Give me Two Sport Athletic Freak Manny Lawson at #15 please!

[footstepsfrom#27]

We need to grab this guy if we can. Looking at him closer than I have before, he's the perfect fit for Denver at a position where our biggest need exists. Best of all, he's probably going to be there at #15 when we pick.

Lawson is an athletic FREAK, pure and simple. If Manny Lawson played WR he'd be the 2nd fastest WR on the Broncos roster. With a 4.43 forty, this guy doesn't have elite speed for a defensive end. He would have elite speed if he ran in under 4.6 in the 40. Lawson has INSANE speed. When Lawsom lines up at defensive end in the NFL, he'll be faster than every QB in the NFL except Michael Vick. He'll be faster than most running backs and safeties, probably faster than half the wide receivers and cornerbacks and faster than probably every TE in the NFL not named Vernon Davis. There are no more than 4 or 5 legitimate athletic freaks in this draft and Lawson is one of them. And best of all...there's a good chance we can probably get him without trading up.

I've read quite a few opinions on Lawson that suggest he'll never be an NFL defensive end because he's a tweener at 6'6", 245 and he should play OLB in a 3-4 defense. But Miami's Jason Taylor is only 12 pounds heavier on the same size body and he seems to be doing just fine. DeMarcus Ware plays at 255. But I think Lawson can get bigger...a LOT bigger. I think he might play in the NFL at 270 and sacrifice almost no speed. Here's why:

A number NFL defensive ends entered the league 20-30 pounds lighter than where they wound up playing at. These include two former Broncos, Bertrand Berry and Reggie Hayward...both of whom have been double digit sack producers at DE. Berry played at 250 before bulking to 275 and Hayward, who is now listed at 280, entered the NFL at 260. Neither of those guys did what Manny Lawson did in college.

He ran track.

Looking closer at this dude...I'm convinced that unless we want to trade both our #1 picks to move up...he's our guy...and here's why. Check this out...

Lawson ran track for NC State and competed in FIVE events. He was also good. He won the ACC championship in the indoor long jump and finished 2nd outdoors and he competed in the 60 meeter hurdles, finished 5th in the ACC in the triple jump and the NC State team finished 4th in the 4x100 relays he ran on. This means than when other prospective NFL defensive ends were building themselves up for trench warefare in the offseason, Manny Lawson was building a body desinged for two sports. You don't win the ACC long jump championship or compete in the relays, triple jump or hurdles weighing 285. Imagine what Lawson could have done in the weight room if he had not been competing in a sport that doesn't want it's athletes to bulk up and get bigger.

Lawson is already strong...385 in the Bench (23 reps at 225 for the combine)...340 in the power clean, but given the fact that he'll no longer be running track, I'd expect him to gain a good 20 pounds of muscle with no problem...maybe more. But consider the following:

1) Versitility- Even if Lawson doesn't gain weight, which seems like a very unlikely possibility given a nearly 6'6" frame, he could play RIGHT NOW at OLB and take over the starting weakside LB spot where he'd still be a terror off the edge in passing downs. We don't get that from Ian Gold and at 220 pounds he's been shown to be very vulnerable against the run there. So in a worst case scenario, Lawson would be a 6 inch and 25 pound upgrade at our weakside linebacker spot even if he can't play DE in the NFL on an every down basis, which I think he can. So there is insurance here if he doesn't make it at DE. Think our LB's are fast now? With Lawson playing weak OLB it would be unreal.

2) Special teams- Lawson had a school record 6 blocked punts at NC State(6 th in the nation) and even returned a punt. The kid is a playmaker on special teams, something we severely lack. He'll contribute immediately there even if he doesn't start on defense right away.

3) Production and Upside potential- Lawson is just beginning to learn the game yet he's still been very productive. He didn't move to defensive end until his JR. year at NC State. His upside is huge because this guy wasn't just a workout warrior, he made plays..a solid Jr. year and a spectacular SR. year with 19 1/2 tackles for loss and 10 1/2 sacks with 17 QB pressures his senior year. Those are major league numbers against major college competition despite the fact that he was just learning the position. Once he gets a feel for what he's doing, his production should rise even higher.

4) Big games and plays- Lawson had some of his best games and biggest plays against the toughest competition and in big games. He had 10 tackles (3 for a loss) and a sack against Florida State, won ACC lineman of the week with a 3 sack performance against Virginia Tech, blocked a punt and totaled 8tackles (one behind the line) against Kansas in the Tangerine Bowl in his first game at right defensive end, totaled 9 tackles in just 21 snaps against Notre Dame in the Gator Bowl and stopped the Irish on the goal line with a TD saving tackle...7 tackles and 2 key 3rd down stops against Virginia...you get the idea.

