believe , can be overcome by a good motor. I don't believe the same for weight though....dman

[BroncoInferno]

I tend to agree with Maximus. Right now? No, I don't see this guy as a DE. Agreed, right now he is too small. Not height wise, but weight wise. IF he is too play DE, he must get bigger. I think 265 is too small, more like 270+. The OL in this leauge are pretty good, even with a great motor, he needs more weight behind it. The height part? Personally I believe that is overrated. Being short in height , I believe , can be overcome by a good motor. I don't believe the same for weight though....dman

Yeah, but as Drek just showed a lot of the top sackers are below 268 Taylor is 255, Mathis is only 235 for chrissake. I think he's heavy enough. I think the question will be whether or not he can extend his arms well enough to fend of offensive tackles.

[Mediator12]

Long arms and real good stripping technique caused most of the fumbles that I've seen him force.

Here's my thing, when people chide him for being short/light:

Freeney - 6'1", 250-260
Jason Taylor - 6'6", 255
Terrell Suggs - 6'3", 260
Robert Mathis - 6'2", 235

Only two (Umenyora, Van Den Boch) of the top 5 sackers last season weighed over 268, an attainable weight for Dumervil. Their heights range from 6'2" (Burgess, 260 lbs) to 6'5" (Rice, 268 lbs).

Now I'm not saying that Dumervil is a lock for NFL success, or that its even realistic to expect the kind of success the players I've listed have had. However, he has a wingspan equal to most of these guys (32 and 3/4"), thats the number one need for height at DE, keeping tackles from getting their hands on your body.

In my opinion Dumervil would work well in either a rush OLB role in a 3-4, or as a weakside DE in a 4-3. In the later however his team would need to have a spread front 4 when he's in, lining him up directly over the tackle is crazy. Coincidentally Coyer has been talking about spreading the line and we have linebackers who're more than capable of covering any disadvantages it would present to our run coverage.

I don't think he'll put up 10 sacks a season like Freeney, but he could be a solid contributor with 4-6, and that'd be pretty valuable to this team.

Great post drek. People get some insane preconceived notions about things. One is that you HAVE to be 6'5 to be DE. While it certainly is a preferable trait, there are a bunch of productive guys who do not fit that mold. The majority of players that play a position in the NFL do NOT fit the prototype. One of my favorite statistic is that 25% of NFL players on the 53 man roster over the last five years have been UDFA's. One out of four players on a team are guys nobody wanted in the draft. Why, because it is hard to predict NFL success until they are on the field with other NFL players.

Training camp is going to be very good this year. The broncos do not have a lot of holes to fill, but there will be several spots with intense Competition. WR, TE, ROG, RB on offense. RDE, DT, #2 CB, and SS will be up for grabs. Elvis will get his shot to prove he can rush the QB. He just will not get to strip the ball until Preseason ;D

[Rascal]

Nah...see if that schmuck rookie QB can take a hit.

[Mediator12]

Nah...see if that schmuck rookie QB can take a hit.

He took enough at Vandy ;D He could use a year out of semi pro wrestling :wiggle:

[Odysseus]

Long arms and real good stripping technique caused most of the fumbles that I've seen him force.

Here's my thing, when people chide him for being short/light:

Freeney - 6'1", 250-260
Jason Taylor - 6'6", 255
Terrell Suggs - 6'3", 260
Robert Mathis - 6'2", 235

Only two (Umenyora, Van Den Boch) of the top 5 sackers last season weighed over 268, an attainable weight for Dumervil. Their heights range from 6'2" (Burgess, 260 lbs) to 6'5" (Rice, 268 lbs).

Now I'm not saying that Dumervil is a lock for NFL success, or that its even realistic to expect the kind of success the players I've listed have had. However, he has a wingspan equal to most of these guys (32 and 3/4"), thats the number one need for height at DE, keeping tackles from getting their hands on your body.

In my opinion Dumervil would work well in either a rush OLB role in a 3-4, or as a weakside DE in a 4-3. In the later however his team would need to have a spread front 4 when he's in, lining him up directly over the tackle is crazy. Coincidentally Coyer has been talking about spreading the line and we have linebackers who're more than capable of covering any disadvantages it would present to our run coverage.

I don't think he'll put up 10 sacks a season like Freeney, but he could be a solid contributor with 4-6, and that'd be pretty valuable to this team.

Great post...I agree. He's not a NT or even DT for that matter...maybe in an insane Greg Robinson/Ray Rhodes world where 2 man defensive front scheme make perfect sense but Elvis is one of those guys that makes you go "what if". I want to see him play. Maybe it's just the name El.....VIS! ;D

Mediator makes a great point. Anybody who has a chance to go to training camp this year should. I think the level of competition is going to far exceed anything we've seen from the Broncos in awhile. It's not a knock but a compliment they are going to have some tough choices to make to get to 53.