5) Speed- you can't coach it. You either have it or you don't, and he obviously has it. If he plays DE in the pros he'll be the NFL's fastest linman.

6) Intelligence- Lawson was an Industrial Engineering major in college.

7) Character- I haven't read where this guy has beaten anyone up, assaulted a woman, failed a drug test or cussed out his coach. He even won his teams leadership award at NC State.

Conclusion: this guy is good enough to be drafted at the #15 spot at a position where we are desperate for help at on the strengh of EITHER his combine numbers OR his production. Yet it's not an either/or situation. He has BOTH the combine numbers that are off the charts, as well as the production to go with it. Factor in the fact that he's still learning his position and was running track when he could have been working out for football and this guy IMO is going to be a steal if we can get him at #15.

[ludo21]

Question:

If he is such a freak, why is he just now rising?

[Elway777]

He would be a good pick at 15 . I still hope that the Broncos move up to get VD .If VD drops to around 9 maybe trade the Broncos 15 Pick plus 61 pick and one of our 4 rounder to move up. The players the Broncos should consider taking are DW2 ,Bunkley,Ngata, Jackson, Homes and Lawson.

[uk bronco]

http://www.nfl.com/draft/analysis/expert/brandt/dl

gill brant rates him the number 2 de behind mario. i think we'll go offence first round tho. the 49ers trade sucks ass we shoulda got more

[footstepsfrom#27]

Question:

If he is such a freak, why is he just now rising?
Two reasons I think; 1) he's overshadowed by Mario Williams, and 2) people are afriad of the tweener label. But when he is able to focus on training for only one sport and learns the DE position, I think the guy is just what the doctor orders for our defense.

We obviously are not going to get Davis now that we've traded down, and Chad Jackson is not worth the 15th pick IMO. No runner at or TE at 15 is much better than what we might get at #37 and no safety not named Williams or Huff is worth a #15 spot either. The D-line is the logical place to go and this guy's the logical fit.

[Ballhawk]

We obviously are not going to get Davis now that we've traded down, a

How is this obvious? #15 & 22 = 4th pick in draft. #15 & #37 = 6th pick in draft. We have obviously had discussions with GB and like VD...lots can still happen.

[ludo21]

How is this obvious? #15 & 22 = 4th pick in draft. #15 & #37 = 6th pick in draft. We have obviously had discussions with GB and like VD...lots can still happen.


I agree, if nothing else, the move was made so that we didnt OVER pay the PAck, AND we got our 3rd rounder back!

[Killericon]

Now that it seems we are not aiming to trade up for Vernon Davis....bring on Manny Lawson!

[footstepsfrom#27]

How is this obvious? #15 & 22 = 4th pick in draft. #15 & #37 = 6th pick in draft. We have obviously had discussions with GB and like VD...lots can still happen.
Maybe according to the draft value charts, but I don't think you can get the 6th pick for #'s 15 and 37. That also assumes the 9ers want to pass on Davis, which I doubt. If their motive is to get some help for Alex Smith in a hurry, Davis is the best equipped guy they can realistically get to do that. Denver probably needed to trade with GB to jump ahead of the 9ers if we wanted Davis. Of course we could always offer something from next year as well if we wanted to move up.

I don't think Shanny will do that...but then again...we are talking about Shanahan here...so who knows.

[Elway777]

I would do this trade our 15 pick plus next year first plus our 61 pick for the 6 pick plus the 49ers either 3 round pick.

[-Slap-]

Put a skinny defensive end over a small linebacker. Call it the Quiche Lorraine Defense.

[TheManeMan]

Seems kinda weird to think that...its possible the first 2 DE's taken would be from the same D-Line...

[Borks147]

Seems kinda weird to think that...its possible the first 2 DE's taken would be from the same D-Line...

and their dt is also highly rated, but his production came from having those 2 monsters on the line....

[Drek]

If we were to draft Lawson he'd be better off converted to a strong side linebacker. He used to play linebacker, has the height, speed, and vertical to cover any TE in the league and the size and strength to dominate any TE or FB as a pass rusher.

Personally I'd be all for taking Lawson, using him his first year as a situational pass rusher and special team stud, while we polish off his linebacker skills. Then we move DJ back to weakside, Lawson takes strong side, and we cut Gold before his contract starts to really escalate.

[footstepsfrom#27]

If we were to draft Lawson he'd be better off converted to a strong side linebacker. He used to play linebacker, has the height, speed, and vertical to cover any TE in the league and the size and strength to dominate any TE or FB as a pass rusher.

Personally I'd be all for taking Lawson, using him his first year as a situational pass rusher and special team stud, while we polish off his linebacker skills. Then we move DJ back to weakside, Lawson takes strong side, and we cut Gold before his contract starts to really escalate.
Somewhere we have to find a PASS RUSH. Denver's relied for far to long on FA leftovers, waiver wire cuts and middle round draft picks to man the trenches on defense. The majority of the time you're not going to find a top flight stud defensive end that way. I'll take the speedster who is an athletic freak every time over the slow ponderous has been who can't get to the QB just because he's 30 pounds heavier. Lawson could play LB on either side IMO but where he's likely to really help us in if we could just turn the guy lose and tell him to go get the QB. I don't care if he does that from the DE spot of as a linebacker. The point is, this guy's a major talent at a position where we are desperate for help. Reggie Hayward arrived in Denver 15 pounds heavier than Lawson but not nearly the athlete he is and he's playing at 280. This guy looks like a Greyhound at 245. If he hadn't been running sprints for the track team he'd probably have played 20 pounds heavier in college and we wouldn't even be having a discussion about his weight. As it is, 20 pounds seems almost automatic and the guy's a physical abberation of nature.

Barring something really wierd, we're not going after VD, and since we have several options for a pretty good TE replacement in round 2, and since TE and DE are the two most glaring weaknesses on this team right now...it makes sense to take the best pass rusher available at #15. Suppose we plucked Lawson at 15 and used the 37 on Gabe Watson if he's there. Now you've got a Jax style D-line inside that would make it easier on Lawson as well.

There are tons of possibilities. But if we're not getting Davis, I want a pass rusher who is not a typical pedestrian Bronco type lineman.

[Drek]

We rushed our LBs a decent amount last year, with Lawson we could do it even more. At DE though he'll have to play weak side, in front of Gold, thats a real small, run succeptible, tandem to send out with regularity. At LB Lawson is still all the athlete, but with a size advantage added to most of his matchups, when facing TEs and FBs, as Brown or Ekuban, the strongside DE, ties up the tackle.

[bendog]

Put a skinny defensive end over a small linebacker. Call it the Quiche Lorraine Defense.
Roaf's back just healed. No way we can field a RDE who weighs under 260.

I've actually wondered if they shouldn't try for the fatty from Mich (Gabe ????) in the second or third, and try Big Money at RDE in a 3-4 ... and cut Gold, of course. (-:

[footstepsfrom#27]

Roaf's back just healed. No way we can field a RDE who weighs under 260.

I've actually wondered if they shouldn't try for the fatty from Mich (Gabe ????) in the second or third, and try Big Money at RDE in a 3-4 ... and cut Gold, of course. (-:
Who says we need to keep Gold even if we play a 4-3? I like him well enough but in spite of his speed, he's pretty much a non-factor as a pass rusher. Roaf or no Roaf...Lawson can play over there. How many 4.43 DE's does Roaf see? None. If Jason Taylor and DeMarcus Ware can play at 255 and 251 what makes you think Lawson couldn't play at that weight? Most college linemen can add 15 or 20 pounds in the NFL, especially if they're nearly 6'6". At 6'5 1/2" this kid could have easily played at 260 in college had he not been in training for running sprints on the track team. Take away that hinderance and I bet he tops out about 275 in two years. Maybe he drops a bit of speed but if you go from a 4.43 to a 4.55 and do it with a 6'5 1/2" 275 frame and a 39 inch vertical jump...who cares?

Nobody at #15 is even close to the athlete Lawson is, which is why we need to take him if he's there and find a place for him...maybe make him the next Karl Mecklenburg or something...where he's playing all over the field causing havoc at half a dozen places. This dude's got the speed to play anywhere and the frame to add weight, plus he's already very strong, so it's not like he's a project. He can play right now.

[bendog]

Who says we need to keep Gold even if we play a 4-3? I like him well enough but in spite of his speed, he's pretty much a non-factor as a pass rusher. Roaf or no Roaf...Lawson can play over there. How many 4.43 DE's does Roaf see? None. If Jason Taylor and DeMarcus Ware can play at 255 and 251 what makes you think Lawson couldn't play at that weight? Most college linemen can add 15 or 20 pounds in the NFL, especially if they're nearly 6'6". At 6'5 1/2" this kid could have easily played at 260 in college had he not been in training for running sprints on the track team. Take away that hinderance and I bet he tops out about 275 in two years. Maybe he drops a bit of speed but if you go from a 4.43 to a 4.55 and do it with a 6'5 1/2" 275 frame and a 39 inch vertical jump...who cares?

Nobody at #15 is even close to the athlete Lawson is, which is why we need to take him if he's there and find a place for him...maybe make him the next Karl Mecklenburg or something...where he's playing all over the field causing havoc at half a dozen places. This dude's got the speed to play anywhere and the frame to add weight, plus he's already very strong, so it's not like he's a project. He can play right now.
Gold cannot play in a 3-4 defense. He's too small to hold the corner. But that was more a joke, because Den is not moving to a 3-4 - not with all the bwoncos. As for Lawson, imo, he's this year's workout wonder. He's great on paper, but one of the stupidist things do in the draft is shoot a top pick on the notion they will coach a guy up, e.g. Delta Dawn. Moreover, putting weight on Lawson will not help his one natural talent, speed. The guy has very little in Dline training, and Den was one defensive lineman pressure from the superbowl. The only LT's in the nfl he can abuse in his rookie year are not teams that will go deep in the playoffs anyway.

With the 15 pick and the way boards are lining up with a week and a half, less than that, to go, I'm starting to think Den really is looking WR. The first WR "should" go around then, and it's possible that even Cutler would slip that low. Shanny has the rook track record with SOB. Give Jake two years to get it done, and if not, pull the plug. This notion makes me ill. I'm hoping against hope that Den really has targeted Lewis as the TE, and figure the 37 will be enough for him, even if they have to move up a few slots, and the SF trade was really a prelude to moving up and getting Ngata or Bunkley.

PS, the broncos also might be targeting Len Dale with the 15th, too. It's possible they're convinced he's "the guy."

[broncohaven]

Lawson is my #1 guy if we don't trade up for Vernon Davis. I think they're the two players who could have the biggest impact for us on their respective sides of the ball. It seems to me that tweeners often become big time playmakers. Peppers was a tweener, so was Freeney, Demarcus Ware, and Merriman, to name a few.

I think Lawson would see the field immediately on ST and in nickle. He's a perfect fit for the way we like to use our DEs in coverage. He'd be a weapon in that regard.

[R8R H8R]

I like Lawson if he has anywhere near Jason Taylor potential as a DE. I wouldn't take him if he must play LB though, we just have too much talent there already. However, we do have the luxory of making him a pass-rush specialist his rookie year while he adds a few pounds on him.

By the way, where is he expected to be drafted? Is 15 a bit of a reach and is he expected to drop past 20? Or is 15 about right for this guy? Just wondering.:approve:

[brother love]

We could probably get Chris Gocong later in the draft from Cal Poly
He is 6'3" 265lbs and is very similar to Lawson
2004: 71 TK 17 ½ SK 2 FF
2005: 98 TK 23 ½ SK 4 FF

This season, Gocong finished first in the nation in sacks per game (1.81), second in tackles for lost yardage (2.35 per game) and 23rd in forced fumbles (.31). He recorded 98 total tackles (46 solo), including a school-record 23.5 sacks and 31.0 tackles for lost yardage, leading the Mustangs to a 9-4 record, a second straight Great West Football Conference championship and the quarterfinal round of the NCAA Division I-AA playoffs.

Combine Numbers
40 time: 4.7 seconds
Vertical: 38 1/2 inches
Broad Jump: 10 feet 3 inches
3 Cone: 7.05 seconds
Short Shuttle: 4.08 seconds
Long Shuttle: 11.35 seconds<O:P></O:P>
Wonderlic- 36

[broncohaven]

We could probably get Chris Gocong later in the draft from Cal Poly
He is 6'3" 265lbs and is very similar to Lawson
2004: 71 TK 17 ½ SK 2 FF
2005: 98 TK 23 ½ SK 4 FF

This season, Gocong finished first in the nation in sacks per game (1.81), second in tackles for lost yardage (2.35 per game) and 23rd in forced fumbles (.31). He recorded 98 total tackles (46 solo), including a school-record 23.5 sacks and 31.0 tackles for lost yardage, leading the Mustangs to a 9-4 record, a second straight Great West Football Conference championship and the quarterfinal round of the NCAA Division I-AA playoffs.

Combine Numbers
40 time: 4.7 seconds
Vertical: 38 1/2 inches
Broad Jump: 10 feet 3 inches
3 Cone: 7.05 seconds
Short Shuttle: 4.08 seconds
Long Shuttle: 11.35 seconds<O:P></O:P>
Wonderlic- 36
Put Lawson in I-AA, and those numbers would look small.

[brother love]

We got John Mobley from DII Kutztown remember.

[broncohaven]

We got John Mobley from DII Kutztown remember.
I'm not saying that Gocong doesn't deserve a look. He put up serious numbers at CAl Poly, and was impressive at the combine. He could be a nice sleeper pick in the 4th, but you don't pass on a player like Manny Lawson for him.

[bendog]

Gil Brandt likes the guy and thinks he can play around 270, so ... maybe he's worth the 15. But I'm still suspecting shanny's looking offense.

http://www.nfl.com/draft/analysis/expert/brandt/dl

[DivineLegion]

Question:

If he is such a freak, why is he just now rising?

Cause his sucsess in college came from a great interior and Mario pulling double teams every game...Manny Lawson couldent read a play if the coach told him what the other team was going to call ahead of time. The guy knows one thing run at the quarterback thats it.

[footstepsfrom#27]

Gold cannot play in a 3-4 defense. He's too small to hold the corner. But that was more a joke, because Den is not moving to a 3-4 - not with all the bwoncos.
I didn't say they were moving to a 3-4, and I hope you're not implying that Ian Gold is the reason we can't draft Lawson. If keeping a 220 pound average linebacker like Gold who doesn't rush the passer prevents us from drafting one of the top 5 athletes in the draft, I think we have our priorities slightly skewed. Ian Gold is easily replaceable, and if he's not, we can simply move DJ back to the weak side and go get a plugger to play the strong side. You don't pass on talent like this if you have any sense.
As for Lawson, imo, he's this year's workout wonder. He's great on paper, but one of the stupidist things do in the draft is shoot a top pick on the notion they will coach a guy up, e.g. Delta Dawn. Moreover, putting weight on Lawson will not help his one natural talent, speed. The guy has very little in Dline training, and Den was one defensive lineman pressure from the superbowl. The only LT's in the nfl he can abuse in his rookie year are not teams that will go deep in the playoffs anyway.
First of all, you have an odd definition of a "workout wonder". Neither Deltha Oneal or Manny Lawson could be considered "workout wonders" coming out of college. Oneal I believe, led the nation in INT's and returned about 5 of them for TDs as well. He was extremely productive in college, hardly a workout wonder. Same goes for Lawson...in his only two seasons at defensive end, Lawson had 18 sacks and 31 tackles for loss, not to mention his 6 career blocked punts. This guy was a heat seeking missile on the field, including on special teams. He's far from a "workout wonder". What makes all this even more remarkable besides the fact that he was learning a new position, is the fact that he didn't have the luxury of training in the offseason for football since he was running track, a sport where the training regimen is basically the exact opposite of what he would have been doing if he'd been focused only on football.

Second, speed is not his only weapon, and if it were, that's like saying to a bank robber holding an AK-47, "Is that all ya got buddy?" This dude clocked a 4.43, which means that even if he drops some speed in exchange for weight, he'll still probably be faster than Jevon Kearse, who does a 4.75. If Lawson adds 20 pounds and drops to 4.6 is that a bad thing? Good lord...NFL teams will drool over that combination for a pass rushing end. Lawson put up 225 on the bench 23 times, logged an NBA-like 39 inch vertical jump and power cleans 350 pounds. He's both a physical freak AND a very productive guy on the field, and he did all this with very little previous exposure to his position and a track career that prevented him from working out for football. If we pass on this guy at 15 we're flat out CRAZY. He's the real deal.
With the 15 pick and the way boards are lining up with a week and a half, less than that, to go, I'm starting to think Den really is looking WR. The first WR "should" go around then...
The guys you're talking about are the true workout wonders in this draft, especially Chad Jackson, who runs a lot faster on the track than he does on the field.

Finally, your assertion that Lawson won't be able to handle higher caliber OT's in the NFL is nonsense. He played his best AGAINST the best in college, including big games against teams like Notre Dame, Florida State and Virginia Tech. In two years time, I'll predict that Lawson will be a pro-bowl defensive end logging double digit sacks and Chad Jackson and Santonio Holmes will be average run of the mill NFL players.

[footstepsfrom#27]

Cause his sucsess in college came from a great interior and Mario pulling double teams every game...Manny Lawson couldent read a play if the coach told him what the other team was going to call ahead of time. The guy knows one thing run at the quarterback thats it.
That's nonsense also.

Explain to me how a double team on Mario Willliams has anything to do with the other side of the defensive line? Williams would get DT'd by either the tackle and guard or the tackle and the TE. At a minimum you're talking about Lawson being 3 holes away from any possible double team that Williams faced. Second, in his freshman and sophmore seasons when he played LINEBACKER rather than DE, and started only 3 games, he still had 88 tackles, (7 for loss), 3 sacks, forced 3 fumbles and blocked 5 punts. As a freshman LINEBACKER against Notre Dame he had 9 tackles in only 21 snaps.

[bendog]

Roaf would pancake his ass all day long, lol. Brandt likes Lawson, but as DL notes his production was due in part to his line. How good is the guy? I dunno. Prolly not worth the 15.

I said Delta Dawn is an example of teams drafting on the notion that they can coach up a relatively inexperienced player ... drafting on potential and arrogance rather than proven performance. Lawson hasn't shown that at 265 pounds he can take on and break double teams and get the qb.

But, I reserve the right to admit I'm wrong. I posted today that Brandt thinks the guy can bulk up and be a RDE with possible pro-bowl upside. I'd be happy with him, but I don't think shanny's taking him at 15. Don't misunderstand, I'd rather him than Holmes (and keep Lelie)

Here's a question though. What's the difference in Wimbley and Lawson? On the numbers, Lawson seems to be a bit faster, but Wimbley has more time at DE. If they could get an extra 3rd rd pick, and move down to 20 and get Wimbley, I wouldn't be upset.

[bendog]

That's nonsense also.

Explain to me how a double team on Mario Willliams has anything to do with the other side of the defensive line? Williams would get DT'd by either the tackle and guard or the tackle and the TE. At a minimum you're talking about Lawson being 3 holes away from any possible double team that Williams faced. Second, in his freshman and sophmore seasons when he played LINEBACKER rather than DE, and started only 3 games, he still had 88 tackles, (7 for loss), 3 sacks, forced 3 fumbles and blocked 5 punts. As a freshman LINEBACKER against Notre Dame he had 9 tackles in only 21 snaps.
Stop.

[footstepsfrom#27]

Roaf would pancake his ass all day long, lol.
Willie Roaf just turned 36. In two years when Lawson is posting double digit sacks the only pancaking Willie will be doing is with a slab of butter and plenty of Mrs. Buttersworths maple syrup.

I don't see the logic in worrying about the soon-to-retire presense of a division rival's player that hasn't sniffed a playoff win in more than a decade.
I said Delta Dawn is an example of teams drafting on the notion that they can coach up a relatively inexperienced player ... drafting on potential and arrogance rather than proven performance. Lawson hasn't shown that at 265 pounds he can take on and break double teams and get the qb.
Leading the nation in INT's and TD returns IS proven performance. And in case you haven't noticed, Delta turned out pretty fine after all. Proven performance is also 18 sacks, 32 TFL and 6 blocked punts. Most of the good players in the draft come out after their junior season anyway, and therefore have less experience than Lawson. That argument has no merit.
Here's a question though. What's the difference in Wimbley and Lawson? On the numbers, Lawson seems to be a bit faster, but Wimbley has more time at DE. If they could get an extra 3rd rd pick, and move down to 20and get Wimbley, I wouldn't be upset.
Lawson's a better athlete. If you can make a case for either player benefiting from his D-line mates, it has to be made for Whimbley, who lined up right next to Bunkley at FSU.

[Pat Bowlen]

Are you dating him or something?

[elpasojoe]

I am all for drafting this guy at 15, I don't care if they say he is a little light and supposedly belongs in a 3-4 defense.

Not only do I say play him in our 4-3 defense, the next time Lelie starts crying (Yea, I know he probably won't be here) line him up as a receiver or TE. He is that FAST.
He and Vernon Davis are the two athletic freaks in this draft. If we can't trade up for VD, get the other freak at 15. Then go read the scouting reports about his hard work ethics. Don't tell me you can't find a myriad of ways to use him.

[Rascal]

Draft Hali At 15!!! Please!!!!

[bendog]

I am all for drafting this guy at 15, I don't care if they say he is a little light and supposedly belongs in a 3-4 defense.

Not only do I say play him in our 4-3 defense, the next time Lelie starts crying (Yea, I know he probably won't be here) line him up as a receiver or TE. He is that FAST.
He and Vernon Davis are the two athletic freaks in this draft. If we can't trade up for VD, get the other freak at 15. Then go read the scouting reports about his hard work ethics. Don't tell me you can't find a myriad of ways to use him.
I agree. But don't expect a 245 pound guy to line up over ANY nfl LT with Gold behind them and not see student body left all frigging day long. And Roaf would kill this guy. Lawson's a project. He can have all the talent in the world, but he's a project. Prolly not as much as Delta was, in that Den missed in thinking Delta's insticts would make up for a lack of closing speed. Delta can play in a pretty basic zone or two deep, but he'll never be a one on one no safety help guy. In 2-3 years Lawson could very well be a probowl DE.

[footstepsfrom#27]

I agree. But don't expect a 245 pound guy to line up over ANY nfl LT with Gold behind them and not see student body left all frigging day long. And Roaf would kill this guy. Lawson's a project. He can have all the talent in the world, but he's a project. Prolly not as much as Delta was, in that Den missed in thinking Delta's insticts would make up for a lack of closing speed. Delta can play in a pretty basic zone or two deep, but he'll never be a one on one no safety help guy. In 2-3 years Lawson could very well be a probowl DE.
As I said before...who cares about Ian Gold? Has he done anything to justify sacrificing our pass rush for? Why are we playing a 220 pound LB anyway? I hardly think we need to be making personel decisions based on the idea of whether a guy will fit with Ian Gold. Maybe we should just dump Ian Gold instead go get a decent sized linebacker?

Demarcus Ware played at 251 last year and Jason Taylor at 255. This guy will probably match that his rookie year. Is he a project? Yea. They're ALL projects at DE in this draft except Mario Williams. Somebody mentioned Hali. That's a horrible idea at 15. Hali will be a very average player in this league, maybe a backup. He's 265 and not likely to get any bigger, has poor speed and upper body strength. He's a 3rd rounder who might go higher based on the fact he's a DE from Penn State. The guy runs like he's wearing cement in his shoes.

[broncohaven]

As I said before...who cares about Ian Gold? Has he done anything to justify sacrificing our pass rush for? Why are we playing a 220 pound LB anyway? I hardly think we need to be making personel decisions based on the idea of whether a guy will fit with Ian Gold. Maybe we should just dump Ian Gold instead go get a decent sized linebacker?

Demarcus Ware played at 251 last year and Jason Taylor at 255. This guy will probably match that his rookie year. Is he a project? Yea. They're ALL projects at DE in this draft except Mario Williams. Somebody mentioned Hali. That's a horrible idea at 15. Hali will be a very average player in this league, maybe a backup. He's 265 and not likely to get any bigger, has poor speed and upper body strength. He's a 3rd rounder who might go higher based on the fact he's a DE from Penn State. The guy runs like he's wearing cement in his shoes.
I agree with your take on Lawson, but your take on Hali is completely out of whack. He uses his hands to shed blocks better than any DE coming out, and is explosive off teh edge. He's also relentless in pursuit. He doesn't represent a good value at #15, but the guy has a monster motor and will be a playmaker in the NFL.

That said, I think that Lawson has the potential to be the elite DE from this class. Even better than Williams when its all said and done. Every first round 'tweener who was drafted last year was a stud as a rookie. Ware tore it up in Dallas, Merriman was the Chargers best defender, not to mention guys like Freeney and Peppers who both wore that label. Lawson will be no different. This fudging around with mediocre DL talent has gone on long enough in Denver. Get this kid, and be happy we did.

I, for one, am perfectly willing to sacrifice a little run stopping to get a dynamic DE off the edge.

[footstepsfrom#27]

I agree with your take on Lawson, but your take on Hali is completely out of whack. He uses his hands to shed blocks better than any DE coming out, and is explosive off teh edge. He's also relentless in pursuit. He doesn't represent a good value at #15, but the guy has a monster motor and will be a playmaker in the NFL.

That said, I think that Lawson has the potential to be the elite DE from this class. Even better than Williams when its all said and done. Every first round 'tweener who was drafted last year was a stud as a rookie. Ware tore it up in Dallas, Merriman was the Chargers best defender, not to mention guys like Freeney and Peppers who both wore that label. Lawson will be no different. This fudging around with mediocre DL talent has gone on long enough in Denver. Get this kid, and be happy we did.

I, for one, am perfectly willing to sacrifice a little run stopping to get a dynamic DE off the edge.
What I don't like about Hali is that he is just slow. I don't care what his 40 time is...and it's not good either...but I watched 6 Penn State games this year, specifically watching him. Watch Hali in pursuit. The guy does have a high motor and he keeps coming, but he's just not fast enough to pursue down the line or chase the QB and he's not big enough to bull rush NFL tackles. I think he's a very good college DE, but you have to have something more athletically at the next level. Obviously he's got a huge heart, but that will only take him so far at this level. I might spend a late 2nd on him if we went with DW2 or somebody else in round one, but I definitely would not go with him in the first round...not when you have a freakishly talented athlete like Lawson available. After reading his story on the other thread however, I hope I'm wrong.

[labronco]

I admit I don't know much about Lawson but he sounds like a good player. I have seen a number of clips on Mario though, that has Lawson getting to the quarterback before Mario.

If we can't bet VY or VD with first pick, I hope we go defensive line. We desperately, desperately need pass rush.

[DivineLegion]

Over Rated

[freak6]

<------------ Freak with a 46 inch vertical jump, guy blocks kicks in special teams too.

Could be a tall Dwight Freeney. At 15 I don't think we can get any better player to give us an immediate impact on a solid team that was so close to winning at all. I think if he is there, we gotta select him.

[youcandoit1687]

We could probably get Chris Gocong later in the draft from Cal Poly
He is 6'3" 265lbs and is very similar to Lawson
2004: 71 TK 17 ½ SK 2 FF
2005: 98 TK 23 ½ SK 4 FF

This season, Gocong finished first in the nation in sacks per game (1.81), second in tackles for lost yardage (2.35 per game) and 23rd in forced fumbles (.31). He recorded 98 total tackles (46 solo), including a school-record 23.5 sacks and 31.0 tackles for lost yardage, leading the Mustangs to a 9-4 record, a second straight Great West Football Conference championship and the quarterfinal round of the NCAA Division I-AA playoffs.

Combine Numbers
40 time: 4.7 seconds
Vertical: 38 1/2 inches
Broad Jump: 10 feet 3 inches
3 Cone: 7.05 seconds
Short Shuttle: 4.08 seconds
Long Shuttle: 11.35 seconds<O:P></O:P>
Wonderlic- 36

uh buddy that is nowhere near manny, .27 slower, '3 shorter, and 10-15 heavier. plus the cal poly to the nfl transition hasnt worked that well if i remember off the top of my head.


footsteps, welcome aboard the bandwagon, it seems like u took one of my posts lol play him at WR,etc. thanks for the extra info on his team honoring him. i really believe we could put atleast 10 on him before season. we dont need him at LB,we need him at DE. if we got him for LB id be mad. he has slowly risen but look at the teams in the 16-21 region and ull see why 22 would have beena risky wait.

current final verdict as of 11:30 PST, go with lawson or CJ and ill be happy

[labronco]

Lawson scored 42 on Wonderlick. Has anyone mentioned this? That's probably the best by any defensive player. Ever.

[JunkyardWillie]

Lawson is growing on me at 15. Shefter just said he may go top 12 but if he does fall i wouldnt mind him at 15

[youcandoit1687]

That's nonsense also.

Explain to me how a double team on Mario Willliams has anything to do with the other side of the defensive line? Williams would get DT'd by either the tackle and guard or the tackle and the TE. At a minimum you're talking about Lawson being 3 holes away from any possible double team that Williams faced. Second, in his freshman and sophmore seasons when he played LINEBACKER rather than DE, and started only 3 games, he still had 88 tackles, (7 for loss), 3 sacks, forced 3 fumbles and blocked 5 punts. As a freshman LINEBACKER against Notre Dame he had 9 tackles in only 21 snaps.

sry cant agree there footsteps. i play TE and ill tell u how thin that makes the line. for simple arguments sake well say that...running to the 3 hole
TE and LT r on mario
guard and center combo block the DT&LB or center scoop blocks the backside
that leaves it straight up one on one for MANLAW and the other DT and the RG and C should prob be scoop blocking

i wont deny that having that talent skewers the statistics a little/lot bit but i dont think that hurts his value. he showed SOME production on the field with great numbers off, thats enuf for me. im a firm believer that fora more surefire transition, numbers off the field are better than college numbers on the field(in most cases - inside oline, STs, etc.)...that was a ploy to get u off the mike hass bandwagon.

anywyas thats my last post until somewhere during/after the draft tm. good luck all.

manlaw or cj get my final vote in this democratic voting system that we must all believe is the nfl draft

[footstepsfrom#27]

...he showed SOME production on the field with great numbers off...
Rick Goselin says he was more productive than Williams. Lawson reminds me of Charles Haley...I'll dance a jig if we get him at 15.